Gold Discussion for Investors and Market Analysts

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(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:00 - ID#284251)
Fergie - here you go.
Venereso's words of wisdom

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:03 - ID#22956)
And I will cherish the coin forever. ... ( wink )

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:07 - ID#339212)
SOME FACTS: Hecla Mng (HL)

For every $ silver goes up, earnings improve by 10 cents a share.

The 1997 silver revenue was 20% of total revenues.
The 1997 silver production was 5.1 Mil. ozs. at total cost of $5.42 /oz
The 1997 shares were 55 Mil.

Silver at $15, then EPS will be $1.00 and with a P/E of 25 the stock should sell for $25. Not bad!

LEVERAGE = 2X of silver

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:07 - ID#340459)
(I am putting more in PM Mutuals.
It's gotta accelerate henceforth

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:08 - ID#340459)
What is Gold in Asia now, anyone please

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:10 - ID#340459)
(Myrmidom, Is Hecla like Microsft of Silver ?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:16 - ID#339212)
@ Midas_A

Not really. There are others PAASF and PRU and SSC. The reason why I like the stock is that they are diversifying into other minerals, a good strategy if PMs don't perform. It is also a gold play, and if you look at the year-end results, they have done OK considering the low PM prices.

Barb Hughes
(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:17 - ID#20783)

My 22:24 post to Ted Butler was in response to Ted Butler's 20:50 post.

Were's your dog in this fight??? Are you one in the same??? OR is

there something we should know about?

You live under the same roof???------------ ( web site room )

That was a dangerously stupid attack, on someone you obviously know

nothing about or idiotically think you do.

If you are as great as you think you are, you would have been able to OR

tried to attack the stats I presented. ( content of information! )

I try to share my insight into what's happening to metals, in the real

physical world, on a day to day basis. Obviously, to witch you have no


Thank you for openly admitting to plagiarism!!!

Take careBarb

P.S. You have been a very entertaining interlude to a very long day.

Here we do not write news letters, only invoices and checks SO I ya dontt

likes hows we speakes ors writes dats OK ---DA BANK CANS REEDS DA


(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:20 - ID#287277)
And on the other side of the world....
"Attack on Freedom of the Press"
Cover story about the planned change of the constitution in Germany that would allow the bugging of private homes in a "Grand Coalition against the Constitutional State" ( cover headline ) .

Headline not yet written
DER SPIEGEL sums up the state of nuclear, biological and chemical weaponry in Iraq ( with exclusive details ) : Almost everything is "Made in Germany".

"They Hoped for a Miracle"
SPIEGEL in-depth interview with IMF head Camdessus about the Asian economic crisis, the IMF's aid program, foolish banks and greedy speculators: "I am not sitting here in front of you and crying 'victory'. ...
Indonesia needs a knowledgeable and credible successor to President Suharto. ... I have no mistakes to blame myself for. ...The belief in the Asian model is part of the problem. ... I don't have the time to analyze Soros psyche. ... I do not believe that we can artificially stop speculators."

If it wasn't so very sad, it would be terribly funny...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:21 - ID#339212)
@ Midas_A
Nothing wrong putting money in PM mutuals, however, consider the following:

1. You can buy 10 stocks for 300 commissions in the Web.
2. You will never pay management fees.
3. You can sell options on your stocks when the time is right.
4. You have more fun doing it on your own.
5. You can buy on margin, if you like the risk.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:22 - ID#284184)
Sharefin--Veneroso report. Nice work.
Thanks, Sharefin. How'd you do that?

To all who e-mailed me requesting the Veneroso transcript: I am not at the same computer I was--got chased off the desktop by the wife--and in mailing the Veneroso to this computer, some got lost in cyberspace. Anyway, I can't e-mail you the transcript until morning now.

However, the mighty Sharefin has succeeded in posting the transcript in it's entirety--read the first post of this day!

Anyone who hasn't read the report, take a look at it. There's lots of good information on it.


(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:26 - ID#286230)
Silverbaron; Aurophole: thanks for the information.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:27 - ID#339212)
@ all

I notice that many names have _A attached after the name. Is this significant, or it indicates Australia?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:28 - ID#284251)
Commentary Quotes
MARKET UPDATE ( 02/5/98 ) PM-----Gold opened solidly higher in early trading then sold off on hopes that the Iraq crisis was going to come to some sort of compromise. Gold was up as much as $4 in the early going. Technically speaking there seems to be some resistance at the $305-306 level and we will see if it can blow through that number before next week's out. We do not consider $305 to be a major obstacle, but things could get choppy for awhile. Gold got another boost at an Australian conference overnight when a governor for the Bank of England told participants that the gold reserve level at the new European central bank would be between 5% and 20%. Time and again, European central bankers have said that the window on gold mobilizations by loan or sale is closing, if not already closed, as Maastricht comes on line this fall. Don't buy into mainstream press claims to the contrary. They lack objectivity and their reporting for the most part represents a departure from what the European central bankers have repeatedly stated in speeches, press interviews, etc. The European policy will be to hold gold if the central bankers are to be believed before, after and during the changeover to the new currency, period. The traders constantly quoted on Reuters, UPI , AP and the other services seem to have a vested interest in the short side of the market and this has to be weighed whenever they are quoted. Gold experts are astonished by quotes like this one which appeared in the Hong Kong Reuters report from a "trader": "It ( the announcement of the 5% to 20% reserve ) made people think, what about the rest of the gold? Will the rest of the central banks just dump it out in the market?" Where did he get this from? Which people are thinking this? Why does Reuters print this nonsense? Does this "trader" read what the central bankers are saying or does he go around making things up because he happens to be on the short side of the market. Fellow goldmeisters, always consider the source.....always consider the source. When Andy Smith or Ted Arnold are quoted in the Wall Street Journal and they are slamming gold keep in mind that the institutions they represent Union Bank Switzerland and Merrill Lynch have two of the largest short positions in the gold market and are responsible for brokering large gold loan deals that depend for their success on a static or a declining gold price. They are on the other side of the gold market from most American investors. One problem: they are now bumping against the largest physical gold demand in history and investors have caught on to what's behind the attacks on gold.......Have a good day, my friends. I'll be back later if anything happens.

John Disney__A
(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:28 - ID#24135)
Avgold is not so bad really
To all
I received an email question yesterday question -
It -was which did I prefer AVGOLD or Randfontein?
I answered that I refered Randfontein because they
were making profits at 310$/oz. their average costs
were down to about 305$/oz from over 400 6 months ago
and their production was UP. They should be at twice the
price they are. They are adding reserves from
contiguous properties. Plus I have just sold out my
avgold only the day before for a 40% profit in a short
time. I was a little tired of it.
However at Avgold , reserves are 19000tons at
13.83gm/ton for 8 mill oz ( proved ?obable )
RESOURCES ( including inferred ) are 482,623 tons at
6.47 gm/ton for 100.42 mill oz.
Market cap is 385mil shares * 0.8$/share= 308mil$
so the resources cost 3$/oz !!... The discussions
with Placer dome centered on the Target area which
is shallow gold at a forecast cost of under 200$/oz.
I would keep an eye on this stock .. they cannot
generate sufficient funds internally to develope
their resource base. Look at their reserves per share.
100mil oz on 385 mil shares = 0.25 oz/share
This is about like ABX but they need finance. Lihir
is a better comparison 42milloz on 900 mil shares
for 0.046 oz/share. I guess lihir is around $1.5
a share so that would set a comparable price for
avgold at ( 0.25/.046 ) * 1.5 = 8 $. Plus they should
get a premium for cash generation from their
Hartes operation. so versus ABX 20/.8= 25 times
undervalued. versus Lihir ( 8+ 4 for harties ) = 12/.8=
15 times undervalued. Interesting hey. And no typos.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:29 - ID#401460)
Night Line New York Times Tomorrow
New York Times
Hours after the President returned from the deposition on the Paula Jones case he took his personal secretary and coached her on how to tell the Monica story.

"If this story is true, it will be very bad for the President. Obstruction of Justice. Ms Curry I was never alone with Monica, right; and She came on to Me, right."

Watch the markets in the AM people. Go Gold!

Good Night Mr. President


(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:35 - ID#344308)

us fixing to bomb iraq.........
arab nations against said move.......
iraq will surely attack israel......
arab opec has agreed to embargo the west if they assist israel....
russia is warning of wwIII as possible out-come of same...

so, who do we have ready to bomb iraq? the us and the uk......

the same bed-fellows of the nwo-for-lunch-bunch-------they just
have to show the world they are still the leaders.......their
economic policies are collapsing around the will
this fiasco into the persian gulf..........iran is prepared to
blast shipping in the vital corridor that has seen us/iran
confrontations before........the scenario is totally changed........
the us fleet and air force will be subject to a real war scenario.....
sea-skimming harbingers of death......remember the french exocets the
argentines used quite effectively against the uk task force? the newer
versions are capable of delivering devastating pay-loads to our floating
examples of america's might.......nothing is invincible......iran will
jump-in quicker than you can say ali akabr...........the pact is sealed
with syria, iraq, iran, pakistan, and several others.....with china and
russia as providers of hard-ware, expertise, and assurances that the
international bullies will not have it their way this time........
many fronts.......with scaled-back forces and material..........and
no time for rapid mobilization.......this is a disaster waiting to
happen.......he will approve the strike sooner than later.....
and he will be removed by capitol hill in dis-grace......he'll say
resignation.......realistic--ally force-out........there can be no
other outcome.......the white-house of shame.......real good for gold....

glenn------glad you think gold ( far-out ) calls are the place to be....
i've been beating that drum ( and silver's ) for quite a while...............and have recently increased the know the evidenced
earlier.....just not the drummer.....


(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:38 - ID#22956)

And it looks Soooooooo beauuutiful!!
D.A. you are a most honorable man. I salute you. Hats off and all that stuff. I will display this coin as a symbol to the end of the great gold bear of 97 ( maybe ) ...

btw, is that a good place to buy coinage?? If you bought there it must be okie-dokie. I will call and place an order soon. prepare for opening night

lgb...I have some tickets reserved even for you.....gonna make the opening?? ( grin ) ...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:38 - ID#340459)
(@Myrmidon, Thanks..

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:40 - ID#280222)
AUS_con; HAGGIS: J Disney;...thank you for responses.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:41 - ID#344308)

$10+ move in pog friday......immmf

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:41 - ID#340459)
@Cherokee, Way to Go, Brother

The Hatt
(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:42 - ID#294232)
Gold Is About To Explode And We Should All Have a Moment Of Silence!!!!!!!!!!
To remember those shorters who went from flush to fleeced in one simple and quick $50.00 spike! They will be back!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:43 - ID#287277)
Sharefin--For the list of 'The Ironic', I submit this.....

Yuan ( Mongol ) ( 1279 - 1368 )
The Yuan dynasty also featured the famous Khubilai Khan...

CHINA INTERNATIONAL FUTURES CO. LTD., of the Peoples Republic of China.. .whose chairman is Tian Yuan.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:43 - ID#374211)
@ As The World Turns.....BJ&Monica.....
ABC Nightline did their whole show tonight based on a story in
todays New York Times, wherein a reporter claims that BJ's secretary
Curly, was called into his office and told "I was never alone with
Monica RIGHT" and "SHE came on to me RIGHT"......
How coincidental that just as BJ had a news conference cheduled for today, with P.M. Blair, let's see do I think BJ will be asked about Miz Curly's statement...nah, yah right!....I have a feeling that this Iraq "thing" is not going to turn out good for the US....I remember Carter, ( of course he
only "lusted" in his mind ) ,and how he was embaraced by the "Hostage"
crisis, how impotent he appeared, the leader of the most "powerful"
nation on earth....and how we later found out that Ragean had
made a deal with the Iranians to hold the Hostages until after the
election, which he won.....But I also have a feeling that this time
EVERYBODY in Washington is going to "smell" bad after the market
tumbles....BJ for his "addiction?" and the Republicans Starr et al
for bringing BJ down and the markets with him....just look at his
high polls, NOBODY wants this "US markets dream" to end, they
have got too much money in it....I am betting that if BJ does "bad"
at the news conference, the markets will tank....and as I always say
who wants to be "short" Gold on a friday, with Iraq and Asia pending,
it seems that the world is indeed "turning" against the US....
just some thoughts....

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:45 - ID#339212)
@ Cherokee, Midas, Fergie

Please excuse my ignorance, but the _A attached after your name what does it indicate?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:45 - ID#288349)
Asia quotes?
Yahoo quotes not available for foreign exchanges. Makes me suspicious. These guys love to remove the red as soon as possible. Anybody got alternative sites for checking Asian markets?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:46 - ID#340459)
@Tzadeak, Right on many scores again.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:47 - ID#340459)
@Myrmidon, Dunno maybe A is added by Kitco for "Addiction"

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:49 - ID#432166)
Eldorado: These are the same guys who took out the Hunts in 80 and Philbro in the early 90's. I am not necessarily certain that the comex commercials are yet "on the same page" as the players in London. If and when they do will probably the signal that the intermediate top is in.

I agree with D.A. that some intermediate top will be formed. If the commercials panic along with all the other shorts then it could be higher than the final top of this process. First there will be some form of resolution of the current short squeeze and then the price will seek the level that will be required to boost silver production. That price will be likely at least what it will take to demothball currently inactive silver mines in the states, etc.

Having said that, the shorts have a lot of penance to do. Ted Butler does everyone a great service by pointing out that there is a short "overhang" of 850 million ounces - mostly owned by the NY commercials.

Short of leaving town I don't have a clue how they are going to deal with that one... Declare war on Omaha??

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:49 - ID#340459)
Goodnight folks, better get some sleep, heavy day tom

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:49 - ID#28585)

Tangible evidence that Canadian mutual funds are witnessing significant drops in inflows, provided in news article below.

A GOOD PREVIEW of the upcoming figures on American Mutual funds!!!!
( They'll blame the negative effects on El Nino, right?? )

Friday, February 6, 1998

Mutual funds chilled by ice storm, volatile market

The Financial Post
Finance Minister Paul Martin has extended the RRSP season by a month for people hit by last month's ice storm. However analysts expect that to be little help to mutual funds - preliminary figures suggest their January sales trailed the 1997 pace by 40%.
The Investment Funds Institute of Canada lobbied Ottawa to push back the cutoff date for contributing to registered retirement savings plans. But while member fund companies say the storm dented sales, they admit volatile markets have been a bigger problem.
Most Canadians will have to meet the usual March 2 deadline, but those in Quebec, New Brunswick, Nova Scotia and eastern Ontario will have until midnight March 31 to make a contribution to their 1997 RRSP.
 "We want to ensure that those individuals who are still coping with the consequences of the ice storm are not prevented from giving full attention to important decisions about their retirement savings," Martin said.
Revenue Minister Herb Dhaliwal said extending the deadline will help the thousands of people forced out of their homes by power failures. He said Ottawa would soon provide detailed information for taxpayers and RRSP issuers on the specific geographic areas in which the extension will be in force.
Dan Richards, president of Marketing Solutions, which tracks fund industry sales, said the extension "will probably help at the margin," but slower sales are mainly the result of "investors' nervousness," caused by volatile markets.
Fund sales figures for January will not be available until mid-February, but executives such as CI Mutual Funds chief operating officer Bill Holland estimated sales at about $3 billion in the month. That's down 40% from $5 billion in January 1997.
"We got no business from Quebec in the first two weeks of January." But he added: "Remember the RRSP season is not what it used to be. More people contribute all year round."
Sales have also fallen at BPI Capital Management Corp.
"Our net sales are down 50% to 60% from last year, but more importantly, the gross numbers are down and the redemption numbers are a little higher," said president Jim McGovern. He said sales in Quebec were especially slow.
Trimark Mutual Funds suffered a huge drop in net sales in January. Sales fell to $42 million in the month, compared with $393 million in January 1997. It had gross sales of $540 million last month, but massive redemptions of $498 million took a big bite out of new inflows.
Sales of mutual funds by the big five banks are also expected to be down significantly when January numbers are reported.
However, a few fund companies have reported higher sales. Investors Group Inc. of Winnipeg, Canada's largest fund company, said net sales in January were $247 million, up from $220.5 million in January 1997. Toronto-based Global Strategy Financial Inc. also reported sales higher than last year.
While the extended RRSP contribution deadline is "welcome," CI's Holland said he is not sure the impact will be significant.
The special extension also applies to hydro workers, soldiers and volunteers from other parts of Canada who helped during the civil emergency.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:50 - ID#28585)
See previous post.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:52 - ID#284184)
I can e-mail Veneroso transcript again
I do have the Veneroso transcript back again and can again e-mail it to you if you want. Just e-mail me at I'm going to be going to be in 15 minutes, though. Otherwise, I'll ship it out in the morning. Or, just read sharefin's first post of today! ( Thanks again, Sharefin. )

myrmidon: we don't put the _A after our handle; Kitco does that for some reason...

Go Gold!


(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:53 - ID#340459)
(I met Paul Martin, Alexa Mc(NDP) at Dinner at Confederation Ballroom at Parliament in Ottawa, They
were debating Ice Storm and costs till late last night

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:53 - ID#339212)
@ Farfel

The mutual fund downflow could also be blamed on Sunspots!!!!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:55 - ID#28585)
God knows they've bought every other piece of crock thrown their way.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:56 - ID#284251)
Watch the rats jump now. Gold to rise on news?
Save the file in MS Word 97 as an html file and post to server.
Avid chatter:
NY Times tomorrow has front page article saying Slick's Secretary, Betty Currie, has spilled the beans on the Boss!!!!!!Koppel says ABC has confirmed the story!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! spoos falling on globex?????

If thats so, i guess thats why he begged ,said , what he did about the grand jury testimonies, executive priveledge. if this is true ,the secretarys story, the charade is kaput!

The rats will probably start running for the fantail now. I'm flabbergasted that an honest person coujld have slipped through the vetting process the Klintonostras obviously have. She may be the only person in that whole bunch who does not lie as naturally as they breathe.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:56 - ID#243235)
(wyzzard after lurking for a month)
( here's my spin on the silver thing - longer term that is - for folks thinking we're gonna' see the metal back into the 20-40 dollar days. someone posted recently re: the numbers of 1000oz bars folks took delivery on back in '80 that might come flooding back into the market. have to agree - assuming we ever get past the $10 range and such, you know the euphoria back in 79-80 had everybody and his/her grandmother buying silver all the way up and especially closer to the high. and you know that the same saps who were buying on the way up DID NOT cut their losses on the way down. they're probably sitting around with big silver bricks in the basement waiting to unload - "if it'll just go back to $20 i SWEAR i'll get out and i'll never be so stupid again!!!" and we're not just talking about moms and dads buying "happy thanksgiving 1979" 1 oz bars. we're talking about lawyers, dentists, doctors, etc. who were all too ready to plop down 10 or 20k to get in on the latest sure thing. not to mention all the oil folks buying up gold and silver. unsophisticated traders don't like to cut losses - esp. when they can just sit on the bars and pretend "it's just a paper loss - it's not real". there's lots of silver waiting in the wings - unless the fundamentals are REALLY solid, the way up could be a very rocky grind...lots of resistance near the round numbers - more so than usual.
or maybe not - what do i know? i paid $54 for that "happy thanksgiving" bar oh so long ago....

(Fri Feb 06 1998 00:59 - ID#340459)
(Alexa Mc said that NDP will fight for non alignment with US on Iraq War
Dunno whether she will stick to it

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:00 - ID#247106)
short silver

as i stated several months ago there was no room above for the
shorts in silver, not a bad call!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:01 - ID#28585)
The number of people with substantive silver holdings from the early '80's are either dead or cashed in their silver years ago and took the tax loss.

If you're shorting silver and trying to unnerve the silver bulls on this forum, I doubt you will be successful. Sorry...but the ball is in the silver bull court right now.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:01 - ID#432166)
PH in LA: There is certainly potential for the financial inflation to start moving into stuff at any point. Buffet has by a single stroke made this a credible option for mainstream investors. Currently the move in silver is a reflection of inbalances which are being capitalized on by very savvy investors.

But, as D.A. points out, the current situation could well be just the appetizer. The main course will come when going long commodities becomes an acceptable core holding for mainstream investors. I don't know what the current numbers would be but last year someone calculated that the market capitalization of one stock, Coca Cola, would buy all the gold stocks ( I think ) in the world.

Buffet is standing in a pool of gasoline and has just lit a cigarette...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:01 - ID#339212)
Perception of a PM trader...

... Hoarder, Speculator, Manipulator, Doomer & Gloomer.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:03 - ID#252150)
Silver@The Oracle
WB stated that he invested in Silver because he felt that the price was out of equilibrium. Now--if we only new what he thinks equilibrium should be. 8$--9$, who knows...maybe we'll reach it today.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:05 - ID#403195)
Haruspex Omahaensis

Yes, Mr. Buffet bought silver. Nobody seems to be saying that what the Sage did was to step off the equities elevator.

Let's all stop for a moment and think about how many people have come out winners by taking the other side of a trade with Buffet.


( Aurator: "cum grano salis", ablative of means or instrument for granus is correct but we need the genitive for sal, not the accusative. Vale. )

John Disney__A
(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:06 - ID#24135)
The Dwarves are revolting --
To all
Read this comment while browsing .....
"BTW the South African Mines we learned have sold and are
selling off all their "Kitty" Gold on the spot market to stay
alive, I wonder which of these two options you would prefer
if you ran a Gold mine and which is having a greater effect
on the cash price of Gold."

This statement is false and intentionally misleading. I
believe that dwarfland in order to divert attention from the
growing faultlines in their favorite stock - ABX -are attempting
to divert attention by attacking Iraq Er sorry South Africa.
Reminds me a bit of someone else ( BC ) - only that guy is
unfortunately a lot smarter.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:07 - ID#28585)
Most of WB's stock investments have never been sold for less than 100% return.

Thus minimum equilibrium price should be at least $12.00 ( although I suspect it will prove to be much higher ) .

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:11 - ID#339212)
@ wyzzard

You just said it. Mr. public generally buys at market tops. This includes Doctors and Lawyers since they have very little time to spend doing their homework in PMs. Mass psychology has always indicated that people want to get out at their break even point of a bad investment.

When something is cheap, nobody wants it. They love DOW at 8,000 and Bonds at 5.8%. They hated DOW at 1,000 and bond yields at 13%.

Stick to Kitco. You will receive your degree in PMs and you will survive the sinking ship. Your graduation date is a year from now.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:18 - ID#252150)
Midas@Egghead is Gung-Ho
Our valiant Minister of Defence-Egghead Eggleton is just salvitating at the prospect of actually involving us in a shooting war. Even if it's the same as shooting sitting ducks. I understand that he's emminently qualified to lead us into war, as he achieved his second eagle scout badge at age 19.

John Disney__A
(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:19 - ID#24135)
Harmony vs drooy - here Kitty here Kitty
for 223
Why do you ask ME of all people WHY has Harmony gone up
faster than drooy. Answer - because it is a better deal -
answer - because I said it would - answer - because I bought
it and Im Mr Lucky. Cmon - look at my spreadsheet - do numbers
- ignore dwarves with cr@p like selling gold from kitty-
For your info - bought my first Drooy for the year yesterday
- PREFERRED stock 18% div. crazy - selling BELOW ordinaries in
dopey market - also more options. DDEEP company secretary
tipped me on the preferred .. by product benefit of checking
their resource base.
Good luck

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:22 - ID#340459)
James, Saddam is made out to be new Hitler, he has no Industry, they cant even build cars let alone
fight usa, This War ( starting soon feb/mar ) is a ploy for getting oil and protecting israel

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:22 - ID#284251)
Worth a repost.
Perhaps this is how Clinton will stay in term.
All he has to do is get Iraq to retaliate.
Then the world will forget about his bad habits.
And they won't be able to remove him.

Methinks this dude plays dirty poker.

Also the widening of the Dow circuit breakers is very ominous.
If the PPT wanted the markets down softly,
They would have left the old breakers in place.

I guess the reason the have expanded them out to 30%
Is that they want the crash all over in 1 or 2 days.
Guess they can see what is coming greater than most.

Guaranteed that this will be bullish for 'my precious'.

Cherrokee - my man.
I just bought 10 Dec400's
To add to the other's
Should have bought them two weeks ago.

I love to see those bullish spikes that fade away.
They normally back themselves up given time and are taken out.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:27 - ID#284251)
Email chatter
elliot wave applied to xau.
Here is the scoop on the metals..
I have talked at length today to 3 big dealers in the metals, 2 in NY and 1 in Calif. What they tell me is massive SELLING by the public of silver, ie-- bringing it in to coin shops and selling. No one is buying silver at the retail level, yet!?
As for gold, they are having massive sales--ie--people buying, heavy.
It takes 2-3 weeks for them to ship to dealers at wholesale. There is no inventory of gold bullion coins. None.
They all agree now is the time to buy gold, at 18 year lows, and sell silver, now at a 10 year high. None of them can make any sense of the metals markets, but did point out how the Tiger fund has held platinum and palladium up for quite some time now, so silver may have a quick up run. They all expect the mother of all runs when gold starts to gain momentum.
The Contrarian's View - January 30, 1998
We have now reached a situation where corporate Japan, Nippon banks, and the Japanese government ALL require a massive influx of money. If one of these entities does not get these funds, then the whole system collapses. All three entities are technically bankrupt, all three require money, and except for the printing press at the Bank of Japan, there is no source for this money. Up until the Asian crises, the Japanese banks were able to supply sufficient liquidity to the system. Now the demand for liquidity has DRAMATICALLY increased, but the supply is contracting. Japan will fail in 1998.- John Kutyn
In this world where no one should fail, banks rescue bankrupt companies by injecting more loans. And when this action threatens the financial health of the banks, governments are called to rescue the banks. And when this action threatens the financial health of the governments, the IMF is called in. And when problems get too large for the IMF, everything collapses. - John Kutyn
The monetarists have been assuring everyone that deflation is easy to avert. Because deflation is a state of mind, when a monetary system is debt-laden, I don't believe it can be averted. Every action will be interpreted in such a way as to fuel deflationary psychology, which puts the spin on the action. I am sure that the Japanese would like a quick fix to their deflation, don't you think? So far, it has progressed for eight years. - Robert Prechter
There must be a limitation on the amount of paper money printed other than a bunch of old men sitting around a room deciding that they should print 10% more this year, or some other number that they concoct. - James Dines
Ah, yes. I was wondering when the CFTC was going to stick its nose into the silver situation. It will be interesting to see their response to B-H's accumulation. The last time someone tried to corner the silver market ( the now infamous Hunt brothers ) , the CFTC changed the trading rules in the middle of the game to save its member firms, who were big time short, at the expense of the Hunt brothers and every other investor who had bought physical silver on the way up. It was the most blatant ripoff in the history of commodity trading and nobody said a word because it was the governing body, the CFTC, that legalized the theft.
Buffet undoubtedly learned from the Hunt brother's mistakes. He quietly bought and took delivery to the physical metal outside of the CFTC's jurisdiction. He didn't use futures contracts via the US markets so there is nothing the CFTC can do. Why they are wasting their time over it is a mystery to me. I love it. The shorts ( and a lot of them are undoubtedly CFTC member firms ) are getting there heads handed to them and there's nothing the CFTC can do to save their butts for them this time.
TS--It IS nice to see the big boy's get it in the shorts on this one.
There is nothing to investigate. Warren HAS the silver, and he did not
borrow to get it it. In war they call it being outflanked!

Gold Drive Followed by Campaign for Waste
Gold is not the only thing being collected to help boost the struggling economy. The steady and drastic depreciation of the Korean won has driven the prices of imported goods to unaffordable levels, and as the nation depends on the outside for the majority of its raw materials, a new campaign to collect and recycle items including paper, metals and glass has emerged.
It began in Shinbukmyun, Pochon County, when citizens decided that collecting waste that could otherwise be used would not only help the economy but clean up the environment at the same time. On February 1 they collected a total of 89 tons of scrap iron, 11,506 tons of paper and 13,500 kg of bottles. Following this the waste collecting movement has expanded throughout the nation to many different organizations. Another waste drive held Wednesday in Tarsung County amassed 25 old refrigerators.
As the movement gains supporters KBS announced it will also join the band wagon by holding a nationwide waste collection drive next Monday with expected participants to reach 40,000.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:28 - ID#374211)
@ DIZZY MUHAMED...and ALL South African "KITTY" Gold sales can be found at...

4th item down

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:28 - ID#252150)
Farfel@I have'nt an inkling re: POS
& there are 16 inklings in a clue. It could be 9 19 or 29. But if I owned
the futures over 8, I know I would'nt sleep well, if & all.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:31 - ID#393224)
Bye bye silver bird
I may be too cautious. I will never be there fully invested for 'the big kill'. When I have an investment that has gone up 50% in a month, I get nervous. This may be the biggest short squeeze in history. I don't know who to believe anymore. There could be warehouses full of silver sitting around ready to be sold into the next spike ( eg now ) .

My policy has always been to sell at least half of an investment after a large gain in price. Today many of my 'door stops' went on their voyage to the melting pot. Spot 7.70??? Would have been a dream a month ago. If it goes higher I will be a little sad--but by then I'll have the $$ reinvested in something else that is going up on heavy volume--Maybe even more 'poor man's gold'-- IF we get a correction.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:32 - ID#252150)
Midas@The Most Cowardly War Part 2
I agree 100% & said so in response to one of your postings yesterday.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:32 - ID#266105)
@Stone Age Tours, Inc.

still in the greed phase I'm afraid.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:35 - ID#243235)
ease up on the paranoia. i'm not here to break the bull. and i sincerely doubt that the market would even notice if everyone around here ( foolishly ) decided to short silver. relax...i'm on your side. i'm holding from 6.15...ain't in no rush to see this bull end...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:35 - ID#284251)
More info.
ScotiaMcLeod Silver Report from Oct 16, 1997
Of course they review the supply, demand, inventories etc and come to the obvious conclusion that silver is setting up to soar big time.
They discuss each of the major silver stocks and have an interesting table showing how much each SHARE of each company analyzed should rise with each ONE dollar rise in the price of silver.
Company...........................$Share................Rise/$1 Ag
Pan American......................7.40...................$5.82
First Silver Reserve............. 0.78...................$0.28
Avino Silver Mines...............1.90....................$1.41
Silver Standard................... 3.81....................$3.87
Sunshine............................. 0.81 ..................$0.30
The others, Cons Nevada, Barrick, Sunshine, Echo Bay etc
were estimated at less than $1.00 gain per $1.00 rise in silver.
Off hand it would seem Pan American is the way to go, however,
if we invest $1000 in each stock, here is what would happen for
each $1.00 rise in the price of silver:
Company..................Shares/$1000......Rise/$1Ag........Profit/$1 Ag
Pan American....................135.........x...........$5.82...................$785
First Silver Reserve..........1300.........x...........$0.28...................$364
Avino Silver Mines.............525.........x...........$1.41...................$740
Silver Standard...................265........x...........$3.87.................$1025
Sunshine............................1235.......x..........$0.30................... $370
( all figures $US, conversion used = .705 )
Sunshine's current share price is $0.81, it will rise $0.30 for each
$1.00 rise in silver. For a thousand dollars you can buy about
1235 shares of sunshine. For each dollar rise in silver you will
profit $370.
When silver ran from 4.30 to 5.30, Sunshine went from about
$0.70 to about $1.10. Many other silver stocks out performed
If ( when ) silver goes to $8.00, Sunshine should be about $2.00.
As One of America's Greatest Men of All Time Once Said:
Silver itself is of no certain permanent Value, being worth more or less according to its Scarcity or Plenty, therefore it seems requisite to fix upon something else, more proper to be made a Measure of Values.
--Benjamin Franklin
@ The 10 Weeks Cycle on The XAU Chart: I have counted and re-counted. Using 11/25/97 as the start of the current 10 weeks cycle, I can now say ( with confidence? ) that that 10 weeks cycle ended on Tuesday's low. ...It's time to "rock and roll".: ) ) ) )

Actually this run up in silver over the last 6 months was in perfect 5 wave fashion. Take a look at a chart of SIH8. Now we should retrace some of it.
How much? Look at some fibbonacci retracement levels. start with 33%.

AT BOLD PREDICTIONS: Please see the Y.Auger Cycle URL.
I predict that we will have "positive" news for the gold shares until we reach the top of the 38 weeks cycle or the end of the green line. If we have a 1993 type move than the "positive" news will "blow by" the top of the cycle. Half-way up to the top ( about 9-10 weeks ) there will be a short term 1-2 weeks correction.
The silver price is now approaching the upper 90,3 bollinger band. Typically when something gets outside that band it`s time for a pullback. TO keep it in perspective, the XAU would have to reach 120 and london gold over 350 to get the same condition.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:36 - ID#340459)
james, thanks for keeping an open mind to other side of the coin too..

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:42 - ID#252150)
$U.S. Firmer Against All Major Currencies
except the $Cdn ( which is a minor major currency ) April AU -.40.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:42 - ID#374211)
@ BJ.... for the record...
I wanted all to know that is actually his name B ill J efferson clinton,
just a coincidence.... I think.....

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:48 - ID#432166)
PH in LA: I was an early "fan" of Big Trader - someone who ANOTHER claims to have some sort of knowledge of. For a while I had private communications with the person who was posting Big Traders "Thoughts" on Kitco - a move necessitated by impostors posing as BT.

BT made some absolutely outrageous claims. He first posted in Dec 96 stating that if they took gold below 350 that there would be considerable buying taking place. In late January or early February of 97 he posted that over 250 million ounces of physical had been purchased along with contracts to deliver another 330 million ounces.

Shortly after that the LBMA fortuitiously decided to go public with trading and price data after several centuries of absolute secrecy. They published absolutely astonishing ( for the time ) trading stats that indicated that BT was not necessarily some teenager who hadn't done his research... Then of course there was the uncanny tendency of the markets to make a significant spike within 12-24 hours of one of his posts.

Big Trader made a number of posts that were facinating to read - poetic at moments ( particularly about western financial decadence and the paper tiger financial instruments ) . Around the time that Hong Kong was reunitied with China his posts became signals for major down moves and I suspect that some shorts had started to use his handle.

His posts were quite consistent on a number of themes: that large asian money was aquiring physical gold; paper gold assets were not to be trusted; that a number of bullion bankers in London were in very serious trouble having sold gold that had been loaned to them and were in no position to aquire the physical metal to repay the loan; and would absolutely refuse to discuss arab involvement in the gold markets - "such things should not be discussed" - despite repeated inquiries by myself ( public and private ) amongst others.

Then ANOTHER shows up much later first relaying some further thoughts of BT essentially indicating that now that everyone had got their physical it was time to sit back and watch the show... Later ANOTHER, soon followed by TSADEAK, started talking about a oil/gold deal made by certain ( arab ) oil producing countries.

Some time later people started posting work done by Frank Veneroso confirming ealy 97 stories of massive short postions in gold on the order of 8000-10000 tons - roughly the same outrageous numbers kicked around by Big Trader in his earliest posts.

What does all of this mean?? Firstly, Big Trader/The Writer and later ANOTHER presented a consistent picture that apparently is congurent with many now known facts, particularly the LBMA stats and apparently very large gold short postitions. Remember, that to go short you have to find someone to sell to. Apparently Big Trader was claiming to be aware of who those buyers were and their motivation. He may have been a significant player himself.

However, there are facts and then there are interpretation of those facts. It is not necessarily given, for instance, that when the bullion banks default on their gold loans ( from the CB's ) that they ( and the LBMA ) will collapse. The CB's may simply choose to restate those loans as sales and let bygones be bygones. Remember that the most prominent of those banks represent different branches of the Rothschilds for instance.

( As an aside, a prominent Rothschild scion was declared to have committed suicide in early 97 having apparently hanged himself from a towel rack in a Swiss hotel. Apparently he sat down and "jerked his neck" to do the deed. Quite the trick... )

I have never quite got straight how this gold for oil deal worked completely. Nor could I ever quite see the deal reflected in the price of either gold or oil. I suspect that ANOTHER knows something but is giving his interpretation of it and how he imagines it will affect things. He also could be a disinformation agent targeted at lurkers who are monitoring sites on the net like kitco.

But there is one consistent - and disturbing - thread throughout all of this which has lately been confirmed by the Buffet story and the earlier story about Gates taking a large position in gold coins.

Big money is starting to move out of currencies.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:51 - ID#339212)
@ sharefin re: 01:35

If from now on silver and gold move proportionally, the big mover will be HL because it mines a lot of gold. The others are primarily silver players. Expected scenario is a total PM movement, and one should position accordingly.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 01:55 - ID#251129)
Silverbaron, Joe Smith Legend mining 19:51

Sorry I have been fighting off a Aussie Goverment Department over the pegging of Mining tenements and I keep going around and around and around and I have only just seen your post.

I have emailed Joe Smith on the figures I posted, they were recieved this morning in a press release 06/02/98, so now I'am confused to the Two years old news story.

I will try to verify FACTS maybe Joe has more or Nick@C may shed some light on the story.

John Disney__A
(Fri Feb 06 1998 02:09 - ID#24135)
More Dwarfcr@p on my doorstep- messy devils
A person ( I think ) addressing me as "DIZZY MUHAMED"
referred me to the following article.
"At the presentation of Gengolds quarterlies yesterday, CE Tom Dale told analysts that the groups
Evander mine had sold 662kg of gold from its reserves, adding about R32m to its revenue. The
comment was unusual because the existence of SA mines gold in reserve has traditionally been a
closely guarded secret. For years, mines put aside gold for these "kitties" in good quarters so they
could smooth profits in bad ones - essentially a form of risk management in a volatile industry."
This is old news and you have said it before. In
many businesses which report results quarter to quarter
in is normal practice to establish RESERVEs for
possible problems in future quarters. I doubt if you
are aware of this because the general tone of you posts
indicates little business experience and usually represents
your OPINION ( in which I have no interest whatever as I
subscribe no value to it ) on lots of things based upon your
misreading of press reports that were dubious to begin with
and your endless watching of late night TV. There
is no analysis behind what you say as you seem arithmatically
Frankly you bore me to tears. However, I will
phone Evander and Business day and find out more
about the little KITTY.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 02:14 - ID#393224)
GFD -- enjoyed your 1:48

"Big money is starting to move out of currencies"

So is small money--mine!!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 02:15 - ID#252127)
Perhaps a victory for sovereing nations?

This may be the first crack in the one world government's armour. Whose next? Americans; do you have the courage?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 02:29 - ID#252127)
Check it out

Maylasia, Thailand agree to Asean currency trade idea.
Find article at Yahoo, International News, for Thursday, February 5, 1998 11:34 pm.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 02:30 - ID#339212)
@ Jack

Can't access the site. It says expired.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 02:37 - ID#310407)
@ Refer........SILVER is the great conductor
Refer, I must respectfully correct your post of a few hours ago, referenced below. SILVER is the best conductor of all metals. Gold is good, and has a lot of excellent applications in electronics due to it's ductility, non corrosive non oxidizing properties, etc. However, silver is the better conductor.

"Date: Thu Feb 05 1998 22:28
refer ( Silver & Gold Conductance ) ID#41229:
Silver is a very good conductor most all relays and motor starters contact points are of silver cadium. As for
as I know, Gold is the best conductor known to man. Earlier analog phone systems switching stations all had
relays with gold contacts, to allow better reception over lines. With silver and gold there is little to no
problem with electrolysis and oxydation, unlike aluminum and copper.

Once we progress further, I think man kind will figure the other uses for such items as diamonds ( which is
an conductor also ) , gold and other rare materials. It is strange how capitalism encouraged new
developement of technologies in the begining, now it is the major stumbling block against. Not profitable to
sell items that last long and are energy efficient."

(Fri Feb 06 1998 02:41 - ID#310407)
@ What's all the fighting about???
Sounds like Bill Clinton at a press conference around here! Silver soaring, Platinum going up, and yet all kinds of Kitcoites fightin among themselves....hmmmm, Barb, I have no idea where you're coming from but I gotta side with Vronsky on this one. Yer posts just aren't making sense.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 02:43 - ID#266105)


Fiber optics. Ambition can creep as well as soar.
When spider webs unite, they can tie up a lion. ( Ethiopian )

John Disney__A
(Fri Feb 06 1998 03:00 - ID#24135)
Kitty - Eat that dwarf
to all
Regarding recent postings by Nameless dwarf on the kitty
in the rsa mines
Spoke to Evander today - The gold Mr Dale referred
to was what they call 3-day gold which was not yet in
bar form but in the form of gold in intermediate
It had built up at Evander because of operational
difficulties. It is operational inventory.
As I said, all gold in bar form must be and is
declared at the end of the tax year.
What Mr Tzadeak says is simple malicious bullsh!t.
He know very little about mining or much of anything
else and he learns very slowly.
If you doubt me, please phone 02711-3769111 to
get to Mr Dale or mr Tony Doyle. I spoke to Mr Doyle
who is Evander's finance Director. Dale was out today.
Will confirm later with Business Day as reporter who
wrote article is not in.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 03:03 - ID#252127)
@ myrmidon

Hope you found article based on my later post. Another interesting gold/silver miner is Prime Resources Group, their web site is at their news release of 01/22/98 gives some reserve data and that of 10/17/97 gives current assets over current liabilities. I think that Prime's web site is a worthwhile read.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 03:14 - ID#28585)
ABC interrupted its broadcast to reveal that Clinton's personal secretary has confirmed that she was "coached" by Clinton to lie about the Lewinsky encounters.

This disclosure is final, incontrovertible evidence of a President who not only committed adultery but also suborned perjury from the people around him.


(Fri Feb 06 1998 03:21 - ID#28585)
When the president is telling his own personal secretary to lie about her testimony in front of a grand jury, then it raises many disturbing questions.

Who else has been coached to lie?

Greenspan re: the real situation in Asia...or the state of the money supply...etc????

Rubin re: the ultimate liabilies of IMF aid???

The government employees who compile the CPI...the PPI...or the unemployment figures???

The mutual fund managers who compile cash inflow and outflows???

DOW corporate presidents who oversee their companies profit statements???

The list is endless...the cynicism can only escalate exponentially.


John Disney__A
(Fri Feb 06 1998 03:22 - ID#24135)
they got him?? is this a promise
for farfel
Hope you are right ... listening to Sam Barber songs ..
must switch to horrid rotten TV... better be good.... im
gonna be annoyed if he wiggles out ... This is morning
music time.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 03:27 - ID#224149)
Wow---Look at Vronsky----The women killer ---Likes to step on but finds he is but a reflection of his own shipwreck ----- why ? ---The man is Ego- Bitter ---Last of the abandoned angels----The man that will find Gold in hell---Amen

(Fri Feb 06 1998 03:27 - ID#28585)
It's no longer a laughing matter....scary....reallllly scary.

I've never seen my wife so frightened in her life!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 03:33 - ID#33650)
thanks to John Disney and all of you
for your valuable contributions which enlighten me as
a layman. I am a german lawyer and as such I usually buy high
and sell low. I you will allow me, I will change my habits
with your help. Here are my postions ( for longterm hold ) :
ticker: buying price:
AEM 5.62
AU 3.07
CBJ 6.38
GGO 25.6
PDLCF 1.66
PDG 14.25
SWC 19.04 Any suggestions or hedge proposals?
SSRI 4.6
NCM 1.85 AUD
Rangy 8.36 Rand
FN.TO 34.05 CAN$
EN.TO 23.4 CAN$

John Disney__A
(Fri Feb 06 1998 04:01 - ID#24135)
Im starting to feel like SNOW WHITE
Spoke to the reporter who penned the little gem that Dwarfchap
referred to. Dont know for sure but he sounds about 25 years
old. I asked him for substatiation of the story. He said there
was no substantion but it was the "opinion" of some
analysts - I asked for their names - He would not give
them over - I asked if he had called Evander to check his
story - No he hadnt ( he is in Joburg with them while
I called them from capetowm ) - I then spoke to his
boss the assistant financial editor Bernard Simond ( editor is
in Davos ) and told him - He shared my interest. I told him that
the paragraph had been picked up by an old anti south
african activist left over from Sharpeville. He will
get back to me - If you wish to confirm phone Bernard Simond 02711-2803000

Steve - Perth
(Fri Feb 06 1998 04:14 - ID#284177)
Aberfoyle (Australia)
The brokers are saying that AMP Funds Management in Australia
are looking at buying 19% of ABERFOYLE, which is involved with
Silver I believe.
Stock was A$4, dropped down to $2.20 now $2.45

Will post my news links within 24 hrs I hope ( If I can find the time )

Steve - Perth
(Fri Feb 06 1998 04:19 - ID#284177)
Aberfoyle (Australia)
The brokers are saying that AMP Funds Management in Australia
are looking at buying 19% of ABERFOYLE, which is involved with
Silver I believe.
Stock was A$4, dropped down to $2.20 now $2.45

Will post my news links within 24 hrs I hope ( If I can find the time )

Steve - Perth
(Fri Feb 06 1998 04:19 - ID#284177)
Aberfoyle (Australia)
The brokers are saying that AMP Funds Management in Australia
are looking at buying 19% of ABERFOYLE, which is involved with
Silver I believe.
Stock was A$4, dropped down to $2.20 now $2.45

Will post my news links within 24 hrs I hope ( If I can find the time )

(Fri Feb 06 1998 04:20 - ID#153102)
Big Money Moving ?
2% of BH bought 20% of silver.
10% would have bought 100%.
If WB is fleeing fiat currency, why not buy all above ground silver ?
Another possibility: WB is involved somehow semi-officially in using silver to assist bullion banks in dealing with consequences of gold loan mistakes. Forcing silver price up is strategy. PPT could not intervene directly because silver is not officially monetary. Just a thought. WB still has 98% in greenback denominated assets.

Steve - Perth
(Fri Feb 06 1998 04:20 - ID#284177)
Aberfoyle (Australia)
Clinton is supposed to have had oral sex with Lewinski on
the carpet with the Presidential Seal on it, plus more

Steve - Perth
(Fri Feb 06 1998 04:21 - ID#284177)
How to get lucky?
Clinton is supposed to have had oral sex with Lewinski on
the carpet with the Presidential Seal on it, plus more

(Fri Feb 06 1998 04:42 - ID#358318)
The Smell of Mutual Fund Reports
This Yahoo-Reuters story:
claims mutual fund assets over the last week rose about 1%. But look at the stock markets over the last week. The DJIA for example ( looking at ) has gone up from about 7900 on Jan 28th to about 8100 on Feb 4th, a rise of 2.5%. So assuming that mutual fund assets are mostly stocks, either they have a lousy portfolio or there have been net outflows cancelling out the gain in stock values. And why is the weekly report ending on a Wednesday? Do I smell a rat?

And there are _666_ retail money market mutual funds? I find that slightly disturbing.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 04:55 - ID#251129)

(Fri Feb 06 1998 05:25 - ID#39845)
Gold is reving up again
Will 300 hold?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 05:30 - ID#432148)
Interesting sites, we know most mutual fund management does not regularly earn their keep of course, not even keeping up with the S&P average. You may find this site of interest, it for instance gives the S&P INFLATION ADJUSTED from 1860 to recently. Very eye opening as we are currently above the trend for this period of time.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 05:47 - ID#358318)
Very Interesting- there is a long way to go to the lower long term trend line. As they say in China, "up like a rocket, down like a stick".
Look out below!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 05:52 - ID#432148)
The home page for that site, which I meant to give you is: There is a lot more this fellow gives us free.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 05:56 - ID#39845)
Fasten your seat belts ladies and gentlemen
Gold up $3.10

(Fri Feb 06 1998 05:58 - ID#432148)
Would you please give me the site for your up 3 plus, my usual site says up 1.70, obviously slower than yours. Sounds like we may be getting an up tick ;- )

(Fri Feb 06 1998 06:01 - ID#302251)

...In effect, the process of global
anti-American coalition building is being accelerated...

Thu, 5 Feb 1998 20:46:32 -0600 ( CST )
"STRATFOR Systems Inc."
To: ZIVA, Kitcos Queen, USA.

See Fortune Magazine's article
on Shredder, February 16 issue.

Global Intelligence Update
Red Alert
February 6, 1998

Turkey Emerging as Key in Iraqi Crisis

Diplomatic activity surrounding U.S. threats against Iraq is serving to
redefine the international system on a global scale. As expected, Russia
has announced itself unequivocally opposed to the use of force against
Iraq, and China has sided with Russia in this view. Somewhat more
equivocally, France has joined them in expressing its opposition. Britain,
on the other hand, is standing firmly with the United States. Thus, as the
United States engages in this latest exercise in global power projection,
the forces wishing to limit American global power are coalescing and
coordinating their actions. This is an extraordinary and unintended
consequence of current U.S. policy. In effect, the process of global
anti-American coalition building is being accelerated. From our
standpoint, there have been no surprises in the global lineup.

On a more regional level, we have been surprised and intrigued by the role
being played by Turkey. A Turkish initiative has become the focus of the
bloc opposed to American military action. Turkish Foreign Minister Ismail
Cem concluded a meeting in Baghdad today, stating that mediation efforts he
was involved in would result in Russia or France bringing new ideas to the
Security Council. He specifically went on to say that his extensive
conversations with Saddam Hussein had the support of Russia and China and
that he expected Iraqi support for the new ideas. Both the Russian and
Chinese embassies in Ankara have been coordinating with the Turkish Foreign
Ministry on the matter.

The Turkish presence in the Russo-Chinese coalition, no matter how
temporary, represents a direct threat to the American ability to mount a
major air campaign against Iraq. Incerlik is a key U.S. Air Force base in
Turkey that would be indispensable for waging an extended air campaign
against Iraq. Turkey has underlined the importance of the base with a
series of leaks describing the structure of the air campaign. According to
the Turks, the U.S. air campaign would begin in about two weeks, and would
last from one to two weeks. Among the targets would be eight sites
declared off-limits to U.N. inspectors, including Saddam's presidential
palaces. Also targeted would be launch sites for 320 Al-Husseyn missiles.

These leaks are obviously intended to underscore the importance of Incerlik
to the air campaign. In order to hit the eight designated targets, the
United States would need to use GBU-28 bombs, designed for deep burrowing
against hardened targets. During the Gulf War, these were dropped from
F-111s, which can not be launched from aircraft carriers. The GBU-28 is
too heavy to be carried by carrier based aircraft and would have to be
carried by land based aircraft of some sort. This means that Incerlik is
critical to air operations. Even if bases in Italy were used, the F-111s
would have to cross Turkish territory. For any sustained air campaign
lasting more than a few days, the full facilities of Incerlik would be
indispensable. Thus, the presence of Turkey among opponents to U.S. plans
is more than a mere irritant. Turkey's failure to cooperate is a direct
threat to the ability of the U.S. to mount a credible attack.

To get a handle on the likely course of this crisis, it is essential to
analyze Turkish motives--of which there are several. First, having been
ostracized by Arab states for its entente with Israel, Turkey is motivated
to play Hamlet, even if it intends to cooperate with the U.S. in the long
run. But Turkey has deeper reasons for not cooperating. Turkey is
bitterly angry with the British over their support for the Greek position
on Cyprus. Since the Turks see the British as an instigator of the current
crisis in Iraq, this gives the Turks the opportunity to exact punishment on
the British. But this does not fully explain the Turkish stance, since
they are spiting Britain to please Syria and Iraq, not to mention Greece.

The fact is that the Turks are engaged in more than posturing. They are
deeply concerned about the effects of a bombing campaign on the Kurdish
situation. During the Gulf War, hordes of Kurds crossed into Turkey,
creating a tremendous security problem that is not yet fully under control.
Turkey has already announced that, in the event of U.S. air attacks, the
Turkish Army would enter Iraq to block the entry of Kurdish refugees into
Turkey. Turkey feels that it was left to fend for itself after the Gulf
War and was actually criticized for its handling of the Kurdish problem.
It doesn't want to repeat that experience.

A final, and perhaps definitive explanation, might be found in a minor
matter being processed by the U.N. at the same time as the main crisis is
going on. At Turkey's request, the United Nations committee dealing with
sanctions against Iraq has recommended that Turkey be permitted to store
spare parts for the repair and maintenance of the oil pipeline running from
Kirkuk, in Iraq, to Yumurtalik, in Turkey. The majority of oil being
exported by Iraq under U.N. guidelines goes through this pipeline. Turkey
is both a consumer of this oil and collects royalties from the pipeline.
Turkey was heavily dependent on this pipeline before the Gulf War and
suffered serious losses when it was closed by the embargo. Turkey is
working very hard to open, maintain and expand the pipeline's capabilities.
At the same time that the U.S. is pumping up the crisis, Turkey is trying
to work with the U.N. and Iraq to contain it.

We believe that while there are many causes behind Turkey's behavior, this
last is the most important. Turkey has a vested interest in normalizing
relations with Iraq even though Turkey is simultaneously in political and
military opposition to it. The Turkish interest seems to be the
politico-military isolation of Iraq without an open military conflict.
U.S. policy is running counter to this interest. Adding this to the
Kurdish and Cyprus issues, it is not clear to us that Turkey will sign on
to the American plan. Most important, it is not clear to us that the
American plan is executable without Turkish cooperation.

With the Russians and Chinese in complete opposition to American plans, the
political foundations of the Gulf War coalition have evaporated. If the
Turks oppose the plan, the operational foundation is in deep trouble. The
U.S. cannot afford to lean too heavily on the Turks, for fear of pushing
them into the Russo-Chinese camp, nor can they allow them to decide to sit
this conflict out. Thus, the key to predicting American actions toward
Iraq is increasingly focused on Turkey.

Given all this, we still tend to believe that the odds continue to run
against a sustained American air campaign against Iraq.

To receive free daily Global Intelligence Updates
or Computer Security Alerts, sign up on the web at>, or send your name,
organization, position, mailing address, phone
number, and e-mail address to>

STRATFOR Systems, Inc.
3301 Northland Drive, Suite 500
Austin, TX 78731-4939

Phone: 512-454-3626
Fax: 512-454-1614

(Fri Feb 06 1998 06:03 - ID#39845)

(Fri Feb 06 1998 06:04 - ID#302251)

Date: Thu Feb 05 1998 18:17
mapleman ( COME ON NOW ZIZA ) ID#348127:

I see you may have done a little homework on conspiricies but WW3. I
think any talk of w3 is the setup. I found an interesting tidbit . e
bilderburger group which is said to be one layer inside the trilateral has
115 members - 80 from Europe and the remaining 25 from elsewhere. Guess
who is one of these extremely exclusive members. None other than Slick
willy's golf buddy Vernon Jordon

I do not read *conspiracies*,
I just look at the world around me
and I apply a little common sense.

Read the news this morning ( bottom ) ,
cant you read between the lines ?
I have a very very large family
in Israel, Europe and the USA
do you think that I want WW3 ?

The reason why I am spending my time writing posts is that
maybe, I can help *raise hell* a little,
just enough to avert WW3.

FYI, the Trilateral are using the NSA
to read and/or manipulate thousands of websites on the Internet,
*i*n*c*l*u*d*i*n*g* this one.
I am confident they are reading my posts too.

JERUSALEM, Feb. 5  A potentially serious rift has
opened between the United States and Israel
over the question of Israels response to any
missile attacks from Iraq. Despite pleas from
U.S. officials, Israel is making it clear that it does
not plan to adopt the same restrained vigilance it
practiced during the Iraqi Scud attacks of the
1991 Gulf War.

BTW; my handle is ZIVA not ZIZA.
But, ZIZA sound so good, I may change my handle.THANK U.

Here is something to take your mind off WW3:

BUT!!! dont go to this Gallery as it is much worse than WW3:


(Fri Feb 06 1998 06:08 - ID#302251)

Date: Thu Feb 05 1998 23:41
Isure ( Anothers Posts ) ID#368244:

I just completed the entire list of you're posts, and I would like to know ,
did more than one person write for you? Writing is like finger prints, and
I see more than one set.



You dont have to give us any details about yourself.
You became an integral INDISPENSABLE part of this forum.
When I turn on my computer,
my eyes are always first glancing quickly over all the posts
to see if you posted something.
BTW, how is the weather in Vevey ?

You and Ziva are my favorite posters.
Date: Thu Feb 05 1998 20:21
sharefin ( ANOTHER's transcripts ) ID#284251:
ANOTHER's transcripts updated:

(Fri Feb 06 1998 06:11 - ID#432148)
Thanks, now up 2.80. Let us hope Ziva's prognostication re WWWIII will be delayed. I am still not over WWII which I had to experience. One day we will undoubtedly have it as mans inhumanity to man still exists.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 06:17 - ID#39845)
Goldbug23 Uncle Sams gettin restless. Wants to stamp area with its authority.
Friday 6 February, 1998 ( 6:52pm AEDT )

United States President, Bill Clinton, is reportedly preparing
to send an extra 22-hundred troops to the Persian Gulf as
Washington continues to gather support for a military strike
against Iraq.

The latest moves come after Mr Clinton's meeting with
British Prime Minister Tony Blair in which Mr Blair gave his
firm support for the United States stance on weapons
inspections in Iraq.

Mediation efforts are continuing in Baghdad with envoys
from Turkey, France and the Arab League renewing efforts
to find a diplomatic solution to the standoff.

In what observers say is a move aimed at winning Arab
sympathy, Saddam Hussein, has ordered the immediate
release of all Arab prisoners held in Iraq.

Meanwhile, U-S Defence Secretary, William Cohen, has left
Washington for Germany where he will address a conference
on security in Europe to gather more support for the U-S

(Fri Feb 06 1998 06:25 - ID#39845)
Last thing I need is WW111 also.
Goldbug23, lets hope everyone can sort out this worldwide
economic insanity before it gets to deliberate sacrifice
of many civilians.Type of War at present is deliberate
vandalism of competitors economy.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 06:28 - ID#432148)
This is making me nervous. If Turkey will not let us use our air base there we will not be able to attack Iraq per Ziva's info. But will BC in charge God help us all. Ziva, good info, thanks. Gold now up 2.48 on your site ;- )

(Fri Feb 06 1998 06:35 - ID#30116)
More revelations about the Bubba, and gold goes up, dollar down...

Monkee Person
(Fri Feb 06 1998 06:41 - ID#288105)
( LOL ) What in the world is your wife frightened about?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 06:42 - ID#185448)
Cold Turkey
ZIVA: re your 6:01 post
In my opinion, the scenario that Turkey could permission to use Incerlik as an airbase, is rather neglectible by the following reasons:
1. Turkey is a NATO-member and by that obliged to support ( or at least not to obstruct ) military action of an allied partner.
2. Turkey is eagerly searching for an entry into the European Community. This entry was refused so far because of several reasons ( Human rights deficit compared with EC-members, misbehaviour against the Kurdish people, anti-democratic tendencies within the government, etc. ) . To refuse the permission to use Incerlik as an airbase now, would be regarded as treachery not only to the USofA, but also to EC in general, even if EC ( as the community ) would not participate officially in an air strike. In fact - via NATO respectively via GB - it would.
3. Public opinion within european countries is ( here: as far as policy is concerned ) anti-turkish. Tourism is ( one of ) the main factors of Turkeys economy and has been hammered hard by threats of PKK, targeting touristic centres as main target for political violence ( bombings ) as well as many people in the EC already regarding Turkey as an inpropriate holiday-resort ( because of the reasons mentioned above.

So in my opinion a refusal would be Harakiri for Turkey, both politically and economically.

Monkee Person
(Fri Feb 06 1998 06:46 - ID#288105)
Yep. The most potent gold price counter-measure of them all.
Dollar IS down... 124.13 Y/D

(Fri Feb 06 1998 07:00 - ID#317193)
How many ounces in a ton of gold?
Thanks. Tom

(Fri Feb 06 1998 07:02 - ID#286199)
More on Silver
Silver Supply Shortage Further Bolsters Prices


The battle for silver is under way in London.

Metals traders in London are scrambling to find the precious metal this week after the disclosure that investor Warren Buffett's Berkshire Hathaway Inc. placed a huge bet on silver -- nearly 130 million ounces. With about one-third of the metal not yet delivered to Mr. Buffett, there has been fiercecompetition to find, transport and deliver the silver on time.
Buffett's Silver Chest
Here's how billionaire investor Warren Buffett's investment in silver compares with other world-wide consumers of the metal.
In Millions Of Ounces
1996 total demand 803.3
Industrial 293.4
Photography 226.2
Jewelry/silverware 262.9
Coins 20.8
Buffett's horde 129.7
Sources: The Silver Institute, Berkshire Hathaway
Rates to borrow the metal have soared in the past three days. And the price for its immediate delivery has skyrocketed, a clear sign that traders are struggling to meet their obligations to deliver. Thursday, the London Bullion Market Association tried to ease the traffic jam, loosening deadlines on silver delivery between its members, to 15 days from five.
"More silver is moving than usual to London," explained Susanne M. Capano, a spokeswoman for the association. "It's hard to get [the silver] weighed and transported" in less than a week.
The afternoon LBMA announcement helped to send futures prices higher Thursday at the Comex division of the New York Mercantile Exchange as traders interpreted the delivery extension as a sign of the tighter supplies. In heavy trading, March silver rose sharply for the third consecutive day, picking up 3.7%, or 26 cnts, to $7.28 a troy ounce, after hitting a 9 1/2-year high of $7.47 an ounce. Silver prices have jumped 16% in the past two days alone.
he explosion in lease rates further illustrates the growing tightness in the market. Thursday, the rates, which act like a borrower's fee, shot higher. Those seeking to hold metal for one month were forced to pay 70% of the value of the silver, roughly $5 an ounce. This compares with a lease rate of about 30% at the beginning of the week and less than 3% in normal market conditions. "We're getting the pinch," complains Fred Hammerle, executive vice president of Stern Metals Inc., an Attleboro, Mass., metals fabricator. "We lease metal, and pass it along to our customers. This is a killer." The firm, which leases several million ounces of silver at a time, may have to raise its markup to help pay for the soaring cost to borrow the metal, he added. Berkshire Hathaway's high-profile investment -- and silver's price surge -- could stymie the buying plans offabricators and other industrial users of the metal, traders say. Besides its role as an investment, silver is used by industrial manufacturers of jewelry, silverware and photographic film. Meanwhile, the rush to send metal to London has continued. It started last fall, when Mr. Buffett's firm in Nebraska was acquiring a holding in silver of 129.7 million ounces, about 20% of annual mine production.
As of Tuesday, Berkshire had stored away about 87 million ounces, delivered in London. The heavy demand there attracted a flood of inventories from New York Mercantile Exchange silver warehouses. And as traders watched stockpiles drop to their lowest levels in more than a decade, prices shot up more than 60% since summer. But traders and investors weren't sure where the silver was headed after it left the New York warehouses. For most of the second half of last year,debate raged about whether it was being used up by increased jewelry demand or hoarded by funds.

I can't get to the FTP server to post the entire article, it is lengthy.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 07:23 - ID#358318)
The great silver sucking sound

(Fri Feb 06 1998 07:35 - ID#26793)
Royal Bank of Scotland sees need to "strengthen capital base". Hmmmm

(Fri Feb 06 1998 07:42 - ID#286199)
Bart has the conversions on another page. This is a very interesting site to explore for such stuff. As I recall, it's about 32,150 troy ounces in a metric ton. 1000 Kg X 1000 gm/Kg divided by 31.104 gms per troy ounce.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 07:42 - ID#26793)
I enjoyed your comments on Mr. Buffett at 21:35 last night. I would like to add a point. While silver is only 2% of his portfolio now there could be a dramatic change shortly. Suppose the 98% stock/bond portion of his portfolio dropped only 10% in a market decline, silver remaining the same would quickly bring it up to 4 or 5% of the portfolio.

JOE Smith
(Fri Feb 06 1998 07:45 - ID#24869)
here is a graph of todays action ,and the incomplete drill results as requested by

these results,which are totally incomplete wer delivered to the Australian stock exchange,after suspending both ECM and LEG

Curious action as a result of 20+% gain in stock price

you will have to type in also graph at

remember these results are very incomplete.

full results not likely now till aftre trade monday

any queries

(Fri Feb 06 1998 07:48 - ID#26793)
Bundesbank President pounds fresh nail into IMF coffin.

JOE Smith
(Fri Feb 06 1998 07:51 - ID#24869)
Donald__A (@DA)-dont become an accountant
a reduction of 10% would increade 2% to approx 2.2%

its all academic

(Fri Feb 06 1998 07:56 - ID#26793)
Japan under assault from many quarters over lack of Asian leadership

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:00 - ID#185448)
re your 00:28 post:
I expect Gold-reserve-level of the future European Central-Bank rather to be 20% than 5%. It is a fact that already today, each EU-member has to hand-over 20 % of their CB-holdings of foreign-currency-reserves as well as 20% of their Gold-holdings to the EWI ( Europisches Whrungsinstitute = European currency institute ) in Frankfurt/Germany. ( In exchange they receive a "claim-paper". -sorry, i dunno the exact expression in the tongue of the anglos & saxons. ) . As EWI is dedicated to be the father of the coming CB of the EMU, I am convinced that those 20% are rather an artifact of future behaviour than just a random-figure.

As far as I remember says the Maastricht-traty that gains of Gold-sales by the ( national ) CBs can only be added to the GDP-figures until Dec 31, 1997. As the main problem for the future EMU-participants is and was to meet the treatys criterium of a maximum new debt lower than 3 % of the GDP, I see last years sales of european CBs in this light. - With the implication of a stop or at least a significant slowdown of those sales. BTW - with the exception of the Netherlands and Belgium I was surprised that the figures of european CB-sales in 1997 were much lower as I had expected. France, Germany, Italy and Spain, to name the major Gold-holders, did not sell any significant amount at all!

I also see a big distrust in the EURO within the future participants as far as the stability of the currency is concerned. So it is over and over repeated by EC- as well as national governments that it is the declared intention to implement the EURO as a hard-currency. I see those statements backed by the fact that former soft-currency-nations ( like Italy and Spain but also France ) did not sell gold in 1997.
The hard-currency-bloc ( Germany, Luxembourg, Austria ) as well as the stabile currencies of the northern european countries, who will participate in the EMU from the beginning ( Sweden will not ) request a hard EURO as a major condition of participation.
The rest or at least a significant share of the Gold-holdings of the national-CBs should in my opinion be kept for domestic purposes ( as the national CBs wont be closed but just hand over some of their functions to the EMU-CB ) as well as they serve as a hedge, in case that EMU fails which is not likely but at least possible. As I mentioned: There is still distrust.

Re: Conspiracy-theories:
Like my ol Buddy Ziggi Freud never said:"Even a paranoic may have a real enemy!"

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:01 - ID#344308)

gold up $2.30----......

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:07 - ID#328159)
TYoung: Conversion factors
Conversion factors

1 pound avoirdupois
= 16 oz avoirdupois
= 14.583,333,333,333,3 troy ounces
= 1.215,277,777,777,78 troy pounds
= 7,000 troy grains
1 pound troy = 5,760 grains troy

1 ounce, troy = 0.031,103,476,8 kg
1 tonne = 1 metric ton = 1,000 kilograms = 32,150.746 troy oz.
1 ton ( UK or long ) = 2,240 lb = 1,016.046,908,8 kg = 32,666.667 troy oz.
1 ton ( US or short ) = 2,000 lb = 907.184 74 kg = 29,166.667 troy oz.


For example, in [change golden back to gold!!!]:

30M troy oz is said to be approx. 930 tonnes
From above conversion factors, 30M / 32,150.746 = 933.1 tonnes

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:09 - ID#26793)
Japanese political leader opposed to use of public funds for bank bailouts

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:17 - ID#266105)
@how does it feel

Ziva, you're simply amazing.

As if to know became the fatality
Of knowing things too well.

poet Wallace Stevens

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:17 - ID#26793)
@Joe Smith
You're right. Thanks for the math lesson. You can do my taxes this year.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:22 - ID#258427)
Gold is trying ....
to buck a strong dollar this morning...tough going!!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:27 - ID#330175)
The EMPLOYMENT REPORT(the 'big one'
The consensus estimate is for 240,000 non-farm jobs to have been creaTED and the reality ( ? ) is----358,000 ( Long Bond selling off on the news )

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:29 - ID#26793)
Falling output having serious impact on Chinese growth

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:30 - ID#330175)
The Employment Report
Biggest jump was in construction sector ( YES ) ....Average hourly earnings up .3% as expecTED...Bond coming back already and now only down 5 TICKS..

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:32 - ID#317193)
Thank you. Tom

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:32 - ID#258427)
Don't get me wrong, but...
Why is Kitco frames prices always different from ebn's?? EBN has silver at 7.59 and kitco at 7.39 ... can there really be that much of a difference?? Not knocking Kitco...but would like to know...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:33 - ID#330175)
He ain't "heavy"-------he's my brother
S+P futures up 3.80

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:35 - ID#26793)
Brazilian attempt to stave off financial crisis leads to fistfight in Congress

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:37 - ID#280215)
powmain - 23:47 -- The Market will be down big time on the open.
Which market?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:37 - ID#330175)
This is NOT a joke...................Sweat + "Heavy"
How do most men define marriage? A very expensive way to get your
laundry done free.

The most effective way to remember your wife's birthday is to
forget it once.

Getting married is very much like going to a restaurant with
friends. You order what you want, then when you see what the
other fellow has, you wish you had ordered that.

At the cocktail party, one woman said to another, "Aren't you
wearing your wedding ring on the wrong finger?" The other
replied, "Yes, I am, I married the wrong man."

Man is incomplete until he is married. Then he is finished.

A little boy asked his father, "Daddy, how much does it cost to
get married?" And the father replied, "I don't know son, I'm
still paying."

Young Son: Is it true, Dad, I heard that in some parts of Africa
a man doesn't know his wife until he marries her? Dad: That
happens in every country, son.

Then there was a man who said, "I never knew what real happiness
was until I got married; and then it was too late."

After a quarrel, a wife said to her husband, "You know, I was a
fool when I married you." The husband replied, "Yes, dear, but I
was in love and didn't notice."

A man inserted an 'ad' in the classifieds: "Wife wanted". Next
day he received a hundred letters. They all said the same thing:
"You can have mine."

When a man steals your wife, there is no better revenge than to
let him keep her. -Sacha Guitry

Eighty percent of married men cheat in America. The rest cheat in
Europe. - Jackie Mason

Marriage is the triumph of imagination over intelligence. Second
marriage is the triumph of hope over experience.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:38 - ID#266105)

Aw'right. Hey Ted, this bonspiel of love is cooked,
let's go CURLIN'!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:39 - ID#330175)
Aurator.................and glad someone else is havin probs with their-----------

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:40 - ID#254269)
good morning all. Ted, loved your detailed analysis on the state of marriage.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:41 - ID#26793)
Moody's says Russian short term debt situation same that brought down Asia

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:42 - ID#254269)
Monica index; now up to 65% chance.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:46 - ID#284251)
Something going on @ 8:30am
Have a look at
SPH8 with one minute intervals.
Looks like some bad news came through,
And they just pushed it higher.
Kinda looks like what they are trying to do to gold too - in reverse.
Seems like the volatility is just increasing.

Strange how the market should be rolling over at the moment.
But they just push the futures higher.
Many of the big market caps look who have just gone through the roof look be reversing.
But they don't want them too sell off yet.
Many of the market guru's have been calling for a sell-off here.
But it just isn't happening.
Suppose they just want to hold it here till it builds up momentum.
Then they can push it through the roof.
The final top to a parabolic curve.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:46 - ID#254269)
Midas, Myrmidon; Does the A stand for A team ?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:50 - ID#26793)
Korean gold collection news (or propaganda

(Fri Feb 06 1998 08:55 - ID#26793)
London morning silver & gold comment

(Fri Feb 06 1998 09:01 - ID#26793)
World Bank provides $1 billion to Philippines on "urgent" basis

(Fri Feb 06 1998 09:04 - ID#330175)
Avalon:Good mornin and glad ya liked it! Morning TORT! S+P futures up 4.60

(Fri Feb 06 1998 09:06 - ID#26793)
Weak Japan economy, weak yen, impact on dollar and other currencies

(Fri Feb 06 1998 09:07 - ID#238295)
gold and small caps
Gold flat this morning despite strong dollar. Reaction to news is steadily improving. The shorts and PPT are battling furiously to hold the line at $300. They are going to lose this battle; all they can do now is delay the inevitable a little longer.

This still looks like the final stock market blowoff. Dow 8500-9000 a good bet by March. Small caps starting to outperform. Small caps typically outperform strongly during the final 4-6 weeks of a bull run as occurred last fall.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 09:08 - ID#368244)

Got ' ta say this 1 last time, be carefull, millons of oz. of silver remain in private hands, do not think it is not out there. If your in now, great, but if the price rises much higher, a silver river will flow.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 09:17 - ID#23782)
It looks like what Kitcoites would call a - spot on - analysis.
I will print out and tape to the appropriate locations in the house.
( Kitchen, laundry, and above Her side of the bed.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 09:18 - ID#339274)
FWIW..April gold poised to go down to
291 and March silver to 635.
Looking for next week cycle low.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 09:20 - ID#33650)
WB portfolio
An investmentbanking friend told me some weeks ago that WB
has already sold his stocks and gone into bonds, which has given him a nice profit. A rich buffet that is !

(Fri Feb 06 1998 09:21 - ID#33650)
WB portfolio
An investmentbanking friend told me some weeks ago that WB
has already sold his stocks and gone into bonds, which has given him a nice profit. A rich buffet that is !

(Fri Feb 06 1998 09:23 - ID#237149)
Silver is ready for take off.
COMEX reported yesterday evening a fall of almost 2000000 of Silver in its warehouse! Looks like silver will take off! Gold still remains bearish though, that's strange though. My broker even wants me to go short on gold! "We'll still see the $280 level on gold before it takes off".
Donald_A, I read some of your links here. The one from Brazil intrested me the most. They are working hard to put the economy back on track and they've being doing very good so far. Brazil faced the exact same problems faces by Asia today, but in the 70's. Last year their stock market yield 80%, and I currently hold 2.3% PER MONTH CDB's in Brazil!

John Disney__A
(Fri Feb 06 1998 09:24 - ID#24135)
Sing a song of silver
Cancion Tonta

yo quiero ser de plata
tendras mucho frio
to quiero ser de agua
tendras mucho frio
bordame en tu almohada
ahora mismo

Words by Lorca, Music by montsalvatge

(Fri Feb 06 1998 09:24 - ID#254269)
WSJ print edition articles;

1. Asians starting to sell US real estate properties. Page A2.
2. Germans in Israel market protection against poison gas. Page A1.
3. Stepped up drive for more IMF money. Page A1, column 5.
4. Australia blasts US on Indonesia. Spat emerges over exports. Page A17. ( Aussie exporters facing fierce competition from US )
5. Malaysia prods banks to merge. Page A17.
6. China bank venture is growing bolder. New operation is 35% owned by Morgan Stanley. Page A18.
7. The EMU will be good for the US. by William McDonough ( NY Fed
Reserve Governor ) . Editorial page.A22.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 09:34 - ID#358318)
JohnDisneyA [ROTFL]
As translated by Alta Vista:

Idiot song
I want to be of silver
Son tendras
much cold
Breast to
I right now want to be of water
Son tendras
much cold
bordame in your pillow son

Words by Lorca, Music by montsalvatg

(Fri Feb 06 1998 09:38 - ID#33650)
Ted and his many wives
Thanks. My wife will get it for lunch tonight. I hope she 'll
come back with something like my daughter ( 12 ) yesterday on men:
Men are like toilets: either occupied ore full of sh..

(Fri Feb 06 1998 09:40 - ID#33650)
Ted and his many wives
Thanks. My wife will get it for lunch tonight. I hope she 'll
come back with something like my daughter ( 12 ) yesterday on men:
Men are like toilets: either occupied or full of sh..

(Fri Feb 06 1998 09:40 - ID#358318)
Morgan Stanley has rated commercial metals up to outperform from neutral
perhaps precious metals will come along for the ride

(Fri Feb 06 1998 09:41 - ID#358318)
Morgan Stanley has rated commercial metals up to outperform from neutral;
perhaps precious metals will come along for the ride, or is that putting the cart before the horse...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 10:01 - ID#251129)
Joe Smith Legend Mining

Joe my email came back?? have sent you another, my post on Legend earlier was correct 20,000 tonnes at 3,500 gpt silver I also have the Legend report to the Australian Stock Exchange on the 3 underground drill hole assays.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 10:03 - ID#26793)
My brother works for Bank of Boston. They are very bullish on Brazil and have been doing business there for more than 100 years. BankBoston has Brazilians in high level executive positions. My own view is concern over excessive debt levels by both the government and the public. Strong competition from Asia and weakened Brazilian-Korean partnerships. I don't like their creeping devaluation policy ( or any devaluation policy ) . On the positive side the geography has much going for it.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 10:06 - ID#93232)
Hell, my forty-eight year old bowels work better than this site. I just figured out that my trying to utilize this site frustrates me more than the price of gold...duh. I'm feeling better now...with that off my chest...

Adios and vaya con doritos...hello Kansas City jazz scene for three nites.


John Disney__A
(Fri Feb 06 1998 10:15 - ID#24135)
beer is good for you
for Oris and Aurator
Met producer from alaska today who is here on
business. We drank a lot of beer for vitamin b content.
Also introduced team to absolute to calm nerves which
sometimes damaged from excessive trading.
They send regards and we toasted your eloquence
several times .
- hope they make it back to Capetown without incident.

PH in LA
(Fri Feb 06 1998 10:18 - ID#225408)
Computer translation of Disney's Spanish Silver Song
Lest we forget that computers can't think, consider this ( human generated ) translation of the John Disney song compared to the Alta Vista version:

Cancin Tonta
Mam, yo quiero ser de plata. Hijo, tendrs mucho fro. Mam, yo quiero ser de agua. Hijo, tendrs mucho fro. Mama, brdame en tu almohada. Hijo, ahora mismo. ( Words by Lorca, Music by Montsalvatge )

Silly Song
Mother, I want to be ( made ) of silver. Son, you'll be very cold. Mother, I want to be ( made ) of water. Son, you'll be very cold. Mother, sew me into your pillow. Son, right away. ( Words by...translation by human intelligence )

(Fri Feb 06 1998 10:28 - ID#286262)
best describes operation of this site during important events. Delayed gratification to test us and make us choose the posts to read with care.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 10:32 - ID#254179)

Is trading for CAU suspended. I'm not getting any data this am.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 10:35 - ID#286262)

Who coaches the coach? Is BC that important a player or did they pick a flawed man who's flaws allow him to be removed at will when necessary? A convenient sting operation aginst our president? Who is the president's coach, Rahm Emmanuel? Think about it. Is Tel Aviv running our government? Makes you want to pause before jumping to agree to remove BC. Who will they slip in as VP, a Rockefeller again like Nelson? Then Al Gore would need plenty of life insurance. They almost got Ford a couple of times, allowing Nelson to be pres. Just speculation of course.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 10:39 - ID#287338)
Tug of War
The Gold Tug of War continues! However the Gold Bears rope is slipping as their palms sweat more and more. Their ground will soon turn to mud and they will all slide head first into the margin call pit!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 10:41 - ID#254269)
An Australian viewpoint on Asia ;

ted butler__A
(Fri Feb 06 1998 10:47 - ID#317184)
supply and demand

The streching out of silver deliveries from five to fifteen days by the LBMA would appear, at first, to ease the burden on the shorts and the market, but might have unintended consequences. In a day and age of just-in-time inventory methodology, the LBMA's move could prove unnerving to the large industrial consumers of silver. A tripling of the time lag in silver procurement could threaten production runs and lead to preemptive insurance stockpiling as a precaution against continued delays.

Also, in response to reports of widespread public selling - even if true, this would assume a large amount of expandable refinery production capacity, which would be at odds with all published capacity utilization statistics.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 10:49 - ID#254179)
Never mind earlier CAU posting. Running fine now. Good day all.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 10:52 - ID#298259)
Still trading as usual... last trade 1...ask 1 1/16...last 1 1/16...vol 23,000.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 10:54 - ID#298259)
Still trading as usual... last trade 1...ask 1 1/16...last 1 1/16...vol 23,000.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 11:01 - ID#22956)
This is funny...........
It is not related to gold but lgb says it's OK...

go gold

and Ted, that is Heavy "D"......not Mr are soooo stoopid sometimes, who the hell would buy ECO.....Sheeeeeeeeesh!! Go ABX!

The Hatt
(Fri Feb 06 1998 11:08 - ID#294232)
A solid base for gold over $295.00 is holding well and so it is my opinion!
That the next move in Gold will be upwards and will be in the $25-$30 range. The shorts remind me of a champion boxer who tires himself out trying to knockout some no-name!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 11:08 - ID#372344)
@ DIZZY EL TONTO.....I believe your "tears" are from pain not boredom....
What a cover up man, maybe you can work for BJ, NAH... he needs
someone who is believable. SO now your browbeating reporters to
change their reports, and asking us to contact an ASS. editor who
"SHARES YOUR INTERESTS" to "interpret' for us said article,
how convinient.....Hey maybe that article was also just a "TYPO".....
Here KITY KITY....there KITY KITY.....

Heavy Hitter
(Fri Feb 06 1998 11:13 - ID#403159)
GOLDS waking up. With fury? If not today very soon.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 11:22 - ID#345176)
@ all

Ziva mentioned that this site is monitored by the NSA.

Well, I hope the NSA employees start buying gold and silver stocks for their retirement now.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 11:26 - ID#345176)
@ Jack

Thanks Jack for the PRU site. Excellent one. ( www was missing )

(Fri Feb 06 1998 11:44 - ID#330175)
Mornin Sweat!
Sounds like a good plan to me~~~~~~~~Studio.R: We both have lived 48 years tooooo long ( ugh ) ....Back to Clinton-Blair talk-a thon

(Fri Feb 06 1998 11:51 - ID#330175)
EB.............+ California weather
EB: Maybe you should move ta the 'CAPE' where the sun always shines....Will try and fufill yer request but yesterday is a loooong way off dude...go team gold!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 11:58 - ID#330175)
EB.................could only find ONE but I'm a --------------
MORON~~~~~~~~~~is the DOW crashin yet??

(Fri Feb 06 1998 11:58 - ID#22956)
Morning Call

PRECIOUS METALS: COMEX and NYMEX precious metals futures prices
were mostly lower early Friday in choppy trade, after silver fixed
at a new nine-and-a-half year high in the bullion market in
London. "There's more trade selling in silver this morning, but
there's not much paper in the ring and the market is nervous," one
COMEX floor trader said. COMEX March silver was down 12.0 cents at
$7.160 an ounce early. Meanwhile, COMEX April gold was unchanged
at $300.70 an ounce. See Full Story at

Crystal Ball
(Fri Feb 06 1998 12:03 - ID#287367)
@ 
Interesting that for all the sound and fury, after the gap up on Monday, the SPOOS have been basically spinning their wheels, burning and churning, but not getting anywhere. If SPOOS close slightly lower today, they could be setting up a WEEKLY island ( top ) in the which would be completed by gapping back down on Monday next week. I also think silver has temporarily topped out at $7.50 and should head back to $6.25 before heading up to $9.50 or thereabouts later this year.

Crystal Ball
(Fri Feb 06 1998 12:08 - ID#287367)
@ Ziva
You liked the new name "Ziza." I think the following name could fit you-- Zvoov Al Hakir, because you are the fly on the wall, inconspicuously listening in on the Bildenberger and Trilateralist conspirators. What do you think? It has a nice sonorous ring to it.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 12:19 - ID#238422)
John Disney
your report on use of beer and absolute
is of great interest for me. Alaskians should
handle it well, however, if they mixed a lot
of beer and absolute together, I am concerned...

Sandvik lab reports there are some big guys
interested in pushing gold up, but at this
time they are in minority. They are waiting
for 2 more big guys to shift the balance...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 12:21 - ID#22956)
Crystal Balls....sees alls
You heard it folks. The Crystal ball speaks. Go CB!! The spoos do look interesting. This island pattern is good. Closing sideways last couple-o-days. I would defer to APH or Oldman on this one. But it sounds good to me. I love the island play. btw, I did sell my Silver Spread for max profit ( yes even this 'ignorant' EB made profit ) and will not short this unpredictable mess. I will buy at the next correction, as will MANY others I'm sure. RJ and D.A. have spoken....... ( bowing down ) .....ohmy.

regarding my last is a 'slice'......

In industry news this week, South Korea's central Bank of

Korea said it will buy gold from the local financial

institutions and sell it over time to minimize the impact on

prices. Korean banks have collected about 165 tonnes of gold

from citizens as part of a plan to help restore the nation's

foreign currency reserves.

hmmmmmmmmm.....I wonder how many of you gold-bugs would volunteer your gold to the Gov. for the good of your respective countries as a whole. Not many I presume. And don't blast me about not supporting corrupt gubmnts and other stuff I already know. The Koreans show a great deal of pride for their country with that move. But, I guess they had little choice, no? They are a different 'breed-o-cat'......uh huh.



(Fri Feb 06 1998 12:29 - ID#254269)
Dow at 8198 (up 81 points) at 12.30 EST, volume 300 million shares.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 12:34 - ID#22956)
I do have a question for the Wavers.....Elliot that is...
I have read so many interpretations of where these markets are going. I do not know much about Elliot Wave theories so I must ask. Why such a difference of opinion?? Some say up some say down ( in any market ) . Am I being ignorant AGAIN?? Is the wave theory that open for different 'readings'? Shouldn't it 'read' the same for everyone, or at least direction? APH? Disney's son? Cyclist? someone? anyone?

If you are going to be snide or call me ignorant please just skip this post.

Any good URL's for 'study' purposes? float AWAY.....damn rain is coming in barrels....and the wind almost ruined one of my Avo trees....dammit!
go gold!

John Disney__A
(Fri Feb 06 1998 12:39 - ID#24135)
Easier to drink beer than translate poetry
For trinovant - I think we lost a little something in the translation
For 2bro2b - yes but have you met the emperor of ice cream

(Fri Feb 06 1998 12:44 - ID#339274)
FWIW..Sell OEX between 485 and 488

(Fri Feb 06 1998 12:45 - ID#289357)
EB @ Wavers

I've been a subscriber to Prechter's service The Elliott Wave Theoris for several years, have read all the books, still seems a black art to me. My sense is, that it is good as a guide to probabilities of price moves ( only ) and therefore should be used as a planning tool, not a timing tool. The theory seems to work much better on long-term charts than on short-term.

I'm curious if somebody out there uses the software ( Winwaves ) developed at EWT with practical ( useful ) outcomes....anyone?

Richard Burke
(Fri Feb 06 1998 12:52 - ID#411318)
Elliott Wave
EB: Take aa look ar a brief explanation of Wave Theory at Auger's site Go back to home and click on appropriate title. I hope this helps to get an understanding started.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 13:02 - ID#335190)
Bank of Canada Corporation @ All is Well - Trust your Corporate Banker.
February 5, 1998
Bank governor promises reasonable interest rates

SAINT JOHN, N.B. ( CP )  Canada's top banker promised Thursday that while interest rates may have to go up a little to cool a hot economy, there won't be a return to the high levels of the 1970s and '80s.

Thiessen said inflation control remains a priority of the Bank of Canada, despite a falling dollar and economic turmoil in the Far East.

He said people worry too much about the recent nosedive in the Canadian dollar.

"The message is that the bank doesn't believe there is a confidence problem for the currency so they're not preparing an aggressive interest rate defence when it falls," he said.

"That means that interest rates are not going to rise dramatically merely to support the currency."

February 6, 1998
OTTAWA ( CP )  The national unemployment rate was 8.9 per cent in January

OTTAWA ( CP )  The national unemployment rate was 8.9 per cent in January.
Here's what happened in the provinces, with the previous monthly rate in


*Newfoundland 17.6 ( 17.5 )
*Prince Edward Island 14.7 ( 14.4 )
*Nova Scotia 11.2 ( 11.6 )
*New Brunswick 13.0 ( 12.5 )
*Quebec 11.3 ( 10.4 )
*Ontario 8.0 ( 7.8 )
*Manitoba 5.7 ( 6.0 )
*Saskatchewan 5.6 ( 5.1 )
*Alberta 5.4 ( 5.6 )
*British Columbia 9.3 ( 8.6 )

(Fri Feb 06 1998 13:02 - ID#345176)
@ EB

There are some who follow wave theory for trading decisions. When enough people follow it, three thinks happen.

1. It works good for sometime only
2. It doesn't work always, so results are inconsistent
3. People try to make it fit so they can say it works

See many rich chartists around?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 13:07 - ID#286230)
Wither Trend
Oldman: Do you see a change in the trend of gold after this week?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 13:12 - ID#22956) the black........
You sell your house when the Can$ is tanking. And you finally close and look at it now.....oh damn. But you'll still make a buck, EH?
only one in the black......'cept for the buck...uh huh.

damn crazy currencies whipsawing it's way through profits......hmmm...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 13:17 - ID#258129)
@Silverbaron 12:45
Silverbaron: Elliot wave theory study couple of patterns, main of them - "impulsive wave" that has 5 "legs" ( up - down - up - down - up or other way around ) and corrections, that follow the impulsive wave, and have 3 "legs" in opposite side . There are more such patterns. The length of each "leg" based on Fibonacci values, or more precisely, on figures, build the same way ( each next value is a sum of to previous ) , but using so-called "golden ratio" value ( 1.62 and something ) . You may find some details about this theory here:
Each wave is an integral value of the waves of smaller size, so one can make long term calculations as well as medium, or even intra-day. Here is one of the main problems of this theory - one can say that we are now at a medium-length wave up, other - on long term wave down, and so on. Even more: how to select the staring point is up to the person, who make research. You never know where you are until it is over. That is why so many contradictions in Elliot wave theory fans.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 13:18 - ID#189273)
The reason you see so many different interpretations on the Elliot Waves is that it's an art, not a science. Looked into it in the mid-80's, read a couple of books, etc. Listened to the practitioners on the old FNN. Fortunately, I didn't trade on it.

Don't waste your time. If there are overwhelming influences on human behavior, they'e a lot more complex than that theory could explain.

Go watch your trees blow over. I'm in the big storm, too. One dog's taken to howling like a hound dog. My neighbor's tree is depositing branches in my back yard, but he's missing my fruit trees.

You'll probably do better reading tea leaves than Elliot Waves. If you must look into it, check out Robert Prechtor's pronouncements in Oct. 87 after the crash, basically that civilization that we know it was coming to an end, all was decending into chaos ( sound familiar? ) and he was leaving the business world and retiring to avoid it all. A couple of years later, he was back and saying, oops, spoke too soon.

The Hatt
(Fri Feb 06 1998 13:20 - ID#294232)
They will try and close gold on the downside!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Watch for huge sell orders to enter the Gold market at the close! They may not have their way, yet they are beginning to understand the fear factor building in the market! To stay short over the weekend must take a combination of iron stomach and dead nerves. The close will be VERY INTERESTING TO SAY THE LEAST!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 13:20 - ID#194311) technologies
as to Ballard fuel cells I was calling that to others in academic circles in '94 but not being a stock type just watched with interest in how the "progressive" companies Daimler and Ford hop on board only after someone else takes all the risks....
now here's something so way out yet not infeasible as to make a stock picker drool....Pacific Corp is putting money up for this guy so he maybe onto something. I've been through his mathematics and it seems okay but the real proof is in the experiments which have not been accepted widely I don't think. I know though that if this comes off, the oil companies will be out of work...hard to imagine a world like that really, isn't it?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 13:22 - ID#243180)
Just bought 10 golden eagles from Russ SAvage. He had lowest price so he gets the business. Seems to be nice guy and pleasure to deal with.

Here are some sample quotes ( SPOT=$299.50 US/oz. ) :

AJ&PM: $315
Blanchard: $325
Jefferson: $313.58 ( ***WINNER*** )

Mr. tolerant1 ======== Thanx for the tip.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 13:34 - ID#258129)
Silverbaron, EB
By mistake I have addressed my previous message to Silverbaron, should be to EB. I am sorry

(Fri Feb 06 1998 13:36 - ID#243180)
I haven't been very diligent in following to discussions recently between Mr. ( Bart ) Kitner and Ms. ( Barb ) Hughes. The few correspondences that I have seen leave me disturbed as to the nature of the responses. I must say that some of them were personal attacks as opposed to intellectual discussion of technical PM ( or related ) issues.

I'm not taking sides and will not enter into the fray but could you summarize what the issues are so that I can restructure my current level of confusion.

( If Mr. Kitner and/or Ms. Hughes wish to summarize this may help me also )


(Fri Feb 06 1998 13:45 - ID#269409)
Remember the classic line in "The Graduate"? Where the guy says to Dustin Hoffman that he has just one word..."plastics"...I have just one word, "Silver". World's best conductor ( better than Gold even ) ...Silver, more commonly used for coinage than any otehr metal..silver...the base for all silver/halide films on which the world's photo's and movies are stored, silver....great jewelry material for blue eyed, blondes, ( and dark sultry types....well maybe Gold in their casee! ) ...silver.....

(Fri Feb 06 1998 13:51 - ID#243180)
As a daily surfer on KITCO should know --- The POS was below production costs in the 4th quarter of 1997. Personally, I spent a fortune ( that I really didn't have ) on silver ---then --- the majority of which was purchased around $4.90/oz.

NOW it is different ---- The POG is low compared to where it is going relative to its production cost.



(Fri Feb 06 1998 14:05 - ID#390249)
A Canadian gold mining company is short silver!
Per USAGOLD, a canadian gold mining company is short silver - of all things. Attached is the article which is very interesting.

John Disney__A
(Fri Feb 06 1998 14:05 - ID#24135)
Tough guys dont watch late night tv
for Oris
Do not be concerned. Vodka and beer drunk separately.
Gold Team had NOT tasted Citron flavored DEEP FREEZE vodka before
and seemed impressed.
Believe we need two MORE big guys buying gold AT LEAST.
... trouble on the dwarfland border ORIS .. requires brief
strike to neutralize dwarf propaganda machine ... apologize
in advance..
Trust me little fella, My tears are from boredom....
the pain that I feel for the human condition when I read
your postings is soothed by the profits I have made in RSA
mines enshal'lah they will continue ...
dont forget it little guy next week ahm goin after
Angus ATEBALONEY..... your favorite analyst... who
you MISquoted as saying 50% or so of RSA mines would
lose money 4th quarter ... GONG... wrong ...
Still waiting for PW BOTHA revolution that you called
wrong ...and the big time comeback of winnie mandela
who was gonne burn my house down ... woops.. wrong
again ... House still here and winnie pretty quiet .
Do not wish to bore others with this cr@p. Come
down and visit me little guy... we can talk this over
man to man -- maybe a couple of vodkas would straighten
you out.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 14:09 - ID#339274)
For your perusal and doing your own due diligence:

Psilver Psyched
(Fri Feb 06 1998 14:10 - ID#216217)
Sure you have the correct URL?

Crystal Ball
(Fri Feb 06 1998 14:20 - ID#287367)
@ EB
Take a look at 5-min chart of $INDU. If that isn't a triple top or H&S top in the making, pass the salt, I'm eating my hat.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 14:29 - ID#335190)
182 IMF Governors (Corporations) @ USofA = 18 % of votes (One (1) for each Country ??)
February 6, 1998
IMF board of governors approves quota increase

WASHINGTON ( Reuters ) - The International Monetary Fund's board of governors has given its final approval to a plan to sharply boost IMF funding, the fund said Friday.

The resolution approved by the board would increase IMF quotas by 45 percent to $288 billion from $199 billion.

The extra money, however, must still be paid by individual countries, including the United States.

The United States currently contributes 18 percent of the IMF's capital through its quota, so Washington controls 18 percent of the votes.

Quotas, effectively a member state's subscription to the IMF, determine the level of IMF resources available to member states and a country's voting power.

The quota increase will only take effect once countries representing at least 85 percent of IMF voting power approve their payments.

But many U.S. lawmakers in Congress oppose the quota increase and have threatened to withhold Washington's share.

Since Washington has 18 percent of the votes, Congress could derail the quota increase.

There are 182 IMF governors, one for each country.

The fund's policy-making interim committee approved the quota increase at the IMF's annual meeting in Hong Kong in September, so ratification by the board of governors was a formality.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 14:34 - ID#373403)
Silver vs Gold for jewelry
"silver....great jewelry material for blue eyed, blondes, ( and
dark sultry types....well maybe Gold in their casee! ) ...silver....." LGB

Trust me that silver is out for anything but costume and native jewelry. Platinum is HOT HOT HOT! Gold still holds it's own. I have a whole store full of gold and platinum, not one piece of silver.

High design clothing stores carry expensive silver ( $500+/oz. ) and no jewelers want to touch it when it breaks. Silver is a pain to polish, it's a pain to solder, the stones typically set in silver will not take the heat and need to be removed prior to soldering. People will not continue to spend big bucks on Channel designer silver when no one is around to service it.

It tarnishes in the case! Bad metal, bad!

The Hatt
(Fri Feb 06 1998 14:36 - ID#294232)
Pushing Gold down at the close!
Will help the shorts sleep a little better this weekend!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 14:36 - ID#345176)
Diversity for survival is a must.

Consider a bit of diversity in PMs, chech this site:

Crystal Ball
(Fri Feb 06 1998 14:40 - ID#287367)
@ 
Guess I can put down the hat and salt shaker...$INDU breaking down.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 14:43 - ID#26793)
Why Buffett bought silver

(Fri Feb 06 1998 14:53 - ID#280222)
On Jan 1 Mr Puetz' prediction #5 stated that silver would continue to lead the way upwards for the PMs; and, should reach $10/oz ( min ) by years end......hmmm...He also called for ( a minimum of ) $500.00 gold by the end of '98. ... ( any comments? ) ...

trader ed
(Fri Feb 06 1998 14:54 - ID#373349)
Elliott Waves
Using Elliott Waves, the following projections for Gold Futures
are made: Prices will decline to about 278 before going up to about
315. The S&P futures will very soon, ( next week ) start a major move down
but this is not the start of the bear market. I have made, for me, major bets on each of these projections.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 14:58 - ID#374211)
@ CNN First casualties of New Iraq War are--- 2 US jet Fighters collide in mid air and crash....

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:00 - ID#330175)
This could be a joke
My Favorite Things

Blow jobs and land deals in backwater places,
Big Macs and french fries and girls with big faces,
Lots of nice cleavage that makes willie spring,
These are a few of my favorite things

Susan McDougal and Gennifer Flowers,
Horny young interns who while 'way the hours,
Profits from futures that Hillary brings,
These are a few of my favorite things

Beating the draft board and getting elected,
Naming to judgeships some hacks I've selected,
Conspiracy theories that blame the right wing,
These are a few of my favorite things

Golfing with Vernon and suborning perjury,
Coming out fine after having knee surgery, [Falling down drunk
that required knee surgery - Alt]
Stars in the White House who come here to sing,
These are a few of my favorite things

Meeting with Boris and Helmut and Tony,
States of the Union with lots of baloney,
Winning debates and the joy of my flings,
These are a few of my favorite things

When that Jones bites,
When Ken Starr stings,
When I'm feeling sad,
I simply remember my favorite things,
And then I don't feel so bad
Only the individual sender is responsible for the content of this
message, and the message does not necessarily reflect the position
or policy of the National Education Association or its affiliates.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:03 - ID#31868)
Glad to be of help. Russ is good guy.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:04 - ID#375108)
....1998 has been good thus far for the PGMs, and SWC is starting to reflect it...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:05 - ID#330175)
EB................and the Loonie
EB: Haven't converTED my Can. $ to U.S. YET but the bank-wire process is all set up ( should I wait longer before wiring it to BT ( NOT big trader but Bankers Trust! ) ???...Check yer damn charts dude!

Heavy Hitter
(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:06 - ID#403159)
Gold stocks have still outperformed S&P 500 this year. Makes me
feel better since I took the plunge 3 weeks ago. Hard assets
will outperform paper in the next 2 years. Hands down.
Paper assets are at their highs and hard assets are still
cheap. Buy P.M.'S. Warren Buffet plans on turning silver
for a 3 to 1 profit. Minimum. Silver still has a long way to go.
Buy on dips.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:12 - ID#330175)
Hi from Cape Breton~~~~~~~~~~~

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:13 - ID#287207)
Warren Buffet plans on turning silver for a 3 to 1 profit.
Heavy Hitter: This is important stuff---maybe important enough to justify the hassel of trying to get into Kitco today.

Where is the source of this news?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:13 - ID#330175)
hey "Heavy"
It's spelled buffetT~~~~~~~~~~~

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:14 - ID#217268)
WB and his Silver stake
If, gov't ever outlaws/confiscates GOLD, WB will be sitting pretty.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:23 - ID#374211)
@ IMF Camdessus says Asia crisis is hurting foreign Banks.....Ohh what a surprise!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:25 - ID#243180)
PE: dramatic reduction in dividend
Amongst other investments I'm long about 80 different companies and have just received letter from PECO Energy dated 29 Jan 1998 stating:

"...PECO Energy's Board of Directors voted to reduce the Company's quarterly common stock dividend from 45 cents per share to 25 cents per share ..."

This is a substantial reduction. Statistically this is the only one I've received for quite some time with this type news ( 1/80==1.25% ) . Some what wonder if I care -- the answer is NO --- bring it on and let's go PMs.

QUESTION: Is this a ripple of things to come for the other 79 in my portfolio ? If so, how long before the inevitable for PAPER.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:25 - ID#330175)
kitco spell checker
Selby: It's BUFFETT ~~~~~~~~how bout that sky-rocketing loonie as Thiessen managed to keep his foot out of his mouth yesterday in Atlantic Canada...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:27 - ID#375108)
(Monica's) favorite/favourite thing...
Ted: Greetings back at ya, down there on the Cape!! And a GOLD medal fer yer scandalous lyrics!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:30 - ID#254269)
Buffett, 300% silver profit and gold/silver ratio;

Selbye and Heavy Hitter; your recent posts. If Buffett is looking for 300% prosit, that equates to roughly $20 per ounce. If Gold/Silver ratio stays at
39 ( yesterday's figure ) , then that mans gold at ( roughly ) $800.
If silver/gold ratio drops for some reason to say, 30, that still means $600

Heavy Hitter; what is the basis for your 300% profit figures ? It sound logical to me that Buffet would be looking for that sort of return, but wondering what your basis is.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:31 - ID#252150)
Any Geologists Out There
I need an interpretation of drilling results from a copper miner I'm short.
Approx 80ft cu 3% p/t ag 17 g/t au .41 g/t

This strike length occurs approx 200ft below surface. I know that the cu is good, the au not good, I'm not sure about the ag.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:32 - ID#345176)
XAU down, -0.24

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:33 - ID#243180)
Puetz was correct in his silver analysis. Several posters were attacking him on his calls/puts and he seemed to fade away - I haven't seen his posts recently.

GOLD is a go!!!!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:41 - ID#254269)
Deep secrets in IMF; 6pak your 14.29
Just read your 14.29. The thing I found interesting is the very last sentence/paragraph in that post. This increase was approved by "the fund's policy-making interim Committee" at the annual meeting in Hong Kong so ratification ny board of Governors is ( only ) a formality.

Hope I paraphrased that correctly, but the bureaucrats in IMF are
"running the show" and not the member nations ? Is that correct ?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:45 - ID#345425)
Ted, if you're posting from Canada, it's 'favoUrite'.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:48 - ID#243180)
Myrmidon @14:36
Not sure if U have financial interest in your posted URL but the bullion prices are MUCH TOO HIGH.

Please check this site for a substantial savings over them:

I've dealt with them and many others over the years. I like when vendors post prices based on spot and on their web-sites.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:50 - ID#288295)
EB, All @ Elliott Waves

Here's a good detailed description:

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:54 - ID#345176)
@ WetGold

My only interest in Platinum is through Stillwater ( SWC ) which I bought two days ago. I found the Pt site by searching in order to enhance my understanding of the metal's properties and applications. Thanks for your posted site. I bookmarked it.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:58 - ID#252150)
Howdy Doody Time
Did anyone see the puppet supporting his buddy Clinton on TV this morn.
He mentioned at least twice the need to "educate" the public about the necessity of attacking Iraq. Reminded me of a German in the 30's who was always talking about the necessity of educating the public.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:59 - ID#254269)
Buffett amongst visitors and celebrities at White House.

maybe he was giving Hillary more trading tips. ?

Heavy Hitter
(Fri Feb 06 1998 15:59 - ID#403159)
Why would he go through the expense of taking delivery and paying
storage fees. He wouldn't settle for anything less looking at his past
performance. Besides all the P.M.'s are an out right steal considering
all the trillions sloshing around. Inflation will be here sooner than
most think. Buffett see's what others don't, well in advance. Why
is he considered the worlds most savy investor.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:02 - ID#374211)
@ James...It's all in the width.....
The 80 ft of core close to surface in encouraging, however one
must have the width of that core is it 2 feet ot 200 feet in width,
since then one could multiply the two to get at some kind of
indicated tonnage. The silver content is about 1/2 oz so as I say it all
depends on the width, if this is just one vein a few feet wide no big deal,
however if it is one of a series of large veins a la porphyry type then
it's a different situation...Also it the perception of this announcement
that is going to be key, as you know most people are not really
familiar with what these number actually represent, in other words
the "spin" that management will put on these results for the public...
I would be careful shorting silver and gold mines at this stage, way
too much risk on the upside...good luck....

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:03 - ID#243180)
Myrmidon: these may help also...

I have more ( I think ) if U get bored with these...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:04 - ID#254269)
Dow closed at 8189 (up 72 points or 0.89%), S & P 500 up 8.91 points, 30 yr.
bond at 5.907%. Volume on NYSE 572 million shares. Busier day on NASDAQ with 755 million shares traded.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:08 - ID#243180)
James... fyi OR

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:10 - ID#246224)
Check out Kiwi's 02/6@13:20 link. VERY interesting.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:14 - ID#153102)
Current Coin
Does anyone know the silver content in current 25 cent coin ?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:15 - ID#238295)
Gold and stocks
Gold did quite well today considering the very strong rise in the dollar index. Long heaven is approaching.

Stock market blowoff continues on schedule. A few more weeks to go.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:16 - ID#345176)
@ WetGold

Thanks for both Pt sites, I will look at them very thoroughly. Thanks.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:18 - ID#410194)
Here are the latest Comex inventory figures released after trading today:

Gold: Fell 16,430 troy ounces to 428,613

Silver: Fell 418,964 yroy ounces to to 100,692,233 -A new 13 year low

The stunning Silver stock drawdowns continue unabatedly. The little "breather" that it's prices have taken today is very healthy considering the huge mediatization of the last several days but the weekly close above the $7 level is very significant.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:18 - ID#246224)
300% seems fairly reasonable to me, but..
This has got to be the equalibrium price not the high. He will be selling into demand for many a moon in order to keep the eq$ steady. Of course, just as in his buying, he will keep his selling a secret.

Did someone say an average price of US$5.50 for his buy in??? So US$22 seems a eq$ guessing price??? Could mean a tough ride above that, then below that, etc. This first upswing has been but a hint of the fury to be unleashed. Reminds me of one of those films with the sea crashing over the decks, etc. Sharefin could tell us a tale of two of that action. Time to strap in and ride it out, mates.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:19 - ID#243180)
Weight 5.67 grams
outer layers of copper-nickel ( 0.750 copper, 0.250 nickel )
bonded to inner core of pure copper.
diameter 24.3 mm

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:19 - ID#246224)
Japanese silver buying last fall
Does anyone remember tales of this to the tune of 10's of Mlns of Oz??? What did they know???

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:20 - ID#243180)
To answer your question ------- NONE

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:20 - ID#252127)

Would you please explain for our benefit the concept of tonnage. The weights per cubic ft of host materials in an ore body must differ.
Are there some good numbers that investors can use for the weight of various host materials so a known volume with metal content in %, or ounces /ton, grams/tonne can be converted to a total tonnage of an ore body?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:23 - ID#302251)
Fred, Goldbug23, ANOTHER,
Fred, Goldbug23, ANOTHER,

Date: Fri Feb 06 1998 06:42
Fred ( @Vienna ) __A ( Cold Turkey ) ID#185448:
ZIVA: re your 6:01 post
In my opinion, the scenario that Turkey could permission to use Incerlik as
an airbase, is rather neglectible by the following reasons:
1. Turkey is a NATO-member as.........

........So in my opinion a refusal would be Harakiri for Turkey,
both politically and economically.


You meant: Turkey would not permit........
Very eloquent reasoning. THANK YOU.
BUT, it is CONVENTIONAL reasoning !!!!
In 1998, nothing will be conventional !!!

NOT just politically and economically, PHYSICALLY TOO.

We in the west are used to be brainwashed by TV.
As the Trilateral took over slowly,
we lost our freedom, we are nothing but slaves.
We believe what the Trilateral tells us to believe.
You forgot Waco ?
What did you do ? NOTHING !

Well, Fred,
this is the time to pay for ALL our inaction.
The Moslems are still free,
and they will fight to preserve their freedom.
The Moslems are not brainwashed by our TV
and they think, watching our TV, that we are totally insane.
If you will dare turning on your TV,
you will probably agree with them !

There will be a sharp exponential acceleration
in Moslem Religious Fundamentalism.
Turkey, Egypt, Lebanon, Tunisia, Algeria, Morocco
governments will topple down to fundamentalists soon,
Jordan will fall to the Palestinians.
Soon all the Moslem world will unite,
and with the help of Russia and China, WW3 is hear.
Read my previous posts, I already said all of it before.
This time you reacted strongly to my post

Just remember what Ziva always said:
Look for Turkey as the beginning of this scenario.
Soon, the Moslem fundamentalists will take over there,
and then you will know that the *g*a*m*e* *i*s* *o*v*e*r*.

This is why I predicted in my previous posts
that GOLD will spike so high and so fast
that all of you, probably will *miss the boat*,
unless you already called Bart, as I advised you yesterday.


Date: Fri Feb 06 1998 06:28
Goldbug23 ( Hedge ) ID#432148:
This is making me nervous. If Turkey will not let us use our air base there
we will not be able to attack Iraq per Ziva's info. But will BC in charge
God help us all. Ziva, good info, thanks. Gold now up 2.48 on your site ;- )

Nothing to get nervous about, my dear Goldbag.
You Goldbags have been eloquently complaining
about all the corruption of our modern western leadership.

It seems, as if, the Moslems are reading this forum,

Looking forward to hearing from you tomorrow.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:24 - ID#424345)
Kiwi, Allen: I have been following Blacklight for a couple of years now. There has been a lot of independent confirmation floating around and they seem to be attracting some very credible corporate backing such as Pacific corp. and ( I believe ) Westinghouse. There have been other sucesses in the "cold fusion" area with validation from independent university labs, but they could all just be different empirical rediscoveries of Mills original concepts.

Blacklight as an investment could be the homerun to end all home runs.

However, in recent times a distressingly high fatality ( biological, not fiancial ) rates among independent researchers into alternative energy sources has developed. Blacklight and Mills better have good security....

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:25 - ID#254269)
Buffett and silver; If Warren has 20% of the stockpile, who has the other 80% ?

Is the 80% in fragmented ownership or are there some other large blocks of ownership ?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:28 - ID#246224)
Why would 'commercials' be short 5 to 1 on silver???
And where are they going to get 43 Mln ounces to take care of Mr. Buffett's order??? 2 Mln last night from COMEX. Probably see the same for the rest of this month. Won't that give the skievy-geebies to the shorts, eh??? Any thoughts about what these folks will do when they can't find silver to save their lives? Potentially they will go bankrupt as they try to cover. Borrow silver at US$5, sell. Buy back silver at US$7.50, US$10, US$15, US$20 to cover???

And one more question: Why does Armstrong recommend that people NOT speculate on silver? He is 500 contracts short, no? Must have thought he was smarter than the average shmoe, yes?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:32 - ID#201238)
comex gold stocks
Comex eligible gold stocks fell 16,430 to 122,843 oz. I believe this is the lowest we have seen and represents about 3/4 of an oz per contract on comex. In the past few months increases in eligible gold stocks has preceeded a decline in gold price ( sort of like someone knew what was going on, huh? ) . Let us hope that the continual decline means gold is going up.

I leave it to Realistic to comment on silver stocks!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:35 - ID#201238)
explain eligible stocks
The other night s friend asked me to explain eligible verses registered stocks in the comex warehouse. Here it is.

Ok, let me explain it like this. The registered stocks are like having your
car parked in your neighbors garage, he has no right to it, its just parked
there. The eligible stocks are like your neighbor gave you something and
you gave him the title to your car which he could take under certain
conditions. Both cars show up as being in his garage.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:36 - ID#26793)
Dow/Gold Ratio = 27.47 Last Friday the ratio was 26.14. This is a gain of 5.1% for the week. The Dow is only 70 points below its August 6th high of 8259 ( .0085% ) yet the Dow/Gold Ratio is 3.4% below its high of 28.44. I stick with my position that gold is very skeptical of the Dow rally but this week sure put me to the test.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:37 - ID#316193)
Astute Observation---Why Warren Likes Silver

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:38 - ID#411259)
..... Paid too much .....

WetGold @ Just bought 10 golden eagles from Russ SAvage. He had lowest price so he gets the business. Here are some sample quotes ( SPOT=$299.50 US/oz. ) :
AJ&PM: $315
Blanchard: $325
Jefferson: $313.58 ( ***WINNER*** )

You left out RJ. 299.5 spot = 313 Maple Leaf - Delivered. No other costs.

Savage @ On Jan 1 Mr Puetz' prediction #5 stated that silver would continue to lead the way upwards for the PMs; and, should reach $10/oz ( min ) by years end......hmmm...He also called for ( a minimum of ) $500.00 gold by the end of '98. .. ( any comments? ) ...

Yeah, The guy has made the most consistently harebrained and reactionary predictions for the entire universe to end for many, many months now. By my reckoning, Puetz would have to call every market move for the next decade just to break even with the rest of his irresponsible predictions. I agree with LGB the Puetz is the worlds best contrary indicator.

Heavy Hitter
(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:41 - ID#403159)
Silver in 2 years will be trading above $20.00 and will exceed that number I believe by at least 50%. The other P.M.'s could do even
better since silver has already had a good run. $2000 gold is a
very real possibility in this same time frame. Could be too
conservative. The smart money has quietly been accumulating
for some time. You can't keep printing money and hide it in
equities for ever. The Buffett factor will finally sink in to investors
minds, but at much higher prices.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:43 - ID#243180)
Even a stopped clock is right twice daily ---- doesn't mean we ignore him when he's right. If what you say is true ( ? ) ... I agreed with him on silver and disagreed with him on others -- this is true of most people we deal with... true, avero, nicht ...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:44 - ID#411259)
..... EEEEEEEBBBBBBB .......

EB Boy -

I would call today a dip. You are wise to stay on the long side of this market. Stay away from the Elliott Wave thingie like the plague. Puetz has a better track record the Elliott. Anything can be proven with a chart. In this kind of market, the charts are useless.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:45 - ID#243180)
Heavy Hitter
$2000 ??? ( when ? -- how do U draw this conclusion ? )

smart money ( who ? )

PH in LA
(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:46 - ID#225408)
ANOTHER's message

For doubters among us who claim to have noticed more than one writing style in ANOTHER's posts I suggest that he has on at least one occasion employed someone to go over his writing: Date: Fri Nov 28 1997 19:45 ANOTHER ( THOUGHTS! ) ID#60253:
"After a proof read by one from the west this is a start and should help you understand."

Furthermore, prior to the assignment of passwords anyone could and did post with any moniker they wanted. ANOTHER denied on one occasion that he had authored a specific post ( note the ID# ) :
"One more thing, Big trader left HK some time ago and is now in a waiting game. No posts are from him. The post was not me on this date: Date: Fri Oct 31 1997 16:09 ANOTHER ( thoughtsID#256321 ) Note the ID # and that "thoughts" appear in lower case.

On the other hand, how are we to interpret his comment from
Date: Sun Oct 19 1997 13:41 when he says, "Do the oil states think our military is there to protect them or protect oil?" Whose military is it? Is this a slip of the tongue or a typo intended to read "your"?

Many among us will recall that around 1980, at about the time of the election of Ronald Reagan and the adoption of supply side economics the economic landscape underwent a major change. Interest rates were already at an all-time high ( 23% ) and had nowhere to go but down ( hence the phenomenal and long-winded rise in the stock market ) and interest-bearing paper was suddenly elevated to a position to be worshipped. That change was felt throughout society and the world as we noted lower inflation and low-priced goods in all the stores. The illusion of this change is still with us and reflected in gold via the machinations of the CBs.

When ANOTHER posts on Date: Wed Feb 04 1998 23:23,
"Please understand, that wealth will move into all forms of real assets as the destruction of our debt/ digitial currency system continues. When the currencies move to a final resolution, it will be the marketplace for precious metals that will die first! It is well known that gold will hold its value above everything. All other metals could lose much of the value they gained prior to this meltdown! Remember, when the currencies go to nuclear war, all paper and paper markets will burn! Many hard assets will lose in the public mind as confusion will rule. In the thoughts of many, gold will perform!"
it looks like the opposite will be taking place again. These things do go in cycles. Nothing goes up forever. In Spain they say "no hay mal que dura cin aos" ( there is nothing bad that lasts for 100 years ) . And nothing stays down forever.

Recently, on Wed Feb 04 1998 23:39 ANOTHER says "The CBs have stopped selling/leasing and that has put the entire world of LBMA "at risk".

Silver's awakening, together with W. Buffett's announcement may just be the first outward signals of the changeover to hard assets. In any case, ANOTHER has promised to post tomorrow. I, for one, look forward to his comments.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:48 - ID#26793)
XAU/Spot Ratio = .255 A week ago Friday the ratio was .248

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:50 - ID#26793)
@ Kitco
Gold/Silver Ratio = 41.24 A week ago Friday the ratio was 48.55

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:50 - ID#372344)
@ Jack....That is what makes precious metals so precious....
Unfortunately there is no simple formula for an investor to use to
calculate reserve tonnage on their own, I know mamy mining companies that undertake numerous costly feasability studies, even after drilling off
a property that indicated some types of reserves, because of the nature
of exploration and drilling, which must be done many feet apart, and
the inherant lack of consistency in grade of mineralized ore. In addition
I know of some mines who declare ore reserves, only to find out when they are underground, that it is un economical to mine because of
geological structures or nature of the spacing of the ore or the great degree of variance in grades of ore, etc.... however I have also heard
of many of these cases when they are underground, that they would
point their drills maybe 200 feet to the left, and Bingo the motherload,
such was the case in Hemlo, one of the richest deposits in Canada
that property was drilled many times over many years and only showed
reserves of about 40,000 tons of ore, when new drilling of course
discovered the motherload....Bottom line is "If there is smoke, therre may be fire" indeed....that is what makes precious metals so precious....
The formulas are too legnthy and differ greatly per deposit to post here. I would suggest however,that you go to your public library and ask for a book on geology they usually have a section that deals with calculating and estimating reserves, of course with abovenoted caviat....
Good luck......

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:51 - ID#252150)
Tzadeak & Wetgold
Thanks. Tzadeak--I think/hope it's mostly spin.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:52 - ID#411259)
..... Puetzless .....

Wet Gold -

The age of the universe is not would not be time enough for Puetz's clock to stumble on the right time even once. The guy has an abysmal record and I don't have a clue why anybody would pay him any mind at all. I would rather toss the chicken bones and follow their advice than to give credibility to anything Puetz says.

While this is a harsh indictment, it was Puetz who put out all those wacky predictions. Live by the sword, die by it. A dozen people on this site have a much clearer view of this market than Puetz, and you hold this guttersnipe up for admiration?????

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:53 - ID#252127)
Is it possible?

That Buffett has the PPT ( and we all have our own ideas of who runs the PPT ) in a body lock? If WB were to make public large stock sales from BH's portfolio can one immagine what would happen to the markets.I still feel that Puetz is an excellent anaylist who became impatient with the market manipulations and made predictions.... in response, which in turn hurt his creditabilty with some of us.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:53 - ID#410194)
The emotional calls
Gold didn't go to 350 this week either.

It finished below 300.

Date: Sun Jan 25 1998 17:10
cherokee__A ( @-----the-fin-who-shares-------- ) ID#344308:

share- fin- - -

my 'tickets' to the super- bowl- - - - - - - gold calls- -
the gold options are bought as they become available
and the current ones expire....the strikes range
from 400 to 340.....october400 calls were $30. last
week....these will fit quite nicely with the others...
not a portfolio mind you, just my contribution to the
fiat currencies and their taskmasters......1300 oz currently....
more on high can it go? 2000oz is my goal..
this month...time to up the is only paper......
and the flame- thrower loves paper......

feel like hanging on the to 350+...this week..
450+ before the end of feb......

chryssalis of gold.......from ankle- biter to star- rider.....and the
smoke- signal- mobile will ride shot- gun........ALLABOARD!

!;- - - share- fin- - - - your- seat- on- the- ssm- awaits- - - next- to- donald_a's

Voyeur Professor
(Fri Feb 06 1998 16:56 - ID#231101)
Silver market manipulation

The Princeton Economic Institute has just published a position paper on the Buffett silver purchase. Intrestingly enough, they believe silver prices will decline and gold will rise significantly by this Summer.

Here is the article:

There have been a few analysts who have taken a shot at us trying to discredit what we have been stating from day one. To set the record strait, we have warned that the hype over silver was bogus. We saw NO sudden change in industrial demand WHATSOEVER that would account for a 50% drop in silver inventories. We saw NO truth in the matter that dealers were shipping silver to London on a 3-cent arbitrage. What we saw in this market was aggressive manipulation to rump the price up as fast as possible. Does this mean that Warren Buffett has suddenly become a commodity manipulator? Our reply is ABSOLUTELY NOT!

Mr. Buffett was NOT the trader who executed the orders in this silver market. What we have been pointing out here is that the ENTIRE metals group has been manipulated. Mr. Buffett was NOT that position. He has issued a statement through his company, Berkshire Hathaway, stating that he has bought "NO OPTIONS" and "HAS HAD NO KNOWLEDGE OF THE ACTION OR POSITIONS OF ANY OTHER MARKET PARTICIPANT AND TODAY HAS NO SUCH KNOWLEDGE."

It is our belief that there is a group of people who had knowledge of Mr. Buffetts order to buy and that they tagged along or ran in front of his orders pushing the price higher in order to force him to pay a higher price. It is this group who has been tied to the inter-market activity between copper, platinum, palladium and now silver. This is the group that we now fear has no GUARANTEED exit strategy and is looking for analysts to keep pumping up prices so they can sell into the rally.

According to Mr. Buffetts press release, he would have announced his silver purchase in his upcoming annual report, which in effect placed a timetable on his announcement. Clearly, the aggressive attack on silver was carried out by professionals who then "squeezed" the market as tight as they could. The attack intensified after the NYMEX statement was released arguing that they saw no manipulation on COMEX and tried to claim that they would expect silver to be shipped to London if there was a premium. The backwardation in silver was more than doubled following this statement as many viewed this to be a green light to those behind the squeeze.

By no means is this over. We believe that Mr. Buffett was perhaps forced to make his premature announcement due to increased surveillance in London and erratic price behavior in silver. Perhaps his reference to having "no knowledge of the action or positions of any other market participant" strikes directly at what we are talking about. We do believe that his activity was tipped to others in the market and the front running began. It is this group who seems to be hell-bent upon getting silver up and really fast is directly tied to some sense of urgency.

We continue to remains extremely cautious about this market. Nothing, regardless of who is buying, goes up forever without some correction. The COMEX has now raised margins 28% once again warning that they see some concern for high volatility as well. We STRONGLY urge that clients should be patient about this market and let things settle down. We see resistance at 710, 768-771 and huge resistance at 808. Technical resistance stands at the 724, 788 and 843 levels. Talk of $10 silver may be totally crazy and highly dangerous not to mention irresponsible.

This market could be approaching a 7-year high while gold is making an 18-year low. Our long-term models are warning that the best buy is gold  not silver. We seriously doubt that silver will ever be able to exceed $12 given the huge amount of silver in the hands of retail investors from 1980. They will be eager sellers in the years ahead. The burden for silver is now to close ABOVE $8.08 on an annual basis. Failing to accomplish this by the end of 1998 warns that silver might actually decline for 2 years as gold rallies significantly. We believe that the selling in gold will subside from the central banks this year and that a new bull market should emerge from either the current low, or more likely one more new low in June/July. Percentage wise, gold appears to have a much greater long-term gain than silver.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:00 - ID#243180)
Admiration ???? I have this ONLY for the people who brought me into this world.

While reading your post I detect some problem with Mr. Puetz himself. I learned a long time ago ( maybe 20 years ) that you need to take your personal feeling out of your financial decisions. Although MOST everyone on this site WANTS and HOPES for PMs to "do it" we need to keep perspective. If ( in your opinion ) some of us are too agressive in our "wanting" and "hoping" and gives the appearance ( at least to you ) that they are providing 'wacky predictions' ( your words ) --- keep in mind --- WE ARE ALL ON THE JOURNEY TOGETHER and some of us may be on the fringe but we will reach the PROMISED LAND ...... no doubt ....

Let Mr. Puetz have his opinion and maybe some folks ( in major positions of PAPER ) will see Mr. Puetz as the catalyst toward a PM standard for government ...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:01 - ID#252150)
What's Boris Up To?
Donald's post on Russia's dire situation re: short term loans makes me wonder if this bluster over Iraq & possibility of WW3 is just an attempt to get some leverage with the IMF, which is basically run by the U.S.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:01 - ID#373403)
Warren Buffett
I don't need this guy to tell me precious metals are a fantastic buy at today's prices. The reason I am on this forum is because I already knew it.

I wonder who is secretly accumulating gold as we speak and will announce that they have a large position which took six months to get in place.

Final quarter, last drive, five minutes on the clock....hut, hut, hike...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:02 - ID#254269)
Dow/gold ratio 30 day moving average 27.89 . The gap between 30 day m/a and today's reading

is 0.15% versus 0.27% yesterday. .

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:03 - ID#411259)
..... Heavy What .....

Heavy -

Congratulations on being the latest member of the Puetz-Brained theory of market prediction. Pick a number that sounds good, say the metal will go there, offer no viable fundamentals to back it up, ignore the facts, and then never mention it again when your numbers prove entirely baseless.

The tone of my last couple posts has been a bit hostile, but its storming outside and I am in a cranky mood. These ridiculous predictions take up bandwidth with dribble. Bart, can we have a kind of fairy-godmother, if I wish it hard enough it might come true, please, please, please pay some attention to me although I know not of what I speak, discussion group? I think some people on this site would fit in very well there.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:03 - ID#424345)
Where's my Equilibrium
Arden: People have been talking about the "equilibrium price" for silver. Obviously this price has to be high enough to spur more production to cover the deficit - say at least 150 mil oz/year of new production.

There are some shut in silver mines in the USA and elsewhere.

I was wondering if you have any idea what price level would be required to justify reopening those closed mines and/or generating another 150 million oz of production per year from new prospects.

Any educated guesses would be greatly appreciated. Much thanks.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:04 - ID#243180)
My post @17:00 was for RJ

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:05 - ID#224151)
sipping & musing
IMHO this Big ole Dow Bull is going to die hard....but the Bear is definitely lurking. Its
scent touched off the recent slides to the edgeof the precipice for the Bulls ( Late
October and Last month ) .Thus terrorized the Bulls are off on one final stampede for
survival but events suggest their time has just about run out. The day of the Bear is at
hand. With Gold the situation is just the opposite. The Bear is being brought to bay..and a
snorting Bull is pawing the ground and about to charge .At least thats how it seems to
me after a couple of scotches and a mighty effort to put a positive spin on things at the
end of another disappointing week for Gold. While the short term charts hold much hope
its the long termers that show how much work there is to be done.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:06 - ID#243180)
RJ attacks members for their views - stay tuned
Taking up bandwidth --??-- come on, man.

If U have a "hard-on" for Puetz --- nobody cares.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:08 - ID#424345)
Battle of the Buffet
The sliver shorts may be preparing an ambush soon - a last digtch effort to drive the longs "back to the beaches".

One possibility is to announce sometime on the weekend that Buffet is named in a silver manipulation lawsuit and then stage a bear attack sunday evening in the thin trade of the MYMEX Access.


Yes. But that word more or less sums things up for the commercials and other assorted silver shorts at the moment...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:10 - ID#287207)
Ted: I know Jimmy from Warren I just copied what was on the screen. I never believed all the C$ crashing nonsense anyway. If the C$ rates catch up to the US rates and maybe go higher then the cash flowing into the US may come here. I hope your still here if that happens --otherwise well you know.

Heavy Hitter
(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:11 - ID#403159)
Demand for gold increases almost on a daily basis. Check with your local
coin shops and bullion dealers. Shipments from Canada according to Monex ( largest bullion dealer in the world ) are being delayed for weeks.
However, this demand is driven by some sophisticated investors, not
the public. Public is in love with equities with open arms. As this demand
increases now with Buffett to shead some light on this asset class, you
could see a short covering rally on top of a buying spree. The public
has not purchased P.M.s for years and now you have a bunch of buyers
waiting at the door who previously have been in equities. Now if you flip
the coin around, you now have a bunch of sellers waiting to exit equities.
Look at the late 80's you had the public in love with their real estate and
who was left to buy. Nobody, everyone that bought already bought. The
foreigners are the last ones to buy our market and then the game ends. We are there now.
have them now buying our market.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:12 - ID#411259)
..... Puetz < Zero .....

Wet -

I agree that many here put too much emotion into their decisions. But calling for a 4000 point crash in the DOW because one of a dozen different solar eclipses last year happened either six weeks before or a fortnight after a lunar eclipse, definitely can be described a wacky. I even took the guy up on his offer of his newsletter, 80% of it was just reprinted stuff from other sources. The guy is a joke. That's all I have to say on the subject. I now return control of all Puetz bashing to LGB.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:13 - ID#401237)
1930's Style Manipulation of the Public
15:58 James ( Howdy Doody Time )

Scary isn't it, this guy can twist anything, now war on the horizon. He will run for a third term after he regains control fo the House this Fall. The American people will ask him to guide us onward and upward or at least get us through the War.


(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:14 - ID#252150)
Japan@How Bad Can It Get?
Donald--you faithfully repost several articles daily on the deteriorating situation in Japan ( which I appreciate very much ) re: their banks, insurers, corruption etc. And yet there are many people who think that someone will wave a magic wand & make them whole again. I have no idea how anyone can imagine the JY strengthening appreciably from here. I think that there is a real danger of a reversal that could take the $U.S. as high as 140. Hope I'm wrong, because that would be devastating for AU.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:19 - ID#411259)
..... You are indeed Wet .....

Wet - @ WetGold ( RJ attacks members for their views - stay tuned )

The final hiding place for those who have no more facts to back up their position:

"You're attacking me for my views"

Seems to me the President and the First Lady are getting quite a lot of political mileage out of that approach.

No I am attacking his track record, which is the worst record on this site, bar none. This is not personal. That you defend him so vehemently, allows us all to count your number well.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:20 - ID#252150)
HIGHRISE@Manipulation & Propaganda
Believe it or not I found Blair even scarier than Clinton. Blair was the one who repeatedly spoke of the need to "educate" the public.
The evil twins.

Heavy Hitter
(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:20 - ID#403159)
If gold went to $500 I would be happy. If it does you won't see me buying
any. My purchases have already been made at 2% above the lows. If
one is going to make a good return you have to think like Buffett. He
knows the P.M.s are an undiscovered asset right now. With a strong
demand and a short covering rally I do not have a problem seeing $2000
gold or $20 silver. Suit yourself.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:21 - ID#254269)
@ Crystal Ball; your 14.10. Can you elaborate on your technical analysis

of the Dow ? Thanks for any further comments.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:26 - ID#287277)
James, re:'Scary'--
The 'Powers-that-be' have gone to the text book:

The Control of Ideas
 This process of cleansing our 'Culture' will have to be applied in practically all spheres. The stage, art, literature, the cinema, the Press, and advertisement posters, all must have the stains of pollution removed and be placed in the service of a national and cultural idea. HITLER in Mein Kampf

PH in LA
(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:26 - ID#225408)
Princeton's short position in silver
Voyeur Professor:

The position paper you so generously post goes far towards lending credibilty to the premise widely reported on this forum that the Princeton Institute is short 500 contracts in Silver. They say ( on the upside ) "we see resistance at 710". Indeed. Once more, where did it close for the week today? Oh, and "talk of $10 silver may be totally crazy and highly dangerous not to mention irresponsible"? Yeah, especially to those who are 500 contracts short.

This kind of "position report" lends new meaning to the word "lie". I wonder how LGB reacts to this one. We all know how he hates it when persons in authority dare lie even about their private sex lives. This kind of professional lying elevates it to a whole new realm.

Heavy Hitter
(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:29 - ID#403159)
On top of all that I have never seen such a negitive response from
people about buying P.M.s. You dare mention it to almost anyone
and they almost want to pick-up the phone and call 911 or call
the wagon to carry you away. I'm sure you have to agree. Try
it some time.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:31 - ID#432169)
Buffet and Silver
Anybody consider that the silver that Buffet has may never make it back to the market ..... swap a few Kodak shares for some silver?

Just a thought.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:31 - ID#287207)
Shipments from Canada...are being delayed for weeks
Heavy H. I like to track this one down from up here. What is your source for this. Where can I find Monex on the web?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:32 - ID#254269)
Basic elemtary question; Re PH in LA's 17.26,

What does happen to someone who is 500 contracts short ?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:33 - ID#224151)
If Puetz put his money where his mouth was ( And I like to believe he did ) he must be
hurting.But surely that is penalty enough and one has to give him credit for the courage
of his convictions.He is not the only one who has been eloquently crying wolf for the
last couple of decades. The way things are going one of these days I fear they may be
right. Their arguments seem logical and reasonable but I guess its the old Lesson. The
markets are really moved by Fear and Greed and not reason.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:33 - ID#26793)
Nothing goes straight up or straight down. The dollar is in demand because so many people owe them. It is strong for the wrong reason. Over time gold will beat the fiat dollar as it has since 1933.

Heavy Hitter
(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:40 - ID#403159)

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:41 - ID#411259)
..... No Delay .....

Heavy -

You are new here, unless you posted before under another handle, so perhaps you know not of what you speak regarding Puetz. As for negativity about people buying precious metals, I am a precious metals broker. Lofty theories are fine, but when a client's money is on the line, you need to view the world as it is rather than as you wish it would be.

Selby -

I am shipping Maple Leafs within one week of receipt of good funds. $14 over spot, delivered.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:43 - ID#153102)
@WetGold re: Current Coin
Hmmm. It's not lawful money because it's not gold or silver.
It's not a note either. Wonder if it's even legal tender. Thanks for the information.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:44 - ID#287277)
Deutsche Bank, Credit Suisse, JP Morgan merger talk...remember UBS folks
Hong Kong Business Standard Sat 7 Feb 1998

Indonesian firms' debts said to be understated
Indonesia's point man on the nation's debt crisis said the country's companies owed more than previously estimated, and that his committee would go to work weeding out those debts that could be repaid.
Indonesia's total foreign debt at the end of last year stood at US$137.42 billion ( HK$1.07 trillion ) , with US$73.96 billion of that held by private companies, President Suharto's special foreign debt adviser Radius Prawiro said after meeting the president. Mr Radius, a former government economics minister, is leading a team of government officials and bankers seking a solution to the debt problem. The government had estimated that private foreign debt was about US$65 billion.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:46 - ID#26793)
In defense of Puetz
His predictions are not whacky. They are absolutely correct. His analysis in arriving at those predictions is also correct. His error is in trying to set a exact date to those events. No one can do that except by luck.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:47 - ID#243180)
Please don't place me in a category of "defending" Mr. Puetz ... I only defend the right of others to post their views ( despite their batting average ) .

If you want to attack someone on "smoke-n-mirrors,,,, how 'bout DINES.

Nothing personal - BUT - I think his stuff is from other sources with reasonable predictions added to it. The worst part of it - he attached his preditions to himself NOT IN THE THIRD PERSON but FIRST.

Aside from that let us ( you and I ) say that we agree on somethings and disagree with others. Everyone is entitled to their METHOD of expressing opinion.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:48 - ID#287207)
HH: With the 69 cent C$ I'm not sure I want to call California.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:49 - ID#432148)
Why did Buffet buy silver?
Does he know something we do not? If Ziva's scenario becomes reality he figures his insurance will not be taken by the govt, whereas the govt may try to confiscate gold? Or, after a quick buck? A long buck? Silver can no longer be called the poor mans gold can it? He is third richest man in the world. Is he just responding to a market?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:52 - ID#243180)
I have this discussion with countless numbers of individuals/friends/family/etc and they just don't get. It gets quite frustrating getting the "INFORMED?" public any pertinent information beyond 'blow-jobs', 'whack-jobs', and 'Bronco-ridin'-headjobs'.

My only sense that their is hope at the end of the tunnel is HISTORY -- without it --- we'd be lost.

BTW--That light at the end of the tunnel is an on-coming-train.....


(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:55 - ID#411259)
..... RJ = Monex .....

Since CNN's Moneyline ran a story on silver yesterday, and the CNN cameraman stood on my desk to shoot the trading floor at Monex, I kind of "outed" myself. I have never mentioned I am a broker for Monex before because I felt it was important that my posts were viewed as statements of my own beliefs and in no way representative of Monex.

I thought it was important for people to realized that I have zero agenda. I trade both sides of the market, so I don't care where it goes. I sell gold for delivery, but I recommended to everybody on this site to NOT buy gold. This advice from 348 on down. In all this time, I never mentioned that I am the number three broker at the largest precious metals dealer in the world - 1997 sales: 880 million. I can be found at the below phone number, extension 2262.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:57 - ID#252127)

Thanks; I always said that mining is a tough business and respect those who take the risks to find and develop mineral deposits. Both those minerals that are consumed for the benefit of society, or to create honest money ( au,ag ) .
What troubles me is that -normally- minerals change little in price while development of new facilities always cost more money. Grades generally become lower and government controls and taxes more stringent; while guys like Wayne Angel, former FRM ( probably a spelling error ) talk about a great abundance of natural resources at cheap prices.
Very few miners make real money today. Something is rotten.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 17:59 - ID#26793)
Mahathir says Singapore dollar should be used for Asean trading

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:01 - ID#287207)
69 cents not spent is a $ earned
RJ: I guess if you say Monex is not experiencing a delay in shipments from Canada then I might as well stop trying to rationalize the California phone call.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:04 - ID#26793)
FLASH! Moody's downgrades Industrial Bank of Japan

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:06 - ID#411259)
..... Not personal .....

Wet -

Nobody on this site knows more than I about posting opposing views. I was roundly slammed by Kitco at large when I told everybody last summer that gold would fall below 300. This site is much more tolerant of the bearish view than is was even 8 months ago. I have posted many unpopular views, the vast majority of which were borne out, and I take responsibility for the bad calls I make. All anybody can hope to do when they trade these markets is to make more than they lose. There is no such thing as always winning. I will stand by my record, as others here will also attest. I ask that others stand by theirs.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:08 - ID#26793)
@James, All: Dollar not out of the woods yet. E-Wave analysis

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:09 - ID#243180)
The legendary RJ --then---now
Date: Thu Jan 15 1998 22:25
RJ ( ..... Gold Coin Prices ..... ) ID#411259:

"There has been a quite a lot of back and forth the last couple days about gold coin prices. I have seen everything from some good deals to downright robbery. My main focus is trading metals for profit, as a result I don't spend a lot of time with delivery business, and I am not here to hawk my wares in any case, but I would like to give a baseline from which to compare.

The following prices are based on today's closing spot price of 287.50...

... Like I said, I don't concentrate on delivery business, but many of my clients have taken large deliveries. I can't remember the last time anybody could match my prices.... I am not soliciting business here, as LGB may charge ( Who knows? Maybe not. He has mellowed like a finer brandy ) . I could sell 5000 oz for delivery and still not make the money I can make from one good trading account, but the stuff is cheap and I am finally comfortable enough to sell it. Gold may fall further, 250 - 260, but at 287 it would be kind of like falling out of a first floor window, its hard to get hurt... I am me, and I am here

Date: Fri Feb 06 1998 17:55
RJ ( ..... RJ = Monex ..... ) ID#411259:

... I have never mentioned I am a broker ... because I felt it was important that my posts were viewed as statements of my own beliefs ... I thought it was important for people to realized that I have zero agenda. I trade both sides of the market, so I don't care where it goes. I sell gold for delivery, but I recommended to everybody on this site to NOT buy gold... I never mentioned that I am the number three broker at the largest precious metals dealer in the world - 1997 sales: 880 million. I can be found at ... "

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:11 - ID#26793)
Second Bundesbank official today to slam the IMF

Heavy Hitter
(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:12 - ID#403159)
If your advising your clients not to buy gold I feel extemely relieved
as you so called brokers are wrong most of the time. The number
3 broker or not I have heard recommendations from the best of the
very best and they make plenty of mistakes. Brokers are too
busy selling and pedeling to know much about anything. I'll
sleep better knowing I'm on the opposite side. Brokers are
for losers and I make my own investment decisions. Road
of hard knocks my friend.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:12 - ID#411259)

Selby -

Actually, the 7 day delay is unusual. Normally I can ship within 48 hour of a bank wire. There is a definite tightness in the market for gold coins. VPs also are delayed about a week. I have heard stories of smaller dealers with delays of many weeks.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:14 - ID#316193)
"Wall Street Underground" Is Telling Us The Story..
"So very quietly, Treasury has been printing money to give to their
Asian friends. U.S. money supply has been soaring at double digit
rates. At some point, something's got to give. Silver will soar.

Gold is just as interesting as silver. Gold is selling at less than
its cost of production. Mines are going broke and shutting down,
left and right. One day you will wake up, and the market will
realize that global inflation is taking off. Just like silver,
gold will soar.

Anytime you can buy something under its cost of production, I
regard that as a bargain. When in addition all the fundamentals
scream out that prices must soon soar--when you catch everyone
sleeping--that's an even better buy. Precious metals are just
at that point."

( From the January '98 issue, not available on-line. )

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:14 - ID#287277)
Soros as butter to the world's bread?
South China Business Post Saturday February 7 1998

Soros swoop a boost for Taiwan

Financier George Soros was behind a strategic swoop this week that sent Taiwanese technology stocks soaring, according to brokers. Hong Kong houses were believed to have spearheaded the heavy buying during Thursday's trading, they said.

Taiwan's electronics sector jumped 4.02 per cent, with technology issues accounting for about 70 per cent of market turnover. The benchmark Weighted Index finished on Thursday up 151.36 points at 8,621.97, off a high of 8,626.8. Brokers believe news of Mr Soros - the billionaire
hedge-fund manager - taking a stake in the sector will prompt the entry of other local and overseas institutions.

The stocks are believed to have been bought for the Quantum Fund, which is the flagship of a group of seven hedge funds. The Quantum Group of Funds, which has nearly US$19 billion in assets under management, are
high-risk hedge funds. They are investment funds that bet on stocks,
bonds, currencies and commodities worldwide with BORROWED money. ( caps SDRer ) Hong Kong brokerages were yesterday tight-lipped about their involvement in the buying spree.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:15 - ID#26669)
R J re your post
Relax, friend. We'd long ago guessed you were a big wheel. But down here at Kitco you can hang out and we won't tell anybody.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:16 - ID#255226)
Silver, Gold, SnP
March Silver reached it's minmum objective today at 7.50 ( 1/10 15:24, 2/4 17:58 ) . 7.50
marked the the wave 3 high from the advance which began in Jan.. On an hourly chart
wave 4 was being formed today. Wave 5 up should be completed by tues or wed between
7.65 and 7.75. This is supported by these resistance lines; Monthly Gann line from the
1984 high 7.72, weekly Gann line from the 1993 low 7.65 and the distance from the Jan
low to the wave 3 high added to wave 4 equals 7.70. The WB purchase will mark the top
of wave I. Wave II corrections can retrace all of wave I and Silver likes to retrace up to
80% of the move. Sell Mar Silver at 7.65 or buy puts.
April Gold is not acting well the lack of momentum while silver was screaming does not
provide a solid base for the short term. Look for April Gold to cover the gap at 288 and a
70/30 chance of 275.
March SnP is getting ready to break out and make a bee line to 1100, this will turn out to
be a multi month rally lasting into July or Aug.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:18 - ID#26793)
3 year "sure thing" Yen Carry Trade is unraveling

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:21 - ID#243235)
elliott wave
re: the earlier wave talk, J. Graham of U of Utah and C. Harvey at Duke recently came out with a study of 132 newsletter portfolios for the period 1983-1995. Robert Prechter, elliott wave guru and all-knowing social/political commentator posted an average -10.1% loss per anum.
that's a 10% loss EVERY YEAR OF THE GREATEST BULL MARKET IN HISTORY. even the Beardstown Ladies whooped Prechter. proponents might want to give wave theory some closer scrutiny.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:21 - ID#252127)

Good newsletter, but everytime I read it I would be pissed off, so I stopped reading it.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:25 - ID#287207)
Ted; RJ
Ted: My concern for your welfare is reflected in the article I just found in the Financial Post.

RJ: Thanks for the information. Any product coming from or through Quebec can be expected to be delayed as they are just now installing the electricity after the ice storm that shut down the province for 2-4 weeks. Even raised the price of milk in Ontario.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:26 - ID#243180)
15 Jan 22:25: ".. My main focus is trading metals for profit ..."
06 Feb 1998 17:55: "... I have never mentioned I am a broker... "
06 Feb 1998 18:06: "... I will stand by my record ... "

Nothing personal ...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:29 - ID#287207)
The Weekend is Here
Oldman: What is you view on the current trend of gold?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:33 - ID#411259)

Wet -
Do you see some inconsistency in the repost you made? Actually, at 287, I was still telling my clients to wait. I was quite public here a couple weeks ago when I conceded, to earlier voices than mine, that the bottom was is for gold. Perhaps you will now dig up the two dozen or so posts I made here warning everybody about lower gold prices over the last eight months. Those that have read this forum for any length of time will attest to the absolute consistency with which I warned of lower gold prices. I detailed all my short trades in gold. I didn't claim the bottom, in fact I covered all my gold shorts at 305 - 308, and I was late in joining the chorus that gold would fall no further - which I did not concede until after gold started moving back up and flirted with 300.

I am not even very interested in delivery business. However, I have been an active member of this forum since last summer, and have become fond of some members here. I then read all this back and forth about gold deliveries. I deliver gold. I do it at the lowest prices in the country for the largest dealer in the world. I wait until I feel the bottom is in and then I tell people about it.

I don't know your credentials, but mine are on the table for the world to see.

Heavy -
I'm not trying to sell you anything. In fact, I would turn down your money. You seem to be in over your head.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:36 - ID#411259)
..... 223 .....

Goldbug Omega -

You were on to me in the first month.

Heavy Hitter
(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:37 - ID#403159)
How much gold are you short? In your personal account.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:38 - ID#28594)
A Different P.O.V. re: Gold "Donations"

"...But the campaign has been greeted by some skepticism. Some of it has to do with the armys role in the collection.

Forced to the political sidelines after being disgraced in the aftermath of a bloody coup, the military has been struggling to project a benevolent image that belies the political ambitions of the top commander Gen. Chettha Thanajoro. Many of the first donations were made by prominent gold traders, anxious to post a picture with Gen. Chettha in their shops, located in Chinatown where Gen. Chetthas son is married to the MP, daughter of the neighborhoods leading boxing promoter.
Many urban Thais have become cynical about their government in this time of hardship and find it hard to hand over valuables to a central bank that is widely blamed for mismanaging the currency crisis.

Im so in debt to the banks I dont have anything to donate, says the Bee Kim Heng gold shop in central Bangkok. Why dont they get money from the government ministers in the former government ( who had an average net worth of $14.5m ) .

Pressed, Mr. Poonchai concedes that if a lot of people donate it will help the country. Ill ask my wife what we should do.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:39 - ID#252127)
Donald @ 17:59

Nice to know that we have some nations that wish to remain sovereing entities and are gently detaching from the one world concept.

Heavy Hitter
(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:43 - ID#403159)
In a recent post you stated you missed most of the silver move.
Why? And what makes you so sure you will catch gold when
it moves? I'll tell you why, because your a broker.

Gold & Silver & Platinum Bug
(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:45 - ID#432214)
(RJ)- Any comments on the retail physical demand for silver at your firm.
In Vancouver B.C. one of the larger gold & silver dealers has a daily gold and silver commentary. He states that on the retail side alot of individual investors are trading physical silver for gold bars/coins. Do you see the same trend at your place of work?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:47 - ID#243180)
I am happy that U are correct in some of your positions and I wish it were true for all of us because I think that this forum ( we are indebted to Mr. Kitner ) is one of the finest of its kind.

As for me, I am NOT in the business. I am an investor who has done well for myself over the years. My credentials in regards to PMs is just that - an investor. I am not a day trader and ALL of my PMs are long because I take physical delivery of my PMs. In fact, I asked several months back on how to get delivery from a contract and was advised ( by several folks ) not to do it. My most successful call was that of silver of which I had purchased the lion share of my silver around $4.90. That information was not posted by me on this forum because I don't put myself in the same category as those of you who do it daily. It was a "gut" feeling and rationalized my purchase by averaging down if it went much lower. I may have been wrong and I would have suffered the consequence financially BUT since I am long it doesn't truly bother me because I know ( as posted earlier ) that OUR TIME WILL COME.

WHY DID I FEEL THAT WAY: It was based on KITCO discussion as to the production costs of mines versus its spot price -- to me -- this makes sense.

Let's ( again ) agree to disagree on certain elements of this and move forward...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:50 - ID#401237)


Everything is pretty well orchestrated, War, and all the $500/hour attorneys representing Interns, Stewards and Secretaries. Evidently, Hillary brought back some cash from Switzerland. I understand a Paula Jones settlement is in the works now.

I am beginning to wonder if Gold has a chance, for if they can do all of this other crap Manipulating Gold has got to be a snap.

Just watch the timing of press releases and their content; and their timing in relationship to press conferences and other events.

Maybe they feel it is time for a war. Oil and Auto sales are down; best way to cure that is to run a few tanks around the desert, then have to build new ones when they get blown up.

I don't know what to say about all of this crap anymore - no inflation, bag of groceries has doubled in price, no unemployment, everyone is making more money, everyone downsizing, 370,000 new jobs, no sexual harassment, no sexual relationships, then there are, Sargent of the Army Court Martial, Commander and Chief doesn't matter, Drill Sargent & Female Pilot resign or be Court Martialled. Gold and Silver worthless, yet a guy invited to the White House buys 20% of the market.

I am sorry, but I feel like we are at a some disadvantage under these conditions.


(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:53 - ID#39845)
Desperately Seeking Judy Whu. US Military GPS down again!
Saturday 7 February, 1998 ( 9:08am AEDT )

U-S military officials say two F/A-18 fighter jets have
collided over the Gulf.

The planes were returning from a mission enforcing a no fly
zone over southern Iraq at the time of the accident.

The pilot of one plane was killed.

It's the second mishap this week involving Marine Corps
aircraft, following Tuesday's disaster Tuesday in Italy where
a low-flying plane cut a ski-lift cable, killing 20 people.

Heavy Hitter
(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:55 - ID#403159)
Your right I am in heavy and have made all my purchases. I have
gone out on a limb, thats where the fruit is. Incidentally, I don't use
wise crackering brokers.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:57 - ID#329157)
A Transactional Analysis approach to ANOTHER's THOUGHTS

You may or may not agree with some of this. I look forward
to some interesting discussion. I would be delighted if any
psychology-trained lurkers could add to this amateur analysis.

Let us call in the shrink for a little while and see what
we can discover from ANOTHER's language.

In Transactional Analysis ( TA ) , the mind is considered to contain
distinct "ego states" which are to some extent a reflection
of the development of the mind through childhood, adulthood,
and as a parent. Parent ( P ) , Adult ( A ) , Child ( C ) ego states can be ranked in order higher...lower respectively.

ANOTHER is definitely biased towards
higher ego states. You never see ANOTHER conducting ad-hominem
attacks, or responding in an immature way to other posters'
comments, which is from the "child" ego state.

To summarise the TA ego states:

Parent: Controlling or Nurturing sub-states; historical time frame; replaying learned behaviour.
Controlling Parent ( CP ) : Set rules and boundaries to keep people safe; appear bossy or overbearing.
Somewhat more dictatorial than Nurturing Parent.
Nurturing Parent ( NP ) : Nurturing and caring, possibly smothering concern about people.

ANOTHER makes occasional reference to the past, e.g. "The answer comes from the distant past" so has a sense of history and this also connects to the Parent ego state which we will see is marked in ANOTHER's language. It is also suggestive of cultural differences.

ANOTHER coming from Controlling Parent ego state ( uses very definite "You think" ) :
"You think long and hard on this as the outcome would have been far different from what all think."

Adult: present time frame; rational thinking, discussion and argument; making decisions. The sine qua non of most business communication, and prevalent in ANOTHER's posts.

Child: Adapted or Natural sub-states:

Natural Child:
Genuine feelings - letting others know, letting it "all hang out"
Curiosity, creativity, brainstorming. Immature, emotional

Adapted Child: Developmental social skills, conforming to norms,
unconfident, irresponsible, seeks approval, dependent, easily led,
over-reaction, aggressive, rebellious

ANOTHER never exhibits Adapted Child behaviour. This alone points strongly to someone who has responsibility, professional training, high station, or is trained or bred to shoulder great responsibility and behave in an exemplary fashion.

TA "Drivers": Behaviour modes that people tend to get stuck in:

Hurry up: Rush, may overlook important areas and skip until urgent
Be perfect: Takes a long time, never gets finished
Please people: Focus on emotional response, worry about getting it wrong and upsetting people
Try hard: Always dabbling in something new - but not succeeding or finishing
Be strong: Must always cope, avoiding own shortcomings, show no sign of weakness.

ANOTHER doesn't seem to have a tendency to get stuck in one driver mode; well-adjusted people exhibit behaviours spread across all modes. If anything, I would have thought "Be strong" showed up a little in ANOTHER's posts, although he/she does show humility i.e. "For those of simple thought, such as I..." - Conclusion: ANOTHER is a very
well-balanced individual.

4 potential channels for good communication ( one person's ego state,
communicating with another person's ego state ) :
Adult-Adult: Problem-solving
Nurturing Parent-Natural Child: Nurturing
Natural Child-Natural Child: Creative, fun-loving
Controlling Parent-Adapted Child: Instruction

ANOTHER invariably uses the "good" channels, and does not use the
"bad" channels. Either a "natural" or someone with
good professional training!

Example of P-AC transaction:
"There are many who would take your gold. Read my long post of tonight and place your life in that time. You will feel the threat against your holdings. If it is taken it will be for the good of all. Perhaps it is not bad. In all things, good life is more important."
ANOTHER appeals to the Child ego state, addressing from both Controlling Parent- "Read my..." and Nurturing Parent ( sympathy for those who would lose gold, and addressing feelings ) .

"All would gain from this. The intent is not to destroy the oil market" - Nurturing Parent, educational advice coupled with an Adult ego-state view on the gold/oil idea, ANOTHER speaking as a teacher. Here is more Nurturing advice:
"Nothing is assured! Life is a risk and subject to many changes."
Nurturing ego-state is typical of the teacher or adviser; and when I say adviser I tend here to think of the Mentor or adviser to the King; one who must be very persuasive to get the message across, without seeming to dictate.

There are lots of Adult-Adult ( rational ) transactions. ANOTHER must engage our rational Adult in order to get the message across, have us understand it, and conduct our own analysis. Not just expecting us to accept a belief system.

Kitco posters often use a Child to Parent channel when inquiring of ANOTHER.
"Daddy, please tell us what the gold price is going to do tomorrow! Yes, please!" Think about it.
Some however display Adapted Child behaviour.

NP example: "Schultz, Your view is a good one" This is Nurturing Parent; doing mental "stroking" in TA parlance which is what you do to reinforce people's self-esteem, keep people happy, and maintain good communication.
If I were to do this I might say "Interesting post..."; note ANOTHER always uses unique language with the characteristic cultural-difference flavour.

"For those of simple thought, such as I, gold is good to own." - interesting sentence, since it addresses feelings ( non-Western approach ) and shows us ANOTHER's child ego state. Also: "Today, I stood in the sand and looked for life in the heavens..."

"But, for those of need for reason, read from one who speaks to me:"
Curious- as if ANOTHER is consciously addressing the Adult ego state,
then switches to Parent mode to hammer in the message. Phrased as
if advice is being taken from select "courtly" advisers, although we realise that the information could be from a journal or a business service.

"We will talk today. Have your coffee or tea and bring a clear mind..."
Speaking as a teacher again, Parent ego state, building up enthusiasm,
talking to the Child ego state of Kitcoites.

"Later I will post, then we will truly consider." Inviting us to
engage Adult ego state.

ANOTHER is an accomplished communicator. He/she engages multiple ego states and encourages us to respond in Child ego state and move to Adult ego state.
Just as a teacher, orator, or leader would. As a teacher, ANOTHER
sometimes poses a question ( often rhetorically ) for us to ask ourselves:
"Do you think OIL will be able to collect what is owed to them?"
"If Arabia says, "I will sell oil for $10US a barrel or in gold valued at $10,000" what do you think would happen?"
Effective leaders are aware of the ego states and how to use them to
best advantage. Natural leaders have no problem with this. Ordinary people ( such as myself ) can be trained in such things for business purposes. ANOTHER may in fact be a professional adviser, manager, politician, leader, teacher or lecturer, or one who has moved into one of those fields from an oil/gold/investment background.
Someone like Sheikh Yamani, for example ( not that I am saying Yamani is ANOTHER ) .
ANOTHER could also be an accomplished propagandist, or an agent trained in psychological operations.

ANOTHER is cryptic, obscure, but in a way very precise with language. Note how he/she usually says "I will be away for a time" or "I will be done for a time."; recently ( over the Davos conference period ) ANOTHER said "I will be away for some time" and, of course,
did not show up on the web chat that weekend.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:58 - ID#243180)
WB and physicals
Does anyone know where WB will house the Ag ? Is it at one of his sites or contractor ???

(Fri Feb 06 1998 18:58 - ID#252127)
Prime Adopts Long Term Silver Marketing Strategy

According to conditions and prices, they may hedge up to 40% of their silver production.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:03 - ID#26669)
themissinglink (Silver vs Gold for jewelry)
Link, IMHO you were right on when you mentioned silver's use in native style jewelry. If I could twist your meanings around a bit I agree also that it is unsuitable for the sort of mass produced, anorecticly lightweight production items that the 'merican public has been trained to think it desires. Silver shines best in the sort of massive work that would be unsalable in gold or platinum.

You're right about the heat transmission qualities, tarnishability, et cetera but I would counter with the fact that platinum is a damnation to fabricate and gold in anything finer than 14k wears out too quickly.

As for the native style jewelry you disdain, well, different tastes for different people.

BTW, I talked to another Indian friend today. She said that the Indians she knew would probably not sell their silver into a rising market as it is made into utensils of daily use and festival jewelry with deep personal significance.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:06 - ID#348129)
@Nice Nice Nice
Comex Gold stocks down over 16K ounces. Silver is plummeting even faster. The vaullts are being striped bare but the paper continues to flow. The paper Gold shorts will pay dearly.........

(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:07 - ID#243180)
"... Kitco posters often use a Child to Parent channel when inquiring of ANOTHER. "Daddy, please tell us what the gold price is going to do tomorrow! Yes, please!" Think about it... "

I thought about this but could never explain it as well as you...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:22 - ID#286249)
Please, Another is a gentleman....

" In the past many world governments and leaders, far greater than those today have embraced these thoughts. I and my fathers have done battle with such evil and won! For we have 6,000 years of history as our armor!

That is not a statement made by a woman.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:25 - ID#26669)
Steve Kaplan where are you?
Is anyone else having a problem connecting to Gold Mining Outlook? Maybe its all the rain and snow but I haven't been able to connect to his webpage all week.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:26 - ID#194311)
people, people, people.....
calm's gonna be a long bus ride so let's all settle down and have a sing along.....
"the wheels on the bus go round and round.... pinching or poking the person in front of you....and for
gosh sakes nobody WET their pants's only money.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:27 - ID#316193)
Bart, please excuse~~the latest Drudge Report

Lurker 777
(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:30 - ID#317247)
I wish you would of told me you worked for Monex back in November so we could of done business. I only work with large companies because I buy 100 oz. at a time and don't feel comfortable sending $30,000. to a small firm while a wait for my coins.
I have bought coins from Blanchard, Jefferson and Monex. Monex delivery time took 24 days from receipt of a personal check and Jefferson takes 18 days. Blanchard changed their delivery time and pricing in January and I do not recommend them.

I enjoy your recommendations and analysis of the PM markets and value your input. Would you please elaborate on the following:

1. Explain the Atlas account and how much does it cost to get started?

2. Are there discounts for 100 oz. or more purchases?

3. Will I have another chance to buy Philharmonic below $300.00 each?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:32 - ID#243180)
Why would U think U could buy PHILs below $300 ???

Heavy Hitter
(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:32 - ID#403159)
Encouraging post. Goes to prove demand is strong. We are clearly
very close to something meaningful. It's like a loaded spring, could
go anytime now. I for one will be waiting to see how the media makes
up all kinds of stories when it happens. This could be a 10 to 1 payoff
when it happens. Smart money will laugh all the way to the bank.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:34 - ID#330175)
SELBY...............and the Loonie
Selby: You must have missed my earlier post today where I said I haven't moved any of my R.E. money out of Canada YET and my 'game plan' is to hopefully watch the Loonie break .70 and then ride it ever higher but I will NOT watch it go below .70 again if it passes that magic ( for me ) number....I have set up a bank-wire at CIBC+ BT and the trigger finger is itchy.....

(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:35 - ID#26793)
@Old Gold
Responding to yours at 16:15 on a stock market blow-off in a few weeks.
I suppose it could happen but let me make a few points in support of the position that the top of August 6th will hold. In the six months since that date we have had billions of fresh money every week. Still no new high. That is not typical of a bull market. Since August 6th we have new information about Asia, serious deterioration of currencies and new competition with low priced goods. Not the stuff of a continued bull market environment. Adding to that we have a crisis in the White House, renewed trouble in Iraq and lack of support for our military adventures by former Desert Storm allies. Not the stuff of a bull market. If we need more we have master stockpicker Warren Buffett picking silver, not stocks. Not the stuff that happens in a bull market and all this is new information since August 6th.

The only thing that the eighteen year old bull market has going for it is residual momentum from novice players. If we get a new high I don't expect it will be a spectacular one.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:37 - ID#330175)
Any CURRENCY traders 'out there'
Specifically someone who follows the Canadian Dollar vis-a-vis the U.S. Dollar??

Mr. Mick
(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:41 - ID#345321)
WSU & Nick Guarino
Long on fluff, short on substance. Nick hasn't said anything you can't learn here for free. I want my subscription money back.

Lurker 777
(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:42 - ID#317247)
I have bought all of my Philharmonic's under $300.00. ( Spot - $286.00 )

(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:43 - ID#23782)
As a teacher, ANOTHER sometimes poses a question ( often rhetorically ) for us to ask ourselves:

"Do you think OIL will be able to collect what is owed to them?"

That was a question I asked on 1-10-98 21:50.

I asked the question of him because of the extreme nature of his
assessment of an extreme situation.

His reply at 1-10-98 23:49

It will come outright or thru the increase in value of metal owned after an oil for gold bid.

Please comment further on this exchange.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:48 - ID#411259)
..... Silver Shortage?? .....

Lurker 777 -
I think your questions can better be answered by e-mail. I am at

As for physical demand of silver, its the same around the world. One thing many people do not realize that COMEX stocks at 250 million oz 18 months ago did not include 49 million oz at Wilmington Trust - a good chunk of which is owned by Monex clients - which was added to the reportable warehouse stocks in January of 1997. The true picture of the draw down in stocks becomes much more clear when we subtract the 49 mil oz from Wilmington. That is a 200 + million oz draw down. All this silver still exists is some deliverable form and will find its way on the market again. There is a liquidity problem with the silver market, not an actual shortage.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:48 - ID#286249)
CJSI--Another's Thoughts examined...
Enjoyed your thoughtful post. My 'contribution' is the observation that--for me, at any rate--his education in governance has been in the long tradition of his country. Do not these words fit your description?

"Exalted, highly esteemed, and honored--he does not use these to be arrogant toward others. Astutely intelligent and possessing sagelike wisdom--he does not use these to place others in difficulty. Quick-witted, fluent, agile, and universal in his intellectual grasp--he does not employ these to gain precedence over others. Strong, resolute, brave, and daring--he does not use these to cause injury to others. When he does not know, he asks others; when he lacks an ability he studies; and even when he possesses an ability, he always yields to others. Only thusly does a man develop inner power."
Xun Kuang ( who wasn't cast aside during most of the Chinese communist era )

(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:50 - ID#243180)
Do U only do PHILs ?

I try to keep diverse with PANDAs. EAGLEs, MAPLEs, PHILs, et al. Do U think this a good strategy OR are PHILs more FINE than others ?


(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:50 - ID#194311) technologies
are you serious about researchers getting bumped off? Do you know of any...or have you read about any?
A research project of mine involves extracting energy from the rotation of the earth ( a giant flywheel ) using a gyroscopical couple device.

I've often wondered if big vested interests would nail me if it proved to be economically feasible.....this thought really sickens me if this is what humanity has come to. A humble scientist working for nothing more than the betterment of humanity and towards continuation of the species and he gets killed for that very reason.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:52 - ID#330175)
Where the hell are YOU

(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:52 - ID#243180)
Problem with W-Trust, et al is the fee paid for storage. Do U have any numbers ???

(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:53 - ID#411259)
..... PS .....

7s -

Remember........ I was still badmouthing gold in November.....

(Fri Feb 06 1998 19:56 - ID#288295)
Ted @ Canadian vs US dollar

I'm not a currency trader, but here's a chart - sort of looks like gold did until a few weeks ago. Maybe our Elliott Wave gurus can interpret this mess...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:01 - ID#330175)
Mucho gracias my friend!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:02 - ID#411259)

Wet -
As I understand it, Wilmington charges 1/3 of 1% of the dollar value of the metal + a little for insurance. My own storage prices are a bit higher because certain costs of moving and handling the metal are figured into storage charges. When I trade silver, I trade in 1000 oz bars and have only ever had one client who took delivery of one of those big bars. He painted it white and used it as a doorstop at his car dealership.

7s -
VP below 300????????? If spot gold hits about $286, I'll be able to deliver VPs at 299. Could happen, but I think the 280 level will hold if there is a dip. I think it is more likely we have seen the last of 280 gold anytime soon.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:05 - ID#330175)
India holds key to Buffett's Silver gamble

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:06 - ID#411149)
223- I can't get into the Kaplan site either. I called him yesterday
to see it it was still up and he said it was, but I sure can't access it.

Tally Ho

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:07 - ID#330175)
India holds key to Buffett's silver gamble(more direct)

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:07 - ID#315256)
@ RJ attack posts
Why all the attacks on RJ? One of the most valuable contributors to this forum? One of the few genuine, high level, knowledgable, close to the market, big time players?

Just because he has the audacity to state with honesty that Puetz's record as analyst is totally abysmal? This baffles me. It reminds me of the CLinton support at any cost types who would defend ole Bill even if he mowed down a room of pre-schoolers with an UZI. Oh well, it's Friday, mellow out and buy silver on dips!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:07 - ID#300202)
Just sittin' here man, watchin-feelin the tension, laffin at the sniping.
Lots of power in words generated via keyboard-brings out manliness-
something like C.B Moonshine from Reserve. I feeeeeel gooooood!!!
Be back in an hour. X Files on. From one X file to ANOTHER!!!! Hope
he's back on tonite. He wakes everyone up & stills the waters. See
ya soon Kitty Kat Kop.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:08 - ID#329157)
sweat 19:43
I am sorry I did not notice that ANOTHER was quoting you, sweat.

Date: Sat Jan 10 1998 23:49
CMAX: You are exactly correct! Follow your thoughts. good luck
SWEAT: What quantity of GOLD, paper or physical, has OIL traditionally purchased on an annual basis?
From 1991, appx. 20m/oz./yr., now it is more.
How much paper GOLD is out there ready to be squeezed?
Over 14,000 tons.
Do you think OIL will be able to collect what is owed to them?
It will come outright or thru the increase in value of metal owned after an oil for gold bid.

Clearly ANOTHER is responding to you from the Adult ego state. The response to CMAX looks like a mental "stroking" and the Nurturing Parent ego state, then switches abruptly to answer your question from the Adult ego state. This would be more convincing in real life, since we do not know how long ANOTHER spent between composing the two answers. But most people tend to keep the same ego state ( s ) during a piece of communication.

That wasn't an example of a rhetorical "teacher like" question from ANOTHER, but I hope the following will serve to illustrate that point:

Date: Fri Dec 12 1997 23:29
If oil says "I am currency" and I will buy gold for $10,000/oz.. Then gold will be at that price. Then all the bullion reserves will ballance debt for oil states.

If Arabia says, "I will sell oil for $10US a barrel or in gold valued at $10,000" what do you think would happen?

If I had gold I would get oil very cheap!

Or if I had only US$ I would have to pay the higher price of $10.
In this day this cannot be, in that day it will look correct. This has been discussed for that time to come.
I will be gone for a time.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:09 - ID#42365)
hey i found a panda from 1987 and its numbered is it still considered bullion or is it actually a numismatic, the jewelry shop salesman said the were askin the spot price for it???!!!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:10 - ID#426220)

Silverbaron ( Ted @ Canadian vs US dollar )

Gentlemen: Tomorrow golden-eagle ( PLS delete the extra "en" ) will post a the following study at its website, which will blow the minds of the U.S. Fed and the Central Banks of a number of countries, including - REGRETTABLY - Canada. It's title is: "WHEN CENTRAL BANKS SELL GOLD, THEIR CURRENCIES DEVALUE."

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:16 - ID#401237)
This is really to much! We knew months ago what Moris was doing when he called the Prez.: but The Prez, at the same time. Sick
Leland did you read this - the first I have heard this report off tapes.

If this is all true, and the President goes down, what will Gold do. Congress discussing impeachment.


(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:17 - ID#286249)
CJSI, with wonder...
"The Demeanor of the Scholar and Gentleman:
When he plays the role of a father or elder brother... his demeanor should be relaxed and his manner should be dignified, grave, inspiring, correct but comfortable to be around, noble and imposing, broadminded, enlightened, and calmly at ease. When he plays the role of son or younger brother, his demeanor should be attentive, and his manner should be temperate, confident, helpful, honest, constantly striving, respectful, exemplary, and unassuming."

I find it astonishing that thousands of years of human thought converge in cyberspace on Kitcos board!

Lurker 777
(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:19 - ID#317247)
WetGold: I personally like the Austrian Philharmoiker one oz. 999.9% pure gold bullion coins. The coins have the highest monetary face value of any gold coin ( 2000 Shilling or $160.00 U.S. ) and are the biggest seller in Europe.

RJ: I hear but sometimes I don't listen.
I remember in 92 I swore I would sell everything I own and buy all the gold I could if bullion coins ever got to $300.00. I started buying Phillies in December when they were under $300.00 each. Recently I have maxed every liquid asset and am poised to buy again but not unless I see $300.00 Philharmonics one more time. As you know I buy December 1999 270 put options for insurance so the most I can lose is around 10%.

Heavy Hitter
(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:20 - ID#403159)
RE: Silver .
You failed to deliberate on demand from the public if and when inflation rears it's ugly head.or any unrest in the gulf. Or for that matter
any uncertainty. Supply would dry up overnight. Those short
sellers would be financially ruined. If we do get some bad news
and I think the good news is behind us watch out.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:24 - ID#330175)
Caper ---for when you return from X-files(if you can still see straight)
Reserve 'shine'---ya ain't foolin around t'night buddy...Last time I drank some CB ( Pier ) shine I was with buddy Eddie and afterwards I ran into a tree ( really it came out of nowhere and slapped me in my moronic face ( ouch ) ....Tomorrow we have plans to do a repeat so in the MEANtime I'm just a countin the hours till I can get even more mindLESS ( my ) ....Well off ta the basement ta throw ANOTHER log in the monster ( Enterprise coal-wood furnace ) that I bought ( used ) from a great old gent from yer home town of Glace Bay.....Talk about HEAT ( WOW ) ~~~

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:26 - ID#28585)
@HEAVY HITTER...JUST REMEMBER...INFLATION IS ALREADY HERE...'s in the stock market in the form of the largest stockpile of savings in American history.

Any unexpected left field event that sends investors "repatriating" even a mere 25% of their savings into consumption will cause so-called low inflation to skyrocket into the double digit zone.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:27 - ID#329157)
SDRer__A 19:48
Your quote from Xun Kuang is most impressive- it puts it most succinctly.
Your notion of an "education in governance" is something I would tend to agree with, as a perception of ANOTHER's background.

I've seen mention of ANOTHER being middle-eastern, or Asian, as explanation of the non-Western flavour. On one side there are quotations which seem Arabian in origin but could be Asian, and mentions of deserts, but there is desert in the far east too I believe, and it could be simply creative writing. The gut feeling I get is more middle-east than Asia. The timing of the posts bothers me. If middle-eastern, a lot of them would have to be made in the small hours; I can't be bothered to wait up for them in real time, and I am in the UK; they would have to be a few hours later if posted from the middle east. If ANOTHER is a regular traveller to America, the timing would make more sense. If ANOTHER is in Asia, timings could be consistent with early morning starts.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:27 - ID#401237)
HM & PRIME silver forward sales
In certain circumstances, Prime may enter into forward sales transactions for a maximum of 40 percent of its estimated
annual silver production in each of the subsequent five years if forward prices exceed certain targeted amounts.

Parker added: ``It appears that the fundamentals are in place for a continuation of the recent silver rally. As a result, the Company has no current plans to place positions in 1998. However, we believe it is prudent to position Prime to take
advantage of the significant increase in the silver price over the longer term.''

Prime is a precious metals mining company which owns the Eskay Creek and Snip gold mines located in northwestern British Columbia. Homestake Canada Inc., a wholly owned subsidiary of Homestake Mining Company


(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:27 - ID#411259)
..... Oh, NO!!!! MY Limes!!! .....
7s -

If you already have gold, relax. The worst that could happen is you will miss out on some of the move. 280 gold is a possibility because we just saw it, but I am under the increasing belief that all the metals will move higher soon. Buy platinum instead.

I gotta' go save my lime tree. The damn 40 mph winds and El Nino rain is knocking all my tender blossoms off.

EB -
None of this Tender Blossom Boy stuff, ya' hear?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:29 - ID#372344)
@ vronsky...keep an open mind though at least on the case of Canada....
Nice to see you posting again.....When it comes to physical Gold ,I just wanted to remind every one that at least in the case of Canada, we
have an ernormous amount Gold in the ground, ready to be mined on a month's notice...also, Silver, Nickel, Zinc Platinum, Palladium,Copper, Oil Water, YOU name it we got it....reserves are outlined, and mining plans are just temporary hold waiting for the price of Gold to move up a bit....
We currently produce about 160 tons per year, and can double this
easily....The Government can involve itself with the Gold mining
industry by giving incentives to miners, such as it did in past, in return
for their Gold....don't write Canada off, who ever does will be in for
a very nasty SURPRISE!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:29 - ID#330175)
Vronsky................not a good move by Canada to do that and------
I'll check out yer site tomorrow for the grim news...If the loonie could only temporarily get back ta .72 I'd be out in a flash!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:30 - ID#330175)
RJ...............and Lime Tree
I feel yer pain

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:33 - ID#28585)
IMHO...The Clinton Protection Team does it again....

Who leaked the grand jury testimony?? The CPT.

Who called up his secretary's attorney's today and threatened "her" with the wrath of the Prez?? The CPT.

Who is suing Starr now for contempt?? The CPT.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:33 - ID#330175) that you've cleaned up yer act
Do you have an opinion on the Canadian Dollar vis-a-vis the USD

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:35 - ID#39845)
Great White Boner Scandel !
Lewinsky sinks her teeth in at Mr G.W. Sharks residence. President
pulls more than muscle and tendons. Fleeing the scene of his
midnight romp FBI agents spring from bushes and gang tackle
what they think is an intuder. Slick Willie is found massaging
his dicky knee.

Heavy Hitter
(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:37 - ID#403159)
Yes, inflation is here. However investors don't realize it until after
the fact. They only believe what they read in the newspapers.
Then it will be too late to buy inflation hedges. The
reality is they still are stuck in low gear brainwashed into
deflation hype.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:46 - ID#348129)
@CAMDESSUS Looking for $90 Billion
February 6, 1998

IMF appeals for extra funds despite attacks

WASHINGTON ( Reuters ) - The International Monetary Fund appealed Friday to member countries to support a $90 billion package to help fight global financial crises amid threats by U.S. lawmakers to scuttle the plan.
 The IMF's board of governors, which represents 182 countries, approved a resolution that would increase IMF quotas by 45 percent to $288 billion from $199 billion.
 The money would help to replenish IMF resources drained by last year's multibillion-dollar bailouts for Indonesia, South Korea and Thailand.
 The proposed increase, however, would only take effect once countries representing at least 85 percent of IMF voting power approve their payments.
 The United States, which contributes 18 percent of the IMF's capital through its quota and controls 18 percent of the votes, could single-handedly derail the package.
 In a speech in New York, IMF Managing Director Michel Camdessus appealed to lawmakers in IMF member states for support.
 "We know that we must work hard to merit their support," he said, without singling out the U.S. Congress.
 "At the same time, however, we trust that the wisdom of legislators everywhere will lead them to see how much the IMF does to support economic well-being in their countries and around the world."
 Many U.S. lawmakers oppose the quota increase and have threatened to withhold Washington's $14.5 billion share of the package. They say the money would only go to support repressive, corrupt or incompetent regimes as well as help to bail out foolish investors and lenders.
 The Clinton administration says U.S. leverage abroad would be eroded and the IMF would be weakened if Congress rejected the funding requests.
 Although the administration has won crucial support for the IMF from key Republicans and Senate Democrats, lawmakers say the fight is far from over.
 Republican Rep. Jim Saxton, chairman of the Joint Economic Committee, introduced a resolution Friday calling on the IMF to sell bonds to raise money rather than rely on the United States and other countries for financial support.
 "U.S. taxpayers shouldn't be forced by politicians to foot the bill for struggling Asian nations," Saxton said. "I would suggest that the IMF exhaust all private resources before reaching into U.S. taxpayer pockets."
 Next week, the Clinton administration will face one of Congress' most outspoken IMF opponents -- Republican Sen. Jesse Helms, whose Foreign Relations Committee has called a hearing on IMF funding.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:47 - ID#330175)
yeah,sure there's no inflation------------
But somebody please tell that to the gov'ment of Putney Vermont as our property taxes are sky-rocketing....

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:55 - ID#409286)
Voyeur Professor (Silver market manipulation) ID#23110
I don't know if I believe or not, but it was a very good post.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:57 - ID#243180)
I bough some bullion today and the guy told me the same story regarding its face value. Knowing the face value will never ( never??? ) be realized due to the premiums -- why care ?

I like PHILs but is that a substantial reason - I don't know ...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:59 - ID#348129)
@$$$Looney Tunes$$$
The Quebec separatist leader Lucifer Bouchard could single handedly derail the Canadian dollar and plunge Canada into a full blown crisis anytime. He is threatening an election this year, followed by a referendum
( number 3 ) sometime thereafter.
The fundamentals of the CAD are quite good but the Sword of Damocles
overhangs it.
Of note, 60 minutes will have a piece this Sunday on the Quebec language police and how the English language is outlawed.
I know of no other democratic western nation where this is tollerated.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 20:59 - ID#346277)
We know your pouch is full, start practicing hitting some of these nails
on the head, instead of splitting wood. The blanks on this bandwidth are
much more delicate, ever tried a silver hammer with brass finishing nails? Check with Ted,re: your application , outdoor decks , wet blanks love big
nails and heavy hitters.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:00 - ID#260433)
I hate be the bearer of bad tiding fellas but I think somewhere on this planet someone is splitting a gut laughing at all the energy being spent on trying to analyze the ramblings and mumbo jumbo of Another. We have guys going into thousands of word essays on Transactional Analysis and stuff trying to figure out what Another is saying and I think he is pulling your leg. Poop, lets face facts here guys, we are dealing in a metal whose sole and only use ( because of it's price ) is either in jewelry or industrial use. Unless someone invents a process that requires massive amounts of gold to manufacture gold it is only useful as jewelry and how much of a market it there for that? The long and the short of it is I think gold will go a lot lower, my estimates are $140 an oz, before it goes higher. I hate to say it but Another's writings reming of the sort of thing I might have written 35 years ago when I was high on stuff that was illegal at the time. Yup, you guessed it, I inhaled. By the way would all the Elliott wavers check in with their 30,90 and 120 day forecasts for the price of gold?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:01 - ID#243180)
Knowing your opinion of Puetz -- how 'bout DINES ?

Heavy Hitter
(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:03 - ID#403159)

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:06 - ID#243180)
I had some correspondence with Barb Hughes regarding delivery of contract. Is there a contract that delivers Eagles/Maples/etc on delivery OR is it only "assay-able" bars that need to be re-assay-ed on resale ???


Heavy Hitter
(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:07 - ID#403159)
I got a good laugh. Thanks
How about a platinum hammer with
some titanium nails. I wonder if
that could penetrate your hard

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:09 - ID#372344)
@ Ted....... CANUK$........yah I just had a shower
Although the figures would say different, Canada is still considered a
resource based economy, this is one factor which will positively effect
the Canadian $ as the price of commodities like Gold, Silver etc go up
So if your a Goldbug, you should llike the Cdn$ for that reason alone.
The fundamentals looke very good as well G. Thiesen Gov BK CDA
came out fighting this week saying "inflation" is a concern which
is a code word for "we will raise rates to defend the $" I noticed it rose
nicely after that statement. In addition I see a scenario developing where
the US economy is starting to overheat, buying those cheap imports and so those US trade deficits are going to moon, maybe 220 Billion or more
so the US$ wil collapse on its own weight and since Canada is the biggest trader with the US,a higher Canadian $ will be needed to lower our exports to the US and help reduce their Baloooning trade deficits.
The Canadian $ has only one way to go and that is up....maybe .72US
in a few months, and certainly .75 to .77 in ayear...all of course JMHV....

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:11 - ID#330175)
MoReGoLd...............and loonie tunes
Lucifer is scary and did you know quebec has a bureaucracy to monitor babies names ( SICK ) ....But is it surprising!---Will check out 60 minutes~~

Lurker 777
(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:13 - ID#317247)
Maples and Phillies are both 999.9 pure gold and the premiums are the same. Maples have a $35 US face value and Phillies are $160.00 US so why buy Maples or any other bullion coin. If CB's sell 15,000 tones this weekend I move to Austria.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:16 - ID#255284)
she's a bit warm
And the world turns..

From the soft underbelly, life looks a little different. Rather than the storms and rain lashing RJ's little blossoms, ;-}} ( just once ) we are having a heatwave ( 90+F, 90% Humidity ) and once-in-a-century droughts. Auckland has entirely sold out of fans - there are none to be had, there are none in the warehouses and none on the warves. Electric fans could be sold at a great premium this weekend...

Worth their weight in gold.



(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:17 - ID#348129)
@TED / Quebec
Didn't hear about the babies thing yet. The latest row is in Montreal's chinatown, where the language police want to prosecute restaurant owners whose chinese letters are bigger than the french translation.
Pass me some of tham thar Frenchie egg rolls............

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:21 - ID#330175)
Tzadeak..................Where are you in Canada?
Thankx for your detailed explanation on the fundamentals for the Can. Dollar and I certainly hope you are correct...What scares me is quebec has been behaving ( ? ) themselves for a change and the Loonie has still taken a beating and it's only a matter of time until the RACISTS start their nonsense again....Muse: Don't rattle his cage ( he bites )

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:24 - ID#372344)
@ Moregold... Lucien , Shmlucien....NO Referendum...French are sick of it....
The recent Ice Storms in P.Q. have demonstrated to the French how
badly they need the rest of Canada, was it a God send, maybe....
Canadian soldiers were sent in to rescue and help with the clean up and are still there very appreciated by Lucien.... polls show 68% of Quebecois are sick of hearing about separation....their ecomony is
tanking...they are not going anywhere....
You talk about 60 minutes and the French language Police...
this is US propaganda for it's own citizens as a warning, since estimates
show that the Spanish population there is going form about 25% in
15-20 years of the polpulation and they will want their own language ESPANOL, in schools etc...Blacks are wanting their language and so the plan is to show how divisive a second or third official language is to a country by showing Canada , BULL.... Just look at the Swiss.....

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:25 - ID#401237)
Heavy Hitter (FARFEL)

"Inflation is Here" Agreed BUT:

If a tree falls in the forest and there is no one there to here it, did it make a noise?

If the public is told that inflation does not exist, and they believe what they are told, does inflation exist? So much is in the perception of the public.

Did the Gas chambers exist? At the time of their existance many were told that they were going for a shower.

We believe what we are told and than are we are dead?

"Gold is no longer a valid investment", we are told. "We live in a new paradigm."

Todays lies seem to be have a long life. One has the felling that they can be reinforced with a false picture forever.


(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:26 - ID#330175)
MoReGoLd................and quebec
This is true!! There is a gov'ment agency in quebec ( lower case ) that monitors new babies names and certain names are out-lawed ( I know this sounds like a joke but it is reality ( ? ) in the province where 82% of the dependant people heat their houses with electricity....Turn em into 'boat people' and then they'd really have a distinct society...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:26 - ID#220325)
Thank you for your 18:16 post. It is appreciated

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:28 - ID#30116)
TZADEAK* -- The problem with 'gold in the ground' is that you have it in your hand when you need it. Canada did a dumb thing by selling their gold reserves out. It will be hilarious to watch the Central Bankers bid up the price of gold to stabilize their currencies. Then it will be sad. Inflation is always and everywhere a monetary event.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:29 - ID#411259)
..... Away..... To See Blues Brothers 2000 .....

Wet -

Since I deal with individual investors, I never ship bullion unless the client insists. Then we ship either JM or Englehard bars, period. We sell no other kind of bullion. Everything we ship or receive is through Brinks, Los Angeles. I have never had a problem with assay costs with Hallmark bars. I even bought 60,000 oz in 1000 oz Bank of Nova Scotia silver bars from a client who had to dig them up with a backhoe. Paid him 9 cents under spot, as I recall. No other costs at all. Since Brinks is our receiving facility, if they accept it, they are responsible that it is what its supposed to be.

I have never heard of a problem with major bullion coins. Leafs and VPs sail through. Since few individual investors take delivery of gold in bullion form, those 10 oz bars are scarcer than you may realize. There are handling costs that make it more expensive to take delivery of bullion than coins. Additionally, one cannot sell a fraction of a gold bar, so you would have to sell in 10 ounce increments. Coins can be parceled out oz at a time.

7s -

The reason your delivery took three weeks is you paid by check? There is a 10 day hold on all personal checks. No one in the country will ship gold until funds have cleared. I prefer to do all business by wire transfer. The transaction is instantaneous and I ship immediately

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:30 - ID#401237)
The Abortion Bill

President Clinton looks up from his desk in the Oval Office to see one of his aides nervously approach him.

"What is it?" exclaims the President.

"Its this Abortion Bill Mr. President, what do you want to do about it?" the aide replies.

"Just go ahead and pay it." responds the President.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:31 - ID#372344)
@ Ted my 21:24...
Quebec isn't going anywhere....they just want the rest of Canada to
"show" they care...but they really love Canada...only about 25% are
hard core separatists....BTW I am in the New Municipality of Toronto
but have many relatives in PQ....

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:31 - ID#330175)
I don't have the faith you do in quebec-french but yes,amerika ain't no utopia either....

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:34 - ID#330175)
Panda...................long time no see-----------
and I totally agree with your last post!...Anymore 'dead Kennedys' recently?

Heavy Hitter
(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:35 - ID#403159)
Thats it. You said it. This is where it is until the next shoe drops.
Good thought and well placed. Thanks for the post.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:37 - ID#411259)
..... Forget Face Value .....

It will never come into play. Pick the VP over the leaf because it is non-reportable. Everything else being equal, I prefer the quieter route.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:38 - ID#372344)
@ Panda...
I truly don't believe that it was Canada's idea to sell Gold....I think
they did so with someone's hands firmly around their neck....
as far as Gold in the ground, well it's the same as a mine that sells
forward, that Gold is also in the ground until they mine it out....
The BIG difference is that Canada's Gold in the ground has not been
sold, and so if Gold skyrockets as they say in SA we'll have
"BLUE SKIES".......

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:39 - ID#30116)
TZADEAK* -- The recent ice storms highlighted NOT the need for the greater government, but the folly of centralized planning. Hydro Quebec was a socialists dream come true, but from a logistical viewpoint, it was a disaster waiting to happen.

Isn't it foolish to generate your electrical power hundreds of miles away, send it down fragile transmission lines, and call that reliable? I call it centralized planning to the max From many points of view, you are better off generating power locally and connecting to a power grid to share loads and excess power generation.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:39 - ID#300202)
Careful with ur words i.e. vis-a-vis. Ur gettin anal-yzed. Kitco
Kats will be quoting u for years to cum. This site is good in the mornin'
Friendly Aussies ( much like C.B. ers ) , Donald etc. At night-everyone
screamin' to be heard. Anyway-source believed to be reliable Ted says-
approx. 14,000 jobs ( don't scoff ) comin to C.B. ( Provincial Decentralization ) after next erec errr election-providing Liberals get in. Source has never been wrong. Finally Capers can buy gold. Provincial
jobs of course.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:39 - ID#35767)
I have made a great profit buying calls on the Canadian Dollar. A bull is born. Canada has all the pro people stuff in place/ The US is a Farce! People will realize it in spite of the Stk mkt and the false conomic figures designed to keep funds flowing into the US bubble from overseas. This will all justly end and truth will come forward. GO CANADA/ PROGRESSIVE COUNTRY OF NORTH AMERICA!! I aman American of DAD having come from TO.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:40 - ID#220325)
Please ignore the criticism and rest assured that I among many others consider your one of the top contributors to this site. You have been honest in your appraisals, right or wrong and a man of integrity. We cannot afford to lose people of you,APH's and Vronsky's calibre among others. We need your guidance.Thank you for your efforts on our behalf. What would we do without the likes of the aforementioned.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:40 - ID#330175)
Tzadeak...........I read yer previous post(actually I read ALL yer posts)
and I do hope you are right but after only five years in Canada I've grown very skeptical of quebec~~~~and I resent having to read french on my damn Wheaties when 'they'have their ridiculous sign laws...No double standard Argos!

gert frobe
(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:41 - ID#43147)
Ray & 223 re Kaplan GMO
I can't get thru to this site either.
Wrote to Steve; he wasn't aware.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:42 - ID#330175)
ROR---------------bernie sanders(lower case) is great too

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:44 - ID#330175)
CAPER----------------are YOU on the Reserve
SHINE?~~~~~~~~~~~~~~go team gold!

Heavy Hitter
(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:45 - ID#403159)
In your best judgement with short covering and high demand where
could the price go?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:46 - ID#330175)
Panda(21:39) there you go again-------------
Tryin to be RATIONAL~~~~~~~~~~~~~

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:46 - ID#243180)
Reportable ???

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:46 - ID#432148)
I still think when you are truly financially independent you could be another Michener ;- )

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:47 - ID#28585)
The baby boom generation ( excepting Viet Nam Vets, ghettoized minorities, and immigrants ) , raised in an atmosphere of comfort and plenty, having spent their teen years ingesting copious quantities of marijuana and LSD, currently sedated with prozac and hefty mutual fund balances...are completely indifferent, blase, oblivious to any portents of imminent systemic dangers.

Other than a small percentage, they have never experienced dearth and their minds, that is something that only happens "outside America"...

They will never believe it until it is staring them right in the face.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:48 - ID#330175)
If my thoughts(DUH) are disjoinTED it's cause I'm watchin
HOCKEY ( Pitt 2 Buf 2~~~~~~~~and like Gerry Ford I can't do TWO things at once.....damn it

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:48 - ID#372344)
@ Panda...interesting you should mention that.....
About the Hydro cables, I just heard this week that the new plan is to
have the Hydro cables butied under ground, that would certainly help
in Ice Storms, as far as the Goverment me a good one....

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:51 - ID#432148)
Gert, Ray - Kaplan
Have been getting Kaplan on this site - no problem:

Bill Buckler
(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:51 - ID#257234)
Gold Technicals
Looking at the technical aspects of Gold, the 100-day MA on a weekly bar chart is something else. The MA has been challenged at least six times since Gold hit $US 416 back in Feb. 1996. It has been challenged again over the past two weeks, and so far, it is holding firm.

If you have visited the study of Gold bottoms since 1976 at my website, you will have seen that each previous bottom was signalled by a breach of this 100-day MA. Back in October, when Gold climbed to $US 338 intra-day, the MA was breached and I called what I termed an "aggressive" buy signal. It was aborted within a week.

A lot of people on this forum have called a bottom since Gold broke back above the $US 300 level in January. Technically, IMO, it simply hasn't happened yet. On my charts, I will regard a bottom as being in if we get a weekly close above both the 100-day MA and above the recent $US 306 high. BTW, if that happens, the recent Silver boom will look a lot safer too. Don't forget, Mr Buffet has already bought his.

The Gold bottoms page is at

All my other Gold pages have now been updated too.

PS I haven't posted here lately so I don't know if there is still a problem with "dashes" in web addresses. If there is, you will have to cut the URL from this message, paste it into your browser, and get rid of the dashes. Cripes, there's THREE of them.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:53 - ID#30116)
Ted -- Howdy! I'm just biding time, and waiting for the inevitable. The White House thing just won't go away. Now we hear the phrase, 'Executive Privilege'. Hmmmm, this sounds remotely familiar. So history repeats, but not in the same exact way. One thing I know, Slick will not leave without considerable persuasion, like a Marine escort out?

So, Warren Buffet likes silver , eh? :- ) )

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:54 - ID#300202)
@Ted(Pulleeeeze-No One Jump My Bones-I'm Not Racist)P.QP
P.Q.-La Belle Province. My opinion only. Jesuit Priests in the early
days said-Frenchmen: u be the farmers ( & hence prosper ) . Englishmen:
u be the shopkeepers ( prosper-NOT ) . Meme Chose: Germany-Jews: U Become
The Shopkeepers. The rest is history. ROR-what r u drinkin????

Bill Buckler
(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:54 - ID#257234)
Bart and Steve Kaplan
Bart, forgive my previous post. I see that the URL now renders perfactly - which is better than I spell sometimes.

Regarding Steve Kaplan's site. I was there about 90 minutes ago. Had no problem getting in.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 21:57 - ID#243180)
Bill Buckler
Mr. Privateer ---- I remember your posts ( site ) from mid 1997 ---


(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:00 - ID#30116)
TZADEAK* -- Don't get me wrong. The folks who did the design of the power transmission system overbuilt the lines on purpose. No one could have forecast a freak storm such as that one was. No one plans for four inches of ice on transmission lines! Never the less, the systems flaw was exposed, and boy was it a big one!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:01 - ID#300202)
Like waiting for Godot. TZ-Enjoy ur posts-may not agree all the time-
but u got balls. Always click on ur words.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:04 - ID#201238)
Equilibrium price for silver?

GFD - you ask the question that is being Buffetted throughout the globe!

As I told a dear friend today, I have a smelter settlement sheet where I was paid for silver at $35 per ounce and gold at $635 per ounce. I was taught to believe that, as perhaps you were, that the supply demand curve intersects at whatever the 'market place'determines the price to be. I guess with that background, I am not really impressed by silver at $7, in fact, as I recall, the last time I was long silver was at $10 and I was stopped out at $9. My point is that we view the market in too short of terms. I believe it was the esteemed RJ who said that we were at an equilibrium price ( if it wasn't RJ, pardon me ) for silver, that the fundementals did not support it. I guess my response to the whole question really is two-fold. First is the supply side and second is on the demand side. On the supply side, silver is sort of in-elastic. In the short term, silver production does not increase with price. If you are already in production, then you try to maximize income which means you mine and process ore to maximize your cash flow. Your plant capacity is fixed, therefore, you can not process more ore. At $5 per oz silver, you are already processing the 'best' ore you have in order to survive. Thus, as prices rise, you rationalize ore grade and actually process less silver through your plant! New or increased capacity is a much loneger term project which has lead times depending upon permitting requirements and capital availability.

On the demand side, I am not impressed with $7 silver. We have a long way to go. The public has not even become close to thinking about it. If so, why would Dow stocks be selling at a PE of 30 and a yield of 1%?

May be I am too old at the ripe old age of 'almost 50', but I thing we have a ways to go!

Now, since this site has become so acrimonious I would like to invite anyone to send me an email address and I will put you on my new list reserved for friends. If , at any time I am bothering you, let me know, and I will drop you from my list. I pass out my comments and thoughts from my heart, only with the best intentions, and only to those who want them.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:06 - ID#401237)
Heavy Hitter


But, it seems that we keep waiting for the next shoe to drop. I find it very difficult to invest in this environment of miss-information.

Of course there is a possibility we are in a transition from the "new paradigm" back to the real world - reality. If this does happen there are going to be some very depressed investors.

MSFT @ 158 vs 40 They are being sued by 11 States and the Federal Government, The loss of Asian sales so what? Doesn't matter!

Stocks like this just keep going up. PE of 54 OK just means it will go higher - RIGHT!

DOW back at 8200 and projected to keep going. Asian Problem does not exist anymore!

Presidential Impeachment - Doesn't Matter!

War - No Problem!

What is the PE now on the DOW and S&P ?

Does anybody know how many US$ have been printed in the last 12 months?


(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:07 - ID#330175)
Panda....Why didn't Warren tell us months ago?
Caper: ROR doesn't have to drink ta think ( ? ) the way he does~~~he's HIGH on Dickie Gephardt ( har har har ) ....and Teddy ( the murderer ) Kennedy

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:09 - ID#300202)
Goin thru to Ont-speed thru P.Q. everytime. Bad experiences at restaurants-gaz bars everytime:English versus French. Quite often
I get-At Least I try to Speak English. I'm limited to: Ouvrez La Porte.
French teachers in Glace Bay??????? Ques que c'est la big idea?????
You know what I meeeeeean. Chantilly Lace & a Pony Tail.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:09 - ID#300202)
Goin thru to Ont-speed thru P.Q. everytime. Bad experiences at restaurants-gaz bars everytime:English versus French. Quite often
I get-At Least I try to Speak English. I'm limited to: Ouvrez La Porte.
French teachers in Glace Bay??????? Ques que c'est la big idea?????
You know what I meeeeeean. Chantilly Lace & a Pony Tail.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:09 - ID#300202)
Goin thru to Ont-speed thru P.Q. everytime. Bad experiences at restaurants-gaz bars everytime:English versus French. Quite often
I get-At Least I try to Speak English. I'm limited to: Ouvrez La Porte.
French teachers in Glace Bay??????? Ques que c'est la big idea?????
You know what I meeeeeean. Chantilly Lace & a Pony Tail.

gert frobe
(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:09 - ID#43147)
Kaplan GMO Site Access Problem
Still getting a "network error" everytime i try to go to
GMO. This must only be happening to certain browsers.
I am using Netscape.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:11 - ID#153102)
@WetGold re The Price of Gold
Words take on new significance when the old, familiar understanding of things no longer makes sense. Some arrive there by reason and by anticipating experience based on knowledge of history; others will arrive there by reason after living through an experience. Unfortunately, we live in a time in which history is used to manufacture propaganda. Truth is the first casualty of governments intent on economic and social planning. It is an extremely frustrating environment in which to discuss public matters.

I still see people posting messages about paying down the debt. In my opinion it is impossible to pay debt with debt. I think this can be proven with two credit cards. I wish someone would show me otherwise.

I see people posting messages that gold is too expensive to be money. It is difficult I admit to conceive that gold might not have a price. But, when gold is money, there is no price of gold. Gold itself is the medium of the price mechanism for all things. It cannot then be too expensive or too cheap because a thing cannot be priced in terms of itself. Would you say how much oil does it take to buy oil ? Or how much wheat to buy wheat ?

Property is a depository for life. A farmer plants, tends, and reaps. He expends life-time into a crop product. It is so for any producer. He exchanges that crop product for other things and now his work-life is deposited in those things. If one of those things is gold or silver coin, he can be certain that the depository will not waste away or become corrupt by natural cause over time. I don't believe the same can be said for the promises of men in positions of power. And when the day comes when it becomes apparent to many that not just the debt, but the interest on the debt will not be paid, all of the work-life deposited in the promises of government will be blown away like feathers in the wind. And the people who have not deposited work-life into real things will have to start over as surely as if they were refugees from fire, storm, flood, or war.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:11 - ID#330175)
Panda------brings back fond memories don't it
I was in yer Commonwealth for episode#1

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:13 - ID#330175)
ALRIGHT CAPER that's more than enuf------------for that triple post you are--
BANNED for the rest of the evening----now go to your room!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:16 - ID#330175)
by-the-way CAPER
I flunked french ( along with everthing ) in church school and still can't figure out what the hell 'sel de table' is~~~~~~~

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:18 - ID#300202)
Lowering myself like the rest of the Kitty Kats-Screaming to be heard.
Mozel-Write a book ( non sarcastic ) . Everything has to be qualified on the site or u get ur bones jumped. Get a life Ted. Shine was a joke Ted.
I'm much more refined-Chateau Gai.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:18 - ID#255284)
Gert Frobe, try clearing out your cache.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:20 - ID#330175) recipe to beat the heat is----------------

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:20 - ID#23398)
Canada has not sold gold since july 1996, this was stated earlier this week.The article also mention that Canada has 1.6 million ounces left in the vaults.CANOE ( FINANCIAL POST ) .For TED The weather in fLA TO NIGHT THE PITS RAINING HARD AND 50 DEGREES.Your friend LUCIFER is very unhappy to day. The FEDS just told him to take a hike with his 1 billion $ claim for the ICE STORM damages.The bill included the 650 m lost by Hydro Quebec.The response was no go. if we pay Hydro s damage ( THEY MADE 650 MILLION PROFITS IN 97 ) the reason stated if we pay Hydro we should also pay the damages of Firms like Alcan and Bell Canada plus all the medium and small businesses who lost or incured damages from.Also for your Canadian pesos I just purchased two weeks ago NEW BRUNSWICK SWISS DEMONINATED BONDS THEY HAVE ALRESDY APPRECIATED. NICE AND SAFE Better than most curencies backed by gold. ( BIG TIME )

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:23 - ID#339320)

Sometimes a cigar is..........................................

..................just a cigar.

There is more behind real life dialogue, than what can be accounted for in your philosophy. That which is between the lines, and that which is NOT said, usually is closer to the truth.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:23 - ID#330175)
Caper -------------shine is no joke to------------MOIS
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ( my brain waves after imbibing ) hey at least it ain't a straight line--------------

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:23 - ID#225273)
Quebec and the Confederate Battle Flag
Ladies and gentlemen,

When you drive through Quebec, you need the right paraphenalia. If you speak Canadian English, they tend to have a natural aversion to you. Get yourself a Confederate Battle Flag and hang it out the window of your car as you drive through towns or up to a gas station. The people will all cheer and treat you like a celebrity.

Image is everything!!!

On ANOTHER topic, I'm beginning if the guy isn't a fraud. The other day he used language that sounded like his shield and mask of Arabia had temporarily come off.

For instance, he began one sentence, :Find me a country.....

That's pretty colloquial for a guy who learned English out of a text book.

On ANOTHER occasions he has let his guard down and spoken English like a native, not someone straining to understand the language.

As for the Transactional Analysis, I analysed myself by it after the long post, and concluded I should be locked in an asylum for the insane. TA is the item needing proper analysis. It's not the standard by which anything meaningful should be judged, in my considered opinion.

One more thing, a major copper-zinc-silver deposit has been found by Western Copper in Zacatecas, Mexico. The shares have about quadrulpled so far this year.

This looks like it could develop into a full-blown area play like Voisey's Bay di in 1994-95. If so, then the little companies that move into the area and acquire land will do very well -- in their share price -- whether or not they find any metal on their property.

So far, I know of two other companies in the area that will greatly benefit from the huge discovery by Western Copper. These two companies are Kalahari Resources and Global Mineral and Chemical.

Both are under C$.50 right now, but as the Western Copper deposit develops, C$2.00 is not out of the question.

Think about it.

The Preacher

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:24 - ID#339320)

Sometimes a cigar is..........................................

..................just a cigar.

There is more behind real life dialogue, than what can be accounted for in your philosophy. That which is between the lines, and that which is NOT said, usually is closer to the truth.

gert frobe
(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:25 - ID#43147)
Thanks but Mr. Kaplan thought of that already.
No help.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:27 - ID#300202)
To Diversify: If u haven't seen it before-Get movie Bay Boy-Keifer
Sutherland's first movie-Directed by Petrie of Hollywood, originally
from Glace Bay. Depicted life in the Bay in the 30's-Korrupt Kops-like
yourself, homosexuality in the priesthood & hatred towards Jews-Glace
Bay Rednecks. Somehow has a feelin' they were his experiences.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:27 - ID#401237)

You are right:
We were talking about the Boomers in the office today. All of these $125 to $400 K homes that have been built. If we ever have another major economic collapse how are people going to heat them let alone cover the mortgage? The monthly cost on these monsters is huge!

I was in the Rust Belt in 75 & 83
I was inthe Oil Patch in 86, There were cars and homes forsale every where.

During the 30's life was much simpler. Homes were heated with coal, so people went out and gathered coal off of railroad tracks. People still knew how to grow a garden for food. etc.

Can you imagine what would happen now - people would starve and freeze to death.

I can't help but wonder if we aren't being marched into this war as a preventive measure against a depression - ie World War II

Nothing like a war to stimulate an economy and to hide printed money for a while.

WB has bought bonds and silver. Is it possible that bond rates can come down as silver goes up?

Whatever, they have to keep selling the bonds to keep the country afloat. Patriotism is as good a reason to buy them as any - especially if you have lost your Asian buyers.


(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:28 - ID#201238)
at Aurator
Please email me so I ask you a private question.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:31 - ID#330175)
Caper........haven't seen it but will check it out
Even thou I have no tolerance for red-necks~~~~~~opinionaTED SOB's

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:33 - ID#330175)
To show I'm diversified-----------I've switched from hockey to-------
HBO boxing.....Vronsky: Get yer damn TV back and join the human ( ?? ) race!

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:35 - ID#243180)
mozel -- One of the best posts I've seen for quite some time
I've written for publication over the years and I still cannot write this kind-a-stuff on the fly --- I have to muddle through several iterations to come close to this. Some of my favorite quotes:

Date: Fri Feb 06 1998 22:11
"Words take on new significance when the old, familiar understanding of things no longer makes sense. Some arrive there by reason and by anticipating experience based on knowledge of history; others will arrive there by reason after living through an experience... "

"... If one of those things is gold or silver coin, he can be certain that the depository will not waste away or become corrupt by natural cause over time... "

Truly visionary ...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:35 - ID#411149)
Goldbug23- I am using Netscape 3.01 Gold and I still can't get into
Kaplan's site, maybe it is prejudice to certain brousers. DAMN!
Thanks anyway!

Just talked to a guy that had a million shares of DROOY. He is lookin for
$50/share in 2 years, 3 at most. Said he would probably miss the big move to $125/share in 4-5 years.

On that this old man issa goin to BED.

Tally Ho

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:37 - ID#339320)


(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:37 - ID#300202)
Could not be more simply put. Am aware.

Heavy Hitter
(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:40 - ID#403159)
The public has a great love affair with equities, defying gravity.
This is the same public that jumped on real estate in the late
80's expecting ever increasing values. I heard from all including
family "You can't lose on real estate". year 1989. Donald
Trump was in the spotlight at that time. Now it's Gates and Buffett.
The only difference between B.G. W.B and DJT is DJT believed
the party would go on forever and his ego got in his way. Now
BG and WB are in the PM's and how much God only knows.
But these two billionares are not going to make the mistakes
of Donald Trump. To make a long story short, well some what
short we have WB making a move and the sceptics ( the majority )
are still in disbelief. He knows something others don't. Buffett is
not guessing, he knows the P.M.'s are getting ready to make a
big move. Can't go on printing money and hiding it in the stock
market forever.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:41 - ID#401237)

Thanks, for pointing out that post . I sometimes read our post to fast, skimming over some really good stuff.


(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:48 - ID#372344)
@ Moneyline....
Ed Hyman was on tonight, looked unusually grim, and said the following
"The economy is heating up"... "stocks are doing better than bonds"...
"bond yields are up".....'The economy will slow due to Asia crisis"......
and can you believe this one " a major crisis is always good for the
markets" he for real?....

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:53 - ID#256254)
Date: Fri Feb 06 1998 20:10

Thanks for letting us know, I will check it out tomorrow.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:54 - ID#35767)
Ted we love ya on this cite but you have to be more tolerant. I will openly I will admit that I ascribed to the principles of Democratic Socialism. The wealth of a country should be used to the benefit of many with much left to the creators so there is an incentive to create. Yet without aid to the less fortunate we invite a situation of social disruption which would prevent social stability which allows the creators to create and be confident of rightly reaping the rewards of their labor.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:54 - ID#201238)
free speach

Actually after reading my last long post I thought I should make something very clear. I have always supported the principle of free speach ( with respect ) to anyone who wants to respond on Kitco. I deeply respect Bart's long and tendious efforts to build this site. I have met more friends here than anyone could imagine. I only write what I believe or what I feel. It deeply saddens me when I see rancor in this group. I have been here a long time. It is sort of like a family. When someone has the courage to post what he believe in, others have a tendancy to jump on it, particularly if it is wrong. All of us have made good and bad choices on investments. Those who have the courage to post their belief in advance deserve the respect of us all, not rancor. For they have true bravery. They at least deserve the right to state their opinion, fo rif they are wrong , they suffer two punishments, the loss on their investment and the ridicule of those who know they made it. The US was founded upon the principal of free speach. Let us not forget it.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:55 - ID#30116)
quion97 - 1.6 million ounces is chump change in the 'C.B.' club.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:55 - ID#302251)
Date: Fri Feb 06 1998 16:46
PH in LA ( ANOTHER's message ) ID#225408:

For doubters among us who claim to have noticed more than one writing
style in ANOTHER's posts I suggest that he has on at least one occasion
employed someone to go over his writing: Date: Fri Nov 28 1997 19:45
"After a proof read by one from the west this is a start and should help
you understand." ..........

The reason I wondered loudly,
was that his use of the English language was sometimes strictly western,
in clear contrast to the bulk of his writing,
and it was not just a question of vocabulary.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 22:55 - ID#339320)

Sorry for the multiple posts.
Kitco responded with a default message "Watchguard Firewall.....access denied.......type content required"...
and on a reload I see that the posts went through.
Anyone else?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:00 - ID#22956)

Heavy Hitter
(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:00 - ID#403159)
Where is it trading now. When he moves out a silver and gold it
won't be for 300%. Try 500% plus.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:03 - ID#201238)
speech or speach? Sorry, my intent is the same.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:03 - ID#30116)
ROR -- I see no need to 'create' as my 'incentive' ( pay ) is reduced if I spend too much time 'being creative'. I don't consider it a 'fair deal' at all. In the long run, we will all suffer under this form of redistribution. I feel like Atlas, shrugging that is....

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:05 - ID#227238)
On a scroll
More Gold: "where the language police want to prosecute ( ??? ) restaurant owners whose chinese letters are bigger than the french translation."

A more fitting word would be: Persecute. LOL.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:06 - ID#302251)
CJS1_A..........RE: ANOTHER
Date: Fri Feb 06 1998 18:57
CJS1__A ( ANOTHER's THOUGHTS Examined ) ID#329157:
A Transactional Analysis approach to ANOTHER's THOUGHTS

You may or may not agree with some of this. I look forward
to some interesting discussion.............



THANK YOU for your monumental work,
I hope many of us will add to this fascinating discussion.

AND while we are at it:
Why not try to guess the culture of this amazing man ?
Don't you sense that there is somthing gentle,
a touch of class, poetic and humanitarian expressions,
which is missing in our western culture ?

Quixotic 1
(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:10 - ID#176235)
Zero Federal Deficits...Equals...Ballooning State and Local Deficits

Ted, your 10:47
One of the reasons your tax rates are sky-rocketing is, all those fat federal-dollar pass through programs that state and local municipalities have become addicted to, are being phased out in this era of "Balance the Federal Budget". Yes, that's right, the feds are spending less, but making the states and localities the bad guys. They are forced to raise taxes to make up for the lost subsidies and federal supports. Here in the Great State of New Hampshire, the biggest concern is in the towns with high expenditures for entitlement programs. The federal dollars are drying up, but the show must go onwho picks up the tabJoe property tax payer. In the bleeding-heart liberal states of upper New England, know one is turned away. I'm in the same boat as you, our mill-rate has increased 24% in 2 years, and no end in sight as the libbs scream about schools, the homeless and teen pregnancy.

Gold & Silver for the good guysGMJ

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:11 - ID#302251)
OLDMAN...............WE ARE WAITING..............

Date: Fri Feb 06 1998 18:29
Selby ( The Weekend is Here ) ID#287207:
Oldman: What is you view on the current trend of gold?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:11 - ID#22956)
~~~~~Ted~~~~~~~~~~~and the Can$~~~~~~
It will reach .7090 to fill the gap......someday....duh. It has been following gold or gold has been following it.....hmmmmm. I will mail you with more TA stuff. There are too many here that think charts are for the birds. This bird knows better....... ( chirp ) .......gulp ( the captain and I are sailin the ship ) ........aaaaaaaaaaaahhhhh!.... ( damn weather ) ... steal some boooty....ohmy ;-0

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:13 - ID#401237)
"The wealth of a country" The country is broke!

You have to be kidding, just who earned that money?

Socialism is dead, it doesn't work, get over it.
Democratic Socialism is that an oxymoron?
What is an Democratic Socialist doing on a Gold Site? Or for that matter living in a capilist Republic?

If I have misunderstood your post - I am sorry!

It is late, and I have had a tough Capitalist week, earning money to pay for a bunch of Socialist want to bes in Washinton. Who do nothing productive all day and just chase young skirts around. Democratic Socialist - Ha! what a joke I thought that went out 20 years ago.

Good Night All


(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:14 - ID#227238)
Panda: The problem with Quebec tieing into a national grid is that French speaking power would then be in danger of having purity its questioned as it's diluted with all that English speaking power. Eh?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:14 - ID#22956)
roger that...just had to say it. It's like when you have a hangin booger and nobody tells you. You wish they had, eh? pick my nose

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:15 - ID#26669)
Ray re Kaplan
thanks I'll keep trying

Lurker 777
(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:15 - ID#317247)
Do you post anywhere else on the net? I would be interested in visiting chat sites that post about conspiracies, war and Doom and Gloom stuff. If you know of any such sites on the net would you please post the address link.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:19 - ID#411259)
..... Alone in the rain .....

When a cry of distress was raised and my limes were in peril, only Ted offered words of condolence. Very few truly understand how lonely the Coronas will be without fresh limes. My poor tender blossoms Curse this El Nino to hell

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:19 - ID#372344)
@ IMF to double members $$quotas....will the US pay up?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:19 - ID#30116)
Ted, the more things change...
A little late evening digression here. A bill was just signed in to law here in the state of Mass. It is now legal to have all female health clubs. Unfortunately ( for the NOW group ) , all male health clubs are also legal now. So the National Org. for Women is complaining about this 'discrimination' against women by the all mens health clubs. It seems it's O.K. for women to discriminate against men, but not the reverse. Funny, whatever happened to freedom of association? I guess we have our own version of Quebec down here.

On to other issues... Clintons travails along with the multinational corporate first quarters earnings will be the test of the equities markets. If Clintons problems boil over, look for dollar weakness. The dollar weakness will then take care of the stock and bond markets. Then what? What else! A rate hike by the Fed! Why? To defend the dollar.

NO ONE expects a Fed rate hike this year. Think about it... Also, what do you think would benefit from this? ( As I trip over this funny looking, yellow brick being used as a door stop... )

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:19 - ID#26669)
farfel re stockmarket inflation
Until you mentioned it I just didn't put 2+2 together. I wonder if a need for decrease of consumption is why the Repubs are trying so hard to get a consuption tax to replace the IRS. Then people would work and save like little beavers building their dam higher and higher and higher until ...oops! Somehow slick Willie's idea of just stealing it up front seems simpler. But a significant amount of wealth in gold might hurt either bunch of crooks.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:24 - ID#30116)
Earl (Miscegeneration.)
Earl ROTFL !!! :- ) ) :- ) ) :- ) )

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:27 - ID#30116)
To Hell with silver! :- ) Whither platinum and palladium? It seems that things have been 'too' quiet on that front.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:27 - ID#201238)
RJ - I could cry for you but ..............

You ?, as one of the most prolific silver brokers in the US, has time to leave his office for lunch while a national TV crew came in!! Good job!

Been on national TV ( not the most wanted! ) myself. You made the right choice! ( Should make a movie like that! )

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:29 - ID#227238)
Droolin over DROOY.
Ray: You excite the hell out of me when talk like that.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:31 - ID#248180)
To suggest that "ANOTHER" is something other than a valued poster is not valid. It matters not whether he is a financial professional, politician, a trader or a lurking gold bug. His posts and "Thoughts" are most thought provoking and of considerable interest to a great number of participants on this site. I for one greatly appreciate his/her input.
"ANOTHER'S" comment regarding COMEX as a small and unimportant "PM" moniter ( or words to that effect ) seems to bear some truth. After all when we note the constant and accurate posting on this site regarding the COMEX movements; what truth or fact has the COMEX movement given us regarding the W.Buffet massive silver purchases of well over a six month period? Not a wisper or a hint was uttered on this site about a major world player/trader accumulating silver for 6 months. The London investigation into silver contracts proved to be a tidy diversion for WB. Let us not all get too swell headed on this Kitco site, most of us are minnows in this very big pond. "ANOTHER's posts are challenging to most lurkers on this site, because we think that we understand and already watch the market indicaters that we understand. He/she simply presents us with different and more challenging "THOUGHTS".
"We live and learn and then die dumb". Let us hope that the markets movers and shakers share our collective thoughts and hope that the herd starts to buy PM's and mining stocks. "HAVEAGOODWEEKEND" KATS & KITTENS.
Thank you.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:34 - ID#227238)
Mozel: That truly was another in a series of really first rate posts. Nothing short of remarkable. ..... If and when time, circumstances and willingness permit, please email me:

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:35 - ID#30116)
@The tax man cometh...
Away to contemplate schedule D. Another nightmare created in the name of simplification, NOT. To whom do I send my bill for time spent figuring out this contrivance to steal more money from me????

Good night all...

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:35 - ID#25673)
Russian Bear on the move
Is the Russian Bear still looking for a warm water port?
Eastern Europe news reports:

accepted an invitation from Saddam Hussein to visit Iraq to inspect "any
presidential sites of their choosing," ITAR-TASS reported on 6 February.
Hussein sent the invitation to Duma Speaker Gennadii Seleznev the previous
day. The Duma delegation will be headed by Duma Deputy Speaker Mikhail
Gutseriev of the Liberal Democratic Party of Russia ( LDPR ) and will
depart for Baghdad on 8 February. The plane carrying the Duma deputies will
also deliver humanitarian aid. Last December, when LDPR leader Vladimir
Zhirinovsky led a delegation to Baghdad, an aid shipment was also

Lurker 777
(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:40 - ID#317247)
RJ Questions
What are your clients telling you? Are they buying gold, silver or platinum? Have you seen a major increase in gold coin sells since $300.00 has been breached? When did you first notice a large jump in gold inquires? What are the most popular coins you sell? Why was your desk so messy? You know we have ways to make you talk! Hey Joe start the chopper.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:41 - ID#411259)
..... The Movies were jammed, too many people in California .....

Arden -
My brother, and fellow broker, was shown in earnest conversation on the phone, but my spreadsheet ended up on the cutting room floor. Footprints of the cameraman dusted the mahogany on my desk. But I thought the whole WB buying puts thingie was a worthwhile post. Besides, the place is a pressure cooker in a market like this, gotta' get out of the office to clear the head.

Panda -
I think a move in platinum is inevitable and pending. The Russians stopped shipments January 1. Legal authority to ship PGMs will not be granted until the general Russian budget is signed, a process that lasted until June last year. I have been disappointed in platinum and have recently lighted up on some platinum positions with very modest profits. I will not trade palladium now. The risk/reward thing is out of whack. I think platinum will explode again. Silver is not the last short squeeze we will see this year.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:43 - ID#153102)
@Caper & Wet_Gold & High_Rise
Thanks for the comments.

To utter words to break the spell cast by the Keynesian sorcerers of compound interest on unlimited credit: that would be something worth more than the paper it was printed on.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:44 - ID#22956)
You should be using your limes for Rum drinks....perhaps StudioR's rum&coke's. Now that is a decent drink. Drink Dos Equs instead.

It is a shame that your tender were injured in the storm. There is more 'stormage' to come. Better get another tree. My Avo trees were injured but they are doing ok now. It will make them stronger, yes. One is in the precarious blossom stage as well and I hate to lose any of 'em. Damnable Christ Child!!!

How was Blues Bros 2000?....not nearly as good as the original I imagine...and you are in rare form today.

John Disney__A
(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:45 - ID#24135)
Cunning as a Sh!t house r@T
to all Clinton Admirers
I believe that the anti clinton leaks being planted
in the press now mostly originate from Clinton's
office. The leak having Levinsky with Clinton at some
golf outing was a set up which gave clinton an
opportunity to employ a SPORTS FIGURE - white shark
Norman - in his defense - That alone was worth 3 %
in the polls. I think the story leaked about his
secretary will follow the same pattern.
So this may have been the tactic they came up
with over the stone wall weekend. Leak disinformation
that can clearly be disproved. Let the press and the
internet spread it far and wide. Then Disprove it as
an example of a right wing conspiracy. Then attack
Starr for leaking the information.
Thats creative - Im starting to admire this jerk. WE
are dealing with one clever degenerate.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:46 - ID#330175)
RandomLESS thoughts on the far east coast
RJ: I ...I continue ta feel yer pain....Quixotic: The problemO in Putney Vermont goes farther than that and actually boils down to one word ( FLATLANDERS ) ....Panda: I see no double standard there!...EB: Let it rain--let it rain ( today was SUNNY @ the CAPE and actually they're predicting SUNNY weather till Wednesday ( I feel yer pain too ) ---bring on the charts baby!---go Yankees~~~~~~~~~~~~

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:47 - ID#302251)

Date: Fri Feb 06 1998 18:53
Hedgehog ( Desperately Seeking Judy Whu. US Military GPS down
again! ) ID#39845:
Saturday 7 February, 1998 ( 9:08am AEDT )
U-S military officials say two F/A-18 fighter jets have
collided over the Gulf. ...............
The pilot of one plane was killed.
It's the second mishap this week involving Marine Corps
aircraft, following Tuesday's disaster Tuesday in Italy where
a low-flying plane cut a ski-lift cable, killing 20 people.

OK..... I know that I am not supposed to talk about it.
I know that even in our Democracy and Free Speech
there are some subjects that Political Correctness
dictates we should not talk about.
Because if we talk,
the whole house of cards will come tumbling down !!!

its Friday night,
Bart is not watching,
no one is reading our forum tonight,
so I will say it fast
and turn off my computer:

An Ex-Military man who was sitting next to me
on a flight from New York to Florida
told me that the majority of Military Jets mishaps
are done by black pilots.
He said they are not capable of handling
sophisticated equipment,
but the politicians are forcing the Military........

Of course I did not believe him,
until I read THE BELL CURVE,
by two Harvard professors.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:49 - ID#301318)

In an attempt to identify ANOTHER we have the best direct evidence in the paragraph below. What country or race has 6,000 years of history? The Chinese immeadiately comes to my mind. But that does not hold up to the mid-eastern slant given by his statement somewhat to the effect "standing on the sand" and his reference to oil. The times of his posts are irrelevant since he just may reside, perhaps temporarily, somewhere in the western hemisphere.

I am not a historian but my senses are telling me that all the evidence we need to
unravel his decendancy is written below.

" In the past many world governments and leaders, far greater than those today have embraced these thoughts. I and my fathers have done battle with such evil and won! For we have 6,000 years of history as our armor! ..."

Another thaught anyone?

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:49 - ID#318321)
RJ, I knew there was a reason I always looked forward to your posts, even when I didn't agree, or want to believe. You were right about gold going down and I now think you'll be right about the action going forward from here. Thank goodness I'm in this for the long haul. In early 1993 I had a feeling that it was now time to be in gold stocks. Gold was down to 330 then which made it cheap in my book. I bought PM stocks made a killing and have been hooked ever since. But boy have I taken a hammering in the last year and a half. Oh well its only a small percentage of the cake.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:50 - ID#330175)
Death to AVO trees
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~How bout movin ta the CAPE where the sun always shines

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:52 - ID#330175)
to FLASH gordon
Another is really Alfred ( E ) Newman

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:52 - ID#287223)
reply to comment
RJ: In the markets, "Timing is Everything". Mr. Puetz is one of those individuals who see clearly into the future; yet, lack that most essential ingredient in the world of trading...Timing. I believe that if you can properly mix Mr. Puetz' insights with a credible timing tool, and of course, money management..... one could do well.

John Disney__A
(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:55 - ID#24135)
Heaping Praise..Gimme a chance.. I just woke up
For wetgold
- mozel's talents are astonishing .. I an dazzled.
for snowbird.
- RJ is first class and NEEDED here. Should he be
attacked by some idiot, defend him to the death ( of the
idiot that is )

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:55 - ID#26669)
gert & Ray: more on Kaplan
If it helps I tried my alternate server via Telnet and got through to Kaplan's site. They have a trunk line through St Louis if I'm not mistaken but my main server ties into the net in D.C. Neither of the other guys who got through mentioned whether they were telnetting or using PPP server. Also if it helps, Steve is more bullish on gold and less so on silver. Much less so if I read between the lines.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:56 - ID#288337)
To paraphrase a great economist, the government is the only agency capable of taking a valuable item, paper, and making it worthless by printing on it.
RJ, enjoy the limes, looking fwrd to my VP's.
ROR, socialism ( democratic or otherwise ) is evil. Charity cannot be enforced by stealing from producers. Taxation=Theft.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:56 - ID#318321)
Hey Ted, I remember when you used to go sea kayaking and the market would go up. Well it won't be to long until the weather is better and you can sea kayak once again and raise all our fortunes: )

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:56 - ID#287223)
reply to comment
Wet Gold: ...thank you for your comment. I IS a go for '98! ( but, watch out for the dips! )

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:56 - ID#39845)
RJ I thought drinking Corona was all about creating an auto-immune response.
Save your limes and drink Castlemaine XXXX Gold or Steinlager.

(Fri Feb 06 1998 23:58 - ID#22956)
Them's big words....
comin from a vegetarian......and yer sunny Cape is but a fluke. The real sunsine is still in California...and the girls are warmer.......oh yes!

btw, yesterday I was watching a show on the tube about these two canuks Kayaking in some big bay in Nova Scotia ( bundy bay?? ) . The tide goes in and out twice a day and the water rises and falls more than fifty feet. The tide was creating ferocious rapids that would have swept them away if they had gotten caught. It was wild, EH! I thought of you...and then I had to sit the stool..... ( doh! ) ...

And I see that you are looking towards baseball already...I guess cause your Nix stand not a snowballs chance in hell............. ( melting ) ...... ( away! ) ...