Gold Discussion for Investors and Market Analysts

Kitco Inc. does not exercise any editorial control over the content of this discussion group and therefore does not necessarily endorse any statements that are made or assert the truthfulness or reliability of the information provided.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 00:01)
WW: Ed has about 3 restaurants and 2-3 theaters near the Sky Dome and LeeChee Gardens is still in operation. O'Keefe Center has been renamed but still there. Ontario place has been spruced up and you should try to see the IMAX theater next door.

I don't think any Canadians would trade the National Health care system for the US variety. One of the great fears of most taxpayers is that the Health system will be reduced to that of the US or even worse a private system be allowed to function as well. Not likely. The system is overbuilt and filled with waste or was until recently with 6000 hospital beds being shut down in Toronto in the last 6-7 years and 11 hospitals scheduled to be shut down in the next 2-3 years to account for the 6000 empty beds. Very prosperous place to afford such waste for so long.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 00:05)


am I a bear or a bull ? my teacher told me I am Japanese ?

(Sun Jun 01 1997 00:14)
WW: I think you mean the Queen's Plate which will be run in a few months. You didn't say when you were here last so it's hard to guess what might be new. You could try the restaurant at the top of the CN Tower. There is a new restaurant section for several blocks along Queen West--Thai-Mexican-Cajan-French. Gretsky's and Planet Hollywood are near the Skydome. Great new zoo if you are bringing kids--about 2 days to take it all in.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 00:15)
@New England
Selby: Thanks for the info. I remember Leechee Garden as I have NEVER had Chinese food that great anywhere since. I cant believe it is still going as at the time it seemed like a kind of hole in the wall. Glad to hear Ed's is going strong that was also a great restaurant. I dont think many Americans not close to the border realize what fantastic theater and restaurant town Toronto is. On a par with NY SF and LA/ probably better than the latter two in theater. Safer and cleaner than all three put together.

You as a conservative supporting Canada's Heallth Care plan Vs. our system would make you a Canadian Conservative a US Liberal if you lived here.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 00:18)
Bundesbank Wants Euro Delay

(Sun Jun 01 1997 00:19)
Earl...I was afraid you were serious. What I am really afraid of is that many
people think like you. That is why I buy gold. To be ready to escape the
unthinking, inhumane assholes that propagate thoughts of mass murder. I am not
an expert but it seems the people who are attracted to drugs are the weaker
members of society trying to escape from real or imagined demons. I am truly more
afraid of people with your attitudes than the druggies. "If they do something we don't
like and they don't stop, we'll just kill them". This attitude has produced
the grassroots of nazi-ism that is embedding itself in our country. Do you realize
how easy it is for a youngster to get hooked on drugs with the potentcy of
today's varieties? Should we kill the kids because they made a mistake and
can't readily correct it? Earl, I really think you're kidding.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 00:26)
WW If you like Greek food there is a 8-10 block Greek section on Danforth with great Greek food in a couple of dozen restaurants. I have heard it said that all Canadian political parties are to the left of the US Democrats. Not sure if that is true but there are 13 Communist Party members running in Mondays Fereal election and I bet they are way left of the Democrats.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 00:28)
BART: I understand that 1 of the options is to function here as on the Stock channel. Is that corrrect?

(Sun Jun 01 1997 00:34)

Har! Just had an experience. Was reading posts
here when my house shook, like it does from thunder,
and the electricity went out. Came back on in 2
minutes. No thunderstorms here though. As I recall
the Mexico City volcano occurred within about 2
hours after someone asked Cherokee to send a little
flux his way. ( I think it was M. Graves ) . Reminds
me of the Twilight Zone episode, where this printing
press would cause whatever was printed on it to
actually occur. I believe the episode title was
"Printers Devil", with Burgess Meredith starring.
You don't think that Bart........Nah.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 00:37)
@New England
Selby : earlier today I was calling 800 numbers regarding rates and reservations in southern Ontario. Being the political junky I am I could not resist asking the operators about your health care system. They were y cordial and seemed quite willing to talk and very supportive of your health care system. Now our countries are similar but if anybody suggested the Canadian system here they would be labeled a Marxian Socialist. Sorry but I dont consider Canada a socialist country. What do you think gives. Here you a "conservative" support a system that American Conservatives would by definition refer to as Socialist. How do you explain the discrepancy or can it be explained.

The Greek restaurant section sounds great I look forward to visiting. Thanks!

(Sun Jun 01 1997 00:56)
GENERAL: My apologies for mentioning your name at a most inopportune time. Please excuse my thoughtlessness. I didn't think about it 'til I saw the next post.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 00:57)
that is determined by the mass of the object, not by un-educated


"for every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction."

there is all you need to know. humans have a sacrosanct view of
themselves relative to the cosmos, and her vagaries. i guess you
believe that the recent SOLar flare will have no discernable effect upon earth either.

you are wrong, and time will prove it so.

flux and chaos love emf ( electro-magnetic-flux ) , as plants
love the sun and rain.


my lance has been removed from cheek, and stands ready to defend
your STANDARD! your ideals are credible and supported by all at
this reservation. continue with your journey of the mind, the
ankle-biters are easily crushed underfoot from whence they came.


yes, you can spell my name better than me. how about.....well maybe later
----apo for the typos'---!

sleepwalkers love to speak of things of which they have heard, and have
not experienced. the experienced ( are you experienced?--jimi hendrix ) love
to watch the sleepwalkers sleep-talk, as they cannot walk the walk.

the bow is drawn, the arrow at the ready,---swoosh---thwock---
the deed is done. another sleepwalker feels the sting of
reality. giants abound, yet mike has found, he knows more than they.
einsteins' laws of relativity have been proven time and time again.
sleepwalkers know only what they learn from sleeping. NOT TO BURY THE
DEAD PAST, AND TRUST THE FUTURE! food a-plenty for all who refuse
to open their eyes.

cherokee----en-route to ganymede for a soiree with don carlos and
the psycho-tropic spirits of times gone past. back in a

(Sun Jun 01 1997 01:02)
Paul: I do not take umbrage at your choice of personal characterization. But my wife will. She is partial to the term and reserves it for her personal use only. Now you can mess with me and escape with your choice of expletive intact but the same cannot be said for my wife.

As for death and destruction. It seems that the drug trade is doing a fair job of killing these sterling members of society without our help. The problem is two fold as I see it. The rate of attritioncould stand some improvement and the casualty loss experienced by the rest of society, before they die is far too high. Burglaries, theft, robberies that result in innocent loss of life and etc.

As for summary execution; I did not say that they should not be given a fair trial. Even a 'straight forward' trial procedure such as Paula Jones vs William J. Clinton would be acceptable. All I am saying is that, at the final stroke of the gavel, the misunderstood creature is dispatched forthwith. Nah! He or she is shot.

While in China, I was told that they manufacture a special cartridge for that purpose. But the family of the honored recipient is required pay for it. For the indigent here, I suppose it would be appropriate to set up a trust fund of some sort to cover the cost.

I am only troubled by the fact that the drug lords are able to reach into the highest offices in the country and would remain out of range, so to speak, of that most excellent Chinese cartridge. More is the pity. I'm sure you will agree that reducing the sales base through zero recidivism would, in time, cut into the drug lords market, the politicians take, release productive assets to other uses, increase the average IQ and make life noticeable more pleasant for the rest of us. Laudable goals all. Don't you think?...... Give it some thought. While sitting on your choice of expetives.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 01:05)
Oh! And Paul. Keep buying that gold.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 01:14)
Cherokee: Go in peace my brother. Send some smoke, I am thinking of the ggggggrains again. There I said it. ... MUst crank in suitable calibrated pucker factor into selected expletive. Will remain in heavy wooden chair until your return from the great beyond.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 01:24)
see previous
Earl....You chide me for using an expletive and then condone mass murder.
This is the mentality I am talking about. Your attitude and others like it
cause people to use drugs. Good night a--hole.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 01:43)
Paul: I didn't chide you for your churlish behaviour. I poked fun at it. There is difference. Forgive me for not taking you seriously. It must have had something to do with your choice of words and the quality of your discourse. A first rate mind argues without emotion. A third rate mind cannot argue without it. Try to chase the idea and not the person. I know it is difficult but concentration and practice help.

BTW, my wife is really irritated and she is more bloodthirsty than me. She does not take kindly to usurpers of her terms of endearment.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 01:55)
@money supply
Does anyone know where I can find figues for money supply growth in the G7 economies? Things are really beginning to heat up in regard to EMU, gold, and the currencies. I think it is pretty clear that interest rates have bottomed in Japan. If the Kohl government succeeds in their plan to get a payout based on a revaluation of gold reserves, does anyone have an opinion what the effect will be on currencies and interest rates in Europe? Thanks.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 02:00)

Telecaster: The back pages of "The Economist
Magazine" has those. Sorry I can't be of help for a
web site. Yes, things do seem to be heating up in
Europe. Any news on the French election?

Immigration Canada
(Sun Jun 01 1997 02:14)
WW your accepted

WW: We hereby accept your application for immigration to

(Sun Jun 01 1997 02:53)
Auric- Thanks for the info. Can't find anything yet on the French elections.

Poster 2323
(Sun Jun 01 1997 03:06)

Ron ( 00:18 ) : If Euro 99 fails, the dollar will probably
stay at present level or go higher. Believe the whole
situation is fabricated to increase German Exports. In
any event, gold will go up 'as the dollar is suspect" and
the Swiss have been knocked out of the equation by "the
Fonze" and I think that they prefer it that way. Think
about it.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 03:08)
French elections : I'm French and the elections began one hour ago at
8:00 am ( 2:00 am in New York Time ) .The desks will be closed at 8:00 pm and
the first results will also be published at 8:00 pm.
A last poll published yesterday always gave the majority to the left
wing ( Socialist Party,Communist Party and Ecologists ) .

(Sun Jun 01 1997 04:14)

FrenchMan: Thanks for the info. I am sure we will
all be watching.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 04:18)

we have consensus--

they will take you, and we will let you go!

well there it is.-------how about a free one way ticket, and
two bits for coffee? canada NEEDS your fiduciary skills with their
robust, recovering economy.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 05:35)
FrenchMan- Can you give us an idea what a socialist victory in France and a revaluation of German gold reserves would mean for the currencies and interest rates over on your side? Your viewpoint would be appreciated. thanks

(Sun Jun 01 1997 05:40)
while flux rests, cherokee rides the crest, of the ether
wave to aasgard, and all points north. to own, all alone,
the grand spectrum of the net, one should hesitate to let
sleep in. the great outflow of energy quickens, and the days
are shorter, each in its' own turn. you feel and sense it, yet
your mind tells you it cannot be so. it is so. there is a
quickening of the events unfolding around all organic beings.
awaken and feel the truth, as your mind cannot reveal it!
the answer is within, just tune in and open the door.

when the student is ready the teacher will appear.

nobody ever knows as much as you think they know!!!

use your own mind, make your own decisions about everything!

shoot from the hip, aim for their lip!!

cherokee---scalper of the copper bulls.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 06:53)
@two-tier currency
Does anyone know anything about a bill before congress in the US that would create a two-tier currency, a domestic dollar and a trade dollar? Today is the first I have heard of this and I'm skeptical of its' truth. thanks

(Sun Jun 01 1997 07:12)


Sorry lad, but if you're that willing to give him up, maybe we'd better look this horse in the mouth once more. Politics aside, it is because of our socialist feelings that we're not willing to give up our health care system. It takes care of us and prevents us ( thank God ) from having to earn so much as to affort a private system. Can you imagine how much we'd have to earn to pay TED's taxes on a 72 cent dollar ! In reality though, without us "liberals" making a living and giving Ceasar his due, then the socialists ( here known as the New Democrats Party NDP ) would not have the money to spend on their luxuries. I really don't think WW wants to come here. The dollars too low and has a Queens picture on it ( rather than a president ) , ( :- ) and the Quebec problem just keeps festering. ( :- ( OH BTW .... WW don't forget to leave your guns at home ! We're too civilized to need them here they say. Now where's my shells?


(Sun Jun 01 1997 07:51)
Front:Did ya have to remind me of my tax bill in the states!!! Multiply it by 1.38 and yer talkin BIG BUCKS...Vermont has the Rainbow Coalition Party run by Jessie Jackson...retch...puke...Worse than NDP...if possible.....

(Sun Jun 01 1997 07:54)
For all you futures fans: The Canadian Dollar is a screamin buy @ 72.55..
Fair-value with U.S. buck is approx. .80...and it will go higher than that!

(Sun Jun 01 1997 08:28)
telecastor-- There was such a bill in the Senate of the U.S. It called for a 'dual' currency system, similar to South Africas' scrapped dual Rand system. I believe it was submitted during the 103rd or 104th session. You would have to do some searching, but Thomas is the site to start at. I have long since last the URL for the legislative search site 'Thomas'. BTW, this is why we have the 'new' $100 bill with the $50, $20, $10, $5, and $1 on their way!

(Sun Jun 01 1997 08:32)
Tort: You are gone but not forgotten...Mornin Panda!

(Sun Jun 01 1997 08:32)
Bart -- The solution for the posting issues at this site is simple, a $150 rally in gold and a $200 rally in platinum. :- ) )

(Sun Jun 01 1997 08:38)
telecaster -- Here is the Thomas URL search away!

TED -- Good Morning TED! It's RAINING down here....

(Sun Jun 01 1997 08:43)
telecaster -- I don't know if the URL below will work, Thomas's search engine is kind of funny about what it or won't accept. Search for S.307 under the 104th congress.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 08:43)
Tort: Just went backwards in time and see you ARE back...But it was DRY HEAT...right...??....Does Phoenix have an ocean??

(Sun Jun 01 1997 08:46)
Panda: Hazy sun and HOT here!...65 degrees..WOW!...By FAR our HOTEST day of the far...Where's the damn air conditioner?? Tort: GO JAZZ!

(Sun Jun 01 1997 08:48)
@last attempt
Let's see if this URL works any better!

Enter in S. 307 in the Bill Search box

(Sun Jun 01 1997 08:50)
Silver stocks:
The 1992 Charles River Associates silver study puts the world-wide stocks of available silver ( bullion, coins, medallions, ect ) at 19.1 billion ounces. There is also a large chunk which is in tooth fillings ect. A rule of thum I have used for fifty years seems to still hold. There is about ten times as much silver world-wide ( both available and unavailable ) as gold. If we posit the gold stocks at an easily remembered
100,000 tons the total silver is a million tons. This ratio of stocks is a reason why in the comming world-wide financial panic the gold/silver price ratio may fall to something a lot closer to 10/1 than it is now.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 08:51)
telecaster -- That one seems to work.

TED -- Winter shall turn in to summer soon enough! It's not so much the heat as the HUMIDITY! What will the French do, and what will gold do? :- ) BBL, got to do some errands.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 09:00)
Tort: CONGRATS OLD MAN!...WW:WE don't want you on this side of the border!...Why don't you go to Foxwoods casino in Connecticut!...Have spent many a day at Atlantic City and Vegas...

(Sun Jun 01 1997 09:04)
Panda: How dare you run away to do errands!..The French will do what they always do....SCREW UP and vote SOCIALIST!...MGraves: Keith wasn't here but the captain sure as hell showed up...Alexa is in Sydney today...should I go down to the steel workers union hall and cause a RIOT

(Sun Jun 01 1997 09:13)
telecaster: I'm not French but Austrian financial journalist. There is a lot of fear from a soft EURO especially in Austria ( we have schillings, but in fact it is a sub-currency of the German Mark ) and Germany - a lot of money was already shifted into Swiss Francs. If the German government insists on the gold-revaluation-plan it is a clear signal to the European soft-currency-countries to use every available accounting-trick to meet maasticht-criteria. Markets HAVE TO expect an soft EURO and that SHOULD help the Swiss Franc, the US-Dollar and the precious metalls as well. It should also give a boost to the italian lira, the spansish peseta and the skandinavian currencies.

Gery, Vienna

(Sun Jun 01 1997 09:30)
@ Valley
Ted : Crappy day again!!! Your going to have to listen to Eddie again!!!
I'm off to the donut shop , 12hrs....Yuck!!!!!see ya after midnight with alexander keiths.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 09:37)
Telecaster-I agree with Gery.Socialists victory if France means a soft,light euro currency and this is good for precious metals.Don't expect big move in French interest rates,may be 1 or 1.5 points on long rates for a few months.
The 1997 socialists are not the 1981 socialists!

Steve (Perth - Western Australia)
(Sun Jun 01 1997 10:07)
In light of Germany's gold "revaluation" talks, check this out..
I'm off to bed. Nice & warm, as it is a wet winter here now..

(Sun Jun 01 1997 10:55)
The gov:
The best commentary on government I have ever heard was in the 1970's. An argentinean politician was asked if the new government being formed would be a Peronist government. He replied. "There is no doubt our new government will be peronist. The question is what type of a peronist government will it be?"

(Sun Jun 01 1997 11:14)
To all,
somethings to digest...enjoy it...
any effect?
need advices...thanks..

(Sun Jun 01 1997 11:16)
Can't please everybody;

(Sun Jun 01 1997 11:23)
Gery,bw,vronsky,housewife, depressed Gold-Silver Bugs:

Vronsky: This Martin Armstrong sounds too good to be true. Is he your cousin? I don't mind your site promotion here ( since you have a great site ) . Keep it up.

Bullish indicators for the Gold and Silver:

Europeans fed up with Euro currency BS, esp rich Germans, will flee to Swiss Francs as soon as dollar shows weakness. The Swiss will get tired of this false valuation of their sacred currency. They will weaken it on purpose and the Germans will finally buy Gold out of desperation. Isrealis are running scared to Gold already.

US Yuppies are being told by George Vanderheiden and other equity gurus that market is ready to tip. Lots of splashy Gold adds in the trade magazines, US medical drug costs soaring, no one believes the old Clinton-Greenspan-Rubin lies about no inflation anymore. Not even blonde Yuppies ( males included ) .

Most important - Beans, Coffee, Paladium, CRB. The commodity breakouts are scaring even the Yuppies. YUPPIES DON'T LIKE TO FEEL DUPED, THEY WANT TO BE WITH THE "IN" CROWD. YUPPIES DONT KNOW HOW TO TRADE BEANS! THEY ARE MOVING TO PAPER GOLD NOW!

Now that I live in the Golden State, with the most Yuppies, I will keep you posted on the latest cancer cures, diets, and the state of Gold advertising on the radio.

Where is the housewife?

(Sun Jun 01 1997 11:25)
JIN -- The dam has cracks in it. The water is leaking through. No one is repairing the dam. Heavy rains are forecast. Seek high ground, don't get in the way of the currencies flowing through the broken dam. You will be drowned in paper. Houses built on golden foundations are forecast to do much better.

Don't you love politics? The politicians are fighting for control of the 'money'. :- ) ) :- ) ) :- ) ) How much is your paper worth in relation to my paper? Funny, doesn't it all come from trees?

(Sun Jun 01 1997 11:27)
grumps, or rather the ghost of grumps is back! We have reprinted his Magnum Opus, "Woulda, Coulda, Shoulda" - It is a must read for all goldbugs. Click RELOAD at:

(Sun Jun 01 1997 11:52)

George S. Cole
(Sun Jun 01 1997 12:01)
JIN: Thanks for the article! A very different EMU take than the one now dominant on Wall Street.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 12:17)
@looks like this might be the week
For those of you who don't understand German politics. Hans T. and the Bundes folks have as much power in Europe as AG does here. They are challenging their own government to stop the revaluation scheme. This means chaos for the Euro or ECU movement. The public is beginning to catch on to the relationship between Gold and currencies. Namely, the lack of a relationship. If Gold is irrelevant, why the struggle? Maybe the public will realize that post-EMU the only way to support the currency will be for the CBs to buy more Gold!

Deutche Damen und Herren, Kommentar bitte!

(Sun Jun 01 1997 12:49)
JIN: Many thanks for the interesting article. It now seems there are two schools of thought ( among several out there ) about the success or failure of the EMU. One says if the EMU never flies, then this is favorable of gold. Now the Australian article says that if the EMU is laucnhed, this too will be favorable for gold. Personally, my knowledge of European history forces me to conclude and agree with webster's dictionary "that the EMU is a flightless bird." IMHO, this will make the precious metals orbital.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 12:54)
kolorado: What means the revaluation of the gold-reserves of the german bundesbank? It means the bank produces a book-gain by magic. The government plans to use this new money to reduce the deficit. Strongly simplified means this: they print the "gained" money and this increases the german money supply - i.e. higher inflation! The first reaction of the markets should be a stronger dollar and this could be a speedbreaker for gold, cause for the last two years we saw a negative correlation between gold and us-dollar ( from a D-Mark-point-of-view ) . Guess we'll see a thrilling week.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 12:59)
Is this EMU issue enough to overcome the WAVE of paper sales which Glenn outlined in his post re his trading floor experience on Friday. If it is how will occur and where and who will start it?

Kolo made a good point "if gold is irrelevant why the struggle" in Germany.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 13:14)
@The Phoenix Shore

Re Earthquakes: Ted asked if Phoenix is on the
ocean. Not yet, : ) !

(Sun Jun 01 1997 13:25)
waiting for Bundes Fall-out
Tw, Gery:

Don't Europeans, Australians, Canadians realize what the Chinese and Japanese already know? The dollar can't be propped up forever. Why would Europeans buy dollars when they know Clinton's on trial and the US current account is still red? What is this fascination with USD? Please explain this to a naive American Silverbug. I'm not talking about drug money now. Don't Europeans go for long term investments?

(Sun Jun 01 1997 13:47)
@..EMU and Gold Reserve..Aussie theory
Bonn's revaluation of Buba's gold is accounting fiction only. It permits an unrealized asset - accrued gains in gold reserves - to be posted on the balance sheet so that Germany may squeeze into the Masteritch fiscal straight jacket imposed on all EMU members. If the Bonn govt prints more DM it would be self-defeating - the revaluation would have no effect.

I wish I could follow Voronsky's and GS Cole's view on the article that JIN found. The Austrialian mineral economists theory that

1 ) Gold price should not flounder as the tender EMU entry on the global monetary scene will require solid gold backing to some degree;

2 ) Eastern and South East Asian developing nations are accumulating gold reserves.

Both factors - in theory - bode well for gold prices.

If hope that the Aussie's theory is correct. There are a few things I do find uncomfortable based on current history of CB gold dumping

- CB's and financial institutions have about a 10 yr. supply of gold production on hand.

The report would have been better digested if the statistics used were sourced - 33% of gold owned by CB's and institutions, about10 yr. supply - and the economists were not compromised - "mineral" economic consultants - and the country ( Australia ) was not a major producer of gold ( 4th/5th in world ) and heavily dependent on mining industries.


(Sun Jun 01 1997 13:55)
WW: I consider Canada a socialist country whether I like it or not. I have Unemployment insurance payments deducted from every pay check in case
I need to pay bills between jobs; I pay for all my medical costs via taxes; all the roads, garbage, collection etc I pay for by taxes; I pay for a national broadcasting system; all roads in the Province are kept up by taxes ( so far ) ; I can get free upgrading in computer skills -virtually any 3-8 month course you can think of; the armed forces are geared toward peace keeping; there are 5 major parties one of which is a social democratic party that has never held federal office and is responsible for the foregoing. This sound like a non social country to you?

With regard to the difference in the use of terms that you mention--I have 2 reasons for the disparity. One is the left overs from Daniel Boone and his contemporaries that has instilled a sense of self reliance
that is not found in many other places except maybe Australia but they can speak for themselves. The second reason is that many in the US get their socialism definitions from dictionaries and have no experience with the views that hold so dear and express so loudly. It constantly show up here. Posters confidently proclaiming the similarity of government health care and Communism--and argue vehemently with people who are living and using it.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 13:59)
@...why is the world buying US$ ?
Kolorado: Because the US is the most powerful and stable economic empire in modern history. The US ( and its subsidiary nation Canada ) is the home plate of "most" ( in terms of scope, scale, and predictability ) of what is valued by people everywhere - freedom, human rights, free enterprise, high standard of living, and - most of all - the best opportunity to increase one's lot on this planet.

The US may have problems - as we all do - but no other nation can claim as great or robust cultural, economic, and geographical landscape.

Cheers ( from an admiring Canuck )

(Sun Jun 01 1997 14:00)
Does Anthrax write for AP? I am reading my Sunday paper ( a legitimate mid size mainstream paper ) and much of the terrorist stuff he posted in this thread is in the AP article I'm reading right now. For example, maybe identical to his post ... A Hezbollah terrorist tapes a lightbulb to the track of a New York City subway station ... etc. etc. releasing Anthrax, one of the dealiest toxins known to humanity. Also, refers to a classified report called Terror 2000. It also refers to the cell structure of the terrorist groups. Scary.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 14:02)
@I see the CBs cracking
Tw, Gery, Bob, GSC:

Being one of the former supporters of the "USD-Gold Ceiling" conspiracy theory, wherein the CBs plot to "purify" the world of the Gold curse, I now admit that I am backsliding. This German row has me excited. IF Alan anti-Gold Greenspan and the Bonn government can't keep Hans T. under control, what does that say about the anti-Gold conspiracy? Weak legs? Go Hans Go! The Euro has no clothes! Cover it with Gold!

(Sun Jun 01 1997 14:02)
@...Canadian are the world's greatest complainers
Selby: You get what you pay for and sometime more or less. You pay a high price to live in Toronto but you live in the world's most livable world city in what the UN claims to be the best country to live.

Cheers ( from oakville )

(Sun Jun 01 1997 14:08)
Bob: I don't hear a lot of complaints but the UN is certainly right.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 14:10)
French elections first results : huge victory for the left wing :
Socialist Party : 274 seats
Communist Party : 36 seats
Ecologists : 8 seats
National Front : 1 seat
Other left wing Parties : 16 seats
Right-wing coalition : 242 seats

I will send the definitive results later.For more information you can send me an e-mail.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 14:10)
Trouble on the Southern flank...New neighbor with several dogs...loud barkin dogs I might add....If they only knew who they were dealin with..
hahaha...if they only knew about Putney Vermont...and barkin dogs...Dobermans...they's DEAD now...lead poisoning....I think they got the hint as it got quiet in a hurry....Thank God I got Eddie on the Northern flank....cause he's got a gun.....Moved a 1,000 miles fer peace and quiet and commune with the ocean-nature...Not to listed ta some sick ROTweillers go beserk...Don't know what this has to do with GOlD but I'll try and weave it in somehow.....If gold does go to one or two thousand as some here have predicted things will be so bad you'd better be pretty self sufficent and NOT dependant on the system...What you gonna those gold bars.....barter perhaps....lived without electricity fer 7 years...let em take it away....heated with wood fer 20+ years...Oil can go to a 100 Dollars a barrel...grow mosta me costs can sky rocket....Everyone is predicting collapse....Are YOU ready fer it???....
or are you dependant on "the system"....Do you walk the walk or just talk the talk...I know what the Cape Bretoners do!!!...Evils of SOCIALISM!!!.
Like an insidious germ....infectin everything in its path....What happens to GOLD if the Socialists prevail in France....You'd think it would help the U.S. Dollar but then anything rational these days???? How bout it RR.....

(Sun Jun 01 1997 14:15)
@...we stand on guard for thee ....
If canada has problems it is because we have had about 100 years of bland liberalism that makes a point of being everything to everyone every election - no matter what name the political party operates under.

If you want to see a better Canada you will need to wait until the current crop of losers - party leaders - retire and ( hopefully ) a visionary with leadership and credibility comes forward.

Are you not tired of professional politicians ? Chretian, Charest ( ? ) Manning- all professional politicians with no other claim to success.

Canadians are a bland version of Atlantic liberalism long suffering from political noise from a minority of Quebec ethnocentric nationalists- who are ( truly ) the world's most favoured ( spoiled ) nation.

Fellow Canadians get ye ready for another four years of bland ruderless liberalism - whoever wins tomorrow.

Eh! Canada !

(Sun Jun 01 1997 14:16)
@not convinced
Bob: A month or two previous I posted my opinion regarding the phantom strength of the USD. Although I agree with your post regarding the world's opinion of the US, please realize that intelligent world citizens envy the US corporate economy, not the US Government currency or debt ( which is actually owned by the Japanese ) . As we all know, many of the US companies are backed by foreign stockholders or foreign outright owners!

I think that many Europeans understand the distinction. Am I wrong?

George S. Cole
(Sun Jun 01 1997 14:17)
World Gold Council
The latest weekly market analysis from the World Gold Council. Note that two other cases of ore sample tampering have turned up.

Weekly Gold Market Commentary

19 - 23 May 1997
[Previous Week]

The gold price remained under pressure in the early part of last week, undermined by a
combination of renewed speculative short selling and sizeable producer selling. The
speculative activity was essentially the tail-end of the previous weeks German-inspired sell-off while the
producer selling, which was mainly transacted through two London dealers, mostly appeared to be for three
years and more forward and was rumoured to be of South African origin. Technical support held firm at the
$340 level, however, and with the help of good consumer demand, strong platinum and palladium prices and
a steady dollar/yen exchange rate, gold spent the rest of the week consolidating around $342. The release
of the WGCs "Gold Demand Trends" publication on Wednesday, showing record offtake
in the first three months of the year, also helped improve market sentiment.

It now appears that the market has come to terms with Germanys proposal to revalue its gold reserves in
order to help bridge a DM18 billion shortfall in tax revenues and achieve the criteria needed for EMU.
Chancellor Kohl has repeated that no gold will be sold from Germanys reserves, and the revaluation plan
itself is meeting with severe criticism within Germany; there have also been accusations of "figure fudging"
by other European nations. The plan, which has still not been released in detail, is due to be discussed at a
regular meeting of the Bundesbank on Wednesday, 28th May.

There have been no further developments reported in Switzerland, where the proposed revaluation of gold
reserves and sale of a proportion of them to create a humanitarian fund is also meeting with strong opposition.

The most recent CFTC reports confirm that the rally in gold prices that occurred before the German
announcement on the revaluation of gold reserves was accompanied by active short covering. The net short
position of the large speculators on Comex fell sharply during this period from 40,249 to 17,683 contracts
( from 125 to 55 tonnes ) . The uncertainty engendered by Germanys revaluation plan encouraged a bout of
renewed short selling, however, so that the large speculators net short position rose again to 30,237
contracts ( 94 tonnes ) by May 20th. Meanwhile, gold lease rates firmed slightly over the week, but there
appears to be no shortage of liquidity, particularly for the nearby months.

Junior exploration stocks suffered two further blows last week in the wake of the Bre-X affair, when it was
announced that samples from deposits owned by Delgratia Mining and Golden Rule Resources had been
tampered with.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 14:18)
Kolorado: Amen.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 14:21)
@...What do you call the noise from Quebec ?
Selby: We agree about the Country and T.O. being a very nice place to live. Canadians are definitely complainers. You prove that we have become numb to complaints. Do you not think that the entire Quebec separatist issue over the last 30 odd years is one gigantic complaint that won't go away ?

(Sun Jun 01 1997 14:25)
French Man ( 14:10 ) Very interesting!.....but predictable!...Germans bickering....currency markets-Gold should be worth folowing tonight!!!...
Hi Jin! Let me know if anything spectacular happens in your area during Monday's trading.....You'd think the U.S.Dollar would be strong tonight..
thus it'll probably crash....

(Sun Jun 01 1997 14:26) many false starts ?
O.K. folks...we waited for the French and the Germans to get onside ( to help us gold investors out ) and now we need some good ( bad ) econmic news this week and if this falls into place and gold does not move past the 340s we know we are definitely in trouble for the short-term - under one year.

Cheers....GO BAILEY ! ( the runner not the booze )

George S. Cole
(Sun Jun 01 1997 14:32)
French elections
Tomorrow should be an interesting day for gold, currencies, and European stock markets. Apparently there are many people in this world who DO NOT LIKE U.S. Social Darwinist philosophy and will actively oppose its spread.

I have long maintained that a backlash against the now extant free market worship was inevitable and would ( in time ) be very bullish for gold. Looks like it may have begun.


Click Here

Leftists win majority in French parliamentary elections, exit polls

Copyright  1997
Copyright  1997 Reuter Information Service

PARIS ( June 1, 1997 2:07 p.m. EDT ) - France's Socialist-led left-wing opposition was on course for a stunning parliamentary election victory in Sunday's decisive
runoff, all televised computer projections showed.

All projections broadcast as the last polls closed at 8 p.m. ( 1800 GMT ) gave the Socialists and their non-communist allies an absolute majority of seats in the
577-member National Assembly even without the Communist party, forecast to win 35-36 seats.

The projected outcome was a crushing defeat for President Jacques Chirac's center-right coalition, which held 464 seats in the outgoing lower house, and will force
Chirac to share power with a hostile, Socialist-led government.

Chirac dissolved parliament on April 21 and called a snap election 10 months ahead of schedule saying he needed a "new elan" to lead France into a single European
currency from a position of strength.

Projections by three leading polling institutes suggested his center-right coalition would lose half of its seats. The ecologists were set to enter parliament for the first
time with seven seats and the extreme-right National Front might win two.

[ Global | Stateside | Sports | Politics | Opinions | Business | Techserver | Health & Science | Entertainment | Weather | Baseball | Basketball | Football | Hockey | Sport
Server | MAIN ]

Copyright  1997
Do you have some feedback for the Nando Times staff?

(Sun Jun 01 1997 14:33)
Selby: Until you've been to Cape Breton you ain't seen SOCIALISM in Canada....or the evils it can cause....No responsibility for anything is taken....everything is up to the government or the goverment's fault....
Say good-by to the lobster industry in Atlantic Canada! it goes the way of "the Cod"......Watchin this unfold right from the living-room window.....SOCILAISM=NO COMMON SENSE!.....

(Sun Jun 01 1997 14:36)
Bob: I may or may not be numb but I am a Separatist. There is nothing I would rather see than the the Quebecers who wish to become a separate country become one. I imagine it would be about 25% of the current Province and centered around Lac St Jean. Then this would be I bland country eh by gar!!!!

(Sun Jun 01 1997 14:37)
George S Cole: Good post on French elections and it sounds much worse than anticipated.....You can always count on the fun will start in about 6 hours...

(Sun Jun 01 1997 14:40)
George S. Cole: People might vote for leftist parties but these parties themselves are moving more to the right. I believe the pendulum is swinging to the right. Take a look at Bill Clinton. His economic policies are more conservative than those of previous democratic presidents.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 14:49)
Ted: You are talking about the excess of the past 30 years of transfer payments and political buy offs resulting in a bunch of layabouts living off the work of people in BC Alberta and Ontario. I have been to Cape Breton and have no problem with your description but see it as a marginal extremes --that I'm paying for--sort of like the Washington DC government.
Every time I see the beer bellied Newfie on TV complaining that he hasn't had a job in five years and his welfare is running out I thank heavens that he and your neighbours are in the boonies and not living in Toronto where it would cost me a whole lot more to keep him in the indolence that he has be come accustomed to. This isn't socialism you are talking about its old fashioned pork barrelism--IMHO. Socialism is where I paid for medical services via my taxes and when I needed a few thousand dollars worth I didn't have to take out a mortgage on my house.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 14:52)
Who's goin to win the Million and a half dollars...Donovan Bailey ( Canada ) or Michael Johnson ( USA ) ....

(Sun Jun 01 1997 14:56)
VRONSKY: I just tried to e-mail someone else ( which I seldom do ) and the "missing argument" came up again. So, the problem's on my end.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 15:09)
GREAT POST and discription of reality here...The most trite of the union rhetoric here is "we gotta put food on the table"....Well...By the looks of the over-whelming majority...they's puttin TOO much food on table!! Almost everyone has a BIG beer gut...yeah, they're really starvin ta death here...hahahahaha.....I know millonaire's sons+daughters in the states that aren't as SPOILED as the sons+daughters of coal miners and steel workers in Cape Breton...Can only laugh at the pathetic rhetoric...he haw....Yeah, your right Selby this ain't's appeasement...Ottawa buyin em off to keep em under control but at the same time creating a real long term festering problem for Canada...Wait till the next generation here grows ( ? ) up here.....A similar problem is ocurring in the states by creating a permanent underclass of citizens...Throw money at em and they'll stay under control....yeah..fer now...

(Sun Jun 01 1997 15:15)
George Cole is absolutely correct/ there is a big backlash building against fiscal austerity. France is nothing wait til they try to do something with the Earned Entitlements here in the US re baby boomers. There will be a big boom as Social Security and medicare have been paid for thus people will feel not getting them is like stealing. There will be balancing but someone is going to end up paying ( or printing ) to make good to those who paid into the system. The message from Europe is that the people are becoming fed up with actions that hurt them but help the financial mkts. I agree with George the beginning of this leftward economic trend in politics is good for gold.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 15:20)
Ted: We agree. There is no real reason that there isn't much to do in the Maritimes. Korea isn't better favoured. Ireland isn't much better off and they produce about 80% of the computer software in the world I'm told and from a socialist country. Japan ain't got nothing going for it but the work of its citizens. In Nova Scotia they were lucky if they can get it together to put Volvo's together that arrived in kit form.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 15:21)
WW ( 15:15 ) You finally said something I can agree with!...Bravo...

(Sun Jun 01 1997 15:26)
GOVERNMENT: What are your views concerning the following roles of government:
1. Regulation of industry to prevent fraud.
2. Financial rescue operations for troubled corporations and financial institutions.
3. Maintainace of military.
If people don't have government regulations on their backs they often like to engage in fraud, grand larceny and embezzlement. Witness for example the S&L fraud. If you are a true conservative you must agree that the defrauded depositors should not have been bailed out. Very few selfproclaimed conservatives will agree with that. While they certainly want government off their back they also want their deposits insured.

Also: Is not the military the greatest socialist institution around: Central planning, lack of individual liberty, entitlements. is this not one of the primary appeals for the underclass to join the military?

(Sun Jun 01 1997 15:33)
With the present controversy surrounding the EMU, it would seem reasonable to expect increasing numbers of people to suddenly begin paying attention to the concept of fiat currencies in general. The French elections and toppiness of world equity markets should 'incentivize' the process. As pointed out earlier by others, it should indeed be an interesting week in the markets.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 15:35)
Selby: You obviously have been to Nova Scotia-Cape Breton.....Mainland Nova Scotia is like a "mecca" of free enterprise compared to Cape Breton.
....They are like two seperate provinces that very much resent each other
and I must say I totally side with the "mainlanders" ...right MGraves!..
....the attitudes in CB are some of the worst I have ever encountered...and I been around...and back!...There are exceptions but the majority are some of the laziest people on earth who just should I say ...WHINE!...Poor babies..I feel for ya...Your lives ( with all the lattest toys+trinkets ) are so rough...hahaha!
Depressed Atlantic Canada...hahahaha...never seen a depressed area where the people lived such SOFT, CUSHY, lives......When CB gets money from Ottawa the local newspaper "the cape Breton Post" refers to the federal money as GOODIES...What's that play money er somethin...The waste and decadence is incredible fer such a "depressed area"...They don't know what depressed is!!...

(Sun Jun 01 1997 15:45)
@Pressing Problems

Earl@ 15:33--The Socialists have promised earlier
retirement, shorter work week with no reduction in
pay, and higher employment. The term "painting
yourself into a corner" comes to mind. The only
"solution"? Fire up them presses!

(Sun Jun 01 1997 15:53)
MIke@: There are philosophical views on this site that differ dramatically from your myopic reference to standard "libcons". Though small in number they would categorically reject each conclusion. ie, putting your money in a bank is not materially different from any other investment. Choose with care and assume your own risk. It is after all the depositors asset.

Moreover, I think it is unfair to pose and posit in the same paragraph. If you wish to pose a question. It is only fair to allow a response without ascribing an answer that may not reflect opposing views. In effect you have opened the debate and closed it. The process becomes merely a rhetorical device. With no net gain.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 15:56)
Auric: You said it better than I could. The net result should be the same. Now all we need do is look for the signs.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 16:11)

Ted ( 14:10 ) Better that gold go up on basis of production
deficits alone. Say to between $650 and $700. Then get
rid of issuing of goverment bonds and pay them off at
face value. Then stop or curtail fractional reserve
banking. This would allow for gold prices that are still
higher than stated above and without the pain that you so
logically allude to.
Also we can use some silver in the monetary system.
Its removal was LBJ's legacy.
Remember the old LBJ/surgeon's joke, with the punch line
- All I had to work with was a horses ass and a cowboy
hat, and he went on to become President of these United

(Sun Jun 01 1997 16:12)
@New England
Just went over to EBN and the Est in France was 333 Left and 242 Right. I dont know if we should get too excited about this with respect to immediate gold prospects. Remember the Left, except for Communists, are pro EMU but they just want more lenient criteria. Germany's gold revaluation to make the nos. look better is parallel to the French austerity problems. Much like US did in shortening Treasury maturities to lower interest costs temporarily to make the deficit look better. The IMPORTANT message is that there is insurmountable resistance to cuts in govt programs everywhere in the interests of creating nirvana for financial investments. This is VERY important/Ques is when will it start to show its effects on Gold. If we can see the writing on the Wall I find it hard to believe some BIG NON CENTRAL BANK money is not reaching the same conclusion or noting the risk parameters are changing. The current political change might be compared to the quiet shift to the right ( at the time ) Reagan 1980 Thatcher 1979. Remember the shift to the REAL right began in Europe then spread. Same may be now occurring in reverse. Before 1978 the the paradigm was always to the left. Since 1979 the "paradigm has always been to the right". This is what may be changing and if it is it has very important implications for the investment world.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 16:22)
Jack ( 16:11 ) LBJ is startin to look good.....

(Sun Jun 01 1997 16:31)
Where's Bernatz

Maybe BERNATZ DE VENTEDORM returned to his little village
in the Pyrenees? - Zu place zee vote. Bernatz, what's
your take on the election's in France.

Senator Blutarsky
(Sun Jun 01 1997 16:31)
@The Toga Party

Damn it all! I agree with WW's 16:12 post. I love
the smell of burning paper in the morning. Smells

(Sun Jun 01 1997 16:50)
Illogical gold
Hello Everyone.
I see a lot of new names.
Been out for a couple of months.......
( better said....just prefered to be an ostrich )
AU has just been toooo depressing to watch...
Logic has long since been thrown out the window.

Has BT come in with anything interesting?

(Sun Jun 01 1997 16:58)
@New England
The dollar action in light of potential EMU problems will be interesting. If EMU problems strengthen the dollar it may be a temporary life line to further inflate the bubble here. If real money views it not for what the new French Govt will do but rather the beginning of a change in the paradigm then we may see better results for gold sooner. Wall St will put the best spin on this possible they will say "this makes the US dollar and bonds and Stk mkt even more compelling" . This will be the case as long as prices cooperate to give them such cover. Manipulate those futures boys as news follows price and we have a bubble which can not afford any negative spin.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 16:59)
Mike: I must have missed something because I couldn't follow your last post except for the last point ie that the military is a socialistic feature of society. It is in many ways. Medical care usually doesn't cost anything while in service and usually is free or reduced afterwards
especially for vetrans. In Canada the Canadian Legion is famous for cheap beer as well. In principle it not too different. Armed forces get low pay but services they don't have to pay for when they need them. It is an extreme--you can die and you follow orders but in concept its not
different. But I couldn't figure out what the rest of your post was about.

Going to be off Kitco soon for a month so the "socialism isn't the cause of all evil" posts are about to stop-- for a while.

George s. Cole
(Sun Jun 01 1997 17:00)
left and right
WW: Glad to see there is someone here on my wavelength re: a likely move to the left in global politics after 19 years of rightward momentum. Mike is right that today's left is far more conservative than the 1970s left. But the financial markets now have so much optimism built into them ( and gold so much pessimism ) that even a marginal shift in the political wind could trigger big market adjustments. And marginal shifts have a way of turning into major movements when the pendulum has swung too far too long to one side of the political spectrum.

Just as the 1979 election of Thatcher in Britain provided an early signal of a boom in financial assets and a bust in gold, current developments in France and Germany may signal much better times for gold and much worse times for financial markets. Too soon to be sure, but the odds are looking good.

Poster 2323
(Sun Jun 01 1997 17:13)
WW a Social Security Gimmick

WW: We sell our National Park's to China, and throw in a
couple of Monuments and Seashore's as well, this should
help to pay for Social Security.
But the real icing, will be the direct flight's from
Beigin to Yosemite or to wherever they own a piece of the
USofA. Buy the Airlines, the heck with gold. Sounds like
a typical W.S. promotion to me. HAR HAR HAR. Not much
different than our debt based system.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 17:16)'s the Monsoons in India Stupid ! ... another view on gold price.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 17:20)
@New England
GS COLE: Just as the 70s left was far to the left of todays left where are we heading in twenty years in the pardigm given the immense future govt promises. The propaganda re self reliance to get people to give up what they know they paid for is not going to work. Prediction/of a trend/ in 20 years both the right and left will be alot furher to the left than they are today. What does this mean for the investment horizon?? The ans is there, but the question is timing. Clearly Wall St the CBs etc will try to keep things going as they are. Ques is when other big money decides it is time to make a move before the crowd and causes problems for over leveraged financials which were always pushed to the upside and over leveraged precious metals where said leverage was an instrument of price suppression. The mkts will tell us when this is happening. Ques is whether it will be sudden and dramatic given the current distortions and imbalances. ie could it all explode in just a couple of days with no escape hatches for anyone?

I have heard no mention of Fench Elections on CNN Headline News as of 5:15 PM EST. This may mean they didnt like the result and do not want to deemphasize it to protect our financial mkts from investor worry.
I havent been watching it every minute but I have heard nothing and you would think it would be worthy of a major mention.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 17:24)
Re: Mike:
Mike regarding your question on the roles of government.
1 ) Regulation of industry to prevent fraud: This can be a problem. Left on their own industry could steal as much as 10% of that the gov is currently stealing.
2 ) Financial rescue operations: The s&l debacle is 100% a product of government, as will be the comming 10x greater failure of all banks.
3 ) Maintainance of a military: We need a military. To protect OUR country may require as many as 200,000 troops, almost all stationed here. However it looks like we may need a few more as it appears our chief may have sold China a few of our secret military goodies. Ah government, they want my six-shooter but give our main adversary billions of times that fire power. I guess I just don't see the big picture.

I am not too sure about all the proper roles of government. I do know in this country they have too much money, too many computers and too many phd's sitting around with too much time on their hands. All those resources looking to do good. Hide the virgins and your pocketbooks.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 17:26)

Just read about the election in France. With the left scoring a huge victory I think this will mean the end of EMU. The line so far has been that even if the left wins there will be an EMU because the left are also for it. The 'only' change would be the accounting subterfuges would now be legitimized and that more countries ( read Italy ) would make it into the first round. The recent move by the Bubu to tell Wiegel to take a hike with regards to gold revalutation says that the real power in Germany is making itself heard. By my read there is no way in the world that the German banking and financial community will ever agree to monetary union with Italy. No how, no way. Given that a majority of people in Germany also do not want EMU, once the issue comes to a yeah or ney either in the form of a referendum or some political contest like Kohl reelection it will be good night EMU. One other interesting plot twist is that the French left are against the remaining privitizations of state owned businesses. Unfortunately for them France was counting on big cash from the sales to help toward deficit reduction. No sales, no EMU.

Short term this will be a big plus for the DM as people head out of the peripheral currencies. Should be interesting to see the action in the Italian bonds on Monday. The EMU spin masters will try their hardest to put a good light on the election outcome. We shall see about the market's verdict.

Out to dinner, be back later.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 17:27)
TED -- Gun? Canada? Those two don't go together! I watched part of a 'news' program down here the other day, the story was about... a gun! It was quit a story actually. You see, this 'gun' went out and murdered several people. It was finally 'caught' and sentenced! Now hold on you capitol punishment abolishers! The gun was fairly sentenced to be melted down! Its remains are to be used in the constuction industry! True story folks. Problem is, they never caught the PEOPLE who pulled the trigger. I guess we're about to see the same Goebbels theory applied to the currencies and gold.. :- ) )

Everybody talks about 'revaluing' their gold, but NO ONE talks about devaluing their currency! What is a stock worth anyhow?

(Sun Jun 01 1997 17:27)
@ now if only LBJ's ghost would be in charge of the FED we'd be O.K.
I understand that LBJ's short tenure as President established the ground work for modern ( post-WWII ) U.S. deficit spending.

With French socialism in power, a Labor PM at 10 Downing Street, cracks in German fiscal stoicism, and the whole 'tucking' world against gold - is there finally light at the end of this very dark tunnel ?

Thanks to GS Cole, Voronsky and other gold evangalists for keeping the flame alive - eventually we'll all get it right, eh !


(Sun Jun 01 1997 17:36)
@ the gun

Panda: Beautifully said.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 17:38)
John Disney -- If your around, what is the deal with Kloof mines? I haven't been able to find out much information on it. It seems like a company that everybody likes to hate. The stock price has been in a long slide down. Is managment the problem, or are reserves dwindling? Any info would be appreciated, thanks.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 17:41)
Jack -- It'll be coming soon to a 'building' near you! Watch for it. :- ) )

If it weren't so sad, I'd be laughing out loud....

(Sun Jun 01 1997 17:46)
WW: Here you go:

(Sun Jun 01 1997 17:53)
@ ...we stand on guard for thee !...
Selby: I agree with you. Habitants outside of Montreal who want to go it alone should have the right to give up all their Canadian privileges immediately and leave us all alone. The only solution is to permit a nation within a nation to co-exist without putting up any geographic borders. Separatists need only pay their taxes to the Separatist govt in Quebec City and federalist Quebecers pay taxes to a newly formed provincial govt. in Montreal. Simple. Clean. End of story.

The problem is, as you will probably agree, the liberal machine ( PC or Liberal ) has made great political hay out of the noise from PQ over the last 30 yrs.

The fathers of modern separatism are Trudeau-Bourassa who together foisted the War Measures Act on an entire nation to catch a few amateurs who eventually killed a controversial guy who happended to be a junior minister of Bourassa's govt - the James Cross ( British Trade officer ) kidnapping was a media play - thus legitimizing a few looney tunes with an idealistic revolutionary agenda.

Do you realize that Jacque Rose is walking the Streets of Montreal as hero today ?!

Prominent poets/entertainers who toyed as fridge romantic separatists now had a reason to go into the movement full-force after WMA was proclaimed and the army rumbled the streets of Montreal with APC's and tanks. WAY WAY overblown and the beginning of the end for compromise in Quebec.

Do you remember the story of one high profile chantuse ( singer ) who was rudely interupted during intercourse by Montreal police who smashed into her montreal apt. with a warrant for arrest under the war Measures Act.

If that ever happended to me or you man we would also be tucking separatists - may oui !!??

If it wasn't for the greatest political blunder in Canadian history - instituting War Measures Act in 1971 - the Separatists would have been comfined to ( barracks ) blowing up mail boxes once in awhile and calling in a few false bomb alarms - still happening in Montreal's Place Ville Marie every so often - to let us know they haven't faded away.

We still have Liberals who actually believe they are the only glue to keep Quebec in Canada !

I'm with you ! Let's get rid of these people and get our political lives back in order without this annoying noise from a minority of Quebec facists.

Oh ! Canada !

(Sun Jun 01 1997 18:11)
Toronto--Home of the World's Fastest Man
Bob: I agree with the Good-bye Separatist sentiment. But always remeber most of the folks who post here are way out on the margin regardless of which country they live in. I doubt most of the people I meet on a daily basis ever thought of letting a reduced Quebec go and getting on with life.

All the politicians except Presto and all of the national media are wrapped up in the same concerns of the last 30 years. An abrupt change means their working life has to change. Most won't like that.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 18:12)
regaring Mr. Greenspan and Balderdash

I think that when all is said and done Mr. Greenspan is
the most knowlegeable Central Banker that we ever had.
While I don't agree with his assessment that inflation is
overstated - he knows a lot better than me.
So why can't he say before the Congress. That gold
because of it's production deficits; SHOULD SELL AT A
MUCH HIGHER PRICE and the perception of it's connection
to inflation is BLADERDASH in this day and age. Sorry
Jimmy I just love that word.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 18:15)
Panda- Thanks a bunch for the URL. I'll be digging away.

Gery, FrenchMan- Thank you for sharing your point of view. Kitco tends to be heavily weighted to a North American outlook on events. I often have a sense of myopia in this regard, that we are missing a large part of the picture. Your input is very much appreciated.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 18:34)

I can't agree with a broken up Canada, irregardless of
who it makes happy. Its a great country, regardless of
the differences.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 18:40)
"Just a shift to the left"
WW ( 16:12 ) - Hey WW, astute post.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 19:03)
Inernets favorite economist, George Cole, sees DOW peaking in late summer - anticipates beginning of secular gold bull in same period. See Coles Market Insights - YOU MUST RELOAD:

(Sun Jun 01 1997 19:08)

Selby & Bob :

And here I thought I was the only person on this side of the Atlantic who thought we should let Quebec go. Thanks fellow Canadians ! Finally some group is standing up and rejecting the name of bigot / racist / ( thrown at anyone who doesn't agree with our political elite ) , in order to achieve a better country for our children. Each march starts with 1 step.

TED: Selby's right that socialism is what covers our butts in disasterous times, not what goes on at the pig trough each and every hour in order to keep the complainers satified. I don't think I'd mind so much if they were grateful for the assistance but they've come to expect it as a right of citizenship which really eats my shorts ( apparel and stocks! ) .


Great eh!

(Sun Jun 01 1997 19:20)
@New England
Selby: Thanks for the Toronto site!

Strad Master
(Sun Jun 01 1997 19:21)
Any news?
D.A. As the preeminent Kitco white metals expert, what do you see happening to PA and PL in the next few days? Will the Russians actually start to deliver? Can they? Any news as to whether the Russians signed on the dotted line with Japan? Tiger Fund would lose big if PA actually made it to market.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 19:26)
Why Bre-X Salted??
All..I'm going to throw this goose egg up to see if anyone will catch it.. IMHO, the goverment, banks and financials have done thier evil
best to discourage the public about hard assets. As you know, goverment
wants to borrow ( and borrow ) at low interest. The banks have a nice
deal, lending out cheap money at higher rates and the Market would
rather you not buy hard assets but to trade ( and trade ) paper.
To me, it appears that maybe the CIA or SOMEBODY may have used the
Salt-Shaker at Bre-X, Delgratia and who knows where else, to help destroy
the future outlook for gold. Bre-X was a good example. By first indicating that HUGH supplies of gold were available ( to discourage investors ) then knowing the truth will prevail, let the gold stocks crash to discourage more gold investors.. ( Double Header )
It just seems to be weird things going on out there..
May the goose egg be of Gold.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 19:38)
Home of the World"s Fastest Man
Front and Jack: Front I agree but would change political elite to political/media elite. Watch the "Panel" on Wendy's prgram and I bet you will see what I mean at 10 PM. I predict Presto gets bombed for sauying waht a lot think re Quebec leadership. Jack: I think it would be even a greater country if the 2-3 million people who seem not to want to be part of it left.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 19:52)
I agree with Polarbear: NAOKO is no who "she" pretends to be.

Presto man
(Sun Jun 01 1997 20:26)
Front, Selby; It's easy to say let Quebec go but what do you do with the 3.5
million CANADIANS in Quebec that don't want to go. It's time for Plan B, if
Canada is divisible so is Quebec OR better still, we declare Canada indivisible,
PERIOD. The last 40 years of appeasing Quebec has not worked and it's time
for a different tact.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 20:28)
@ Canada: Love it or leave it
HERE'S LOGIC: EBN gold down $0.45. Reformers...remember to vote tomorrow. Conservatives, Liberals, Canada Action Party, Marxist-Leninists, and Greenies, NDPers...please vote Tuesday.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 20:44)
SILVER: An enigma wrapped in an anomaly. Analyst Butlers 5/29/97 insightful study is a necessary read by all. See Guest Guru Ted Butler - CLICK RELOAD in Gold Digest page:

(Sun Jun 01 1997 20:48)
The Home of the Fastest Man in the World
Prestoman: I think Reforms view is the right one. Those areas/ridings that vote for separation next time should separate. Further if they turn out to be land locked--a good possibility-- give them Labrador and Newfoundland in return for a promise that they never try to come back. A clear route to the sea and get them all out of our pockets and off the national agenda.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 20:51)
Hi Novice!..U.S.Dollar strong against European currencies and Gold down .40...predictable initial reaction to unstable situation in Europe.....
Novice: Are you saying you don't like the NDP or somethin...Alexa was in Sydney today and neighbor Eddie ( the scam man ) went to hear her babble on and on...

(Sun Jun 01 1997 20:56)
What a gracious loser Michael Johnson was...NOT...The "ugly American" syndrome strikes...again...still haven't heard a thing on U.S. network TV on Confederation bridge...maybe I'm watchin the wrong network...

(Sun Jun 01 1997 21:01)
Novice: Low flying gull just dropped yer missive...Ain't I a great salesman fer retirement Cape Breton....

(Sun Jun 01 1997 21:08)
Front: Agree with you and Selby on socialism issue as opposed to what goes down in Cape Breton and you're right in that all the hand outs are NOT appreciated...Like PIGS at a trough they always want more...Too bad Bailey didn't agree to all or nothin...

(Sun Jun 01 1997 21:09)
@More on Politics
Hi Ted: Maybe logic does come into short-term ( i.e., this evening ) play here re: gold, with the strong US$ in light of French elections and other flux in Europe. My "Canada: love it or leave it" address below a bit strong, I guess, but I agree with Selby, Bob and Front that the national agenda here has been hijacked for the past FOUR decades ( or more ) on the separatist threat and it is time to fish or cut bait on the whole business. It has been debilitating for the country ( including Quebec....Exhibit A: look what has happened to Montreal ) .

(Sun Jun 01 1997 21:11)
Give em one way tickets to Socialist France!....

(Sun Jun 01 1997 21:18)
Novice: You have to learn to tone things down and not be so strident...
Only FOURTY YEARS and yer sick of the issue already...patience dear friend......WILL GET YOU NOWHERE!...Let em leave...on a boat!..or plane!
Where is everyone tonight?? Watchin Basketball...update:Jazz 58 Bulls 57

(Sun Jun 01 1997 21:53)

Sorry not to have responded yet to your Email. Will do so shortly.

WIth regards to the wild and wooly world of palladium, I don't think ( hope ) its over yet. I have no direct knowledge of the Russian position either with regards to stockpiles or intent to sell. All I see is the action in the market and the statements made by Tiger fund. For the game to be over would probably require that Tiger give up on its squeezing efforts. Since it is highly unlikely that they have liquidated their position given the severe tightness which still exists in the market I think that the game will go on. My read on Friday's action is that it was just a reversal of the strike news and first notice day of June Pa contract in N.Y. A lot of people were no doubt looking at the lack of apparent warehouse stocks and assumed that no metal would be forthcoming and they would participate in the squeeze. Perhaps someone with a decent pile of metal decided to take the sure 20$ per ounce which was on the table for a three month roll. I believe the action in coffee was pretty much like this in the march - may roll. The large backwardation was greeted by some spot supply, but defered purchases. When May came around it was squeeze time all over again.

One thing I think you can be sure of with the Russians is that they will do whatever they can to get the most bang for the buck. Their dumping last year was in response to a huge need for cash. Their position has either changed vis a vis a desperate need for cash or else they ain't got no more stuff to sell. If they do have more Pa in the old vaults I think that it will still be sold to the highest bidder. I can't see them walking into Tokyo and just agreeing to some price for a big load. Not when there are other folks out there ( Tiger fund et al ) who might well be prepared to bid it higher.

For what its worth, we still have our load and won't be parting with it any time soon unless there is some truely radical upward move. I still think that time is on our side as the fundamentals must cause price rationing. Since I have heard nothing with respect to any of the big consumers doing any substitution, I can only guess that the fundamental picture has not changed.

Short Buuuullllllll (Getting bullish!)
(Sun Jun 01 1997 22:12)
@ Catching Platinum Fever
D.A.: Looking at long-term charts today I noticed something quite
startling. Gold topped in January of 1980 while Platinum topped 2
months later in March 1980. This situation occurred on other rallies
as well, as gold would top out early ( likely due to hedge pressure )
while Platinum continues with great relative strength. A long Platinum
short gold trade takes care of the problem about getting locked limit
down in gold when gold tops out. Over the next 7 years, I see the
long Platinum and short gold spread as a real winner! Do others have
any thoughts on the subject?

(Sun Jun 01 1997 22:12)
Bulls Bah
The Bulls pulled off a lucky one. From this vantage point the Jazz look better. My prediction at this point is Jazz in 7. Also gold and silver up pretty well tomorrow.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 22:17)
Canadian Election tommorow and I would have been glad to forget all about it ( for once ) as after Mulroney I didn't even want to think about politics for at least two elections! C'mon guys - vote tommorrow and be done with it. I give our American buddies heck for tying up the airwaves, they tone it down, and now us dumb Canucks gotta start. Jeez!

(Sun Jun 01 1997 22:23)

Presto man:

In your last post you said that "it's easy to say let Quebec go" . Sir, I want you to know that this was one of the most difficult decisions I've ever had to make. To willingly devide ones country for the sake of your childs future is an important milestone in life. It's close to heretical I realize, as a lot of old style Liberals have commented to me, but I see no other way than the route that Mr. Manning and the Refprm party are suggesting as a means to peace. What's wrong with the equality of citizens in a country? What's wrong with taking the power from the people who have wasted it and giving it to a group closer to the people? What's wrong with having the 3.5 million seperatists having things the way they want WITHIN Canada? Whats wrong with the other 3.5 million Canadians in Quebec being treated as equals across this land? If anyone can tell me, I'll VOTE LIBERAL ! Otherwise, the future of my country will be determined tomorrow and it really was a difficult thing to say.

You mentioned the 3.5 million Canadians in Quebec. Either way, no matter what happens, we'll have half the population of Quebec pissed off! That's a no-win situation! So the present system of appeasment etc. hasn't/doesn't/won't ever work obviously. So let's wake up and look for other alternatives to keeping our country together.

Nothing personal I assure you. Just raising the flag.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 22:23)
@the market
Strad -- After taking a look at the June palladium contract and the next active contract month out, which is September, You'll notice the price 'equalization' that took place. They both ended the day in the low 170s! Probably won't take more than a day or two before it could head back up. Let me emphasize the word 'could'. I kind of feel the same way with gold, but silver has to 're-direct' its' attention towards the upside. ( Hey, BMI currently shows it up a penny and a half! ) . Platinum seems to be making a normal correction, and it may not be quite done yet. It would be more proper to wait for some decent basing action indicating that it was done in that direction. News could make it go in either direction very quickly though.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 22:37)
SHORT BULL: I wouldn't want to be short gold during the next 7 years. Matter of fact; gold is the last thing that I would want to perennially short. Better think about it some more.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 22:39)
WW: Will you quit the DNC and James Carville rhetoric on Soc. Sec. and Medicare. People get more than they paid for in Soc. Sec. and Medicare is subsidized health care ( subsidized by future generations ) . Soc. Sec. is not a pension plan. Many people get five times what was contributed for them in Soc. Sec. And for Medicare, people get five bucks of services for every buck they contributed. When will the ponzi scheme end. With the average boomer living probably into their 80s, it paints a future of economic slavery to the younger generations. But you obviously do not care about that.

Short Bull
(Sun Jun 01 1997 22:45)
@ ?
Savage: Who said anything about shorting gold. I am talking about a
spread trade...BIIIGGGGG difference!!! I am bullish gold, I am
just more bullish platinum as over time the premium in platinum
will widen as it usually always does on strength. At extreme lows,
Platinum loses to gold and can go under the price of gold. I would
not put on the Platinum/gold trade unless I was bullish on metals ( dah ) .

(Sun Jun 01 1997 22:46)
I see the move towards socialism lasting through the U.S. elections in 1998 ( with the operatives of big government out in force ) . I see the year 2000 ( partically in the U.S. ) as a potential backlash against the bully influence groups that steal for the economice future of this country through their WW styled socialism through incrementalism.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 22:51)
Short Bull - glad you're not leaving. More comments later.
D.A. - Did Friday's action in PA surprise you? I figured Thursday was
the reaction to the strike being settled. Friday caught me completely
offguard. I jumped into Sept. first thing Friday morning - boy was that
a bad move.

off to dinner - be back later.

kuston ( a new handle )

(Sun Jun 01 1997 22:51)
@ HSI, July 1st, and a Red Deal for the Billionaires
A few months ago the HSI was hovering around 12000 and the Red China take-over of the capitalist mecca was ( and still is ) a subject of more than passing interest and concern.

Now that we have listened to Mr. Market ( HSI style ) it appears that the recent rise in the HSI can be attributed to a Red contract with the wealthy elite of Hong Kong. Can anyone else offer an alternate explanation of the harmony and good fellas karma happening there ?

My read is that the HSI will be the Reds primary distributor of privatized Red govt entities - IPOs. The victims will be gullible Western and European banks and funds who have been well primed by the lead of the HK Billionaires for the story story of the 21st century. Who would offend this sleeping giant that is ready, willing, and able to play the capitalist game to move the Chinese economy into the forefront of nation states ?

The MO for buying into Red IPOs ( through HSI lead primary dealers ) is to join the HK Billionaires who are good mouthing the Reds and seemingly pumping more investment in HK - whats good for the inside rich folks should be good enough for the munchkins in Europe and West to throw some good money on the story story. ( Thats right - "story story", you know, infrastructure, a billion consumers, demand for higher standard of living, etc., etc. - a story built on top of stories. )

The way I see it is that the only reason the HK Billionaires are playing along with the Reds is because they probably have a "Red Deal" to secure and enhance their wealth as a "commission" for orchestrating Red China into the next financial and economic empire. Look out Darth vader !

In theory, given the population base of China, the Reds may very well eclipse the US economy sometime in the 21st century as the Americans had eclipsed the venerable British Empire in the early part of this century.

This, of course, could only happen if the West moves sufficient investment capital into China - much like the Brits did for the US before the Americans tossed the Limies out on the ask me no questions...


(Sun Jun 01 1997 22:53)
Short Bull: I think the mining shares ( for gold, silver, platinum, copper, etc. ) are more bullish ( i.e. better returns ) than the actual metals itself. I feel this way because of the decent jobs most mining companies have been ( and seems to be continuing ) doing in reducing cost. What do you think?

Short Bull
(Sun Jun 01 1997 22:55)
Savage: I guess it would be hard for anyone at this site to endorse even
a spread trade which involves selling gold as part of the spread trade,
even if it was the most economically feasible thing to do. I am not
married to my trades, my opinions, even my passions.....I am married to
my wife and I am still trying to figure that one out, Earl. I guess if
she can put up with me....

(Sun Jun 01 1997 22:58)
It seems that most are expecting a stronger Dollar as a result of the French elections. I wonder how strong is too strong? Guess we'll have to wait to see the European reaction in the metals early this A.M.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 22:59)
Bob: I think HK is a booby trap for investors. I would touch it with a ten foot pole. Suckers rally, in my view. A lot of reports show the iron fist of Red China is already starting pound on HK.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 22:59)
@the market
Short Bull -- It'll work, but your 'profits' won't be nearly as large. Personally, I'd just as soon be long both those metals and silver from low numbers, such as we have today, or soon, and not worry about it. Take the elevator ride on all of them. I think your spread trade might be better at the point where you THINK gold might have topped. Then short it while keeping the long platinums. This should help preserve the gains to date, and keep you fingers in for a potential turnaround.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 23:00)
@...for Canucks only
Lets face it folks. Presto, Jean, and Jean Jr. are all professional politicians who would not have achieved anything without riding the wave of father, Trudeaumania, and Baloney Mulroney - daddy/consultant to Charest, respectively.

We suffer from a long line of nobodies who dominate the political process and let things slide for the sake of political opportunism and expediency.

Reform would probably do better if Manning retired and let some new blood lead the next battle.


(Sun Jun 01 1997 23:03)
Short Bull -- Good point.

Short Bull
(Sun Jun 01 1997 23:05)
I definitely like being long gold shares ( via XAU ) more than the gold
metal due to the leverage of the shares to higher gold prices. I realize
the right unhedged Junior gold stocks will have the biggest returns but
I prefer the liquidity of the XAU. In regards to the metals, silver will
ultimately be the metal with the largest % gains, as silver can move to
$50.00 ( ten times a $5.00 price ) quicker than gold will go up ten times.
However, short-term as long as gold is being manipulated, I like the long
Platinum and short gold trade....buying Platinum on dips and selling gold
only on rallies. I would leg the spreads on. Other thoughts?

(Sun Jun 01 1997 23:08)
SHORT BULL: I guess I feel that gold may eclipse even platinum during the next 7 years. ALL: Am I irrational in this belief?

(Sun Jun 01 1997 23:09)
@the market
Short Bull -- Now you're talkin'! And silver will certainly be the biggest percentage mover!

Short Bull
(Sun Jun 01 1997 23:10)
To Eldorado
Exactly!!! I will be buying silver and Platinum on dips ( Palladium a
bit too thin for my tastes ) , and will wait to aggressively sell gold
when we reach much higher levels, selling some gold around $500.00,
resistance, selling more once we approach $650 to $800, etc. At above
$750 to $800 I would be totally hedged and watch the spread work for
me for further gains.

Short Bull
(Sun Jun 01 1997 23:14)
To Savage:
Looking at the charts I have never seen a time when platinum did not
gain on gold during rallies. Can anyone find a place where it did not
happen? Especially now with the great hedging going on in gold, selling
forward, etc., the yellow metal should lag. I guess if there ever was
a short-covering rally big enough to knock the shorts out on their
now bankrupt butts, gold could for a time be the big winner. However at
the top I feel Platinum will end up at higher levels and a little later
in the cycle....other thoughts?

(Sun Jun 01 1997 23:15)
Short Bull: I agree on the juniors comments. That, along with growth companies that have a proven track record, is where I'm focused. A little more risky ... but that is what I'm looking for in my asset allocation in the mining sector.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 23:17)
Dollar strong but not soaring...Gold down .50...RR gives speech at George Washington University tomorrow and lets see what goodies he pulls outta his bag of tricks...One month to go for HK!

(Sun Jun 01 1997 23:21)
@the market
Short Bull -- Maybe next time will, for some reason, be different, but I too cannot foresee why platinum would sell at a discount to gold on a big rally. Historically, only at the bottoms does platinum trade at a discount to gold.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 23:24)
Home of the World's Fastest Man
Mooney: You just calm down and accept the possibilty that after all the Clinton, RR, CB, Greenie, Libs ( US ) , Hilbillary, Gated Community, Sam Adams, etc chat around here--it is OK to mention and indeed comment on the possible outcome of a federal election in our own country. Sure we are conservative and polite but there is a possibilty that we are not all esculent even if some of us are from the Yukon.

Short Bull (
(Sun Jun 01 1997 23:27)
Through my free midday e-mail comments I provide my thoughts on Rydex
and Invesco ( formally Financial Group, Denver, Colorado ) sector funds.
Invesco gold fund ( heavily into juniors and small growth gold stocks )
has been slipping badly of late, but I feel it should bottom quite soon.
I feel the XAU is the best trading vehicle ( Rydex Precious Metals ) as
it is easy to chart the XAU during the day. But the XAU will have
problems due to hedging by some of the stocks. Newmont is not hedged I
am told but many of the other BIGS are. That will limit the XAU rise
long-term. In 1993 I was long Invesco gold fund at 3.82, jumped out at
a loss at 3.72 area. It dropped I believe down to 3.38 to 3.40 and then
really took off and I missed much of the moves. The fund went to 7.50 I
believe in 1993 and hit around 9.60 in early 1996, with some dividend
payouts. Today Invesco is in Euro Nevada, Franco Nevado, Lihr, and
numerous stocks that are highly touted based on my junk mail. I will
be moving back into Invesco once gold reaches above $400 but for now, I
am playing the XAU through Rydex. I am going to take Larry's challenge
and post my positions on this server if others want to follow along.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 23:28)
@the market
Savage -- Not ir-rational. Perhaps you'll tell us why you think that gold will surpass platinum. Maybe it'll enlighten us!

(Sun Jun 01 1997 23:34)
election @ excellent discussion
Mooney June 01 21:17: This Participant, disagrees with your reference to the discussion about the Canadian Election, but, very much agrees with your position, regarding THE MAN,*ON THE TAKE* Crime,Corruption and Greed in the Mulroney years.

When Brian Mulroney's Tories left office in 1993, Canadians breathed a collective sigh of relief. There had been boondoggles, cover-ups, and scandals aplenty and the strong suspicion that among those in power many had looked after themselves and their cronies at the expense of the citizens who had elected them. Canadians knew they didn't like the Tory regime, but they didn't know half the story ( by Stevie Cameron )

This participant has enjoyed each and ever post regarding the Canadian Election , and want to thank each person for sharing their views.

This participant is very much, 180 degree opposite view, in terms of most positions stated, regarding Medicare, and Quebec. Just thought you should know. A conservative with a *conscience*. Thanks again everyone.

Poster 2323
(Sun Jun 01 1997 23:38)

Goose: And Old Skull and Bones, the crackling Bush who
stated openly "A New World Order" made overtures to
Sukarno. Then who is a director at Freeport. Veddy,
Veddy Interestin____. Perhaps Bre-x will gain the status
of a folk hero.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 23:39)
@the market
Earl -- You still out there tonight? Noticed earlier that you were 'looking' at grains. You got the same take on them as I posted early early Saturday A:M?

(Sun Jun 01 1997 23:41)
To Front
When I's bullish I'll try to put the emphasis on the bull part of my
handle and when I'm bearish the short part. I am bullish which does
not meen I am recommending buying at the market, but I hope to get
long shortly, hopefully in the next 2-3 days, depending on the action!
I'm signing off now.

(Sun Jun 01 1997 23:42)
EBN Gold down .55 ...Good night TOO Tarnished!...But NOT you ALEXA!...Go Preston GO!

(Sun Jun 01 1997 23:45)
to Short Bull: I like following individual stocks ( a group ) versus a fund. More risky ... I know. I found the gold stock analyst site interesting ( ) with their potential takeovers and stocks around a buck picks ( a good starting point at least ) . Those are the types of individual ones ( along with some others I have looked into ) I'm looking at. Some don't have a whole lot of volume ( so they probably aren't for the faint hearted ... or for people who are trigger happy but have a lot of shares they want to sell with limit orders ) . All these elections are interesting ( French going socialist .. it figures; GB, etc. ) ... not really sure how to interpret them in relation to the metals. I would think the French Election is short term bullish for metals? Maybe no impact? Who knows .. I guess.

Short Bull
(Sun Jun 01 1997 23:52)
Caledonia Mining ???
I used to belong to an investment club that really pushed this stock,
thinking it was the stock over the next ten years that could go up
ten to 50 times. It had a big run-up and has since languished. I haven't
even checked the price lately...anyone have info. on it or opinions
about the company?