Gold Discussion for Investors and Market Analysts

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(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:02 - ID#57232)
G'Nite all! Peace please!
Please: Lets all calm down before we embarrass ourselves infront of our more civilized colleagues from DownUnder! I thought most of the conversation was great -- apologies Bart Kitner -- but I think the Saddam stuff is also highly relevant to Gold.

Bullish for gold:

The beginning of the Middle Eastern buying period for gold

Fireworks in Iraq ( only Iraq I hope )

Clash of the Hedge fund gold titans

More Clinton surprises

End of CB selling

G'Nite All!

Old Soldier
(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:03 - ID#185274)
Philosophy of war
JTF 23:46 In war there is no substitute for victory. General of the Army Douglas McArthur.

All soldiers want to win. Politicians should never loose the dogs of war unless they have a just cause in mind and total victory is the goal. Anything worth doing at all is worth overdoing. Overwhelming force is understood the world over and across all time. Contrary to popular belief, the use of overwhelming force against an enemy causes the least casualties for us and the enemy. It is the slow, brutal, grinding war that does the most damage.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:07 - ID#344308)

forgot the url

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:07 - ID#344308)

hot damn-----

post a few url's and a war breaks-out.....

well, read is all about the coming middle-east war....

be back with the iraqi anthrax.......and body cavities soon......

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:09 - ID#398105)
Ziva.......I think that it's about time you found a new hobby......

Date: Thu Jan 29 1998 16:45
Ziva ( General ( 14:28 ) , enough for your homosexual propoganda in this
forum. ) ID#302251:

"This is not surprizing at all if you will take the time to study
the history of sex and corruption in the Vatican.

WebCrawler has 25774 references to that:
&src=ns "

WHY NOT take up ... Pyroxene mineralogy, or Rock Fabric Analysis ...?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:13 - ID#257136)
Veterans March on Washington.
Didn't know FDR had command at that time.
He was once Sec. of Navy, I believe.
Do know it was MacArthur gave the order to FIRE to EISENHOWER.

BTW- nearly as I've been able to learn, m that was the closest ol' Ike ever got to a fire fight!!
Shameful chapter in OUR history!1

Shades of Waco and Ruby Ridge!!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:13 - ID#31868)
The one thing that bothers me about all of these so called reports on the Middle East is that they are always talking about when the war will start.

I have always thought the war was a constant and I have been waiting for peace to start.

The misery in that part of the world is a disgrace. IMHO

Get Camdesuss!!!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:14 - ID#344308)

here is a url that will take weeks to
read all the fascinating links....

happy hunting-------buy is good for 'the people!!!"

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:14 - ID#254179)
War and Gold
I draw your attention to the classic film
Kelly's Heros
Funny how those gold bars redefined just what it all means

Old soldier: Fine job!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:15 - ID#238422)
Old Soldier
One more question, if I can.

I noticed this paradox - big war is always a success ( as
a rule ) , but small military conflict is always ( at least
very often ) a disaster for U.S. military. U.S. military
is not to blame, they are very well armed and trained.

If you agree, what is the reason for such paradox?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:19 - ID#31868)
Eisenhower was put was where he was because he was a milktoast.

Now as to this silver law suit, it is a joke, plain and simple.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:20 - ID#57232)
Your posts are appreciated
Old Soldier: Your words ring true again. Fighting wars are necessary, and if they must be fought, they should be fought to win -- decisively, and with the least amount of civilian casualties.

I was brought up Quaker -- and I believe in peace and prosperity for all as the ultimate goal. But -- you must steel onself and fight for what you think is right, because there are times when it will be taken away from you.

I respect pacifists like Ghandi very much -- but that approach only worked because he chose to resist the British, who have a strong sense of honor and justice. If he had chosen to resist someone like Stalin, I don't know if the history books would have anything about him. Ghandi would not have been very effective against Saddam Hussein, either.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:23 - ID#31868)
And another thing ( pun intended ) what to you think will happen with gold on Friday. In my opinion with all of the external items aide I think the metals are going to make a surprise move upwards.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:26 - ID#288260)
Oris Old soldier
America fights wars of attrition very well. Lots of

munitions, men and equipment keep getting thrown into

the conflict until the opposition cannot keep up with

Americas' production. On the other hand small conflicts

don't call for the same perameters. The U.S. can fight

BIG wars but cannot fight small wars. My uncle fought

in Korea ( Brit ) he says you could always tell where

the U.S. forces were. A rabbit would run through the

bush and air strikes would be called in. These kind

of tactics don't work anymore.

Old Soldier
(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:26 - ID#185274)
Big war--Small war Paradox
Oris 00:15 The big warsmall war paradox is a problem for most great nations down through history. Great nations win most of their big wars or cease to exist. They fail in many of their small wars and keep muddling on. There is your answer. Great nations cannot afford to fail in big wars. Big wars leave few acceptable options except doing whatever is necessary to achieve victory. In small wars, politicians and some foolish generals have so many options that they are free to choose poorly and fail.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:28 - ID#373403)
Joke from the Treasury Department
4.2 ) How do you make a contribution to reduce the public debt?

Please follow these important steps to make a contribution to reduce the public debt.
1. Make check payable to the "Bureau of the Public Debt"
2. In the memo section of the check, make sure you write "Gift to reduce the Public Debt"
3. Mail check to -

Capital Area Servicing Center
1300 C St. S.W.
Washington DC 20239-0001

Do you think they would accept gold?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:28 - ID#238422)
Tolerant, it's really funny and seems not being
justified, but I got the same feeling about Friday...

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:29 - ID#31868)
In considering Mr. G you left out one critical factor as to how he got rid of the British. He united all the different fractious sects and factions by putting a face on a common enemy to all.

Once acomplished, they killed him. And cut up the victory into slices which remain intact to this day.

Quixotic 1
(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:30 - ID#176235)
Slow progress, maybe, to late

I see very few changes for the better, albeit some. I still see far too much of the old "take care of me and my friends first" mentality, with complete disregard for their constituency's rights, beliefs and fiduciary interest. I think there is a movement under foot to take more responsibility for our representation, little, too late. Give the masses their beer ( Bud ) , pizza, football, and the "Illusion of Prosperity", and the lemmings won't make waves. There is no more solidarity in "We the People, of these united States" ( small u intentional ) .
Is it possible that the CIA director was commenting about the Whitehouse's inability to keep control of its dirty laundry? These agencies are all arms of the Whitehouse. How independent can their views and public comments be? BC is professional politician. That's it. The office imparts disdain on all it touches. I believe we have a lot to worry about, as BC searches for a legacy.
I had the privilege of discussing this current BC incident with our Governor. Her daughter had worked at the Whitehouse as an intern some years ago. After about 10 minutes of the standard Party Line response, I asked if She would allow her daughter to return for another term...I did not get a response !!!
Sorry for the attack, It was either that, or I take it out on my dog. My wife is starting to worry. The poor dog has only one leg left.

Gold for the good guys...GMJ

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:31 - ID#227238)
T1: You may be right. As in correct. .... This week's action may have represented some folks taking advantage of better news for general equities and bonds, in order to shake some gold loose so they can cover before the weekend. ........ Then again, it may be just another grim Friday in the gold market. No longs willing to hold over the weekend.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:32 - ID#31868)
Old Soldier
You left out a critical factor. It is the bankers that have learned that large wars are not as profitable and are far more risky. The politicians and generals all get a paycheck from the same people.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:39 - ID#31868)
oris - Earl
More just a gut reaction on Friday. However I see many items exterior to the market which can send gold up in a nice healthy streak. If things start to get real heated in the Middle East, zoom to the moon. This event will not be like the last. Friday I see a nice little move up. The other thoughts will greatly affect the coming weeks.

The world is nervous and gold is the only real money on the planet, I do not dismiss silver, however gold is where much larger blocks of money can be placed quickly. Plus, there is not that much silver to buy considering the vast amounts of paper looking for a home in the event that nerves become, shall we say edgy.

In either metal, gold or silver, the amount of paper is huge, the amount of the metals is quite finite.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:39 - ID#373403)
Silver Lawsuit and other musings
The silver lawsuit is most likely legal blackmail. Someone knows that there are secrets which are better paid for than brought out in public. The case would lose but would bring out uncomfortable facts. A $million or two would be a small price. Don't ask me what the secret is, I just have a gut feeling based on the ridiculousness of the suit.

Fidelity Select Precious Metals moved very little based on a $3/oz down day. Maybe the newfound upward volatility is attracting long term investors. People like me who got in late in the game and are not scarred by the last year ravages.

I would not mind Oris so much if she was not conducting this online public affair with John Disney.

What happened to this mornings news that DNA tests were complete on Monica Lewinsky's dress? That is not something a good liar would lie about. I think this Ken Starr reluctance to grant immunity and Monica's reluctance to testify is brilliant stagecraft to appear apolitically motivated. Presidential "stuff" saved on her dress as a White House souveneir. Wow!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:40 - ID#238422)
Old Soldier
You just confirmed my own feeling about it.
No political will to win - no support for soldiers.
Just games without responsibility and real goals.

I bet profesional military people should be upset
when this sh*t takes place...although some practical
experience never hurts, if it's not too bloody.

Thank you very much. Good night.

Old Soldier
(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:46 - ID#185274)
Attrition and pacifists
Skeptic 00:26 All great nations fight wars of attrition well and naturally prefer them because that makes best use of their strength. Your uncle was speaking metaphorically but the point is well taken. In their day, the Brits were masters of attrition war. The Some Offensive in WWI and the Battle of Gallipoli were memorable example of great effort wasted. Current U.S. thinking on attrition warfare is to attrit the hell out of the enemy while taking as few friendly casualties as possible. That worked spectacularly well in the Panama Incursion and Gulf War I. The mere threat of it worked so well against Cedras in Haiti that he quit without a fight. As Sun Tzu would say, That is the attainment of military perfection.

JTF, Soldiers who have ever fought hate war and deeply respect true pacifists. Their tough standard is that a true pacifist is willing to serve unarmed as a medic on the battlefield. All others are just contentious cowards hiding behind the noble word pacifism. Many Quakers have been highly decorated medics in U.S. wars.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:49 - ID#344308)


fellow warrior & liver-eating friend-------

gold is fixing to feel the effects of war and political
up-heavel simultaneously.........add another $100/oz
compared to the jump it took in the first campaign.

there are going to be some major surprises during this
round of attacks. an arab coalition between the radical
states has been formed during the latest lull in fighting.
iran and iraq are allied......the arabs are tired of american is the world.......remember the tet-offensive??

could'nt happen right? they kicked our booty! and it is well-nigh
fixing to happen again.......not from a frontal assault.....
from with-in, from is so
destroy people......not in-frastructure.....the bible speaks
quite definitively of plauges-----bio-bombs?

how about a BOND-BOMB? that sucker is ready to go!------

opec has formed another pact with the warrior nations in their region
also.......the arab members of opec have decided they will embargo the
west, if the west assists israel when the next arab/israeli war breaks-out.

russia is in iraq's camp......they were acting as advisors in the latest
desert-storm......they monitored our weapon systems......the war was a
sham for us.......we did not finish the job...intentionally...

and russia found-out all she needed to the russian/iraq connection....url posted earlier...

there is documented proof of thousands of 'russian advisors' in
iraq DURING the war..........what were they doing?

what are you doing? soon..war...klinton...flux..


(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:50 - ID#31868)
Old Soldier
Your second paragraph in your last post. A shot of tequila to ya, gulp.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:56 - ID#251268)
yen down 125
If anyone is wondering why gold is soft in Japan today ( tonight ) prob. a good reason,I'm still looking for strong push in London and then N.Y. I sold april gold yesterday ( was long from 292 ) still got 290 calls which for me is the best way to sleep at night ( a little ) got some 310's too don't think this market is going down but got to be ready for the bounces,the last couple of weeks every up move was preceded by a hard move down and I think that might be the character of this market for a while a little stair stepping,whew anyway just wanted to bring up the yen and started yacking nite all.

Old Soldier
(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:58 - ID#185274)
Good night, gold and silver dreams to all
Tolerant1 Thanks, you have the spirit of a warrior. I must now take my tired bones to bed and dream about gold and silver piled higher and higher. My powers of prediction are good but often my timing is early. I was early on gold and silver, too early, but I will be right.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 00:58 - ID#401237)
Wild Site
Interesting site posted earlier, I was checking it out and found a lot of stuff - not just Clinton.
Politics, and International Business.

Sex with Hillary
. . . inspecting the global underbelly:

They are also telling us nothing about
Sally Miller Perdue's affair with Clinton.
Might that be because she reveals that
he used drugs to enhance their
love-making and that she was offered a
nice federal job if she would keep quiet
and told that something might happen to
her "pretty little legs" if she spoke out.
She tried to speak out but the TV station
to which she gave an interview never
ran it. Later she received a number of
threats, one, a note which she turned
over to the FBI said, "It happened to
Marilyn Monroe. It can happen to you." 


(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:00 - ID#31868)
Ah, keeper of watch on the shoulders of giants. First off I am doing my best to prepare family and friends for many events as I look backward to see forward. I have been sending coins along with literature to get them all started for the ones whose hands I cannot reach out and touch.

There is much which disturbs me about the possibility of an attack on American soil, especially one which would utilize bacteria or other techno wonders? of this modern age we live in. America is a force to be reckoned with when the people get angry with a common goal. Not pretty for whomever the enemy.

The bond bomb I think at this point, a foregone conlusion.

The are many who have no idea what is coming their way.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:02 - ID#401237)
Hard to find info and stories-THANKS


(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:04 - ID#344308)


wait till i find the one on the anthrax and iraqi
wome here in the states!.......

big cities........rats in traps.......

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:05 - ID#401237)
Nikkei 225

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:10 - ID#250121)
---Ministry of Truth---

Old Soldier

- sleep well- thank you for your sober reflections tonight. There is often much conspiracy twaddle spoke here..I am glad you spoke up. We can all sleep better.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:11 - ID#31868)
Good gravy man! The entire sex-scandal thing is, good grief. gulp, no, one more, gulp, bless tequila. Nah, one more.

John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:13 - ID#24135)
It's all in a name
Strange observations from the desert -

Russians are smart. Philby new it. Also they have a

sense of humour.

Peoples with names that sound like

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:15 - ID#410215)
..... Barbie .....

Barb Hughes @ 21:26

I find it interesting that you would rail against the Kitco minions who displease you. Since your arrival on this forum, you have insulted almost everybody with your stilted, sophomoric prose. You profess to be this big tradin' chick, but you don't even know proper reporting procedures. Your quick fire questions of me a week or two ago, were designed to create the illusion you are a big hitter..and your attempts to draw me out in the hope that I would not know what I was talking about, instead, you looked the fool and were wrong at the top of your voice. Perhaps you have decided to become Kitco Queen. Your snide and hostile remarks will afford you little warmth or welcome hereabouts.


You're pretty good at all those lines between your posts. Must come from all those years filling out your forms. How does your trite, oh so cute sign off go? Oh Yeah..

Take Care


(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:17 - ID#31868)
John Disney_A
You can get rid of that pesky midget by getting one of those high frequency Midgetaway from Ronco battery operated bury in the sand models. No muss no fuss or injury to the midget.

John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:18 - ID#24135)
This desert wind blows my pages. Sorry-read that again.
Strange observations from the desert -
Russians are smart. Philby new it. Also they have a
sense of humour.
Peoples with names that sound like Z...... have
no sense of humour ( only a touch of bitter sarcasm )
and vastly inflated opinions of themselves - is it
because their names sound as if they come at the end of the
alphabet ??? And they feel in some way victimized ?
Change your names -- become Ava or abediyay.
Honest Abe sounds nice - worked for Lincoln.
The zee people scream for others to be kicked off
the site - like little fascist midgets ..
they scream for the Keetcocoop. They try to start
arguments and manipulate others. Really now Zee
people. Try to find the grace and class that must
be within you but is so slow to rise to the surface.
I believe Oris may have hit upon the way to save
his new country - female examinations to check for
Anthrax filled devices.
Its a tough job but someone's got to do it. Oris,
Dr Disney al Crus-ti voluteers for service. Where does
the line form ?.
Oh I forgot, But that will have to wait for Musqat,
enshal'lah ( I must remember to check for the dread
bacteria there too ) .
Yallah zebediah ... until you learn grace and
politeness you must be dragged in the sand across
all Araby.
Al'lah is great.

John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:22 - ID#24135)
Do they win a Prize.
Barbie will never replace Ziva as kitco queen ?? Or maybe
missinglink if you can get past all that body hair.

John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:24 - ID#24135)
Who said anything about not injuring the midget??
For Tolerant1
Thanks, I only need a cheap one

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:25 - ID#252150)
When I served with NATO in W. Germany they had annual tank competitions. I was in the Cdn Air Force but remember 1 yr in the early 80s when the U.S. army took delivery of a new tank. It was the first 1 to have laser guided armament systems & was by far the most advanced in the competition. Th Germans won that competition,we came 2nd & the U.S. 4th or 5th. The problem was that although they had the greatest technology,

they did,nt have well enough trained personnel to operate them. The tank that the Germans won with was basically a modified ww2 tank with manual optical aimimg devices. When I served with the Cdn Navy on the east coast our ships annually won the anti submarine competition. As for the Air Force, within the last 2 or 3 years one of our pilots won the best fighter pilot competition. Our Air Force is 1/15 the size of yours.

The thing that you have always excelled at is supply. The unfortunate truth is that not enough of your enlisted men are well enough educated to really perform well in the highly technical trades.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:26 - ID#410215)
..... JD .....


I have some suspicions about Ziva's gender, something doesn't read right. She is, by and large, a continent ahead of Barbie Doll........

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:26 - ID#31868)
JapanNikkei 225^N2251:05AM16628.47-386.12-2.27%

neo fight
(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:30 - ID#390179)
right wangaaa conspiracy
this neo fight has abandoned the status quo---all money in gold---joined the right wing conspiracy---but feel like i'm being watched---must resort to code lingo---great white flabby one great white flabby one serpent head serpent head trailer park trash drag $100 drag $100 alpha omega bravo sierra bravo sierra whiney whiney ur mama guuudonya carlton rules she's insane soiled dress bravo sierra bravo sierra g-man leavanworth g-man leavanworth hang bi da necktilldud---proceed--- you feel luckiiii?iduuuuu---gut1stmamagut1stmamamelbourne-been there dun that great flabby one needs ur daaater----drag $100---serpent headneed mo muney-all hail kenny---all hail kenny---swallow the eveeeedence

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:30 - ID#31868)
John Disney_A
Who said anything about not injuring the midget??

I just knew you were going to say that. Gulp, a shot of tequila at ya!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:31 - ID#250121)
while I exercise doubts with her sanity and mental capacity

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:36 - ID#429245)
Federal reserve statistical release
The federal reserve figures on gold holdings are steady at about 11 billion for the last two years of figures.

Does anyone know at what price they value gold?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:37 - ID#401237)
neo fight
Man! I understood you!
That's scary!

Time to go to bed.
Good Night All


(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:39 - ID#285392)
Glen re: gold selling-what do you make of this
Peter Lynch in his latest Worth Online article states that the U.S. has "262 million ounces, ( of Gold ) and law requires us to hold on to it".

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:40 - ID#410215)
..... Now That's Cheap .....

GW -

The official value of US gold reserves is...... $42 per ounce.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:41 - ID#31868)
$42.00 -? I think.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:44 - ID#410215)
.....Zippy .....


You would have beat me to the post if not for the

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:46 - ID#429245)
reserve gold
That makes 8,183 tons.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:47 - ID#250121)
Elliot Wave Analysis Gold in Different Currencies--Comments Welcome

APH, DA, Cyclist, ALL

A couple of days ago I said I had received some Elliot wave analysis from a friend of mine that included a reading that the bottom in gold had not yet been reached. He sees the true bottom at $273.90. Anyway, hes given me permission to post his work, and he hopes to receive comments that I shall relay to him.

Let us call my mate BURT, ( not Bart ) , for that is what everyone calls him, even his children, it is not his name, but that doesnt matter..

Anyway, Burt, not Bart, nor Bert, would appreciate any responses to this:---


From the index graph you can see the relative movements in local currency terms. Assuming an efficient global market, the differences in local prices relative to the $US price reflect each currencies exch rate movements against the $US. The YEN has appreciated most against the $US hence its local gold price has fallen the most. Conversely, the $NZ and $AUS have depreciated most against the $US hence their local gold prices have risen the most. Gold does appear to have provided an exch rate hedge for local investors whose currencies have depreciated against the $US, the recent public turn- in of gold in some Asian countries despite severe depreciation of their local currencies runs contrary to the expectation of gold hoarding instead. One wonders just how much of the available pool is being turned in ( very little ) and how much is media hype ( a lot ) .

The current YEN and DMK prices are still above their all time lows, implying that continued selling from their CB's is likely to continue i.e. sell gold to increase their currency reserves, rather than holding gold as a reserve directly, thereby reducing the need to create credit which is therefore non-inflationary and hence stabilises their currencies against the reserve currency ( $US ) . As circumstances ( relative exch rates/inflation ) change they may change to net buying but the trend is still down so more selling is likely.

The $NZ price is at an all time low, consistent with our appreciation against the $US since 1993 ( lower relative inflation ) . From a cyclic view, the $NZ price should start to move up this year i.e. our inflation relative to the $US will be higher leading to currency depreciation, buying gold will provide a hedge.

The Elliott wave pattern in $US is not clear cut ( it never is ) . My long term bullish interpretation ( see gldlocal graph ) is that it is nearing completion of the intermediate 'C' wave down which began in Feb 96 at $414.80. The target is $273.90. The 'C' wave is itself the final part of the major decline which began in Dec 87 at $494.10. As we are dealing with a major 'A-B-C' zig-zag pattern we should expect approximate equivalence between the 'A' and 'C' components in terms of % movement. The 'A' wave declined 34% to $326.30 in Mar 93, an equivalent decline from the 'B' wave peak in Feb 96 indicates a bottom of $273.90. Others appear to looked at this 'C' wave using the XAU and indicates that we are in wave ( 3 ) of ( 5 ) down until completion at 35 ( at least that's what I think he says, see below ) . Is there another a longer term wave count handy?

That's the bullish interpretation. The long term bearish is that we have been in a protracted 'X' wave since the Jun 82 low of $296.70. This 'X' wave completed a five wave 'a-b-c-d-e' triangle pattern at $414.80 in Feb 96 implying that we are now in the first 'A' wave down of the second 'A-B-C' pattern ( the first being from the Jan 80 high of $850 to the Jun 82 low ) . This ( I think ) is another long term count, we are in wave ( 3 ) of ( 5 ) of this 'A' wave. The target for this 'A' wave can be approximated using the % movement of the 'A' wave in the first 'A-B-C' pattern. The 43% drop indicates $235 as a target ( or 35 on the XAU? ) .

Either way, the decline hasn't finished yet ( in $US ) . I would tend to wait until the CB's trading policies are clearer as they are clearly driving the market. However, any continued spend-up by our ( NZ ) own politicians combined with a declining exch rate will only add to our current account deficit and hence further exch falls and therefore a likely appreciation of gold in $NZ terms. The long term cycle also favours buying some now although gains are likely to be only moderate.

index graph

Gold Price in local Currencies



neo fight
(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:47 - ID#390179)
rising high
High rise--rise to the okashuun--gudonya--bravo sierra

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:50 - ID#341214)
James: It appears that plenty of the Yanks learned to use those laser sights to great effect by the time the Gulf War rolled around. I prefer to think of the US Armed Forces as having great depth to go with that great supply factor that you mentioned. We might not have all the star performers but we have the deepest damn bench you ever did see. I'll say this about the Canadians. They had their own beach on D-Day. They get my utmost respect based on that one fact alone.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:50 - ID#410215)
..... Quotes Bummers .....


I can now report firsthand knowledge of the dreaded Kitco quote bug. Was it JTF who said his posts were getting cut of as soon it hit the first set of quote marks? My last post ended with the words - I Think - in quotes, but where are those words now? Let's try an experiment: I will post this as is. I will then repost and put the quotes around the I think. Ah yes, experimentation and observation, the scientific method.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:51 - ID#410215)
..... Quote Bummers II .....


I can now report firsthand knowledge of the dreaded Kitco quote bug. Was it JTF who said his posts were getting cut of as soon it hit the first set of quote marks? My last post ended with the words, "I Think" in quotes, but where are those words now? Let's try an experiment: I will post this as is. I will then repost and put the quotes around the I think. Ah yes, experimentation and observation, the scientific method.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:53 - ID#410215)
..... That's Not It .....

So much for that theory. Screw scientific method. I never trusted it in the first place..

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:53 - ID#31868)

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:55 - ID#335184)
DETOX- Folks I've been drying out in FT. Lauderdale, Fla. on Business.
I've tried like hell to kick the habit, but my "enablers" left my cage open & I'm happily back. I have really missed you folks, but I have occupied my self with ZIPPERGATE. Boy does our boy Prez make us proud or what!

But, on to business & better things.

M3 cooling to a scorching 8.77% !

BARRONS AU/MINING index ratio moving down to a bullish 1 year outlook to
1.22 as of Jan 26 ! However, note down trend continuing :12/9=1.28;
12/15=1.25;12/22=1.30;12/29=1.33;1/10=1.25; &1/26=1.22.
Stay tuned. Any thing below 1.15 prognosticates a wildly bullish scenario !

Tar Baby

neo fight
(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:57 - ID#390179)
aussies unite
horde pronto-horde pronto-bravo sierra
1stmama watching u
report to leader
join da neo fight
nosub300nosub300swallow evidence

(Fri Jan 30 1998 01:58 - ID#31868)
Needless to say everyone here knows I am no rocket scientist not economic wizard of charts and waves.

I would surmise that there are certain items like the situation in the Middle East, the use of derrivatives, etc., that were never factored into the original formats, certainly wars and such and the affects.

Perhaps the waves have been altered due to totally non-economic happenings. Given the various fluctuations in the price and the concerted efforts by the CBs perhaps we have seen the bottom.

I am just throwin this on the wall.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 02:00 - ID#432166)
Old Soldier
Your insights and concise analysis are much appreciated. Thanks. Also thanks to JTF and Oris for interesting posts tonight.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 02:01 - ID#285392)
Martin Armstrong short SILVER???
Would the person that lately reported that Martin Armstrong was short a large amount of silver contracts please repeat that post and the quantity? Also do you believe it is authentic information?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 02:07 - ID#250121)
At last, an Empiricist....{{amongst all these alien~lovers}}---

Yup. that's what we need 'round here, more occam's razor, more Francis Bacon..

Heck, lets's go the whole hog, ;- ) ) gimme cartesian dualism and hegelian dialectic too round it off with PRAXIS.

The scientific method won't stop ya having babies, but it sure is fun...

JOE Smith
(Fri Jan 30 1998 02:11 - ID#184165)
Todays report on Munni Munni for Haggis Vronsky et el--the drill results next wed

Second Quarter Activities Report


DATE: 1998/1/30


HOMEX - Sydney


During the quarter 1,367,500 East Coast Minerals NL options were
converted to fully paids and 13,500 contributing shares converted to
fully paids.

Contributing shares can be converted to $0.10 fully paid shares at
any time by paying $0.09 per share and options by paying $0.20.


East Coast Minerals holds:

Greenvale Mining NL contributing shares 22,000
Greenvale Mining NL fully paid shares 862,000
Esperance Minerals NL contributing shares 1,016,000

Indirect through its holding in Minga Pty Ltd, East Coast Minerals NL
also holds 25% of 4,560,400 Esperance Minerals NL shares.



Munni Munni ( Elizabeth Hill ) Silver Deposit Joint Venture

Mining ease 47/340
Mining ease 47/341
Mining ease 47/342
Mining ease 47/343
Exploration Licence 47/587 ( converted to M47/414 & M47/415 )

Joint Venture participants are:

East Coast Minerals NL 70%
Legend Mining NL 30%

During the quarter the Joint Venture has undertaken the following

1. Successfully dewatered below 86m. allowing development to proceed:

2. A 20m crosscut at 82m. level.

3. A 100 tonne bulk sample of ore which is currently undergoing
metallurgical testing.

4. An underground diamond drilling program of thirteen holes,


Testing of the large bulk sample has proved to be much slower than
previously estimated.

The Christmas holidays and breakdowns of equipment caused delays in
the bulk sample testing. Testing is currently proceeding at 0.7 - l.0
tonne per hour. As the ore is of different characteristics, an
overall silver content is not possible until total completion and
clean up of the bulk sample.

The Joint Venture geologist anticipates the 25 tonnes of ore
completed to be at least the previously quoted grade.

The tailings from the crushing to date were assayed and contained
3,000 grams of silver and 1.3 grams of gold per tonne.

The Joint Venture will not be releasing final results until the
complete 103 tonnes is tested.


Thirteen holes labelled DDH-1 - DDH-13 were drilled in December for a
total of 253m. The object of the program was to test the strike,
depth and particularly the plunge characteristics of the ore shoot
exposed in the crosscut.

All thirteen holes intersected visible silver mineralisation and
results are expected soon.


The Joint Venture would also like to inform shareholders of the
unique nature of the Elizabeth Hill style of mineralisation which
previously has not been recorded. The mineralisation is related to
the large Munni Munni layered intrusion which has dimensions of 25
kms x 9 kms x 5 kms. Within this intrusion a number of different
styles of mineralisation have now been recorded.

1 .Upper strata bound platinoid horizons previously explored and
reported by Hunter Resources NL. 2. The strata bound central
palladium horizon - as yet unexplored.

3. The strata bound Judy's Reef. The lowest platinoid reef also has
nickel, copper and silver credits.

4. The strata bound basement nickel-copper, silver sulphide deposits.

5. The structurally controlled Elizabeth Hill style mineralisation
which has an extremely high grade silver content but also has credits
in palladium, rhodium, gold nickel and copper.

The Elizabeth Hill silver occurrence is the best explored of the
numerous silver anomalies known to exist around the edges of the
Munni Munni intrusion.

The occurrence plunges to to the south at about forty five degrees
and contains anomalous silver throughout. Within this zone are a
number of complex and possibly "L" shaped zones containing extreme
grades of silver.

Initial exploration and shaft sinking has concentrated on one such
zone known as the No. 30 pod. Five other zones have previously been
recorded including the nearby apparently richer No. 25 pod.

All these zones are mineable from the existing shaft. As the ore is
primary in nature, further such zones may be expected to occur both
down plunge to the south and possibly along shear link structures to
the east.

The No. 30 pod is to be closely examined between the 82m and 102m
level. This pod is expected to contain between 5,000 - 10,000 tonnes
of ore. However its exact parametres as yet have not been determined
and cannot be determined until the 102m level is completed.

Other ore shoots like No. 25 pod are similar in size.


In laboratories and test plants native silver, like all metals, tends
to be extremely malleable causing potential massive contamination to
subsequent samples or worse loss of product. After each sample is
crushed the whole circuit has to be cleaned out, which makes assaying
a slower than normal exercise.


The ore zone contains two main types of ore:

a Ultramafic - where the silver mainly occurs as silver - nickel or
silver - copper sulphides, although dendritic or globular native
silver is known when the grade is in excess of 2% ( 20,000 g/t ) .

b Calcite - in calcite zones the ore is mostly as native silver in
veins, as wire silver or disseminated pods. Also present are some
crystals of silver - copper sulphides and argento galena.

Also expected to occur within the ore are credits for palladium,
rhodium and gold - however the complex chemistry and association of
these elements ( particularly the palladium and rhodium ) is as yet not


The Elizabeth Hill deposit is a unique deposit which has the potential
for a small tonnage at extreme grades within a larger ore zone, which
could be mined and treated relatively cheaply. Due to its unique
nature a careful step by step approach is warranted.


The Joint Venture Partners intend to deepen the shaft a further 20 -
30m in order to open up the ore zone at depth. This will also involve
a larger headframe, a permanent pump station and crosscut and raise
development. However the decision will be made after diamond drill
results and metallurgical testwork on the bulk sample is completed.

L White

The information on mineralisation contained in this report accurately
reflects information compiled by a Competent Person ( as defined by the
Australian Code for Reporting of Identified Resources and Ore
Reserves ) with relevant experience in relation to such mineralisation.


The long awaited drill results next Wed----My thoughts is plenty of 2-5 %

initial reserve of about 100,000 of 2% Ag plus other credits.

i,e over 600 oz/ ton or 60mill oz---

credits shouild pay for extraction

plant necessary should not exceed $100,000 capital cost

at 5000/ ton /pa @2% is say 3.0 mill oz or a profit of say $us18mil

could go for min 10 year

ECM price today 0.55c AUS Mkt Cap at Approx $USD7.5 mil

any Queries to

neo fight
(Fri Jan 30 1998 02:11 - ID#390179)
Are you having fun yet?
I am.
So much to learn in this neo fight.
All or nothing.
Barraccccc for gold mate.
Got to love it--so cheap!!!
Melbun Grammer Alumn--
Watch for 1st lady--she's on to us.
Yo william--more deny more deny--
I calculate .50 an oz for each and every denial.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 02:15 - ID#335184)
JTF RE US monetary policy:1914 to 1929.
The basic money supply expanded at a relentless rate averaging 10 % each year in the 15 years leading up to the great crash in Oct.1929.
Therefor the monetarists are all wet M supply contraction playing any role in the crash. Great confusion results from munipulation of yhe data, but, the historical record is replete with uncontradicted evidence that 29 like all other major contractions was not preceded by a contractin, but a large & unrelenting expansion of the M supply. Let's discuss @ T NEWTRON AOL.COM .

Tar Baby

(Fri Jan 30 1998 02:15 - ID#153102)
@D.A. re: speculation & manipulation
Yours was a very perceptive explanation of the benefits of speculation.

"speculation actually has economic value beyond liquidity and risk
spreading. Speculators by their very nature are forced to seek out the
best information available so as to have an edge in their speculating.
Those that do not, die. This information ( action of speculation, I would have said ) actually has economic value beyond liquidity and risk spreading.... ( it ) helps in rational price discovery. The more accurate the price the more efficient the allocation of resources."

I have previously posted the fact that Public Law 91-151, the Credit Control Act of 1969, grants the President through the federal reserve board control over ALL allocation of credit and that all Federal Reserve Notes are credit. This control defeats all market forces to one degree or another and is increasingly preventing not just rational price discovery in the gold market, but rational discovery of real rate of return for investment at large. The projects funded by World Bank are gross examples of misdirection of resources in countries in which they were financed. Our entire economy and the OECD country economies, however, are being distorted by centralized credit allocation in the same way the Soviet economy was made inefficient by centralized control. An entrepeneur is a speculator in the service of rational discovery in industry and commerce in general. And entrepeneurs and other speculators, whose activities, rationalize price and investment are withering under the weight of lack of access to "credit capital" and overwhelming regulation and restrictive legalities, despite political press to the contrary. Can you imagine Thomas Edison succeeding in this day and age ? I anticipate that if this world corporate socialist credit system based on greenbacks does not soon self-destruct with a crash and a bang, it is going to stifle us to death economically.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 02:16 - ID#398105)
INCOMING.............Cyclone off NW Aussie coast : Category 1

This particular cyclone "drowned" Kathreen - where Pegasus had the Mt Todd operation.

Looks like it's going to cause a "wee bit of a problem" !

(Fri Jan 30 1998 02:16 - ID#398105)
INCOMING.............Cyclone off NW Aussie coast

This particular cyclone "drowned" Kathreen - where Pegasus had the Mt Todd operation.

Looks like it's going to cause a "wee bit of a problem" !

(Fri Jan 30 1998 02:16 - ID#250121)
A little Like Asimov's Trilogy Series.. Hardin's theory of history///

tolerant1- Hi

I'm no expert neither, but I understand that Elliot and his followers factor all these thing in.

In the manner of fleas having fleas upon ---

( Dogs have flees upon their backs to bite "em, and these fleas have other fleas, and so on, ad infinitum ) THere are Grand SuperCycles, and lesser cycles and lesser cycles still, minuets and sub-minuets,..

So, just as "All things are Written". so Elliot wave is supposed to encompass War both general and particular.


(Fri Jan 30 1998 02:17 - ID#31868)
nite all
Get Camdesuss!!!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 02:19 - ID#31868)
Just saw your last post. I did not know that all the external items were woven in. Gulp, a shot of tequila at ya.

evening to ya

Get Camdesuss!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 02:41 - ID#341214)
snowbird: Martin Armstrong
snowbird: If I remember correctly Speed posted that article from the WSJ. I don't have a copy of it and I was just hitting the sack so I don't have time to search for it now but the facts as I recall them are: Princeton is/was short 500 contracts of COMEX silver and the position was taken based on the advice of Martin Armstrong. That WSJ article is the ONLY place I have seen mention the short position. If Speed can't repost it perhaps we can dredge it up from the archives.

These guys won't get anything done. They are pushing on a string. We will be making at least one more high in silver, maybe more, then we will have one hell of a correction because we will have reached the price point where enough people are willing to sell physical supplies of silver. And that, my friend, will be the end of the beginning of the new bull market in silver, otherwise known as wave II. Lot's more fireworks to come in the years ahead.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 02:44 - ID#283121)
Silver Manipulation

DA - if there is a genuine shortage of silver, why are we not seeing an attempt by the large commercial users of silver to protect themselves from this shortage in the futures market ? "Just in time" inventory management doesn't explain this. The rally seems to have been totally driven by speculative buying.

I defer to you on the lease rate issue as this is your area of expertise. However, I question whether the lease rates could also be manipulated. For a start, who are the lenders and borrowers of silver ? I would think that commercial users would buy silver, not borrow it, so they would be unaffected by the lease rate.

The real story should unfold soon. If silver is able to get above 6.89 and stay there or continue higher, then we probably are looking at a bull market. If Armstrong is correct then we should see the rally fail somewhere south of 6.89, followed by a crash.

Cheers, sas

(Fri Jan 30 1998 02:58 - ID#335184)
T ZADEAK @ 21:28 -Surly you jest re "VAST RIGHT WING CONSPIRICY......
If we all didn't know that our BOY PREZ hangs to the left, both politically & anatomically, there might be some credence to your speculation regarding the press & their silly repetitious showing of Monica & our fixation with her silly little french hat. The conspiricy my dear TZADEAK ( & HILLIRY ) is in his crotch which we are informed is crooked to the left & I asure you the right wing's got nothing to do with it ! It doesn't enter in to it !
The press is just stuck with one hell of an Arkansas Bru HA HA & can't let go of it because it is so darn funny & purient & tragic & true that the American people are dying to know how this real life soap opera plays out.
Believe me folks, I'm from the neighborhood & I've traveled all over the world & there are just some things you have to come to Arkansaw to see if you want to see them before you die. BC & HR just took their show on the road. My, my ! The truth is, of course, that they have a hopeless, degenerate, open, swinging ( AC/DC ) , enabeling, co-dependent & ( most important ) lying/hypocritic relationship that they present to the American people & the world as a "normal" part of the villiage, as if she had the moral authority to forgive his "LITTLE PECKERDILLYS" ! "IT is to laugh & cry !

God bless us all, every one!


(Fri Jan 30 1998 03:03 - ID#393224)
"I think" --let's try again.
To be valid a scientific theory must be tested.
BTW RJ--what happened to platinum?? You were going to buy when it got down to the 410 range. Could palladium be used as a cheaper substitute??

(Fri Jan 30 1998 03:14 - ID#22956)
Is this the Silver article to which you refer?
The Armstrong Article:

I still believe that $7.00 silver is a dream.....but then I don't want to be redundant.



(Fri Jan 30 1998 03:25 - ID#22956)
Newtron.....I knew it!....and other stuff
I have often said to friends that Hillary was the oil applicator and Bill and ___________ ( fill in the blank ) were the applicatees. Now you have opened up a sizeable can-o-worms. Sorry Bart...go gold.

Aurator, thanks for the good Elliot Wave stuff from your friend. It was enlightening to me. Gold is not out of the woods yet, eh?

btw, Tol1, Oris, ( a few ) others....Fridays vs. Gold....Hmmmm. I take Fridays. Gold is showing weakness and dollar/dow.....well, you know the story. People would much rather hold 'paper' this weekend. get thrashed by right wing gold-bug conspirators.


(Fri Jan 30 1998 03:26 - ID#252127)
Asia-Pacific up bigtime, except for Japan

Is telling me that Congress will approve rescue package.
About a week ago I heard Rubin say that no taxpayer money would/should be used foe Asian rescue.
This time, unlike Mexico the lap-dogs of Congress ( dems & repubs ) will not be overruled.

John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 03:38 - ID#24135)
Royal Oak is a Silly Joke -- Just Kidding
For Ray Oris others
Hey I get into this RYO thing by complete accident.
I have no axe to grind either way - I never owned any
nor would I - But it is getting interesting - First
I find out from one of the best Kitco comtributers
that the lady CEO pays herself 1.7mill a year _ Thats
a touch heavy for a company that loses dough.
The company's economics for kemess resulted in
forecast cash cost for gold of $US79/oz. However,
A copper by product credit of 1$/pound was used.
As copper is now 0.8 $ per pound, the cash cost for
gold will rise as a result to about $125/oz. The cost
for kemess property was 202 mill canadian say 140
mill US.
The reserves at kemess are 221 mill tons of ore at
0.018 oz/ton of gold for a total of 4 mil oz of
reserves. That means the property costs 140/4 = 35$
oz for gold which was not bad ( forget cu as that will
be byproduct throughout ) . With gold production planned
at 250,000/year we have a 12 year life of mine.
Capex was heavy at 430 mill canadian - say 300 mill
us. ( with a lot of government subsidy-why is that
needed ?? ) . Gold at 325 make a cash flow of 50 mill
a year times 12 years = 600 mil and we get twice our
money back hurray - woops I forgot to use average
costs - now what will they be- 325 say - woops we get
zilch back - and dont forget to subtract the ladys
salary each year. This is an interesting invesment.
Oh and the Canadian Government assistance - they
dont expect to get anything BACK do they ?? Just how
merciful do you expect al'lah to be here ??

(Fri Jan 30 1998 03:50 - ID#255284)
The darkest hour is just before dawn? Hey, It's not midnight yet...


That's right, according to Burt, gold has not yet found the darkest part of the woods at all... were still huntin without a torch...

Croesus! You've had a lot to celebrate!..Aussie winning the cricket...You making a fortune with au aus stox. Good to see you back.

We've been having a better class of bun-fight while you been on holiday, Ockernick....if you scroll back you'll notice...btw noticed any strange light over Canberra recently? cos, cave carpem, the ufo loonies are about..

Ack Ack Ack Ack Ackstralia..

rule ackstralia fair

always liked to be contrary_@aurator_hehe

(Fri Jan 30 1998 04:17 - ID#393224)
Antipodean mate
G'day Auracious. Good to be back. Three weeks of sitting on beautiful Queensland beaches--glad I didn't go scuba diving out on the g.b.r.--I hear they leave people behind out there. As an ex-scuba diver--I'm having nightmares about that one. Imagine being left 45 km from shore!! The mind boggles.

Good charts, mate. I appreciate how much work went into that. Aussie gold prices have been predicting the turnaround for months. Let's hope it lasts. Have had my best week on the markets since I bought 600 000 of a penny dreadful that nearly became a dollar dreadful. Am still suffering mightily today from yesterday's irrational exhuberance. I'll never learn. A lot of very persnickety posts today. Must be near a full moon. Keep up the excellent research, mate. It often translates into real results for people like me. I owe you a few steinies next time I visit your gracious land.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 04:25 - ID#252127)
It has'ta be wun'dem con..spirate'cies

The US $2 billion Austrailian gold sale translates to about A $163 per Aussie. Damn they could have printed that amount and no one would have known about it.
The boys could have had more Fosters, the girls nicer frocks and the kiddies a real nice X'mas.
What really happened is that the miners got the shaft. That all this occured in the same time frame as the Asian crisis smells like alligator breathe or power farts.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 04:27 - ID#28585)
If a Mid-East War erupts and it is not a short-term event, then government will be forced to compete for funds against the private sector. The result: a sharp spike up in interest rates.

Although in the past, war has often been good to financial markets, in this particular instance, with markets priced to perfection, it is not likely that war would produce a favorable result. Many foreign investors would dump collapsing bonds and equities. Given the war scenario, investors would have little choice but to park funds in gold.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 04:40 - ID#255284)
I mean...Advance Australia.. not rule Australia...Ludd!!

Thanks for helping me to post those charts.

and I've done my share of scuba diving too, mate, they've still not been heard of? Abandoned? at sea? Croesus! There's still a chance they're floating, they've ditched they're weight belts...

You're welcome to the charts, mate, as is everyone else. I suprised my broker the other day. So I have a reason to be thankful too. My tanks are really low, but not yet had to buy water.

If anyone interested, another NZ business in trouble 'cos of Korea.

A factory specialising in supplying dairy products to Korea is facing possible closure. There was some Niche marketing propoganda stuff that these places swallowed...find an export market and exploit production is skewed towards political favour, no matter how small, and when the bubble burst, why, good honest citizens suffer too.

A dairy factory in trouble in New Zealand is small potatoes in the scheme of things. but...keep your ears to the ground, mes amis, ignore the shrill eldritch cries of the ill informed....keep your wits about you.. tra la la.....

(Fri Jan 30 1998 04:47 - ID#252127)
Asia-Pacific up bigtime, except for Japan

Is telling me that Congress will approve rescue package.
About a week ago I heard Rubin say that no taxpayer
money would/should be used foe Asian rescue.
This time, unlike Mexico the lap-dogs of Congress ( dems
& repubs ) will not be overruled.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 04:51 - ID#393224)
 -- that P.I. silver article you posted is first class, mate. I suggest to one and all --bookmark and read as it answers many questions about silver, palladium, platinum and you-know-what.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 05:00 - ID#398105)
New Aussie URL for exploration and mining info.......

Australian Mineral Foundation:

(Fri Jan 30 1998 05:04 - ID#255284)
Someone explain to me once more please, what is Free Market Capitalism?
Does that article answer questions or merely present an apology for a@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
Censored by the aurator. they are a litigious bunch, those *Princes among Men* of whom you posted Nick, and they are sore losers in a market place.

Whoever said a Free Market was a Fair Market, Eh?

You look at volume ( and so are smarter than most technicians here ) , there is only a gradient of knowledge.

At the pinnacle of the gradient, the knowledge is perfect. From thence it is only corrupted. Sounds like The Princeton 'Princes' made a boo boo.. and it cost their clients how much???

There's sharks, there's merchant banks, there's consultants..and they'll all be hungry soon.....

(Fri Jan 30 1998 05:11 - ID#398105)
John Disney.........Royal Oak..........

"the lady CEO pays herself 1.7mill a year"..........

was she a Human Resources Manager, or a very good friend of the Chairman ? ..........STRUTH........

(Fri Jan 30 1998 05:19 - ID#393224)
Auracious...The P.E.I. are a good counterfoil for one such as I who spends too much time at Kitco. Kitco is a bit like going to a wolf convention to ask if lamb is good to eat. Occasionally it is a good idea to consult the lamb. But then you are a Kiwi and know all about that.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 05:32 - ID#255284)
I can tell sheep jokes better than ewe........;-))))

Nick@C which sounds like something out of 'The Restaurant at the End of The Universe." I agree on your take on finding contrary opinion. Then again, Kitco is unique site, one cannot fall across it easily, one must hunt. So opinion contrary to kitco is not hard to find...

Time to count sheep.....

55, 56, 57, 58, Hello Darling, 60, 61, 62 ...

(Fri Jan 30 1998 05:40 - ID#153102)
Mining the gold of true history

Old Soldier ( Veterans March )
IDT 23:21 I am no expert on the Veterans March action. From what I do
know, it was not a proud moment for the Army or FDR who ordered it. Your
point is well taken but I think it is one thing to take police action
against a group squatting in the capitol and quite another to support a
martial law that is perceived to be unjust and unnecessary and directed
against the people as a whole."

In my true history of America it is recorded that Hoover was President when the WWI Bonus Marchers were driven from their peaceful encampment by detachments of the US Army under the command of Douglas McArthur. It is also recorded there ( as well as in the book American Caesar ) that McArthur exceeded the order issued by Hoover and the widely shown film of veterans in the depths of the Depression being denied their right to petition the government and roughly treated as well virtually guaranteed FDR's landslide election. Considering his circumstances thereafter and his ambition and his mother's political activity on behalf of his career, a conspiracy minded observor might suspect McArthur exceeded Hoover's order by design and for purposes of demonstrating certain facts to the nation. A kind of 1930's Waco, if you will.

IDT ( Veterans March ) ID#228128:
Old Soldier - I can think of one example where the U.S. military turned
on its own, the Veterans March on Washington during the great
depression. Any group with too much power can become a threat. The
founding fathers gave a lot of thought to a balance of power in
government and the civilian control of the military, much to our good

It is also recorded in my true history of America that the myth of "civilian control of the military" was long cherished by Americans despite its untruth. Old Soldier will be given credit there for truthfully saying the American military "support a martial law that is perceived to be unjust and unnecessary and directed against the people as a whole." Martial law does not mean what most Americans imagine. Its meaning in American law was explained by the Supreme Court in ex parte Milligan ( 1866 ) , a fateful decision in which the court found three distinct types of martial law to be authorized by the Constitution. Old Soldier is chastised in my true hisory for the propaganda phrase "the Union ... in the Civil War", U.S. a phrase which misinforms us about our true history.

The Union predates the Constitution. In fact, the Union predates the Declaration of Independence. The States that walked out of Congress never declared any dissolution of the Union. In their declaration of Causes, every southern State affirmed the Union. In the War of Northern Aggression, the Federal Army and Navy of, by, and for the federal government placed the military power over the Constitution and over the civil authority in the States where it remains to this day. The contest in 1860-65 was between the civil authority of the States and the United States military. "The people of Indiana have been ground hard under the military authority and power within the last three or four years, but it was borne because it was hoped that when the war would be closed the military power would be withdrawn from the State. Under this bill it may be established permanently upon the people by a body of men protected by the military power of the Government."
Senator T.A. Hendricks of Indiana quoted in HISTORY OF THE THIRTY-NINTH CONGRESS OF THE UNITED STATES, By William H. Barnes,
A.M., p.112. Nor, was Indiana the exception. The entire civil government of Maryland was put out of office and the Writ of Habeas Corpus was suspended in all of the States. No governor, no civil authority, could protect any citizen anywhere from the Army. Nowhere in the Constitution is this power granted to the federal by the States, the federal military being only empowered to enter a State to put down rebeliion at the request of the civil authority of the State.

Thus, the American military has enabled federal transgression of the guarantee of the Petition of Right, a guarantee of freedom from martial law.
"The Court believes that the place to begin this discussion,
before coming to the vital question of constitutional
interpretation, is in English law and the development of the
rights and liberties of the English people. The rights and
liberties of England became our inheritance. The Constitution of
the United States and the constitutions of the states contain
provisions that come directly from that source.

Almost all of the states adopted "reception statutes" receiving
into state law the English common law and acts of Parliament as
they existed as of a certain date--which was usually 1507, 1620,
or 1776--except to the extent that they were contrary to our
federal or state constitutions or statutes or were contrary to
our form of government... The Petition of Right was one of the foundation stones of the English Constitution." US District Court Order Clinton v Jones

The Petition of Right was the result of the imposition of martial law by Charles I. In it freedom from martial law is guaranteed as a right. This guarantee is part of our inheritance of liberties in the common law. It is also written into almost all State Constitutions. This right in America has been and is now transgressed by "a body of men protected by the military power of the Government". In 1610 using military might Charles I seized the Treasury from Parliament, which cost him his head. In 1933 backed up by the US military, FDR seized all the gold in the United States and by so doing put the military over the civil authority and deprived the civil authority in the States of all means of constitutional revenue because ( Article 1 Section 10 ) , "No State shall ... make any thing but gold and silver coin a tender in payment of debt". By ratifying FDR's acts, Congress imposed martial law on the States as it had done previously during and after 1860-65 and by the 14th Amendment.

Ross Perot: "This country is at a point in time, when Washington does what ever it wants to, and the People have no control of their government" The two great powers of government, the sword and the purse, are unchained in the federal government precisely as Patrick Henry foretold. Only those meager weapons in the hands of unorganized civilians stand between us and complete despostism.

"Date: Thu Jan 29 1998 23:10Earl ( Conscription? Si. ) ID#227238:
Oldman: In the days when a professional military was being proposed, ie,
zero conscription, not enough attention was devoted to the clear
implications a dedicated profession of arms CAN have. Not the least of
which you have already alluded to. Now we are witness to reports out of
the Marine Corps that the American civilian is being denigrated as a
routine part of their training.
There are certainly ample reasons for doing so and most of them
justified but at the same time it would seem to me to be a dangerous
practice on the part of those who, on some bright tomorrow, may be the
only people able to bear arms in the US.
I have always believed that we, as a nation, made a horrible mistake by
expunging the draft. There is a certain quality of safety in knowing
that a substantial number those in the of the armed forces are not there
by choice. "

In my true history of America, it is recorded that the federalization of the National Guard, the organized militia of the States, was the horrible mistake and that conscription in Europe was never any guard against tyranny at any time in history. The armies of all of the European tyrants were filled with conscripts and Hitler's Wehrmacht was conscripted. By contrast, the English always had a professional army. But, it was an Army that was subordinate to the civil authority at all times after the Petition of Right.

Military supremacy to the civil authority in the States is doctrine in the US Army. This fact can be verified from documentation published on the net. In fact, agreements are published as well for the military occupation of the States by former East Bloc country forces in the event the US military needs other military assistance to control the American civilian population.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 05:40 - ID#286234)
Every year I go to the Air Show at Pt. Mugu NAWS ( has a new name I know, I will always think of it as NAWS. ) Every year you fly by just over the deck. Awesome, no other way to describe it. Every year I chat with you and say, "Sure am glad you're on my side!"

(Fri Jan 30 1998 05:45 - ID#286234)
Take a few deep breaths, count backwards 100, 99, 98,........

(Fri Jan 30 1998 05:46 - ID#393224)
Auracious--read somewhere today that Kiwi economy in big strife due to SE Asian meltdown. Timber I think it was, to go with your dairy industry. Oz too going to suffer badly. Share market doesn't agree. Almost time to buy puts again as everyone liked Billy's speech and bought more shares. Wake-up call may come soon. Sharefin would know more about that. I usually react to what IS happening rather than what I THINK is going to happen. BTW--how's the R.E. sale? Are ewe in Auckland yet??

(Fri Jan 30 1998 05:59 - ID#255284)
no flies on me boy...

I posted about Timber a coupla weeks ago as you were sunnin yourself on the GOLD Coast



(Fri Jan 30 1998 06:00 - ID#255284)
no flies on me boy...

I posted about Timber a coupla weeks ago as you were sunnin yourself on the GOLD Coast



(Fri Jan 30 1998 06:05 - ID#255284)
no flood, just a volcano........
Being the sort of ( salt of ) aurator I am, I have to correct my earlier post, The Tangiwai disaster was actually caused by the destruction of the Bidge due to a Lihir ( ? ) molten lava from Ruapehu. Anyone intersted I can post some more NZ vulcanology on the morrow ( if there is one )

(Fri Jan 30 1998 06:46 - ID#286199)
Princeton's trading arm short 500 silver contracts
REPOST for the night crew:

The Wall Street Journal Interactive Edition --
January 14, 1998
CFTC Boosts Surveillance Of Silver-Futures Market


The Commodity Futures Trading Commission said it had increased surveillance in the silver-futures market following allegations that several market participants were manipulating prices.

Speculation in the market about a pending CFTC investigation and a possible class-action lawsuit alleging manipulation has sent prices reeling recently. Tuesday, March silver futures bounced back sharply
after falling four-consecutive sessions at the Comex division of the New York Mercantile Exchange. The active March contract gained 21 cents, or 3.84%, to $5.685 a troy ounce.

But traders and analysts said they are continuing to monitor the possibility of regulatory intervention, keeping in mind that a prolonged investigation would diminish buying interest in the market.
"Unfortunately, the market is spooked from time to time" by reports and complaints of manipulation, said Edward Kempf, an analyst at CPM Group, a New York precious-metals consultant. The CFTC ended days of silence about its stance on the recent price moves. In an interview, a spokesman
confirmed that the commission had increased its monitoring of the market to address recent concerns.

"The commission intensifies its surveillance efforts when unusual events or activities occur such as we've seen lately in the silver markets," he said. He wouldn't comment further on the possible outcome of the heightened supervision.

At issue in the CFTC's inquiry is whether economic fundamentals justified the 29% silver price spike over November and December, which drove the metal to an 8 1/2 -year high. When prices rose to more than $6 an ounce in December, some market participants attributed buying interest to increased demand from jewelry consumers in India. But others contested that much of the silver purchased and transported out of U.S. Comex warehouses was sent to private warehouses in Europe and was stored there by speculators trying to keep prices rising.

In October, Merrill Lynch analyst Ted Arnold noted in his precious-metals report that a large trading "syndicate" consisting of a large hedge fund and two aggressive bullion houses controlled or owned a large amount of silver in London or New York. In a year-end report released last month, he said the big unknown that would dictate prices would likely be
"what the so-called consortium would do and how high they will be able to raise prices against a backdrop of falling Indian demand and rising

Many traders and analysts noted that Indian demand did tail off at the end of 1997 because of currency weakness in the Indian rupee and rising Comex prices.

In addition, Martin Armstrong, chairman of the Princeton Economics Institute, said earlier this week that he had been contacted by a New York lawyer, Chris Lovell, for his opinion about whether silver
futures prices had been manipulated. While Mr. Armstrong said Mr. Lovell was preparing a suit seeking class-action status alleging price
manipulation, Mr. Lovell declined to comment and no suit has been filed. Princeton's trading arm had a short position of about 500 contracts on the Comex that would rise in value as silver futures fell, Mr. Armstrong said, adding that he advised taking the positions Dec. 30 because of patterns in the price behavior of silver relative to gold.

As talk of a possible class-action suit faded Tuesday, precious-metals markets were led sharply higher by gold and palladium. Gold futures rose $4.90 to $283.80 a troy ounce in heavy trading at the Comex behind heavy physical demand and reports of better-than-expected gold imports to Dubai.

Palladium futures rose by the daily allowable limit of $12 an ounce on fear that first-quarter shipments of Russian supplies could be delayed for the second consecutive year. The nearby March contract gained
$12 to $236.40 a troy ounce.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 06:51 - ID#286199)
Ebb & Flow
GOLD: Futures fell at the Comex division of the New York Mercantile Exchange following a rally in U.S. stock and bond markets, analysts said. The February contract dropped $3.20 to $302.80 a troy ounce. George Gero, senior vice president, investments, with Prudential Securities in New York, said that gold and silver fell as U.S. Treasurys and equities moved higher, following testimony by Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan in which he warned economic growth could slow.

WSJ Interactive subscriptions are only $49 per year if paid all at once or 5 and change per month. You get Barron's and SmartMoney thrown in.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 07:04 - ID#302251)



Crystal Ball
(Fri Jan 30 1998 07:06 - ID#340392)
Hillary says
It takes a village
to satisfy my husband

(Fri Jan 30 1998 07:18 - ID#302251)
CHEROKEE..........WAKE-UP !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
that a 150km ice-block just broke from the North Pole.
They called it an enviromental disaster which will change sea temperatures.
Our '''Media''' did not report anything yet.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 07:21 - ID#36965)
This gold market reminds me of my wife getting up in the morning. She opens her eyes for a minute, then dozes off, then opens them again slowly making her way up. Finally she jumps out of bed. That is what we are seeing; the slow awakening of the gold bull rather than the huge overnight rebound many had predicted here. However, awake is better than asleep and asleep better than falling out of bed.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 07:24 - ID#36965)
ice breakoff
Please humor a not metric New Mexican. How big in miles is the ice break off. Its sounds huge.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 07:27 - ID#302251)
150km is just under 100 miles !!!!!!!!!!
100 miles = 160 km

those dummies on short wave still think in km.
OR maybe........we are the dummies........

(Fri Jan 30 1998 07:29 - ID#302251)


You have a choice between the natural stability of gold and the
honesty and intelligence of the members of government. And with all
due respect for those gentlemen, I advise you, as long as the
capitalist system lasts, vote for gold.

-- George Bernard Shaw

(Fri Jan 30 1998 07:32 - ID#35767)
Armstrong may be right. But what if the buyer is just taking delivery at a PRIVATE thus non reporting place. IMHO this is probably the case AS THE INVENTORIES KEEP FALLING and lease rates keep rising despite the threat of a lawsuit and invesytigation. These threats only effect the futures players thus the pressure on the market in the months before first notice day. Notice the real move up came in DEC so it should in March after gradual strength in FEB. IMHO those taking Solver are doing so in preparation for the REAL bull and they will unload some when everyone in the worl wants it and their sales will have little effect on price. Why not buy all you can before the real Bull mkt. Thats just being smart. If they have stored it privately just wait til the investigators open up the LBMA and there aint none there. TALK ABOUT YER SQUEEZE. The people who are doing this are not short term and are smart enough to do everything legally. Nothing wrong with buying to take delivery and storing privately. The fact that stocks of silver decline inspite of lawsuits and investigations should give worry and pause to the bears. The buyers know big investment demand will develop soon. Anyone notice how gold Comex stocks have dropped from 2.7 million a few years ago to 4oo k area now. What does Armstrong think of this / same phenomena but no mention. Oh thats right gold prices have fallen in the process. The fact that iit is happening in two commodities makes it less likely that there is some sort of conspiracy. Yet the fact of falling stks in both commodities is an undeniable fact. They dont have CBs with silver so use THREATS. There maybe someone gobbling it all up at the artificially low prices. The futures mkt is the price discovery mechanism for silver and thus until contract month artificially suppresses prices as speculators react yto the threats. When we go into the delivery month that all changes and the CASH MARKET is king. JUST KEEP INVESTIGATING AND THREATENING AS SILVER STKS DECLINE AND DRIFT INTO PRIVATE WAREHOUSES REMAIN FOR LONG TERM INVESTMENT.

DONT THEY say in stocks that the smart money accumulates at low prices..HMM Since Martin Armstrong sees no inflation he cant understand why someone would do this with silver. He is settin up alot of people to get wiped out by being short.

Bob M
(Fri Jan 30 1998 07:43 - ID#26059)
If Clinton survives this one, he may very well be a political god, then the true person will emerge and look out, the leftist agenda will shine forth big time...may even usher in a Democratic Congeress...then the metals will truly be in a Bull Market...and equities will tank..a leftist Democratic takeover will upset the markets greatly

(Fri Jan 30 1998 07:48 - ID#31876)
I agree with your comments about Armstrong and the mis-information
about the coming squeeze in the silver. Anyone who is uncomfortable
should re-read Ted Butler, golden-eagle, January 18.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 07:58 - ID#364147)
Monster waves rollin in

(Fri Jan 30 1998 08:16 - ID#427357)
THE END OF THE LINE... for the Silver Lease CON

ROR ( Armstrong/Silver ) & Leland:

Armstrong's 500 SHORT SILVER CONTRACTS position hardly qualifies him as an unbiased source of opinion regarding silver warehousing -- quite the contrary!

On the other hand Ted Butler is the worlds foremost expert in nuances, intricacies and ramifications of GOLD & SILVER LEASES. Many months ago he exposed the Central Banks ill use of Gold Leasing Operations. Now he shares his insightful observations regarding the Silver Loan CON.

And don't be surprised with future tactics intended to derail
what promises to be a very long and sharp price UPWARD spiral for silver.

...there is no way that the vast bulk of silver loaned can ever be returned.

That was then, this is now - the silver lease CON is over! email me for more detailed information:

(Fri Jan 30 1998 08:27 - ID#364147)
4th quarter GROSS domestic product was up--------------------
4.3% ( expecTED to be up 3.8% )

(Fri Jan 30 1998 08:31 - ID#35767)
Commercials/Silver shortage
OF COURSE COMMERCIALS will say there is no shortage of silver as they are the last to want to see their costs rise. Moreover, they have benefited from the artificial suppression of the prices for years. The lease rates tell the undeniable truth.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 08:37 - ID#289382)
Gold Up
CNBC- Gold Spot at 303.15

(Fri Jan 30 1998 08:38 - ID#93232)
@Teddo...I love the smell of anthrax in the morning....or night?
I heard that Fidel is contemplating lacing his american-bound 'gars with a bit of 'thrax....smokers beware....only smoke El Versos or Swisher Sweets,,save money...smoke safe.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 08:41 - ID#348127)

Gold prices should fall today as a strong dollar and Japans markets had an active night.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 08:43 - ID#419147)
Why do we have to make living and save by predicting events as manipulative as gold and silver prices.

I surely would like to make money the old fashioned way, print it that means, can anyone recommend good equipment to make 100$ bills?


(Fri Jan 30 1998 08:52 - ID#289382)
Weak dollar in Europe, Stong in Japan.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 09:07 - ID#93232)
All I ask is....
BUY MORE GOLD..EAT MORE BEEF...SPILL MORE GASOLINE ( when you fill 'er up ) ....if the G/B/G index does not go north soon...I may stage a public human fireball Phillies over the eyes, two Whoppers in hand, doused in my part for the causes...Studiolonious Monk.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 09:07 - ID#256255)
Bart ... please fix the quotes. It is very frustrating to NEVER be able to trust their readings.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 09:11 - ID#256255)

Futures Contracts
Updated as of: Jan 30, 1998 @ 9:07 am ET

Sym. Name Last Change %Chg High Low Vol.

GC G8 Feb. Gold 3036 +8 +0.3 3089 3013 39.1K
SI H8 March Silver 5995 -35 -0.6 6025 5965 24.6K
HG H8 March High Grade Copper 8020 -50 -0.6 8070 7980 8.73K
PL J8 April Platinum 3870 -7 -0.2 3885 3870 2.24K
PA H8 March Palladium 23700 +360 +1.5 23850 23700 433

(Fri Jan 30 1998 09:14 - ID#26793)
From Davos: Mexican Fin Min says peso to remain volatile (surprise?)

(Fri Jan 30 1998 09:16 - ID#289382)
CNBC Commodity Update
9:15 ET, Gold Spot 303.75

(Fri Jan 30 1998 09:17 - ID#26793)
Clinton wins Man of the Year award

(Fri Jan 30 1998 09:17 - ID#256255)
On open gc8g spiked up to 308.+ .

With stocks dropping, I see our situation as climbing the wall of worry.
The DOW is zooming up on NO FEAR because there is no place to put the money put stocks. They are zooming on AL words. Rubin's words. They can ignore ASIA, currency CRISIS, slowing earnings, ... .

Place your bets carefully.


(Fri Jan 30 1998 09:22 - ID#26793)
Foreign lines of credit stopped to all but three Japanese banks. Major story.

Dave in CO
(Fri Jan 30 1998 09:22 - ID#215211)
@newtron 02:58 - excellent summation - should appear in the history books
"...boy prez hangs to the left politically and anatomically..."

According to Jennifer Flowers' statements I've heard, the unaided eye cannot determine on which side it's hangin'.

Another one for the history books: president evades possible impeachment/prosecution because of a questionable legal ruling by a judge from his home state who was his student/friend.

My admiration for the character of Richard Nixon grows by the day.

This resolution is probably long-term good for gold but not good short-term for my blood pressure.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 09:23 - ID#256255)

Date: Fri Jan 30 1998 08:16
vronsky ( THE END OF THE LINE... for the Silver Lease CON ) ID#427357:

Thanks for your continued posts. I find them very informative an helpful.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 09:32 - ID#26793)
More European banks likely to suffer downgrades due to Asia exposure

(Fri Jan 30 1998 09:33 - ID#254269)
good morning all.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 09:33 - ID#289382)
CNBC Commodity Update
9:30 ET, Gold Spot 304.50
Silver Spot 6.19 What a JUMP.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 09:35 - ID#220272)
Gold 303.80 +1.05 09:36

(Fri Jan 30 1998 09:36 - ID#220272)
Gold 304.35 +1.60 09:37

(Fri Jan 30 1998 09:39 - ID#348286)
@Hope I don't jinx the market
Spot Gold could have a good run today, IMHO my prediction 308. to 310. close.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 09:39 - ID#333131)
Donald, Your 9:22 on Japanese Banks
This seems momentous. Do you have a feel for what this will do to the dollar/yen? I feel like I'm in Alice in Wonderland. Japan with huge reserves and trade surpluses with a weak currency and the US with giant trade deficits and a strong currency.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 09:48 - ID#344308)

watching cnbc before the opening bell.....

they showed gold down $6.00!!

they wish!! lying dogs.....

hang on to your hides........klinton's fixing to give us------goldbugs--
one hell of a ride.......


ziva--------i was sitting on top of that ice-shelf--somnambulistically---
------------when it crashed into the the ssm wet!

there are going to be a lot of un-wanted baths given very shortly......
in scalding h2o..........

ALLABOARD------------the ssm leaves for higher ground---aasgard----
at the closing bell.......going to partake of the nectar of the
gods.........knowledge.........sweetest fruit in the SOLar system....


Richard Burke
(Fri Jan 30 1998 09:50 - ID#411318)
Which way gold?
Moregold: I am looking for a gold stock buying opportunity on a dip in gold to 296. We appear to be at opposite ends of the spectrum.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 09:57 - ID#364147)
The farmer................ and does Canada still have a currency
Studio.R: Luckily I grow my own ( hmmmmmmmmm ) ......Re-Canuck buck: And I mocked my Bangkok brother ( a sleezy lawyer ) for investing rich amerikan's money in Baht-relaTED stocks on the SET....Might have done better to buy a house in Thailand.... ( EH ) ....and just what does crooked-mouth do in Ottawa????....go XON + Bubba!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:01 - ID#364147)
Novice..................and Canadian immigration policy
Pathetic,ain't it but thank the good lord ( James Brown ) they didn't accept ( MOIS ) ---guess my french ain't good

(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:03 - ID#364147)
Loading my gun
GET THYISSEN~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:03 - ID#251268)
Tail wags the dog!
It is my uneducated guess that the futures market will push gold higher today,unlike the last what seems like forever.What a deal you can buy gold in the future for less than it takes to store it,watch the volume explode! ( maybe ) Cherokee whats up with corn been long been short seems kinda flat?


(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:06 - ID#364147)
Still MAdly cleaning the house--------------------
switched shovels..............go team gold!!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:07 - ID#251268)
oh yah,
The point I was making is instead of spot pushing futures I see Possibilty of reverse.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:08 - ID#364147)
Bro-----stop posting from work or I'll turn ya in!
And finally, this one from yours truly:

Ted Kennedy apparently went up to Clinton the other day and gave his some

"At least she isn't dead."

Ba da boom.
Only the individual sender is responsible for the content of this
message, and the message does not necessarily reflect the position
or policy of the National Education Association or its affiliates.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:13 - ID#348286)
@Gold Stocks
Richard Burke: I think a lot of investors are waiting for lower prices to buy.
These investors will be pushing the markets much higher as they attempt to jump on the moving train.
IMHO the seasonal lows were hit in December.
Example: Eldorado was .60 a month ago and is now 1.15 .

Voyeur Professor
(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:13 - ID#231101)
CBS Market Watch this morning on mining stock

AN FRANCISCO ( CBS.MW ) -- North American gold mining stocks have risen 25 percent as a group since touching a low Jan. 12, yet few investors are rejoicing.

The Philadelphia Gold & Silver Index of mining companies has recovered a nice chunk of its steep losses in the past two weeks, in part because of a $15 gain in the price of gold futures during the same time span. Some individual gold mining stocks, namely Newmont Mining and Barrick Gold, have gained as much as 30 percent during the period.

Yet the metal's rise to above $300 an ounce, due in part to a sliding dollar and skittishness over a White House crisis, still leaves it perilously close to 12-year lows.

And gold mining stocks, after the fast and furious rally, are still severely depressed. The group's rally came to a screeching halt Thursday as the Philadelphia Gold Index fell 4.5 percent.

Newmont Mining's stock market worth of $4.3 billion is yards distant from the $7.3 billion high it hit Feb. 28, 1997. See table. And so it goes for all gold stocks, large and small.

February gold futures are benefiting somewhat from a fall in gold stocks in exchange-certified warehouses. Gold supplies fell 12,006 ounces to 429,899 ounces in the latest count. News that Newmont Mining plans to cut back its operation also is boosting futures. The Colorado company expects to cut its workforce by 11 percent.

"As we predicted," says longtime gold bug James Dines of "The Dines Letter" in California, "gold mining companies everywhere are starting to shelve projects and beginning to close down." Theoretically, such shrinking of the industry will reduce the supply of precious metals to jewelers, coin mints and investors.

Major Wall Street analysts smell opportunity in companies that are reducing their jobs rosters by closing mines.Throwing in the towel?

February gold this week rose as high as $306 a troy ounce on the Commodities Exchange division of the New York Mercantile Exchange and was last down $2.50 to $303.50 Thursday. See Futures Movers.

Robert Bishop of the "Gold Mining Stock Report" has followed mining companies for decades and isn't throwing in the towel. Yet he is complacent.

"What an investor would buy today may bear little resemblance to what a person might have liked a year ago," says Bishop, whose newsletter is written from California. "I don't mean to sound like the Grim Reaper, but when there is a reason to feel more positively about gold, I'll happily shift gears."

The major Wall Street analysts, meanwhile, smell opportunity in companies that are reducing their jobs rosters by closing mines. ( See our jobs layoffs story. )

Newmont just unveiled strong fourth quarter profits of 27 cents a share, leading Daniel McConvey at Goldman Sachs & Co. to raise his 1998 estimates sharply: to 49 cents a share from 31 cents a share. The analyst's brighter outlook comes even though he sees gold prices rising to a mere $310 an ounce this year and $325 a year next.

Dines, a self-described gold lover, says the "only gold stock in the world ( whose stock is ) in an uptrend is International Pursuit." The Toronto-traded company is actively exploring for gold and copper deposits in the Philippines, Indonesia, Mongolia and Nevada. The penny stock has about doubled after news of a possible copper and gold discovery in Southeast Asia.


(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:15 - ID#28594)
Davos Update--Kohl Keynoter....

Davos, Switzerland, 29 January  German Chancellor Helmut Kohl tonight called for "a comprehensive North-South partnership for environment and development." At the opening session of the 1998 Annual Meeting of the World Economic Forum, he declared:
"The most important contribution the industrialized nations can make towards positive development in the Third World is to commit themselves to a liberalized system of world trade. The products of developing countries must have a fair chance on world markets."

Kohl, underlining that "environmental protection and economic development belong inseparably together," said increasing environmental pollution posed a threat among other things to world climate and thus to humankind as a whole.

He also said he was "in no doubt that the euro will arrive on 1 January 1999 as agreed. The euro will be a currency of lasting stability. It will eliminate the exchange rate risk for member countries. This will save companies all over Europe about 90 billion marks a year."

West Germany inherited debts totalling 350 billion marks from East Germany with reunification in 1990, but it has transferred 900 billion marks net of public funds to Germanys new provinces since 1991, equivalent to 4% of annual GNP. "That money has been well invested," he told the Annual Meeting. "As a result, the most up-to-date transportation and telecommunications infrastructure in the world is emerging in that region."

At the same time, Germanys over-65s will be 26% of the population in 2030, compared with the present 15%. "That is why we are taking the necessary action now in order to keep the welfare state affordable and sustainable. We are easing the tax burden on citizens and investors. Our aim is to bring direct taxes on individuals and companies in Germany down to a competitive level, and also to make the tax system simpler and more equitable."

"The ending of the East-West confrontation which had dominated the world for decades offers Europe, indeed the whole human race, a magnificent opportunity to build a world in which we can all solve global problems together," Chancellor Kohl said.

Donald@Japanese.Banks And they are telling us that the crisis is over!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:19 - ID#364147)
Obviously...........not MADly house cleaning------------
Feb. Gold up 2.0~~~~~~~~~~~~

(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:23 - ID#344308)


look at the daily charts for beans, oats, and corn..........

look at the weekly chart for same........channels? look at weekly
corn....what is fixing to happen? oats in a hell of a tight channel...

what do you see grasshopper?

i see some strong moves coming......down........use your own mind.....

the smoke-signals are is the raging asian contagion.......don't be fooled by a rebound in stocks or the
way it just seemed to 'stop being a factor!' ask the asians how it
has impacted their lives.......and it's just getting started!

it is close to our shores.....they cannot afford our exports.....
they are CLOSE TO TOTAL IMPLOSION!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

look at where we are in history........

world-wide currency crisis........
world-wide debt crisis............
war drums world-wide..............
govt's in chaos world-wide........

sh!t there is nothing left...................BUT WAR!!!!!!!!!!!

this is a set-up............if it can be seen at this level, then
tell me how those at the top of the information pyramid cannot! alas,
they can......and oh how they plan, with the lives of all men.....

tolerant1-------there will be more than 1 feast when the eagle flies....
.................she eats the eyes.......i'm there.......

forgot to tell you share-buddy-fin--you're the throttle man...let-er-rip.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:23 - ID#28594)
Davos Update--Thai Minister speaks...
Thai Premier highlights Chinas importance for Asian stability

Thai Prime Minister Chuan Leekpai told 2000 business, financial and political leaders that the industrialized nations, particularly the G-7 in concert with large countries such as China, should discuss how to increase stability in the economic system. "Major economies must recognize that their conduct of macroeconomic policies will inevitably
have an impact upon other countries as well as the global economy as a whole. The maintenance of currency stability in China is a crucial factor in sustaining the stability of other currencies in Asia," he said. "The effective stimulation of Japans domestic economy will provide an engine for recovery in the region as a whole. Continued and expanded access to Europe and North America will be equally important. These issues should receive prompt attention by the major industrialized economies, in particular from the G-7 countries, working in concert with other large economies such as China."

(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:25 - ID#22956)
Thelonious Monk - Now that cat has a GOLDen horn...ohmy.
away...toot, toot!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:26 - ID#224149)
Loony  lets all sing together God save the Queen . Mulrooney and the loony what a pair of hot- air baffling buffoons .

(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:36 - ID#251268)
Yo Dude,don't forget its only paper they canuse when the ink is still wet,look at the Korean package,but your in good company,Glen Ring ( who has been great at calling the moves ) see's 200 corn and 300 wheat by fall.I'm not convinced which way it will go yet.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:37 - ID#254269)
Soros Watchers; this is a REAL interesting article;

(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:43 - ID#28594)
The New World Order--are we listening?
Swiss President Flavio Cotti highlighted protection and promotion of human rights as a priority for the 21st century: "The next century must become a century of human rights." He understood that companies must focus on economic success as their main priority but he knew of "very effective contributions to human rights by business, contributions which
naturally remain discreet."

Professor Klaus Schwab, founder and president of the World Economic Forum, announced a new initiative entitled TRUSTEES "21" as "a comprehensive, pragmatic approach to improve the state of the world" involving people in positions of leadership and influence. Details are to be announced during the six-day Annual Meeting.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:47 - ID#373403)
Gold Information
Bloomberg shows gold up $1.50 at $306.40/oz. Kitco says $304. Why is it so hard to get a handle on this?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:47 - ID#28594)
Cherokee--And 'if' they could afford them...
FT reported last week that the shipping channels are clogged
by the monetary turmoil! You have another string for your

(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:49 - ID#22956)
50th Anniversary
Mahatma Ghandi was murdered 50 yrs ago today. Let us all take a moment and reflect what his teachings have done for us all. A great man, yes.

now...go gold celebrate for the little bald guy


(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:50 - ID#316238)
Pardon my ignorance, but would someone please translate: "IMHO".
It appears regularly in these columns, and I am stumped.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:51 - ID#288399)
Davos & Saddam
Andrea Mitchell, who flies all over with M. Albright, said on Imus this morning that time is "running out" and "there's only a week left". What does that mean? Is there some timetable or is that diplomatic veilled-threat talk? Or, do is Albright getting ready to deliver the "go ahead case/give US your approval bankers" to the Davos guys?

Making sandwiches, doing laundry, and buying physical.....Shlomo

(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:52 - ID#287358)
The xau has been trading like a short term top. The rallies are terrible and the down days are far worse than they should be.

John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:53 - ID#24135)
A state of flux
To all
Some opposition to jci sale of West Areas and Joel to anglos
at JCI shareholders meeting. Opponents led by Brett Kebbel who
obviously want it for hinself along with Randfontein. Mzi
Khumalo cuts low profile and resigns after lousing up company
in a big way. My guess is anglos will win in the end. They
always do.
Flack says Rangold ripe for takeover as results from Mali
start looking better. Could anglos be a possibilty?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 10:58 - ID#251268)
Prices ?
Lot of guys coplaining but KITCO lines up fine with my other sourses.IMHO =in my humble opinon

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:04 - ID#41229)
Dip buyers
I hope all these dip buyers have already put a position in gold. I can't figure out why some people are worried about getting in at a few dollars or a few % on stocks, the metal appears to be poised for a good move on some news on Iraq or BJC.

Never was a day trader.

John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:05 - ID#24135)
Life is tough for ape men
For the Missing Link
You said
Bloomberg shows gold up $1.50 at $306.40/oz. Kitco says $304. Why is it so hard to get a handle on this?
Its only hard for you booby. If you're nice I'll throw you
a tire to play with.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:07 - ID#246224)
Someone once (or twice) asked what amount of coins were confiscated in 1930's
According to the post last night ( all Fed reserves report ) line item COIN has value at US$536 Mln. Divided by US$42/oz = 12.76 Million troy ounces in gold coin. This not typically reported with the 262.9 million troy ounces of gold bullion ( total of 275.6 million troy ounces, @US$300 = US$82.7 Bln ) . Not a bad little kitty, eh?

Also not line item "Gold Certificates". Is this leased gold? Gold on loan to other CB's?? What think ye???

John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:08 - ID#24135)
I like liver too
for tolerant1
You are a class act. we hate the same people.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:08 - ID#22956)
a little bit-o-stuff regarding currencies
Old stuff...might be new for some ( the more dim ones ) ....:- )

The Buck, The Buck...everyone still wants the Buck. Can all three rally at the same time? It has happened before, no?

Encouraged by U.S. Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan and a

German Bundesbank member, currency traders refocused on economic

reasons for buying the dollar, pushing the U.S. currency higher

against the mark and yen.

One factor was the Congressional testimony Mr. Greenspan, who

spoke of the softening effect on the U.S. economy of Asia's

financial crisis.

His comments sparked a rally in U.S. stocks and bonds, which

simply highlighted the fundamental strength of the dollar,

especially as the looming threat of military conflict in the

Persian Gulf drives investors in search of a safe haven currency,

traders said.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:10 - ID#28594)
Global Leaders of Tomorrow--There is a 'short list'.....
Just checking around to verify that Rubin might well be in Davos,
I came upon this list....better take a look....

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:11 - ID#22956)
Half my post was cut off....trying again...
I removed ALL quotes too...

I'd say the markets were horribly burnt by rumors and speculation
at the end of last week, but they won't be burnt now, said Marc
Chandler, senior currency analyst at Deutsche Morgan Grenfell,
referring to the scandal surrounding President Clinton. Whey you
buy the dollar you are buying stock in America, not stock in

I think Whey=When

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:12 - ID#257136)
JTF re: 00:20-T#1 re: germ warfare and reaction in U.S.1
Add these words: and Clinton. ( he is as big a monster as saddam or any others!!

Even a MINOR germ attack would be seized upon by the administration as excuse for all sorts of shutdowns of Liberties.

Hoarders--be they persons following religious admonitions re: storage of foodstuffs; owners of arms and ammo.....

Any sort of terrorist action would be attributed to domestics. viz: okc ad nauseum..

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:13 - ID#41229)
U.S. Selling Gold?
JTF: Did you post that? That is very interesting, why would u.s. sell in the face of other countries hordeing, What would be the reasoning to sell when mining shutting down and down sizing, it would be interesting for the forume to discuss what would be the reasoning and implacations.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:15 - ID#22956)
Easy does it JohnD....
Remember the ONE.......ooooooooooohhhhhhhhhhhhmmmmmmmmmmm... alli akbah some eggo waffles


(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:20 - ID#258427)
Gold getting "whacked"
ddown .05 in a matter of seconds...

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:22 - ID#258427)
Man-o-Man look at that Gold
Go 1.15...hmmmm

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:23 - ID#220272)
Randgold takeover scenario
John Disney,

What would your camel say about how a Randgold takeover might work? Given that RANGY is trading at a 50% discount to NAV, wouldn't a buyout or takeover result in a quick double for shareholders? As interest in gold shares picks up, wouldn't you expect the discount to shrink? Thanks.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:28 - ID#41229)
Price swings
These swings in gold price causing option premiums to inflate. Purchased April 300 call 2 weeks ago for $280 was trading @ $1200 today!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:29 - ID#251268)
Last gasp
atempt to shaake out the weak longs not going to work us gold bugs seen worse than this and we are hard headed.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:30 - ID#411259)
..... JD & Nick .....

Nick @ "I think" --let's try again. To be valid a scientific theory must be tested.-

You are right of course about the proper testing of any scientific theory and my work appears to have been very shoddy indeed. The lab is a mess and my notes are indecipherable. I fear I may have set the whole field of Quote Bummers back several years.

I did buy Platinum at $410, mate. Bought a bit as high as $425. Still holding on to most of it. I bought none at the $341 low - to spooked about the sudden drop, I guess - but I did pick up quite a bit in the $450 - $460 range. The cost average has nearly put even my highest priced platinum in profits. That's one reason I Like platinum, it always comes back. Always.

John Disney -

Since I don't have a clue about mining stocks, and most of your posts deal with that subject, You and I have had very little to say to one another. I do enjoy your posts, though, and your latest bunch are both funny and informative.

I was an Arabic Linguist ( part of my interrogation training ) when I was in the army. I have since forgotten the entire language except for some sentence about my refrigerator which apparently stopped working and I don't know the reason. Since my refrigerator is in fine working order, I have had very little opportunity to practice my Semitic language skills. Your recent posts have a disquieting feel of Deja Vu. I can almost understand your Arabic references, but not quite.

John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:30 - ID#24135)
Oh sweet harmony of life
To all
Do my eyes deceive me ?? Harmony up 9 %. Moved past
drooy?. I told you raymond. I really am going to Musqat!

John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:33 - ID#24135)
Dont be a greedy polarbear
For Polarbear
Yes. I'd take 40 %- Call it 12 rand. say $2.5.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:34 - ID#254269)
Lou_ Jan : Kitco shorthand , your 10.50 ; see below

IMHO means In my humble opinion.
Some others are
IMNSHO, In my not so humble opinion.
BBL, Be back later.
There are probably some others I have not figured out yet.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:37 - ID#285392)
Speed, FundaMETALIST, EB THANKS for Armstrong info.
The article that I was looking for was Speed's 06:46 Many thanks to all three for taking the trouble. Other were enquiring as to whether Armstrong had an unterior motive in decrying silver, this may be it. I have found him to be the most accurate predictor long term. I have followed him for 7 years and for the most part he is right on. Short term he does not do so well, hence my hesitation on his silver predictions.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:38 - ID#26793)
I keep seeing stories like the Japanese situation that reinforce my absolute conviction that there is no way out of this mess. All currencies will be devastated in turn. Any solution attempt that does not include gold will fail. U.S. manufacturers and exporters are already calling for a weaker dollar. Mexico and Canada are now devaluing. The U.S. dollar can not escape the pressure. Bonds, stocks, all paper will go down with it. Major events are happening closer and closer together. Major banks are being downgraded daily. It must be close to the final breaking point.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:38 - ID#411259)
..... Forget Elliot Waves... I got the real thing .....

Woke up today to news that a big storm off Hawaii is going to bring 15 - 20 foot waves to western facing beaches for the next two days. After pounding beaches in Hawaii with 50 foot waves, the swell will arrive today during an extremely high tide caused by the storm surge. The upshot of all of this is that Huntington Beach will be slammin' today and I am taking the day off to witness the spectacle. Cowabunga.

Eboy -

You taking the day off? Got the board waxed? Got the bikini line waxed? Good good.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:39 - ID#31876)
USAgold for today....

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:43 - ID#22956)
Time to take profits or 'cap'... ( sell call against it ) ....better to have money in your account than on the trading floor sometimes, NO? Of course, do what you want, but it is two weeks ( or so ) till expiry and they will lose value FAST if gold goes nowhere. imo

do your homework, and ( as Eldo says ) caveats do apply.



hey Irvine, I'm holding a decent amount of Plat. in profits, tell your clients to give it a swift kick in the arse....NOW. Although, time is on my side, yes it is.... ( has anyone seen 'the Fallen' yet?, spooky ) ...

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:43 - ID#372344)
@ missinglink...I see Camel's Breath DIZZY Muhamed Spewing out hatred again!
To answer your question, Kitco Gold Chart and price showed 304 is Spot
price or cash price for Gold but Blooberg's normally show the nearest Gold 100 oz contract ( Feb etc.. ) traded in comex thus the difference in the two. BTW I would not let that hateful so called ANALcyst call
you names. he's pathetic....

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:45 - ID#364147) almost finished with the charts showing them-----------
Fibonacci fan lines on gold slowly starting to give the answers I so strongly desire~~~~~~~~ P.S. Who did Mahatma play for?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:46 - ID#93232)
@EB....Studio does Ranchie Santer Fe........
March 22-27...Toddy Time...plan Kitco convention....kill brain cell....ebthere? Monk=88 key genius.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:46 - ID#364147)
Poorboys + Loonie Tunes.....................and Chretien ain't a --------------

John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:47 - ID#24135)
On to Musqat - they have Danakil girls from Nubia - on special
For RJ
Effendim - you are very kind.
We did speak before but perhaps you have forgotten.
At that time I was in another shapechange - the old
troubadour of the Pyranees - who sometimes plays
leef ze skairts and has zee granate sheeps in heez
computaire. You may recall.
Al'lah O akbar

Charles Keeling
(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:48 - ID#344225)

Silver Market

Allegations of
Price Fixing

NEW YORK -- A lawsuit
was filed, as expected,
over last year's spike in
silver-futures prices.

The suit, which was filed
in U.S. District Court in
New York and seeks
class-action status,
alleges that Phibro -- the
commodities-trading arm
of Salomon Smith Barney
Inc. -- and 10 other
unnamed defendants,
acted to manipulate silver
prices higher during the
rally last year.

News of the suit, which
has been anticipated for
some weeks, pushed
down silver futures at the
Comex division of the
New York Mercantile
Exchange. The March
contract fell five cents to
$6.053 a troy ounce,
although it recovered
from a loss of 28.5 cents
at midsession.

The suit is on behalf of
Kerry Seale, a citizen of
British Columbia and the
sole proprietor of a
company called Golden
Harvest Co. It was filed
by Christopher Lovell of
the Lovell & Stewart law
firm in New York.

Phibro, through its
general counsel Mike
Young, rejected the
allegations of price
manipulation in the suit
as "egregious." It denied
removing silver from
Comex warehouses in the
past 18 months and
moving it to England or
elsewhere, and denied
acting in concert with
other market
participants. The
company also said it is
"considering our own
lawsuits against the
persons behind these
unfounded allegations."

Golden Harvest's suit
claims that Phibro and
the other defendants
forced Comex silver
futures up to "artificially
high levels" in the second
half of last year through
moving silver from
Comex warehouses to
"nonreporting black hole
locations" in England and

The suit says some
trades by the defendants
were carried out through
Republic National Bank
of New York, and it says
J.P. Morgan and Credit
Suisse held silver for the
defendants in London.
None of the banks are
listed as defendants in
the suit, and there's no
claim they were involved
in market manipulation.
J.P. Morgan and
Republic refused
comment, while no
spokesman was available
at Credit Suisse.

Comex silver stocks fell
by 90 million ounces
between late May and
the end of 1997. To
support the case that
price manipulation
occurred, the suit also
points to an
divergence between
silver prices and copper
and gold prices.

Such claims about
artificially high silver
prices have been keenly
debated since last
December, when prices
rallied sharply, hitting an
eight-and-a-half year high
of $6.378 an ounce during
intraday trading on Dec.

Some analysts argue that
the rise in silver prices
was a reflection of tight
supplies and solid
demand. Among those is
Jeffrey Christian,
managing director of New
York consulting firm
CPM Group. "I think it
[the action] is garbage
and at the end of the day
it will be a nonevent,"
Mr. Christian said.

Timothy Porter,
commodities analyst at
Refco Inc. in New York,
said the news of the
lawsuit was unlikely to
weigh on the market for
long. "The fundamentals
alone will keep prices
propped up pretty well,"
Mr. Porter said.

Wall Street Journal, Jan.
29, 1998

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:54 - ID#22956)
Cowabunga Boy
Gotta go to work real soon. Waves have been spectacular. I still have a shoulder injury that has me sidelined. Hurts when I paddle so I've been gettin fat and lazy. And it's too dangerous for a guy with an injury. All good excuses, right? NOT! Thanks for the wake-up call. GO PLAT! git my @ss to the gym

and shouldn't you be slamming the metals right now?? I know, ya' got the betty there and you're taking the morning off. You go man!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:55 - ID#251268)
EB 6wks not 2
Although can't argue with your advise but givin world situations I would rather be long than short over the weekend,somebody gets shot or blon up who knows,last friday somebody got a b.j. and gold went up 6.50

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:57 - ID#411259)
..... Kitco Hiccups? .....

Bart -

Since we were assigned ID numbers with our handles, my number has always been 411259. I see that my posts last night are identified with ID#410215. I just installed Netscape 4.03, so I thought that maybe that had something to do with it, but my ID # has reverted back to my original. I access this forum through only one computer, I don't get it. Bart???

EB -

Time is on your side, yes it is.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:57 - ID#348127)

(Fri Jan 30 1998 11:58 - ID#31868)
EB 10:49


John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:00 - ID#24135)
Is it my imagination??
Effendim -
Sometimes I feel the dwarf zebediyah does not
love me as I love him. It hurts me. When will he
find peace within himself, enshal'lah.

Yallah zebediyah
Dont play with that newsprint hurry - these Danakil girls
have skin like cool silk.
Al'lah O akbar

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:02 - ID#22956)
Studio - Santa Fe huh, I'll check the schedgie. Monk was on keyboards? I must have my monks all monkeyed up. Who's the dude with the FuNky HoRn?? Do you golfie??

Ted - he was a walk on for Temple and didn't play in NBA. Had no crossover dribble and nobody wanted him. Unlike get those charts posted. I want Gann lines too. the store...... ( ugh ) .....more blind old ladies today....I just know it.


(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:02 - ID#375108)
Ted: The CDN CB FINALLY heard ya....interest rate hike of 0.5% this a.m and the loon @ noon @ $68.65. One shouldn't expect too much of a central bank that has sold virtually all its gold. Great friend of the Canadian mining industry... Oh yeah, immigration... Inmates are in charge of the funny farm...

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:04 - ID#375108)
what's a decimal place or two...
Try CDN $ = $.6865 US at noon.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:05 - ID#31868)
This administration would set the USA on fire if they dared to impose anything. Clinton is a dirtbag ( no reference to current news items ) an absolute spend, spend, drive the US into the ground scu_bag.

Get Camdesuss!!!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:06 - ID#364147)
Novice + 'Ole Crooked Mouth'
Novice: You mean Chretien snapped out of his life-long coma~~~~His leadership abilities bring back memories of Churchill +

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:06 - ID#328159)
Quotes in Posts
"Suggest" 'that' ''posts'' ""with"" '''quotes'''
"'only'" "'get'" cut off if you cut and paste
from fancy word processors ( i.e. they're not
standard ASCII ) . Use a dumb ASCII editor to
prepare posts instead ( i.e. notepad, PFE )

The golden rule

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:08 - ID#251268)
Big waves!
Yeah you bet,they are so big they had to cancel the big wave clasic,which they don't even get to have unless 15 to 20 ( Waimea Bay Hi. ) last heard 35ers coming down from Alaska,I'm going to check them out tommorow,going to the Pro Bowl Yahoo!Gold bouncing back

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:09 - ID#364147)
Novice..............Sounded better the first time and was just lacing up by Nike's for
a sprint ta the bank....when ya brought me back down to earth..

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:09 - ID#256255)
Silver shorts please call into your brokers. Beat the Margin Call.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:11 - ID#364147)
EB..............and now you want Gann lines---------you are very demanding!---
You must be an

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:12 - ID#22956)
I got mixed up. That higher math does me in sometimes. Go for what you know!!! ohmy.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:12 - ID#93232)
Smoked links only....nogolfo....sorry. Could've been the Bird ( Parker ) of even Johnny Coltrane...could be anybody great...W. Shorter? Strad may come down too. One of Lini's folks' places...neat place.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:12 - ID#41229)
I'm sure you are right! Option expires 3-13 , I treating this option as a long shot, as Cherokee would say there is a lot of flux in the air. Too many thing happening in the world today that a major gold rise could happen in that time frame. Could be pie in the sky but will to risk $900 dollar gain for a much larger one.

I may not be understanding what your saying, If I sell one it puts me out of the position correct, or are you saying something else. Thanks, always ears for someones opinion, especially yours, you have made some very good calls.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:15 - ID#411149)
John Disney- I am with you on Harmony also. Although the volume in the USA is 1/10 that of DD. Matter of fact I am loaded with both of those,
I need another recomendation, SA that is??? Now I am lookin for leverage!

Tally Ho

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:19 - ID#372262)

Refer--Methinks US selling gold to keep the price of OIL from EXPLODING to the upside! The game is getting harder and harder to play and the Saudi's are getting antsy to raise oil prices NOW!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:22 - ID#31868)
You know the media is a bunch of lying dirtbags when they tell you that Clinton's popularity ratings are sky rocketing. Ah, yeah!

Get Camdesuss!

And let Rubin and Greenspan put in their money in first before any more money goes into the black hole of the IMF. And that includes all the dirtbag politicians and bankers around the world, you dirtbags put your money up first before one penny goes in from the people.

Bring me Fazzio that pimp for Camdesuss!!!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:23 - ID#254269)
Asian Waves; are they hitting Hawaii yet ?

RJ; Are you in Huntington Beach ? I was talking with a business associate in Northern California a few days ago and he said that the
Hawaiian economy is starting to feel the efects of the Asia metldown on tourism . Can anyone else address this issue ?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:24 - ID#335184)
DAVE IN CO Re 09:22 Judge Susan Weber Wright student to tudor Bill
Incest in Alternative Kansas, as in some "hollars" of the Smokey Mountains, knows no bounds! Any thing is possible & does happen in Alternative Kansas Toto !
There is no doubt that the Judge is committing egregious error in favor of the Boy Prez, but this may well come back to haunt his cause if she loses & then gets another bite at the apple.
Whatever happened to those Watergate pieties & platitudes of : "The President is not above the law" & "executive privledge shall not be used as a shield to criminal conduct" & ofcourse the ever ubiquitious, "the public's right to know must trump the needs of the chief executive to engender confidential & candid counsel from his advisors".
HRC's latest outrage, A LA, RIGHT WING BS, suggesting that the shere magnitude of press interest is presumtive evidence of conspiricy gives me pregnant poinant pause to refelct on the extended firestorm that Mrs. Reagan endured for merely purchasing a new set of china with donated funds. The press can truly fixate on inane things, however, serious & credible alligations of criminal conduct for financial gain by the President of the US is far from trivial. The miricle in my mind is that the Press is actually following it at all, as I believe they were only figuratively caught with their trousers down around their ankles & have not been able to dodge the public's interest.
Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain ! THe ALL & POWERFUL OZ HAS SPOKEN ! Tap your ruby slippers & repeat after me, "There's no place like Alternative Kansas & the Good Fairy of the East ( SAM Donaldson ) will waive her magic wand & all will fade to some black & white washed out opiant distraction.
All the poison that lurcks in the mud will out. Boil & bouble, toil & trouble,...out damn spot ! The Ghost of Banqo is the Spirit of their fallen comrade !
God bless us all, every one !

Tar Baby

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:26 - ID#410194)
*** Important Silver news ***
Photographic market expert "Peter Krause" has stated this morning that global use of Silver for photography increased 3% in 1997 to 232. million.

Also, late last night NYMEX released a statement that there is absolutely no basis for the charge that Silver prices are being manipulated.

Several people mentioned lately that it wasn't "normal" for Silver to move up without Gold as it has been doing regularly in December. Today, once again, Silver is moving up quite powerfully without the help of any other metals!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:29 - ID#220272)
Economic Collapse vs Economic Destruction
Just finished reading a very interesting article at Vronskys site by John Kutyn. Having lived in Asia for many years now, I feel comfortable stating tha this article goes to the very core of the ASIAN DEBACLE.

IMHO, he hits the nail on the head with his views that the IMF doomed-to-failure rescue attempts fail to realize that the real problem is too much debt and too little profit by corporations, governments, and individuals. It is this problem ( too much debt and too little profit ) that causes first a banking and then a currency crisis. I think that the Asian Governments' frantic short-term solutions may bring temporary respite from the crisis of recent months, but destine these embattled economies to a long, ugly journey ahead. It may only be a matter of time before it gets ugly at the local level here in Japan.

Kutyns entire analysis may be seen by clicking the title Economic Collapse vs Economic Destruction in the Hot News box on the Homepage of golden eagle.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:31 - ID#335184)
Unless I was being censored by the thought police !
Sorry BART if I was out of bounds . No offense intended or retracted !

Tar Baby

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:31 - ID#22956)
love to stay...I really would, but work is calling...oh hell, I'm the boss-man...
refer - mail me dude. It keeps you in the game...with profits locked and possibilities for more if price goes up ( although profit potential is capped too ) . If price goes down, the profits are already in your account and you lose nothing ( NOTHING ) ....except some commisshy to your broker ( but that's 'built in' and he's gotta buy his kid some shoes or something ) ...

Ted - yes, Gann lines too. and check the RSI for divergence. That kinda talk impresses the chicks at parties...uh huh.

Barb Hughes
(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:33 - ID#20783)
long weekends

Guess Barney is taking up the slack today.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:36 - ID#316409)
@ Realistic...Silver
The folks who listen to Amrstrong are going to miss one of the best opportunities in metals that we'll see in our lifetimes. Thanks for the latest news, I hadn't seen the Nymex release. No wonder silver is going so strong today...there have been plenty of times historically that silver has diverged from Gold anyway, and this especially makes sense in the current environment of CB sales of Gold, while silver has become more an industrial commodity than ever before.

John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:37 - ID#24135)
Lines in the sand
I look at the gold charts drawn in the sand. The
charts in currencies indicate we are in a zone of high
volatility and rapid movement. Moves as high as 470+
in swiss or perhaps even 197 in the coin of the
beloved Philby and Glubb Pasha are possible. This would
mean 310 -320 is a possibility, enshal'lah. The yen
perhaps is the key.
Stop flinging sand, zebediyah. Al'lah al'lah - you
are a burden. My charts are ruined.
To Musqat

John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:48 - ID#24135)
Maybe some garlic too - dont take chances
For Oris
I await your comments on RYO. I dont know what this
hairy thing is - maybe ape man maybe werewolf.
Better bring silver bullets just in case.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:49 - ID#372344)
@ newtron....reading between the lines?
RE your 2:58, where oh where is my post did you read anything about a "right wing conspiracy"? I believe I said "they". I agree with your
"dressing"left leaning point, however my point is all these facts about BJ
were known for years, .....Flowers,Jones ++++, and that it is more than
mere "curiosity" or" interest" for sex and dirt by americans, they have known for years, it's been all over the media ,'s not news... as a matter
of fact I counted an additional 12 times from last nite to now.....I believe a reasonable person after review of said facts would come to the conclusion that "they" ( a popwerful group ) is out to get BJ NOW at this
time for reasons which will become clear later.....
BTW isn't it sad when we in NA one of the the most "advanced" societies, are reduced to hear ,nightly, all about the President's
pe-is , size ,shape, that says lot about "morals"
and the relentless march of change, but is it for the better? JMHO

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:53 - ID#22956)
Silver and Brain Cells
LGB - you may be right...............and you may be wrong ( billy joel, eh chero? ) ....tick-tock, tick-tock.....the lgb ( with heap, bags-o-silver under his arms ) ran up the clock..... ( BONG ) ...

Mr. Studio, btw I have been one to off a few brain cells once or twice. Unlike the heydays I have been a reformed man. No drinking before noon, unless a sporting event is on.....wait a sec, I can get 24hr sporting events.....hmmmmm...

buy gold....where is Sheller? ( speaking of dazzling ) ...must be raining in the park, eh?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 12:59 - ID#364147)
Novice.............not ta beat a DEAD horse but re-the Canadian rate hike-------
Last night while watchin ( as I do EVERY night ) ATV ( Atlantic Can. version of CTV ) nightly news who should pop up on my screen but ole crooked mouth ( was so surprised I dropped my ( DARN ) dentures in my soup as it's been years since I've seen em on the news ) ,actually saying something about the plungin Loonie but I could have sworn that after his very luke-warm statement,the reporter said but the gov'ment in Ottawa ( that's the way it's always worded--not Chretien says but the gov'ment ( by committee no doubt ) would NOT raise rates to defend the loonie----do 'they know what they are sayin....or doin....Good ta hear they have a well thought out strategy to defend whats left of their currency ( gee whizzzzz ) ...away to scratch my head ( again+ again ) ~~~~~~~~~

Spud Master
(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:00 - ID#273112)
@Sunshine Silver...
"...when will this long yearning end..."

Someday, eh LGB? Still, I can dream of SSC @ $20...

Barb Hughes - WHAT is your problem with Vronsky? Bad form, old girl. Talking out of school and what. It certainly isn't cricket.

( appologies to J. LeCarre & Patrick McGoohan )

Spud, who will not be filed, stamped, indexed, briefed or debriefed...

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:01 - ID#335184)
There is an excellet update on progress of Asian Tsunami ( The Mask Of Red Death ) posted about 1 hour ago . I have no first hand knowledge about Hawai, but wouldn't you think that the currencvy disparities would be enough to put the Big Quahitus on tourism from Japan & Korea ? Also I read in Barrons that the effect has been devistating to ski condo R/E as it was vastly pumped up as part of Asian Bubble .
Chio & Lombago !

Tar Baby

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:01 - ID#333131)
Presidential popularity is just another economic confidence index. Most of the American people have bought into the planned economy notion that their well being is due to the government. The most paradoxical thing is that most of the people in the strong economies of the world have bought the underlying premisses of socialism while believing that free market capitalism won the cold war. I think I'm in Alice and Wonderland. My head is spinning. All that remains of me is my smile.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:07 - ID#41229)
Check your email, postman says you have a letter.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:09 - ID#410194)
@ jman
jman: I noticed your "10:36 am" post...

I learned a few weeks ago that "Glen Ring" is no longer the editor of "Trends in Futures". Do you know what he's doing now? And where?

Thanks in advance.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:09 - ID#57232)
The quote bug
RJ: I did your experiment too -- several days ago. The quotes did wipe me out -- then I think it was yesterday the bug disappeared -- for me anyway. I accidentally forgot not to use the

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:12 - ID#31868)
I understand what you are saying. Now what I am saying is that the media is lying, flat out, I would to see their numbers, and then do the polls again.

They have been beating the airwaves and hardwire withthe fact that women are backing the President, horsepucky. Like Bill Clinton is every womans wet dream. Horsepucky.

When these mushroom American wannabes wake up the rest of their lives are going to be filled with disillusionment.

Anybody have a stock pick out there for therapy booths, sorta like confession and tanning in the same half hour.


(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:12 - ID#57232)
The quote bug -- have it right now with Netscape upgraded to 4.04
RJ: I did your experiment too -- several days ago. The quotes did wipe me out -- then I think it was yesterday the bug disappeared -- for me anyway. I accidentally forgot not to use the 'quotes', and used them. Intermittent problems are worse than permanent problems, because they are hard to analyze.

I still have the quote bug, because I put quotes around the word 'quotes' above. Now they are just exclamation marks.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:12 - ID#410194)
The crashes
Kind of a quiet month in the North American stock markets although they approached their all time highs by the end of this month... and an impressive recovery took place in Asia throughout January, particularly in North Korea, Japan and Honk-Kong to name just a few.

It could have been worse:

Date: Fri Jan 09 1998 22:14
Puetz (>>> ) ID#222167:
Crystal Ball: This week was nothing in US stocks. Wait until next week , and the week after. 2 or 3 days of the DJIA down more than 1000 point is to be expected. The period between a full- moon and a new- moon is historically negative for a bubble- market - - once it bursts.

The full- moon on monday will be the start of the greatest stock market crash of all time. On Wall Strret Week tonight, the elves were still a bullish +4. Martin Zweig was still bullish. He believes - - as long as the Federal Reserve is easy, stocks will rise. That belief assumes that any individual entity can control the economy. If it is obvious, it is obviously wrong - - as Granville used to say. Deflation has the upper hand, and the Fed has lost control.

I'm still looking for the DJIA to crash to somewher between 2000 and 5000 before the end of January ( this year ) . Monday should be a serious down day. Maybe not 1000 points, but it could very well be.

Let it be known, I'm still very bearish on stocks, and very bullish on gold and silver.

Date: Thu Jan 08 1998 21:33
Puetz ( ) ID#222167:
Thar she blows -- 9000 is history on the Hong Kong market. Another psycholigally important support level is broken. Tokyo below 14,000 is next. Then comes the big NYSE stock market crash. Stay tuned.

Date: Sun Jan 11 1998 15:41
Puetz ( ) ID#222167:
Only 3 more hours before the carnage begins is Asia.
Stay tuned to Kitco for the details.
The great stock market crash of 1998 is set to begin!

Date: Sun Jan 11 1998 21:05
Puetz ( ) ID#222167:
The s**t just hit the fan. Hong Kong opens down nearly 1000
points. Wanna know the next crisis point - - Hong Kong!

John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:12 - ID#24135)
Some thoughts for Raymond
For Ray
Some ideas - Randfontein could double based on
solid earnings with no change in gold price. Avgold is
undervalued because of low cost Target prospect.
Then there is rangold - I have some - I like it the
least of these three but on a takeover maybe a quick
50% - or a fall on your face. Its well valued.
For example, the resource company has 11 mill oz
reserves. The syama heap leach is forecast at $110
per oz average cost for 30,000 oz per year. There are
projects everywhere. Reading this report makes you feel
like indiana jones. But the market cap is 350 mil
rand or 70 mill$ for 11 mill oz reserve at 110$/oz
cost thats 6.5 $ per oz. Now why does a guy like you buy
a stock like RYO when you can buy this??
This is flack who does not BS. If kebble said
this I would read the fine print and count my fingers
and toes.
Im talking myself into more after calculating cost
of reserves.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:15 - ID#254269)
Economic collapse; Polarbear your 12.29; It's amazing how much debt can

cripple an individual, a company, a region or a country. You're right, to make more loans is just crazy. When you don't have any debt, it's amazing how low your breakeven can be ! If they were serious about these bailouts, then IMF should probably "just give them a billion or two"
to help them out but unfortunately that would be hard to explain to the
average American taxpayer. I just did a small calculation and if a billion dollars were spread over 250 million Americans or other Westerners, then
it works out to $4 per capita. I would be happy to write a check for $40
( or even $400 ) and just give it to someone in Asia ( who really needed it ) , rather than have it go the "long way" through my taxes to Washington and the IMF etc. Unfortunately, I don't see that happening though !

Likewise, I agree with Tolerant 1, about Mr Camdessus ( whatever his name is ) writing a personal check to some poor Asian.
I hope this all makes sense; I'm trying to do this on the run today.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:20 - ID#31868)
John Disney_A
I am sorry to report that the Midgetbegone from Ronco is not available at this time. Apparently Ronco has been deluged for their newest hot seller the Babbitbegone with orders exceeding their manufacturing capabilities in the Western part of the United States.

The big difference is that while the same technique is used to drive the critter away via the use of high frequency, there is a major cosmetic difference.

The Babbitbegone does not get buried in the ground, it has a small casino with lights and is merely pushed into the ground until the casion is at ground level.

If you do not mind a tiny casino outdside your tent I will inquire as to a possible shipping date. It could be a while though.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:21 - ID#251268)
Well I got his farewell comments in His last trends in futures,mostly he said he wanted the independence of not being commited to a job type thing,said he is still trading,kids are grown doesn't need to worry about money etc.Steve Brieseid is the new editor.

John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:28 - ID#24135)
Ill get back to you on this one.
for Tolerant1
Say, have you got any recipes for midget liver?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:30 - ID#410194)
Regarding my "13:12" should obviously read "South Korea".

But there was no crash of any kind in North Korea either though......

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:36 - ID#410194)
Thanks again for the valuable info jman.

Glen Ring played a big part in my education concerning the markets but I stopped following his newsletters once I wanted to be on my own.

Steve Briese has some big shoes to fill but he has an excellent reputation in the circle.

Quixotic 1
(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:36 - ID#176235)

JTF, Sorry I missed you last night.
I see very few changes for the better, albeit some. I still see far too much of the old "take care of me and my friends first" mentality, with complete disregard for their constituency's rights, beliefs and fiduciary interest. I think there is a movement under foot to take more responsibility for our representation, but to little, too late. Give the masses their beer ( Bud ) , pizza, football, and the "Illusion of Prosperity", and the lemmings won't make waves. There is no more solidarity in "We the People, of these united States" ( small u intentional ) .
Is it possible that the CIA director was commenting about the Whitehouse not being able to keep control of its dirty laundry? These agencies are all arms of the Whitehouse. How independent can their views and public comments be? BC is professional politician. That's it. The office imparts disdain on all it touches. I believe we have a lot to worry about, as BC searches for a legacy.
I had the privilege of discussing this current BC incident with our Governor. Her daughter had worked at the Whitehouse as an intern some years ago. After about 10 minutes of the standard Party Line response, I asked if She would allow her daughter to return for a termI did not get a response !!!
Sorry for the attack, It was either that, or I take it out on my dog. My wife is starting to worry. The poor dog has only one leg left.

Gold for the good guysGMJ

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:37 - ID#254269)
Value of Information; Tolerant one; this one is "sort of" for you in rsponse to your

12.22 and a few of your other posts re Clinton's popularity. I think you're
rightthat the media is lying but I also think right now the US economy is
"doing too well" and the average Joe just doesn't care too much about
the DC mess. The average person ( who probably doesn't frequent this site ) is only concerned about their next paycheck and what they're going to have for dinner tonight, they really don't tune into international finance
like we tend to do. Thus, to my real point, if you control the information database ( CPI figures, debt figures etc ) and the MEANS OF DISTRIBUTION ( i.e. mainstream press, ABC. CBS, NBC etc ) , then you can "control" the main population with very little effort. Of course, if you cannot control the means of distribtion ( such as the Internet, foreign press ) , then you have to do some "armtwisting" ( such as Madeleine is trying to do in Europe re Saddam ) , because then not everyone is behind you. I notice that the Europeans ( except for the British ) have not been too quick to jump into this Saddam thing that the administration is trying to "whip up" ( again to take the spotlight off of Billie Boy ) .
I hope you get my drift, pardner.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:38 - ID#372344)
@ tolerant1.......
In case you hadn't noticed this is a Discussion Group on matters
relating to GOLD, if you wish to discuss ronco batteries and the like,
may I suggest you obtain D's e-mail and discuss said ronco batteries
or any other matter Not related to Gold directly and pricately .
thank-you in advance for your understanding in this matter.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:41 - ID#31868)
T person, don't read my posts
My monitor has a button that says bright and it has not helped any of your posts.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:46 - ID#364147)
JTF................and RD
Ya bought any yet ( grin thing ) ~~~~~~~~~

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:46 - ID#31868)
I get your drift, I fear that the fiat drift will bury us. AG and RR showed me nothing today in their comments. Nothing at all. Their cure is worse than the disease.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:47 - ID#403277)
John Disney
Danakil girls have stitches, you know.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:48 - ID#372262)
Tell like it is TZADEAK

Amen brother TZADEAK! Away now to bow down toward Washington and my idols Bill and Hillary C! NOT!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:49 - ID#335184)
Did you catch my 09:22 to DAVE IN CO ? I think it gives my rebuttal to your post.
My central point is that as fantastic as the attention is to this peckerdilly ( YOUR POINT THAT EVERY ONE WITH A PULSE KNOWING THAT THE BOY PREZ is a KENNEDYESQUE CLASS LETCHER BEING UNASSAILABLY TAKEN AS A GIVEN, NOT WITHSTANDING ) , it doesn't take a villiage or a Philly PHD to explain the present PRE-DICKament the Boy Prez has brought us to . Remember above all things Bill likes to live out there on the edge & in Arkansaw parlance, that means the more hanging out, the better. I know this sounds tawdry, but you can't make this stuff up, as fiction can never truly compete with the truth & " PUSSY-FOOTING " just won't do it justice ! Remember that Gennifer Flowers said in her Penthouse interview that Bill could & frequently did " cut a line like a Pro". Cocain does make one feel, invincible & I couldn't help noticing that his convicted drug dealing half-brother, Roger, was at his side at the Super Bowl party he threw for his spiritual advisor, THE REVEREND JACKSON.
Of course, ROAD WARRIOR RODAM is never so powerful & in control as when she is enabling & validating & covering up his addictions, no matter what body she has to step over or through or feminatzi principle she has to trash to do it!

No, Virginia, there really is a Santa Claus & you really can understand all the players, their motves & MO'S on the simple merits ( SIC? ) before us, without resort to even mild paranoia.
As they say in the PARROT SKETCH, "IT DON'T ENTER IN TO IT." Even if the sordid life of the boy Prez is a simple Pallandrone !

Choi & Lombago!

Tar Baby

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:51 - ID#411149)
John- thanks!! NatWest also has a BUY on
Ranfontein. I am lookin for 10+ baggers or
25+ baggers in the case of DD. If gold moves
RYO is in that categoty mainly because it is easy for the poor
bboys to buy as is ECO.
Glad I sold that DOG silver stock SSC and bought
more SSRIF and PAASF. Tryin to diversify and steped
in IT.
I am tryin to beat my X144+ from the past BULL

Tally Ho

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:53 - ID#213265)
@the scene
Just goes to show, the metals ain't 'broke' until THEY say they are!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:54 - ID#372344)
@ can count on it...
Rest assured that I seldom read your posts...I thought for a moment
you might have had something to say about Gold.....
But why don't we get all back to the purpose of this discussion group
which is Gold, let's not clutter bandwith ... and please what ever you do please DO NOTread my posts, it would make me happy......
thank-you again....

(Fri Jan 30 1998 13:58 - ID#254269)
Assaulting the Messanger ; Editorial in WSJ today re the Clinton/Starr situation

It's right there on PageA14 and it's about this very subject we've been
talking about. How the White HOuse is trying to "move the spotlight "
away from them.

2. Starr "War" article by Paul Gigot right next to first article.

I hate to tell you this folks, but I think that there are some Press people
in Washington who CAN think and are starting to do so.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:02 - ID#335184)
JTF, THIS IS TAR BABY, come n Rangoon , can you hear me ?
Did you get my post to you re US Monetary policy 1914 to 1929 ?


Tar Baby

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:07 - ID#375108)
Does the right hand know what the left hands doin..??
Ted: We're gettin our Au dip...and I'm gonna be a dippie ( but not yet ) ! Wasn't someone supposed to take delivery today? Re: CDN politicos: don't expect too much of Chretien...he's been around Ottawa since the 60s....enough to fossilize anyone's gray matter. Bring on Stephen Harper ( who no longer is in politics ) , sez I. Back to da grind...

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:07 - ID#288100)
Avalon 13:15
Right on. The problem is that with any institution, government,

or corporation, is that the incompetant finally rise to the top.

All we are going to do in Asia is forgive the incompetant, so they

can have another go at it. The longer I live the more I see why

revolutions happen. The people in power concentrate that

power among their families ( i.e.Kennedys ) and friends ( Suharto ) .

However due to the fact that very little new blood gets

in, very few new ideas percolate through the system.

The real problem is that companies, or governements on

completely wrong tracks have the power to continue

screwing up the planet and the masses. However a

certain king in France found out the hard way, along

with a certain Czar. It is not politics it is power.

I think politicians should be seen but not heard. Government

is a simple job made complex by the ignorant.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:07 - ID#246224)
Naughty, naughty, naughty ..
Press persons! You should NOT be thinking. Bad, bad, bad. Sit. Now I will give you a bone. Oh, GOOD doggies!!! Now, go outside and chase some rabbits.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:10 - ID#335184)

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:11 - ID#246224)
WHOA, Babycakes!!!
That Silver is a streakin' skyward!!! US$6.40 Ma' head she be spinnin' fiercely!!! Yow'za'mahn!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:11 - ID#372344)
@ newtron... I think we are in agreement..,.but...
We are in agreement, I think... But my point is all the items you listed
in your posts about BJ has been known to the american people,
all of it, BJ did an interview on CBS with Hillary, before he was first
elected flatly denying his 12 year affair with flowers...etc...Jones's
and many other stories have been out in the media for years....

So then it is THIS current saturation of video clips and breaking news and live from the courthouse stuff,etc... constantly being aired in an obvious "HYPE" of all these past and present allegations against BJ, which leads as I said a reasonable person that "they" are out to get BJ....
as far as the "cabal" etc...I will adress this point in another post
as more evidence "develops"...but you have not adressed the
implications of this relentless change in "perceived" morals?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:12 - ID#246224)
Gold holding its own pretty well today against ..
the US$ rise, etc. Leveled off at US$301.25 pretty much. Chance for a bit o' recovery by day end.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:13 - ID#254269)
WSJ articles; Can someone try to post some of the articles electronically; they are quite
interesting and very important. Thanks.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:21 - ID#228128)
Silver and Uncle Sam
DA, RJ, ROR, Realistic, Silverbaron, Anybody! Last night I posed a question that went unanswered but bears repeating. Armstrong in his Princeton Economics article on silver stated that at some point the government may step in, "without warning", and force those speculators that have bought up the existing supply of silver to sell it. Do you think that this is within the realm of possibilities? Can they for whatever reason, force investors to do so and ruin our hard won, and I might add, well deserved party?

Finally, for those of you concerned with government wrongdoing, stupidity, etc. I simply posit that the government isn't irrational, it simply works in mysterious ways. For example, do you know what it means when the U.S. Post Office lowers the flag to half staff. Answer: It means they're hiring.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:23 - ID#26793)
FLASH! Panic in Russia over possible rouble devaluation

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:26 - ID#213265)
@the scene
IDT -- Only way I can think of they could possible accomplish it would be to simply DUMP on the silver market, sending the prices lower and causing a liquidation of longs to ensue. But to ban purchase of silver? I don't think so!

PH in LA
(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:29 - ID#225408)
Silver's Rise
While the tolerants, newtron's, Dave in COs and others wallow in the muck of unsubstantiated political allegations and smut none seems interested in tearing themselves away long enough to comment on the fact, much less the reasons for silver's performance today.

Right on TZADEAK! Rest assured that many others among us skip over the aboves' posts too.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:33 - ID#238295)
the action
The fact that gold stocks never were that strong today was a tipoff that the bullion rally would fade.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:34 - ID#26793)
Bank of Canada raises interest rates 1/2 % to protect dollar

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:35 - ID#251268)
tThe quick and the dead,
must be some major actin in the silver pits,but gold bugs don't be to jealous gold is still in a very nice upward trend channel and I don't see any major resistance until 325,everybody have a nice relaxing weekend cauce theres going to be plenty of action next week,off to north shore then the Pro Bowl go AFC

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:36 - ID#335184)
Maybe it's the purgery / obstruction thing & attendant criminality credibly tied to Boy Bill that has their blood up. I don"t detect a shift in morals because the US press is simply amoral at best !

God speed, I got to go. Catch you on the flip. My family/job neglect is calling.


Tar Baby

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:39 - ID#410194)

Speculation is speculation. Governments will never ever send out any kinds of warnings before any type of intervention/forced liquidations in the markets.

But the odds for this to happen in Silver are extremely low given the fundamentals of the past several years.

Times are changing and traders/investors who haven't been able to be flexible enough to accept that Silver can "divorce" from Gold from time to time are the ones complaining today....and some big players at that.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:39 - ID#26793)
CFTC refutes statements of silver traders

John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:39 - ID#24135)
oh whistle while you work
For Ryter
Not the one Im looking for - but I applaud your powers of
observation. Sounds like you did some up close work .

For Tolerant1
- All work and no play makes zebediyah a dull
midget. There're not all like snow white's little fellers.
- some seem more like little fascist chaps.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:42 - ID#409292)
Silver Bulls/Bears
Hello Folks, you may be interested in this article on silver

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:43 - ID#26793)
Silver spikes on NYMEX statement; also gold news

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:45 - ID#409292)
Silver Bulls/Bears
Sorry, try this URL and click on Silvers New Bull Market

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:48 - ID#372344)
@ Dizzy Muhamed Camel's Breath......
Why don't you come clean and tell us all that you really are "THE"
fascist, as you said in your 11:08 this morning how classy one is
when one "HATES"...why don't you crawl back where you came from,
and leave us to discuss GOLD.....

Spud Master
(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:51 - ID#273112)
@PH'ed in LA
Re. your "true believer" statements concerning the Clintons:

As Dan Rather, that paragon of journalistic virtue & non-bias said:

"If it walks like a duck, talks like a duck, and ****s like a duck,
it's a duck"

You are going to be in heavy need of therapy after the Criminal in Chief
is driven from office in utter disgrace, but not before having so soiled the Whitehouse that channeling the Potamac through it won't clean out the ankle-deep moral, ethical and political filth.

Only a total fool or a totally naieve person can still believe what Bill & Hillary say, while ignoring what they do.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:53 - ID#246224)
It is conceivable that under the Emergency Powers act, in which the USA is still year upon year renewed as declared in emergency ( just renewed ) , that the President COULD commandeer the Futures Markets and force those who hold material and contracts to make a market at whatever price is deemed "in the national interest". That would be a sure sign that we were completely in the tank ( a state of emergency akin to war ) .

The reality is that the last time a silver conspiracy was broken up was after due process and a conviction, then a court ordered liquidation: the situation of the Hunt Brothers. Their main problem was in the futures market where they had amassed a huge speculative position intended to force their will on the market ( sounds like the Fed/Tres premium pumping operation to me, but that is the gov being benevelant now, no? ) . Sumoto was of the same stain.

If there is any conspiracy here I'm sure they have microscopicly examined the Hunt debacle and all subsequent legal issues in order to be assured of a 'clean' operation. Appearantly the statement from NYMEX ( quoted in USAGold analysis for today ) has secured the fears of the market and so we see a renewal of the tremendous pressure on the markets.

Hope we see US$10 silver real soon. FWIW I'm a part of the 'great conspiracy' known as "BUY LOW, SELL HIGH" and "FUN'DA'METALS" in our secret code language and have done my part to ensure the success of our sordid plan to dominate the planet. ;- )

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:54 - ID#31868)
John Disney_A
I must say I am glad that you enhanced my decision to buy DROOY and then HARMONY. They should do rather nicely as time moves on.

Checked on the recipe at the local you kill'em we chill'em chop shop. I have been informed that since they are so short they cannot get a leg up, incest and one yellow leg has lead to a species that is best burned.

Coal burning plants will take them off your hands but you must pay the plant a fee as the smoke is so foul that they have to run the scrubber after each burning of three of the foul creatures.

Also, any other small furry creatures with worn hair on the rumps exposing a rash and hoof indentations or hoof chips embedded in the exposed area, in the vicinity must be detroyed according to the UN Center for Disease Control.

I will forward more news shortly.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 14:59 - ID#238295)
The action
Gold bouncing up a little at day's end. Now down just 30 centavos.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:02 - ID#227238)
A mouse in the pocket??
Tzadeak: Who's the us? I think the record would support the contention that John Disney has posted a great deal more gold related information, with numbers to back it up, than most who would find themselves in the general category of - US. ..... Continue the battle if it pleases you but try not to extrapolate the specific to the general. There is no US in your position.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:06 - ID#257148)
Gold is Great....

Old Gold
Have you heard of the 3 Pillars of the Gold Bull? I'd be interested in your current take.

Allen I think the Hunts might disagree with you that they were granted due process, or even a trial. Nope, it was all done by the judge and jury ( and interested parties ) who made up the COMEX board.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:06 - ID#28594)
Allen (USA) at 14:53--or thereabouts
Well done! Your sense of humor goes down well too...

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:10 - ID#287358)

Brother can you spare a $1 for some SSC.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:19 - ID#372344)
@ Earl....."US" refers to the "Kitco Gold Discussion Forum"....
And BTW you are absolutely correct when you say DFIZZY has contributed with numbers to back him up, now let's see he recommended DROOY and Harmony , Drooy was down only 80% in value, and Harmony well I guess it was the better buy it was only down 74% in value...Oh YA! great contributions...right into someone's pocket.....

I, as has been mentioned by some here, did not start this..
But I shall retain the right to inform this Gold forum with accurate facts from numerous sources as a counter balance to the few propangandists here and further defend myself against their attacks accordingly....

BTW did you buy DROOY at $ 9 when it was so highly reommended?
or did you know better.... and do you associate with people who "HATE"

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:19 - ID#302251)
SHLOMO: .............GOLD IS GOING TO THE MOON.............
Date: Fri Jan 30 1998 10:51
Shlomo ( Davos & Saddam ) ID#288399:
Andrea Mitchell, who flies all over with M. Albright, said on Imus this
morning that time is "running out" and "there's only a week left". What
does that mean? Is there some timetable or is that diplomatic veilled-threat
talk? Or, do is Albright getting ready to deliver the "go ahead case/give US
your approval bankers" to the Davos guys?

Making sandwiches, doing laundry, and buying physical.....Shlomo


Dear Shlomo,
We women seem to understand much better..........

Shawn David Morton
Americas MOST accurate psychic,
said on the Art bell program ( Dec. 29. 1997 ) ,
that M. Albright will soon be assassinated.
and that will lead to an immediate retaliation by the Israelis and us.
You can listen to 5 hours interview with him in the Art Bell archives,

If Albright is assassinated as he said,
I will not be particularly fact......
( OK, I will not say it ) ,
as no one is pushing us towards WW3
more than Albright, she is obviously just a front.
The Banks chose her because she is a woman.

As I told you last year it was all planned in advance.
The arm-twisting of politicians around the world
already have been done by the Bankers,
Albright is just running around
to make it look official for the public.

Andrea Mitchell is trying to give this mess
a touch of respectability.

From all the boys here at Kitco
Cherokee and others finally are moving to my side
they begin to grasp the gravity of the situation.
Someone last night already purchased gas-masks from Israel.

And to think that just one month ago
I was the only one here who talked about WW3.

This is why I found it hard to comprehend
why our highly educated Kitcoites,
are talking on anything other than PHYSICAL.
BART did not pay me to say it.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:20 - ID#333131)
Note the reference to Davos tonight and tomorrow in Donald's 14:43.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:27 - ID#302251)
refer................YES, WW3 IS AT OUR DOOR STEP........

Date: Fri Jan 30 1998 11:13
refer ( U.S. Selling Gold? ) ID#41229:
JTF: Did you post that? That is very interesting, why would u.s. sell in the
face of other countries hordeing, What would be the reasoning to sell
when mining shutting down and down sizing, it would be interesting for
the forume to discuss what would be the reasoning and implacations.

I would like to read it too, I smell disinformation.

My grandson also called me from New York yesterday
to tell me that the US is selling GOLD.
I did not want to sound alarmist, so I did not post it,
waiting to see if Kitcoits will pick it up.

It is indisputable that the US ( Trilateral....+ Bilder..... )
are pushing us towards WW3, as they will profit immensely from it.
This will push gold to the moon too.
So, it does not make sense that the US will be selling GOLD now!
This is why I did not post my grandson message last night.


A hint for my Kitcoits kids:

A psychic whom NOW, I highly regard,
who has a deep intense involvement with gold,
told me about when Gold was around 380
that he sees Gold going slowly down to levels we cant believe.
and then it will spike straight up,
and no one will have time to get aboard.

I listen to him with great skepticism then,
as it sound foolish then
to believe that Gold could possibly go under 380.


1. Ramadan is over, all the young Moslem religious fundamentalists
are HOT on the road to battle Satan ( us ) .

2. There is ABSOLUTELY no doubt in my mind
that they will act THIS year, most likely Feb. to April.

3. The Bankers who manipulated this Arab Terrorists
will jump on this golden opportunity,
and start WW3, and windfall profits for them.
It was all planned meticulously ,
with the assassination of Yitshak Rabin.

Humanity are such fools,
they cant even see what is on the tip of their noses.
With all the explosion of information,
we are still been led as sheep to the slaughter.

Listen to Cherokee,
the spike up will come sooner than you think,
dont miss the train......

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:29 - ID#238295)
Andy and Ted
Interesting how Andy Smith and Ted Arnold are quoted all the time in our "unbiased and objective" media.. I'd like to see people like Venneroso quoted more often, but am not holding my breath.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:31 - ID#429245)
TVX Bonds
I got some TVX bonds a few weeks ago at $62. They are now $72.

It seems like a hell of a deal. They come due in about 4 years. They can be redeemed then, at the holder's option, in gold or dollars, with gold pegged at US$ 361.

There is a built in appreciation of 38% over 4 years, ( current to par value, $72 +38% = $100 )

Also 6% interest calculated on the face falue, which means 8% on the current value.

And there is what amounts to a four year futures contract on gold at $361. If gold were to be at $500 anytime over the next 4 years, you get the premium over $361.

This bond trades actively. TSE:TVX.N

The only downside risk seems to be the stability of TVX, which I understand has political problems at one of its operations in Greece. However it seems to be a strong company worldwide.

I would be interested in any comments.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:31 - ID#23398)
Bullish comments from Analyst./on GOLD BUY BUY BUY

In 1999 cash production cost will fall below US150..

BUY TVX TARGET c$9.00 With interest in five gold mines in 1998 av cash cost to totalUS$220,
BUY SUNSHINE MINING TSE C$1.39 Now running a full production cash cost US$4 in 1998,
TECK TSE C$20, EURO NEVADAC$17.90 Generated a steady 26 per cent a year in earning per debt.


Adrian Day calls this one a real value. MIRAMAR MAE TSE c$2.35 selling for less than the cash it has in the bank/no debt.Produces gold at US$275. ALL PRODUCTION SOLD FOR ANOTHER YEAR AT US$400.

Mr Leeb s says "I hope you won tcoomplai if my 10 fold prediction pans out to be three fold.Either way, at least a small position in gold stocks is worth a shot," His prefered stocks are TVX GOLD and BATTLE MOUNTAIN GOLD.BMG NYSE.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:33 - ID#238295)
U.S. selling gold?
By law, the U.S. Treasury cannot sell gold without Congressional approval. I suspect they may have provided some bullion to the U.S. mint for coinage purposes.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:34 - ID#193348)
Ted(re:12:59) yeah....I saw the same thing too...and wondered the same thing
watched all the big name analyst types stepping on their lips
over the zipper loonie,but the only guy that hit the nail on the head
was little squeak box Manning.TOO MUCH DEBT....TOO HIGH TAXES
( the two principal reasons for currency devaluations ) ....

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:35 - ID#23398)
Very good deals I purchased the same CV A year ago at C$117.90

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:35 - ID#254269)
US selling gold ? Ziva; could oil be more valuable than gold ? The war

machine won't run on gold .

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:38 - ID#286230)
Ray: Between you and John Disney and POLARBEAR I'm getting re-interested in the SA mines. Unfortunately I have not been paying attention until recently. At what gold price do you expect the 10 and 25 X's increases.

..on Ranfontein. I am lookin for 10+ baggers or
25+ baggers in the case of DD. If gold moves...

Charles Keeling
(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:38 - ID#344225)
You requested a WSJ article.

Silver Market

Allegations of
Price Fixing

NEW YORK -- A lawsuit
was filed, as expected,
over last year's spike in
silver-futures prices.

The suit, which was filed
in U.S. District Court in
New York and seeks
class-action status,
alleges that Phibro -- the
commodities-trading arm
of Salomon Smith Barney
Inc. -- and 10 other
unnamed defendants,
acted to manipulate silver
prices higher during the
rally last year.

News of the suit, which
has been anticipated for
some weeks, pushed
down silver futures at the
Comex division of the
New York Mercantile
Exchange. The March
contract fell five cents to
$6.053 a troy ounce,
although it recovered
from a loss of 28.5 cents
at midsession.

The suit is on behalf of
Kerry Seale, a citizen of
British Columbia and the
sole proprietor of a
company called Golden
Harvest Co. It was filed
by Christopher Lovell of
the Lovell & Stewart law
firm in New York.

Phibro, through its
general counsel Mike
Young, rejected the
allegations of price
manipulation in the suit
as "egregious." It denied
removing silver from
Comex warehouses in the
past 18 months and
moving it to England or
elsewhere, and denied
acting in concert with
other market
participants. The
company also said it is
"considering our own
lawsuits against the
persons behind these
unfounded allegations."

Golden Harvest's suit
claims that Phibro and
the other defendants
forced Comex silver
futures up to "artificially
high levels" in the second
half of last year through
moving silver from
Comex warehouses to
"nonreporting black hole
locations" in England and

The suit says some
trades by the defendants
were carried out through
Republic National Bank
of New York, and it says
J.P. Morgan and Credit
Suisse held silver for the
defendants in London.
None of the banks are
listed as defendants in
the suit, and there's no
claim they were involved
in market manipulation.
J.P. Morgan and
Republic refused
comment, while no
spokesman was available
at Credit Suisse.

Comex silver stocks fell
by 90 million ounces
between late May and
the end of 1997. To
support the case that
price manipulation
occurred, the suit also
points to an
divergence between
silver prices and copper
and gold prices.

Such claims about
artificially high silver
prices have been keenly
debated since last
December, when prices
rallied sharply, hitting an
eight-and-a-half year high
of $6.378 an ounce during
intraday trading on Dec.

Some analysts argue that
the rise in silver prices
was a reflection of tight
supplies and solid
demand. Among those is
Jeffrey Christian,
managing director of New
York consulting firm
CPM Group. "I think it
[the action] is garbage
and at the end of the day
it will be a nonevent,"
Mr. Christian said.

Timothy Porter,
commodities analyst at
Refco Inc. in New York,
said the news of the
lawsuit was unlikely to
weigh on the market for
long. "The fundamentals
alone will keep prices
propped up pretty well,"
Mr. Porter said.

Wall Street Journal, Jan.
29, 1998

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:41 - ID#344308)


get a grip! i've not moved to 'your' message
is aware-ness of current and historical facts.....

please.......stand on your own merit...the ssm takes passengers,
not drivers!!

realistic---------how about those grains? who REALLY loves ya? lgbito!

ted----how about that c$?......who said it was going where?

the asian tsunami in-exorably comes this way.......time is short....


John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:45 - ID#24135)
Love - Love is Sta - range
For Earl
Thank you for whatever you said - Zebediyah is
a little mad - I have never actually recommended
Drooy at all - and I said that I do not own any
although I did at one time via the puchase of
On harmony - I surely never recommended it at 9$.
These are the strange dreams of a harmless dwarf.
Why do I fascinate the little chap so?? Bear with him
- he fancies that he protects the world from poor me.
Perhaps I should have some one knit him a small
superman uniform. He would be so cute.
At first I found him annoying and a bit embarrassing -
now he is a constant source of amusement.
He means no harm - some one said today that they believe
he loves me. How sweet. to be loved by a plaything of
What did I do to deserve THAT.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:45 - ID#31868)
Jeffrey Christian at CPM on CNBC "the law suit is HOGWASH."

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:46 - ID#302251)

Date: Fri Jan 30 1998 15:35
Avalon ( US selling gold ? Ziva; could oil be more valuable than gold ?
The war ) ID#254269:

machine won't run on gold .


Oil as GOLD, will go up too.

Our way of life will be disrupted so much,
I dont see myself waiting again
in a long line at my gas station.

If I will still be alive,
I will just stay at home and tell myself
that I did my best to warn my kitcoits.

I wish when the whole thing start
that I will be the first to die.

So making profits from oil or GOLD
is the last thing I am thinking about.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:46 - ID#270295)
couldn't resist


(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:47 - ID#302251)

Date: Fri Jan 30 1998 15:35
Avalon ( US selling gold ? Ziva; could oil be more valuable than gold ?
The war ) ID#254269:

machine won't run on gold .


Oil as GOLD, will go up too.

Our way of life will be disrupted so much,
I dont see myself waiting again
in a long line at my gas station.

If I will still be alive,
I will just stay at home and tell myself
that I did my best to warn my kitcoits.

I wish when the whole thing start
that I will be the first to die.

So making profits from oil or GOLD
is the last thing I am thinking about.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:49 - ID#227238)
Tzdeak: No. I only associate with those who have the good sense to despise my enemies. They are of my tribe. ..... and no again, DROOY at 2 1/4 Harmony at 2 1/2. But only after experiencing the superior strength of NA's. ........ At the same time I don't overlook your argument for NA's, it's merely that the SA's have been beaten down more and are currently a better buy. If it changes in the future, so will my opinion. Lesson numero uno: Don't marry the position. You may love 'it' ..... but 'it' will never love you. For love?? It's far better to buy a dog. And cheaper too.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:53 - ID#372344)
@ Dizzy Muhamed Bad Camel's Breath....
You say you didn't recommend DROOY, yesterday you told us you
were going to spend the profits from DROOY, so which is it?
And if you say you never actually recommended what does actually
mean.... did you not recommend all South African Mines last year?
Why don't you, for benefit of all our discussion forum, give us
your recommendations for last year say from Jan 30/97 so that
we can all see what YOUR ACTUAL recommendations were and
where they are today....we can all add....
I dare you! and show us the date and time so that we can all review....

John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:54 - ID#24135)
Anybody want their very own dwarf??
for selby
PLUS with the purchase of RSA gold stocks you can get your
very OWN dwarf !!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:56 - ID#254269)
Asian crisis spreading according to Greenspan ; well, I guess it's official now;

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:58 - ID#252150)
Cherokee@UP or DOWN , NORTH or SOUTH
It's a relief to know that the antarctic iceberg is southbound ( 9:48 )

(Fri Jan 30 1998 15:59 - ID#227238)
On the love thingy?
John Disney: Unfortunately, my personal experience with the many facets of affection have been mostly a wretched experience. Conclusions regarding same are better left to those with a congenital disposition for knowing when to touch it and when to leave it alone. Sin. Now that is another matter entirely. Like any good Sunday school graduate, I can recognise it immediately. And mess with it interminably ...... Ask me about sin; why don'tcha?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 16:01 - ID#254269)
Dow closed at 7908 (down 66 points or 0.82%), S & P 500 down 4.87 points, 30 yr. bond at 5.805%

volume on NYSE at 598 million shares.

John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 16:03 - ID#24135)
I would not wish you on a dog .. better stick with me.
For Zebediyah
Think I said I have some options on drooy - cause I do.

Regarding looking stuff up --- little fellah - havent got
the time -- YOU look it up. Do something usefull. Help write
my memoirs.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 16:09 - ID#372344)
@ Earl...I am a former SA investor, who made plenty,especially in dividends but...
I'm not married to any stock, NA or SA believe me....I did not get back into the Gold market, until very late last year, being out for some 15 years....I mentioned here before I used to get $1 dividend from
some of my SA mines, and they were trading for only $3to$4 something
like a 25% return....My point has been all along that there is little
premium paid in general for SA Gold mines, without the lure of dividends
they really become exceedingly cheap...just look at the Kugerrand
no premium...this is not my doing as someone here believes, this has
been going on for a long time, the political situation there be it
real or perceived, I believe real, will limit any upmove on SA shares P/E
ratios...also you may not have heard but DROOY being just outside
Joberg, has been experiencing "thefts" of some 100KG of Gold
per mointh according to one report I read from SA...this is another reason
why I shy away, the organized unions who are in the mines are powerful
politicaly in with the ANC... I could go on but hey I believe in an open
and factual discussion... not in name calling and attacks.. but with the right to defend myself when attacked...good luck with your investments...

PH in LA
(Fri Jan 30 1998 16:10 - ID#225408)
Spud's 14:51
What fun to be accused of being "a total fool" and "naive" by someone proud to be unable to distinguish between public prouncements on policy issues such as social security, education, childcare, foreign policy et al...and the president's own personal sex life. For the record, the latter does not interest me in the least. ( And I would never think of asking even my best friend for details on his ( or hers ) either. )

BTW, you are forgiven for feeling a bit foolish yourself to note that the headline categories for the day on Yahoo deal with the winter olympics etc. and not the white house scandel. It would appear that the new P.R. strategy at the White House is taking hold. Clinton will never be forced to resign.

Furthermore, not only were Woodrow Wilson and Jimmy Carter the only presidents this century with a clean sexual record, the only president of all time of whom it was ever said "he never told a lie" was George Washington, and I am not so foolish or naive to think for a moment that even that was really true.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 16:14 - ID#227238)
Would someone be so kind as to post the URL for the Kitco ftp. I seem to have misplaced it. No one has posted SA stock charts and I have some to put up ... along with a couple of NA's.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 16:14 - ID#372344)
Come on tell us, show us, OH Great Bedwetter from the desert....
We all await for your predictions from Jan/97 to compare their
relative value, if any, today....we can all add and subtract....

John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 16:27 - ID#24135)
A poisonous dish - no thank you very much
Your warning came just in time. Al'lah is great.
To think I could have eat.... yuk. I gag with horror.
But from what you say my problem is worse than I
thought. Before Al'lah this small creature is
a plague. How can I rid myself of this dwarf and
why does he follow me?? What have I done to fascinate
him to this degree. Have I said something that may
have offended him?? I surely hope not as I merely
wish to be brother to all men and help them to find
the grace and goodness that is surely within them.
He is quiet now .....
I note with pleasure that gold seems to have
found support at 300/oz - it has also held against
silver at its fibonacci ratio of roughly 47. I was
worried about that.
Peace - Al'lah O akbar

(Fri Jan 30 1998 16:29 - ID#251268)
So noble of you to stick up for Billy,you can be sure if you were his freind you would get treated the same.NOT! he'd throw you to the dogs in a heartbeat and blame it on Jerry Fawell,wake up and buy some gold!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 16:33 - ID#372344)
@ Earl...I think you're missing the point....
It's not a question of SA vs NA it's a question of contributor's own
recommendations that is the subject of my inquiries... in other
words how profitablle or not did D's or in the case of LGB ,Puetz, GSC, etc...investment advice really trun out to be? You have claimed he has given great recommendations backed up with numbers...I am just
asking him to SHOW all here on this Forum, where these so callled
great contributions backed by numbers are say from Jan/97 when he in fact has admitted "recommending" SA Shares.... where are they?....
See if you can get him to post them....

(Fri Jan 30 1998 16:33 - ID#432148)
(Mr Disney) If I'm Snow White...
can I have 12 dwarfs? Yes! Doornfontein, Unisel, Stilfontein,
St. Helena, Zandpan, ET Cons. Grootvlei, Buffelsfontein,
Hartesbeestfontein, Deelkraal, Bracken, Blyvoor...and don't
forget Loraine.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 16:39 - ID#335184)
Is the US Treasury by law prohibited from leasing AU ? Can the US FED buy or lease AU?
Any light accepted !

Tar Baby

(Fri Jan 30 1998 16:40 - ID#26793)
Dow/Gold Ratio = 26.14 ( Last week Friday 25.67 ) Although the Dow advanced 2.67% in terms of 1998 dollars this week the Dow/Gold Ratio seems to be saying "not so fast Mr. Market" and advanced only 1.8% in terms of 1933 dollars. Real money is skeptical about the Dow advance this week.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 16:40 - ID#426220)

It is readily apparent Greenspan has kept a close vigilance on John Kutyn's analysis and revelations. However, the Fed Chief has obviously not yet read Kutyn's latest which predictes total economic collapse for the hapless Southeast Asian countries, being weighted down with even more debt than they can productively handle. Otherwise, Greenspan would be understating of the Domino Effect upon Western economies.

Actually, the IMF monies are going to ensure that Western banks do NOT GO BELLY UP... witness how Deutsche Bank and numerous Dutch Banks are presently teetering on the very precipice of ruin due to excessive Asian loan exposure. The financial nightmare is just beginning.

Greenspan's Comments:

WASHINGTON, Jan 30 ( Reuters ) - Federal Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan warned on
Friday Asia's financial crisis could spread to other regions of the world and said large investments
were needed to quell the turmoil which bordered on ``panic''.

``There is ... a small but not negligible probability that the upset in East Asia could have
unexpectedly negative effects on Japan, Latin America, and Eastern and Central Europe that, in
turn, could have repercussions elsewhere, including the United States,'' Greenspan said.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 16:45 - ID#26793)
XAU/Spot Ratio = .248

(Fri Jan 30 1998 16:46 - ID#26793)
Gold/Silver Ratio = 48.55

John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 16:46 - ID#24135)
You go too far - smelly gnome
you dare call me a Bedwetter - you dog of the trash heap.
You misbegotten flea fart from the underside of a dead
and rotting camel. Away with thee.
If YOU wish to read the prophesy of Ibn Al Crus-ti
( as I am sometimes known ) then look them up yourself
you lazy son of a sea worm. Collect them and bring
them to me. Them polish my boots with your tongue
and carry my bags for one year. We can then publish
my works and you can have one tenth of one per cent
of the proceeds - It will be more than you have ever
made in your life.
Your errant mouth is out of all proportion to your
tiny brain and your pea sized heart.
Never address me directly again or you will be dragged
behind my caravan FOREVER - wretched one - begone.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 16:49 - ID#270315)
The fact that gold has closed above 300 for the past week, even in light of the US$ strengthening, and all the chatter about dissinflation, has to be a good sign that there is some serious $ backing it; can anyone please respond?

P.S. also the fact the 50 day moving average has been held since 01/23/98 on a closing basis.
and the daily rsi has been above 59% since 01/16/98 andopen interest has declined to 160,000. Does this not look like the footprints of the elephants walking through the mud in a northerly direction? or am I just halucinating? Check out this site for some great info.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 16:51 - ID#189273)
@PH in LA
I'm sorry, sir, your protest that the BC problem is an issue of how he conducts his personal sex life does not ring true. Do you suggest, then, that CEO's, governors, etc. should not be held accountable for having trysts with trainees, then passing them on to higher paying jobs in other departments when they become demanding or otherwise undesirable? And that it is unthinkable that the employers of such executives should investigate when evidence of such conduct is brought before them?

On the other hand, gold held above 300 an oz. one more day. I was just looking at the chart since the late 70's. Except for that enormous explosion after the price was deregulated, it's had a pretty solid range of 300 - 500, with the inability to sustain lower or higher prices when it extended. One of these days the technicians will hop aboard and it will a fun ride.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 16:54 - ID#254269)
D/G ratio 30 day moving average is 27.87. percentage gap between m/a and

today is .66%. FYI Donald.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 16:56 - ID#224149)
Pink Floyd
It must be Friday ---umagumma

John Disney__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 16:57 - ID#24135)
Thats funny you dont look like Snow White
For Goldkm
Your metaphor is interesting - but what is your point??

(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:09 - ID#28594)
Carl, Many thanks!
Carl ( SDRer ) ID#333131:
Note the reference to Davos tonight and tomorrow in Donald's 14:43.
I would have missed it but for you! Much appreciated. Thank you again.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:09 - ID#344308)


were you not a regular poster here last year under another nomer?

the stage is set, the players selected......they ALL will try to
hit home runs during this campaign....the arabs have some major
surprises for the 'semi'-allies------har-har-har----this is the
us showing the world why the us$ is king and will stay king.....
end of another cycle......

this scenario should be avoided at all costs.......we best not bomb
iraq at this juncture in history.......not under these conditions....

zipper-gate......political un-certainty...........

asian crisis.....economic un-certainty..........

what does each of these situations create? opportunities...

ALL the wanna-bees wanna-be on the scene at this moment in history...
a time of chaos and flux......the best time to make ANY kind of move....
and moves there will be.......may-be this your gold?

opportunity.......opportunity for adversaries such as saddam hussein
to fractionate the solid co-alition against him ( and he did ) , AND MOST IMPORTANTLY... ( and we're fixing to...may-be this week-end )
get us to attack him again.........big mistake.......we are being played
like a minnow on 100# test mono-filament....

gee-----what happened to the european currencies?.....realistic?


(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:13 - ID#432148)
CB, Defense, and Treasury,... they target gold...
but never criticize the SYSTEM!!!!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:17 - ID#26793)
Pegasus Gold still trading in Montreal

(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:18 - ID#30116)

(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:23 - ID#315256)
@ PH in LA...............Bunch a phony hypocrites, liberal democrats all
Forgetting Monica for a moment, how about Kathleen Willey, a hardcore Clinton supporter GROPED by Clinton when she went into his office to discuss her job prospects? Let's keep in mind that she ADDS to Linda Tripps credibility because it was Tripp who broke the Kathleen story, but Kathleen had stated afterward that she would not discuss it.

Tripp was called a liar by Clinton's Ahole lawyer Bennet, and now we find out that under oath of deposition, Kathleen Willey corroborated Tripps version to the letter, and that she was INDEED grobed and fondled, unsolicited, and unwanted, by the Prez! This is not harrasment and gross abuse of power? Puhhhleeeeze.

What a bunch of phony hypocrites you left wing liberal democrats are. A campaign of destruction for Clarance Thomas for totally unproven minor allegations, and a wink & nod for Bill when engaging in far more disgusting behaviour. From the leader of the free world and the only remaining superpower. The highest office in the land and we get this? You and all the liberal feminists give the word hypocrisy new meaning.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:24 - ID#28585)
America lining up "Mid-East allies" and oil guarantees in preparation for imminent war against Iraq.

January 30, 1998

Albright due in Bahrain on Monday

From our correspondent

MANAMA - US Secretary of State Madeleine Albright will arrive in Bahrain on Monday on a two-day visit for talks with the country's leaders on
regional developments. The visit will be part of an extended tour of the region which will also take her to Saudi Arabia and Kuwait.

Bahrain and Britain, meanwhile, have agreed to set up a new joint panel to expand and strengthen bilateral ties, it was announced in London on
Wednesday night.

The announcement came on the sidelines of an official visit to Britain by Crown Prince and Commander-in-Chief of Bahrain Defence Force Shaikh
Hamad bin Isa Al Khalifa.

The crown prince held talks with senior British officials, including Defence Secretary George Robertson and Foreign Secretary Robin Cook. Shaikh
Hamad's discussions with Mr Robertson covered aspects of cooperation and military coordination "in line with the historical relations binding the two
countries and aimed at supporting security and stability in the region," an official statement said.

The two sides reviewed the situation in the Gulf and stressed the vital importance of maintaining peace and security in the region. The meeting was
attended by Bahrain's Foreign Minister Shaikh Mohammed bin Mubarak Al Khalifa, Ambassador to Britain Shaikh Abdul Aziz bin Mubarak Al
Khalifa and Assistant Chief of Staff for Operations Colonel Shaikh Rashid bin Abdulla Al Khalifa.

The stability and security of the Gulf also figured prominently during Shaikh Hamad's meeting with Mr Cook. Both sides underlined the need for
further developing Bahrain-Britain relations in various areas.

The establishment of the new British-Bahraini Group was announced during a dinner hosted by a number of British members of parliament at the
Westminster in honour of Shaikh Mohammed, Housing, Municipalities Minister Shaikh Khalid bin Abdulla Al Khalifa, Minister of State Jawad Al
Arrayed and Shaikh Abdul Aziz.

Shaikh Mohammed said the aim of the group was to consolidate the historical relations and cooperation linking the two countries. He expressed hope
that the group would succeed in creating more and better awareness about Bahrain among the British people.

He recalled the visit of a team of British MPs recently to Bahrain, and added that more such visits would take place in the near future.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:24 - ID#28585)
America lining up "Mid-East allies" and oil guarantees in preparation for imminent war against Iraq.

January 30, 1998

Albright due in Bahrain on Monday

From our correspondent

MANAMA - US Secretary of State Madeleine Albright will arrive in Bahrain on Monday on a two-day visit for talks with the country's leaders on
regional developments. The visit will be part of an extended tour of the region which will also take her to Saudi Arabia and Kuwait.

Bahrain and Britain, meanwhile, have agreed to set up a new joint panel to expand and strengthen bilateral ties, it was announced in London on
Wednesday night.

The announcement came on the sidelines of an official visit to Britain by Crown Prince and Commander-in-Chief of Bahrain Defence Force Shaikh
Hamad bin Isa Al Khalifa.

The crown prince held talks with senior British officials, including Defence Secretary George Robertson and Foreign Secretary Robin Cook. Shaikh
Hamad's discussions with Mr Robertson covered aspects of cooperation and military coordination "in line with the historical relations binding the two
countries and aimed at supporting security and stability in the region," an official statement said.

The two sides reviewed the situation in the Gulf and stressed the vital importance of maintaining peace and security in the region. The meeting was
attended by Bahrain's Foreign Minister Shaikh Mohammed bin Mubarak Al Khalifa, Ambassador to Britain Shaikh Abdul Aziz bin Mubarak Al
Khalifa and Assistant Chief of Staff for Operations Colonel Shaikh Rashid bin Abdulla Al Khalifa.

The stability and security of the Gulf also figured prominently during Shaikh Hamad's meeting with Mr Cook. Both sides underlined the need for
further developing Bahrain-Britain relations in various areas.

The establishment of the new British-Bahraini Group was announced during a dinner hosted by a number of British members of parliament at the
Westminster in honour of Shaikh Mohammed, Housing, Municipalities Minister Shaikh Khalid bin Abdulla Al Khalifa, Minister of State Jawad Al
Arrayed and Shaikh Abdul Aziz.

Shaikh Mohammed said the aim of the group was to consolidate the historical relations and cooperation linking the two countries. He expressed hope
that the group would succeed in creating more and better awareness about Bahrain among the British people.

He recalled the visit of a team of British MPs recently to Bahrain, and added that more such visits would take place in the near future.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:26 - ID#252127)
Tryed to post this during last nights wee hours

It didn't work......."UBS To Make Announcement Friday On Rumours".
Did anyone see any UBS postings during the market day?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:30 - ID#411149)
gold stocks
Selby- you need a copy of the November, Gold Newsletter. It explaines
the case for DROOY. You can get it on line here Jim just said if you subscribe for a year
he would send a printed copy of the Nov. issue.

I like a mix of the SA and NA, ones that are not hedged.
Now iffin gold don't move I may be in deep s--t. I been there
before and know how to survive. But I will tell you what
ole cherokee and even Steve Puetz have a good handle on
what issa goin to happen they must have also read The Bible
Code. But who ever has got what ever money is will be able to buy

Can you believe while I was typing this Jim Blanchard called,
boy what a day. $300 gold for a week is varry significant.
Straight from Venereso's mouth "we should see $600 gold in
three years, conservative estimate". DD will be $50-$125.

I can tell you there ain't no more theft of AU at DD!

Tally Ho --- Beer time!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:38 - ID#254179)
@Cherokee & Ryter

(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:38 - ID#26793)
Mexican CB Governor denies trying to "talk down" the peso

(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:40 - ID#410194)
Here are the latest Comex inventory figures released after trading today:

Gold: Fell 907 troy ounces to 427,062

Silver: Rose 285,654 troy ounces to 104,105,190 -Just above a 13 year low

What a volatile day again in Silver today and prices were all over the place in the last half hour of trading before finishing strongly to the upside.

As mentioned here a few times, only the "big accounts" should touch the futures markets at this point unless you invest in options or physical.

For more interesting news about Silver, you can look up today's posts of: 12:26.....14:39.....14:42.....14:43.....14:45

(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:40 - ID#270295)
Band- Ore ...BAN /T...PGM'S
Anyone heard anymore about the PGM'S discovered in Canada. I understand its near Timmins ,Ontario and the mineralizatiions are similar to the "Bushveld" complex in S. Africa and Stillwaters in Montana. BAN has had a couple of nice gains in the last 2 days !!May be worth a serious look. P.S Current noon article fairly interesting Friday January 30, 11:33 am Eastern Time

Silver spikes on NYMEX statement, gold choppy

LONDON, Jan 30 ( Reuters ) - Spot silver jumped more than ten cents on Friday after the New
York Mercantile Exchange denied allegations of market manipulation as gold bobbed around
within its recent range above $300 an ounce.

New York Mercantile Exchange president Patrick Thompson said there was ``absolutely no
basis'' for allegations that the COMEX silver futures market was being manipulated as claimed in a
class action lawsuit filed in federal court in New York this week.

Gold fixed at $304.85 an ounce in the afternoon, up on the morning's $301.80, the latter having
come amid quiet trade blighted by overnight strength in the dollar.

``In a period of demand overseas, represented by London spot prices several cents above the
exchange's current month prices, it would be extraordinary, and indeed a cause for concern, if
stocks were not being withdrawn from the exchange registered silver depositories to fulfil the
demand represented by the higher price,'' Thompson said.

Spot silver, having spent the day bid between $6.02 and $6.08 an ounce, jumped to $6.22 on the
announcement before settling to be last bid at $6.16/$6.18 versus its Thursday London close at

COMEX warehouse silver inventories fell by nearly 50 percent in 1997 from over 200 million
ounces at the start of the year to a 12-year low around 103 million ounces earlier this week.

Gold, which had already firmed off its session lows before the announcement, was helped higher
by silver before slipping back again.

It was last at $302.30/$302.80, down $0.70 on its previous London close.

Andy Smith, precious metals analyst at the Union Bank of Switzerland, said gold's performance on
Friday rounded off what had been an extraordinary month for the metal.

``Something's certainly happening. We have volatility in gold going from single figures a couple of
weeks ago to more than 20 percent. We have had a $30 range in a month -- we used to have to
wait a year for that,'' he said.

Smith wondered how mining companies could possibly manage to plan hedge programmes for
their production with prices moving so quickly.

``Although there are more sales coming in, the 12 month rates have gone up, there's not been
much of a producer reaction to the rally because they have not had time.''

Implied lease rates for gold on Friday were at 2.03 percent for gold borrowed over a year, having
risen more sharply in recent days than rates for shorter term loans.

Smith suggested one line of action for miners, who have traditionally missed the best of peak
prices in fast-changing markets, would be to buy put options at strike prices of five or $10 over
the current spot price.

Smith highlighted another item of interest to the bullion market on Friday, albeit one due to unfold
after market hours and away from the media, as being one of the evening session's at the annual
meeting of the World Economic Forum in Davos, Switzerland.

Among the participants slated for inclusion in a talk on ``The Future of Gold'' are Anglogold
Chairman Robert Godsell, Inter-American Development Bank President Enrique Iglesias and
Bundesbank chief economist Otmar Issing.

A second session of interest to gold watchers, this one on Saturday and focusing on the planned
euro's relationship with the dollar, is scheduled to bring together Issing once more with others such
as Belgian Finance Minister Philippe Maystadt, Bank of France Governor Jean-Claude Trichet
and Industrial Bank of Japan Chairman Yoh Kurosawa.

Away from gold on Friday, platinum softened to $387.50/390.50 versus its London close of

Palladium also fell and was last $0.50 off its previous London close of $236.00/$238.00.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:40 - ID#254269)
Jack; UBS is briefly mentioned in this article ;

(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:43 - ID#26793)
Swiss UBS reports US$102 million loss in derivatives

(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:44 - ID#254179)
@Cherokee & Ryter
Cherokee: I confirmed the Biohazard in the V..... story. Have a friend in the bureau. He acknowledged the incident. will try to get the scoop

Ryter: couldnt get the Mriamar info but check out Quion 97's 1531
post. Might be a buy if the cash in bank & no debt info is verified

It seems PGU grew some new wings on the Montreal Stock Exchange.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:52 - ID#26793)
Sunshine Mining news.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:52 - ID#224151)
Reporting for Duty
Just back from 2-week Island holiday hiatus....No
flux and chaos. Just a little CNBC...ABC etc....with everything coming up
Roses...according to Clinton....The CNBC bunch for the most part....why even old
Greensleeves hisself. But I got to admit its nice to be back in the Kitco Trenches doing
battle with this disaster thing. God I missd you guys. Must be the masochist in me. Oh!
By the way...this latest little Gold move more than paid for the holiday!!! Chivas Cheers!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:56 - ID#335184)
I'll try not to waste our mutual cybber-breath explaining the obvious connection between private morality & the public moral authority which is indespensilble to the exercise of supreme executive authority in the most awesomly powerful office in this country & on the planet. But, perhaps you may be able to grasp the connection between, oh say, the exchange rate of the US $ & it's nexus to the policies of boy Bill & R. Rubin who serves at the pleasure of the Prez & the direction of the price of silver that you apparently hold so precious.
Of course there are none so blind ( & dumb ) as those who will not see my dearest PH in LA !
Our point is that this latest ripper may not perturb or disturb the terminally placid, but it has a definite potential for bringing down the man ( & the CO-PREZ Road Warrior Hillary ) of a thousand scandals & that is of dire import to this forum.
It seems to me that they did not bring down Al Capone for all the major stuff he did like tying hands behind backs & crushing sculls with Louisville Sluggers, but for simple white collar garden variety income tax evasion. If this silly tryst turned criminal act does bring him down ( ODDS CURRENTLY @ 50/50 ) then so be it, but be fore warned.
In the mean time relax & smell the roses & know that your Prez is a first class rogue & if you don't percieve any threat to your personal freedom,
remember your precious porfolio will ride up & down with his Silver Stallion ! Don't fall too hard.
"Who was that masked man any way stranger ? "
" I don't know, but he left this silver bullet !"
Return with me now to that thrilling day of yestryear, where morals didn't begin with the letter "A" & economic illiteracy was only a class phenomenon.
Exhibit "A" in the land of the left coast, where time & space combine in the lower cerebrum to form that transcendental dimension known as the Twinkie Zone, where sponge cake & confection spin their delusional notions about a man they believe comes from Hope. What's that sign up ahead ? ( "DINK,DINK,DINK,DINK,DINK,DINK ) , A destination they can only reach in the Twilight Zone !

Good Luck & may God Speed You on your blissful journey ! I am afraid there are more important things in heaven & earth than are dreampt of in your crampt & snug little paradigm !

Tar Baby

(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:57 - ID#26793)
From Davos: Japan fires back at US accusations.

Spud Master
(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:58 - ID#273112)
@PH'ed in the Whitehouse...
PH'ed, I will have pity and consider you utterly naieve. There's at least the sincerity of a well-trained dog in that, if not much more intellect.

The Clintons have turned our government into a revolving door brothel and bribe-o-mat for forigen power's money.

You've made the cardinal mistake of wrapping up your ego & self-esteem in a team of con-artists. When they fall, no doubt you'll invent some self-deception, some doublethink to make them out as wronged saints. What was the pat excuse Hillary laddled out? Ah yes ... the old New World Order Republican Conspiracy.

Better remember Occam's Razor: Given two theorys, the simpler one is usually correct, i.e. they're crooks.

Once again, repeat after me: Fear, anger, denial, acceptance...

(Fri Jan 30 1998 17:59 - ID#26793)
@PH in LA
It would be greatly appreciated if you would add President Harry Truman to your good guy list.

PH in LA
(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:04 - ID#225408)
LGB's politically correct ravings
How informative for Lurking Gold Bug to weigh in with a few more facts mascarading as unsubstantiated rumors ( or was it the other way around? ) more name calling, etc.

Would't you like to write us a treatise on the sex life of R. Packwood, R. from Oregon, too?

Do men in high places abuse their powers? Yes they do...they have for many years, now. Are liberals the only ones who do? Hardly!

Do women who encounter men in high places ( even as high as the boss's office ) throw themselves upon such men? Some do, some don't.

Does Linda Tripp, whoever she may be, deserve to be taken so seriously that we waste the nation's time debating whether this one or that may or may not be lying? Or whether or not so-and-so did or did not? etc.

While you are so deeply engaged in researching the so-called facts and allegations threatening to bury us all, why don't you broaden your investigations to include the members of the supreme court, the clergy, or the nations mayors, no wait! THE POLICE...But why stop there? The FBI, The CIA, European heads of state, Ancient Chinese Leaders, The Dahli Lama... We all wait with bated breath for your discoveries. BTW, we trust you to limit your studies to liberals since you have already demonstrated you open-mindedness.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:07 - ID#26793)
Congressman charges IMF is withholding essential information about Asia

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:08 - ID#254269)
@ newtron ; your 17.56. You put the odds at 50/50 that this will bring BC
down. I would be slightly more venturesome and say that the odds are
60/40 for a couple of reasons;
1. We know about it. A few weeks ago, no-one had ever heard of Monica. Now, there is probably no-one on the planet who hasn't heard of her.
2. The ( mainstream ) Press is starting to cover it with more diligence than before and iwhile they may be blindsides by a few diversions here and there, they are starting to wake up to his character.
3. The Paula Jones trial will start in May and that WILL bring the spotlight back with a vengeance.
4. The other issues floathing around ( Asia, mideast etc ) leave B.C. absolutely no room ( IMHO ) for any more errors af any type.
5. Of course, I may be 100% wrong.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:10 - ID#23398)
Donald thank you for the info PGU closed up .10 @ c$.35 might see money eventually.

Bart Kitner (Kitco)
(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:15 - ID#26395)
ids & adverts
RJ - One handle can have several ID#s, but each ID# is associated with only one handle.

Leland - Kindly refrain from the commercial messages. I don't know any words that rhyme with usa-gold.

To vronsky: Although I admire your great tenacity, "...for more info write to" is NOT a loophole.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:15 - ID#347457)
@LBG on 17:23
LGB, I learn the new things about your thinking every day. Its scary - we may have too many similar thoughts ;- )

Dont get too excited in responding to some posts about BC, its not worth it - same people will never get it no matter how hard you try.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:16 - ID#254269)
US wants Asian nations to stay democratic;

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:17 - ID#254269)
US wants Asia to stay democratic; (forgot to add the link ! ! ! )

Ronald Jett__A
(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:18 - ID#413119)
London gold
Was London Gold open or closed today? If open what was close? Thanks

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:18 - ID#93232)
Ringading...a dingey....Ohmy! What is that I hear?
'Tis the drinkiepoo bell! Ohmy! 5:00 everywhere! First toast: Here's to gold closing the week over $300. ( US ) ....Second toast: Here's to silver flaming the shorties of the shorts! Salud! ( gulp ) CUBALIBRA!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:28 - ID#364147)
Bro: imNsho,Preston is one of the few decent pols in all of Canada and how bout lack of productivity as one of the major reasons for the weakness in the Loonie...

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:28 - ID#93232)
Ringading a dingey!
Third toast: Here's to Bart Kitner...our kind host! ( GULP ) Salud! CUBALIBRA!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:29 - ID#364147)
A Toast to Bart

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:31 - ID#26669)
With silver up to 6 and 1/4 at the close the prospect of another weekend of political commentary is a real yawner! We have zero control over what they do in Warshinsox B.C. but it would be nice after a hard week in the salt mines to get back to whats happening in the markets. Does anybody here dabble in metals related investments anymore? ;- )

My own personal conspiracy theory is that the improvement in silver has been more related to the fundamental maldistributions in the market over the last decade, oversold condition this winter and the intrinsic chaos of the marketplace than who's sodomizing who.

BTW, Packwood was not a real Republican. He was merely a Democrat in drag. Ack! Now you've got ME involved in the argument too!!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:34 - ID#364147)
Impeach Chretien
Get Thiessen

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:34 - ID#285392)
Ted Butler on Silver see-Vonsky's Site
Ted Butler has some interesting comments re:silver. When talking about lease rates he states "the ten-fold increase in lilver lease reates these past six months means that we have reached the bottom of the barrel o the silver lendable supplies". It's a worthwhile read

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:35 - ID#93232)
Whooooaaaa, I forgot what I was goin' say. Geeze.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:35 - ID#257148)
TED G'day, am listening to a first class radio doco on Robert Johnson - King of Delta blues??

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:38 - ID#347457)
Kitco, Kitco where will you go?!?
Its interesting to watch the development on this forum. I participate on multiple professional and outdoor hobby forum and the story repeats in all of them. After establishing the trends, and becoming popular, the membership grow, and eventually prophets and purists take over. E.gthis is GOLD discussion forum  your post does not add anything to it  I am holier that you  Its time to kick XYZ out  Bart do something about it  etc.. blah .. blah  blah! These post are mostly driven by the sorry *ss fact that somebody disagreed with posters opinion.

Come on folks, get a life. Because life it is. What gets people to this forum is a common interest. That does not mean that the only thing which should be discussed is technical analysis! If you dont have any tolerance for opposing views, posts which disagree with your position, a few jokes here and there, friendly kidding between people having the same interests, and turn to personal attacks instead, you have no idea what discussion group is about, life is about, and more importantly, WHAT INVESTING IS ABOUT!!

BTW, if I had to follow all of your "only I am right" posts, I would be in a poor house already. It goes for representatives of all camps!! I read it all, but where I put my money depends on my own personal "feeling" which may be just a partially influenced by "this is the latest trend and I am right about it" posts.

Please, drop all your personal vendettas and prophesies. Its silly!! Lest make some money an have some fun at the same time!!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:41 - ID#364147)
Aurator...........and Studio.R
G'day mates....Aurator: Sorry but don't know the dude ( I'm an ignorant simpleton ( under the influence of foreign substances ) Studio.R: Now you see why I can't think ( duh ) ----I don't EXHALE~~~~~~~~

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:44 - ID#364147)
Miro....good post !-----------------I'll drink +
SMOKE to that!!!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:45 - ID#364147)
This is NOT a joke
In a survey of American women, when asked, "Would you sleep with President
Clinton", 86% replied, "Not again"

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:45 - ID#93232)
"Blind Lime" Studio here to do da blues fer yous.... MIRO ( man of soul ) ! Good chops.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:46 - ID#26793)
More on the Dow/Gold Ratio for January
Some folks think that January sets the tone for the year. I hope they are correct!

The Dow started January at 7965 and ended at 7906. A drop of .73%. But here is the better news: The Dow/Gold Ratio started January at 27.65 and ended at 26.14. That is a drop of 5.46%! I stand by my earlier post that real money, gold, is clearly skeptical of the Dow future.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:49 - ID#28585)
January 29, 1998

PROSECUTORS will have a tough time proving President Clinton tried to cover up an alleged affair with former White House intern Monica Lewinsky.

That's the opinion of Oscar Goodman, one of the city's premier defense attorneys.

"It's going to be her word against anyone associated with this administration," says Goodman, whose career in criminal law here has spanned three decades.

His assessment comes as special prosecutor Kenneth Starr opened a grand jury investigation in Washington, D.C., this week into allegations Clinton told Lewinsky to lie about the purported affair. The president has denied any wrongdoing.

But the criminal probe continues.

Few lawyers in this country can match Goodman's experience in criminal law.

The Las Vegas attorney, who's rarely at a loss for words, has earned a national reputation representing the likes of the late Mafia kingpins, Tony Spilotro and Nick Civella. But he also has defended judges, entertainers, doctors, politicians, supreme court justices, even newsmen.

In 1986, Goodman experienced the media feeding frenzy in the nation's capital when he represented former U.S. District Judge Harry Claiborne during a well-publicized impeachment trial in the Senate.

Though Goodman believes Starr won't be able to prove a coverup, he says the special prosecutor can nail the president on the affair with Lewinsky if DNA evidence surfaces.

FBI agents working with Starr are conducting DNA tests on one of Lewinsky's dresses.

"If there's any DNA evidence on her dress, then he's history," Goodman says. "America won't tolerate that dumb of a president to make that dumb of a lie."

But without the DNA evidence, he adds, "the case is going nowhere."

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:53 - ID#364147)
Not on my watch
Anyone who thinks Clinton will be impeached is in a fantasy world or on good blotter ACID.......

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:58 - ID#93232)
I need to fork over thirty bucks and snag that Robert Johnson anthology....just keep puttin' it off ( duh ) . Leadbelly,,,Elmore James ( first SLIDE ) .

(Fri Jan 30 1998 18:59 - ID#26669)
Doanld_A re your 17:52 post
That's pretty good news from Sunshine. I hope they will have an average price for 98 first quart of over $6.00. Might have to start worrying now what I'll do if they exceed my target price too early to get the tax break.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:02 - ID#364147)
Aurator...............................and musac
I can't get into anything 'heavier' ( heavy dude ) than Herman's Hermits and the Kingston Trio or maybe Burl Ives....If I listened to the 'Blues',I might do somethin dangerous ( like blow out my brain cell ) ...go team gold!!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:03 - ID#411149)
Joke- S. Kaplan is becoming BEARISH.

Tally Ho

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:06 - ID#270315)
Ted; what do you think gold will do next week?
this url tells me its getting stronger;

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:10 - ID#270315)
Sorry this is the url:
RE: new url

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:11 - ID#224149)
The@Best @Is
When youre talking blues harmonica better say Little Walter

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:12 - ID#372344)
@AG,RR beg Congress...Desperate times call for desperate measures..Euro to have political muscle
Here are the complete text of AG and RR testimony before congress...
And how the Europeans feel the new "Euro" will have political muscle....>>

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:12 - ID#270315)
I put the url on the wrong line

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:13 - ID#288295)
Gold delivery notice @ COMEX
Hey - what happened to the rumored short squeeze in gold that was supposed to start today on first notice of physical delivery at COMEX? Did nobody show up? I kept looking for the bounce that RJ was predicting after 2:00 pm - zero.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:13 - ID#270315)
I put the url on the wrong line see daily chart of gold and rsi

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:15 - ID#288399)
Cohen/IMF/on CNN with Louie Louie
Just heard William Cohen expounding on economic policy. Wait, isn't he the Secretary of Defense. He just said Japan must stimulate their economy and Japan must not merely "rely on exports". Oh, excuse me. Wasn't your speech today with AG and RR at your side ( and its reprint ad infinitum in the Sunday Newses ) enough? Are we covering all target markets? Secretary of ( IMF ) Defense! Live from the Pentagram.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:19 - ID#270315)
Hey Silverbaron the shorts are being squeezed out
The only problem in the equation is that there is not enough new buying coming in. The open ineterest is declining because the shorts have had there fill, now people just have to wake up for this thing to take off.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:19 - ID#234218)
Hate to interupt the name-calling-chat-line with a GOLD question, but.............
Anyone have any thoughts or predictions on the seamingly over zealous nose dive of PDG the last two days? Apparently trading on PDG was halted 10 minutes prior to market close due to an 87,000 share sell imbalance. This was supposidly caused by PDG's abandonment of the Argentine mining operation. It seems to be having a more than anticipated result in their stocks. Down 11/16 Thurs. and 9/16 today. Am I missing something? It appears to be more than a normal adjustment. When I heard about it a week or so ago, I figured it would have a small downward adjusment and recover. Not so sure now! Would appreciate any thoughts, news, or opinions.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:22 - ID#28585)
Market rumors of an all-share, no cash buy-out of a gold company?? Rumor accelerated in last two days.

If it's true, then PDG stock will experience some dilution.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:23 - ID#270315)
snowball I think you are missing something
pdg is as solid as they get this is just a minor speed bump in the long and prosperous road ahead.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:27 - ID#347457)
@Silverbaron and gold bounce
I don't know, but as a matter of fact I see a bounce after 2pm today

Come on guys, gold was performing just fine this week!! Despite all surrounding factors, it held ( and increased ) its position. Don't expect meteoric rise every day. I like the trend, and so far it's working for me. If you want to trade on daily basis you are in for some volatility. Overall, this year ( IMHO ) will be good. Hey, use some of that Wall Street guys talk - get in and ride it through, dont let some up-and-down spikes turn you off! I gues this long bear scared the hell out of most people.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:28 - ID#288295)
Maybe ( as a non-futures-trader ) I'm missing something here...If the shorts have sold a gold futures contract, don't they zero their position by buying one back? If so, how it is that buying all these contracts back doesn't give the price a boost?...Please explain.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:32 - ID#251268)
Sex and lies,
It is kinda wierd that a sexual escapade enrages more americans than inviting chinese and everyone else to cough up big bucks for the camp. war chest,these guys have a lot of practice at damage control and no practice at telling the truth,makes one wonder what they would do if something really critical happens.Start war or,hey Al wake up how about a little help here!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:34 - ID#35767)
I was in the car driving between depositions and heard A recording of Dick Morris courtesy of Rush. Dick said "I dont know anything and this is not fact but what if Hilliary were a women who did not like sleeping with men and the President was well in a word oversexed, I think we could see how certain situations could develop. Could we even say that the sexual frustration of the President by not having sex would be unhealthy for the country and in fact his daliances help keep him focused on helping the country". He then said that he was just throwing this out and said that he had no personal knowledge. Rush commented it was a trial balloon. Thoughts?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:36 - ID#224149)
So Happy about Gold this week ---Drinking some of Teds East Coast Screech. ----Away gulp gulp

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:36 - ID#288295)
Please don't get me wrong; I'm not complaining, and am as bullish on gold and silver as anyone. It's just that making money the last two weeks is a habit I sort of like.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:38 - ID#347457)
I know what you mean. It's so easy to get used to good thing ;- )

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:39 - ID#227238)
Clinton on the gropes.
LGB_2: Right on and weigh in. The slimy bastard is gonna get a skate, on the Monica thing but that is no reason for his misguided supporters to enjoy one as well.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:41 - ID#227238)
Panda: Thanks for the URL. I had the right words but forgot they were abbreviated.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:41 - ID#93232)
Hillary's sexual preference is none of Bill's world sexual order.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:42 - ID#372344)
I suggested yesterday that Gold would open weak and close with a rally,
I guess I was half right, no rally, but still closed above 300 for the week, a good sign when the US$ gained significantly vs Yen....Sec of Defence
Cohen, was begging congress for ( more ) IMF$ along with Ag & RR
he even appeared on Moneyline ..Geeee.....Things must be serious indeed.....he was quoted as saying today"The deterioration of
Asia's economy, could lead to upheavel and endanger US security ( interests ) We are at a turning point in terms of this crisis, if we turn
away and think we can live in splendid isolation we will be sadly mistaken"....dahh....I think we can all see how important it is
becoming for the US to strike at Iraq, they must show "stregnth"
to the rest of the world, using punchingbag Hussein as "their"
example...I don't belive it will work, my guess is it will backfire on them....
Russia and China have already said it would be a grave mistake...
Look for oil which was up again today to up maybe 20-22........
Japan is getting "mouthy" disobeying orders to "inflate"...Europeans
are talking about a stronger political voice with their Euro....all this
bad news for the USA can only be certainly good news for GOLD....
stay tuned....

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:49 - ID#93232)
@poorboys.......ADAT........DAT........inda mix.....
Junior Wells and Buddy Guy......harp 'n hammer. Gotta' go party.bbl.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:50 - ID#288295)
Wasn't one of ANOTHER's warning signs of big trouble ahead - rising US$ at the same time that gold and oil are rising?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:52 - ID#227238)
On cordial seduction.
PH in LA: "Would't you like to write us a treatise on the sex life of R. Packwood, R. from Oregon, too?"

For the record, our Senator Bob served them boxed wine...... A cheap Cabernet, no doubt, but the thought was there, nonetheless. Not at all like that crude, Arkansas, version of 'slap and tickle'.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:54 - ID#234218)
farfel & KMTMAN, Thanks for the input.
Wasn't too worried, about PDG going down the tubes. It was just more of a downturn than I would expect. I hadn't heard ( or thought ) about an acquisition. Just didn't expect this kind of a "bump" on what I had heard. Was contemplating unloading it and then re-acquiring it. Think I need a new stockbroker. I think I'm giving him more input and ideas than he gives me. Any ideas on who they might be acquiring? TVX? ( doubt it )

Thanks again, maybe I'll learn enough to contribute something one day! Right now it's better to stay out of the war of words.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:54 - ID#227238)
PH in LA: 'N by the way, our Senator Bob is no longer with us in that capacity. Lest thee forget.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:54 - ID#251268)
Silver Barron
The vast liquidy of the market lets us get in and out of a position in amatter of seconds at the market price and roll into the next months or next heavily traded month ( gold=feb apr june ets}this can be done on a strait order to the broker,if I'm thinking right it's it is the guy buying that really could put the squezze on,you just have to come up with 100 times price and pay storage fees etc,unless you really wanted the phisical you would be better off rolling forward to, a lot less money and paper work you just make a 30 second phone call.I didn,t do the math yet but open interestwent from 51000 in feb gold to 13000 today with the majority rolling into april,I think the over all open interest droped but I would asume thats because of the weekend and small specs going into silver.Okay all this is the way I under stand it,might not be right.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:56 - ID#224149)
Today I grieve for the American taxpayer ---Imagine giving youre hard earned tax dollars to support the bribable governments ( Dictators ) in Asia ---Time to stand-up and tell your congressman Hind end First .

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:58 - ID#93232)
Watch it!......your image. CUBALIBRA! screw fidel...Sandanistas! yada cubed...bbl.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 19:59 - ID#227238)
Ted: Dammit it all. You beat me to it ..... but you got it wrong. It was actually only 36%.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:01 - ID#255151)

Pacers down 49-34 @ half to Cleveland. Prediction--Gold going nowhere until Monday. Go Larry Bird. Go Gold!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:02 - ID#372344)
@ Silvebarron...
The rise of the US$ vs Yen I mentioned was only a partial move up
from 124 to 127 1/2 but well below the US$ high of about 135 Yen
So if one is to look for a rise in US$ as per Another, we would have to
see it a new highs in all currencies, although not impossible, JMHO
not likely, since it would all but kill US exports, and BALLOON their
trade deficit.... but hey anything is possible when Asia can collapse
in a few weeks....we'll see......

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:04 - ID#251268)
New numbers
O.I. feb gold 6221 april 72254, I would think the 2 dollar gap would start to gradualy close ( feb gold up for the day )

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:04 - ID#28585)
Today, Gold mining execs seem to be roughly split between overt bearishness and great optimism.

Those that are optimistic are bound to make acquisitions at XAU's current price levels.

The key factor is this: the stronger gold companies don not want to pay anything except stock...NO CASH. They are all trying to preserve cash in the event that there is another negative gold wave. They wish to remain solvent.

PDG has been looking for a major acquisition/merger ever since its attempted Bre-X takeover was thwarted ( lucky for them ) . The target will likely be fairly's anybody's guess who.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:06 - ID#364147)
Kmtman...............and Poorboys
Kmtman ( 19:06 ) =Good question!....Poorboys: 'Newfie screech' is what we drink on the East coast~~~~~~~~

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:06 - ID#26793)
Stillwater Mining news

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:07 - ID#288295)
If the shorts are just rolling over most of their paper to the April contract, maybe this is just postponing doomsday.....sooner or later physical demand will overwhelm them, IMHO.....Steve Kaplan seems to be leaning toward the gold dead-cat bounce outlook. Maybe such a possibility is what keeps the shorts from completely walking away from the obvious reality of the supply/demand situation.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:08 - ID#26793)
Because Placer Dome recently made a deal with Bema would you suspect that Bema would be a target?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:12 - ID#302251)

Date: Fri Jan 30 1998 17:44
Aztec ( @Cherokee & Ryter ) ID#254179:
Cherokee: I confirmed the Biohazard in the V..... story. Have a friend in
the bureau. He acknowledged the incident. will try to get the scoop


I am still trying to find that URL for you.


(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:14 - ID#26793)
Currency of Laos is latest victim in Asia crisis with 70% collapse

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:15 - ID#227238)
Pounding other things.
Studio R: Image be damned. As soon as gold hits $500, I'm a fixing to go out to Maine and help Ted pound nails. .... He's promised to improve my vocabulary, at the same time. ......fat chance.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:15 - ID#28594)
The amazing world of debt...
FT French to issue Polish Bonds

Coface, Frances export credit agency, is to break new ground by issuing bonds which will be backed by commercial loans to Polish borrowers.

The move, which for the first time involves the securitisation of a developing countrys debt by its creditor, is expected to be followed by similar transactions from other European export credit departments.
Then blah, blah about how forward looking all this is...closing with this:

The French government, however, will continue to guarantee the risk of default on Polands Paris Club liabilities. This will ensure the bonds receive a high credit rating from the rating agencies.

Comment: They came to market with those credit derivatives in a very timely fashion...

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:15 - ID#393125)
Snowball re: PDG
IMHO PDG is very close to losing Las Cristinas 4 & 6 in Venezuelan court case. Cristinas 4 & 6 is 11.8 milion oz gold ( according to PDG, probably as high as 22 million oz ) .

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:18 - ID#364147)
For Vronsky
President Clinton looks up from his desk in the Oval Office to see
one of his aides nervously approaching him.
"What is it?" the President yells..
"It's the abortion bill, Mr. President. What do you want to do
about it?" the aide asks..
"Just go ahead and pay it," responds the President.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:21 - ID#224149)
Ted Dont get smart pertaining to heres one to youre Newfangled ideas about screech Gulp---Double Gulp ---Triple Gulp

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:22 - ID#28585)
My own guess is that Placer is involved with Bema simply to develop its S. American deposits, thereby adding the imprimatur of a major's name to Bema's future efforts. In that case, Placer is outlaying REAL CASH. I am not sure what they gain from an actual acquisition of Bema given that, to some degree, they already control the company.

Therefore, I do not think the target is BEMA...rather, it is probably another fairly large ( though somewhat shaky ) gold company with some great prospects whose management believes consolidation ( in the form of an all stock deal ) is its best hopes for survival.

I can think of a few...but I will not name them.

Lurker 777
(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:22 - ID#317247)
Former CIA microbiologist Larry Harris has discussed on CNN in a program that has not yet aired that Iraqi agents have brought anthrax and plague into the United States to unleash on Americans cities.

In November of 1996, just before the presidential election, Senator Sam Nunn ( Senate Oversight Committee on the Pentagon ) was interviewed on CSPAN late one night.

He was asked if there was a possibility of America suffering terrorist attacks. He replied,

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:22 - ID#364147)
Hey Earl-------------we'd make a (HECK) of a team
And maybe ya could even teach me how to write a coherant sentence~~~~After ponding nails.....and before pounding Brews***

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:22 - ID#26793)
Closing silver, gold, oil & other commodity news

Lurker 777
(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:24 - ID#317247)
Former CIA microbiologist Larry Harris has discussed on CNN in a program that has not yet aired that Iraqi agents have brought anthrax and plague into the United States to unleash on Americans cities.

In November of 1996, just before the presidential election, Senator Sam Nunn ( Senate Oversight Committee on the Pentagon ) was interviewed on CSPAN late one night.

He was asked if there was a possibility of America suffering terrorist attacks. He replied: It is not a matter of if--it is just a matter of when. The majority of people in this country have no idea of the great danger of our times. And consequently, there is no preparation.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:25 - ID#267276)
At the congressional hearing today about the IMF bailout, Greenspan, Rubin, Summers and Cohen all tried to make their case to pony up about $18 billion. Bernie Sanders did a number on them talking about Suharto and his imprisionment of labor leaders, but that did not get any decent replies. Larry Lindsey also made a great case not to fund the IMF. BUT THE WORDS that caught my attention is when first Rubin said that the IMF had $40 billion in GOLD reserves, and Summers called it ( GOLD THE UNTIMATE RESERVE ) . Finally a little respect. I could have sworn that the IMF had about $30 billion less than a year ago. Could they be buying?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:28 - ID#35767)
Today while on the cross country sky thing at my health club I saw Bob on TV. He said there is no bailout for investors in the money he seeks for IMF but that if we didnt provide it confidence would be lost and that there would be defaults which would cause investment to shy away from the developing world ( read no more SAFE cheap labor to exploit for profit and to the denigration of the American worker ) .As I interpret his words, defaults mean private capital is lost but if we provide IMF money this wont happen as capital will have confidence. How can he say this is not a taxpayer bailout of private capital. Let them go under and NEW private risk capital will invest at the apprpriate lower price. As to American Workers a collapse in the stability in Asia would mean an empowering boom. I am a leftist but I agree with Republican Dick Armey "lets abolish the IMF". Lets go fer it!!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:30 - ID#364147)
This is NOT a joke
Clinton returns from a vacation in Arkansas and walks down the
steps of Air Force One with two pigs under his arms..
At the bottom of the steps, he says to the honor guardsman, "These
are genuine Arkansas Razor-Back Hogs. I got this one for Chelsea
this one for Hillary."
The guardsman replies, "Nice trade, Sir."

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:30 - ID#26793)
Drom Davos: Russia tries to calm foreign investors

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:31 - ID#28594)
Dig Deep, "Could they be buying?"

................Using What?....................

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:31 - ID#28585)

The market has known about the Venezuela mine problems now for the last few weeks. Therefore, I think the stock already reflected the issue ( prior to the weakness seen these last two days ) .

Admittedly, the market may be experiencing a delayed reaction to the Venezuela problems...yet, I really believe, if anything, the Venezuela experience has simpy motivated Placer to go out and get something else ( CASH FREE ) to replace the "seemingly lost" Venezuela mines.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:32 - ID#26669)
ROR re Rubin
You just said "...if we didnt provide it confidence would be lost and that there would be defaults...". So it sounds like he's agreeing that its all a big con game?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:32 - ID#26793)
Drom = From in Fatfingerspeak

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:34 - ID#364147)
Lurker 777(my favorite #--Mickey Anthrax
Lurker bro: Can one drink or smoke anthrax??...and does one get a buzzzz from it?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:36 - ID#26793)
Crystallex issues statement

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:37 - ID#364147)
This is NOT a joke
Bill and Hillary are at the first baseball game of the season.
The umpire walks up to the VIP section and says something..
Suddenly, Clinton grabs Hillary by the collar and throws her over
the wall onto the field..
The stunned umpire shouts, "No, Mr. President! I said, Throw the
first PITCH!'"

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:39 - ID#224277)
on pdg
Don't you think it is possible Placer got that Cerro Casale option as window dressing because they were concerned about losing 25% of reserves ( low cost, i might add ) in Ven. to crystallex? I'm not that sure that Cerro Casale will ever be mined. I question the economics. It originally was supposed to have 30 million minable reserves. Now 16 million. And those 16 may not be economically compared to other deposits. Just look at how much insider selling was done in Arizona Star ( I realize insider sell ... but look how

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:41 - ID#288399)
@Studio.R/you got da blues?
Studio, saw Buddy Guy perform in winter 1968 at a small cafeteria in Rochester, N.Y. He had the blues....a cool dude in loose mood....

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:42 - ID#28585)

You may be right about your surmisal...but an option on developing a gold deposit is meager window dressing compared to an outright NON-CASH acquisition of a fairly large gold company.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:42 - ID#344308)

the asian problem is already causing problems for the us.....

look at the export numbers for grains......there are no buyers....
the buying has dried-up.......look at the charts.....check the export
reports....they cannot afford our products with their curriencies......this is so simple and basic.....
place your bets accordingly.......what do we export? where is
the us$, vis-a-vis the REST OF THE WORLD'S CURRIENCIES? where
is it headed now? ( at the worst possible time )

what is coming------world-wide currency collapse-----is due to----


this opened the doors for the rapists of humanity to open shop, and
promptly take over......the money lenders.....they are fixing to be
cast-out again.......

how long before the dam, which never was meant to with-stand, the
weight of the world; collapses upon it-self, and washes over the
last bastion of hope for the wanna-bee-free's.......they missed
the boat on this run........time to batten the hatches and cast-off
all who would board and try to escape their fate......the peopleo---
hundreds of millions........crowded into the cities and burbs.....

determine what we export to asia........and short the sh!t out of it!
the prices are fixing to the grains.........started today............... is soooooo close as the asian contagion...
and they said it would not impact the us markets....WHO SAID IT?
what did bald-headed-al-greasyspam have to say about asia?
they are worried sh!tless!!!!!!!!!!! it cannot be stopped.....there
is too much anti-us sentiment ( justly so ) to get all the players back-in
line long enough to work through this.......the genie has escaped.....
pandora's box opened......the bug of bugs released.......

only one and silver........for wealth preservation...

about preservation of life and limb? altogether another question....unless you are as the ant.......preparing for the
long hard will be the worst ever........


Lurker 777
(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:43 - ID#317247)
Dust lace Hmm? Could bang it but might clog the needle No I got it, BONG

No No No NO I do'nt do that no more, Tired of waking up on the floor.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:45 - ID#364147)
Lurker777...............and Bongs-R-us
What's wrong with the floor .....and BONGS?....maybe I'm just

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:45 - ID#28585)
Haggard Haggis...where are you?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:49 - ID#302251)
Date: Thu Jan 29 1998 23:15
Earl ( What's that smell? ) ID#227238:
Ziva: There is the definite odor of something overheating..........

Yes, my darling Earl.....THE MIDDLE EAST.

BTW Earl,
my posts are NOT directed primarily at our Kitcoits,
but to the many thousands who read Kitco and never post.
This forum attracts high quality thinking people,
I feel they are worthy of the time I invested in preparing these posts.
Even though my English leaves a lot to be desired,
most of them are true gentlemen and never commented about it.

Were else could an old lady in the bush....
with just half a brain, express herself so freely ?

I hope more common GOLD investors post here,
as we have almost a monopoly of traders.


(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:53 - ID#24563)
fleetwood mac-they are as good as ever!
Dinner, a bottle of white zimfamdel, a video of the fleetwood mac reunion, and the great people at kitco.... isnt life great!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:53 - ID#261267)
Question: How much hair can a...

goldbug / conspiracy theorist pull out of his head before its all gone?

Answer: None. There is no hair left to pull out!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:53 - ID#401460)
ROR (Rubin)
I had the same reaction to his presentation - more double talk. Just who will get the money if the Bankers don't - more of the Clinton shell game.

How long can they keep this balloon in the air?

He is doing such a good job, what do you think a third term.

I felt all along, that since he patterns himself after FDR, he would create an international economic crises or a war that created a national mandate for him to serve a third term.

And, if he turns this Monica thing into a right wing conspiracy, allowing him to retake Congress - look out.


(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:55 - ID#261267)
I think white Zinfandel...

went out back when Fleetwood Mac was the hot thing. If your into gold too, maybe that should be sign.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:56 - ID#302251)
Date: Fri Jan 30 1998 20:22
Lurker 777 ( Anthrax ) ID#317247:
Former CIA microbiologist Larry Harris has discussed on CNN in a
program that has not yet aired that Iraqi agents have brought anthrax and
plague into the United States to unleash on Americans cities.

In November of 1996, just before the presidential election, Senator Sam
Nunn ( Senate Oversight Committee on the Pentagon ) was interviewed on
CSPAN late one night.

He was asked if there was a possibility of America suffering terrorist
attacks. He replied,

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:57 - ID#28585)
Bondsfiler...go to a nightclub and find yourself a wife ( if someone will have you ) . Wouldn't a guy like you have more fun heckling a schoolbus of crippled kids?

Leave the goldbugs alone.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:58 - ID#261267)


(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:58 - ID#432221)
What's the most important entry on Monica Lewensky's resume'?

She sat on the Presidential Staff.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 20:58 - ID#302251)

(Fri Jan 30 1998 21:01 - ID#344308)


thanks for the link to the story on 'thrax.....

just like rats in a barrel.....release and poof!
how fast would it spread in today's society......
sure we'd nuke 'em.....but the damage would be done...
150+ million americans......anthrax spores remain active
for years too..........

1 airport could contaminate the is so
simple.....why even worry with nukes that can be tracked,
require specialized expertise, and are very expensive and hard
to get.........

done before we decided they were our enemies.....small breeders
here in the us......they are here.......waiting.....

what is the best way to dis-rupt ANYTHING? from inside......our very
own policy on other countries for decades......except never with
some-thing this insidious........

this was whipped silly here on kitco last year........let's get it
on again.........

(Fri Jan 30 1998 21:04 - ID#302251)

(Fri Jan 30 1998 21:05 - ID#401460)
Half a Brain, you are doing better than the most of us.

One of your post last night was interesting, but I couldn't tell whether you were quoteing someone, posting an article, or just talking to yourself. If it was the latter I can understand you then. I like most here talk to ourselves much of the time.

No matter - Gold STEADY this week. $300 better than $200.


Lurker 777
(Fri Jan 30 1998 21:06 - ID#317247)
It's here:
Date: Fri Jan 30 1998 20:24
Lurker 777 ( Anthrax ) ID#317247:

(Fri Jan 30 1998 21:07 - ID#255151)
Blues and Gold

Five in a row for the Blue and Gold. Pacers 89 Cavs 83. Larry Bird will be coach of the year. Go Gold!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 21:09 - ID#287207)
Anyone got a URL for Venereso's report?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 21:11 - ID#302251)
I wonder what CHEROKEE will say when he reads it.

I guess I dont have to look anymore
for the vagixx URL.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 21:17 - ID#227238)
The ftp seems to be inaccessible this evening. Can't upload charts.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 21:19 - ID#270295)
I have 10 x 100 oz. bars of silver I would like to get poised to sell. My problem is they were from 4 different refiners and I anticipate someone saying I need to have them assayed. Does someone know a reasonable dealer that does'nt make it a complete hassle and expensive.

Could you be so kind as to E-mail me at : k& or post it.
Thanks a lot.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 21:21 - ID#344308)


ok here it is......the man larry wayne harris....

his it......and consider all things care-fully.....

he is no charlatan........

(Fri Jan 30 1998 21:22 - ID#392328)
CAN SOMEONE TELL ME HOW TO GO ABOUT GETTING INFO ON GGFI ON CDN ULISTED ............................................

(Fri Jan 30 1998 21:35 - ID#398105)
cherokee............ the Americans, anything for a Dollar ?

done before we decided they were our enemies.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 21:36 - ID#372344)
@ Predictions....What if......
From the reception given today to AG RR and Cohen and, comments
of my previous post, and the Cohen "rounds" in the news media I
believe the IMF funding is in very serious trouble and further I predict
If it passes it will be for something like 2 to 4 Billion US$ not the $20
or so Billion requested,,,.. What will that do to the "fragile" Asian
Crisis?...I think you all know the answer to that.....

But where OH where is the IMF going to get the US$ for the Bail-out?
You all know I suggested in December to look for IMF Gold sales, just
as POG would take off.... But anybody who went thru the Gold battles
of the 70's, and has the scars to prove it, will tell you, It will mean
nothing even if they do sell Gold, because once the markets "perception"
changes in favor of Gold, and all of the paper actual and electronic
starts to chase it, the long term BULL will not be stopped, maybe delayed
pulled back, bad mouthed, but these will merely be buying opportunites
indeed it will be the Goldbugs turn to proudly boost" Buy on dips"....
I look for this Fight for Gold to be very long and exceedingly hard fought, with many casualties on their side....We are entering a new era....soon we will here the "POWERFUL Thunder of GOLD".....

(Fri Jan 30 1998 21:39 - ID#288295)
They have a web site:

(Fri Jan 30 1998 21:39 - ID#251268)
Silver Barron,
Open interest is falling,shorts are getting out,the way I see it ( kinda foggy ) is this weeks trading seemed like small specs and scalpers'the commercials always come into a trend late,they don't have to pick a top or a bottom,they made so so much money on the way down and they proably will make money on the way up,but they don't have to get in and out at a top or bottom,when they go long,I think they will stay long for a long time.Is this post long enough?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 21:39 - ID#398105)
Bfiler.........try not to fart !

(Fri Jan 30 1998 21:54 - ID#30116)
Lo and behold, I looked at my trading account and discovered.... a couple of S.A. issues.... Sadly, though, some of the better known N.A. issues are there to. Who says imports aren't better quality? :- ) )

On a different note, I have learned not to lick the electrodes... Now, how do I apply this new found knowledge to the present trading situation???? :- ) )

(Fri Jan 30 1998 21:55 - ID#217268)
cherokee @ 21:21
Cherokee -- We owe you one. Good post.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 22:01 - ID#224277)
Who are you thinking PDG would take a run at? They don't seem to be in a great situation right now. Problems at Porgera .. looking like they will lose Las Cristinas .. Cerro Casale may not be all it's crack up to be. Who could they afford?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 22:07 - ID#266105)

House raisings are so much fun. Out to d'blues here.

& thanx.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 22:26 - ID#227238)
Panda: Aaah feel yer paaaain. ..... but it's still less than the electrode 'tickle'.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 22:29 - ID#401460)
I think I am Glad you found the article. I read only part - scared the bajeevers out of me, I will try to read the rest in the morning. I don't think I should read this before I go to bed.

The Ohio State University huh?
Do you have any idea how many foreign nationals we have here? I think that is the right term, foreign Nationals?

Prior to the end of the Cold War, we were on the top ten list of targets.

a Buckeye

(Fri Jan 30 1998 22:34 - ID#255151)
Bolts From The Blue
Earl, Panda, aurator, and all fellow Kitco
The forces trying to control Gold, and for
whatever the reason, have got to be very
nervous now. There have been two major
"bolts from the blue" to shake the economic
world in the last 6 months. 1.The Asian
turmoil and 2.the hemorrhaging of the
Executive Branch. These two events were
discussed extensively at Kitco months prior
to happening. It took almost
everyone else by surprise, though! However, the
at Kitco were not surpised at all. There will
be other similar shocks to come. Many of
which have also been discussed at length at
Kitco. Better get your Gold!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 22:37 - ID#344308)


there is another link associated with some more incredible details
about the cheyenne complex ( norad ) going on deafcom4 last year....
and the possibility of why...atomics OR bio's are its' only concern...

this story had good legs last year......there is a lot more to it....
time to surf the aether again........and seek the seeds.......they
are there.....


(Fri Jan 30 1998 22:42 - ID#339212)
@ all

I have got some silver tableware displayed in a glass case in my home. Regardless what the price of silver is, I get very much pleasure in looking at those sterling objects, admire their beauty, and most important, it reminds me of the times when people had something "of real value" in their homes, not silver plated junk you buy now in department stores.

The problem is keeping it clean and sparkling. I like to keep it shining
knowing that this is the penalty one pays for beauty.

Any idea on an easy way to keep the silver in the display from tarnishing? Any chemist that can help?

(Fri Jan 30 1998 22:52 - ID#393224)
SS GoldBull
"AHOY mateys, three cheers fer a job well done"

"First mate, an extra ration of rum fer all!!"

"Err..ahh..sir...the rum kegs are stove in and the rum's all gone sir!!"

"WHAT!!...ship's carpenter to the bridge!!!"

"Err...ahh...ummmm..sir.. the ship's carpenter is...ahhh...indisposed,sir"


"Aye,aye, sir. Errr... those botanical samples we collected sir...well...ummm..the ...err..carpenter found..err...another use for those funny looking leaves,sir"

"Shiver-me-timbers!!! Sargent-at-arms--throw the ship's carpenter into the brig!!!...err...ahhh..never mind..just bring me some of those leaves"

"Now laddies...AHOY in the crow's nest!! What's that sail on the larboard beam???!!!"

"It's a galleon, sir!! Can't make her out...but...there's someone on the bridge with his britches 'round his ankles, sir!!"

"Battle stations laddies!!! Tis the USS Greenback!!! She's comin' back fer another lesson in humility!! Gunners, load the cannon with grape!! We'll take the wind out of her sails again, laddies!!

"Sir, there's a mermaid on her prow, and she's wearin' the biggest grin yer've ever seen sir!!"

"Aim high laddies. I want the mermaid fer myself!!! Now look sharp!!! The battle has just begun!!!! Gooooo GoldBull!!!!!"

Lurker 777
(Fri Jan 30 1998 22:52 - ID#317247)
Date: Fri Jan 30 1998 21:21

cherokee Re: anthrax

My friend, you are a wealth of information and I have benefited greatly from your Posts.

Anthrax is no joke and the public is not aware. About a month ago we had a small article in our local liberal press about the Government training our emergency personal for terrorist attacks and chemical/bio weapons. No T.V. news coverage or public awareness program just emergency crowd control training for the officials.

The Isralli Government see fit to issue gas masks to their population but the U.S. is in denial. WE believe no one would have the nerve to attack the U.S. or our allies because we would nuke them. WHAT does Saadam have left to lose if we go back in and bomb Iraq. By attacking the U.S. he would become immortal to the Middle Eastern Islamic fundamentalist countries. If he died they would build a monument in his image and every year they would have a great pilgrimage in the name of the great martyr.

The worst part is we really would not know if it was Iran, Iraq, Libya, Syria or ?.

Pray for peace in the Middle East.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 22:53 - ID#335190)
Non-Profit Corporation @ Control Internet via Improve-Supervise-Critical (Control eh!)
January 30, 1998
Government, having nurtured Internet,wants to set it free

WASHINGTON ( AP )  The Clinton administration proposed today to reduce the government's role as traffic cop for the Internet.

More Internet functions would be managed by the private sector and opened to competition under the plan. It includes a long-anticipated new structure for assigning Internet addresses that would expand the number of address suffixes, or "domains."

Domains are broad categories used at the end of Web and electronic mail addresses. Among those in use now are .com ( or dot com ) for commercial businesses and .org ( dot org ) for nonprofit organizations. Five additional major domains would be authorized.

A non-profit corporation would be set up to improve and supervise systems that run critical parts of the network, currently are operated by a patchwork of computers.

Competition would be allowed in the registering of Internet addresses, now controlled by one U.S. company under a federal contract expiring this year.

The proposal can be found on the Web at

(Fri Jan 30 1998 22:55 - ID#401460)
$700,000,000,000.00 + Bonds + Currency + +
Friday January 30, 6:58 pm Eastern Time

IMF official says Asia crisis can be contained:
``If the programs are implemented by the governments, with financial assistance from the international financial institutions and the national governments, together with the private bankers, ( the crisis ) will be contained,'' Sugisaki told Reuters.

IF is a really big word in this story - all they need $500 BILLION US smackers.
Greenspan said there had been a 700 Billion loss not counting bonds and currency.

The US is in a bad poker game, we have to keep betting or we are out of the game. Is it a bluff or not?
$5,000,000,000,000.00 + US Debt PRINT PRINT PRINT



(Fri Jan 30 1998 22:57 - ID#266105)


(Fri Jan 30 1998 22:57 - ID#373403)
I just want to go on record before it becomes un-american to say so that this rush to war is not in our country's best interest.

1 ) It is not called for
2 ) It will not accomplish stated goal of reducing weapons of mass destruction
3 ) It will inflict massive collateral civilian casualties bringing worldwide condemnation and alienation
4 ) Our unilateral sabre rattling will cause our allies to second guess us
5 ) Arabs will unite against this colonial bullying
6 ) Terrorist repurcussions will be like we have never seen in America

It's not that I have sympathy for Iraq. I believe that by flaunting our unique superpower status in the world's face like this and especially Russia's, we risk grave alienation by rising future economic opposition.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 23:00 - ID#227238)
Auric: I guess my major fear is related to your number two. That is, that BC may feel an overarching need to disprove his lack of manhood in some fashion related to Iraq. That is also coupled with a concern for the state of political independence of the US military command. I fear that the military may be in such a state as to carry greater concern for their respective careers than for the need to provide sound counsel on the advisability of another military adventure in the ME.

Since he has no knowledge of anything except politics, our executive knothead may well embark upon a course that is better left to another time, place and more capable executive. Perhaps even someone who has actually been shot at.

If wiser heads are unable to prevail, even at risk to their careers, we could be in a world of hurt. Gold or no gold, we ain't got no business, nohow, messin' around in that part of the world .... or any other for that matter. ...... Hubris, hubris - political hubris. It's going to be our undoing before very much time passes. We can only poke sticks into that hornets nest a small number of times before we discover more hornets than we can deal with in one sitting. .... 'N that ain't even beginning to deal with the moral element of the thing. But what else can we expect from an amoral republic???????

(Fri Jan 30 1998 23:05 - ID#401460)
themissinglink (Iraq)


Indonesia, Malaysia, etc. are all on hard times and the Asia crash will spread to more Muslim Contries. The moderate Muslims will begin to join the radicals against the US.

Do you think Clinton is doing this on his own or are "THEY" at it again?

This is not good.


(Fri Jan 30 1998 23:11 - ID#225273)
(Nikko and GGFI)
GGFI is one of the three exploration companies I mentioned here at Kitco about three weeks ago.
It is a great little company. And management is putting together more properties in Guyana while they are cheap.
For more info, call the company on Monday ( 416 ) 363-3933. Ask for Patrick Sheridan, jr.

The Preacher

(Fri Jan 30 1998 23:15 - ID#335190)
Highrise @ 22:55 ("Welfare Industry" = "Welfare Industry Workers" USofA Pre: 1962 & 1998 )
International Welfare Spending - Corporate Welfare Bums -

$700,000,000,000, +Bonds + + Currency ++ International Bankers

Suits get 63% of the Local Welfare Dollars ( $100,000 per year ) - The poor/worker/citizen gets 37% of the welfare Dollars.

................The Shame of Welfare Reform

"trickle down welfare." Out of the billions of dollars the government spends on welfare, only a small portion actually reaches the hands of the truly needy. The rest is paid to middlemen and social workers who make up the welfare bureaucracy. Why not pass stand alone legislation requiring all recipients of government grants to disclose the salaries of their managers? Does helping the poor merit $100,000 pay checks maybe or maybe not, but taxpayers should know where their money goes.

It is also time to require truth in effectiveness. Taxpayers deserve to know if their hard earned dollars are being used wisely or not, and thus stand alone legislation should be sent to the President that requires government programs and programs that are recipients of government money to track and publicly release their success and failure rates.

..................Welfare Spending

Before 1962, ***three out of every four dollars in federal aid to the poor went to them directly, in cash.*** Today, the numbers are almost reversed. Most federal aid and local welfare spending goes to the "welfare industry" rather than directly to poor people.

In Milwaukee County, Wisconsin, for example, only 37 percent of total welfare spending goes directly to poor people. The rest either ends up in government programs or goes to service providers who are supposed to design programs to help the poor. As a result:

Antipoverty spending in the county was ** $1.038 billion in 1988.** That was $10,793 for each poor person, or $32,379 for a family of three  well above the poverty line.

Yet the poverty rate in the county has not gone down.

The trend toward directing money to the welfare industry instead of directly to the poor has escalated, especially in recent years. Whereas a nonpoor person can choose how to allocate his or her resources, a poor person must depend on the amounts and types of goods and services chosen for him or her by the service providers who control 63 percent of antipoverty spending.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 23:19 - ID#227238)
Nick@C: No problem mate. She's rotten below the waterline. A short salvo of 3 pounders should cave in her timbers like than her skipper's moral resolve. ...... If it be yer intention to carry away the buxom lass, be quick. It's likely to be a race between the floodin' 'n the skipper gettin' her first. His name is Barnacle Bill. Got 'em on his belayin' pin, I'm told.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 23:23 - ID#401460)
Saddam will give in to SLICK!
This is how Clinton and Gore are going to keep the employmwnt up! That's it!

By the way, can you imagine how Saddam is feeling today? He has to be saying " Man that Clinton is SCARY look at how his approval rating is at an all time high and his wife hasn't cut his throat, And that girl Monica's Dad hasn't slit his throat! LET THEM INSPECT! LET THEM INSPECT!"


(Fri Jan 30 1998 23:25 - ID#227238)
A blood boiler.
6 pak: It is a rotten system. But like all govt programs it is really intended to reward hordes of middle class folks who would otherwise be unemployable in a modern technical economy. BTW, the last national number I saw was only 27% of all welfare dollars actually went to the poverty stricken. The rest went to ..... uh, overhead.

Spud Master
(Fri Jan 30 1998 23:34 - ID#273112)
@While we are going on the record...
We have no business in Iraq or bombing Iraq.

We let Saddam kill Kurds & Marsh Arabs & did nothing.

This war is all about Power & Ego, and nothing to do
with world freedom or a lasting peace.

Let the Arabs defend themselves.

If we are so damn scared of high oil prices, then let us get off
our *sses and put practical solar, hydrogen, thermal and wind power
into American usage.

No more wars for the vainglory of politicians, pants around their ankles!

(Fri Jan 30 1998 23:39 - ID#31868)
How about Bill and Saddam in hand to hand combat to the death. Winner gets a trip to, ah, let's say, Disney world, their hurtin anyway due to lack of Asian tourism dollars.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 23:42 - ID#335190)
Earl @ 23:25
Over head. Could that be considered as Control Costs. Like Hitler had an over head Control Cost, when he hired German Citizen's, to Control the Fellow German Citizen's, that were targeted for the Gas Chambers. Is my thinking, old news, not related to modern day people control.?

Earl, by chance have you a ball park dollar number, for USofA Welfare costs. I had not understood, that only 27% of all welfare dollars, trickled down to the poor. Sad eh!. Hire half the working class, to kill the other half. [ 1888 or 1998 ? ]

(Fri Jan 30 1998 23:43 - ID#227238)
The COT. So far it hasn't meant a lot.
Jan. 30 COT: I don't think anyone has posted them yet.

COMEX gold futures:
Commercial insiders: long 92,532, short 77,266;
Speculators: long 12,390, short 36,522.

The spec shorts continue to escape the just wrath of God as the ratio become less and less bullish. Ho Hum. What else is new? No reason to become excited, it has been bullish as hell for a year ..... to no net postive effect.

(Fri Jan 30 1998 23:51 - ID#401460)
Dallas Morning News

"The fact that Mr. Clinton's presidency is threatened by allegations that he had sex with a White House intern also does nothing to strengthen his attempts to garne Arab support."

"Some Arab skeptics suggest the president
might launch an attack to deflect attention from his difficulties."

""Even if attacking Iraq is necessary to get Clinton out of his personal mess, it will not be in the interest of the U.S.," Mr. Ahmed said."

"It's a sentiment that Mr. Hussein brought home to his Arab neighbors in a scathing polemic aimed at Mr. Clinton in his family-owned newspaper Babil:

"If you think your sex scandals will give you problems which may lead you out of the White House, then the attack on Iraq will not only destroy you as president, but it will destroy American interests in the Arab and Islami worlds.""