Gold Discussion for Investors and Market Analysts

Kitco Inc. does not exercise any editorial control over the content of this discussion group and therefore does not necessarily endorse any statements that are made or assert the truthfulness or reliability of the information provided.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 00:01 - ID#240170)
What Platinum and Silver mines would the kitoces reccommend as good deals to invest in now?

What about Pdlcf?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 00:02 - ID#344308)

d-day with the moon?

from the fin-who-shares....just facts.....

(Tue Apr 07 1998 00:04 - ID#339212)
Interesting chart

Harmony ( HGMCY ) heading to infinity? The gaps must close soon. Sold it today.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 00:05 - ID#339212)
Sorry, I forgot the Harmony chart, here it is

(Tue Apr 07 1998 00:06 - ID#344308)

in honor of dow 9000

(Tue Apr 07 1998 00:10 - ID#57232)
Japan and possible cheap goods Tsunami, Gold - G'nite all!
All: One more tidbit from the Mar 25 ( ? ) Economist about Japan. Apparently several Japanese auto manufacturers are in dire financial straits, so it is unlikely they will be able to bankroll an auto 'flood'.

Only Toyota, and ( I'm pretty sure ) Honda have ready cash on hand. Makes the auto goods Tsunami less likely - for this year, at least.

Gold: How long will our gold rally last, after one major brokerage firm says today that gold stocks are a 'strong buy'?

RJ -- Any suggestions? How about the floor traders? My guess is that gold bullion had better follow suit fairly soon.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 00:14 - ID#238295)
Preacher: I too am looking for a few down days in gold and the XAU before we rally again.

A forecaster on another thread who called this rally perfectly is looking for a fairly sharp correction near-term, but sees XAU hitting 150 by summer.

Something to think about.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 00:18 - ID#26669)
Bubble getting ready to burst?
Sharefin: brilliant post, echoing whispered sentiments from all over. You must have read "Heart of Darkness" recently.

Anyone have any conjectures as to where land prices will go when the market bottoms and gold picks up?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 00:20 - ID#401460)
Spot Gold?

Has anyone found a place to find spot Gold prices yet?

Kitco seems to be shut down again?


(Tue Apr 07 1998 00:24 - ID#256250)
This is how they play the game.

Released 14:35 FWN

"Meanwhile, four different dealers told FWN today that
silver futures tumbled in reaction to a report from Ted
Arnold, metals specialist with Merrill Lynch in London,
saying that Warren Buffett's Berkshire Hathaway may have
sold roughly 30% of the 129.7 million ounces of silver
amassed between January and July.
The oddity of today's trade was that Arnold's report
apparently played such a prominent role even though it was
released back on March 19.

Arnold himself indicated that some of the market
reaction may have been because some news organizations were
apparently treating it as a fresh story. The story was
carried today by the Financial Times, he noted. Arnold's
report said the Buffett sales are thought to have been made
back when silver was around $7 to $7.20 an ounce.
A New York trader suggested that some players may have
looked at the story as an "excuse" to sell silver at a time
when the market is "nervous" about future direction."

Well, I feel very comfortable is saying if Warren sold off all his silver holdings on or around March 19th, THE SILVER BULL IS HUGE!!!

For as we have said many times before and Allen reminded us today, it isn't who sells that is important BUT WHO IS BUYING. AND we can see that silver eligible stocks on

March 19th


0 2,171,375 39,162,855
-214,250 -2,171,375 50,933,471
-214,250 0 90,096,326

And today were:

-201,456 0 33,648,884
-171,573 0 53,757,086
-373,029 0 87,405,970

That means that someone took all that SILVER off of MR. Buffet's hands at top dollar and NONE of it has found its way back to COMEX. EXTREMELY BULLISH.


Please note Arnold's bufflement on how the media could have possible got so excited and confused about his old story.

As Austin Powers would say " SURE BABY!"


Gold 75,000
Silver 18,000
H.G. Copper 8,000


-201,456 0 33,648,884
-171,573 0 53,757,086
-373,029 0 87,405,970

warehouse stocks:
GOLD ( Quoted in Troy Ounce )

571,508 0 96,147 -96,147 0 475,361
148,278 0 0 0 0 148,278
719,786 0 96,147 -96,147 0 623,639

Just think of it all of the massive exciting action with the post price of gold up 6 down 5 .


COMEX IS A PAPER GOLD MARKET, probably run on a fractional reserves basis ( as Allen suggested Date: Fri Apr 03 1998 20:53
Allen ( USA ) ( COMEX and other charades ) ID#255190 ) .

They may have to have at least 148,000 or so ounces no matter what and that is why we aren't seeing any changes in eligible gold stocks.

BUY and TAKE DELIVERY while you still can.

JOE Smith
(Tue Apr 07 1998 00:24 - ID#24869)
Silver Comex stocks down 373,029 today to 87.41mil
The squeeze continues,hard to believe that W.Buffet. I watched the minuit by minute trades last night--when there was a down tick another sold down on small lots.then it rebounded 2 ticks i,e 1 c

if Buffet was seller it would have been hit a lot harder.

In my view the fundementals are still in place for a run to $10 as predicted by CPM group.

Mind you i am trying to discover the report that W.B. had found a new use for silver in a Silver -Zinc battery

(Tue Apr 07 1998 00:26 - ID#210235)
Dear fellow trader,

I have been aware of Richard Maybury's concerns for some time,and have not posted his link ( to cheer up Studio.R ) only because of the inevitable flak that would surely follow from someone finding it unethical to gloat after someone else's loss. Besides, at this point, it's still purelyspeculative.

The one thing that is truly clear about "Another" is that he takes information of which many are not aware, but which is not really unique, and presents it as his own. He awes the ignorant ( of that particular information ) . A percentage of readers, who are reading certain information or prognostications for the first time, think "This Another guy is terrific!" And they join the fan club. The club continues to grow. I am not a member. Curiously, this same fan club repeatly ignores the savvy writer who posts "I've known this for sixteen years . . . . " Such is the power to believe in a higher power.

I have personal friends who are current or recent ( pre-WWI ) aristocracy. Because of my own familial background, it was easy to make those connections. All I can say, with certainty, is that none of them would play such an adolescent game, nor would they gain any enjoyment from the tremendous speculation about or kow-towing to Mr. Another. I suggest to you that it is either your Hepcat having a good time or another prankster. Sorry. But it doesn't fit.

I had already written to Pete, I think, that if Another were a true royal enjoying anonymity, he would not appreciate being found out. This is my experience. The rich and famous, when they make like the rest of us, lose all benefit ( to them ) from the experience when they are found out. You my draw your own conclusions.

Best - Prometheus

(Tue Apr 07 1998 00:38 - ID#255151)
223 @ 00:18

Thoughts on land. If we get into a situation where "stuff" is outperforming "paper" in $ terms, then Land as a whole should do well. How well depends on such local factors as location, intended use, regulations, and so forth. Seems a better bargain than stocks right now, eh!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 00:44 - ID#339212)
@ 223 on land

$100,000 buys you a nice home in aGreek island and to heck about values.
"Follow the footsteps of the giants", ANOTHER is going to live there, do the same thing too, and you will have personal conversations with him and get to know how to make some real money.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 00:44 - ID#256250)
Thought you might like this one also.

It looks from the reports like :

COMEX Delivery Notices for Today

Merrill Lynch Futures, Inc. 1 Republic N.Y. Securities 1


COMEX Silver Warehouse Stocks, Part 2

-- ( Quoted in Troy Ounce )
Net. Adjust- Total
Chg. ment Today

-201,456 0 20,850,709
-246,538 0 11,372,392
-447,994 0 32,223,101

That maybe just maybe, Ted Arnold helped his Merrill cover some short positions.

Arden can you check me on this. Am I reading the delivery notices correctly. Looks like merrill was linked to Republic and in the status for silver Republic's stocks dropped 447,994 ounces.

Looks suspicious to me.

Let tomorrow fulfill our GOLD and SILVER dreams... and Platinum and Palladium too!!!!

I'm out of here, goodnight all.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 00:53 - ID#373403)
Chartist Nuveau
Look at the gold chart at:

It is the once in a lifetime pregnant lady formation. The gold bull is ready to be born!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 00:55 - ID#247273)
Your earlier post: Selling of gold to Chinese, et al. This is what has occurred to many, that US is secretly selling, as has our govt sold just about everything else, selling our past, mortgaging the future, and also working on the present. How would someone verify this? Can an audit be requested? I am not knowledgeable enough to know, however, I will investigate this issue. It seems too large a secret to hide for very long. Such news would have instant and devastating effect on our economics and society. This would be a spark for many changes.

John Disney__A
(Tue Apr 07 1998 00:57 - ID#24135)
I HATE to make forecasts
But for you brother Oris .. Ill try
No pickles no vodka 6:45 am .. dark outside and chilly in
Africa.... I HATE to say it .. I HOPE Im wrong .. but I think
we've SEEN the high for the week ... and will be hanging by
our fingernails till friday. Ill be Happy to see us over 300
on friday .. Have 100% profit on Harmony since Christmas..
... Maybe 30 or so on Randfontein.. will take some profit
today on the open .. maybe Im wrong .. I hope so... But Im
turning into chickenman .. and fear is overcoming greed..
( my two controlling emotions ) .. wish the sun would come up.
PS did you notice Juniors post talked about South African
guy in MOSCOW with Stardard Bank spokesman explaining
for Zadorov ( ?? ) all about PGMs. Hey what is south african
guy doing in MOSCOW in branch of Standard Bank. What is
standard bank doing in MOSCOW. Hey I also see RSA will buy 22
migs from Russia since US tried to freeze out their attack
helicopter and their 2 long range groundpounders which still
world best. Maybe they get together on PGM supply ?? and
explains why RSA info on russia PGM not so bad.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 00:57 - ID#252281)
Spot Prices
Here is a site in Africa with spot prices quoted in
local currency
You're welcome!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:02 - ID#252281)
Spot Prices #2

has a page of market references including spot prices in local currency

(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:04 - ID#401460)

Thanks for the URL
However I think the Gold price was for 04/06/98 ?

thanks again for the site.


(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:05 - ID#210235)
Funny, verrrrry good. We may never see her again. ( Just once, John Disney, I hope you're wrong! ) Pregnant lady formation indeed!

Night, all. Probably won't be able to log on to Kitco until all markets are closed and all East Coaster are sleepin'.

Good day tomorrow.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:06 - ID#339212)
Accurate Au price?

In the Yahoo ECO msg board a poster says that gold is up $4.10.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:14 - ID#339212)
Au price - How can this be verified?$kbi$>$kbi$

(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:15 - ID#284255)
I vote for deflation with dropping house prices.
The post was emailed to me so I cannot help with the authenticity of the comment.

But it does seem like everything is for sale these days.

I vote for deflation with dropping house prices.
At least in the land of OZ.
Gold was high in 87 when we had our last correction.
It was then in an inflationary cycle and property prices went crazy shortly after the bust as people transfered the assetts elsewhere.

This time of the cycle gold is low pointing to a deflationary period coming.
In many cities around the world property prices have already gone through the roof.
If we get a crash within the markets this time around then vast sums will disappear and will not move to the property market.
We have already seen this in effect in Asia.
Swing chart updated:
The last upswing was excessively weak and now the ma ( red line ) is falling off.
If the equity markets cannot lift up their skirts soon it will accelerate to the downside.
The period coming up - the next month - is one of the most dangerous periods to hold any form of equity shares over the last ten years.


(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:18 - ID#339212)
If you have trouble accesing my previously posted URL..

.. then go to the Echo Bay Mines msg board ( ECO ) and see msg 410.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:23 - ID#22956)
I'll take the TA on this one. Charts don't lie...eventually. ;- ) Gold will get a spanking this week. Count on it. Better not buy until the dust settles. And buy a Mountie from Bart. OK. call it like I see it

and what is this??:
That was ( I believe ) before Bill admitted under oath ( Jennifer Flowers ) that he was a LIAR. Also before his
Zipper was allegedly unzipped a few more times.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:23 - ID#373403)
Glass-Steagall Act: 1933
So Citibank and Travelers just chatted over a Danish a month ago and decided to merge their two companies and here we are today. How delightful.

Oh, you need The Glass-Steagall Act of post Depression era repealled? It no linger holds any relevence in today's marketplace? O.K., we will get right on that.

Did we mention that Glass-Steagall is also the act which gave us the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation?

Bank deposits will soon be used to deal in, own, and underwrite corporate stocks and bonds. Sound like Japan? You bet.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:23 - ID#339212)
Problem clarified

The msg on the ECO board was from this morning. Sorry. Gold is not up $4.10.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:24 - ID#340302)
Just look's in the's everywhere.

Now my wife has been a strict vegetarian FOR 15 YEARS!!! ( around the same duration as the PREVIOUS gold bear cycle )

This week, all of a sudden, she begins eating meat like a ravenous wolf.

What happened? She announced that she had determined that some of her past medical problems were owing to lack of meat in her diet.

All I can say is, GREAT!!! I've been sneaking my hamburgers on the side long enough!


(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:27 - ID#401460)

Add Insurance Cash Values to the list.


John Disney__A
(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:29 - ID#24135)
Im trying to lose my accent...
Reading between the Lines..
Anglo American announced in the PRESS that IT was
CONCERNED that talks between KAFUE ( comprised of AVMIN
of RSA, Noranda, phelps dodge, and London based
commonwealth development ) and the Zambiam copperbelt
company ZCCM had FAILED. Anglos owns 27% of zccm.
Zambia announced it would open talks with other
parties INCLUDING anglos, and ANGLOS said it had
NOT been approached.
Now thats the old RSA press in action. Its the way
people talk to one another. Isnt this a lovely waltz.
Translation of above. Anglos want US companies
out of Africa. It indermined talks using its 27 interest
and contacts. Phelps must go. Noranda maybe but
a Canadian may be a Yank in a different suit. London
based is OKAY. It will take Phelps' place and do the
deal and own the world biggest copper producer but
only if it is Yank free ( to avoid American meddling..
like maybe preventing Directors from smoking in
Board meetings or having to eat fat free ham sandwiches
for lunch ) .

(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:29 - ID#339212)
@ Farfel on leading indicators

If your wife turns vegetarian again, does this mean that the Au bull is over?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:30 - ID#340302)
@ALL...historically, every decade preceding a new century...
...has been preceded by a good deal of crowd madness and systemic disruptions...

However, contrary to historical determinism, this decade to date has been the most peaceful, tranquil, prosperous decade in American history.

What does it mean?

In order for historical determinism to manifest itself, then the next one and half years must make up in madness and systemic chaos what the previous eight and half years lacked.

What does it mean?

Buy gold to protect yourself against the impending chaos.


(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:32 - ID#340302)
@MYRMIDON...the way she's enjoying her new carnivore state...
...I don't think there's a chance in hell she'll be reverting to leafy greens soon.


(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:34 - ID#340302)
@EB...I think the only spanking you hear this week...
...will be gold longs slapping themselves for failing to buy on any dips.

Some exciting fundamental announcements ahead.


(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:34 - ID#373403)
Spot at $314/oz today
I sit here thinking what that guy who bought at that price was thinking a few hours later. Probably some yuppy.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:37 - ID#255151)

You call Gold as you see it. You've also been right, damn it. I don't think you or RJ have a bias one way or another toward Gold. That said, here is a wager. I say Gold closes $310 or better at the end of this week. No stakes, just a gentlemen's bet. We on?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:39 - ID#339212)
Farfel, need your opinion..

.. this morning you praised a bit BMG. Can you expand a bit more on it please? I got rid of Harmony and switched to BMG - not because I am in love with BMG but I see it as a short term trade - with the intention to later go back to Harmony if it pulls back. So, how does BMG look to you?

PS. I am heavy in SA stocks now so I have to keep a good balance between SA and NA.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:41 - ID#260252)
Howdy PM fans
New poster here. Been lurking for a couple of months and just wanted to say thanks to all for all the great information and dialogue presented. Nice to know I'm not totally in the dark. Go AU/AG.

BTW, Farfel - your posts rule! Keep 'em coming, they're appreciated by the lurkers ( and funny, too ) .

Bart, the RCM's look great.

Here's to the pending AU/AG party.


(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:43 - ID#340302)
@D.A. Your post analyzing the gold market yesterday... of the best I've seen here...

I too have determined the call option activity is a sign of a new revenue raising tactic on the part of producers. The brief period of forward sales is ending.

Moreover, the giant ( BARRICK ) that popularized forward sales is no longer in a position to do any more such sales of any consequence.


(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:43 - ID#286230)
Tammy Wynette just died.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:48 - ID#433422)
This site has changed my life,,literally
I started lurkin' here 6 mos ago, when I saw the pog falling. I've always wanted to own some gold,now I do. I've been enlightened to the Y2K thing and am taking it seriously.
More than anything, I find it heartening that there is intelligence out there. I've read you guys 'till my eyes burn.

John Disney__A
(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:51 - ID#24135)
What does it all MEAN ??
To anyone ..
Lease Rates are down to 1.35 %. If Shorts have
increased how come rate are down so much ??? Unless
CB are pushing gold on them faster than they can
short it ...
Can someone explain these really low lease rates??
It would not be unlike CD to Talk about HIGH gold
future holdings and LIE !! I dont think you can
eliminate this possibility. Im worried about the
lease rates .. Can somebody calm me down??

(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:51 - ID#286230)
Bull Support

(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:52 - ID#433422)
ET TU 171S03?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:55 - ID#255151)

Yes, there is an incredible amount of information and talent available at Kitco. The way some of these posters can write is inspiring at times. Hell, even the whines and coniption fits at Kitco are good!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:55 - ID#339212)

You were thinking of selling HARMONY, you still intend to do it tomorrow?

As a better indicator to salt of world inflation I suggest we use the price of a 5lb Dutch CHEESEHEAD world wide. I hope you have no objections.

@ CHEESEHEAD, just a coincidence...

(Tue Apr 07 1998 01:56 - ID#340302)
...I really cannot expand on any comments. However, I can provide you a little puzzle for you to consider....





You follow?

Now here's the final piece...






You follow.



(Tue Apr 07 1998 02:01 - ID#339212)
@ Farfel

Thanks, I read between the lines. It is heading South.

Never had it so good! Never whatsoever, as Mc Millan once said.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 02:07 - ID#340302) Afro-Americans would say...'s real bad!

You follow?


(Tue Apr 07 1998 02:09 - ID#433422)
Like most other things, ya gotta weed through the bs to find what ya want. What I find so wierd is that there seems to be such a polarization of "the masses", ie. those that delve into word affairs and take the responsibility of remaining informed, and those that don't. What's even wierder is how those that don't think that those of us who do are kooks.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 02:11 - ID#433422)
Too bad about Tammy

(Tue Apr 07 1998 02:11 - ID#260252)
Yes, I feel similarly regarding the information found at this site. What is interesting is that I have tried discussing some of this site's ( poster's ) concepts and ideas re: markets, POG, Y2K, etc. with individuals ( friends, family, coworkers, etc. ) on the outside. Suffice to say, they all think I'm loopy. Proof positive that something's going/coming DOWn.

Also, this site really keeps one up-to-date. Most people I talked to last week had no idea as to the significance of April 1 ( Japan ) - I'm guessing most still don't.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 02:16 - ID#255151)

And the Hell of it is, those who have had their heads buried in the sand, have kicked ass in their investments up to now!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 02:18 - ID#340302)
@SELBY...your 01:51 article re: GOLD is a MUST READ...


(Tue Apr 07 1998 02:19 - ID#433422)
171SO3, read our last four posts

we,ve both said the exact same thing, wierd, you're probably sayin "this" too! One of us oughtta shut up before someone starts bitchin' about double posts!
Wheredja get "171S03, is the "0" an O or a zero?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 02:27 - ID#433422)
Yeah, Auric, it would seem that way, BUT

What those people don't realize is that THEY"VE GOT TO GET THAT MONEY OUT OF THE STOCK MARKET BEFORE IT IS THEIRS. They have loaned that money out, and every body 'in the market" thinks "THEIR" shares are worth "9000"......boy are they in fer a surprise!
I'm sorry, but I CAN"T WAIT TO SAY "I TOLD YOU SO!"

(Tue Apr 07 1998 02:32 - ID#431263)
Must be Myrmidrunk posting some more of his skunkworks! You still alive, you low-life stueck von scheiss! Put some LIHIR in your bear and put a grin on your chin! And some haar auf deinem Brust by gar!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 02:34 - ID#260252)
The handle should read 17 ISO 3. 17 is the density for AU ( actual range is 15 to 19.3 ) , ISO is its structure ( Isometric ) , and 3 is its hardness ( Mohs Scale ) . Wanted to say it another way, I guess.

Re: the people who have been making tons of dough in the markets through no planning of their own - I keep thinking they're gonna get nailed when the DOW takes its plunge, but they may be so far ahead that it doesn't matter. Meaning... they have their expensive Bay Area home ( land ) with the Sport Ute ( which has never been offroad, mind you ) and loads of other trappings. Maybe at worst they'll experience a minor lifestyle adjustment ( selling of the SUV ) . Pretty nice gamble to date. ( I must be living to close to the Bay )

John Disney__A
(Tue Apr 07 1998 02:35 - ID#24135)
Fear cuts both ways
To Myrmidon
1. Not long ago that Harmony traded at about
10$. Since then its resource base has gone from 20
mill to 70 mill ounces and its costs from about 330$
to as little as 280$/oz
2. Last year during a 3 month spell its price FELL
from about 37 rand to 22 rands. A total of about
1.5 million shares traded over the entire 3 month
period. Yesterday and Friday last week a total of
1.5 million shares traded in two days.
3. the area from 22 to 36 is effectively a "gap"
as it encompasses very little volume.
4. I wonder who the buyers are .. there is nothing
like this volume in the ADRs. Its either the RSA
financials or the Europeans.
5. Im afraid of gold.. not Harmony... Ill sell a bit ..
and Ill sell mostly Randfontein. Ive still got a hour or so
left before the market opens.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 02:45 - ID#248180)
J.Disney/Oris & All "RSA - Russia - PGM's- Banks
J.Disney @ 00:57 - "Bingo"!!! I do not think that RSA was in Moscow to discuss the price of eggs and chickens in China. ( Although the egg/chicken moniter is important to international economic stability ) .
RSA & Russia most probably will form a market alliance or at least shared information as the top two PGM producers. The entire world is busy carving and shaping new alliances. Stratfor Systems reports confirm this.
It would be an interesting exercise in DD to inspect the Share Register of Norilsk and its' subsidaries. One would also have to check the share registers of the major shareholder banks in Norilsk. You might see the connection or at least the reason for a marketing alliance.
New Russians love Western "Buzziness" and "Marrkkitting". Very fast learners. Our friend Oris often says never underestimate Russia. Russia never spills a drop or drops his pickle.
Cheers, I must be away for a few hours.

John Disney__A
(Tue Apr 07 1998 02:48 - ID#24135)
Ing should be renamed Nong
to anyone ..
A "renowned" gold analyst that knows nothing about RSA
golds .. well pardon me if I discount everything he says.
There are many guys on this site that now know a lot
more about gold mines and their economics than most NA

(Tue Apr 07 1998 02:52 - ID#340302) continue to shoot yourself in the foot...
...a continuous attack against N.A. golds is an attack against S.A. golds.

IMHO One market will not do well unless the other does, my mouse-related friend.


(Tue Apr 07 1998 02:57 - ID#347127)

This exponential rise with the double gap converging to infinity scared me on HARMONY. If we see some consolidation in gold we may see a pullback by 15% in the stock. This rate of upward acceleration makes me skeptical, even with the good fundamentals you pointed out.

I have no technical problem with any of the others and DROOY looks orderly. Good luck John.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 03:00 - ID#433422)
Since my prediction is as good as any one elses,.....

POG will make 400+ this year, DJIA will "correct" to7800-8200 by 1-1-99, DJIA will hit 6800 before12-31-99 with POG at 450 or so, by 2-1-00, DJIA will be at 3000-4000 with POG AT 1100-1400.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 03:02 - ID#347127)

All we need is an international gold fund. I know not of such a fund, but I surely think it would be desirable by investors if it was available.

John Disney__A
(Tue Apr 07 1998 03:07 - ID#24135)
Amazed mouse speaks ..
But Farfel ( of the bluto armpits )
I said nothing against NA golds.. are you dreaming my stinky
friend.. reading my poor imaginary posts in your sleep .. are
you reading my mind??
... and why is your foot bleeding??.
NA golds are fine .. they just have high costs and no reserves.
.. and I said nothing against them until you reminded me

To others of sound feet .

What happened to kleptofartinratf@g
Remenber .. an idiot savant is still an idiot...

(Tue Apr 07 1998 03:09 - ID#431263)
Herr Myr--
Unless it was run by somebody like the Dalai Lama it would soon begin to polarize like a bar magnet into ALL NA or ALL SA! Such is human nature, human ego, human prejudice and personal preference! Anyway, we've already got some international gold funds out there--like INIVX, BGEIX, GRFRX and GHAAX to name but a few of the better ones!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 03:13 - ID#39828)
aurator, re your fart at 21.44 on Mon 6
Thats what it was wasnt?. Oh come on now. Bit more choke and
you could have kickstarted that one.

John Disney__A
(Tue Apr 07 1998 03:13 - ID#24135)
Better even than the pregnant bull formation ..
for Myrmidon....

The " exponential rise with the double gap converging to infinity"
is my favorite formation..

Better even than the old "winged .. tee"

(Tue Apr 07 1998 03:21 - ID#266105)

"Meanwhile, the torrent of debt issuance continued
from the FHLB system, which raises money for member banks
to lend to thrifts and banks across the country, primarily
to finance mortgages. The government-sponsored agency passed
the Treasury in the first quarter, as the bond market's
most-active issuer, selling $593 billion of securities,
compared with an estimated $515 billion from the Treasury."

- Credit Markets; WSJ; 4/3/98; C17

(Tue Apr 07 1998 03:23 - ID#433422)

(Tue Apr 07 1998 03:25 - ID#347127)
CBS MARKET WATCH HAS GOLD AT $311.50, up $1.00

(Tue Apr 07 1998 03:39 - ID#266105)
@of mice and chickens

J.Disney @ 00:57 - "Bingo"!!! I do not think that RSA was in Moscow to discuss the
price of eggs and chickens in China. ( Although the egg/chicken moniter is important to
international economic stability ) .


It was the bowtied Jimmy Rodgers statement a couple years
back that Chinese leadership announced the policy aim of increasing
the average Chinese family's weekly intake of eggs from, I think, two
to three. And that accomplishing that would take the entire grain
output of Australia to feed the marginal chicken. Jimmy went on
to mention that Australia is one, I think, of the world's top
three grain producers.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 03:47 - ID#284255)
Gold chart
GCM8 chart on 720 minutes.

Nice looking wave pattern.
Definitely a short term uptrend.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 03:47 - ID#22956)
A gentlemen's wager?? Hmmmmmmm....Some here would say I am no gentleman ( not you Ted ) . I accept regardless. I say it will finish this week......BELOW 310. Let the wager be on. But let us wager something.......I need a mate for my wink. ;- ) await the reply

 ( $ ) 

(Tue Apr 07 1998 04:19 - ID#22956)
scratch paper calculations
i.e. not exact. Give or take, rough #'s, etc.

For my demonstration I will use the .62 gold Fibo#

340 ( sept high )

280- ( jan low )


60 = ( with me so far? )

60 x .62 = 37.20 + 280 = 317.20 ( still there? )

Todays high ( June Comex ) = 316.80 close enough ( see where I'm goin'? )

It retraced to 62%. Now it is time for the correction. No?

Now, where will the correction lead us? To ANOTHER 62% of last move? Well, that would be 306..... ( hmmmmmm ) .....GSC's # earlier this eve. Chalk one for Cole. Or......will it be 62% of the last bigger move ( the low ) ....That would put us in the 303 range. I even see room below 300. There seem to be some nice gaps down there. This is one fun game.......And I really like this Fibo stuff. OK.

Now it is time for some tough guys to blow



forgive me all fibo purists...I am just scratching on paper...... ( ohmy ) .

(Tue Apr 07 1998 04:55 - ID#393224)
Breaking News!! F.P.I.C. to get new teeth.
Reuters ( April 07 )

The Federal Penis Inspection Commission is to get new teeth. A bill has been introduced by Republican members of congress to control these deadly weapons and to keep them out of the hands of innocents. The chairman of the F.P.I.C. ,Mr. John Stiff, stated "We will go to any lengths to curb their use. The situation is at crisis proportions when news headlines discuss nothing but the misuse of these weapons. We have some hard decisions to make but are not afraid of taking the bit between our teeth."

Commenting on the new legislation, the President of the N.P.A., Mr. Richard Longley, remarked "It is the right of all male Americans to use these weapons without government interference. The Federal judge in the Paula Jones case upheld our constitutional right to bare these weapons."

(Tue Apr 07 1998 05:37 - ID#358318)
Stand by your gold
Sometimes it's hard to be a goldbug,
Giving all your love to just one metal.
Longs'll have bad times and shorts'll have good times,
POG doin' things that you don't understand.
But if you love gold, you'll forgive it,
Even though it's hard to understand.
And if you love gold, oh buy more of it,
'Cause after all Dow's just a bubble.
Stand by your gold...

(Tue Apr 07 1998 05:43 - ID#255151)
With a Wink and a Nod

EB--Winner gets to name the charity we each donate $50 to. Fair dinkum?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 05:53 - ID#284255)
Avid chatter - the merrits of the approaching bear
a crash now is much too obvious. There's a million and one dippies who missed the jan-apr run just waiting for a pull back to get their leg in. It just ain't gonna happen. Not for a while...

I have never traded a bear market so I am scared silly of one. I would much rather have a crash and get on with the bull again.

You get the prize for naming it a bear first. I respectfully disagree. This selloff should give a good buy anon. Bear markets dont start with bonds and Utes where they are now. Could be some good quick profit on the downside for a few days, but we'll see higher prices in a few weeks.

If 17.50 breaks, 1100 is in view. If 1100 breaks, its a correction. It AINT a bear noway nohow. That is for the autumn.

the bear before the week is out!

you basing no bear on the bond rally?

Utes are more important than bonds in my model. No bear ever with Utes here.

I didn't really call it a bear. I did call it distribution however. Bear markets can only be judged somewhat after they start. The action today was bearish, however. I hope we never see a bear market, although I would like to see a significant amount of air let out of this bubble, ala 1987. I take the prize however, if this turns out to be the start of something ( kidding ) .

I say we go higher after this pullback. For the record. Are you willing to go on the record that its all over?

It ain't over 'til the fat lady gargles and she ain't even sent for the listerine yet

how can people play the bear market if they cannot play the bull market?

the bear is even more tricky than the bull, has anyone here really studied a bear in detail?

If this was the TOP, I can say I sold it within a handle of the top. Problem is, though, I was long a couple hours later.: )

I won't argue with the classic definitions, but spoos are a commodity now, and should probably be treated as such from a T/A standpoint.

If we're putting our opinions up for the record, I've got a minimum fibonacci target of Dow 10,500 due around late summer.

You wont miss it by much.

Downturn in vix is not a good precursor for a major correction. If the action today was as so bearish, we would certainly see the number rising. Considering the risks at these loftly levels, the vix is very tame.

spoos, commodities, currencies, stocks. all follow the law of linkage, fundamental, t/a indicators.if you understand the whole scheme, opportunities are all over the place at any given time.

put a chart up a few days ago that was a dead ringer for today. Dont remember whenm it happened, but the failure of the first rally at the early high after big gap is always baaaad.

over the very long run the market always goes up, so i would agree that no matter low long or short a "correction" the market will be higher after it is over. when this tops it will only be a third wave completion out of 1982. the 4th could last a year or more however.

I gog all kinds of opinions, like most fokes. I would not bet on an up close tomorrow. All I'm sure of is that today's low will break tomorrow. It may go on down, or it may reverse. But the low WILL break. May be a real good buy when it does, or it may tank. It wont take long to know when we get there.

if equities didn't go up, people would insist on investing in real stuff and prices would go up. better to keep all the dough in paper where it can do no harm.

when one has no idea what value is realistic price can do some pretty crazy stuff and make the path up look like a gentle rise in comparison

I'm not trying to sell fear...just that when something behaves irrationally on the way up it can also behave just as irrationally on the way down

the market could lose 40% of it's value and still the long term holders would tout it as being a good investment

the poor guy who bought it at the top however would never accept that arguement

won't take a genius to figure out that alot of folks will have been had... all the arguements about how the existing investors will be held prisonner to an ever rising market will fall on deaf ears

when markets enter new territory it is safe to assume that the territory could contain many deep abyssis as well as peaks

I'm in total agreement with you ( and always have been ) . But there's a time for being long and a time for being short. Now is not the time to be short.

I never heard of a good time to be short alpha..... generally these things are not well advertised:}

I mean how ever would they be able to find all the suckers to be bagholders if they advertised that the market prices would fall?:}

That would presume it is in somebody's interest for market prices to fall. In reality it is a very sad occurance - its people's life savings and wealth accumulated over many years. While it is everyone's best interest to warn of over-valuations and to issue cautions, it's in no-one's interest to promote a crash. Equity investment is not a zero-sum game like speculating on futures, earnings do increase, and companies do grow. And the suckers haven't done too badly so far.

it may seem to some dillusional that this bull market may come to an abrupt end ....but how else should such a thing be expected to expire?

we are way past the stage of warnings of overvaluations ....the greeness of greed tends to cloud the eyes.....yes companies were more profitable and saw earnings grow but not nearly enuough to cover the type of speculation that has occured

The number of days with 100 point plus moves have diminished drastically. Panic selling/buying is not in evidence. Intraday trading ranges are mild in comparison. If the market does fall over the next day or two it will only be to build a base for the next rally. This bubble is made of hi-tech rubber.

only until the pessimism of sellers is matched by the optimism of buyers. After 1929, it took three years. In October it took 1 day. Who knows?

what is most amazing is the amount of denial out there...... folks are willing to admit that valuations are being pushed to extreme levels but prefer to think that it can continue to rise forever

the scariest thing that I know of is comming to a price level that is completely absurd and then talking oneself into believing that it is sustainable

even scarier is that if enough people believe it, it can rise forever. The limiting factor is that a buyer exists willing to buy your shares at a greater price than you paid for it. Of course, the day will come when buyers head for the hills, and someone is left holding expensive toilet paper. But there is usually some degree of fickleness in the market to herald such times. I don't see any sign of it right now.

truth of it is alpha that nothing is enough to be convincing ...some here say it's a 10% correction...but we have seen the market bounce off that number a couple of times.....15%...nah ........20% starts to get interesting...... course that only brings us back to the end of last year 40% oh that's gotta be the bottom cause look at 87 and the recovery shortly thereafter.....but what about something like 70% or 80% ???? nah "never no way impossible" yet it is quite possible

and if you want the reason to blame it will be asia

we now live in a world that comprises not only america but the rest of the world as well.... and the rest of the world is financially a basket case

America's largest corporations now are dependant not only on NA markets for their revenues but also those of most world countries so what happens to them will affect us

to deny this relationship exists is certain doom

it is very possible. The Dow lost 89% of its value in the 1929/32 slide. But even in the months prior to the 1929 crash, there was severe volatility and fickleness among investors. There is a fairly distinct build up to a crash, a wearing away of confidence. Very different to the present situation.

if I were to tell you alpha that the pattern is identical to 1929 what would you say then?

apart from Asia, world markets are in record territory. Japan is a financial basket case, agreed, but it has been for the last 8 years.

similar in many repects - identical no. And if you were to overlay the pattern of 1929 onto today's action, how far are we from the crash?

we have arrived alpha

I'm not sure what to make of p/c ratios. I suspect they only tell half the story, or maybe a quarter. Are more puts purchased, because they are more readily available, or because there is more demand. Curve traders are generally indifferent to holding puts or calls, since a put plus long equity is equivalent to a call, and a call plus short equity is equivalent to a put.

.....fundamental sentiment indicator site link for today's close....... potential for tomorrow to turn into one really ugly day imho!

we could have a really massive down day commin up ....truly spectacular stuff

some of these gap up's look awesome ..... don't look supportable IMO

WE ARE AT A MOMENTUM CHANGE. Probably a directional change. What the market has been doing, it is going to stop doing. ( at least for a while ) If it is going to keep going up... it is going to go up faster. If it is going down ... it is going down... The trend has changed!! The trend is down until it changes again and that may be tomorrow. ;- ) .....I am getting soooo good.

I'm hearing more and more people talk about the market. Where ever I go, I hear work, poker rooms, grocery store, on planes, etc...

I've heard it before...there is another article at CNNfn that states that "Stock is King." Folks would rather hold stock than cash. In fact, folks wish they had more cash to put into the market. I guess this is where those 125% mortgages come handy.

insurance put buying. This will probably be a stat that won't mean much once the music stops. It will be like the dividend yield in reverse. Eventually it will mean something, but not in the intermediate term. It is hard to find another period of time when the shorts have been treated worse.

makes sense, but wasn't the problem in 87 that they ( fund managers ) stopped buying insurance as they felt it unnecessary. Perhaps we need a lot more upside to replicate that sentiment here.

I'm not sure one day will suffice mits certainly there won't be any cheering from my section of the bleachers if this one turns into another bear killing festival....but I do think this one will end up being very different than the rest ....much more devasting phycologically cause it's gone up so fast

what fun some of these bullish folks are....stating that it's almost patriotic to see markets continue going higher ...they point to how much wealth is being created ....making millionaires out of paupers ....well the truth of the matter is the only thing that they have created here is one gigantic ponzai scheme that will come apart at the seams and wreck havoc on the population

japan suddenly a non-event, perhaps a turnaround. Time to buy nikkei calls and sp puts?

it's always the same ...just when it looks like it's about to burt into 100's of mirades of colors hesitates and in that one moment of weakness when all eyes are focused upon it expecting the worst just lays down and dies

in that moment of weakness when the light is blinding you must strike and plunge your weapon into the soft vulnerable tissue

but as you say the level of optimism is high ...nobody thinks this can turn down here ...yet it will and probably with an unimaginable vengence

just wanted to say the game is JUST getting started. The break will indeed be glorious, but they are absolute masters at stringing this thing out ( pressing higher and higher over time -- the hard way ) No easy money trading spoos, do what is hard and you'll be alright

(Tue Apr 07 1998 05:58 - ID#284255)
Round-table meeting on Russian govt crisis starts

Jakarta seen announcing IMF agreement on Wednesday
Banking sources said that out of a total private debt of around $74 billion, about $35 billion was the immediate target for some form of settlement between debtors and creditors.

Mike Sheller
(Tue Apr 07 1998 06:31 - ID#347447)
Since nobody asked
Just raising my head up from the jugglings of life these days to chime in my opinion. Don't want to get rusty...or too timid. Gold looks to be a price chart feeling a base in here. Next important resistance is at 330ish. Silver looks to have completed a 5 wave leg up, and abc correction, and is forming a launching shoulder for a run at new highs. Remember, lads n' lassies, Jupiter conjuncts SSC's Sun at 22 Pisces in Mid May. That's either a kick in the teeth to silver or a joyous boost. I'll go with the more optimistic scenario, inasmuch as I'm long SSC from around a buck. World News will be very important April/May. At its current angle of acceleration, gold could get to 330 and consolidate while silver catches up in mid May. Then they could both rock n' roll. Chance for $9 silver this year - that would put SSC at at least 2.25 ( next resistance ) or perhaps best case $4 or $5, don't you think? Gold past 330 will be the new bull pawing the earth.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 07:05 - ID#330175)
'True confessions'----don't hate MOI goldbugs but---------------
I sold my entire stake in ABX @ 23.25 ( NYSE ) yesterday~~~~~~~just call MOI Benedict Arnold.......

(Tue Apr 07 1998 07:09 - ID#35767)
"over the long haul the mkt always goes up" Just ask the Japanese. When this bear begins it will be at least 30 years before we see these levels again. Dow will have major support in the 1000-1300. I think there is a good chance that yesterday was the high. But the mania about 10000 is so pervasive I am sure the boys will do everything they can to push it there. But time is running out. Everyone is in so crash potential is great. Asia is burning/ the US dollar is going to be challenged and has reached its high as with bonds. Yesterday may have been the financial sector blowoff the reverse of when Citibank was at 11 this would be a fitting top for this bull. The underlying economy is a sea of red ink which through its expansion keeps things afloat. The spin and almost lies on tv have reached the point that anyone who is not convinced will never get in.

The Merrill story on silver was to throw cold water on gold as "they have to keep the cat in the bag" . Any investment interest in gold and all contril would be lost. We are getting close. Hopefully yesterday will be a multi decade high in stocks. We will know soon.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 07:27 - ID#341189)
Gold buzz from Australia

(Tue Apr 07 1998 07:29 - ID#330175)
Watch the bastard(ABX)----------------
soar now~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

(Tue Apr 07 1998 07:30 - ID#330175) YOU think we are at the start of a new 'bull-market'--------
in equities?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 07:31 - ID#26793)
Citicorp-Travelers merger tied to Asian market penetration (Americanization?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 07:33 - ID#284255)
Has the Dow topped?
Like you, I think that this could be the top,
But then I turn and reflect on the power that these markets have.

That last lot of Avid chatter was interesting but some of the first dozen or so comments were from Oldman.
And I have learnt to respect his wisdom.

This could, should, would be the top except that the market movers still have pocket's full of cash.

Either there has to be a major sentiment change -
And we've seen that nothing financial, that has been able to rock these markets.
Or something major - and I mean major, has to enter the stage.

I realize the excesses that have been reached,
And realize that this beast has gone to far.
And that the end is nigh for equities.

But you have to respect the power of this bull.

Since the begining of this leg starting at the end of 1994,
There has been 4 waves.
Soon we will reach the top of the fourth wave.

Perhaps there could be five waves.
Heaven knows there is enough liquidity around.
As for gold?
I think that both EB and Auric have an even bet 50/50
And the winner will define the trend.
Short term up.
If it breaks higher then the gold bear is dead.

And LORDY then we will have to put up with
EBgoldilocks being a converted long.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 07:34 - ID#35767)
You did not read my post. I think the Bull ( sh ) is almost over. You can cut the mania with a knife. Everyone is talking about the mkt. It seems to have reached a deity status. Truly amazin'! 1929 or Japan could not have been a greater mania than this.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 07:36 - ID#26793)
BOJ Governor complains that yen fall is "a bit excessive" (stop printing then!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 07:40 - ID#26793)
BOJ Deputy Gov. seems to be at odds with his boss. "Prices falling too much"

(Tue Apr 07 1998 07:42 - ID#45173)
ROR: sober analysis of the stock market
I agree with your assessment that the market is at or close to a peak that we will not see here in the USA again for a while. Things certainly seem to be going our way, but there are a fair number of happy coincidences that are making that possible. Dynamics that continue to hold the value of the dollar in spite of the massive debt behind it is a major weak point, as is low oil prices and an influx of Asian investment capital escaping falling equity markets there. I've attached URLs for a couple of good articles that help explain what looks like inexplicable behavior in the stock market. These suggest a retreat from 9000 in 1998, likely triggered by some political ( Middle East ) or economic ( Asia ) event that portends a lengthy period of instability, as in the 1970's. Good for gold, bad for stocks. I'm not trying to time the market with accuracy, but it's safe to say that a stock market between 9000 and 10,000 is a high and $280 - $310 is a low for gold. Historically, stocks and gold move in opposite directions. I'm buying more gold. This isn't rocket science.

By the way. I have a nutty theory about Buffet and silver. I think Buffet knows his positions in stocks are high risk ( e.g., he owns 36,000,000 shares of Gillette trading at over 40 times earnings--extraordinary for a consumer products company ) and he's hedging with silver. He'd like to hedge with gold, but press coverage of Buffet buying lots of gold would send a scary message to the stock market, thus hammering his stock investments, and contributing to the very event he fears. Silver can be potisioned as a "long term investment in an industrial metal."

(Tue Apr 07 1998 07:43 - ID#26793)
Taiwan banker charges Citibank breaking the rules in derivative trading.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 07:43 - ID#35767)
There was an article by Bill Fleckenstein which reviewed all the previous mania bubbles. None of them ended with "something" happening. They all just exhausted and fell over. The only test for exhaustion can be whether based on the belief in the best case scenario of propounded fundamentals is everyone in who wants to get in. In other words who is not convinced that needs to be convinced. When this is satiated it by definition would mean exhaustion. And dont worry about events they are always reported when prices fall and overlooked when prices rise. I think were close to exhaustion because of the extent of belief and euphoria. We now have operations opening for day trading!!! If your not convinced by now you probably never will be ergo a top. Fleckenstein also noted that in all previous bubbles the fundamentals that would be behind the bear were evident but just ignored in the very late stages of the bubble. All of the manias retreated by a rang of 89-98%. Based on his analysis this is the biggest bubble yet!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 07:46 - ID#26793)
Can you imagine what would happen to the markets today if the Justice Dept. said they were opposed to the Citicorp-Travelers merger on anti-trust grounds?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 07:51 - ID#39828)
Only what goldbugs know already
Tuesday 7 April, 1998 ( 8:45pm AEST )

Japanese economists have described the country's economic
plight as serious and severe

Economic planning agency chief, Koji Omi, made the
warning on the eve of Prime Minister Ryutaro Hashimoto's
announcement on spending.

The agency, which has delivered monthly pessimistic verdicts
on the economy, will release its next report this Friday.

The Industrial Bank of Japan has also warned Japan will be
stuck in recession until at least next year.

It says real gross domestic product growth for the current
year to March 1999 will be negative

Mr Hashimoto has not indicated whether income tax cuts will
be included in a 124-billion dollar economic stimulus package
due to be finalised late this month.

Return to the World News Menu

plus from the Asia Pacific Region in Indonesian, Chinese and Tok Pisin

 1998 Australian Broadcasting Corporation
Tue Apr 7 21:00:00 1998 ( AEST )

AEST = Australian Eastern Standard Time which is 10 hours ahead of UTC ( Greenwich Mean Time )

(Tue Apr 07 1998 07:54 - ID#255151)
Gold History

Gold at times has followed the stock market. It did so from early '85 to the "fall" of '87. The Dow hit 2700+ in August '87. Can't remember if Gold hit $500 or not that year. If it didn't, it got close. I guess my point is, Gold will go where Gold will go. It marches to its own music.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 07:55 - ID#26793)
Japanese bankers fearful US$8.95 trillion (not a typo) at stake in Citibank merger

(Tue Apr 07 1998 07:58 - ID#252391)
EJ Right ON
I think your suggestion that WB's silver play was in part a hedge of his stock positions. The way I read his financial statement amonth ago was that he was saying he couldn't find value to buy with the exception of Silver. The cold towel ML story - out dated at that - what a ploy. You could feel they had to do something. Gold and silver were just about ready to be an embarassment to the equity bull run - potential spoilers of the DOW 9000 party. It all adds up but then sometimes I wonder if I'm not looking for reasons to believe.

More continued weakness at the opening for Silver. Can't determine whether to buy back the PM shares I sold yesterday. Got to think there'll be a little consolidation and probably not much happening with the Eaester holidays at hand.

Using myself as my own contrary indicator. - since I want a contained pull back there won't be one, instead a move steady laboring move higher for PM shares.

As for the equity bull - no I don't think its over yet. Probably yesterday's divergences was an early warning. But I think I clear all my traditional equity positions by the 9th.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 08:00 - ID#330175)
I did read yer post

(Tue Apr 07 1998 08:06 - ID#288369)
@From a deacon of the Church of Goldology, located somewhere in Los Angeles, California....
I had a dream....yes I had a dream. And it was revealed to me that I must pay at the Gate a few golden sheckles so that I may enter into the golden Kingdom. And all others who have fallen short, with a few exceptions like Mother Teresa, must offer the same to Peter. It works kinda' like Disneyland or Knotts Berry Farm.

And paper or Visas will not work....nor a few good deeds...for where in the world do you think these golden streets come from? Somebody's gotta' pay for these roads. amen.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 08:19 - ID#286349)
Yesterdays silver myth, old news...
Maybe we should release some bullish stories about Gold and Silver that have already been released 3 weeks ago.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 08:21 - ID#238295)
June gold down just 30 cents recently. Holding up better than I expected. Now 70% in cash and 30% in PM funds. Loking to push this ratio to fifty/fifty, but only on significnt dips.

The stock market does look toppy, but 10,000 Dow cannot be ruled out before the bear hits. Once the trend reverses it will be a LONG way down. I had thought a long bear narket was more likely than a crash. But the excesses are now so great and valuations so absurd that a crash with virtually no warning seesm the most probable scenario now.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 08:30 - ID#286349)
A nice surprise on a day when must expect a pullback???
Apparently the only ones willing to go short at this time are the speculators. Well I guess we need someone to buy from.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 08:30 - ID#45173)
jims & Auric
On the history of gold and equities moving in opposite directions, I meant over long periods, specifically the past 20 years. The reasons for this are not mysterious. Equity values grow with the growth of profits of corporations. Gold value grows when capital looks for an ultimate safe haven in times of economic and political instability. Most of the capital that goes into gold at these times would be just as happy going into land, except land is not portable and transaction costs and complexity are higher. The equity markets have come to be perceived as so safe over the past 20 years that most stocks don't even pay dividens as they used to have to in order to compete with bonds as safe investments. For this reason--safety and sustained growth--capital invested in the stock market over the past 20 years has done 10 to 100 times better than gold. I've done ok with equities, could have done better, but I can't complain. But I expect that the stock market will not be considered safe if there is a sustained downturn. Yes, bubbles tend to peter out from exhaustion. But my guess is that a huge percentage of the folks in the market now think it's very safe, and that they'll exit in a hurry and stay away for a long time when the market signals it is not safe, such as when it drops back under 8000 or so, at which point there may be some panic dynamics. Just a guess. To the extent that gold is perceived as "safe" this is good news for gold in the short term. However, when I think the stock market's bottomed out, I'm getting rid of my gold and going back into the equity growth game. In an integrated, worldwide, Information Age economy, it's the only game in town for really making $$$.

As for Buffet and silver, I am confused by something. He stated when he purchased that he was making a long term investment in silver. Then he turns around and sells 1/3 of it. What's with that?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 08:31 - ID#238295)
JSE gold index down just 0.5% rhis morning. May not get that sharp dip I'm looking for.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 08:32 - ID#286349)

(Tue Apr 07 1998 08:47 - ID#252391)
EJ - who said WB sold anything?
How do we know WB sold his or part of his silver - rumors put out by ML to contain the recent PM rally. I don't believe it. Look at this gold now up going into the coex opening.If these metals all get up on the day we'll see fireworkss . . . .

(Tue Apr 07 1998 08:47 - ID#358318)
Dow 10,000!
Dow 10,000 will have a much stronger psychological significance than Dow 9,000. Since the mania blow-off peak is driven by investor psychology rather than sober consideration of companies' financial performance data this is definitely an important consideration. When investors see Dow 10,000, they may stop to think 'hey, maybe stocks are valued a bit high' and suffer an attack of vertigo. Humans' tendency to become sick from lack of oxygen at 10,000 feet may become an allegory for the Dow.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 08:49 - ID#20135)
Just a quick repeat... Look at that balancing act in gold ...


Gold 75,000
Silver 18,000
H.G. Copper 8,000

warehouse stocks:
-- GOLD ( Quoted in Troy Ounce

571,508 0 96,147 -96,147 0 475,361
148,278 0 0 0 0 148,278
719,786 0 96,147 -96,147 0 623,639

-- ( Quoted in Troy Ounce )

-201,456 0 33,648,884
-171,573 0 53,757,086
-373,029 0 87,405,970

( Date that Warren sold according to Merrill's Ted Arnold - you got to wonder )
warehouse stocks:
GOLD ( Quoted in Troy Ounce )


0 2,171,375 39,162,855
-214,250 -2,171,375 50,933,471
-214,250 0 90,096,326

Difference before and after sale ( if it occured ) are very bullish for silver because NO SILVER found its way back to COMEX. Maybe Warren sold it back to the Isalmic bank for the minting of Dirhams.

NOW THAT's A STORY. Maybe that's the story???? Probably as accurate as Arnold's and just as selfserving.

And finally, eligible comex gold reserves remain so low that any $100 millionaire sheik or businessman can take them out. Only 1,490 contracts taking delivery and thier gone!!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 08:53 - ID#31868)
WB has not sold one ounce of silver. I repeat WB has not sold one ounce of silver.

He has not sold and will not sell. He sees what anyone who studies silver sees, much, much, much higher prices.

Mike Sheller
(Tue Apr 07 1998 08:56 - ID#347447)
That settles it. No more good deeds, Deacon!
ALL: The Dow will finally top around 9500.
Have a REALLY Great Day All!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 08:57 - ID#252391)
Swiss stocks now down
Swis stocks ballyhooed by CNN earlier are now donw on the day. Globes is only up 100 still projecting a weker opening. Silver now up!!!!!!!!!!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 08:59 - ID#426220)

Trinovant ( Dow 10,000! )

........BLUE SKIES

Blue skies smilin' at me
Nothin' but blue skies do I see
Bluebirds singin' a song
Nothin' but bluebirds all day long

.......................... i. berlin

(Tue Apr 07 1998 08:59 - ID#330175)
June Gold
down .50

(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:00 - ID#252391)
Goose I fail to see a balancing act
What do you mean by a balancing act???/

(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:04 - ID#31868)
Mike Sheller
You said you are in NY? Where? if so.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:09 - ID#288157)
Vronsky--The Dow Song [heard at a party] is an old one called:
"I'm forever blowing bubbles...
Pretty bubbles in the air
They rise so high
Nearly reach the sky
Then like my dreams
They fade and die.

Fortunes always calling
I've looked everywhere
I'm forever blowing bubbles
Pretty bubbles in the air."

It is from the thirties [I think]...{:- ) )

(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:11 - ID#183109)
KOREAN consumer spending down 50%
Per CNN TV here in Japan, KOREAN consumer spending down 50%....wide spread business failures. People are only buying what they absolutely have to buy.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:11 - ID#284255)
Globex down
SPM8 under pressure.

Sold off 5.5 points this morning.

Time for another dippies party.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:12 - ID#358318)
Dow 10,000 by April 15th?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:17 - ID#333127)
Looks to me like the plat. move is over for the time being, Gold?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:18 - ID#20135)
Date: Tue Apr 07 1998 09:00
jims ( Goose I fail to see a balancing act ) ID#252391:
What do you mean by a balancing act???/

My mistake - no balancing act. Just straight drawdown where registered stocks are being moved elsewhere.

Thanks jims.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:25 - ID#45173)
jims & tolerant1: so I misunderstood the WB info on silver
Good, because I've been buying silver, too. By pulling almost completely out of equities yesterday, I've placed my bets on the market not making it to 10,000 and gold and silver rising for a stretch. Even if it does make it to 10,000, I won't feel bad. I rode it up from 1987 and it's ready to go down, either slow and steady or like a rock. Who knows? Keeping 50% in cash for the event. Timing the bottom of the coming bear stock market as well as I timed ( I hope ) the more or less bottom of gold ( with the invaluable advice of the Kitco group ) will be tricky. There's a lot of cash out there for optimists to jump in with. Jumping back into the stock market at the wrong time could be very expensive. I wonder at what point naive investors lose their resolve and dump their mutual funds? My guess is under 8000. That event might push it well below 7000. I guess we'll see soon enough.

Now I gotta go do my job and make some money the hard way: work.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:29 - ID#252352)
Gold producers & % gsin potential

Most of the action and price increase thus far have been in the bigger producers like Barrick, Placer, Greenstone, but there now are very large percentage gain potentials in some of the smaller overlooked producers like Viceroy VOY-tse. Geomaque GEO-tse, and even in some of the well cashed up exploration companies like Pangea PGD-tse with something in the order of $20 million cash and lots of jv'd money being spent on their properties

(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:29 - ID#213265)
@the scene
Yup, a most interesting day to be on Wall Street. This is the cross roads of the bull run. It SHALL either go up even faster, or we go into a correction mode that could last a lot longer than a few days, though with the usual ups and downs. This simply means to get your puttys in hand. A break over about 1150 on the June S&Ps will probably extend the run UP ever faster. A break much below yesterdays low I think will put those puttys to good use.

I believe I'll do some skinny dippin' in the grains today or tomorrow. Should be good for a bounce. Cattle and hogs also should continue to be good. Sugar is so far successfully testing support. Should be about to go. Gap filling in the oils about to finish up?

Gold and silver will be fickle for a short while, but unless silver cracks yesterdays lows, I won't be the one to short it. Buy this stuff at support.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:30 - ID#242249)
And while Europe faces critical challenges,USA and
And while Europe faces critical challenges, Canada and the United States
are not immune.


(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:30 - ID#252352)
Gold producers & % gain potential

Most of the action and price increase thus far have been in the bigger producers like Barrick, Placer, Greenstone, but there now are very large percentage gain potentials in some of the smaller overlooked producers like Viceroy VOY-tse. Geomaque GEO-tse, and even in some of the well cashed up exploration companies like Pangea PGD-tse with something in the order of $20 million cash and lots of jv'd money being spent on their properties

(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:34 - ID#20135)
COMEX Delivery Notices for Today
April 6th

-- -- -- -- TOTAL DELIVERY NOTICES -- -- --
ISSUED TODAY 225 1 198
SO FAR FOR April 3,858 43 3,943

Now the way I read this is "COULD mean trouble for COMEX".


(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:37 - ID#288369)
@?....Will gold shares become the new "paper gold"?
It might be a reasonably good idea for the PM investor to maintain at least a ratio of 1:2 dollars invested in physical:shares....the physical shortage will probably do more to drive up the share prices than buying more shares. It's kinda like us cattle guys....we always have BEEF for dinner. Thank you Ms.'s for dinner!

Now to the office to pump oil to give it away....and as always, GO GOLDBUGS. ( ( Take possession of your PHYSICAL!!! MAKE 'EM TEAR LOOSE OF IT!!! ) )

(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:37 - ID#31868)
Something that bothers me intensely is the fact that they do not run stories on
the financial horrors in Asia. The US government, media, etc. constantly talk about helping the world and making things better for people. Folks in the US have no clue about what is really happening overseas.

The media and government throw in the IMF everywhere they can, and discuss how this will help rectify the economic woes. It makes me sick to think that one penny goes to the dog defiler Camdesuss and the other dirtbags at the IMF, any politician in the US that votes to put one more penny in the coffers of the IMF should be tried for crimes against humanity.

Now that there are major problems in Asia the dirtbag treasonists turn Americas eyes to Africa and present show after show of starving babies and children running amok. Yeah, like these pri_ks have just become aware of the blight in Africa, and the Coward Erect spouting from the mouth like a pig at the trough apologizes for America. That lying low life, self serving dirtbag. Save Africa, I think not, the Coward Erect and the other dirtbags are looking at their next rape victim and brother Jesse is there to fill his pockets. A fat man in a fine suit saying he understands Africa. The whole plan has been going on for over sixty years and culminated in the anti-apartheid sentiment that was rammed down the throats of the American people. What a sham, like the civil war in the United States, RSA was presented to make things look as if they were oh so black and white. Bulls_it of the highest order. It was and is about money and the real money in Africa is spelled N A T U R A L R E S O U R C E S. Plain and simple.

Bill and Jesse, ebony and ivory, what a crock.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:43 - ID#185448)
Interesting thing today on goodoleeuropean stockmarketz: Established markets: down. Eastern europe and pooroleeurope: up. Looks, as if money goes, where upside-potential is assumed. Germany released bad news yesterday, today big demonstrations of unemployed people in more than 300 ( ! ) cities - stockmarket up as bad news are good news ( as well as good news are good news and no news are best news, says the bull ) .
If somebody would ask me: Take your money and run to buy more gold.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:49 - ID#36156)
HighRise - Spot Gold
I have spent hours since yesterday trying to find another ( no relation to ANOTHER ) real-time spot price source ... no luck. All those I find point back to KITCO! Seems to be the only game in town unless I'm searching for the wrong thing.

Is spot gold known by any other name? If it is, let me know and I'll search for that.


(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:51 - ID#288369)
Beautiful...absolutely beautiful! Thanks! and Thanks to ALL for such fine text these last few days!!! Sharefin!, EJ, JD, farfel, SDR, Gooser, eb, aurator, Preachaman, RJ, DA...and ALL!!!!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:55 - ID#342376)
DOW down below 9000....
I subscribe to a site that tracks "floor sentiment" on the exchanges. Today it is sharply negative, something which has not occured in a few months. Have we seen the top?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:56 - ID#31868)
HenryD - someone put this up the other day

(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:56 - ID#258427)
@Henry D...Spot Gold...This one isn't very good, but
it is spot gold...doesn't seem to update very often...but when Kitco is down...whaddaudo??

(Tue Apr 07 1998 09:57 - ID#258427)

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:05 - ID#340286)
OLD GOLD - Only 30%?
I am surprised that you are only 30% in gold stocks and 70% cash. The low in stocks was in december confirmed by the divergence in January when gold made a new low and stocks didn't. Again, stocks are leading the bullion. My subscribers and I are in at 100% since December 7th. This rally is possibly a bear market rally, but we wont know if it is for real for quite a few more months....for now enjoy the ride.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:08 - ID#348286)
@Some Good News for Royal Oak RYO Followers

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:09 - ID#22956)
stuff...then work....
Auric - Fair 'nuff.

Rube - You have it switched...Plat is a 'pause'. It is waiting for all slow pokes to get a board...... ( hint-hint ) .... ( wink-wink ) is over...temporarily.

Sharefin - right 'o mate. Just give me an excuse to dive into gold head first buyin with all 'appendies' and screaming from the roof tops......GO GOLD!!...GO GOLD!!! .....alas, the whites will prove better movers...uh huh.

Ted - sold ABX... ( hmmm ) ...what next? A drip here a drip there......pretty soon there will be torrential flooding.....EH?!? Go ABX...woof-woof!

MikeS - hello's the park?

StudioR - no no no. Thank YOU! :- ) the grind

?ohmy! ( $ ) 

go plat ( way deep ) ...go beans ( straddled ) ...go mark ( getting deeper ) .

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:13 - ID#31868)
excuse the bandwidth - I wanted everyone to see the whole thing. thanks
Death to the U.N. ( by Joseph Farah )

A new report by the United Nations Human Rights Commission calls on the United States to halt use of the death penalty.

I've got a better idea. Let's kill the U.N.

The U.N.'s latest beef is that some U.S. states carry out executions in an arbitrary and discriminatory manner that violates obligations imposed by various international agreements. To come into compliance with international standards of law, the U.N. says, the U.S. must halt all executions.

The report was written by Bacre Waly Ndiaye, a busybody from that well-known bastion of human rights, the African nation of Senegal.

We, in the United States, live in a sovereign nation governed, first and foremost, by a Constitution of the people, by the people and for the people. The day Americans forget that is the day we cease to be Americans and become, God forbid, "world citizens." That would not only be a tragedy for America but for the entire world.

It is becoming increasingly clear that the United Nations is the preferred vehicle of those forces and individuals who would like nothing more than to see the emasculation of sovereign nation-states in favor of global authorities. These forces and individuals make little distinction between countries wracked by civil war, rife with human rights abuses or run by totalitarians, and nations governed by constitutions and elected officials.

Why some otherwise sensible citizens and politicians in the United States continue to support our participation in such an organization never ceases to amaze me.

There can be no question, with the proliferation of international treaties governing human rights, trade, health, weapons, education, sexuality, economics  in short, every facet of human life  that the world is moving inevitably toward global governance. There can also be no question that global governance is, ultimately, the U.N.'s overriding goal. The organization makes little secret of this agenda.

Yet, while there are only a handful of people in the United States who would state openly that they favor such a hideous agenda, the vast majority of Americans tolerate the transfer of their money and, slowly but surely, their most basic freedoms to this wretched, Godless, humanistic harbinger of world totalitarianism.

"Oh, it can't happen here," Americans think. "The U.N. could never exert authority over our lives. The U.N. is needed to keep in line those uncivilized enemies of peace in other parts of the world."

That, my friends, is very short-term thinking, as the report by Mr. Ndiaye illustrates. They're coming after you, Mr. and Mrs. America. It was only a matter of time. And this is only the beginning.

Currently, the United Nations has plans to participate in the confiscation of firearms from civilians around the world. Do you think for a minute the Second Amendment to our Constitution will be a barrier to such plans in the future?

The U.N. is also developing broad plans to organize, train and supervise civilian police forces to do its bidding. Do you suppose those plans are being made only for places like Bosnia and Rwanda?

U.N. officials are also working on ways to impose their own direct taxes so they won't be forced to rely solely on those archaic state governments to pay membership dues. Guess who's going to bear the burden of those new involuntary fees?

Now the U.N. is proposing a new World Court that will have authority and jurisdiction over individuals regardless of whether their nation-state has any complaint against them. Do you really think Americans are safe from the judicial tyranny that will inevitably follow?

The U.N. has many tentacles  from the World Trade Organization to NATO. Americans should fear and loathe such agencies. We should seek to dismantle them. We should abandon them. We should recognize them for what they are. Instead, we permit our government to expand them, enlarge their scope, breed them, transfer our wealth to them, give them new powers over our lives.

Once we concede the U.N. has any legitimate role in the United States  advising us on our own affairs, requiring us to pay for its missions, ordering U.S. military personnel to serve its interests  Americans have begun sliding down the slippery slope to slavery.

It's time to put a stake in this monster's heart  before, with the complicity of our misguided leaders, our own precious and inalienable rights are crucified on the altar of Babel.


Joseph Farah is editor of the Internet newspaper and
executive director of the Western Journalism Center, an independent group of investigative reporters.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:17 - ID#288157)
BOJ's new chief...[a currency trader in his younger days!]
FT Tues Apr 7 1998
JAPAN: Veteran with vigorous view
Gillian Tett meets Masaru Hayami, Bank of Japan governor [Excerpts]

Mr Hayami has the advantage of speaking English. He understands international finance. He supports a strong currency: in 1995, for example, he published a book entitled "The Day the Yen Wins Respect". He also has a reputation for being outspoken.

Some economists think the Bank will now absorb the liquidity. Yet if it does not, the combination of lower market rates and more liquidity could loosen monetary policy. This in turn could lead to a sharp weakening of the yen, or even boost growth.

Mr Hayami is reluctant to reveal his plans. But broad monetary indicators, he points out, are not alarming. If the politicians cut taxes, the Bank must also play its own part in boosting the economy. "From the Bank's side I am thinking of how to increase the money supply needed for companies."

There is another area where Mr Hayami could also play a critical role: the reform of Japan's banks. Mr Hayami believes that the "worst is now over for the financial system", following November's turmoil. Yet with the banks weighed down with Y77,000bn worth of problem loans, he accepts that the financial sector's problems are dragging down the economy.

Will Mr Hayami force through change? Perhaps. He argues that excessive government regulation has prevented Japan's service sector from becoming competitive in the past. Consequently, Big Bang means that "Japanese banks which have been protected under the so-called convoy system ( where the strong have protected the weak ) will be pushed into the competitive world."

The country should also welcome foreign competition - even if foreign companies win all the prizes instead of Japanese businesses. "I do not shy away from the so-called 'Wimbledon' effect," he says, referring to the widespread fear in Tokyo that financial reform could lead to foreigners winning the juicy financial prizes, just as non-British tennis players win the prizes at the UK- staged Wimbledon tournament.

He wants faster deregulation in areas such as the government bond market, stifled by a taxation system that discriminates against non-Japanese. "The securities transaction tax and corporation tax system should be reformed - we need a level playing field," he says."

Such calls will sound attractive to the outside world. If Mr Hayami's appeals for tax cuts and deregulation are heeded, Japan may belatedly be recognising the scale of its current economic woes. The country has a history of changing direction with determination when a national consensus is reached and Mr Hayami might be one sign of such a switch.
If so, that is encouraging. But if Japan does not embrace a policy switch now, the prospect is alarming. In effect the economic powerhouse that men such as Mr Hayami have helped build for half a century could be heading for steady decline.

Mr Hayami's 73rd year could be one of the most crucial of his entire career.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:19 - ID#251268)
Ouch~~~come back baby!!!
I was thinking about Kaplan's letter of yesterday,when he said
gold rally wasn't influenced by shorts covering,H"MM~~
maybe not big producers but the best way for a small spec. who
sold gold calls to cover himself would be to go long?
am I thinking right?just don't want to accept all that anyone says
without thinking it through~~~fight back gold!!!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:24 - ID#267276)
Your so right we must get out of the u.n. asap. If you want informative info on the u.n. check out the John Birch Society they have a web page and they are staunch supporters of our CONSTITUTION and want us out of the u.n. and I agree.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:27 - ID#250353)

Right on! to your post ref. the UN.

I believe the Bible foretells exactly that
which is now occurring.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:28 - ID#32078)
The following sites provide an accurate future quote which tells the change in the future for the day. They are both close to realtime and change often, no 20 min delay.

The change in the future is very close to the change in spot, so if you know yesterday's spot...

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:29 - ID#284255)
On the lighter side - after Tolerants death rave
There was a boy who worked in the produce section of the market. A man came in and asked to buy half a head of lettuce. The boy told him that they only sold whole heads of lettuce, but the man replied that he did not need a whole head, but only a half head. The boy said he would go ask his manager about the matter.
The boy walked into the back room and said, "there is some as**ole out there who wants to buy only a half a head of lettuce." As he was finishing saying this he turned around to find the man standing right behind him, so he added, "and this gentleman wants to buy the other half."
The manager okayed the deal and the man went on his way.
Later the manager called on the boy and said, "you almost got yourself in a lot of trouble earlier, but I must say I was impressed with the way you got yourself out of it. You think on you feet and we like that around here. Where are you from, son?"
The boy replied, "Canada, sir."
"Oh really? Why did you leave Canada" asked the manager.
The boy replied, "They're all just whores and hockey players up there."
"My wife is from Canada!!"
The boy replied, "Really! What team did she play for?
Nose Stuffing ( Limburger Cheese )
Hans Kleiber, of West Berlin, holds the record.In a contest held on May 1, 1986, Hans managed to stuff 13 ounces of Limburger into his nostrils in less than a minute.Hans' closest competitor gagged on nine ounces and was disqualified.

Roach ( Largest )
Rita Carlson, of Pasadena, CA, claims the record for having raised the world's largest roach. Her record-setting roach is over a foot long and weighs close to two pounds ( 1992 ) ."Plenty of protein," Rita told us, "and plenty of good, natural vitamins helped to make this roach into a champion. You should have seen it when I first found it crawling around my kitchen." {There are a couple more roach records.One is highest paid for a roach named Lassie II ( $112,450 ) and longest living ( Lassie, 12 years ) .Both roaches came from roach aficionado Sheila Biderman. About the oldest roach, Sheila reports that "She's like one of the family. If she ever gets too old to poke around food by herself, you can bet I'll do the humane thing and step on her, record or no record."}

Tapeworm ( Longest )
Sally Mae Wallace of Great Grits, Mississippi, holds the record. On Sep 5, 1991, doctors extracted 37 feet ( continuous ) of tapeworm from Sally."About after 20 feet of that thing had come out of my mouth," Sally told us, "I just knew I had the record.I was really filled with joy."

Tongue ( Hairiest )
Selma Ruby, of Dallas, Texas, holds the record.Selma's tongue is fully covered with hair ( 1992 ) ."I've been thinking about having it removed by an electrolysist," Selma told us, "though lately people have been telling me that it's beautiful."

Underarm Hair ( Length )
Florence Floss of Ban, Idaho, holds the record.On July 15, 1992, the hair growing out of Florence's left armpit stretched to a length of 34 inches.This was more than enough for a record, but Florence hopes to have a yard of hair dangling from her armpit soon."I shave the other armpit," Florence reported to us.

Feet ( Smell )
On Aug 21, 1991, Wanda Lake, 18, broke the record held by Dave Horrigan. Wanda removed her shoes in the crowded lobby of a Los Angeles theatre. In the five minutes that followed, the lobby was a chaotic mass of panic-stricken people trying desperately to escape. In the end, 42 people were sick, and 14 others had passed out.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:31 - ID#342282)
AZAU re your 00:55
Excellent idea. Before Citicorp/Traveler deal trashes Glass-Steagal, you may find some good allies in congress. Try Orin Hatch and he may have some good leads. With the roots the banking industry has there, I bet there issome boiling going behind the scenes. Good luck, please post findings, Charlie

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:34 - ID#413109)
Just Curious
NIKKEI- Hey look at the charts of the last 9 years, and ask yourselves
with all news coming out being negative, and the Nikkei has had a sub-
stantial correction, why not be a contrarian, and let's say compare the
long term chart to the 1929-1937 US market, and WOW, the pattern does
look similar, now doesn't it?
Granted no 2 markets are the same, but there are striking resemblances
and we have had the correction and the news is constantly negative, but
the Nikkei is holding. So where are some contrarians, amongst all of you
sharp analysts?
Gold, oh yes- gold- my work, which I've described is a little different
than the norm, shows a move to the 335-355 range in the near term of about a couple of months or so. Enjoy the ride, it may be a bit bumpy
at times, but that's to be expected. Short term a correction is in order

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:34 - ID#31868)
sharefin - "death rave" - I am shocked and cut to the quick and up until your
comment I did not know I had any.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:36 - ID#267276)
On the lighter side.
Back in the 70s I owned a bar and participated in all the things that go on in barrooms. I chugged with a little beer in the mugs 24 raw eggs in 25 seconds. It could have gotten into the Guiness Book except it was not official by their standards,but I did it. Of course this was before colesterol.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:36 - ID#333127)
to EB
Hope I'm right on plat, sold my SWC at 25, now at 26+, want adip to re-buy

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:42 - ID#348129)
Gold under attack by the shorts. IMO this will be a good short term indicator.
If Gold can come back with a gain, the market has good underpinnings and the rally should continue, IMO.....

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:43 - ID#238295)
CC: As usual Eldorado's analysis of the stock market is right on the money.

To put things in perspective, the two strongest bull markets for gold and gold stocks -- the early 1930s and the 1970s -- both occurred after the biggest stock market runs of the century had come to screeching halts. Can anyone doubt that the end of the current wildest bull run ever will have a similar aftermath?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:44 - ID#284255)
Could have been a "I LOVE GOLD" rant?

I did count 2 mentions of the word "death"
And 1 mention of "kill"

Followed by:
"It's time to put a stake in this monster's heart"
"crucified on the altar of Babel."

Must have been the smoke in my eyes.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:47 - ID#31868)
sharefin - no offense intended and none taken,
stunned I have quick though, didn't know I had it in me.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:48 - ID#341261)
Here it comes...DOW 10,000 mania....
The 10,000 Dow? How about a 960,470 Dow by the time your infant kids reach middle age?

That's the level the Dow Jones industrial average is expected to hit at the middle of the next century, based on the current bull market frenzy.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:51 - ID#334219)
"Can anyone doubt that the end of the current wildest bull run ever will have a similar aftermath?""

Make sense. The problem is we don't know when this bull will end. It could be well in the next century. I sure hope that gold will begin his way before the peak in US Equities..otherwise it could be a long wait.
As usual, we will know only after the fact.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:53 - ID#238295)
Looks like we're getting that correction after all. Tornto gold index off 2%. Probably another 2-3% to go on the dwonside

(Tue Apr 07 1998 10:58 - ID#324266)
I'm with you in your optimism for gold and gold stocks, but my gut is telling me that "past performance is no guarantee of future results".

(Tue Apr 07 1998 11:00 - ID#251268)
sojmebody jumped all over silver
at about 6.20,got to be some big fund?I expect gold to be
in the green soon.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 11:02 - ID#251268)
sorry multiple typo's

(Tue Apr 07 1998 11:13 - ID#36156)
All - Spot Gold
Thanks to all for the URLs. There doesn't seem to be anything out there with the look and feel of the KITCO quote frame. Then again, that's the way it oughta be, no/yes?

HenryD - GG!

Gusto Oro
(Tue Apr 07 1998 11:18 - ID#377235)
Thanks for the futures quotes links. If the Buffett thing were a negative, the price wouldn't be up today. Silver is showing the resiliance of a bull.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 11:19 - ID#284255)
Comparison charts
Old Gold
Here are some charts to show how gold equities fared during the 87 crash.
Even though gold topped after the Dow crashed,
Tthe gold equities fared no better than the industrial equities.
They then bounced around for a year or so till they started trending again.

87 crash: weekly
Dow, Oz gold index, XAU, gold price

Long term: monthly
Dow, Oz gold index, XAU, gold price

Shows the Dow over the top of the gold price.

The divergence this time leads me to believe,
That gold will act differently this time.
How the gold shares respond is yet to be seen.
But they will be predictable in a Dow crash.
They will suffer like all paper.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 11:27 - ID#227238)
Short term harvest time.
Did a little selling this morning. .... in the anticipation of a dip. Cleared the position in SWC which was looking toppy on the weekly chart. Even though the daily chart is well mannered. Also cleared half of the position in HGMCY.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 11:47 - ID#213265)
@the scene
Gold; One gap filled, one to go. Don't want any left behind. I'm expecting June gold to fill it at/near 305. It may ping a wee bit lower.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 11:52 - ID#284255)
24 eggceteras
What an amazing mouthful.
Lucky the eggs weren't a little older.

The sun's splitting it's sides - amazing pictures of solar flares.
The pictures make a great Win95 background.
Right click on picture and 'Set as Wallpaper'

(Tue Apr 07 1998 11:58 - ID#269409)
@ Silver vs. Gold........ "New" buyer needed
Gold running out of steam as expected by many......appears that Silver has reversed direction and heading positive, Merril Lynch trash, lies, and videotape notwithstanding. Hey Armstrong and cronies...time for more WB selling rumors eh? Let's see, lawsuits are passe now, WB sell rumors not working well about the long lost Hunt silver hoards being found on a desert island somewhere for an encore?

Meanwhile, for you ANOTHER disciples...what we need for Gold to sustain a rise, is a HUGE new CB bank Gold sale, yes? Maybe 500 toms or so. It'd be SO bullish....After all, wouldn't this mean there are BUYERS of all that Gold? Let us see how the next huge CB sale drives Gold's price up as these new purchases show Gold market not as before and the shorts rush to cover...what's that you say? CB sales have driven Gold DOWN for 3 years running? ...........Ohhhhh........NEVER MIND!

PH in LA
(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:06 - ID#225408)
Who is ANOTHER and why does he post?
In light of ANOTHERs startling and explicit posts of late it behooves us all to ponder his identity, since it bears so directly on his credibility. The present post examines this issue and in the process will try to put the views of both the scoffers, and those who unreservedly embrace his THOUGHTS, into better perspective.

It has been suggested here that ANOTHER is a highly-placed official or investor in the Arab world, I suppose based mostly on his frequent reference to "western thought" and his intermittently non-English syntax and grammar. The problem with this interpretation is that it fails to address the question "why does he post".

A salient ( and to some irritating ) feature of ANOTHERs posts is their didactic nature. ANOTHERs intention is obviously to teach us. History and economics are the subject matter, and he uses very standard techniques to get his message across. Last week he posed the question "why was the dollar disconnected from its convertibility to gold in the early 70s?" He advised us to "think long and hard on this". This week he commented on our answers and gave his own explanation. This is normal, everyday teaching technique, exactly what we would expect from a good college professor. Not what we would expect from an arab oil minister.

ANOTHER is not afraid to let his thoughts stray from within conventional economic boundaries. He often chides our "western ways of thinking". Arabs and/or business men, if they think in original, non-western ways, would not be aware of doing so, and would never waste time commenting on it. They would just do it. Integrating this "doing" with understanding is an academic approach, a worthwhile goal in any course of study; a technique for "bootstrapping" our thinking into new knowledge ( to borrow a phrase from "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance" ) and this is something the best practitioners of academia do well.

On my own browser, ANOTHERs posts used to substitute an accented character "i" for the apostrophe; as in "its" for "its". I have learned that this is caused by the posters use of a font not supported by my browser, Netscape 2.02. On ANOTHERs own screen it would not appear this way. And it probably does not appear on the screens of the majority of Kitco followers this way, either. I have since seen the same phenomena at one other site on the internet and am willing to concede that it does not serve to identify ANOTHER in any definitive way.

But it is still a clue. Originally, by following this thread, I discovered a real-world individual who so far fits what I would expect to see as a profile of ANOTHER: Professor of economics at a respected university; undergraduate degree taken at the University of Geneva ( one year there as teaching assistant ) ; subsequent graduate work in USA; long list of published works including: "Aspects of Oil and International Financial Markets" , "The Gold Standard: Comment" , "An International Gold Standard Without Gold: Comment", "The Effects of OECD Macroeconomic Policies on Non-Oil LDCs: A Review", "The Bretton Woods International Monetary System: Comment", "Currency Crises and Collapses", etc. These writings were published between 1975 and 1995 in various highly-respected journals and publications.

He has testified numerous times before congress and congressional committees and seems to be a member of several national and international thinktanks, with published and cited writings on a wide variety of economic topics. He appears to maintain residences in two major US cities, one of which is Washington DC.

Judging from his voicemail recording, the above-profiled individual is a native speaker of the German language; from his studies in Geneva it can be surmised that he is also fluent in French. Published tracts dealing with economic themes in Brazil ( in both English and Portuguese ) suggest that he might also speak that language. Honorary titles and published articles indicate fluency in Spanish as well. Such a person would have no difficulty phrasing his remarks in a "non-western" syntax. It would only be necessary to transliterate into English the thoughts conceived first in another language. Indeed, the danger in such subterfuge would be the accidental slipping into the real-world language of his adopted country; exactly what has been noted here in ANOTHERs syntax and phrasing. ( An assistant of his told me that he does have an interest in the internet. )

Considering the dramatic and troubling content of ANOTHERs THOUGHTS, it might be very difficult for such a real-world figure to reveal them in the real world ( as opposed to the cyber-space here at Kitco ) without either compromising his real-world reputation and/or adversely affecting world events. A respected person forecasting $30,000 gold might well become the pin-prick that causes the implosion of the Dow. As a consequence, he might very well fear finding himself in jail, or a padded cell, in the unemployment line, or worse. But if his intention is to enlighten, what more effective way to do it? As was noted here between ANOTHERs posts the other night , "This forum is frozen tonight, waiting for your posts. Please speak up, sir." He does certainly know how to get our attention.

It is not my intention to disclose the real-world identity of the above-profiled individual; if I am right, I would not want to discourage in any way the continued posting of ANOTHER. Rather, it is my hope to stimulate thought about his identity as reflected in his posts and perhaps lend credence to this exceedingly compelling story, which for my money is the most coherent vision of the future that I have yet discovered on the World Wide Web. I look forward to "watching the unfolding of this story of gold" together with him and hope that this present post contributes something to the understanding of all.

In closing let me offer a quotation from a eulogy for a colleague written by the above un-named but very real-world person: "There is no greater compliment for a man than to say he was a great teacher". Whatever else he may or may not really be, from his posts we can see that ANOTHER is indeed a great teacher. Whoever each of us may or may not really be, may we each profit from his posts by being great students!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:08 - ID#431263)

(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:08 - ID#269409)
@ Brilliant call!
Who was it who predicted yesterday that Pegasus was too risky? It's off 23% today at .43 cents! Brilliant call! I bought a little PSGQF at .60 cents and sold at .53 cents a few weeks ago. Only bad beating taken recently, but luckily just a miniscule amount invested. I'll stick with good old HM for Gold share investment in the future. ( when the time comes )

However, not to sound redundant re what so many others have said...but you folks that cheer for a DOW crash, remember that even the venerable Homestake took a horrific beating in the 1987 crash.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:13 - ID#335190)
Only in Japan ! You Say @ Free Enterprise EH ! (Difficult-Complicated-Risky)
April 7, 1998

Japan fund asks pensioners to return benefits

TOKYO, April 7 ( Reuters ) - Retired Japanese rice sellers are being asked to return hefty benefits paid out before low interest rates and stock prices caused their pension fund to collapse last year, officials said on Tuesday.

"I've spent the pension money to cover daily expenses. Nothing is left," the daily quoted one former rice retailer in Osaka, western Japan, as saying.

"The association bears the responsibility for the collapse. Why do we have to shoulder the burden?" the retailer said.

The official said 14 employees' pension funds collapsed during the business year that ended on March 31.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:14 - ID#269409)
@ PHinLA
All that liguistic deconstruction for a Hoaxter....he's gotta be laughing hard...ANOTHER lost all credibility in my book, ( what tiny shred he had ) when his "New buyer" call fell flat and so he THEN adopted his disciples convenient explanation that the "new buyer" was the Belgian CB sale! Once he co-opted his followers logic tortured explanations of his meandering posts, in order to be shown accurate, I realized once and far all that he's a total fraud. ( Of course as RJ so rightly pointed out, there's plenty of linguistic evidence to that effect already )

As I just posted moments ago..... if such "New Buyers" are now to be defined as CB sales, you Gold bull/'Another cult' fanatics...better hope that not many more "New Buyers" emerge in the near future unless you want to see Gold at $250.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:20 - ID#269409)
@ PS for PH
Are you disappointed that you missed the trip to Hale Bopp last summer will "Bo and Peep" took their disciples to a new plane of existence?

( Sorry folks to be a little Bernatz like this's just that I'm catching up on past Kitco reading and quite annoyed that we lost the valuable contributions of RJ for awhile due to some of the inane nonsense being posted here of late. One of the few rational, logical, contributers at the site...oh welll...sigh.....Fairy tales rule supreme when compared to boring straightforward logic, yes? )

(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:22 - ID#20135)
Now that we have learned that COMEX is a paper gold exchange, it is much easier to understand how gold has made all these strange moves over the past years.

Paper gold is easily controlled with derivatives. The way I see it the US ( with Britian maybe ) has set up a group that insures that the market and all its components support the concept that the US market is the only place to be ( whether it makes sense or not ) . All the worlds key commodities ( including the pm's ) are valued in the Usdollar. I strongly suspect that the various exchanges that trade those commodities work in a very similar manner as the Comex.

It is fantastic. As Arden pointed out. When someone wants to make a actual trade they call the exchange and the exchange helps set the price. The Exchange itself doen't sell "SPOT gold", it just seems to set its price. I suppose the paper gold flying around is used to entertain and confuse folks and protect the base game.

I do not see the end to this insidious game until, Comex no longer holds eligible gold stocks. The SPOT price of gold that we continually search for is not to found within the walls of Comex or LBME ( for I do not believe that they are honest free market agencies ) .

Think about it. If it will take ONLY 1,490 contracts to wipe out comex's eligible stocks, the price wouldn't be lower it would be higher ( the old supply and demand theory ) . Paper gold has no problems with supply and demand and thus is the reason Comex operates as it does.

Japan, China, Islam, , will have to make an announcement that they are selling bonds and buying raw gold and silver. The announcement will be as important as the actual action of buying bullion. Until such a time, I believe we will continue to see the situation continue as is. Hard assets head down while paper assets continue to rise FOREVER.


( the good news is that many countries in the world are very upset with the U.S.'s dishonest actions with the Usdollar and US financial assets. I do believe the game is coming to a close. Sooner than later. And I believe that one morning we will wake up to find out there is NO spot price of GOLD, as ANOTHER suggested some time back. )


(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:25 - ID#330175)
I'm SHOCKED-----------------XAU down 2.71
usually the 'day-after' I sell,the stock soars~~~~~

(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:27 - ID#368244)

As I said in the past, gold will never be cheap enough for most. They will only buy when it's to high.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:33 - ID#269409)
Metals news.... A rise in price now called a "correction" ????
Tuesday April 7, 10:24 am Eastern Time

NY precious metals mixed early, silver rallies

NEW YORK, April 7 ( Reuters ) - COMEX and NYMEX precious metals futures were mixed early
Tuesday, with silver rebounding from Monday's sharp sell-off on rumors of selling by the silver
market's most famous long, Warren Buffett.

The silver market retraced half of Monday's losses, which came following an article by the
Financial Times, which quoted a two-week-old Merrill Lynch report that speculated that Warren
Buffett had liquidated a third of his 129.7 million ounce long position.

At 1012 EDT, COMEX May silver was $6.455 an ounce, up 8.5 cents from Monday's close, in a
range of $6.315-$6.48 an ounce.

``The selling in the silver market appeared to come from the trade today,'' said one floor trader.
``There didn't seem to be any trigger to it. The cash market had been moving higher. We were just

In the bullion market, spot silver was quoted $6.43/46 an ounce, compared to the late London fix at
$6.385 an ounce, and Monday's New York close at $6.40/43 an ounce.

``The market clearly was overdone on the downside and looked ripe for a correction,'' another
floor trader said.

COMEX June gold fell $2.30 from Monday's close to $309.00 an ounce trading between $308.50
and $312.50 an ounce.

In the bullion market, spot gold was quoted $306.50/7.00 an ounce, compared with the late London
fix at $309.20 and the New York close Friday at $308.80/9.30 an ounce.

NYMEX July platinum fell $2.00 to $409.00 an ounce, while June palladium fell $2.75 to $256.25
an ounce.

Gusto Oro
(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:34 - ID#377235)
LGB 12:08
LBG--was Homestake the mine that reneged in the '80's silver bonds put out, or was it Sunshine?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:38 - ID#31868)
Lets call a dirtbag a dirtbag and Ted Allen is a dirtbag, Merrill Lynch I believe employs the dirtbag.

As reported today on USA GOLD, Reuters, that bastion of truth? has taken the dirtbag Ted Allens name off the story and is now not reporting it as a fact that WB sold any silver.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:39 - ID#340302)
@SHAREFIN...I am greatly amused by your posts today...
...and the posts of all chartists and technicians who declare flatly the rules in which bull markets unfold or collapse.

Don't they realize we are in a NEW PARADIGM?

After all, Wall Street has been propagandizing this "truth" for the past two years in order to justify the total absence of all the old rules....for example the astronomical P/E's on such rhinos as Coke, IBM, Gillette, Disney, etc....are all justified because of the New Era.

Certainly, the NEW ERA cannot be a one way street, can it? If all the old rules no longer apply, then why do chartists and technicians constantly refer to 1929 and state, "No, we can't have a crash because today's events do not mirror the conditions of 1929 ( that's my favorite ) "
or, "No, the DOW cannot be set for a tumble because the Russell 2000 has not mirrored the DOW's ascent ( of course, back in '29, they did not have a mutual funds cartel that practised indexing ) ."

There are countless numbers of such brain-dead maxims disseminated by the Wall Street Bull technical crowd....and people actually buy this hokum???

Exhaustion is the key word...the liquidity inflows cannot sustain themselves at these exponential can merge companies ( like Travellers & Citibank and go through all varieties of esoteric accounting machinations to pretend that profits exist where they do not...however, in the end analysis, the money is either there or it is cannot buyback your own stock with "goodwill profits" ) .



(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:43 - ID#213265)
@the scene
Oh Oh Spoos. Be very very careful!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:45 - ID#340302)
@GOLD this as good as it gets? this litte retracement all you guys can muster up? Despite all the lies and B.S. you guys push into the markets every day, is this all you're sending my way? C'mon, baby, I wanna hear the latest canard...the latest deception of lies....

C'mon baby...let's go...let's rumble...yeah, you think you're tough...wait until you see what's coming down the road tomorrow, you little just wait and see..

Har..har..hor. hor..har.. har..hor...hor...HOR..HOR...HOR...HOR!!!!!!



(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:45 - ID#342282)
A. Goose re eligible
In all your research, have you found any LARGE holders of London Good Delivery gold who do not register at Comex?? If so, please advise ASAP. Thanx Charlie

(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:47 - ID#324266)
JSE All Gold Index down 0.82% to 963.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:47 - ID#32078)
If you're going to buy and hold, why do you have to 'watch it like a hawk'?

As much as I am a long term bull for gold, I believe in taking advantage of the overbought and oversold conditions in gold trading as much as I can and not buy and hold. This recent rally has placed us in a definite overbought condition and I expect it to go down some from here. How much is a question I cannot answer, so it could reverse on me at any moment. If I use my technique, I have to be ready to cover and reverse myself, ego be damned. I understand why many cannot do this.

The gold market is a worldwide phenomena and is influenced by too many inputs and worldviews to be absolutely controlled unless all of the inputs can be aligned in the same direction. Right now there are too many varying opinions to think we are all aligned to the upside. Therefore I expect a gyrating market to condition.

It will take an event or decision of very large importance to make this market run away at $15-30 per day. When it happens, then I might buy and hold for a few months.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:48 - ID#410198)
Facts on numis gold while all are going gaga over bullion
.Wholesale price of MS 63/64 Saints since 1/28/98,source National Gold Exchange.

MS 63 Saints

1/28/98 $485.00

2/25/98 $485.00

3/05/98 $495.00

3/23/98 $510.00

4/01/98 $520.00

4/06/98 $525.00

MS 64 Saints

1/28/98 $545.00

2/25/98 $545.00

3/05/98 $550.00

3/23/98 $560.00

4/01/98 $575.00

4/06/98 $580.00

Now read this:

(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:51 - ID#210235)
Good morning. Didn't want to register for that last link. Could you
offer a brief synopsis?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:52 - ID#368244)
The truth
Houses built on lies and deceit will surely crumble.

Best look out for falling debris!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:54 - ID#256250)
Date: Tue Apr 07 1998 12:45
chas ( A. Goose re eligible ) ID#342282:

Date: Tue Apr 07 1998 12:45
chas ( A. Goose re eligible ) ID#342282:

Chas please remember I have only been looking into the comex for a month or two. I have NO information on LBME. As I understand it, LBME keeps all their information to themselves.

Comex is a paper gold, paper silver game. So when they can no longer obtain bullion -- what will the price be?


I am extrapolating what I have learned from Comex. Hopefully, some people will come forward and show me the errors of my ways, OR possibly validate my assumptions.

I am calling them as I see them and looking for feedback, guidance, validation ....

(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:54 - ID#225273)
I'm of a different opinion than you on ANOTHER. He has said that central bank gold sales are the apparatus that facillitate large gold purchases for "oil" in exchange for cheap oil flowing to the West. So I see it as perfectly consistent with his perspective that when he sees a large purchase going down, the news will be in the form of a large CB gold sale.
He predicted that we would see such a sale within 5-10 days. We saw it in 8 ( trading ) days. It was supposed to send a signal to the CBs to get gold back into the $320-$360 range, which we are $25 closer to now than then.
I can see where you don't buy this entire scenario for a variety of reasons. But to call it "tortured logic" is out of bounds, IMO.
It was similar on his $280 bottom gold call. He said the BIS would buy it in the open market for all to see. I didn't see it, but gold did not move far below $280 before a meaningful uptrend began.
If ANOTHER's perspective is legitimate, then obviously he's seeing things that are hidden from us. I allow for that possibility.
Now as for his $10,000 gold price, that is a meaningless number in my book. Not that it won't happen, but it's not on the horizon and I imagine there will be ample warning before it takes place.
Can you imagine the world we'll live in with $10,000 gold? I will be something we won't want to see.

The Preacher

(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:55 - ID#344308)

i smell some beans-a-burnin!

longs better look out.....we's fixin to fly........south.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:57 - ID#410198)
For those who tried the URL on my last post it requires password sorry
it's a Financial Times columnist Philip Syephens CENTRAL BANKERS:the money masters.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:58 - ID#340302)
@LGB...yes, in fact you are right... not laugh because Mr. ANOTHER is absolutely, huge sales of gold by CB's would be very bullish for the gold market....

Remember, my friend, we are in a NEW GOLD PARADIGM...the old rules no longer are operating under the logic of a superannuated curmudgeon.



(Tue Apr 07 1998 12:59 - ID#342282)
A.Goose after your 12:22
I would appreciate talking to you. My phone is 704 433 6473, or you can email me yours. Incoming email is ok-- thanx

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:00 - ID#431263)
Like the equity bulls heeding the incessant bull mantra to BUY THE DIPS, gold bulls have been conditioned to SELL THE RALLIES! At some point, the rules wil INVERT and WHAT HAS WORKED SO WELL FOR SO LONG IN THE PAST WILL WORK NO LONGER! My only point is that no one will tell you when the rules have inverted! You will only know AFTER THE FACT! AND THEN IT WILL BE TOO LATE! YOU WILL KNOW THE PARADIGM HAS CHANGED BUT IT WILL BE TOO LATE AND TOO RISKY TO REVERSE COURSE! I am not of the opinion that the next big move in gold will be tradeable! I believe it will be so powerful and so unbelievable and so frightening to most investors that they will simply FREEZE, LIKE A DEER ON HIGHWAY, AND GET BLASTED TO SMITHERENES BY THE CRUSHING FORCE OF CHANGE IN MARKET SENTIMENT! Remember the old trading saw, "BULLS make MONEY, BEARS make MONEY, PIGS GET SLAUGHTERED!" Here's hoping your not short the DAY THE WORLD CHANGES COURSE!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:01 - ID#25171)
BUBA council member ERNST WELTEKE said in an interview today with Bridge news that GOLD would play only a small role in the ECB. He added that GOLD had hardly a role to play today.
It seems that this comment generated the retracement after LONDON GOLD fixing.
I guess some here won't care as they are buying more, but it's always nice to know.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:02 - ID#410198)
Prometheus,have no idea how to attach artical,send me your EMail will forward

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:02 - ID#340302)
@LGB...oh, and the corollary of my previous post...
...not only are huge sales of gold by CB's now extremely bullish for the gold market....huge purchases also remain bullish for the gold market ( though not quite as bullish as CB sales ) THE NEW GOLD've got to love it!



(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:05 - ID#31868)
I just love it
all these people selling CFB on any drop in price, everytime it drops to the desired price I just gobble more and more of it up. I just love it.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:06 - ID#25171)
Give him a break.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:10 - ID#340302)
...real men with balls of steel hold gold for the long term...
...wimps and whores hold gold for a day...



(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:14 - ID#288155)
GOLD BANKING~TopraBank~ Hows this for a BANKs Mission Statement?

To see what others can not see, to search to discover to calculate correctly, to set a ship's course, to reflect upon the truth even in
the smallest details, to be effective at all times...There are a few examples of this in history. We also observe the same rules. For those who journey with us and for those who will journey with us."

*********G O L D B A N K I N G**********

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:16 - ID#324266)
Balls of gold are very uncomfortable.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:16 - ID#238422)
John Disney
Brother John,

Regarding RSA-Russia connection: I believe both
countries cooperate with each other in some areas,
including PM's, precious stones and weapons. It is
interesting that Russia has no prejudices against RSA.
RSA guy in Moscow probably tries to arrange for more
requlated prices for metals, which looks logical to me.
I think or let me say that I feel some progress is going
to be reached within a year.

In regard to Migs - Mig-29 is an exceptional craft, and
when operated by a good pilot, is extremely effective against
any other similar aircraft in dogfight range combat.
Its flying characteristics allow it to performs numerous
unique moves in the sky, including "cobra" - complete stop
in the air without loss of controlability. It uses a very
interesting sigthing system and has cannon besides missiles
( US jets have not ) . It's simple and reliable, as you can
hear from americans who had a chance to FLY it and WORK with
it, not just read about it. I think it will be a good deal
for RSA. I have little doubts that there is some weapons
trade between RSA and Russia, although it's difficult to
find out about it.

Gold will hold above 300, high for the week=314..315.
Your forecast is pretty close.

You brother Oris.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:19 - ID#31868)
Clifton Mining - I just love these guys - I'm buyin more.
ALPINE, UTAH, April 7 /CNW/ - Clifton Mining Company ( OTCBB: CFTN and
ASE: CFB ) today announced that it has been selected as a 1998 Earth Day Award winner by the Utah Board of Oil, Gas and Mining. Clifton received the award in recognition of the company's commitment to environmental excellence at its Herat Mine in Tooele County, Utah.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:21 - ID#286349)
Hold ON to that Gold!
Buy & Hold! Hold! Hold! Don't sell any, until the price is so high that you hear them start talking about extracting gold from seawater. Then sell a little.

Then wait until all they can talk about on CNBC is PM's and PM stocks, and they have their Gold $10,000/oz special. Then sell a little more.

Or you could just hold out for the real long term until the price is so high that you can start your own country with your Gold holdings and with a currency that's 100% backed by Gold.

John Disney__A
(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:21 - ID#24135)
the cheeseman cometh ..
for Larryn ..
Yes like cheesehead says -- you buy and hold
and watch it like a hawk ... Dont question
the cheeseman ..just do it.. his brain is
solid camembert... or ricotta .. anyway..
some milk product.
for myrmidon .. Sold a tiny bit of harmony
today .. a burnt offering to the gods of fate.
threw in some randfontein some e-dagga and
some free state development .. Up to 15 %
cash .... born to trade. May do more tomorrow
.. looks like a loss of momentum and a BIG
resistance at 315 ish. My son who was burned
at the stake in a prior life for soothsaying
without a licence warned me about this.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:22 - ID#285121)
Hope we test 290 once more !
I want a sh#t load of RANGY for a buck.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:29 - ID#251268)
Farfel? whats up?
there is as many different ways to trade or hold a position
as there is people,everyones risk tolerance is different for
many many reasons,apparently you are comfotable with your
strategy but hey the proofs in the pudding anybody who took
profits ah lets see hm they profited which gives them more capital
to buy more GOLD!!!anyway it would be boring if we all thought alike

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:33 - ID#288369)
@Kitcoites.....I just did a quick read of Michael Kosares'......
"Footsteps of Giants" ( ANOTHER @ Kitco )'s great! A lot of you "giants" are mentioned in the book. Kitco is well on its way to greater significance....this "first piece" on Kitco warrants merit for historical say the least. Published in a first-class manner. Congrats to Michael!!!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:35 - ID#340302)
@STRONG MAN..your suggestion re: old gold bull agit-prop is astute....
...I agree that gold shorts resort to any tactic to undermine the asset...they are preponderantly mama's boys who, in a street fight, would call on their daddies to intervene...
...they are woosies who would dress up in women's clothing to get a lifeboat on the Titanic....

So, Mama's Boy, Ted Arnold, afraid of losing his "allowance," resorted to an outdated canard concerning WB's alleged silver sales.

Although in a better world, one should take the higher road...sometimes there can be no better tactic than "fighting fire with fire"...except, ideally, one should take the retaliation to a more sophisticated, deadlier level.

Certainly, there must be a host of old stories, bullish as hell about gold and silver, which could be released into the media stream on a regular basis...readily available retaliation for the inevitable spate of gold short propaganda that will be released over the next little while.

Maybe one of the Kitco posters has special access to mainstream media sources and would like to tackle the project.



(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:38 - ID#340302)
@jman...taking profits is one thing...
...nothing wrong with that at all...however, my polemic deals with active shorting of gold/silver while simultaneously slandering the assets into the ground.

Do you see the distinction?



(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:38 - ID#431263)
Agree with you on "Footsteps"! Only wish he had waited for ANOTHER'S prediction of $30,000 gold! I, too, believe it will be a collector's item that may well command a MUCH HIGHER PREMIUM at some point down the road.Hope it's the only piece of paper I have in hand the day gold is permanently revalued by oil!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:39 - ID#26669)
SWC holding over 26; In case anybody missed the SWC news from last week.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:39 - ID#255217)
Gold @ $315 - $320 by 1 May. I DO CARE. THAT'S WHY I JUST BOUGHT MORE US  oz. golden eagles. I'll need em for change when gold is $1000/oz. Same as last time. Get em now while they're cheap.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:41 - ID#340302)
@DISNEY...aka the "Mousester" in and out??...
...well, at least your broker is happy...



(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:45 - ID#345176)

I am not selling any more SAs.
Current holdings are RANGY, DROOY. AGOLY, DRFNY, and ASA.
RANGY down 8% and thinking of buying more. Out of HGMCY but also under consideration if it drops another $3/8.

By the way which one is your favorite of the above?
The one you advice I will get first.

Good luck John, I hope you feel better now you unloaded a little. You never go broke by taking a profit.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:51 - ID#334219)
SWC Expensive ?
SWC looks very expensive based on production numbers alone. Does someone has an idea of what are the proven and probable reserves ?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:54 - ID#431263)

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:56 - ID#345176)
@ Farfel - must trade in and out

I have been hit so hard with some of the golds that short term trading and switching is a must to recover some losses, otherwise I wouldn't bother. You think I like it? Of course not but the road to recovery is often very long and painful.

Go gold and broke "aye"? - as Haggis says

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:57 - ID#431263)
You may not go broke takin' profits but you don't get rich either! Look at Warren B! The ultimate BUY-AND-HOLDER! The reason he can afford to is that he did!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 13:58 - ID#39971)
Varios musings and what-not---------------

J.Dizz:Your cr*ping on any NA analyist or company is evolving into your

personal signature. ( along with your side-kick's ) Do give it a rest,aye.

You can promote your SA stuff without denigrating everything else my

friend.If everyone were to continue the promotion of companies like

HOOWY...DOOWY...and LOOWY on this channel,then Bart may as well re-name

it the Stock-Channel.Yes?Carry on.PS:Toronto is THE mining capital of the

WORLD today.Even the Aussies are jumping onto the TSE for exposure.Why

not suggest to your friends they consider same?Nuff said?

Phil in L.A.:Great post that.An open mind is a wonderfull thing.Yes?We

all have much to learn,and our ability to think beyond the more obvious

and accepted teachings is what lets us grow.Those who fear they have been

or are being mislead may wonder if they were mislead all along and are

only now seeing some truth.Will we ever really know?Maybe.Buy The Book!

The Donald:Great stuff on the COMEX shell game man.A real eye opener.

Who would have thought it was so easy to pull this charade off for so

long without anyone questioning it.Keep us posted and like *F,spread the

word.We may witness a REAL gold market some day in the future after the

implosion/explosion.Hey!And where is UN-Realistic?

SEQUIN:Could you post that when/if you see it please?TIP:TRUST NO ONE!

Did he say it was his opinion or what?Sounds fishy to MOI!Thanks.

LGB:Nice to see you back in form.Some things never change.No?

PS:Why would you buy a Gold stock being as negative as you are?

ECB--25%.Thats ma story and I"m stickin to it.Good Luck!Tick Tock......

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:00 - ID#269409)
@ Gusto/ Preacher
Gusto, I believe it was Sunshine..not possitive however. I do know my 1987 Homestake shares, the only Gold shares I owned at the time, took a beating in that downturn.

Preacher... Folks keep luading ANOTHER's $280 bottom call. Only problem is, just about every astute analyst under the sun called for a $280 bottom before he did, and on this very forum. Even I made that $280 bottom call before another's "BIS open buying" post.

As to Oil for I've said many times, that news is about 20 years old. As to big CB sales now being called major purcahses...Puhhlease, you don't want me to call that tortured reasoning? Why have such "major purchases" ( which obviously all required buyers ) been called the primary reason for Gold's decline over the past few years? And why does this CB overhang of Gold supply, still loom as a huge black cloud over Gold's upside potential?

There's a good reason why ANOTHER's flowery prose is so makes it quite easy for he and his cultic disciples to always give a hindsight interpretation which matches current market events...highly convenient for an obviously intelligent mind, who has demonstrated an ability to speak clearly and articulately on ocassion, to speak in such "mysterious" riddles the rest of the time, YES????

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:01 - ID#358318)
PH in LA/Who is ANOTHER...Apr 07 12:06
Professor of economics with a long list of published works?

Said Professor did say on November 17, 1997 that Asia may be on the verge of a "great depression", because of a shaky Japanese banking system and a weak, indecisive government.

He also said, elsewhere:
"There must be no doubt that Japan is teetering on the verge of a
1930s-style collapse of financial institutions, confidence and economic
activity. Taking measures to prevent this is "very difficult." "

These are familiar topics to Kitcoites...

Steve Peutz has noted that said Professor has called for a Keynsian 'aggressive expansionary monetary policy' in Germany, to forestall recession, and also said that German monetary policy has been too tight and that too much focus is being put on deficit reduction as part of efforts to achieve monetary union in Europe.

According to Peutz, the Professor's plan would make the German 'debt trap' even larger. Does this sound like a recommendation from ANOTHER? Loosen monetary policy and to hell with the deficit?

The Professor's fix for Japan:
"Japan needs a vigorous market economy; the old model is dead. Over the
next two decades the government requires a gigantic amount of money to
meet its liabilities. More taxes can't deliver that. They would merely
crash the economy as we saw last year. The right answer is a vast
expansion of taxpayers and economic activity--the supply side. That is
what the U.S. did in the early 1980s--pay for a bank clean-up and big
deficits through supply-side economics. Patently it has worked, since
America enjoys both full employment and a balanced budget. "

Does this sound like advice from ANOTHER? Massive government spending, running up the debt, and America has done the right thing and has a balanced budget?

Does the Professor have anything to say about gold or gold standards? I don't know, but there isn't much on the internet. In fact he advised people to buy into Asia, saying at Davos:
"The gainers will be those who take big-time risk buying up assets. Don't wait! If you missed the last one, get in now. It's a bargain."
This sounds suspiciously like buying on the dips in a bear market. Does this sound like the philosophy of ANOTHER?

"If Mexico wants to change, it should give up the peso and adopt the
dollar as its currency."- Does ANOTHER have much time for the dollar?

Could such a Professor be inclined to spread disinformation contrary to his normal inclinations, by posting in the guise of ANOTHER? The Professor is suggested as a German in the USA- however, ANOTHER's writing has clear suggestions of Arabian, or non-Western origin:

"A good view from you, sir! A fine Arabian horse is much the same."
"You and all western minds must weight this offer as it is heavy for your

How would the Professor stand to benefit, by promoting gold in the manner of ANOTHER? Has he strings being pulled by links through the Fed? Or perhaps someone else wishes us to think so?

Prudence dictates that we consider ANOTHER's contributions as a starting point and do our own research on the subjects raised.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:09 - ID#269409)
@ Farfel..all....DOW correction = Bull market
I guess that when the DOW inevitably goes into correction mode, down to say...8200 or so...and frightened conservative Mutual fund managers start dumping millions of shares en masse...the "New Buyers" of these shares will demonstrate a new and Bullish direction for the stock market, yes?

In fact, OPEN buying by liquidity pumping, US dollar propping, Ag/Rubin plunge protectors will send a "new message" to the market, "Bring DOW back to 8600-9000 level" as shares of US complany equities are traded for currency instruments, foreign and domestic, and the shorts rush to cover in this "New" stock market...which will not be as before.......

Buy stocks! DOW will be goin to 8 X 10 40th power!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:11 - ID#340302)
@GOLD SHORTS....C'mon, woosies, you can do better than that!!!
Drop the metal lower, you dolly boys...drop it...stick it to me...I can take it...whatever you've got, throw it at me, baby...




(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:12 - ID#431263)

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:14 - ID#36156)
Your Farfelness --- They can't heaaaaaar youuuuu!
Gold inching up for the close...


(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:15 - ID#340302)
I needed the laugh today.



(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:17 - ID#345176)

I do it for tax purposes. Before losses become long term I sell the stock and switch into another stock. Now if the stock I switch into runs up significantly, I sell it, take the profit and go back to the first stock which I took a short term loss, provided that the trade is longer than one month. This way if you are in the 40% tax bracket, and had $160K losses long term you save $64K from taxes ( 40% of $160K ) . Now if you had $320K long term profits which are taxed at 20% your tax liability is also $64K. The two are cancelled out but in essence you made $320K - $160K = $160K tax free.

It pays to play the tax game.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:17 - ID#269409)
@ PHinLA, Triomnevarant.......Who is Another?
Much speculation has been done on the forum as to the identity of "ANOTHER". Let me just add my own speculation, "ANOTHER" is not a single idenitity, instead ANOTHER is the collective identity of a vast pool of wishful Gold Bull believers..... His posts, while alluding to oil/Gold trades, currency manipulations, et al...are intentionally worded in such a manner, that all of us may put whatever spin we wish on said posts, but always coming to a Gold Bull conclusion.

This being the case, ANOTHER serves a handy purpose as being a catalyst for any wishful thinking we might want to indulge in, in our desperation to believe that some mystery "insider" has special knowledge about the market which we Mortals do not posess. All our hopes and dreams re Gold, are thus vindicated by this Guru from beyond, who doth tickle our ears with that which we long to hear, yes?

silver plate
(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:17 - ID#289468)
PH in LA post of 12:06
Throughly enjoyed your studied analysis of ANOTHER. Right or wrong your conclusion makes a lot more sense than the name calling and hysteria that has greeted his postings. I too can see no other motive than that of a teacher patiently trying to impart some knowledge to a bunch of rowdy, scoffing students. To attribute all the time and effort ANOTHER

has spent, trying to gain financial or ego profits makes no sense. Please do some more level-headed posting when the urge permits.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:17 - ID#431263)

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:19 - ID#431263)
At yesterday's 110 spike reversal! Way to go JERRY!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:25 - ID#431263)
TOO much bookkeepin' for this cheesehead! Got all my spare cash in IRA's and TSA's where taxes ain't an issue until I's spendin' all my time driving my golf cart on the gold course with my silver-haired beauty by my side!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:27 - ID#368244)
What's that green on the screen?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:28 - ID#345176)
Kyrie CHEESEHEAD - big loser for the day is MOTOROLA, down $6

Book keeping is easy. I have written a Hypercard program for my MAC that automates all tasks.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:28 - ID#26669)
Another and LGB may be AI programs.
What if both are merely AI life forms, using natural language processing? Another would seem to pass the Turing test but I have my doubts about LGB. LGB if you're there convince us that you're real.

Seriously, guys, all this conjecture about Another's personal attributes is overtaxing my cooling fan. And I need all my CPU power to decide whether or not to keep holding SWC past my price goal of 25.5 :^ )

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:30 - ID#31868)
Myrmidon - Hmmmmmmm - all tasks eh...
Program it to make Camdesuss disappear...

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:31 - ID#269409)
Silver for Oil deal fall through
Obviously the "behind the scenes" story was missed. Phibro wanted to trade WB Silver for oil and the Russkies balked....

uesday April 7, 1:24 pm Eastern Time

Phibro says considers sale of Russian oil JV stake

MOSCOW, April 7 ( Reuters ) - The main foreign partner in Russia's Siberia-based White Nights oil joint venture is looking at the
possibility of selling its stake in the project, an official at the company said on Tuesday.

Phibro Energy Production Inc, part of U.S. investment bank Salomon Smith Barney, has been approached by a potential buyer, but no
deal has been signed yet, according to Gary Rinaldi, a Phibro director based in Moscow.

``Phibro has been approached ( on the sale of its stake in White Nights ) , and is exploring the possibility, but there is no deal,'' Rinaldi

Phibro is discussing the sale of its 45 percent stake in White Nights and the sale of a five percent stake held by Anglo Suisse, a small
Houston-based outfit.

The holder of the remaining 50 percent is Varyeganneftegaz, a subsidiary of the SIDANKO oil group, whose main production unit is
Chernogorneft ( CHGZ.RTS ) .

Industry sources said White Nights' oil production fell last year to 595,000 tonnes ( 12,000 barrels per day ) from 695,000 tonnes in
1996 and 770,000 tonnes in 1995.

The sources said that the steep drop in production was mainly caused by natural decline at maturing fields being tapped by the venture.

Rinaldi declined to comment further on the discussions.

Phibro had previously complained that Russia's punitive tax system was squeezing margins at the project, which was one of the
pioneering joint ventures in Russia's key energy sector. It began operating in 1990.

Alexei Kocheshkov, project manager at the Association of Enterprises with Foreign Investment in Oil Production and Refining
( AssoSPneft ) , said problems facing joint ventures had shifted away from the tax and legal framework towards the lack of investment
among major financial institutions.

``The situation has turned around. Five years ago we had little legal framework in place for joint ventures, but legally things are quite
normal now,'' he said.

``What concerns us now is that financial institutions are interfering in production politics by claiming dividends and quick returns and
not reinvesting in output, including at marginal wells.''

Some of Russia's largest oil groups come under the umbrella of financial-industrial groups, which hold considerable political and
financial clout.

Kocheshkov said joint ventures produced 18 million tonnes of Russian oil ( 360,000 bpd ) in 1997, around six percent of the country's

They produced 15.2 million tonnes in 1996. He forecast joint venture output to rise 10 percent in 1998.

While financing was a growing problem for joint ventures, some progress had been made in lowering transportation costs for all

Kocheshkov said joint ventures welcomed a recent decision by the Federal Energy Commission to halve the fixed cost for using the
monopoly Transneft oil transportation system.

Transneft also promised joint ventures that they would be treated as the equals of Russian oil majors, Kocheshkov said.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:31 - ID#431263)

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:33 - ID#317193)
Letter delivered to Foley by Hashimoto
Dear Bill, it was a pleasure to meet with Ambassador Foley. He is a very pleasant and articulate man. The ASEM summit went better than All had hoped. The Europeans agreed to support the new Yen-Yaun currancy and the Asians agreed to support the Euro. By the way both will be strongly supported ( backed by gold ) . Enclosed is the current amount due Japan for all the treasuries we are selling. Thank Mr. Greenspan for being so accommodating. The nation of Japan is truly sorry to repatriate all these US dollars but this was a question of Japan's continued existence. Once again, all of Japan sympathizes with the coming plight of your country.. Take care. Prime Minister Ryotaro Hashimoto

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:34 - ID#375108)
Gold stocks held up pretty well all day, and now a bottom-of-the nineth rally... Au no patsy anymore???

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:34 - ID#431263)

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:35 - ID#348129)
@Great Action AU
The shorts had it under attack all day and at the end of the day UP +.95 .
This action is not the kind we have been used for soooo long.
Be interesting to see tonights VOLUME and OPEN INTEREST & COMEX STOCKS.
*** Go GOLD ***

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:36 - ID#269409)
@ 223
Answer...unreal! A product of artificial intelligence experiment financed by LBMA/Rockafeller/Illuminatti conspiracy to monitor this ste and report back to Rubin/AG/Tri-Laterla comission. Frequent typo's a product of advanced algorithms to artificially place "defects" into posts for quasi human credibility purposes.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:39 - ID#238295)
Golden Cheesehead: Your 12:08 post on why buy and hold is the way to play this gold market is a classic. That is how the big money is always made in genuine bull markets. That was the way to make a killing in the Dow bull and the same will be true in the gold bull. Of course this not apply to leveraged futures traders. But for investors in PM stocks, PM funds, and physical that is the golden rule. If traders do better than investors as they have for many years, it is not a bull market.

Sharefin: Disagree strongly on how gold stocks will perform in a market crash. The situation today is totally different than 1987. Gold and gold stocks much cheaper both absolutely and relative to the market than in 1987. In fact in the current environment a market crash is hard to imagine unless gold soars and visa versa. When the US financial markets ( stocks, bonds, and the dollar ) turn south decisively, gold will skyrocket taking gold stocks along for the ride if prices are still anywhere near current levels.

In hindsight, gold's weakness during last fall's market correction was a signal the market would come roaring back. But with POG breaking out on the charts, doesn't look like a replay is in the cards.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:42 - ID#345176)

--- "I want a s**t load of RANGY for a buck"

Sorry mate, I got some more at $1 7/16 a few minutes ago and it isn't going to a buck.

I am still waiting advice on more SA purchases from my advisor
LORD DISNEY but I think he went sleeping.

Sorry again, it isn't going to a buck, GET IT?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:42 - ID#288369)
@Here! Here! Herr....
Argent....let's get physical, physical... ( I still choose not to believe Olivia N.J. is gay ) ....I do believe, however, that continued demand for physical delivery of gold does throw a monkey wrench in the schemes of the price setters/manipulators.

Herr Golden Cheesehead....rock 'n roll, my man....cheeze whiz!!!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:42 - ID#335190)
PARADIGM/Archetype=Life is good-All is well @ Old rules do apply-Trust!
Gold and Silver scarcity 1694, Bank of England established. Louis XIV King of France, has silver furniture melted down to pay the cost of his war with the League of Augsburg.

William III King of England, in allliance with the Dutch, against the french. Because of war costs, William III is in heavy debt, he arranges a Gold and Silver loan of 1.2 million from a company of merchants headed by Scots financier William Paterson. William agreeded to a 8% rate, plus an annual management fee.

William III authorized to have the Central Bankers issue "Banknotes" and to issue these to the public at a rate of 10% interest plus management fee. The public treated these "banknotes" as if they were gold and silver coins.

Theoretically, then, this meant that the bank would have 1.2 million worth of gold and silver on hand, at all times, in case, those holding "banknotes" wanted gold and silver.

In practice, however, the central bank planned to keep only 200,000 or 300,000 worth of gold on hand at any one time. It was an ingenious scheme: the central bank was essentially lending the same 1.2 million twice, thereby collecting twice the amount of interest on the money. At that rate, the banker's would double their money every four and a half years.

1716: "Wealth depends on commerce, and commerce depends on circulation [of money]" says Scottish promoter John Law, he persuades the French regent Philip d'Orleans to let him open the Banque Royale which pays Philip's debts and issues notes that the government accepts for taxes.

Law's private banknotes, in principle are backed by gold and silver, are in fact, based largely on the gold alleged to exist in France's Louisiana territory.

Mushrooms-R-Us EH!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:43 - ID#213265)
@the scene
Guess the Spoos wern't careful enough. Kinda tumbled over a cliff.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:44 - ID#288157)
The World of Gold Banking--it's here! it's real! and the return on gold deposits has DOUBLED!!!!
********GOLD BANKING*********

Until now, gold reserves in Turkey have remained under the bed as an idle resource and have not been utilied within the economy.

Toprakbank started actual "Gold Banking" in 7995 with the intention of both stimulating and providing new resources for the economy. It also wanted to contribute to the creation and development of a Gold Exchange by transfoming gold ornaments such as bracelets, rings and necklaces into economic tools.

In 1996, Toprakbank continued Gold Banking and achieved its targets. Obligations of keeping additional reserves at the Central Bank for gold deposit accounts were lifted. In addition, the deducton for the Resource Usage Support fund in gold credits was discontinued. Both these developments were beneficial to the growth of Gold Banking.

Gold Deposit Accounts which once could only be opened with physical gold were now possible with TL or foreign currency as deposits. All 96 branches of Toprakbank have now started opening up Gold Deposit Accounts and, together with gold loans the volume of gold transactions have reached more than 20 million USD this year. It is expected that it will reach 80 million USD in 1997.

The return for depositors in the Gold Deposit Accounts has increased from 2 percent to 4 percent. Along side one year term accounts, six month and three month term Gold Deposit Accounts have also been made possible. The award of consumer credits for Gold Deposit Account holders continues to be a priority. Furthermore, for the first time in banking, Toprakbank has introduced the Gold Gift Cheque, a new product which is designed to cater for those who wish to give gold as a gift. Therefore, it could be said that our bank introduced the only inflation-proof gift!

In order to service the jewellery sector, we have also started on-call Gold Deposit Accounts and made physical gold transfers possible between regions through our bank. Thus, it is now possible to deal in gold like other currencies. Toprakbank is justifiably proud of being a pioneer in Gold Banking which will, no doubt, greatly contribute to our country's economy.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:46 - ID#316232)
Steel balls rust. I think what you want is brass. They just need a little polishing.

If you buy and hold, you become a spectator, and it doesn't take balls to do that. It's more fun working it out in the arena. Of course, if I didn't make a profit, I'd join you in the bleachers.

I was just about to short a gold stock today to hedge my long gold fund, but XAU and gold didn't dip far enough to tell me, so you may be right. So far today is just a minor correction, not a trend change.

Tomorrow is another day.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:49 - ID#340302) is not a trend change?
Thank you for providing me a good laugh.



(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:50 - ID#345176)
CHEESEHEAD, something wrong with your eyes...

.. that is why Allen suggests you to calm down.

DOW down 1.14% and you get all excited,

XAU down 2.83% and you don't even notice!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:51 - ID#285121)
Myrmidon / No more CB sales anouncements ???????
The manipulation is not over till the equities tank completely.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:53 - ID#269409)
Rush ta buy Korean Bonds!

Tuesday April 7, 2:18 pm Eastern Time

FOCUS--S.Korea sets $3.0 bln issue in debt debut

By George Lerner

NEW YORK, April 7 ( Reuters ) - South Korea launched the first sovereign bond in its history on Tuesday, and investors rushed to get a
piece of the $3.0 billion global issue from the recovering Asian country, which stood on the brink of economic collapse earlier this

Investors familiar with the deal said Seoul will sell $1.0 billion of five-year notes and $2.0 billion of 10-year paper.

``Both tranches were well oversubscribed, particularly the 10-year,'' an investor said, as market players bet Korea would continue to
rebound from a liquidity crisis that rattled market confidence and humbled the world's 11th-largest economy.

The investor said the five-year paper would probably price to yield about 345-355 basis points over comparable U.S. Treasuries, with
the 10-year issue yielding 357.5-367.5 basis points over comparable U.S. paper.

Market sources said pricing was delayed until Wednesday after more than 400 investors expressed interest in the deal. Officials at
Goldman Sachs & Co. and Salomon Smith Barney, lead managers of the Korean debt issue, declined to comment.

Seoul has said it plans to issue $9.0 billion of sovereign debt this year, and recently registered with the U.S. Securities and Exchange
Commission to issue up to $5 billion in debt.

Investors have been encouraged by Korea's recovery from its crisis earlier this year. The nation has rebuilt its reserves to more than
$25 billion, and the country has embarked on a course of financial and corporate restructuring.

With the sovereign bond issue, Seoul continued to repair the damage from its harrowing financial crisis that rattled world markets. A
string of Korean corporate failures last year put pressure on the domestic banks, led to a sharp drop in the Korean won, and depleted
Korea's international reserves.

Earlier this year, it appeared Korea's banks might fail to service their vast stockpile of foreign debt. The Korean government eased that
crisis when it negotiated a monumental exchange program in which global creditor banks agreed to swap nearly $22 billion in
short-term debt for new issues maturing over the next three years. That program closed last week.

The country enjoys staunch support from the international community. The International Monetary Fund led a nearly $60 billion rescue
package last year, and 13 industrialized countries promised $23.35 billion as a second line of defense.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 14:54 - ID#288157)

"The return for depositors in the Gold Deposit Accounts has increased from 2 percent to 4 percent"

Is not the rate of return on an asset predicated on the Value-Scarcity of the asset?
Flood the world with diamonds and the price goes down.
Gold is SCARCE...COMEX and LBME trade paper.
Who has the physical gold and WHAT DID THEY PAY FOR IT!

W H A T I S T H E R E A L P R I C E O F G O L D ? Physical gold, NOT the spot price for PAPER gold.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:01 - ID#375108)
Rumors & more Rumors
Just heard on business radio report here in Toronto ( CFTR ) : A German official ( didn't catch his name ) is to announce later today that the European Central Bank will hold only a small amount of gold??? BS or confirmation, anyone???

(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:01 - ID#269409)
Gold Miner vacations
Full story
S.Africa miners get option for unpaid leave
10:17 a.m. Apr 07, 1998 Eastern

JOHANNESBURG, April 7 ( Reuters ) - Several
thousand South African gold miners will be given
the option of taking extended unpaid leave in a bid
to save jobs, South Africa's Gold Crisis Committee
said in Tuesday.

The committee, comprising the country's major
gold producers and its largest gold miners' union,
reached agreement on unpaid leave for workers at
three mines -- Kloof, Libanon and East Driefontein.

``Instead of wholesale retrenchments, people will be
given an option of extended unpaid leave. It's not
saying they don't ever come back. There is an
option of being recalled,'' committee spokesperson
Dinah Lefakane told Reuters.

The crisis committee was set up in February to
minimise job losses in South Africa's embattled
gold industry. An estimated 50,000 miners lost
their jobs in 1997 as the country's once-mighty
gold firms slashed costs and closed unproductive
mines to compete with leaner foreign rivals.

Lefakane said 1,432 miners at East Driefontein and
1,685 miners at Kloof were eligible for the leave
proposal. Lefakane said the number of eligible
miners at Libanon was not available.

Asked about the prospect of miners being recalled to
work, Lefakane said, ``It would depend on
production costs and also the gold price. If the
price goes up, obviously they will need more

Recent gold strength has sparked hope that the
prolonged slump in bullion, which has devastated
South Africa's gold industry, may be over.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:03 - ID#288157)
TYoung (Letter delivered to Foley by Hashimoto)
Brillant! Clever! Witty!
Do you hear the sound of MANY hands clapping? {:- ) )

(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:05 - ID#431263)
DO MY EYES DECEIVE ME OR IS THE DOW DOWN 130 and Nasdaq DOWN 39 and GOLD @ 312? Tick -1116! You buy the dip, mein naive kleine Freund. I'm LONG GONE!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:07 - ID#340302)
The Plunge Protection Team and other mythologies...
LGB and his ilk are exceedingly complacent about any of the various falls in the DOW...complacency born of OCT. '97's intervention by the government and coporate America to preclude a DOW/Nasdaq debacle...on this forum, this intervention is given the name, "THE PLUNGE PROTECTION TEAM."

As I mentioned in an earlier post, the PPT is essentially the stock market's version of "DADDY" while DOW/Nasdaq investors act like children, unconcerned about any negative ramifications occuring from their reckless actions. Like children, they are convinced that, in in event of any world problem, "DADDY" will intervene and prevent any disaster from occuring to them.

This attitude represents nothing less than the infantilization of the American investor by the establishment. They have been treated like children so long that they in fact have become children.

This micro analogy poses one substantive problem however: sometimes, in a real good street fight, Daddy is just not around...he may be preoccupied with more pressing business...maybe off to fight a war somewhere...or he may be ill with the Asian Flu...and in such a scenario, a kid unable to think, act, and defend himself on his own can get the living crap beaten out of him.

Unfortunately for DOW/Nasdaq investors, when they buy stock they are not guaranteed the services of a protective Daddy. Extrapolation from the circumstances in OCT. '97 to the present is a dangerous child-like "fantasy." There has never been in the history of America to date a guarantor against financial losses. What is so unique about today's America that such a radical new phenomenon would manifest itself now?



silver plate
(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:08 - ID#289468)
Gold accounts
What a great idea. Why doesnt a US bank open "gold deposit accounts"? Instead of leaving gold transactions to gold and coin dealers they couls cater to those that want a hedge against paper, offer a safe secure storage facility. The profit could come from a premium differential in the buying and selling of the metal.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:11 - ID#401460)
Gold $

Gold May or June CNBC $312.00


(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:11 - ID#36156)
silver plate - Gold accounts
Just a matter of time before that happens ... not because it's a good thing, but because the Feds would then know where the gold is once they confiscate it from the populace.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:12 - ID#269409)
@ SDR'r...REAL price of Gold?
The real price? How about the price in U.S. dollars that the U.S. Treasury charges for a One Ounce American Eagle on a given day to it's member distributors?

Or....barring currency, we can look at Gold relative to other things. Housing, Food, auto's, etc. Let me see now, I bought a home in 1980, and a Honda automobile.....

Ounces of Gold for Home purchase ( Silicon Valley, 3 Br Rnch ) ;

1980 = 150 Ounces of Gold
1998 = 1,096 Ounces of Gold

Ounces of Gold for Auto purchase ( Civic LX )

1980 = 6 Ounces of Gold
1998 = 48 Ounces of Gold

Ounces of Gold for DOW

1980 = 1.5 Ounce of Gold ( approx. )
1998 = 29.0 Ounces of Gold

Services, Food, Gas, insurance, medical care, etc....similar results. Above does not account for lost 1000% equities market gains if Gold held
in lieu of other commodities.

Summary, Gold is worth about 15 % of what it was in 1980. can still buy a suit at K-mart with an Oz. of Gold...

(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:12 - ID#212197)
I enjoyed very much your analysis. Could be you are right. However, I tend to think that certain tendencies in his post indicate a partial engagement of opinion which probably comes from real experience rather than academic opinion.

I noticed ANOTHER is quite critical of the LBMA business policies and on the other hand trusts the BIS ( Bank for International Settlement ) .

The way he talked about these two institutions indicates true knowledge resulting from experience. This is not typical for people communicating in the academic environment.

Interesting is also what he says implicitly but not directly. Implicitly, he told us that Saudi Arabia has accumulated a gold hoard in the magnitude of 6,000 or up to 10,000 tons. Note: Implicitly! Can you imagine any academic expert who could avoid calculating and not making his calculations public just to gain credibility ?

ANOTHER avoids these typical academic attempts to gain credibility and therefore his statements don't lose grace. To brag with or talk about 10,000 tons of gold is not gracious! See, I talk about it without any grace, I go for the numbers, because I'm a financial dwarf.

If an academic expert would have the idea to bring the implosion of paper-money based economies in connection with global military strategies ( American war ships in the Gulf....Who defends Arabia?? ) he/she would start developing a scenario of possibilities. ANOTHER just brings up the thought and then refuses to broaden the discussion about it.

Nevertheless, I liked your considerations a lot.

Alberich the Dwarf

(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:13 - ID#342282)
Anybody re Standar charter Bank
Anybody got a URL? I lost mine. TIA

(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:13 - ID#304282)
Interesting quotes - look at yahoo

(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:15 - ID#269409)
@ 15% Gold's value relative to 1980
The 15% of course, corrected for many factors, such as market conditions and prices in other areas of U.S., to give Gold the most charitable benefit of the doubt. Local actual value, closer to 8% of 1980 value.

Strad Master
(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:15 - ID#250297)
Not so fast.
LGB: IF ANOTHER is who I think PH thinks he is, he has impressive credentials to say the least! ( I must reiterate, italicize, and underline the word IF!!! ) Beyond that, if PH has figured out ANOTHER's identity ( quite an achievement ) then it is wise to remember that even he operates from an economic worldview that colors his thinking and opinions. However, PH's ANOTHER has access to data, and possesses expertise and a brilliant economic mind that far outpaces anyone we have on this forum. If ANOTHER is who PH thinks, we should be honored that he spends time trying to educate us. I, for one, have not paid too much attention to the ongoing ANOTHER debate, nor have I read his posts that often, but if he is who PH thinks ( and if I'm right in my suspicion ) , I'll be memorizing his posts in the future.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:15 - ID#280215)
TYoung, ALL : RE - Japan selling US treasuries!
I haven't seen any comments about this, but I saw on the news over the weekend that CHINA has bought huge amounts of treasuries and the US is worried that they will sell to hurt the US, should any friction occur between the two countries, or should China need money.

As someone who knows of but doesn't follow this to closely, it would seem to me that this would be more ominous than the Japan situation. Japan is considered a ally and the US could probably convince them to hold off and work out some kind of a deal not to sell strongly. But would China care, since they are an enemy? I'm just curious if anyone saw this news item on CNN and if anyone has any comments on this. Thanks in advance.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:20 - ID#401460)

GOLD 04/07/98 2030 30920 0

On CNBC, they are talking about having another 4 1/2 hour session on Dow 9000.


Spud Master
(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:26 - ID#273112)
Don't worry, be happy....
da Plunge Protection Team ( practicing safe "investing" ) will pull the Dow back up at the last moment. You believe it.

Apapercalypse Now!


(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:29 - ID#212197)
Lieber Herr Goldener Kaesekopf
...I think you saw right:
as of 3:21 pm June gold is at 312.00 ( up $0.60 )
and the DOW is down 133 at 8,900.

Mit herzlichen Gruessen

Alberich the Dwarf

(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:29 - ID#431263)
I reported this on Kitco yesterday! The rumor has it that China bought 52 BILLION worth of US Treasuries in February to use as a weapon against the US should some western hedge fund begin speculating against the HK Dollar! Barton Biggs is on right now on CNBC and he believes that the ASIAN reflex rally we've had since January is NOW OVER and that the Japanese problem is going to send Asia into the toilet one more time maybe worse then the last plunge. WIll pressure China to devalue and decouple HK Dollar from US dollar which she will resist as long as possible EVEN IF IT MEANS FLOODIN' THE WORLD WITH US PAPER!!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:31 - ID#289357)
chas @ Standard Chartered Bank

(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:32 - ID#208393)
Good URL showing the losses on the NAS flyers. Second day in the row for them. The end is near when the big guys start showing losses.


(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:32 - ID#288155)
LGB, Excellent! Now if we can look a little beyond our backyard?
Ounces for purchase Germany:
Ounces for purchase France:
Ounces for purchase: Japan

Just struggling to see beyond the Potemkin dollar {:- ) )

(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:33 - ID#269409)
@ Strad Master..ANOTHER
No doubt he's a shrewd minded character with high IQ and market knowledge. However, as to his overall sincerity I remain a skeptic. Why speak riddles if you're trying to "educate"? He talks of a New major purchase/buyer, changing the fundamentals of the Gold market, leaving it all very mysterious, and then tells us AFTER the fact ( once his true believers have adequately coached him as to how current market events have follwoed his scenario ) ...that he was indeed referring to the Belgian CB sale!

Uh huh..then why not say up front that it was a CB sale announcement of 2 or 3 hundred tons and put all doubt to rest as to his insider knowledge? What's the big secret? Why was this sale so different from the dozens that came before it? Before we get too Euphoric about Gold's move up thge past few days, we'd do well to look closely at just how small a move it's been, relative to say, the Equities market of the past 3 months.

$280 Gold bottom was called for by many here, but for sound fundamental reasons relative to supply, demand, increased purchases in 1997/1998 at bargain levels, current market conditions, and production costs that average around that $280 level. I'll stick with common sense and reason until ANOTHER nmakes clear and verifiable calls and claims. Till then, his phony foreign mystery prose smacks of just so much Hypobabble in my view.

The perpetual skeptic........LGB

(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:39 - ID#257148)
Spud man.

Mindless rampage? You?

In the Spudhammer world, evil forces drive the greater family of potatoes in a mindless rampage across the lands. Mighty Spuds arise from the fields, possessed by the arcane magiks of evil overlords to destroy the human scourge.
Mounted Baked Potatoes, riding magically animated gourds, race across the veldt dealing out death and carnage to the fleshy folk

(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:42 - ID#269409)
@ SDR'r....US Centric
I understand your point, in today's global economy and all....but keep in mind that ( US centric though this sounds ) the fact is, the U.S. economy is king, the U.S. dollar is currency King, the U.S. political system and stability is King, the U.S. worker is King, U.S. Corporate profits are King, U.S. worker productivity is highest in the world, U.S. social services vs. tax burden is among the best in the world, U.S. is the only remaining global superpower, etc. etc. ad nauseum.

The fact is, folks everyhwere recognize and accept the mighty U.S. dollar.... but I wouldn't say the same for the Yen, Desutchmark, etal..and including the upcoming untested Euro.

( Running for cover and back to work now as the U.S. haters gear up to launch nuclear weapons at poor ole patriotic, sheep like, gullible, hoodwinked by the conspirators...LGB )

(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:55 - ID#269409)
Pan American Silver Options...YES!
Gonna get me some...Tuesday April 7, 1:17 pm Eastern Time

Company Press Release

SOURCE: Philadelphia Stock Exchange

PHLX to Begin Trading Eight New Options

PHILADELPHIA, April 7 /PRNewswire/ -- The Philadelphia Stock Exchange ( PHLX ) is pleased to announce that it will begin trading
put and call options on Abacus Direct Corporation ( option/stock symbol: AZQ/ABDR ) , Brandywine Realty Trust ( option/stock symbol:
BDN ) , Michael Foods, Inc. ( option/stock symbol: DQM/MIKL ) , and Perclose, Inc. ( option/stock symbol: PQ/PERC ) upon the opening
of business on Thursday, April 9, 1998. Options on The Houston Exploration Co. ( option/stock symbol: THX ) , Pan American Silver
Corp. ( option/stock symbol: PZQ/PAASF ) , and Servico, Inc. ( option/stock symbol: SER ) , will begin trading upon the opening of
business on Tuesday, April 14, 1998. Options on Midway Games, Inc. ( option/stock symbol: MWY ) will begin trading upon the opening
of business on Wednesday, April 15, 1998.

The following table lists the stocks, symbols, position limits, auto execution guarantee ( AUTO-X ) , and specialist unit for each new issue:

Abacus Direct Corp. ( AZQ/ABDR ) 4,500 20-up Market St. Securities
Brandywine Realty Trust ( BDN ) 4,500 20-up Apex Inv. Group
The Houston Exploration Co. ( THX ) 4,500 20-up Market St. Securities
Michael Foods, Inc. ( DQM/MIKL ) 4,500 20-up Apex Inv. Group
Pan American Silver
Corp. ( PZQ/PAASF ) 4,500 20-up Market St. Securities
Perclose, Inc. ( PQ/PERC ) 4,500 20-up Market St. Securities
Servico, Inc. ( SER ) 4,500 20-up Apex Inv. Group
Midway Games, Inc. ( MWY ) 4,500 10-up Park Avenue Securities

Options on Abacus Direct Corp., The Houston Exploration Co., Pan American Silver Co., and Perclose, Inc. will trade on the March
expiration cycle with initial expiration months of May, June, September, and December. Opening strike prices for Abacus Direct Corp.
will be 40, 45, and 50. Opening strike prices for The Houston Exploration Co. will be 20, 22-1/2, and 25. Opening strike prices for Pan
American Silver Corp. will be 7-1/2, 10, and 12-1/2. Opening strike prices for Perclose, Inc. will be 25, 30, and 35. Options on
Brandywine Realty Trust, Michael Foods, Inc., and Servico, Inc. will trade on the February expiration cycle with initial expiration
months of May, June, August, and November. Opening strike prices for Brandywine Realty Trust and Michael Foods, Inc. will be
22-1/2, 25, and 30. Opening strike prices for Servico, Inc. will be 20, 22-1/2, and 25. Options on Midway Games, Inc. will trade on the
January expiration cycle with initial expiration months of May, June, July, and October. Opening strike prices for Midway Games, Inc.
will be 20, 22-1/2, and 25.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:58 - ID#344308)

here is an interseting perspective of many indicies....

thanks vronsky...

channels for some.....volatility for others...options
LOVE volatility...rikki don't lose that number.......
you might need it when you feel better...when you get
home....steely tell your-self your not my kind..
but you don't even know your mind....

bring on another to replace another...there awill always be
another to believe another...cherokeeism

another is hep-rat...hep-rat is another......first bre-x...
then big another gumblio... borne of kitco's
earlier days, when he tried to impress....his ego kicked-him-in-the-ass.. can one fool make 'another' wise? ----kansas....
gullibility is the fallibility of mankind...

the smoke-signals told of the first two well before they arrived at
roads you know about another tam bien...peopleo gold buyers?...
damn...guess it could happen..

who has their tickets? the last announcements are being made...
ALLABOARD--------ALLABOARD....the gold-n-silver express leaving
for all points shortly!! ALLABOARD......

reminds me of the song by the eurythmics----'missionary-man'---

rj---you know better....bring your hide back here a'fore'n the
texas tribe makes their next trip to huntington beach!--real soon-btw--
that would insure that would be-a-keepin-it!!--yer-hide--
with your abilities....there is NO WAY you can accept the terms dictated
due to anger..

..gen georgie patton said it best..

'the best defense, is a strong offense!'
you are one of the giants
i refer to in my ramblings.....return, or suffer the wrath of
flaming-cyber-arrows----they're real nasty...ask-the-rat......


(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:59 - ID#344308)

here is an interseting perspective of many indicies....

thanks vronsky...great site...

channels for some.....volatility for others...options
LOVE volatility...rikki don't lose that number.......
you might need it when you feel better...when you get
home....steely tell your-self your not my kind..
but you don't even know your mind....

bring on another to replace another...there awill always be
another to believe another...---cherokeeism IV...

another is hep-rat...hep-rat is another......first bre-x...
then big another gumblio... borne of kitco's
earlier days, when he tried to impress....his ego kicked-him-in-the-ass.. can one fool make 'another' wise? ----kansas....
gullibility is the fallibility of mankind...

the smoke-signals told of the first two well before they arrived at
roads you know about another tam bien...peopleo gold buyers?...
damn...guess it could happen..

who has their tickets? the last announcements are being made...
ALLABOARD--------ALLABOARD....the gold-n-silver express leaving
for all points shortly!! ALLABOARD......

reminds me of the song by the eurythmics----'missionary-man'---

rj---you know better....bring your hide back here a'fore'n the
texas tribe makes their next trip to huntington beach!--real soon-btw--
that would insure that would be-a-keepin-it!!--yer-hide--
with your abilities....there is NO WAY you can accept the terms dictated
due to anger..

..gen georgie patton said it best..

'the best defense, is a strong offense!'
you are one of the giants
i refer to in my ramblings.....return, or suffer the wrath of
flaming-cyber-arrows----they're real nasty...ask-the-rat......


(Tue Apr 07 1998 15:59 - ID#304282)
The report I saw was that they were threatening to sell them if currency speculaters attacked their currency. Chinia is our enemy and this would be an interesting scenerio.

Voyeur Professor
(Tue Apr 07 1998 16:00 - ID#231101)
For Novice at 15:01

(Tue Apr 07 1998 16:01 - ID#402260)

R E H T 0 N A

Quit spinning. The code is broken. GOLD is GOLDen!!!!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 16:03 - ID#304282)
Sorry Golden Cheesehead
I didn't see your post

Voyeur Professor
(Tue Apr 07 1998 16:06 - ID#231101)
For Novice at 15:01


You did indeed hear correctly. Apparently, the disinformation masters are at it again. Now, according to this Yahoo post, the Euro gold reserve will be minimal. Here's and excerpt:

"Another dealer said the fund selling was sparked by a report that a Bundesbank council member had said gold would play only a small role in the European Central Bank ( ECB ) after European Monetary Union.

In an interview with Bridge News, Bundesbank council member Ernest Welteke said the ECB would likely hold gold reserves but a decision had not yet been finalised.

Welteke noted in the interview that gold had hardly a role to play today, although Germany as the second-largest gold reserves holder after the U.S. certainly had an interest in seeing bullion reserves maintained at the ECB."

We may be inundated in a new round of speculation about gold's role as a currency reserve.

John Disney__A
(Tue Apr 07 1998 16:10 - ID#24135)
Sweet Harmony
Some new person has criticised me for cr@ping on
NA stocks. If I told you I would buy one Id be lying.
I think they are overvalued by any standard, reserves,
average costs, earnings/share. But I am not PROMOTING
RSA shares. I dont care one way or the other who buys
them. And if some gentleman thinks he's being nasty with
me, I rather hope he does NOT buy them but sticks with
the NA stocks. He will learn the hard way.
It is NOT a matter of opinion .. it is a matter of
mathematics.. However if it makes some people FEEL better
, I think some of the NA stocks have nice names .. I
like HOMESTAKE .. cute name .. Newmont mining .. got a
nice ring to it. Buy them ... enjoy

For Myrmidon... Im in love... I only have eyes for
Harmony.. I sold a couple thousand and it KILLED me.
It was an offering .. a sacrifice ... it was awful.
I dumped a lot of other stuff without mercy .. but
losing a little Harmony hurt me. Ill sell some fregold
tomorrow I think and a little more randfonts. Still
holding Rangy .. and DDeeps preferred and options..
but I have a LOT of randfontein and Ill trade out of it
into more Harmony if I can buy it break even.
If there are any signs of life for platinum versus
gold Ill buy more Impala.
Im worried about gold now and the RSA first quarter
earnings. Im fine when Im losing money but very
jumpy when Im winning... pretty stupid hey ??

(Tue Apr 07 1998 16:15 - ID#39971)

I believe the world was in awe of Japan at one time too!Huh?Only

problemo,they weren't allowed to build up the massive firepower the

US has.Things change.That is the only certainty.This is why people

buy insurance and invest what they can.What has been an individual's

return on their house,car,or medical insurance since 1980?

You site the same old tired argument of comparing a gold investment to

an equity or other investment.This is the most misleading argument used

by those who would hang you out to dry to get their commish!I don't buy

it and neither should anyone with an IQ higher than their shoe size.


P.S.I don't dislike the US,I just wish you guys would come back down to

good old Mother Earth before it's too late.:- )

(Tue Apr 07 1998 16:18 - ID#212197)
@LGB (15:33) ANOTHER never announced the Belgian Sale!
He announced a large purchase! Not a sale! That exactly makes the big difference in the whole deal.
This purchase was obviously enforced, initialized, at a point of time, when the purchaser wasn't known. That's why the price in the transaction didn't depress the marked. The opposite is true. The deal was made at $305 when the COMEX price was in the low $290.

o.k., after the victim was chosen and the Belgian dummies were the ones who had to do satisfy the purchasers, it was told to the public as a sale! It is propaganda that it was a sale! Only through ANOTHER do we have the empiric evidence how these gold transactions are manipulated.

I think you don't do yourself a favour by not seeing the facts as they really are. At least the probablility of this version which I tried to explain above is much higher than to say: o.k, after the fact when everybody learned through the press that a "sale" has happened ( and all facts, like the higher price proof that it was a "purchase"! ) ANOTHER claimed credit for the prediction. Fact is: he has announced a purchase wich had the market effect of lifting the price! We still don't know who the purchasers were! We only know the seller. Why?


Alberich the Dwarf

(Tue Apr 07 1998 16:23 - ID#251166)
@ PH in LA re. your 12:06 re. ANOTHER: Why Does He Post?
Excellent, well thought out post. Can't say I believe the specifics of your conjecture -- that is, that ANOTHER is a European professor. My best guess is that he's from the Middle East. But that's neither here nor there. What most impressed me was your conclusion as to why ANOTHER posts, that he is a teacher.

I teach as well ( rather, also -- I would hope as well ) , among the diverse mandates of my calling. Few joys surpass imparting insight to another; few joys exceed that of watching in the eyes of another the light switch on. It is a kick -- even a form of justification, even vindication. Beyond that, however, teaching is a way to change the world, cf. Confucious, Homer, Socrates, Jesus Christ, Paul of Tarsus, Mohammed, et al. Does ANOTHER belong among this class of teacher? No need to answer. But in considering the question we must first consider how we respond to teaching.

I am new to Kitco, new to investing, but not new to taking risks. I came here only after I'd secured my position, clutching tight to my fundamentals. The Dow is high and gold is cheap. Everyone's looking one way, so I'm gonna look another. I am, I believe, the persuaded Little Guy ( although Farfel says not, to which I deduce then I'm early ) . Anyway, what ANOTHER finds here at Kitco -- what we all find here at Kitco -- is a group predisposed to consider matters related to gold. ( Just try talking about an oil-gold-dollar relationship with your centerfielder, your bass guitarist, or, gack, your wife! ) We would be remiss not to weigh the counsel of ANOTHER -- or Farfel, or LGB, or vronsky, or RJ, or John Disney, or APH, or Allen, or EB, or Bernatz, or PH in LA, or even some new little guy of hardly any weight at all. Who knows too much to learn a little more?

For me the question is: Who am I here for? If it was just me, I'd be bumbing around Europe writing novels and sprechen oxenscheiser mit de frauleins. But it's not just me. Just as, for each of you, you tender a position much larger than yourself. For whom is ANOTHER here? PH in LA, you've answered my question. He's here for himself *through us*; he sees himself in our reflection; he defines, maybe justifies and vindicates himself, through us -- a much broader purpose, maybe, than many of ours, and surely intensly personal. Anyone can tell. Anyone can see. Because he so enjoys himself. Enjoys us.

His stuff is consistent and not really mysterious, just requiring a careful read. But more or less valid than anyone else's stuff? That's for each to decide, and to act upon or not, alone.

If gold goes to $250, I hold and buy more as I can. If gold goes to $500, I hold and buy more as I can. If gold goes to $10,000, I hold and buy more IF I can. I cannot be any richer than I already am today, therefore I seek not profits but a legacy. Maybe that's what ANOTHER is after, a legacy -- through whomever will listen, among them, us.

With or without the posts of ANOTHER, however, I count myself among a privileged few.

Thanks for reading.
Respectfully, jonesy

(Tue Apr 07 1998 16:26 - ID#280215)
MR. G. CHEESHEAD and Tricky!
Thanks for your responses. To me, this is more of a possibility than Japan for I think, obvious reasons. Stay tuned!

I would have responded to you sooner, but KKKIIIITTTCCCOOO IISS SSOO SSSSLLLOOOOWWWW NNNOOWWW !!!!

Spud Master
(Tue Apr 07 1998 16:30 - ID#273112)
Yamamoto: "We have awakened a sleeping tater..."

Highly risable.

What next? More Brazilian dissing of tapirs? Bill Clinton only wishes...

Spud, ardently lusting for the end of the false world of debt-slavery paper and its wicked cabal of slugs in three piece suits.

ps -
Whoever said, spoke well: the Dow, like a dying star, must consume ever increasing quantities of cash to merely stay in place. But the additional infusions buy LESS time than each successive infusion ( ROTH IRAs, Home Equity Mortgages ) .

Hence the latest mewlings about redirecting Social inSecurity money into the stock markets. Make no mistake! This is a sign of utter desperation! There will be an end!

1776 NOW!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 16:40 - ID#375108)
Voyeur Professor, 16:06
Thanks for checking this report from another media source. I've now heard this "news" mentioned two more times ( on radio news ) , where it has been given as a reason for weakness in ( 1 ) TSE gold stocks and ( 2 ) the Canadian dollar ( our resource-based economy, you see ) . Spinmeisters at work...

(Tue Apr 07 1998 16:42 - ID#340302)
F*'s Evaluation of the GOLD market....
...extreme wariness on the part of gold investors continues...they still cannot believe it when the market opens up on strength or when the market ends in strength...two phenomena rarely ever witnessed over the course of the gold bear, particularly during the gold bear "crisis" this past year.

Again, this "tentative, uncertain climb up a wall of worry" is great news to gold indicates the complete absence of euphoria which would signal a gold market top.

Gold stock volumes remain unusually low...indicating the almost total absence of populist interest in the gold market. Much money waiting on the sidelines to pour into the gold market once the equities/bonds bear is confirmed via an imminent debacle.

On a fundamental basis, the best news about GOLD these days ( amidst the avalanche of negatives ) is this:

A majority of market analysts seem to be forming a consensus that a mere 5% gold support of the EURO will indicate a minimum gold price this year of $350.

If the gold support behind the EURO is only 10%, the gold price support level is indicated to be 375 this year.

Furthermore, if gold support behind the EURO exceeds 10%, then 400 is almost a certainty this year.

This is encouraging news in an often very discouraging gold market.


(Tue Apr 07 1998 17:00 - ID#201238)
A. Goose take a gander at this
Comex gold stocks
475,361 0 203 -203 0 475,158
148,278 0 5,207 -5,207 0 143,071
623,639 0 5,410 -5,410 0 618,229

Comex silver stocks fell 400,000 oz to 87,000,000 oz

(Tue Apr 07 1998 17:08 - ID#252127)

When the setting of the spot gold price -basis paper gold- as traded on the Comex and other World paper gold exchanges comes to a halt, I can see the gold producers working through their various associations setting an equitable price for their product.

If global debt, assets or whatever were used to set the gold price as ANOTHER seems to suggest I see complete havoc and uncertainty occurring.

If as I believe, or IMO, THAT WE HAVE MAJOR POWER STRUCTURES WHOSE GOAL IS MORE POWER; that results of such a revaluation would be like jumping from the frying pan into the fire, or: that control over the population in such a situation would be even greater.
I for one would not want to see the result of such a massive gold price rise.

On the other hand an initial price set by the producers and set as "a temporary equitable gold price", seems to be best. Such a price can be set by virtue of their knowledge of the costs and could vary on that basis plus supply/demand.

The various financial systems would have time to establish their final "equitable gold price" and to determine golds roll in those indivigual systems.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 17:10 - ID#252127)

When the setting of the spot gold price -basis paper gold- as traded on the Comex and other World paper gold exchanges comes to a halt, I can see the gold producers working through their various associations setting an equitable price for their product.

If global debt, assets or whatever were used to set the gold price as ANOTHER seems to suggest I see complete havoc and uncertainty occurring.

If as I believe, or IMO, THAT WE HAVE MAJOR POWER STRUCTURES WHOSE GOAL IS MORE POWER; that results of such a revaluation would be like jumping from the frying pan into the fire, or: that control over the population in such a situation would be even greater.
I for one would not want to see the result of such a massive gold price rise.

On the other hand an initial price set by the producers and set as "a temporary equitable gold price", seems to be best. Such a price can be set by virtue of their knowledge of the costs and could vary on that basis plus supply/demand.

The various financial systems would have time to establish their final "equitable gold price" and to determine golds roll in those indivigual systems.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 17:14 - ID#26793)
Dow/Gold Ratio = 28.95

(Tue Apr 07 1998 17:18 - ID#26793)
XAU/Spot Ratio = .278

(Tue Apr 07 1998 17:21 - ID#269409)
@ Alberich...Belgian sale/purchase
Re your 16:18, your premise ( and the ANOTHER clut's premise ) is pretty faulty re the CB Belgian sale being a major "purcahse" by a new buyer.

For one thing, this sale was conducted in increments over time, and for ANOTHER thing, when it was finallky announced, it was announced that it was the final is a series of sales since 1989! Hardly anything earthshakingly "new" as far as some big buyer is concerned. And where was the vaunted BIS open purcahses?

Producer buying, shifting Long/Short ratio, Japan problems, the Oil consortium deal of 2 weeks ago, diversification of nervous stock profits, "Bargain" hunting for Gold now that it seens it's seen it's bottom, these and many others are the reasons Gold is firming.... with little or nothing to do with the Belgian news of long gone sales of 299 tons.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 17:22 - ID#26793)
Gold/Silver Ratio = 48.27

(Tue Apr 07 1998 17:39 - ID#329157)
ANOTHER as teacher
As I previously mentioned on Feb 6, a transactional analysis approach to ANOTHER's writing brings out aspects that point to a "teacher" behaviour:
"Nurturing ego-state is typical of the teacher or adviser; and when I say adviser I tend here to think of the Mentor or adviser to the King; one who must be very persuasive to get the message across, without seeming to dictate."
"ANOTHER is an accomplished communicator. He/she engages multiple ego states and encourages us to respond in Child ego state and move to
Adult ego state. Just as a teacher, orator, or leader would."

PHinLA very clearly highlighted the "teacher" aspect again today with an interesting post. However, as others have pointed out with better justification, he doesn't seem that much like an academic type.

ANOTHER's "multiple personality" posts simply point to literally multiple persons working at the keyboard. Someone is in charge, someone is a chief advisor ( the above analysis may be of the advisor, not the key player! ) , and others may be brought in to give "special reports". Or that is what they want us to think....

Recall also SDRer__A making the following most interesting observations
on Feb 6th:

SDRer__A ( CJSI, with wonder... ) ID#286249:
"The Demeanor of the Scholar and Gentleman:
When he plays the role of a father or elder brother... his
demeanor should be relaxed and his manner
should be dignified, grave, inspiring, correct but
comfortable to be around, noble and imposing, broadminded,
enlightened, and calmly at ease....

Also; Fri Feb 06 1998 19:48
SDRer__A ( CJSI--Another's Thoughts examined... ) ID#286249:
Enjoyed your thoughtful post. My 'contribution' is the observation
that--for me, at any rate--his education in governance has been in
the long tradition of his country. Do not these words fit your

"Exalted, highly esteemed, and honored--he does not use these to be
arrogant toward others. Astutely intelligent and possessing
sagelike wisdom--he does not use these to place others in
difficulty. Quick-witted, fluent, agile, and universal in his
intellectual grasp--he does not employ these to gain precedence
over others. Strong, resolute, brave, and daring--he does
not use these to cause injury to others. When he does not know, he
asks others; when he lacks an ability he studies; and even when he
possesses an ability, he always yields to others. Only thusly does
a man develop inner power."
Xun Kuang ( who wasn't cast aside during most of the Chinese
communist era )

I think SDRer's comments point us directly to ANOTHER's upbringing and maybe later interests. Many business leaders in the West study the writings of Sun Tzu, for example.

Tyler Rose
(Tue Apr 07 1998 17:47 - ID#373164)

Thank you, PH in LA for your interesting post re: ANOTHER's identity. One thing I can say for sure, I have been educated as a result of researching some of his pronouncements. I had never heard of BIS before, for example. Also, I think his comments re gold/oil arrangements led some one on this site to discover the Lebanon Accord. In addition, his insight that it was in the best interests of the US to raise oil prices in the 1970's was quite a flash of light. In looking at that period, one can easily see that the price of oil was so ridiculously low that the price had to be raised in order that drilling and exploration would be financially feasible. I think ANOTHER has made many contributions to our education, or at least to mine.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 17:47 - ID#26669)
LGB, then as one AI to another (no pun intended)
I made nearly 40% last year in a total DOG of a value stock fund, the sort of income stocks that nobody ever expects to make more than 10% per year. And my gold portfolio lost nearly 20% by year end. Well this first quarter the gold stocks have gone up over 25%% as opposed to 12% for the income stocks. Thus proving the old adage that every man ( provided they pass the Test? ) is a genius in a bull market. IMHO

Here is the link to Dr. Phillips' webpage. His AI has really racked up some impressive wins this last year ( see the old adage about bull markets ) .

(Tue Apr 07 1998 17:47 - ID#26669)
LGB, then as one AI to another (no pun intended)
I made nearly 40% last year in a total DOG of a value stock fund, the sort of income stocks that nobody ever expects to make more than 10% per year. And my gold portfolio lost nearly 20% by year end. Well this first quarter the gold stocks have gone up over 25%% as opposed to 12% for the income stocks. Thus proving the old adage that every man ( provided they pas the Test? ) is a genius in a bull market. IMHO

Here is the link to Dr. Phillips' webpage. His AI has really racked up some impressive wins this last year ( see the old adage about bull markets ) .

(Tue Apr 07 1998 17:48 - ID#269409)
@ HepMeMoney
Yes patriotically beating drum has a redundant tone to it...but consider this. The folks here who constantly talk up Gold as a "Store of value" and "Insurance" and "Real Money" etc etc. in fanatical manner and to the exclusion of Equity and dollar investments, have missed the BIG picture re today's economy.

In missing the best Bull market in history, and favoring Gold, they've done exactly the OPPOSITE of what a cautious, conservative, big picture, "Insuring the future" and "Store of value" investor would have done.

I'm just beginning to accumulate Gold. I believe it's seen bottom. I think stocks are in for a fall. However, I thought stocks were overvalued at DOW 8150 last August.... and I sold all my mutual fund shares at that time. Meanwhile, I currently have 50% of my 401 K plan in my own company's stock ( which has gone up approx. 20% in the past month, 400% past 3 years ) . OK, that's a bit risky, but I understand this particular company and it's market very well.

Would I have been wiser to have all my investment funds in a "secure" store of value like Gold the past few years? Only if I wanted to embrace future impoverishment in retirement. Other than bad derivitaves plays ( like the ones Puetz used to try and sell us on here ) I can think of no other major investment that's been worse than Gold the past 2 decades. And even when the tide turns, as it seems to be doing now, those who don't diversify, and keep some cash & stocks in mind for future years, will do so to their financial detriment.

When all the bad corportae earnings reports come flowing in, and other triggers precipitate a big downturn in DOW, I'll be waiting with dollars on the sidelines to dollar cost average back in for the LONG haul....Gold will only be a portion of my portfolio, and a small one at that.

Charles Keeling
(Tue Apr 07 1998 18:05 - ID#344225)
@ ALBERICH RE: Belgian Gold Sale
Based on my information ( from somewhere
credible ) The purchaser of the Belgian GOLD
was the BIS.

The GOLD was spread out to 9 member CB'S.

This is old news that I thought everyone had
access to.

If ANOTHER had info on that pending purchase,
he could be affiliated with the BIS, or one
of the CB'S that received the purchased Gold.

Bharain? The list of member banks is to be
found at the BIS site.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 18:19 - ID#31868)
LGB - your post on patriotically beating a drum.
Are you in a round about way saying that patriotism is greed. Or did I miss something in the way you have woven about 5 totally different topics into one post intending on proving a vague point.

In addition you continue to label gold an "investment" when it is clear that it is the only true money on the face of the earth. If you can prove otherwise I would like to hear it.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 18:22 - ID#317193)
Agree gold has been bad, stocks very good. Like to have some cash available just as you. Gold, however, is a large portion of my investment strategy now. Tops go to bottoms and bottoms go to tops. Gold has been so bad the upside is,well, in my opinon,fantastic. Good luck. Tom

(Tue Apr 07 1998 18:39 - ID#348129)
@READ Steve Kaplan:
"BUY GOLD-The recently accelerating commercial accumulation of gold futures in a rising market is the most impressive feature of the past week's trading, especially since it has been given scant attention by analysts, and indicates that the price of gold is likely to continue to rise sharply."

(Tue Apr 07 1998 18:42 - ID#348129)

(Tue Apr 07 1998 18:47 - ID#375405)
G'morning all.
I see that the pregnant lady turned over.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 19:20 - ID#31868)
and a moment of silence for the Lady
Tammy Wynette -

(Tue Apr 07 1998 19:35 - ID#393224)
Gold Fever.
Yesterday I sold half of one of my gold shares that had gone up 52% since buying 7 trading days ago.

Told my wife that afternoon and she said "YOU SOLD!!" "WHY!!??" She was most upset.

I would like some advice on how to deal with a wife that has gold fever.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 19:35 - ID#288369)
@In the enemy camp....
So that I, and others so inclined, may pray and work for the speedy demise of our enemies, would you be so kind as to add to the following list the names of those that seemingly profit from our harm. I believe bringing to light their names and adverse agenda may help our solidarity ( and Kitco seems a bit slow tonight, er...this morning, Nick ) :

I offer to the council the first name of our enemy:

1. Ted Arnold and his Merrill Lynch gang.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 19:36 - ID#35767)
Remember the bogus lawsuit about silver, that was to flush out who was buying. Why,because the market hated the uncertainty of a rising market without flushing out the who. Once done the rumors that Buffet is selling are used to suppress the market. Everyone knows he owns it so the rumor works. They did it monday to keep gold from exploding ie sympathy selling. The Europe story re gold is out so that now rumors or stories can be spread about it not being true to support raids on gold. They need to immediately explain the rallies to control them and prevent big money demand from developing in which case what the Europeans did would be irrelevant/ how do you spell explosion ( gold ) and implosion ( Dow ) . THe markets appear to be becoming immune to this nonsense and they are getting desparate. Today's recovery in gold along with recent open interest and volume increases is nothing short of fantastic/ and horrible for the Wall St. Boys/ Ah When the Bell Tolls.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 19:40 - ID#31868)
Studio_R - the fire was lit earlier, we've been waiting for you.
Date: Tue Apr 07 1998 12:38
tolerant1 ( LGB ) ID#31868:
Lets call a dirtbag a dirtbag and Ted Allen is a dirtbag, Merrill Lynch I believe employs the dirtbag.

As reported today on USA GOLD, Reuters, that bastion of truth? has taken the dirtbag Ted Allens name off the story and is now not reporting it as a fact that WB sold any silver.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 19:41 - ID#31868)
never in writing.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 19:42 - ID#222231)
Someone ( I will not reveal who ) , wrote to me that LGB would'nt make a pimple on ANOTHER ( ANOTHER'S ) A@@. I said he would. YES or NO?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 19:43 - ID#288369)
Is Ted Allen another Merrill Lynch bum?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 19:48 - ID#31868)
Called and asked, they said they did not know. Who is Ted Arnold anyway! And how does anything this known to be short silver pri_k says get into the reuters reports anyhow.

Hmmmmmmm, I think these idiots think anybody with an attitude is poor or afraid. Don't rock the boat. I say lets sink it.

Funny though how when more people lookin to make money on something ask questions the retractions get put in print real fast.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 19:48 - ID#288369)
LGB can be a boil on anybody's arse.

Mike Sheller
(Tue Apr 07 1998 19:48 - ID#347447)
Just caught up with your morning question to me. Yes, I'm in New York. For more details, please email me at
I always did like your style.

Mike Sheller
(Tue Apr 07 1998 19:49 - ID#347447)

(Tue Apr 07 1998 19:51 - ID#255217)
Spud Master, re: 16:30
I don't care what anyone ( except Bart ) thinks. And I don't care if it IS off subject. I think your posts are hilarious and they give me a lift when I read them. There are some puffed-up fuddie duddies on this forum who have NO sense of humor and I really don't CARE what they think or say. Thanks. You should receive the golden spud of the year award.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 19:57 - ID#42365)
Mail me your IP next time you get online.. please? i wont tell just give the numbers ok? : )

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:00 - ID#288369)
@The Golden Sword of Justice vibrates with a glowing fire.....
anxious to offer its swift truth to the bowels of the enemy...for it is only their blood that will cool the blade. I offer the second name to the Sword:

2. Andy Smith

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:11 - ID#31868)
and you see, life is good, heartfelt and good.
Around Christmas my neighbors had stockings on their front door. So I slipped a Noble/Platinum in one stocking and a Nugget/Gold in the other.

A few days went by and as I was walking to my door they came out to greet me and said thank you. For what I asked. Well, that was a private conversation.

This evening I was presented, ( he had been traveling with a vicious schedule - first time he and she had a chance ) with two, of the only cigars I smoke, Arturo Fuente Grand Reserva, and a lighter that is magnificent.

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm, life is good. I gave gifts of value to them, and they in turn, presented me with gifts I value. Life is good.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:11 - ID#252391)
Reuters pulling WB STory?
Do I have this correctly that Reuters is backing off its story and quote of the ML trader who heard that WB had sold his silver.??

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:12 - ID#316193)
This is Very Positive For Gold - Japan Starts Cleaning Balance Sheets!!!!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:12 - ID#288369)
@The unholy name of.....
3. Michael Camdessus

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:17 - ID#288369)
@The Dow Fool's jester.....
4. little Jimmy Rogers

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:18 - ID#342282)
I need to discuss with you. If you can email your phone, I'll give you some details. thanx

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:18 - ID#411112)
Call me conspiratorial,has this happened to any one tried to get on the site at about,1500 hrs PST,

it kept taking me to a web service page, had a local number for tech support, I called ,disconected......I now I'am hearing black helecopters hovering over head.....

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:22 - ID#261269)
The Four-mouthed ...
5. kat..

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:22 - ID#288369)
@The Devil Incarnate:
5. Don Kudlow

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:23 - ID#261269)
Make that Foul-mouthed...
6. Hep.rat...

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:24 - ID#31868)
Studio_R if Andy Smith stood on his ancestors shoulders he could not
kiss a dogs ass, but before he tried, he would have to wait for Camdesuss to be done with the poor dog and his now oh so famous sex act which he alone is famous for.

They used to eat dogs in Asia, but no more, ever since the oral rash breakout of 95 when Camdesuss was visiting. Fortunately nobody died but the infected people must suffer through a life of kissing through Saran Wrap and antibiotics.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:26 - ID#288369)
@Thanks, Bill....whew!.......Now: His Mother's Pimp:
7. mobster Dom Battipaglia

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:32 - ID#288369)
@T#1...we'll drink hell's fire together....for selling out his industry.....
8. Peter Munk

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:34 - ID#253246)
Old Regan economist Larry "Cokehead " Kudlow

In todays squawk box appearance Kudlow remarked that gold is
the "mother of all inflation indicators" , he stated he is not worried
unless there is another $50 - $60 rise in the price of gold

Kramer says recent rise in gold price is from Japan reflating

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:36 - ID#288369)
@Cause he looks like a flute player I once hated....
9. Ron Insana

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:38 - ID#228128)
A book?
Studio.R: You were saying something about a book earlier this afternoon. Whats that about? Were you jesting? Also, I think you meant Lawrence ( I can fix the oil shortage problem if you strain out my hair ) Kudlow from Strictly Business on CNBC Anybody know what happened to that show?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:39 - ID#256250)
Remember we are facing a hard currency versus fiat currency battle. We must look at the world differently than before. Not East versus West, not Communist versus Capitalist, ..., BUT rather HARD Currency proponents versus Fiat currency proponents. We must support those who will help win this critical battle. Islam, China, Japan, India look as if they should be the friends of Kitco.


I was asked to repost this.

Date: Tue Apr 07 1998 12:22
A.Goose ( ) ID#20135:
Copyright  1998 A.Goose/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
Now that we have learned that COMEX is a paper gold exchange, it is much easier to understand how
gold has made all these strange moves over the past years.

Paper gold is easily controlled with derivatives. The way I see it the US ( with Britian maybe ) has set up a
group that insures that the market and all its components support the concept that the US market is the
only place to be ( whether it makes sense or not ) . All the worlds key commodities ( including the pm's )
are valued in the Usdollar. I strongly suspect that the various exchanges that trade those commodities
work in a very similar manner as the Comex.

It is fantastic. As Arden pointed out. When someone wants to make a actual trade they call the exchange
and the exchange helps set the price. The Exchange itself doen't sell "SPOT gold", it just seems to set its
price. I suppose the paper gold flying around is used to entertain and confuse folks and protect the base

I do not see the end to this insidious game until, Comex no longer holds eligible gold stocks. The SPOT
price of gold that we continually search for is not to found within the walls of Comex or LBME ( for I do
not believe that they are honest free market agencies ) .

Think about it. If it will take ONLY 1,490 contracts to wipe out comex's eligible stocks, the price
wouldn't be lower it would be higher ( the old supply and demand theory ) . Paper gold has no problems
with supply and demand and thus is the reason Comex operates as it does.

Japan, China, Islam, , will have to make an announcement that they are selling bonds and buying raw
gold and silver. The announcement will be as important as the actual action of buying bullion. Until such a
time, I believe we will continue to see the situation continue as is. Hard assets head down while paper
assets continue to rise FOREVER.


( the good news is that many countries in the world are very upset with the U.S.'s dishonest actions with
the Usdollar and US financial assets. I do believe the game is coming to a close. Sooner than later. And I
believe that one morning we will wake up to find out there is NO spot price of GOLD, as ANOTHER
suggested some time back. )

Remember we are facing a hard currency versus fiat currency battle. We must look at the world differently than before. Not East versus West, not Communist versus Capitalist, ..., BUT rather HARD Currency proponents versus Fiat currency proponents. We must support those who will help win this critical battle. Islam, China, Japan, India look as if they should be the friends of Kitco.


(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:41 - ID#253246)
Studio R a picture tells a thousand words
Studio R

The next time when your taking a dump, take a look at the paper when
your done wiping and you'll see a picture of Ted Arnold

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:45 - ID#373403)
The president is a quarter mile down the road right now at a $15,000/plate fundraiser. I was not willing to give up 50 oz. of gold for the priveledge. It was amazing the police presence as I drove down the road to the house he was at. From a mile away a squad car every driveway. As I passed the house it was a circus of secret service, police, news vans, and people seeking a portion of their 15 minutes of fame.

I just imagine that every guy at the dinner is watching his wife closely to make sure she does not disappear for a few minutes.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:46 - ID#288369)
@IDT...."Don" larry kudlow...of the and the same hoodlum.....
10. Bill humous ( even though the bacteria still thrive inside this mobile carcass )

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:47 - ID#31868)
A. Goose
Fiat paper = liars and scu_mbags

Gold and Silver = truthful people and people of honor

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:48 - ID#432157)
Who is the PREGNENT LADY ???????
Have to say something about GOLD. How I love thee let me count the ways 325-350-375-400-425.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:52 - ID#288369)
@I'm a dead man talking.....
11. Greenspam on a Reuben sammich....for printing the USA into chapter 7.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 20:52 - ID#31868)
The last three would not even be used as chum during a hunting expedition for Leper Goats that Camdesuss had adulterated.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:00 - ID#288369)
@ the Limey central banker that badmouths gold...
12. Hell I forgot his name ( just as well ) ...

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:01 - ID#31868)
L'il Jimmy is laughing all the way to the bank. He does not belong in this group. Not for these crimes, his choice of motorcycle is treasonable.

Kudlow on the other hand, is something the CDC should be working on to eradicate.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:04 - ID#28594)
A. Goose--BRABO!
"...if it be not now, yet it will come: the readiness is all."

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:05 - ID#31868)
Studio_R - dead man, shiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii_t! - you must be joking, there are one whole
lot of Americans that would just as soon have the last seen in Once Upon A Time in America be AG and RR jumping in the back of the garbage truck.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:07 - ID#256250)
Date: Tue Apr 07 1998 17:00
arden ( A. Goose take a gander at this ) ID#201238:
Comex gold stocks

Great to see the drawdown continuing.

This data is from yesterday.

-- -- -- -- TOTAL DELIVERY NOTICES -- -- --
ISSUED TODAY 225 1 198
SO FAR FOR April 3,858 43 3,943

The way I read it, Comex is going to have trouble filling these deliveries. What is your take?

Date: Tue Apr 07 1998 17:08

Nice post. I agree that if a honest exchange rate isn't set up before hand, things could get extremely nasty. I hope we will start seeing the formation of a gold pricing mechanism in the near future.

Is that what ANOTHER is proposing? Will it be a Islamic based currency? Will it come out of Asia? Eurpoe?

Don't know? But I hope it is one of the above and soon.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:07 - ID#288369)
@T#1.....little Jimmy.....
will have to make plea to the Golden Sword of Justice....I am but its lowly mouthpiece. Swoooooooosh! ( silence )

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:07 - ID#35767)
Social security Reform
The Wall St boys are desparate. IMHO Thru deriviatives they have kept the bubble going thru rescue so the public would become enamored with their product. Their goal is/was to get Social Security into the stk Market. To do this dissent is detested. Joe Battapaglia from Gruntal looked positively angry when Bill Fleckenstein pointed out the folly of this policy proposal. I noticed former Col Gov Lamm's ( I believe ) Daughter is involved in this movement ( he ( Lamm ) is a pro euthanasia and abortionist enthusiast and is in favor of cutting off SS to those who paid in ) Lets take his family's govt pension and impoverish them before one finger is put on SS or medicare by this bastard or his third millenium relative. We in our thirties wantt SS paid to our parents amd ourselves because we paid for it. If they give us a cause of action against Wall St if the Mkt falls then maybe OK. MAKE MERRILL PAY!!! for SS. The collapse will mean justice and liberation!!Clinton is right on this one!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:14 - ID#284255)
Swing chart updated
Swing oscillators looking very bearish and leaning over the edge.
If they can't pull up the indexes soon,
I would expect a sell-off similiar to Oct97 within the next 8 trading days.

Indonesian gold price.
Will the USA gold price look the same?

Old Gold
None of us can be that sure?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:16 - ID#26669)
Themissinglink re Clinton
Isn't it odd that a man could get elected as president of the US mainly on basis of female erotomanic fantasy ( with a not small admixture of male homoerotic charm thrown in ) ? Analysts of such matters say that the candidate with the most charisma usually wins the election; in Clinton's case though he appears to be a mutation not unlike The Mule in Asimov's "The Second Foundation" some with sort of bizarrely apt ability to make whole cities of fetishists and deviants turn out on his behalf.

I wonder if there a year 200 coin with Clinton as Caliguala would sell?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:16 - ID#31868)
Do you mean Dick Lamm from Colorado?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:18 - ID#288369)
@IDT....back to reality...whew!
The book of ANOTHER is offered for sale by Michael Kosares. Just click on the USA Gold advertisement here on Kitco....I think it's an interesting account of Kitco/ANOTHER/and the other "characters"....Kosares is a fine writer and as knowledgeable of precious metals as anyone alive.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:18 - ID#256250)
Date: Tue Apr 07 1998 20:47
tolerant1 ( A. Goose ) ID#31868:
Fiat paper = liars and scu_mbags

Gold and Silver = truthful people and people of honor

tolerant1, you have a way with words. Yes, I agree- well summed up.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:20 - ID#368244)
Boys, Boys

Really blood thirsty tonight. I have my golden lance prepared for battle.

Whom shall I let have it first?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:21 - ID#256250)
Date: Tue Apr 07 1998 12:59
chas ( A.Goose after your 12:22 ) ID#342282:
I would appreciate talking to you.

chas I will e-mail you later.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:25 - ID#210235)
In response to your poll, I would suggest that LGB has contributed much of value to this forum over the months I've been following it. His analysis of the silver market movement has been interesting. It takes many voices and viewpoints to make an interesting discussion. Lately it seems that only one voice is possible, that of Another and his fan club, and the "true believers". We have lost a whole string of interesting posters. RJ is the latest. You may be enjoying the victory of the battle while losing the war.

It is the cautious and critical analysis of those like RJ and LGB that make sense to the REST OF US. Those of us still in the regular world. Those of us who have the money and stock market profits to make a difference in your world.

you attacked LGB ( because he dissed Another, I presume. He did say he's buying gold today ) and you just reinforced the notion that goldbugs are a bunch of nuts. Add the IDCIBM chanting and groupie adoration of Another. Well, would YOU look further if you were considering perhaps adding a percent or so of gold to your stock-overweighted portfolio? YOU DON'T CARE, YOU'RE BUYING MORE, right?

Please respect Bart's guidelines. If you hate the rest of us, at least respect Bart. It is his dime.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:26 - ID#31868)
Studio_R - regarding Jimmy, my response as a mime
"____ ________ _____ __ _____ ______!"

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:31 - ID#201238)
A. Goose - its not that easy
Just because a delivery notice is issued doesn't mean the buyer intends to take delivery. It can happen when some one stays in the front month contract too long and gets this notice and says sheiss! I have to pay for this, then they either sell the contract or pony up full margin to pay for it. In the past when I thought there was going to be a big draw down in eligible stocks from the notices, they were mostly rolled over or sold, however, with a rising gold market all of that could change!!

Gold is now the strongest currency in the world!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:31 - ID#412172)
223, you blew me away with the reference to the Mule of the Foundation Trilogy in your post. There may be much truth therein.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:32 - ID#288369)
So that's what he looks like! ohmy.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:35 - ID#307271)
Joe Bettapaglia of Gruntal. Now there's one of the Very High Priests of the "HOLY BULL CHURCH". CNBC always yanks him out of the drawer when confronted with any opinion offensive to the "party line". He and those lizard shoes! He would look great on the hood of a solid gold Mercedes...chewing his well manicured nails of course.

Pacific Northwest Dave
(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:35 - ID#223187)

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:35 - ID#373403)
Is LGB being thin skinned again? Every few months he comes on and attacks someone hard. Then everyone counterattacks and he runs away. Poor LGB. Remember Puetz? Now Another.

If he was not so abrasive about these things other Kitcoites would welcome his counter-analysis.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:39 - ID#411112)
223,lot of fancy words,he like her are products of the 60's,understand that time in history

add 30 years,what you got is a pot
smoking,grey head hippie,rather than say sorry for slavery he
should say sorry on behalf of his
generation,for getting us in this mess

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:40 - ID#288369)
@ROR and PNW Dave.....
I will denouce my citizenship if Social Security invests in the stock market. Equity is always the last man out ( except he never gets out ) .

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:40 - ID#31868)
Gold is the only money. Paper in any form is a promise and subject to the honor of that entity which issues it.

Gold is the only value that may pass from the owners hand to a different hand wherein there is no need for confidence. It is what it is. This is this, that is that. nuff said...

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:43 - ID#31868)
Only if the Mercedes is cut into an El Camino body and has a bale of hay in the back, due to globalization, the hay can be from any country.

And the tape, Don't you...forget about me! heh, heh, playing when the owner takes delivery.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:50 - ID#307271)
Too bad I can't input a sound loop. I'd make the sound of a rifle bullet ricachetting off the Lone Ranger's teeth. The El Camino Allusion...A little non-sequetur no!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:54 - ID#288295)

Not to forget our good friend Wayne "better than gold" Angel...maybe we can just drag him along behind...

(Tue Apr 07 1998 21:58 - ID#255190)
Gold went up and stayed above 308

Rather than fall back to the low 290's again. Some where expecting a fall backward. Well, we have some strength and seem to be beating off the selling that typically follows a quick move. A number of funds and services have changed their gold stock sector anaylsis to buy recommendations, etc. And even LGB is buying. Well that about settles it!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:01 - ID#400214)
Prometheus Re: comment to Pete

Ditto to all you said.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:01 - ID#31868)
223 -robnoel_A -How were we supposed to know everytime Kennedy said
"We choose to go to the moon." He and his brother were talking about Marilyn?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:05 - ID#255190)
You are not angering me. You are boring me. There's a difference. You are one hyper chihuahua. You are enthusiastic to see the demise of a market and we certainly know that from your posts. Hope you feel great after each post, a real catharsis for you. Unfortunately the insightful comments you do make are lost to me since I skip your posts out of habit ... to much air. But as I said in the preliminary post, "IMO", and so this in that same vein. No hard feelings, just a little feedback if it is of any interest to you.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:07 - ID#411112)
tolerant1,at least JFK went after the best looking lady in the land,bubba's pack are dogs ,just for
that he should go

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:10 - ID#26669)
Robear, sorry, but it seems to be the truth. Didn't mean to step Asimov's toes.
The Mule was a likable, rather inept guy with a moderate i.q. and some kind of ESP mutation which made people want to do his bidding. He just happened to be born during vulnerable times when the entire civilization was uniquely vulnerable to such manouvers. Same as Clinton ( except I think his must be pheremones-much more provable than ESP ) . In a hundred years or even 10 if we're lucky we'll be past the adolesnsce of the postindustrial age and no longer so susceptable to ruin and dissolution by his ilk. If we live that long. IMHO

One of my disagreements with Mozel was that he believes we have some God given onus to change things. I on the other hand, just believe that the good guys must only strive to outlive the fools. Which is a pretty good reason to keep a gold nest egg despite the fact that it doesn't draw interest. All IMHO of course.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:10 - ID#288369)
@I'm not entirely sure if it is better to be .....
a pimple on someone's butt or not to be able to be a pimple on someone's butt? I know one thing, LGB can be a formidable pain in the butt if he thinks you're full of crap.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:11 - ID#400214)
LGB comments to SDR'r (...REAL price of Gold?)
I appreciated your comments. It really made me think. It really has been a bad 20 years for gold, and I had never really noticed, how bad.

I believe in the future this will reverse and gold will have the value returned to it, plus more. If it doesn't, then I will work to aquire what ever is of value in the future.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:13 - ID#238295)
Bufford: Thanks for the Larry Kudlow update. He is one of the most influential economists around. And if he won't be concerned unless gold climbs another $50, that is very bullish for us gold investors. because he speaks for many in the financial establishment. In effect the establishment is giving a green light for $350 gold. But above $350 will be a whole nother story.

BTW, it was never my purpose to drive RJ off this thread. He is entitled to his views just as all of us far. But his arrogant know it all style, not admitting the slightest possibility that he could be wrong, rubbed me the wrong way. I do hope he comes back. If he does our feud is over as far as I am concerned.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:13 - ID#247273)
The backing off of gold stocks today, and flatline of gold is/was caused by something. What to the best of your expert opinions, could that have been? Honest question.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:17 - ID#266105)
@checking twice for naughty & nice

Quality material, thanks for the grins. I'd add
to that stretch of mayhem but seems the cat's got my
tongue, for but Shirley you joust.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:17 - ID#255190)
It seems we all have one opinion or ANOTHER
Its a free for all here. Some of us find ANOTHER's thoughts provoking, some just stupid. So it goes with many of the subjects here. Unfortunately there are a few of these subjects which seem to evoke alot of polarity, conflict and verbal abusiveness. I suppose this is unavoidable ( ? ) .

What I'd like to see is a bit more restraint on the personal insults which are all to easily unholstered and fired ( wounding the occational bystander ) . Its just not necessary is it??? If you have an opposing view then express it thoughtfully and persuasively. To my way of thinking personal insults and name calling are signs of real mental laziness. It never increases my opinion of the one who so resorts. It never adds to the diversity of view point.

IMHO, for what its worth.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:20 - ID#230216)
Need to be clear on POG and wager. I am a futures kinda guy....not cash market. I watch the June Comex. But I believe our wager is for spot.....correct? Spot POG below 310. Right? What if it trades EXACTLY at 310 on close Friday? ......just kidding around, it won't be close to 310 by Friday. Todays action showed good sportsmanship by the bulls but tomorrow they will not fair as well. Tick-Tock....the POG ran up the clock........the clock struck. the end.
ONG! ... ( ! )

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:20 - ID#284255)
Unusual case of events

Interesting that Europe was in the red yesterday.
Normally that would push Asia into the red.
But lo and behold all of Asia is in the black today.

Does this mean that Asia is not going to,
Pull the global markets down this time.

Perchance it will be the old markets who have this pleasure.
Or could it be that the Dow is just top-heavy
And will lead the way.

After all no excuse is needed.
Just the sheer weight of all that exhuberance,
When it turns the tide,
Should do the job.

Soon to find out the truth.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:21 - ID#26669)
robnoel__A , Tolerent1 fancy words and shooting the moon
You know, all that politics is just words. The entire purpose of it is to convince us, the peons, to let go of a portion of our wealth for the politicians to use to give to their buddies. But there is a new breed of 60's political groupie who cares more for destroying other people's lives than building its own, call it the inherent jealousy of young rich socialists grown middle aged. Like James Carville, the circus sideshow barker. IMHO

JFK might have poked Marilyn and half her friends but he would not have survived even one such scandel as WJC has weekly. The times are exquisitely vulnerable for influnce from a Mule to destroy civilization and remake it into his own image. Which is a fairly solid reason to have some gold, don't you think? IMHO

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:26 - ID#257136)
Promethus, Hardcase, Pete: I reiterate to LGB; Do you sometimes get the thought
that Another is laughing up his/her/their collective sleeve at the results obtained from posting on this forum?
I for one am gonna feel stupid if by the slightest chance the denoument reveals any other than a prankster or group of same.
In past I have posted at LGB in attack mode.
His recent posts-to me- are very lucid and founded in fact rather than fantasy now and are not so much attacks on individuals as deliberate thrusts intended to cause us to THINK!
I'm of the opinion it hurts many of the others as much when they think as it does me. ( :+^} ) [

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:27 - ID#31868)
Gold has been money since the begining of written history. God according to
many has been here from the beginning, and perhaps long before that. I find it interesting that God was dead in the sixties,the 1960s, according to some, of course they for the most part had not read Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche, who conveniently died in 1900 and missed Y2K by 100 years.

Gold has lost its appeal for twenty years?

Hmmmmmmm, so long as a man might live, his values should be placed upon that which serves him best?, or should he serve that which is best although he might not benefit or profit, which used to be prophet. Hmmmmmmm, just because we can do something does not mean we should. David Brower is attributed with having said that to the unread.

Hmmmmmmm. Contemplation like foreplay seems to have lost its intrigue in a world wherein instant gratifications set the rules no matter what the cost.

Oh my darlin, oh my darlin, oh my darlin paradigm...

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:27 - ID#255151)
G'Day EB

Yes, spot Gold at close on Friday, using Kitco's price.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:31 - ID#31868)
Allen - 22:17 your opinon is quite right and I admit to being guilty of mental
laziness more than my fair share. Althought I would have chosen retort rather than resort. Yuk...Yuk...

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:31 - ID#252352)
XAU dressed up with indicators
Put a few indicators on the XAU>,
and it looks convincing for now, along with PDG & ABX charts, plus other things

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:32 - ID#25255)
Preacher, you must be home from church by now. What's the read for tomorrow on the XAU? I'm in a buying mood for gold stocks. Some of the high betas backed a bit today.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:35 - ID#257136)
A month or so back someone ( Pete? EARLE? I dunno ) mentioned the song title above. I have all the words but none of the music. If the party to whom I refer is interested, I'll post it some dark and dreary day or night. Just post a note sayin' so!

Crystal Ball
(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:37 - ID#287367)
@ 
 old buddy,
How's the tiddly wink museum? Gold has run into the proverbial brick wall at $317. Any strength tomorrow is an opportunity to lay on some shorts. The XAU is even worse. The general stock market will drag it down the tubes. Check out ABX at the Option Force Monitor.
The chart is screaming at you to sell ABX with both hands and feet. Tomorrow morning I'm loading up on ABX July 22.5 puts. h M !

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:38 - ID#334280)
Robnoel: I thought it was REAGAN who got us into this messsss.
Robnoel: Now it's Clinton that introduced borrow now and pay later???

Lurker 777
(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:40 - ID#320226)
I'm a Kitcoholic!
As most know I have bought many 100s of oz. of gold since last December. All my purchases have been for under $300 each and I always buy Puts on gold to limit my downside risk. I don't think anyone at this site is more of a Goldbug than me but I do buy PUTS on gold so I can profit from a declining or rising market. I have bought some June 98 295 puts for $80 each just incase gold drops in the next month. Bottem line is I want to make more dollars so I can afford to purchase more REAL money ( gold ) .

Everyone here owes RJ a big THANK YOU for contributing to Kitco. He works for the largest bullion house in North America if not the world and trades all precious metals for profit. He has insight into the PM market that I could only dream about. Just think about all the REAL Gold ( not paper ) being traded on a daily basis at Monex and we have a insider willing to share his wisdom with us. If RJ can help me make correct decisions on buying OR selling gold so I can increase my hoards than I am all ears. RJ is my Kitco friend and I hope he continues to post. THANK YOU RJ!

The Mountie coin advertised here at Kitco by Bart is the best deal. If spot is at $304 Bart will sell the Mounties for $325 ea. plus 1.30 insurance and a one time $30. fee for shipping. If you buy a 100 coins you pay $326.60 each and get a $310. January 1, 2000 Put option ( SHORTING GOLD ) built into the coin. They are 9999% pure gold and guaranteed by the Canadain Mint. The most you could lose is 5% or $15 dollars a coin.

Now if you wanted a 100 Maple Leafs or any other coin it would cost you more: If spot is at $304 plus 4.7% commission and $10. S&H = $318.39 each. A $310 put option on the Comex would cost $11 per coin for a total of $329.39 each. The most you could lose is 6% or $19.39 a coin.

BUY THE MOUNTIE, its a better deal and it helps keep the lights on.


(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:42 - ID#411112)
223/ favorite question that we have identified the do you solve

it?.....they ( the flower children ) are every
where,schools ( teachers ) ,college ( professor's ) f
eeding the future generation,mindless the answer for Jonesboro,ban guns
and camouflage,no one ask's what are kids
been taught in school,I think I just answed
my own question

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:48 - ID#201238)
a reflection
Both RJ and George Cole have made some very good calls historically. I vividly remember George exiting his gold stocks when the XAU broke below 110 about a year ago or so - we haven't been back there since ( YET ) . I remember the call that the Dow was going to top at 8300 in mid August - it did and held for a long time.

I remember RJ saying that gold was not going to bottom until the first quarter of 1998 when the EMU stuff was settled.

Both gentlemen have made good calls. For the life of me, I can not understand why they choose to do battle. Yes both of them have made other comments that were not as accurate. My god if they were as good as some people would like them to be, then one of them would have all of the money in the world!

When these gentlemen made their respective calls, first George in the XAU and then RJ saying the misery was to continue until now, I did not want to agree with either of them at the time because my whole life was bet the other direction and it has cost me a lot to recognize they were right and now I give credit where credit is due However, now that pendulum is swinging the other direction and EVERYONE who has the slightest inclination to be invested in gold or gold stocks will WIN!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:49 - ID#253246)
Crawford perspective subscribers

Havn't seen old Arch on the media circuit lately. Any subscribers
out there that can share Crawfords April gold stance

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:50 - ID#288369)
@RJ will return when he reads the need.............
Life is adversity....the joy of life is overcoming it.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 22:55 - ID#255151)
lurker777 @ 22:40

Yes, RJ ruffled a few feathers at Kitco, but he does know the Gold market. I learned much from his posts, and hope there will be more.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:01 - ID#411112)
Cavender..some banter from the left....answer this question,today it was announced in Japan,that to
save there sorry butts,they want to introduce a REAGAN style economy,you know the old princeple give the people thier money back,a concept the left can't grasp,we feel that we the people can better spend our money than big brother,Reagan said"government is not the solution to the problem,government is the problem"besides congress spends the money and it was the democrats in power.....that is really a old tired tail,just like Ken Starr is Hitler old socialist ploy villafaction of ones enimes...have to admit it still works

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:01 - ID#389244)
Cost of producing
Does anyone know the cost of mining an ounce og gold? Also, what about the cost of finding/extracting a barrel of oil? I think I saw somewhere it cost $225 or so to mine an ounce of gold. Thanx.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:02 - ID#45173)
Busting my chops
All my buddies keep telling me I'm a nutcase for buying gold. They say it's archaic. Gold has no meaning in modern world finance. It's a lousy store of wealth. I accept that it will not have meaning after we complete our transition from an industrial to an information age economy, in 10 or 20 years. In the mean time, gold is going to have a lot of meaning, after a lot of turmoil, is my guess. Anyway, if my pals believe that gold is so unimportant, can someone explain why the venerable lists the following at the very top of the home page?

Last Change
Dow Industrial 8956.50 -76.73 NASDAQ Composite 1798.71 -30.43 S&P 500 1109.55 -11.84 Spot Gold 310.60 +4.60 June Crude Oil 15.58 -0.21 30 Yr Treas Yield 5.83 +0.01

Dow, NASDAQ, S&P, Gold, Oil, and Treas. Someone ought to tell those guys to take gold off the list. No one cares. It's not important. It's archaic. Take the oil off while you're at it. It's old, too.

p.s. If gold is sustaining over 300 during a PR attack by Wall Street while oil is headed down, what do you suppose will happen when oil goes back up again?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:05 - ID#288369)
My oil company's break even is $15.30/bbl...that does not include any debt service....fortunately, we're debt-free....typical mid-continent domestic producer.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:06 - ID#431263)
Could it be that money is flowing BACK TO ASIA from the US?

Herr Allen--Entschuldigen Sie mich, mein Herr, for boring you with my posts! If you find them boring then by all means skip them! Wouldn't want you to die from boring banalities! Matter of fact, I hope that from now on you will skip them! But it seems to me you're trying to posture yourself as one of those deep analytical pseudo-intellectual type thinkers who have little tolerance for personalities, opinions or styles that challenge, bore or conflict with your own! Perhaps you think of yourself as being above the common rabble that from time to time use this site for their own mental health, ego-satisfaction or personal interests. Whatever! However, if you would like this site to become a narcissistic reflection of yourself--a cold, dry intellectual well from which only deep existential ivy-league types like yourself can draw with profit and satisfaction, without human personality or individualistic color or the occasional nut-case, jokester, fool or cheesehead, then I think you've found the wrong place! Go make up your own site and screen those who log onto it according to your own criteria and areas of interest. Otherwise, mein Herr, take a ride on the Reading where you can monopolize not only the content of what is discussed, but the type of people who discuss it! Hope I haven't been too boring or blunt in my rebuttal! Who knows, maybe, given enough time at this site, you, too may post something of interest to me! Then again, maybe not! But one can still hope, eh Allen! By the way, lighten up, mein Freund, maybe change your handle to something more colorful than simply Allen! That shouldn't be too hard for a gifted and articulate young man like yourself! Maybe something like UPTIGHT or CHALLENGING or ALLENEXIA! I'm sure you'll think of something, yes? Wiedersehen!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:07 - ID#347127)
@ NateDogg

The $225 is the cash cost for an ounce of Au. It does not include administration salaries, office rentals. exploration etc. It is only the cost associated with miners digging, equipment and depriciation.

I wish it was all $225! If you add the other costs it comes up as much as $100 more per oz! At current prices 50% of the mines are losing their a**es!

Don't know about oil, sorry

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:08 - ID#284255)
Sanctions threat to banks losing Year 2000 race

Australian firms face Millennium Bug threat

'Off' switch key to new computers surviving Y2K bug

Millennium computer bug could cost SAR $1.3b to correct, study showsIPq

Asia action warning on 'millennium bug'IPq

Lurker 777
(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:10 - ID#320226)
Kitco has seen better days. AND GOLD IS UP! Hmmm
Does anyone know when RJ posted that he will not be contributing to Kitco anymore?

Correction from Date: Tue Apr 07 1998 22:40 Post: The most you could lose if you bought the Mountie is 5% or $16.60. ( not $15.00 )

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:11 - ID#57232)
G'Nite All! RJ, D.A. where are you?
Charles Keeling: Your comment that your sources indicate that the BIS bought the Belgian gold fits with one of ANOTHER's comments some time ago about the BIS wanting to keep gold above $280/oz. He commented to me ( I think -- or perhaps someone else ) that he knew the Rothschild who set up the BIS ( Nathan? ) . So -- this fits with the idea of a gold bottom orchestrated by the BIS.

Rumors of low/high EURO gold backing: The rumormongers, whoever they are, will confuse the newsmedia with internal vs external European gold reserves. The external reserves necessary for direct backing of the fledgling EURO will be very low initially -- so discussion of that will be bearish for gold. But total gold reserves, as we know, are likely to be significant. So discussion of total gold reserves to back the European currencies will probably be bullish.

Gold bull vs bear: I think we are falling into the trap of mixing up long term investing priorities with short term investing priorities. My suspicions are that EB and RJ will do better than us longer term types for some time to come, as a twenty-year gold bear will not convert into a strong gold bull overnight ( unless we have a world crisis ) . Will buy more gold/gold stocks if we have another intermediate term bottom, and will be watching current investments if gold continues to rally.

I think the good news is that if we roar into y2k with a continued equity market rally, gold/gold stocks will do well - some of the pros quietly heading for the exits. And, if the market falters, gold/gold stocks will do even better. The only thing we have to fear is an outright US market crash, and massive gold sales similar to what happened in SEAsia.

Paper Gold: Arden, A. Goose and others : I do not understand COMEX as well as the rest of you, but I don't think we should conclude that COMEX or LBME are dealing 100% in 'paper gold', so that the spot gold price is not based on physical gold. I base my comment on Frank Veneroso's comments that only about 25% of the spot gold price is due to gold derivatives trading. So -- if any of you think ANOTHER is correct about this one point -- that the true value of gold is nowhere near the current 'spot' price -- you need to refute F. Veneroso's conclusions with gold derivatives data of your own.

G'Nite all!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:12 - ID#31868)
this is for 223 and robnoel_A and totally off topic so pardon the bandwidth...
thank you for your understanding.........................................
Kennedy was known for his sexual exploits, every doorman in Manhattan knew about them. My family owned 17 prime buildings, did business with Mr. Helmsley and Solo ( a name I am sure you have not heard, Donalds Father as well ) in NY City, one of which was 116 Central Park So. I grew up there, saw the news of Malcolm and Martin, Bobby and JFK, the landing on the moon, on a tv, stretched on carpet worth more than most peoples homes, 12N at 116 Central Park North, that is the front of the building, dead center on 59th street looking out over the park.

The people handling things knew everything, just like they do now. The FBI used to utilize some of our buildings for surveys of "criminals." Oh what a wacky web they weave. My Father was in the intelligence service. He quit, I have written about it before.

This is all about money, nothing more, nothing less. The people you see in the news are piss-ants, nothing more, nothing less. I have said it before and I will say it again, Henry Kissinger ( type his name in MSWORD, right click and look at the definitions presented, and you get kissing and cosigner  priceless, is it not? ) is a water boy. Plain and simple. The Coward Erect is a water boy. Plain and simple.

All of this has nothing to do with politics, it has to do with MONEY.

And unless those individuals that want to stomp on whatever you have and are, feel that they and their family will suffer greatly, they will stomp you into the ground. Put one of them in a box and mail that box first class to the head honchos home and you will get an invitation to a formal.

Like Janet and Louie are that tough. Yeah, and my grandmother is a Greenbay Cheerleader selling soup. Be a rock, stand on a rock and hit like a rock. Live fair, honest and compassionate, and treat others as you would wish they would treat you and yours.

The love of money is the root of all evil.

We all make choices.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:14 - ID#341312)
Oris-U.S. fighter armament
F-15's and F/A-18's are far from "gunless". All models of both Eagles and Hornets come with General Electric's M61A1 Vulcan cannon. Its six barrels fire 20mm shells at 4000-6000 rounds per minute. This is a result of the U.S. Navy's experience with F-4 Phantoms early in Vietnam. It was thought that the Phantom's formidable missile armament would make a cannon unnecessary but this proved to be quite wrong. Cannons are invaluable in close-in dogfighting scenarios especially when the missiles have all been launched. They were, I believe, hastily retrofitted and have been standard equipment on all U. S. fighters since then. Other aircraft designs not intended for air superiority/interception roles might well lack them, I'm not sure. An interesting sidebar to this is the A-10 Warthog's 30mm cannon. The A-10 was basically designed around the gun, not vice versa, and has proven well suited to its tank-killing mission.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:20 - ID#288369)
@Goodnight Gracie.......
You see, they will all come back home.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:22 - ID#334280)
Robnoel: Ken Starr looks just like the Cheshire cat, doesn't he?
Robnoel: My complaint with Reagan was that he left my children with a debt that will never be repaid, but I guess that's why gold is going to be the money of last resort, goldbugs should thank Reagan for the coming disaster. You are just as frustrated by Clinton's teflon as I was by Reagan's teflon.
We should have used the money we saved by scrapping the B1 bomber to pay for Star Wars -then we could knock out that asteroid heading towards -no problem.
Robnoel: I enjoy your comments, don't like them, but enjoy them, no offense ever.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:23 - ID#190411)
@223 ---y200 coins clitton as caligula
Franklin Mint --Where are you?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:24 - ID#225273)
I am home from church now. Give me about 20 minutes and I'll answer your question. I want to download some data and look at some charts. Yesterday, I said we were looking at a couple of down days ahead of us. We got one today, although the comeback by gold late in the day with no corresponding comeback in the XAU complicates matters somewhat.
Usually, the XAU is telling the truth and gold is lying when they diverge. Let me have a look and I'll be back.

The Preacher

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:29 - ID#57232)
Oil prices? Down or up? Logging off for real!
Studio R. : Two questions for you!

First, do you think the world-wide cost savings of bringing oil producers online has bottomed? I am referring to the advanced imaging, exploration technology that has benefitted the newer producers in the last 15 years or so.

Secondly, do you think that the OPEC group will volunarily reduce oil production to keep prices up? I think not -- so I am sitting on the oil stock sidelines, expecting crude oil to head down one more time -- until Venezuela or Mexico is forced off-line -- or the US dollar takes a dive.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:29 - ID#411112)
tolerant1...your post explains why someone would spend 80 million dollars to get a job for 6 years

paying at best 150K per year,how no one questions this is a mystery to me

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:35 - ID#26669)
robnoel__A the answer is simple
IMHO the rise of civilisation isn't a gradualist thing but rather a series of leaps, likened to a man crawling up a slippery talus slope on a mountain, sliding back, jumping across chasms, et cetera. So I think the key is to use relative advantage not to necessarily jump a bigger crevasse than one is able but to get a firm grip so as to not backslide in the next little rockfall.

In principle I like Lurker777's philosophy, the idea of insuring ones investment ( but in principle prefer put options to puts themselves for insurance ) but my style is insuring my stock and bond investments by weighing them with PMs which are countercyclical to todays market. But to each his own.

Your philosophical question is more important and difficult. I think that it would be important for one's own family survival to quietly educate one's children in higher principles and demand the best performance in math and sciences, all while probing gently at the obvious weaknesses in current fashion to show them the superficial and ridiculous. Always training them toward stability of morals, and leading them with little rewards toward higher goals.

If one has a stable, two parent family then that is one of the best weapons in the fight for the children's hearts and minds, another might be to show a little personal bravery against little inflictions of the evils which frighten them. Rather than being a petty tyrant to inflict worry on them one has to seek out good strong examples of wicked people who genuinely frighten or disgust their natural sensibilities then show them how to do battle to free themselves from them. ( stealing a page from Castenada here ) IMHO

I recall a very good example of this, a twisted femanist single mother who had insinuated herself into a position of leadership into a scout troop. She exemplified much of what is bad with 1990's American hedonistic, anti-moral female centered culture. All it took to inoculate the kids against her, her relativistic values and the basic evils of her castrating form of feminism was to allow her to show her conflicts, then teach the kids how to recognize them and to avoid looking like such a fool as she was. One doesn't shield them from battle or even from losing, but rather makes the point of showing the general uncoolness of evil. IMHO

For kids there is a difficulty that they are all looking for some overidealized person for reproductive purposes so part of the training must be to instill enough good examples of close-to-ideal persons so they have a good basis for developing attachments. Kids develop early preferences for such things so it is important that their first 2nd grade romantic interest not be the boy who wears the nose ring or the girl with purple hair. And for the inevitable critic of such behaviours I'd say that they may keep whatever housepets they wish but they can't inflict their tastes on my kids. As Clint Eastwood once said in a famous barroom hooker putdown,"Only with human beings".IMHO

I hoped that this helped. If not, at least it was fun to write. Goodnight ;^ )

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:36 - ID#224149)
Lauded as One of the first Niggas ever to rap on a Gold Forum A long time member of Kitco Screwed up Clique of sheep ANOTHERS debut on Kitco was anticipated with much fanfare. ANOTHER gained much popularity as the new Gold Messiah with sheep connecting with Bah Bah praise from around the World. The sad news today is deafening across the World Wide Web. Sources say the Gold Guru went to collect performing fees from his boilermakers and never came back. ANOTHER was found, shot dead on the floor of a unknown palace owned by the prince of Razzmatazz a well known Saudi Gold dealer .His death has shocked Gold forums around the World. Many Internet forums have vowed silence for the next month on ANOTHER and his Sayings .The Internet shows respect to all gurus ---But many worry ---Who will be next? R.I.P.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:37 - ID#411112)
Cavender...still in DA nile....just so you know my favorite caller on my show is Cord the socialist

from Bolder,we work at it, agree some disagree a lot,it all comes down to respect and responsibilty....sadly to elements missing in todays PC world

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:39 - ID#31868)
Have you found the solutions to your migration to WIN95? Of course this is obviously an on-going dilemma. If you are content with the solutions you have found, great, if not I have a couple of links which may be of service to you.

Go gold and silver to keep this one in context.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:42 - ID#238422)
Thanks for your correction of my post. I was thinking
mainly about F-16, which is often considered to be
in the same class as Mig-29. I believe that F-16 does not
have cannon or machine guns. As you pointed out, guns
were brought back to the U.S. fighter jets after it was
proven to be the valuable feature. Russian jets were always
build with guns. A-10 is a ground support aircraft and is
in completely different category than Mig-29. A-10 is a great
"tool of war", but I heard that Pentagon is planning to get
rid of them. I think it is extremely stupid ( if this rumor
is correct ) .

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:43 - ID#222231)
Prometheus - The self rightous.
I and many others find ANOTHERS THOUGHTS interesting and possibly of great benefit. For you or others to imply that I am driving RJ, LGB or others away is ludicrous. I am only dishing out the same as I get in return. If these insiduous statements against ANOTHER, myself or other posters that feel the same are not doing the very thing you accuse me of doing, then I must be dense. What gives anyone the right to post in this UNCIVIL manner:


"Lately it seems that only one voice is possible, that of Another ( and his fan club, and the "true believers"." ) IF YOU HAD STOPPED AT ANOTHER, I WOULD NOT HAVE TAKEN OFFENSE. WHY WAS IT NECESSARY TO ADD THE LAST PHRASE?


"We have lost a whole string of interesting posters. RJ is the latest. You may be enjoying the victory of the battle while losing the war."

Speaking for myself, I did not want a war. I believe in death before dishonor and will do battle until attacks against myself and others stop and desist. ( IF ANOTHER STOPS POSTING BECAUSE OF YOUR ATTACKS AGAINST HIM, A POX ON YOUR HOUSE! )


"It is the cautious and critical analysis of those like RJ and LGB that
make sense to the REST OF US. Those of us still in the regular
world. Those of us who have the money and stock market profits to
make a difference in your world."

I take it as a fact, stated by you, that cautious and critical analysis of those like RJ and LGB is GOSPEL. How pretentious. Did you ever consider that that there are others whose opinions and analysis make sense to TRUE GOLDBUGS, even if it does'nt to you? And please tell me and others why you're the only ones that make any difference in this world with your so called money and profits?


"you attacked LGB ( because he dissed Another, I presume. He did
say he's buying gold today ) and you just reinforced the notion that
goldbugs are a bunch of nuts. Add the IDCIBM chanting and groupie
adoration of Another. Well, would YOU look further if you were
considering perhaps adding a percent or so of gold to your
stock-overweighted portfolio? YOU DON'T CARE, YOU'RE BUYING

There are true hard money advocates, and obviously YOU ARE NOT! I for one resent the patronizing remark about GOLDBUGS being a bunch of nuts. I think many here will not take kindly to your remark!


"Please respect Bart's guidelines. If you hate the rest of us, at least
respect Bart. It is his dime. "

I do not hate you, LGB, RJ, etal! I HATE THE ARROGANCE! It is obvious to me at the least that you do hate me and the so called idolators, sheep, idiots and many other names too volumunous to mention. May I suggest that you and others practise what you PREACH.


(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:43 - ID#31868)
it wasn't their ( the Coward Erect and First Bunt Cake ) money.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:45 - ID#45173)
Lurker777: RJ posted the following yesterday. It was immediately
followed by no fewer than six posts saying, in effect, good "riddance." Now everyone misses him. Interesting dynamic.

It's no surprise that anyone who fails to lead the cheer for gold is not treated as a respected member of the Kitco tribe. Perhaps RJ did not understand this. If you come to a group sponsored by a precious metals company filled with self-avowed goldbugs, you have about as much chance of impunity in expressing views that cast doubt on the wisedom of buying and holding gold as you have expressing pro-gold and anti-stock views at a mutual fund site. RJ is reading the Koran at an Easter sermon.

"After reading over my last, it occurred to me:

People ranting about 30K gold. Japan will collapse ( with 1 trillion in foreign assets and reserves, and zero external debt ) . YK2 will cause planes to drop from the skies. The collected sages here, who perhaps in another situation are entirely rational, follow blindly a prankster with a hole through his story a mile wide.

I post numbers which prove that gold has been an abysmal store of value and a horrible buy and hold investment. The silence screams. The same automatons blink and blindly spout assurances that do not obey any mathematics on Gods Earth.

Who needs this?

I will be gone for a time, yes?"

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:46 - ID#411112)
223..well put...however if values taught at home are not reinforced at school,you have what we got


(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:46 - ID#373403)
Big Bang
I don't think the Japanese are going to be so anxious to invest in the NYSE.

They lost their butts in their own Nikkei and they think they are the bees knees. Why would such a proud nation trust the round eyes market. I think they are all going to gold, platinum, and cash. They are savers by nature. Speculation and risk is not in the cards for people used to lifetime employment.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:48 - ID#227290)
Market Comments
To all:

zeke asked me the forecast for the XAU tomorrow. The best I can do on that is to say there is one more downside gap that wants to be filled, and I expect the XAU to make an attempt to do that tomorrow. This is the gap from last Friday. The gap runs from 83.41 to 84.76. Yesterday's gap was filled today, which is not good.
A 50% correction in the XAU would take it down to 81.15, currently at 85.92. My near-term, tomorrow-morning call is for the XAU to drop and try to fill that gap.

On the other hand, I'm looking at the monthly chart of GOLD. We had the outside month ( turnaround ) in January followed by an inside month ( consolidation ) in February. March waffled and finally began to strengthen at the end. I think April will be big and I'm still looking for a run to $320 or higher this month.
With that in mind, this pullback should be shallow and short and followed by another blast to new highs. A 50% correction from the March 18 low would take gold back to $301. That is allowable, especially if followed by another blast upward. $301 would keep us above the 100-day MA and would keep us in sight of another run at the 200-day MA, which usually isn't bested on the first attempt.
Today's afternoon turnaround also holds out the possibility that gold will now explode upward; this would leave a breakaway gap on the XAU, if it follows, which it should.
Tomorrow should be interesting and although the short-term picture isn't clear, the latest high above the January high augurs well for the future.

Go gold!

The Preacher

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:52 - ID#256250)
Futures Contracts
Updated as of: Apr 07, 1998 @ 11:43 pm ET

Sym. Company Name Last Change %Chg High Low Vol.

PB K8 May Pork Bellies 54200 +1625 +3.1 54300 51800 1.86K
GC M8 June Gold 3115 -5 -0.2 3124 3115 69.8K
SI K8 May Silver 6390 +13 +0.2 6415 6385 15.9K
HG K8 May High Grade Copper 7755 -15 -0.2 7780 7750 3.30K
PL N8 July Platinum 4125 +15 +0.4 4130 4080 1.51K
PA M8 June Palladium 25920 +20 +0.1 25970 25450 468

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:52 - ID#31868)
It has been proven that gold has been a far better store of value than paper. It is a proven fact which is undeniable. No if's and's or but's.

None. The reality of gold is unwavering, the promise of paper has yet to be proven.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:53 - ID#57232)
Appreciate your win95 posts!
Tolerant1: I got your earlier post -- very useful. I discovered that the problem with my investing program was not Win 95, but buggy W95/NT software ( Windows on Wall Street, 'WOW' ) that needed to be upgraded by the vendor. Took me several days to figure out where the bug was and wasn't. The upgraded WOW and my upgraded HP deskjet 855c work much faster/better with Win 95 than with Windows for Workgroups 3.11. I still don't have my DOS programs operational except by hunt and click.

Personally, I much prefer DOS to Windows for programming, but must accept the inevitable. Working with Windows 95 is like working with a new operating system that you can't see anymore -- and little useful documentation is available.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:53 - ID#373403)
Now you know how I feel when I go to the Yahoo Stock Chat Room and get heckled when I suggest gold as an investment.

I guess it is spitting into the wind for myself there and RJ and LGB here.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:55 - ID#344308)


bite me again...

everybody has an opinion...the net cuts to the bone in an instant..
ask hep-kitty...all have felt the sting at some point in time...
that is, if you dare to climb onto the've never
risked the limb, but you have felt the swat of the watter...heee..heeee
know what i mean?!; )

reminds me of ANOTHER limb climber...claimed the grains were going
to crater........long time ago....mmmmmmmmmmmm...THINKUM-THOUGHTS----
mmmmmmmm------THOUGHTS----------mmmmmmmmmmmmm...MORE THOUGHTS......

almost time to buy calls.....on the grains....still smell beans-a-burnin.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:56 - ID#57232)
G'Nite everyone!
Nursing a cold with Vit C and E -- Spent spring break in a motel room with someone who had a bad cold -- I think the vitamins have made my cold as mild as it is.

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:56 - ID#45173)
tolerant1: ok, so if I invested $10,000 in the stock market in 1982
and $10,000 in gold in 1982, in 1997 the gold is worth more than the stock?

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:58 - ID#373403)
Instead of 1982, how about 1928!

(Tue Apr 07 1998 23:59 - ID#254201)
For tomorrow short May Silver 6.40 or better stop 6.50 - Objective min. 6.20 and if thurday's PPI is bad could see 5.50's again.