I thought RJ was a nickname. It is for my nephew. Do you want a nickname for your nickname? . . . . hmmm. . . I suppose Ron James is taken . . . .

I thought you were "gold shorts" for awhile there. No more?

Stealth Correction occurring in US stocks
http://www.users.dircon.co.uk/~netking/blizard.htm

They could buy plutonium and feed it to the cows. And then they could worship cows and plutonium at the same time!! No, that would never work. The cows might blow up and spread radioactive manure all over..

mine are not borgs that are nine, no floss needed here, and my INN is always open ...I would gladly give my LIFE that you may hear the laughter of your special children...NAMASTE'..IT would truly be my privilege to RAKE the grass beneath your feet arriving

What do the markets and the Wicked Witch of the West have in common? They are Both MMMELTING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

GM

Good to hear from you, thanks for the comment. With regard to the prior post and
commentary, is it not indeed remarkable and worthy of considerable thought as to why
the Japanese economy has not been able to grow while its neighboring Asian Tigers
flourished notwithstanding a very low interest rate, other substantial governmental
attempts to stimulate the economy, and with a populace known for its large savings.
And, especially, when during this time, it has enjoyed a substantial trade surplus with the
US.

And if Japan has not been able to grow during this past period of Asian growth, would
not its economy substantially suffer by a further decline in regional currencies, and/or if
its exports and trade surplus are adversely affected by a slowness in the US economy.

If Japan does not defend its currency, will this not contribute further to deflation not
only in Japan but contagiously in neighboring countries as well. But if it does not defend
its currency, how can it attract foreign investment and encourage Japanese investors to
invest domestically. And does not a falling YEN contribute also to inflation by causing
an increase in the price of imported goods, particularly in oil and other commodities
priced in US dollars.

But what is it to use to defend its currency if it elects to do so. Ah is not that the rub. If
the Japanese sell US bonds, would not the US economy to be slowed by a rise in interest
rates, as the commentary explains, resulting in a reduction in Japanese exports.. And if it
were to sell dollars to defend the YEN, would this also not contribute to a decline in the
dollar and a counterproductive resultant rise in US interest rates which may induce the
YEN to decline further. Would it not be better for governments such as Japan to garner
gold as a foreign reserve which can be sold to defend its currency without affecting the
dollar or US rates. As to gold, I note that gold as measured in YEN is relatively strong as
would be expected with its fall relative to the dollar. It would be of interest to learn how
much of this is due to actual physical demand..

In any event, it would appear that the global financial conditions are becoming
increasingly more precarious. It is somewhat perplexing that gold is not responding to it. A
famous trader stated that the most important thing a trader can do is to study
conditions. But he did not say what to do if these conditions did not cause the response
in an investment that one expects. What I am hopefully looking for are signs that gold is
beginning to respond to these global conditions in a positive rather than negative manner
as it has been previously doing. And once and if this starts to happen, these conditions
should enforce the movement in gold as the media begins to direct its attention to it.

Ah but you know all this - nes pas!

From a lurking, feathered friend.

The commentary came out in November 97 and I believe the author is Japanese,

but I failed to retain any other information regarding it.

Thank you for your comments. However, I had not noticed the misspelling but your
comments remind me of the time I was in a museum and a crowd was gathered in front of
a fine painting. When the head of the party asked what the audience thought of the
painting, one walked over and remarked that the painter spelled his name wrong. The point
is, without being didactic, like the painting, who carries about the misspelling - What is important is the nature of the work and the meaning conveyed.

Sunday, May 31, 1998

Study: Internet 'addicts' often show other
psychiatric disorders, treatment may help

( AP ) -- People who seem addicted to the Internet often show a bumper
crop of psychiatric disorders like manic-depression, and treating those
other conditions might help them rein in their urge to be online, a study
suggests.
On average, Internet "addicts" in the study reported having five
psychiatric disorders at some point in their lives, a finding that "just blew
me away," said psychiatrist Nathan Shapira of the University of Cincinnati
College of Medicine.
It's unclear whether the Internet problem should be considered a
disorder or just a symptom of something else, or whether certain
disorders promote the excessive online use, he said.
Shapira is scheduled to present the study Monday at the annual
meeting of the American Psychiatric Association in Toronto.
He and colleagues studied 14 people who'd spent so much time online
that they were facing problems like broken relationships, job loss and
dropping out of school.
One 31-year-old man was online more than 100 hours a week, ignoring
family and friends and stopping only to sleep. A 21-year-old man flunked
out of college after he stopped going to class. When he disappeared for
a week, campus police found him in the university computer lab, where
he'd spent seven days straight online.
The study participants, whose average age was 35, were interviewed for
three to five hours with standard questions to look for psychiatric
disorders.
Being hooked on the Internet is not a recognized disorder. But Shapira
said the excessive online use by the study participants would qualify as a
disorder of impulse control, in the same category as kleptomania or
compulsive shopping. In fact, he suggested the Internet problem be
called "Internetomania" or "Netomania," rather than an addiction.
But the striking thing, Shapira said, was the other psychiatric problems
that turned up:
-- Nine of the 14 had manic-depression at the time of the interview, and
11 had it at some point in their lives.
-- Half had an anxiety disorder such as "social phobia," which is a
persisting and unreasonable fear of being embarrassed in public, at the
time of the interview.
-- Three suffered from bulimia or binge eating, and six had an eating
disorder at some time in their lives.
-- Four had conditions involving uncontrollable bursts of anger or buying
sprees, and half reported such impulse-control conditions during their
lives.
-- Eight had abused alcohol or some other substance at some time in
their lives.
The participants said medications for some of these conditions helped
them gain control over Internet use. That happened nine of the 14 times
they tried mood-stabilizing medications and four of 11 times they tried
antidepressants.
They still used the Internet too much, Shapira said, but "the difference
between three days straight online and spending two to four hours a day
... is an important move in the right direction."
Kimberly Young, a University of Pittsburgh psychologist, said she has
found a similar pattern of prior psychiatric problems in most people
hooked on the Internet. Some people who'd abused alcohol or other
substances told her they were using the Internet as a safer substitute
addiction.
But she said many people with no prior sign of psychiatric trouble have
gotten hooked on the Internet too.
They may be dealing with other life circumstances like stale marriages or
job burnout, she said.

Thanks for the kind words and for your thought-provoking commentary

Aust. All Ords down to 2675. Down by 39 points today already

I am the ANT that leapt out of your way because I am so short that I realize GOD gave you TWO SOULS...NAMASTE'...FOREVER YOUR FRIEND...

I will verify the 15 month Japanese ( ?stockpile? )

I wonder if this refers to standard corporate inventory?

Lots of little piles makes one big one, yes?

Increased demand in China seems to be overtaking decreased Asian demand

Hmmmmmmm

5/31/98 -- 10:55 PM

Gold in Hong Kong opens higher


HONG KONG ( AP ) - Gold in Hong Kong opened at $293.05 an ounce on Monday, up ten cents from Friday's close of $292.95. API

Does anybody have more current info, or know of a gold site with a current gold quote. Gold doesn't seem to trade on Mondays here @ Kitco.

HighRise

Promey -

Still short, but I will be unshort shortly

Here's the latest from Asia ( 12:40 AM EDT )

Nikkei 15367 down 303 ( 1.94% )

Hang Seng 8709 down 224 ( 2.51% )

Aussie Ords 2674 down 40 ( 1.48% )

Singapore 1239 down 15 ( 1.20% )

They can't take too much more of this, especially Japan and Hong Kong.

Highrise-
I find this one to be the most reliable, but Quote com is also good
once the futres are open.
http://www.dbc.com/cgi-bin/htx.exe/dbcfiles/curcommt.html?SOURCE=core/dbc

http://www.dbc.com/cgi-bin/htx.exe/dbcfiles/curcommt.html?

http://www.dbc.com/cgi-bin/htx.exe/dbcfiles/curcommt.html?

Skylark
Got it! that was posted here first Date: Fri Nov 07 1997 14:49
John K ( WORLDVIEW ) ID#24760:Currency Chaos and Financial Colapse


Thanks for re-posting it

Selby

You've heard it said that neurotics build castles in the air, and psychotics live in them? Well I just *have* to keep 'em clean and tidy.

janitaur@tor

Oh, give me a broom, where the buffallo roam,,,

Nuclear Buildup and Financial Meltdown: India, Pakistan and Russia

The past week had two major foci. The first was the decision by Pakistan
to demonstrate its ability to conduct underground nuclear tests. The
second was the sudden and fairly unexpected crisis in Russian financial
markets. The international community was transfixed by events on the
Indian subcontinent, while seeming to take the Russian crisis in stride.
---From our point of view, the order of priority should be dramatically
reversed. The Russian events constitute a decisive, definitive event, even
in the history of a former superpower. The Indo-Pakistani events, while
appearing more dramatic, are actually a minor evolution rather than a
decisive break with the past.

It must be remembered that no one has doubted that both India and Pakistan
are capable of detonating nuclear devices. The fact that they have
detonated the devices has certainly attracted attention, but is merely a
statement of the obvious, this time with an exclamation point. The threat
of nuclear war on the subcontinent neither increased nor decreased because
of these tests. The threat of conflict did increase when a new,
nationalist government was installed in India and played off against an
already established, nationalist government in Pakistan. But the mere
explosion of nuclear devices simply confirmed what everyone knew, which was
that both India and Pakistan had the ability to test weapons.

It is, of course, unclear that either country, especially Pakistan, has the
ability to deliver nuclear weapons. Even the availability of delivery
systems, such as aircraft and missiles, does not mean that either country
has the ability to marry their nuclear devices to the delivery system.
Creating a device that can explode in a cavern and creating a device that
can fit on a delivery system and be detonated over a target are two
different matters. Therefore, it is important to recall that we have seen
a demonstration of the ability to detonate nuclear weapons and not a
demonstration of the ability to deliver them as weapons of war.

But let's assume the probable, which is that both India and Pakistan have
the ability to deliver nuclear strikes at each other. This leaves us in
the same position we were in a month ago. At that time it appeared
probable that both India and Pakistan could deliver nuclear strikes against
each other if they wished. Today it appears probable that both India and
Pakistan can deliver nuclear strikes against each other if they wish. We
end this cycle of tests in the same position as we began it.

Indeed, what changes have occurred tend to argue against armed conflict
rather than for it. The Indo-Pakistani conflict, which is now a half-
century old, entered a new phase with the installation of the new Indian
government. The confrontation along the entire border, and in Kashmir in
particular, increased markedly. The probability of armed conflict
increased to some extent. However, even this was limited by military
realities. Pakistan's ability to engage and defeat the Indian army is
doubtful. Therefore, a full-scale assault on Kashmir is not in the cards.
The Indian army's ability to conduct extensive offensive operations also
has some limits. Moreover, India holds Kashmir and really doesn't covet
Pakistani territory. Since it is not clear that the dismemberment of
Pakistan is in India's long-term interest, the willingness of India to
launch a general offensive, were they to judge themselves able to carry it
out, has always been doubtful.

Therefore, while border skirmishes remain possible and even likely, all-out
war makes little strategic sense for either side. With the public
demonstration that nuclear weapons are a probable factor, the likelihood of
all-out war decreases rather than increases. The one strategic
possibility, an Indian invasion of Pakistan designed to secure India's
western frontiers permanently, ceases to be possible if Pakistan has
nuclear weapons. To be precise, the presence of nuclear weapons does not
abolish conventional conflict. However, it tends to decrease the
willingness of combatants to challenge the very existence of a nuclear
state, as that is the only rational circumstance under which the use of
nuclear weapons makes sense.

If the history of the nuclear era has taught us anything, it is that
nuclear powers tend to become more, rather than less, circumspect in their
use of warfare. Neither the Soviet Union nor the United States threatened
the very existence of the other, therefore, both sides refrained from using
nuclear weapons. Indeed, the circumstance when the use of nuclear weapons
seemed a real possibility was in Israel in 1973, when it appeared that
Israel's very existence was threatened by Syrian forces on the Golan
Heights. Once the limited capabilities and intentions of the Syrians
became clear, the nuclear threat passed. Other nuclear powers, including
the United States and the Soviet Union, endured substantial politico-
military defeats without resorting to nuclear weapons because neither had
its very existence at stake.

The real significance of nuclear weapons is diplomatic and psychological.
They are a tool for appearing to increase the stakes without increasing the
risks. The very fact that India and Pakistan have focused the world's
attention on their subcontinent by doing fairly little, demonstrates the
utility of nuclear weapons in this regard. Not only is the United States
suddenly interested, but the apparent failure of the CIA to provide warning
of the blasts means that there will likely be a major shake-up in the
intelligence, defense, and diplomatic strata responsible for India and
Pakistan. This gives both countries added visibility in the U.S. analysis
and policy-making communities and marvelous opportunities for manipulation
as the bureaucratic struggle mounts in the coming months. They have gotten
the attention of the only country that counts. The real issue is what they
will each try to do with it. In the meantime, skirmishes will continue,
each side will practice brinkmanship and each side will court favor in
Washington.

The one danger is that the Indo-Pakistani conflict will be dragged into the
general Middle Eastern conflict. Iran has not had good relations with
Pakistan because of differences over Afghanistan. The Iranian Foreign
Minister will arrive in Pakistan on Monday to discuss these differences.
Pakistan now has something Iran badly wants. The entire dynamics of these
discussions could shift. The real issue is: is this a Pakistani bomb or an
Islamic bomb? The Iranians will be far more interested in the answer to
that question than in Pakistani relations with India. And so should we.

In the meantime, the collapse of the Russian financial markets was noticed,
but not sufficiently. This was not a transitory hit by foreign
speculators, but a massive vote of no confidence in Russian economic
policy. Foreign capital, which had stopped arriving in Russia, now is
withdrawing. The Russian Central Bank said that foreigners withdrew
between $500 million and $700 million from the government bond market
during the past two weeks. It said that foreigners held about one third of
the bank's outstanding instruments, about $20 billion. The total market
is valued at $60 billion. This would mean that the stampede out of the
markets was led by Russians, since we find it difficult to believe that a
withdrawal of about 1 percent ( $500million-$700million ) of the total market
could cause the market to crack.

In actuality, we suspect that the Russian Central Bank has no real idea as
to what happened over the past week, since its ability to track who holds
government bonds is limited. This also means that the RCB's brave
declarations that the ruble is in no danger because foreigners are staying
in the market, should comfort no one. There is no way that the Russian
markets crumbled as they did without major foreign liquidation. That means
there are a great many rubles in foreign hands still waiting to be
converted, and that the RCB's declarations that the ruble is in no danger
of devaluation is unsupported. Particularly given the weakness in the
energy-related markets, Russia's hard currency reserves must be dwindling.
The pressure to bring the ruble to more realistic levels is irresistible.
Without a currency crisis, the only alternative is a general financial
crisis. Given the Russian track record, we will probably see both.

The problem is that no one really knows the extent of the situation. As in
much of Asia, corruption and inefficiency beyond imagination have rendered
Russian financial statements meaningless. The state is spending money it
doesn't have, and its ability to raise money in foreign markets has become
doubtful. The crisis: what will the Russian state do for money? The
Russians have focused on tax collection, firing the old head of the service
and promising a complete overhaul, going after the largest companies first,
since they are also the largest deadbeats. The problem is twofold. First,
the entire economy has been built on tax evasion. Second, we suspect that
most of these enterprises couldn't pay their taxes, even if they wanted to.
After seven years of failing to deal with fundamental problems in the
economy, the Russians have hit the same brick wall as the Asians. This is,
of course, only phase one. The next sixty days will bring other calamities
galore.

As in Asia, we are brought to the social and political consequences. The
Russian economic problem, like the Asian economic problem, has become
insoluble. As the tax situation shows, even obvious reforms can't be
implemented. The question remaining is, how will Russian society respond?
We continue to feel that the massive failure of liberalization for all but
a narrow stratum of Russian society will lead to the return of traditional
Russian authoritarianism, both to contain unrest and to respond to it. We
expect the regime, with or without Yeltsin, to crack down on unrest while
focusing that unrest on the only group that can be dispensed with: foreign
bankers and their Russian allies. They can be dispensed with because they
are dispensing of themselves. No sane foreigner will invest in Russia
today. Their dilemma is how to get out in one piece. Blaming them for the
crisis is safe and well within the Russian tradition for coping with policy
failures. The real losers, of course, will be the Russian bankers who made
their living peddling their connections to Western banks. The lucky ones
already have their money in the United States. The rest will be driving
cabs in New York, if they are lucky enough to get out.

With repression, comes more traditional Russian foreign policy. Indeed,
one of the more interesting aspects of the Indo-Pakistani crisis is how the
Russians, traditional allies of India, will respond. As with the recent
Iraqi crisis, we expect Russia to place itself in a more familiar role than
it has in recent years: a thorn in the side of the United States. Next
week, the focus should still be on Russia and the subcontinent. We expect
it to be in a more rational ratio than this past week.

http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980601/taiwan_sto_1.html

( exalted one ) , we need a name, soon. RJ's gonna take off his golden shorts! Now what's left of my brain is mush, the last of the kids' spring recitals is at last finished, threw together a celebratory party for the kiddies. Now exhausted and crawling off to the land of golden dreams. It's to you, wordsmith ( SB ) .

Free Comments for the week of May 30th.
The reversal on Tuesday morning May 26th and the 350 point nose-dive to a new swing low on Wednesday May 27th has changed the dynamics of the situation. Be put on notice that a crash pattern is now present on the charts. The NEWEST PARADIGM of potential regional nuclear warfare combined with renewed DEFLATION came into clear focus last week on some very significant astro events.
A table posted on AstroEcon for subscribers on April 6th warned of trouble last week far in advance.
"May 28th: Sun opposed Pluto, Venus conjunct Saturn
A huge loss. Great sadness, Mourning the dead, This may be when the bull market is recognized as dead, there are deflationary implications".
There is a chance that Monday and Tuesday June 1st and 2nd will be a mini crash because the bulls were unable to take advantage of the opportunity in May to take the market safely into new high ground when they had a chance. Parabolic markets must rise or crash if history means anything. A larger crash pattern similar to 1929 may emerge out of any decline that does develop. You need to be keenly aware of this possibility even if it is still somewhat remote. Ignoring history binds you to repeat it eventually.

If rj remove shorts..
may lose @ss

Australian Financial review, Jun 1, 1998

Precious little reason for return to metals stability

By Stephen Wyatt

Gold's great white hope, the new European Central
Bank, is formally created today. Discipline and order
shall now return to the gold market.

Haphazard gold sales by individual central banks,
one of the major factors behind the collapse in the
gold price to 18-year lows earlier this year, will now
stop. Right.

Well, the gold market is not so sure.
In fact, the gold price slumped back down into a
$US290-$US295/oz range late last week to greet the
newborn.

But, to be fair, the precious metals were hardly
looking at Europe. Like other commodities, they were
pushed lower by the surging US dollar, rising
uncertainty in Asia, particularly in the gold and silver
devouring India with its collapsing rupee, growing
fears of a competitive devaluation of the Chinese
yuan and the apparent spread of Asia's economic
problems into Eastern Europe.

Silver, in US dollars, dipped on Friday to its lowest
level in six months, US dollar gold has lost more than
7 per cent of its value in the past month and platinum
has fallen by almost 14 per cent over the past six
weeks.

But palladium  the white metal used in electronics
and in emission-reducing catalytic converters in
automobiles  took the biggest hit. Russian
economic chaos was behind its 30 per cent price
collapse over the past 10 days from record highs of
$US410/oz to a low of $US276/oz during Friday's
trading in New York. It closed a little firmer at
$US325/oz.

Russia produces about 60 per cent of the world's
palladium and it has not shipped any metal since last
December due to internal political problems.
This has caused severe shortages. The cost of
borrowing palladium ballooned to an astonishing 245
per cent when the spot price rocketed to record
levels. The palladium one month lease rate has since
fallen, although it remains high, at around 60 per
cent/year.

Then on Friday more bad news hit the palladium
market. The US Environmental Protection Agency
( EPA ) said that catalytic converters have become a
significant cause of global warming.

This is because they sometimes create nitrous
oxide, which is 300 times more powerful than carbon
dioxide in its impact on global warming.
The US Clean Air Act, written in 1970, does not cover
such greenhouse gasses, only smog-producing
gases.

While palladium struggles with these issues, gold
and silver are primarily struggling against Asia's
economic slowdown and the strength in the US
dollar. Both these metals are becoming more
expensive in local currencies.

And this is having an impact on demand. Over the
first four months of this year precious metals imports
into Japan have fallen dramatically. Japanese gold
and silver imports are both down about 48 per cent
over January-April 1998 compared with the same
period in 1997.

But now, will gold find new meaning in life with a
newly born European Central Bank? Certainly, the
gold market will be keenly awaiting the ECB's
decision on just what proportion gold will comprise of
its total exchange reserves.

Crusty
Perhaps if you are stumped by my POP email today, we could ask Limey, he is already looking at the sub-futon domestic Platinum stocks?


salty

opened at 1222 closed on the low for the day at 1197, falling sharply in last five minutes

Two other indicators that may indicate increased voitility soon.....

This one may even help gold..........:- )

http://www.canoe.ca/Jam/canoejam.html

This one is sure to grab a little attention anyway though,highest yet?

http://wwfn.com/crashupdate.html

Hope we see some improvement in gold this month,after RJ has covered.

Maybe the banks will allow the ratio to float to a more natural state?

Ya right.Good night nurse.

.............OK

Thanks, for the URL, I have that one, and check it, My problem is that I can never tell if the quote is current or the previous day's close. I still like to follow the spot price, it seems to be the one that is most elusive.

I just get bent out of shape on Mondays when Kitco and Yahoo are asleep - must be my addictive, compulsive internet personality.

GC Q8
August Gold
2950
-1
-0.0
2955
2950
40.8K

HighRise

GM

S&P 500 JUN98 1087.00 -380
SEP98 1097.25 -550
NSDQ100 JUN98 1191.00 -325
http://www.cme.com/cgi-bin/gflash.cgi

HighRise

Limey
Right, Crusty and I would like to ask you and F* the following. Replies are going to be graded:

I have been reading more of this JM Plat review, just as I was falling
asleep reading the Platinum Prices and Future Market review, that's the
one that talks about the self-explanatory charts on page 42/3, kinda
like reading a race call while watching the race live, i read one
sentence that POPped my eyes, I wonder if you can explain it to me
please, as I have no idea what they are talking about:

"This bout of weakness was brief. Tightness in the physical market was
exacerbated by a sudden increase in borrowing by Swiss banks, causing
one month lease rates to leap above 50 per cent on the 4th " ( of June )
0n page 43


Okay, I follow all the logic, but what are Swiss banks borrowing Plat
for?


PS don't cut tomatoes into the Thai Beef salad, crusty says not to. Crusty, this is the first year in at least 5 where I've not been growing cherry tomatoes inside in the middle of winter. I am devestated, but I have lettuce growing inside and will add rocket.... vroooom.


pps
This is a test, short for testimonial, who knows the etymology of "testimonial"? anyone??

Something about moaning and testicles if an endorsement is not given

I will research Mystery Page

OK

http://www.dbc.com/cgi-bin/htx.exe/dbcfiles/curcommt.html?SOURCE=core/dbc

HighRise

ANOYNE: If you're up this late ( US Time ) , where are you getting Asian Market info? Yahoo has everything quoted from the close on May 28th. Thanks for any help.

http://www.bloomberg.com/markets/asia.html

My entrails say massive bloodletting Monday & Tuesday !


General note to all on a slow night. Be sure to read the Dick Morris reports on Drudge.
As a former intimate insider who thinks exactly like Bill, he is a potent source of poop. His critiques are withering. Since he was finally fired for the last time ( since Bill can"t run again ) for disclosing that the First Prez likes to swing ( on alternating as well as direct current ) , he has been unrelenting in laying bare the real strategies, tactics & agenda of the boy Prez & his Jezebelle, to the point that his personal safety probably hinges on his ability to stay in the public eye !
Don't miss his reports while they last.
Trashing Dick Morris was like not settleing with Paula Jones for a lousy $700 k & a milk sop apology, the sole of hubris !


Y.O.S.


TAR BABY

Monday June 1, 1:49 am Eastern Time

Nissan Motor denies rumours of derivatives losses

TOKYO, June 1 ( Reuters ) - Nissan Motor Co ( 7201.T ) on Monday denied rumours in the foreign exchange and bond markets that it had incurred losses in derivatives trading.

"We have not made such losses," a Nissan spokesman said.

Market sources said the rumour appeared to have been based on a story in the June issue of the Japanese magazine ``Sentaku,'' which quoted an unnamed international financial source as saying that a U.S. subsidiary of Japan's number two carmaker had made large losses on derivative trading due to the fall of the Indonesian rupiah and turmoil in Southeast Asian and other emerging economies.

Last week Nissan announced its earnings results for the fiscal year ended on March 31, including a consolidated net loss of 14.0 billion yen.

The company attributed the poor results in large part to a 50 billion yen loss in connection with its leasing operations in the United States, which were saddled with massive residual losses due to a drop in used-car prices.

With its U.S. leasing mess largely cleaned up, Nissan Motor predicted it would break even on a consolidated net basis in the current fiscal year.
_____________________________________
Everyone must be in the Derivative Game, last fall the figure being thrown around was $70 trillion.

HighRise

SHAREFIN: Thanks so much. I really appreciate such a propmt response. What's the matter with Yahoo?
Doesn't look so good in Japan and Hong Kong tonight does it? Thailand is going down the tubes, too. Tsk, Tsk, Tsk...

Limey
Close enough. Etymology from testare to bear witness. I believe that before a man could either ( a ) vote or ( b ) become a senator in ancient Rome, he had to bear ( bare? ) witness to his manhood. As in, peak-a-boo. I see you. Hence he bore testimony, the display became his testimonial, actually the word test doesn't share the etymology but I had to give you, ahhemm, "a helping hand."

Next time someone asks you for a testimonial, what yer gonna do?

salty

I recall back in December looking at a double top that had not yet turned down. I'm still looking for this in my files as it contained some detail on the dynamics of this very interesting tool. I'll report as soon as I get my hands on it.

Y.O.S.

TAR BABY

NEWTRON: Dick Morris wrote that? Still, he does give the Prez the benefit of the doubt insofar as he says Ol' Bill would've turned down the money in a flash if he'da known it was coming straight from China. Yeah, right. Dick better sleep with his boots on and an Glock under his pillow.

Skylark wrote earlier this morning a very good piece the end of which bears repeating and remembering for I think that he ( or she ) is right on the money...


And Skylark wrote:
."What I am
hopefully looking for are signs that gold is
beginning to respond to these global conditions in a
positive rather than negative manner
as it has been previously doing. And once and if this
starts to happen, these conditions
should enforce the movement in gold as the media
begins to direct its attention to it.

In other words when SOMETHING starts being bullish for gold, that will be the time to be aggressive on the long side.

Just got home. Past 12 hours of posts were quite good. Some posts were earthshaking: ) Asia took a hit tonight. With the onset of Summer ( yeah it starts June 21, but it really begins now ) we could be in for a wild ride. Recommend seatbelts be fastened.

This would be the 6th Double top "killer wave " in this century ! 4 have preceeded 29,69,73 & 87 bears. The 47 signal was not as dramatic, but "lead time" we discussed last night is zero as market reaction is very swift, abrupt & plumb line down from a double top.

I don't know if it is significant, but 29 & 98 are the only DTs where the 2nd top is noticably higher than the 1st top !

Unless the PPT can stem the red tide flowing out of the asain markets in Europe in the early morning before Ny opens, they will not be able to prevent significant technical damage to the S&P .

All, ofcourse IMHIPO !

Y.O.S.

TAR BABY

Here's a couple of picks to show the wave.
I can bring up the Coppack indicator on the Dow in a dos charting program.
But cannot export as a picture.
It clearly shows the double top.

Eplanation
http://www.kitcomm.com/pub/discussion/Image373.gif

Diagram of the coppack wave.
http://www.kitcomm.com/pub/discussion/Coppack.jpg

Lest we be too ethnocentric, Auric, One man's summer is another man;s winter, yes?

Now who the Hell ever heard of winter starting June 1? Craziest thing I've heard!: )

SPM8 looks like it is about to take a dive.

Yahoo and Bloomberg have no updates on European bourses.

Keeping us in the dark?

how the Yahoo people seem to not wake up until about 5 or 6am to the fact that their computer has stuck and their exchange price information isn't working. I'm very interested to see how the South African golds are reponding to the shake out in Asia.

Even the CBS commodity quotes are stuck with gold showing unchanged four hours ago.
CNBC shows the yen at 139.22 , Hang Sing down 300 , everything in Asian down 1-3%, Japanese bonds at record highs yielding 1.163% US bonds at 5.774% , oil off 14 cents, spot gold atf 50 cents in what else but light trading.

Dick Morris only says these off hand things of kindness toward BILLERY for two reasons : to give him a veneer of objectivity & to distance himself from knowledge of corruption. He knows the truth & he wants to reek havoc with their political ( they have no other kind ) souls ! He pretends to hedge his comments, but what he really wants is Hillery's head on a platter.
"Dance for me Soleme !"

Go Dick ! I hope they don't buy or kill you off or eat crow & hire you back !
Tell it all brother !

Y.O.S.

TAR BABY

read "aft" tp be "off"

Gold is off 50 cents in Asia.

Interesting that all the electronic information regarding the European exchanges.

I wonder if the Globex S&P isn't stuck too. If those European markets come in down 1-2% I bet you'll see the S&P go from off 350 to off 1000.

With Intel in such a mess Monday should be bleak, but the dipsters will be inthere buying. My bet is for a weak opening and a recovery. Higher opening Tuesday then the crash. My opinion is based on a reversal of what happend last week where the bollom was at the opening of the second day of trading. This week could be a reverse of the opening pattern. Whatever, except for the pessismism over the S&P and DOW being about universal - it does look lower.

I think a good sell off might get the metal stocks down to a level where $280 has been discounted and front of the EURO meeting on the 9th be a good buy for a least a bounce. Gosh if the ERO got backed by 20% and sleas were limited to $325 or better , we'd be right off to the races.

Hope springs eternal, even if its winter time for our friends down under.

Report that White House has decided not to cooperate with Ken Starr, and expect impeachment proceedings as a result. http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a289247.htm

Auric
Wanna hear something crazier? Today ( that's Monday 1/6 ) is Queen's Birthday Holiday. Kinda like your President's' day, I suppose? But with older cynicism

Sleeping with a Glock under his pillow will do him no good, as this is the leading cause of "ARKANSIDE". It, however, normally requires more
than one clip !

Y.O.S.


TAR BABY

Well, I got QEII in my palm as I post. She looks good as Gold.

TOKYO ( Nikkei ) -The Nikkei Commodity Index dropped 0.516 point in May from a month earlier to stand at 111.966, marking a 25-year low. Further falls in domestic prices of steel products and textiles lowered the 42-item commodity index, commonly regarded as a leading indicator of the Japanese economy.

TOKYO ( Nikkei ) -Japan's automobile exports rose 4.9% in April from a year earlier to 380,113 units, the 23rd consecutive month of year-on-year increase, the Japan Automobile Manufacturers Association said Friday. The 23 months is the second-longest period of increase since the industry body began recording export figures. Automobile exports to other Asian countries fell 60.3% in April to 22,467 units, marking a drop for the seventh straight month. Exports to Thailand sank 93%, while those to Indonesia plunged 97.2% and to Malaysia plummeted 99.9%. Japanese auto exports to the European Union jumped about 30% in April. Exports to Central and South America also increased about 30%, while exports rose 4.2% to the U.S., where sales of sports-utility vehicles were especially brisk.

Interestion mutterings..........Haruhiko Kuroda, head of the finance ministry's international finance bureau, said Japan will "take measures as necessary against the excessively weak yen," while Minister of Finance Hikaru Matsunaga warned that Japan is "strongly concerned" about the yen's plunge below 139.00 yen and will "act decisively" against an excessively weak yen.

letting the dollar appreciate more is another way for the Fed to burst the stock market bubble without using interest rates as a pin. Multinational earnings will shrivel and bring the indices down while bonds take off.

back in early April when the BOJ intervened to the tune of 10 or 15 billion ( largest ever intervention ) Rubin infuriated the Japanese by saying that the US would not intervene ....my guess is that the Japanese are suspiciously absent because they want Rubin to eat those words ..as he must ...or risk taking alot of flak from congress

most interesting item in that article deserves a second post .... "Japan is facing its toughest economic slump in decades, with bankruptcies mounting and unemployment climbing to a postwar high - 4.1 percent in April, the government reported Friday. The jobless rate would be higher by Western standards, but Japan counts anyone who works at least one hour in a month as fully employed. "

Travelers wants to buy up to 25 percent of Nikko Securities for as much as 200 billion yen ( $1.44 billion ) , the Nihon Keizai business daily reported
New York-based Travelers, now merging with Citicorp to form the world's biggest financial company, would become Nikko's largest shareholder. Nikko is Japans 3rd largest brokerage firm

Sunday May 31, 8:47 pm Eastern Time MOF's Kuroda says concerned at excess yen weakness TOKYO, June 1 ( Reuters ) - Japan is concerned about the excessive weakness of the yen, Haruhiko Kuroda, director-general of the Ministry of Finance's ( MOF ) International Finance Bureau, told reporters on Monday. He also said the nation's foreign exchange policy remained unchanged. Asked about Japan's foreign exchange policy, he said: ``Our stance is always the same.'' He added: ``We are concerned about the excessive weakness of the yen.'' Asked if he was aware some ruling Liberal Democratic Party ( LDP ) politicians support a weakening of the yen to boost the fragile economy, Kuroda said: ``I'm not aware of such a view. I don't feel there is a gap ( between MOF and the LDP over the level of the yen ) .''

fiend
Real quiet out here tonight...S&P 500 futures down 5 points. Could get ugly ( uglier ) for the techs tomorrow.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
TORONTO AREA BUSINESSES
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Network/2735/#US

Starr may subpoena Clinton in sex probe
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/headlines/top_stories/story.html
?s=z/reuters/980531/news/stories/testimony_2.html

Japan's economic slump hits hard in capital's slum
http://www.tampabayonline.net/news/news101s.htm

Pakistani scientist: Our country can produce nuclear weapons
http://www.tampabayonline.net/news/news1021.htm

Investment revenue to treble by 2010-EIU journal
http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980531/investment_1.html

Morgan Stanley - The Global Economics Forum
http://www.ms.com/GEF/index.html

CNBC Europe
http://www.cnbceurope.com/

I always like to have a drink on the Queen's birthday.

This one will be my 40th
But I've only drunk on 25 of them.

Mayor Island was my training turf.
----for serious drinking----
and serious fishing too.

Has anyone got a site to view Europes indices?

Yahoo and Bloomberg are down and out.

He won't testify before a Grand Jury because to do so would 1} prove prior purgery that would be easy to demonstrate; 2} commit new purgery, again easy to prove or 3} take the 5th Amendment, political suicide.
Any 1, 2 or 3 would make impeachment a cinch !
Therefor, he will stay with the stone wall & whistle past the grave yard on the cunnard that a sitting Prez cannot be indicted.
Didn't the Paula Jones case set the clear precedent that a sitting Prez is not above the judicial process like all other citizens. It would seem to be much more appropriate in a criminal setting.

What was it Louie said just before Marie ordered the cake ? "Estate am Oi" .
I don't recall that being in my reading of the constitution !

Y.O.S.

TAR BABY

http://www.dbc.com/cgi-bin/htx.exe/dbcfiles/curcommt.html?SOURCE=core/dbc

http://quote.yahoo.com/m2?u

good day from the chilly Midwest.

end

Well it's the 1st of June; maybe these computer's not updating indices is Y2K related, you know, the weakest link thing, and entering data past the Y2K.

Harry Schultz had a great piece on Y2K; will summarize shortly.

PPT--I wonder if we are really seeing the PPT at these levels or is it more likely overzealous Banks of the kind of Merrill or Solomon trying to keep prices steady so that they would make money on option writing.

Interesting thought. Today is the start of New York state's fiscal year. I think they budget 2 years at a time. Hah, as soon as this is posted, Yahoo will be back up.

http://www.afr.com.au/content/980601/banking/banking1.html
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Australian markets outlook
http://www.afr.com.au/content/980601/market/markets1.html
A minefield of economic data this week will add to the uncertainty faced by domestic financial markets already grappling with the meltdown in Asia and instability in the Russian economy.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Wall Street
http://www.afr.com.au/content/980601/market/markets2.html
Investors are heading for the safety zone by pocketing bonds. The rush is not yet strong enough to signal a significant share price correction but a definite bond rally is building.
~~~~~~~~~~~

http://www.afr.com.au/content/980601/market/markets5.html
Gold's great white hope, the new European Central Bank, is formally created today. Discipline and order shall now return to the gold market.

Haphazard gold sales by individual central banks, one of the major factors behind the collapse in the gold price to 18-year lows earlier this year, will now stop. Right.

Well, the gold market is not so sure.
http://www.afr.com.au/content/980601/images/gold.jpg

In fact, the gold price slumped back down into a $US290-$US295/oz range late last week to greet the newborn.

But, to be fair, the precious metals were hardly looking at Europe. Like other commodities, they were pushed lower by the surging US dollar, rising uncertainty in Asia, particularly in the gold and silver devouring India with its collapsing rupee, growing fears of a competitive devaluation of the Chinese yuan and the apparent spread of Asia's economic problems into Eastern Europe.

Silver, in US dollars, dipped on Friday to its lowest level in six months, US dollar gold has lost more than 7 per cent of its value in the past month and platinum has fallen by almost 14 per cent over the past six weeks.

But palladium the white metal used in electronics and in emission-reducing catalytic converters in automobiles took the biggest hit. Russian economic chaos was behind its 30 per cent price collapse over the past 10 days from record highs of $US410/oz to a low of $US276/oz during Friday's trading in New York. It closed a little firmer at $US325/oz.

Russia produces about 60 per cent of the world's palladium and it has not shipped any metal since last December due to internal political problems.

This has caused severe shortages. The cost of borrowing palladium ballooned to an astonishing 245 per cent when the spot price rocketed to record levels. The palladium one month lease rate has since fallen, although it remains high, at around 60 per cent/year.

Then on Friday more bad news hit the palladium market. The US Environmental Protection Agency ( EPA ) said that catalytic converters have become a significant cause of global warming.

This is because they sometimes create nitrous oxide, which is 300 times more powerful than carbon dioxide in its impact on global warming.

The US Clean Air Act, written in 1970, does not cover such greenhouse gasses, only smog-producing gases.

While palladium struggles with these issues, gold and silver are primarily struggling against Asia's economic slowdown and the strength in the US dollar. Both these metals are becoming more expensive in local currencies.

And this is having an impact on demand. Over the first four months of this year precious metals imports into Japan have fallen dramatically. Japanese gold and silver imports are both down about 48 per cent over January-April 1998 compared with the same period in 1997.

But now, will gold find new meaning in life with a newly born European Central Bank? Certainly, the gold market will be keenly awaiting the ECB's decision on just what proportion gold will comprise of its total exchange reserves.

http://www.afr.com.au/content/980601/market/markets8.html
Commodity prices were hit hard last week by the continuing economic crisis in Asia and its spread into Russia and Hong Kong. The widely followed Commodity Research Bureau ( CRB ) Index fell to its lowest level in five years on Friday.

Base metals, precious metals, sugar, grains, wool, coal and crude oil were all knocked lower. Fresh evidence that Japan's economic malaise was deepening, Russian interest rates hitting 150 per cent in an effort to support the rouble and rising fear about the ability of Hong Kong to hold its peg to the US dollar were all behind the weakness.
http://www.afr.com.au/content/980601/images/crb.jpg

"A second wave is hitting Asia," said one New York investment banker. "The Japanese banks are on the brink with more bad loans to Indonesia still to be written off, labour revolts in Korea, atomic tests on the Indian sub-continent and now Russia drawn in who wants to know about Asia? The only currency to be in is US dollars at the moment."

This sums up the current market attitude. Little wonder commodities are at five-year lows. And there is worse to come, say analysts. There are now signs of rising commodity inventories in the pivotal markets of Japan and China.

In Japan, inventories are at their highest level since 1973 and this "upward trend in stocks seems likely to continue unless there are larger cuts in production and/or the government's economic stimulus package has a greater impact on the economy," said Jim Lennon, senior commodities analyst with the Macquarie Bank group.

Stocks of copper cathode held by Japanese producers in April were 37 per cent larger than the amounts held in April 1997, refined zinc inventories are 8 per cent higher but producer stocks rose by almost 32 per cent in April.

Aluminium stocks rose by 100,000 tonnes ( to 461,000 tones ) over the first quarter as Japanese traders had to take delivery of contracted tonnages despite the sharp fall off in domestic demand. But, in April, port stocks fell 11,000 tonnes, the first fall in 10 months, as Japanese traders negotiated down imported tonnages.

And in China, copper stocks in exchange warehouses have increased from around 50,000 tonnes at the end of 1997 to around 110,000 tonnes today, with an additional 50,000 tonnes-plus rumoured to be held outside exchange warehouses, according to local sources.

At the same time, in Russia, hopes of recovery have been dashed by the sharp rise in interest rates, said Angus MacMillan, research manager for London based Billiton Metals.

"This will effectively nip the incipient recovery in demand for the base metals in the bud, leaving more metal available for export to the West," he said.

The issues of excess capacity, deflation, falling consumption and rising inventories are not just hitting base metals. China has suddenly become a net exporter of massive amounts of cotton as it battles to knock down inventories.

Cotton, however, is one of the few commodities that has managed to rally over the past few weeks because of concerns about the coming US crop. Cotton closed Friday at 70.59 US c/lb, up 13 per cent from its four-year lows hit in early April.

Sugar was not as fortunate. It fell to a five-year low last week due to poor Asian demand, the disappearance of Russia from the market and large South American production.

Wheat also hit five-year lows last week on the back of forecasts of US 1998-99 supply being the highest since 1990-91 and US trade sanctions on Pakistan, after its nuclear blast. Pakistan is one of the US's top five customers.

On the energy front, the oil market remains burdened by massive supplies in the face of weaker Asian demand. Crude oil prices are hovering just above 12-year lows while coal prices remain under severe pressure.

In short, the demand side of the commodities price equation is in trouble. Right now, the only way commodity prices can rally is if supply is reduced. And here agricultural commodities, given the vagaries of weather, have a better chance of rallying short-term than the slower adjusting mineral commodities.

This has been asked before, but who bought the CB Gold? Not sure if we ever figured it out.

http://www.hkabc.net/cgi-bin/mtl-cgi

Let's test our muscle !
I propose that we select a member of the next committee that will get a shot at R. Rubin & or A. Greenspan testifying undere oath before Congress & petition him or her to ask them each one question: does your agency engage in or do you have any knowledge of any federal entity or chartered institution engaging in for it's own account or for the account of any other US Agency or foreign government, either directly or indirectly, the purchase of securities, derivitives ( other than permitted open market activities in pursuit of legitamate monetary policy objectives ) or the sale or lease of Gold or Gold Derivitives?
When your eyes glaze over from an obfiscatory response, fire back:
Do you intervene to manipulate Bond , Equity & commodity markets from Tokyo to Frankfurt ?
If so, what is your stautory authority & what is your mandate !
Please submit a full report of any such activity to congress within 10 days or expect a subpoena.

Diogenes must first be found to find an oxymoronic Congressman to pose such a brave query.

I propose we take a poll on the best candidate & deluge Him or Her with personal letters from all on Kitco who would like an official answer to this question.

"Lord, we done mest with the primordial powers of nature this time."
"That's ok Mandrake as long as we preserve our precious bodily fluids we'll be alright. Why do you think the Russians drink nothing but pure Vodka ? Because Mandrake, they don't want to pollute their precious bodily fluids !"

Y.O.S.


TAR BABY

May 25 Harry Schultz Letter ( tel: +32 16 533 684 ) commented on Y2K.

Says: part of the problem is INSOLUBLE.
US may be the country most Dependent upon computers, as they run everything.
Chips are programmed Rigidly, and when they can't compute they freeze up or malfunction.
Airliners are vulnerable.
Some power plants & hospitals have already failed. Jan 1, 2000 is mid winter in N hemisphere; Many power plants will fail. Food can't be delivered? Drinkable water may not flow through processing plants.
China/Russia missiles run on stolen US software, haven't got the source code.
Clinton will declare State of Emergency well before Jan 1, 2000; civil rights will be suspended. Airlines will ground themselves a week before Y2K, and maybe for months thereafter.

Harry is starting to lay in a supply of gold coins ( very rare, not so rare, and common ) , partly to get money out of Banks. Who knows if a Y2K crisis will shut down banks and for how long? Also, Harry is predicting bank runs for 1999 and computer breakdowns. Bank runs may show the fragility of the Fiat/Fractional Reserve System.

He is also accumulating "cookie jar" cash, small and large denominations, and normal coins.

He says in the virtually certain crisis ahead, gold will likely rise sharply, but that's a bonus, not the main reason to buy.

He says Not to store your hoard in bank vaults! Says to use private storage bin; in US/UK there are private safe-deposit box companies.

Most of Europe is closed today. London -1.3, Helsinki -1.4, Moscow -3.75

JM

Gold was off 35 cents in London 30 minutes ago. Silver was up 5 cents , oil down 14 cents, yen 139+. South African gold index off 1.38%.

S&P Globex off 500ish. Been there for about 2 hours.

http://www.esi.co.uk/

HTTP/1.0 500 Server Error ( The referenced account is currently locked out and may not be logged on to. )

Your diagram of the coppack wave: http://www.kitcomm.com/pub/discussion/Coppack.jpg

When was the first top, and when was the second. Are they weeks or months apart?

http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980601/yen_bears__2.html

http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980531/s_korea_ce_1.html

http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980601/markets_as_1.html

The 'confirm point was Feb95
The first high was Mar96
The second high was Oct97

This oscillator is a very long term one.
Its cycle is approx 2-3 years.

http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980601/markets_as_1.html

There is something even more insidious than Internet Addiction, my friends. Beware of Net Burnout. It happened to me. Once a vigorous and enthusiastic poster and internet contributer, I suffered this dread malady. It came upon me in the form of responsibilities and life events. These addictive forces drew me away from the net, slowly at first, then faster and faster, more and more. Relationships, business, earning a living, caring for sick and frail relatives, family obligations, household chores and concerns...all of these things suddenly became the end all and be all of my life. There was time for nothing else. The modem lay silent, its once promising, comforting buzz stilled in the night, silent in the day.

With treatment, they tell me I should be back on the net as before , before too long. Consider this tentative testimonial my hesitant attempt toward recovery. One post at a time.

Pray for me, friends. Nmastast...Nasmastase...er...Nama...
well, you know...

http://www.nickelalloy.com/

Sky, I agree - who carries about misspelling anyhow? I don't.

You've got quite a line up there, Donald. If things weren't really in such a pickle I'd think you were making these thngs up, but what's scarey I know you are not. Seems like we are all of a sudden on a slide that's getting steeper. I remeber when making gold was alot happier undertaking. Prices were going up in general, gold just more so than others. Now, everything is going down or about to, and maybe alot, and so far gold has gone down the least in '98, among many things; infact isn't it up. Perhaps as gold becomes a relative better performer to the more liquid investments it will start to attrack attention on its own.

Maybe you can own alot of dollars but what are you going to put all of your money into? Stocks to a point but those investors who sell will be taking dollars out of the market and reallocating them, largely in cash in treasury bills and bonds, we've seen that rally and with an ecoonmic contraction where better to put cash. There's another 500 basis points to go after which really freightened money will pay to have their funds in Treasuries.

But at some point, as gold gets ( cheaper? ) , stays the same, or heavens goes up. It will become one of few alternatives for all that flood of money that's slowing a return. Let the Euro get backed with a downside limit set on the price of central back sales and . . . and . .
YOU HAVE A REASON FOR GOLD TO GO UP!!!

http://www.usnews.com:80/usnews/issue/980608/8fina.htm

how are I'm fine you : stop looking at me! where's the mustard? it's over there... pass the mustard...Why is gold low? stop looking at me! Can you see through this thing? Pass the mustard...

Nissan has a little derivative problem does it. Boy if those derivatives start going off . ..

Not much to do for a couple hours. Another two before NY opens. I see the attention being all stock, the dollar/yen and treasuries. Gold stocks shoshould fall along with their counterparts in South Africa and with equequities in general. Buy the break and catch the knife??

During times like these, no matter where you live, you can only think about economic survival. Don't try to pick exact tops and bottoms. Expect the worse and be ready for it. Each of my posts could be a glimpse into our own smug futures.

is off 21 at around 910-915. I believe
that a break of 900 may lead to a rather
dramatic fall off.
God bless puts.

Last evening I posted information related to a paper I had written on population and a subsequent response from Dr. Foot, Professor of Economics. The attached WORD document has a graphic showing the enormous purchasing power of the approximately 80M boomers.

Hope this works...

MONDAY JUNE 1 1998
Asia-Pacific 

ASIAN CRISIS: UK insolvency experts called in
By Jim Kelly, Accountancy Correspondent
More than 120 of the UK's leading experts in company rescue - up to 10 per cent of the entire senior insolvency profession - are working in the stricken economies of south-east Asia on behalf of international banking syndicates and financial regulators.

The confidential assignments, representing an investment of up to 150m a year in partner and staff time, range from assessing the repercussions of the crises for developed nations to rescuing companies from failure.

The UK profession has been called on in the light of expertise in cross-border insolvencies such as those of Barings Bank, the business empire of the late Robert Maxwell and the Bank of Credit and Commerce International. UK-based experts also gained expertise in the early 1990s in rescuing businesses outside formal insolvency procedures, such as liquidation or receivership, by getting creditor backing for a survival plan under the so-called "London Approach".

Murdoch McKillop, president of the Society of Practitioners of Insolvency, said: "There's a lot of the UK profession out there. We have learnt a lot about the rescue culture. We've moved a long way from shutting the doors and getting the auctioneers in. We have been able to act as abridge between the international banking community and local corporates."

Individual firms will not divulge their corporate recovery commitments in south-east Asia, but the Big Six accountancy firms are understood to have had up to 800 staff on the ground over the past six to nine months, including legal back-up from London firms.

Most of the Big Six have allocated senior insolvency experts, who normally manage insolvency or corporate recovery departments, to work in south-east Asia. They rely on local staff and partners allocated from the US and Australia.

Initially, high-level work in the region was backed by financial regulators - understood to include the Bank of England and the International Monetary Fund. They wanted to assess the risks of systemic failure spreading from the region's economies.

The insolvency experts are beginning to pick up specific corporate rescue work, particularly in Thailand, as businesses struggle with bad debts, dollar-denominated borrowings, and sharply contracting local demand.

The profession expects more work to come on stream as companies that have so far survived on operating cashflow turn to foreign banks for new money, and when the currency situation in south-east Asia stabilises.

"It is difficult to restructure debt until these things happen - that will be when the creditors have more leverage. Third parties will certainly stay in the wings until the currencies stabilise," said one leading practitioner.

http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980601/markets_pr_1.html

June 1st, 1998
Monday's Wall Street Journal reports that, according to U.S. ship operators, Japan isn't living up to its agreement to improve access to its ports, seven months after the agreement led Washington to drop trade sanctions against Japan. Will pressure resume in Washington to impose sanctions? Note the potential for an impact on the stock markets- see Background section, below.

How would the Japanese respond to new sanctions? Might they recall what Japanese Prime Minister Ryutaro Hashimoto said on 23rd June 1997:

"I hope the U.S. will engage in cooperation to maintain exchange stability, so that we will not succumb to the temptation to sell U.S. Treasury Bills and switch our funds to gold."
Hashimoto also said:

"There are many countries in the world which conduct the management of their foreign exchange reserves in Treasuries. These countries continue to hold on to those Treasuries, even when the dollar plummets. And to some extent, it is this continued holding of Treasuries which supports the U.S. economy."
In one of my previous commentaries, updated at 21:30 pm GMT on October 31st, 1997, I said:

The agreement now has to stand the test of being put into practice.

We may soon see the results of that test.

as you've never seen before ...
.
http://www.totse.com/files/FA020/frncourt.htm
.

I was reading some of the yesterday's commentary. Alcohol, IMO, was probably made legal again because of widespread incidence of people brewing their own moonshine. Auggie Busch couldn't have been too pleased.

I think the thing of that California referendum legalising Mary Jane that irked politicians the most was that people could grow their own stuff and wouldn't be obliged to buy it from the gubbermit.

Gollum had a great post of why there are hostilities in the Middle East: they sell oil and get dollars. The west has to sell them something back, namely weapons.

The English empire had most of SE Asia hooked on opium in a triangle of trade: England sold opium in exchange for Goods. Sold goods for currency. Used currency to buy opium, and profited on each step.

Ex-CIA operative, Chip Tatum, speaks of a similar Triangle in this article.
http://www.peg.apc.org/~nexus/pegfile1.html
http://www.peg.apc.org/~nexus/pegfile2.html ( part 2 )
Everyone knows of the Arms to Iran in the Iran-Contra scandal, the drugs link isn't widely known.

The US sold weapons to Iran for currency. Used currency to buy drugs in S America. Sold drugs in US for currency, and profited on each step.

Govts are always the biggest drug dealers. Drug laws are for police states, protection from competition, feeding the usurer, pork barrel spending etc.

Seasons, as do a mans fortunes, move in cycles. There is a well
known business cycle in the markets wherein there is a time to
be in stocks ( particularly in cyclical stocks ) , a time to be in
in bonds, and a time to be entirely in cash and/or real assets.

For the last 20 years it has seemed like the cycle was stuck. A
prolonged cold war giving way to renewed globalization of world
economic systems gave rise to conditions reminiscent of the
roaring 20s. An extended bull market in equities and economic
opportunity initiated an extended bear market in precious metals.

Even as the normal cyclical patterns eventually led to slowdowns,
in some cases severe slowdowns, in asian and foreign economies the
percieved strength of the US economy and currency led to a flow of
flight and arbitrage capital to the US and has served to further
prolong the bull cycle in dollar denominated markets.

That phase is now coming to an end. We now proceed to "coast over the
top". The US, going late into its decline, is going to have some
prolems 18 months to a couple of years from now as other economies
recover an begin to grow. There will be much strain put on the dollar.

During the uncertain times in the months ahead I believe there will
be increased interest in precious metals as a repository to conserve
accumlated wealth and a certain amount of concomitant speculative
interest. This will also serve as a motivation to put central bank
reduction of gold reserves hold until things get sorted out.

It is hard to predict the period of time we are talking about here.
The average bear market during "normal times" runs around 1 1/2 years
or so, but some people have estimated it will take up to 5 years for
some asian economies to recover ( and who knows how long for the
Russians ) . The closest period in similarity to what we are seeing now
was th 1920's and it took over tweny years and a major world war before
there was even a glimmer of coming out of that one. One way of
estmating would be to note that bear cycles are often about half the
size of bull cycles. Twenty years up means ten years down. On the other
hand things happen at an ever accelerating pace nowadays so perhaps
anywhere from 5 to ten years would not be a bad guess. We shall see.

In any case, for all those patient and long enduring goldbugs out there,
the light at last is at the end of the tunnel. Let us hope it is not
nuclear flashes....

GM

"... The projects envisaged by the Joint Year 2000 Council include:

providing a forum for the disclosure of the status of global financial market preparations for the Year 2000;

encouraging all payment and settlement systems, clearing houses, exchanges and other parts of the global financial market infrastructure to make publicly available information on their preparatory efforts and testing programs;

meeting regularly with an external consultative committee composed of organisations or associations with an international perspective on Year 2000 preparations;

developing a global supervisory contact list for the Year 2000 challenge that includes a coordinating contact covering as many countries as possible;

supporting, co-sponsoring and providing assistance in planning further conferences and roundtables on the Year 2000 challenge in different regions of the world;

facilitating exchanges of information related to Year 2000 testing programs within the international financial community;

encouraging coordinated cross-border testing to the maximum extent possible;

developing a series of publicly available working papers on different aspects of the Year 2000 challenge;

facilitating the sharing of information on Year 2000 preparations by core infrastructure providers such as telecommunications, electric power and government utilities, as they relate to preparations by financial market participants;

sharing and developing ideas on contingency measures appropriate for individual firms and domestic markets;

serving as a point of contact for the coordination of international contingency efforts;

and encouraging the development of and the global sharing of plans for market conventions and dispute resolution procedures designed to mitigate the effect of Year 2000 transaction failures... "

Full text: http://www.bis.org/wnew.htm

Good Post

If I remember correctly, the Arkansas National Guard Airport played a part in this exchange.

Thanks,

HighRise

From article linked at 07:49

On 26 February 1985, Tatum and his crew were instructed to fly two individuals to one of the larger Contra camps on the Honduran border. His flight log lists the names of the two individuals as Bill Cooper and Buzz Sawyer, both of whom worked for Corporate Air Services. Following a meeting between the CIA agents and Contra leaders, Tatum was given a sealed cooler, marked "Vaccine", weighing approximately 200 pounds, and instructed to deliver it to a USAF C-130 transport plane at La Mesa Airport, Honduras. Two crew members offloading the cooler accidentally dropped it, breaking the seal. Inside were over 100 bags of cocaine. Tatum resealed the cooler and later watched as it was transferred aboard the C-130, outward bound for Panama.

On his return to Palmerola Air Base, Honduras, Tatum phoned Col. North to advise him of his discovery. North replied that it was "a trophy of war" and that the "Sandinistas are manufacturing cocaine and selling it to fund the military". North closed the conversation by saying that "the cocaine was bound for the world courts as evidence" against the Sandinistas.

The whole incident struck Tatum as odd and reminded him strongly of earlier missions dating back to 1983-84 when he was stationed at Fort Campbell, Kentucky, as a Special Operations pilot. Regularly he would trans-ship white coolers, marked as "Medical Supplies", to Little Rock Air Force Base, Arkansas. On two occasions he carried similar coolers to Mena Airport, Arkansas. Deliveries of medical coolers to Little Rock AFB were picked up by Dr Dan Lasater - a close confidant of the then Arkansas Governor Bill Clinton.

which best fits your expectations...

Deflation Scenario #1:
Unemployment, cash shortage, everything gets cheaper by the day, and most people have less money each day than they had the day before. Who has money to buy gold? No one. Price of gold deflates along with everything else.

Deflation Scenario #2:
Same as above except... Who has money to buy gold? The wealthy who liquidated equities and debt for cash early in the crash and avoided the sucker's rallies. Gold becomes the most favored hard asset for anyone who has money to invest because it does not deflate as fast as other hard assets, that are usually bought with debt ( e.g., property ) , and is less risky than equities and bonds. Demand exceeds supply, the price of gold inflates.

The implications of the second scenario are that while the US will not default on its debt obligations, which would make the dollar worthless, it may play tricks with them, such as converting short term bills to long term notes, that frightens investors. In other words, government bonds have to somehow appear more risky than gold, or investors use a mix of both cash and gold ( as I am today, maybe a little ahead of my time ) .

Thx for your thoughts.
-EJ

Gold has been trading for 13 hours, lets turn the charts on, it's time to go to work.
Thanks for everything,

HighRise

PS:
CNBC
Somers, " Russia's problems could spread globally"

This is a MAJOR negative statement, check the wire news for more!!!!!!

http://www.kitcomm.com/pub/discussion/GlobalIndices.htm

Yes, this stuff appears to cross all party lines.

More later, got to run.

Thanks again

HighRise

Commodities in general have a funny habit of not getting produced where the anticipated selling price is below the cost of prodution.
Particular enterprises like Pegasus may go out of existence, but their kinetic potential will just be consolidated in stronger hands & the spring will just be wound that much tighter.
If you wanted to accumulate some commodity & you had the power to manipulate prices, would you push them up or down ? Which way would you encourage speculation ? Would you make it painful & uncomfortable for
those who were holding the substance you wanted ?

$300 billion buys all the AU in all the CB's of the world !
That's about 10 months of capital inflows into this bleeding from the mouth Bull market or about 1/30th of what they say the Japanese households have to invest !
Let's see, what investment could the Japanese
make that won't further weaken the Yen ?
Yes, boys & girls, can you say GOLD ?

The sheep are being herded into the Bond market because it would be a lesser disaster for the equities investing public to go Bankrupt than for a collapse in the Bond market to reveal the insolvency of the US Treasury. AU must not be viewed as viable alternative.
Think of all that USG debt Rubin has rolled over into short maturities. Think about the short term debt of Korea that the IManFer has not even begun to address. Think of the derivitive loses & non-performing Asian loans that will show up in late July & August.

Will AU stocks be washed over board with US Equities collapse & deflationary tidal wave ?
Tough call, but my IMHIPO is as good as your IMHIPO & it says that a collapse or clear bear S&P market would set off a currency crisis starring the USD that in view of the juvinile status of the Euro would make a certain commodity I can think of an irresistable place to park value.
The USD was not the world currency in 1934 that it is today. There was no doubt back then after sopping up all the gold from Europe ( Except France which made several late raids on our stash ) that the US could muster the AU to match it's trade balance obligations after devaluing the USD by 75%. With all the USD's in the world, it would take one heck of an upvaluation to match that trick . The blow back would be sharp, but not as sharp as 87 & the bounce back would be quick & sharp. Obviously a lurching S7P Bear would be better for Au stocks than a blow off.
Because of the space age brain washing tecniques of Wall Street to get the Public to wade into the Dips, the strength of the USD & the brazen audacity of the PPT, IMHIPO, the final Bear trap rally will be sprung after a precipitous drop in early June, possibly commencing today.

Stay tuned fellow AU Air Cadets. Let us see how this amazing piece of history unfolds.
I heard Boy Bill threatening to allow the IManFers to make another loan to Russia that they don't have to lend. Theory being now that they're down to threatening to do things that the whole world knows that they don't have the capacity to do. The fact is that there is not enough currency in the world under their direct control to bail out, nationalize or roll over all the defaulted debt in the world. Korea being the most eminent & acute example.


Y.O.S.


TAR BABY

P.S.
Kitco, you better talk to this Tar Baby, or I'll knock your head clean off !

Gold at $290.90 down $1.40

Memories of the Souk al Manakh

"How large can a bubble grow before it bursts? Farther than

you think. And there need not be a fatal pinprick that makes it

burst. And when it bursts, the crash that ensues can be deeper

and more discontinuous than you could ever imagine."

"The Sheik of Abu Dubai was the richest man in the world at the

time and the Ruler of Dubai was also quite well to do. The five

other sheiks who had no oil were poor cousins."

"In the end I mustered the courage to tell the truth. "It is all a

bubble," I told my client-. "And it will burst."

"Don't you understand, there has never been a place on

earth like the Gulf with such unprecedented wealth? You will

never understand that the Gulf market cannot crash."

"Well, it topped quietly at mid summer after

you left, with no provocation. One can't quite say it declined or

it crashed; it has just stopped trading."

"Its decline was so discontinuous it cannot be called a

crash. There were simply no bids."

from the Souk al Manakh back to the Souk of Wall Street

Remember, you must delete the entra letters "en" in the word "golden" before pasting the URL to your Internet locator:

http://www.golden-eagle.com/editorials_98/veneroso060198.html

It would seem by the similarity of views posted early this morningthat a view is developing that while everything else may go down, if gold doesn't it will at that time begin to attract conservative and speculative capital, and THAT WILL MAKE THE PRICE OF GOLD GO UP.

Interesting that so many of us have that view this morning.

Frankly, other than the fact I agree, which may be a warning to others, I think we've got it - now's the time to watch for the turn.

well done,every dog has his day.

Saw one of those ABC News dosumentaries over the weekend and there was one segment about a town in Connecticut ( Willomatick ? ? ) that has taken to issuing its own money. Seems the local merchants are issuing and accepting their own currencies ( bills, etc ) in local trade. At the start of the show, the commentator said "it has the approval of the IRS" ( think I heard that correctly ) . Not quite sure about the name of the town.
True story .

The dislocations caused by the 1st world war & the chaos engendered with Britain forcing the world back to a Gold standard & then capitulating to Keynsian principals of soft money & the subsequent mobilization for a total war economy for the 2nd world war & the devastation of world capital assets through the destruction wrought by WW2 & the incredible wealth that had to be wasted to remain on a war time footing with the Bolshevics since WW2 would indicate to me that this cycle that you so adequately compare to past cycles will be both sharper & more compressed in time than you project.

I am optomistic enough to think that a new global structure could arise from these ashes that does not require the hedgemony of a super power or the enslavement of debtors to ensure prosperity, a system of trade & commerce that is not hostage to stealth & surprise attack devaluations, a system where the cost of money does not include a hugh premium for the uncertainty of the intrinsic value of the currency

itself.

Gee

http://www.newswire.ca/releases/June1998/01/c0031.html

Nikko Securities for $1.6 Billion . Page A3 of WSJ.

WSJ. Major social unrest possible.

An excerpt from the breaking news in FT May 30-31.

JAPAN: Jobless rate at record 4.1%

By Paul Abrahams and Bethan Hutton in Tokyo

"...Deflation is particularly alarming because consumers, knowing that prices will be lower in coming months, delay purchases. In April, retail sales fell 0.5 per cent year on year. This is highly damaging for companies, because they are left with large stocks, the value of which rapidly depreciates. They are then forced to cut production, affecting employment and private demand.

Production cuts have not been keeping pace with declining demand. Data published earlier this week showed inventories in April reached their highest levels since 1973, although industrial production also fell 1.1 per cent from the previous month, and 6.2 per cent from a year earlier.

The scaling-back of production in order to clear inventories has already hit take-home pay for many workers, whose overtime hours have been cut. Overtime worked fell 9.9 per cent in April from a year earlier, and overtime pay dropped 8.2 per cent, with the heaviest falls in the manufacturing sector. Weakness in the labour market is in turn hitting consumer sentiment..."



Here we have some key factors: deepness of recession, unemloyment rate,

cash ( savings available ) and the most important of all, time. In the third year of recession, who needs ( dear ) gold?

JM

Page A13 of WSJ. Cost of fixing banks in the region estimated at $70 B and up". ( That's 70 Big Ones ) .

the evening TV news. Voice caption from the announcer, " Today, the global economy collapsed and everyone agreed to go back to subsistence farming ".

Bart's charts are working but you may not want to look. Gold is below 289.

http://www.kitco.com/gold.graph.html

Abreast of the Market section . Chart in article shows eight previous occassions when DJIA fell 20% or more. ( last occassion 1990 when there was recession and Gulf War )

What a wake-up call.
http://www.kitco.com/gold.graph.html

Construction Spending UP
Purchasing managers DOWN
Lumber DOWN
Gold DOWN

S & P Futures do not mean much any more, they reverse rather quickly just before the open.

Later, I have to go make some money to cover my margin call.

HighRise

""A Golden Cure for World-wide Deflation Contagion""

From Thomas Jefferson, in an address to his
fellow 'founding fathers' of the new nation:

Thomas Jefferson: "If the American people ever
allow the banking system to control their money,
first by inflation, then by deflation; their children
will one day wake up homeless on the continent
their fathers conquered."

The world's financial and monetary systems may
be likened to a gigantic teetering circus-tent. And
when the tent finally collapses. It will not be the
center-post that goes first; it will be the side-posts;
and even the stakes."

The "stakes" are the Asian Tiger economies. The
"side-posts" are the most important trading
partners of the U.S. This includes the strategic
national economies of: Hong Kong/China, Japan,
Canada, Mexico, South America and Europe. The
"center-post" is the U.S. economy, including its
stock markets.

The "tent" is the world-economy, built on a
mountain of artificial money and credit, created out
of thin air, by a politically engineered and
dominated central banking system, that has
mastered the art of legalized counterfeiting. It has
taken generations, to perfect this art and master
this tune, that plays to the drum-beat of billions of
dollars of false wealth created per week.

Not too many years ago, it was against the law to
counterfeit money, including by governments or
banks.

And now what: Gold going up?in the midst of
spreading Deflation? How can this be!

I've been visiting the Kitco site for about a year
now; and it is evident from the discussions there,
that most of us are still deluded by, and caught up
in, the artificial Santa-Clause Economy built on the
BIG LIE: money and credit created out of nothing.
This insures an over-extended, artificial, seemingly
benevolent "economic summer" that may last for
generations. All the while the masses
misperceptions grow, while the money-masters of
power, in the world, in control of interest rates, of
credit availability, and of the volume of money
flooding the world.they thus become economic
dictators in hiding.ruling over the ultimate value
of the money you earn, spend, invest, and save for
a 'rainy-day" or retirement, or the kids'' education.

The world over central banks have evolved with
their governments blessings into a quiet, awesome
club of collusion and unbridled power. They hold
in their hands the destinies of nations, and the fate
of millions. Reginald McKenna, a 19th century
banker of England said: "Give me control of a
nation's money, and I care not who makes the
laws."

It is, in fact, very natural, for gold to go up, as
deflation intensifies. Just as it is very natural for
gold to go up in inflationary times, as well. That is
because the inflation and deflation are happening
to the paper currency, the artificial money of the
realm. Inflation and deflation do not happen to
gold. And it is artificial, unbacked money and
credit, once it is spawned out across the world,
that ebbs and flows by the billions and trillions,
thus distorting and manipulating the economies of
the world's nations. Once this spreading cancer is
set in motion, the economies and countries grow
increasingly out of balance, and ultimately out of
control. And it almost always starts showing up in
an obvious way with with currency instability,
which was the root of the problem to begin with -
unreal currencies. Just ask the hundreds of
thousands of Asians who have just been laid off,
or reduced to 30% of their previous income, almost
overnight.

The ignorance, misconceptions and confusion
grow, because we seem to live in enduringly good
times. And the BIG LIE  that artificial money
created out of nothing is real money -- has had
generations of time to take root: in our institutions
of higher learning, in the board rooms of our most
brilliant corporations, at the family dinner table
discussions of what we studied in school today,
and in the not so noble halls of government offices
across our fair land. What we have failed to
understand, or have forgotten, is that the basic
standard, the unit of a nation's money -- the
medium of exchange and store of value -- is the
foundation of, and the fundamental building block,
upon which, a nation's entire economy is built. It is
essential for this unit, this standard of money, to
be freely, willingly , and universally acceptable
because it is stable, real, and can be trusted, by
any and every one.

Historically only gold money, or money and credit
units convertible to and backed by gold, have
endured as real money, immune to both inflation
and deflation. Gold is independent and free of
manipulation and control by any governmental
powers and special interests. John Adams' words
of 200 years ago are just as timely and important
today: "All the perplexities, confusions and
distresses in America arise, not from defects in the
Constitution or confederation, not from want of
honor or virtue, as much as from downright
ignorance of the nature of coin, credit and
circulation."

Real money, gold, endures as stable and trusted
currency, regardless of governments that rise and
fall, and economies that go through there natural,
moderate, non-manipulated cycles of economic
summer and economic winter. Politicians resist
gold-based money, because it strictly limits them,
and disciplines their lust for power and control,
along with their intimate banking friends. This
means that economies no longer remain in
balance, and ultimately, over-extended economic
summers, are followed by inevitable, and very
painful economic winters. All of this excess to
excess, is unnecessary, and would be avoidable, if
a gold standard money system were established
and honored, among the community of nations.

The brilliant Ludwig von Mises, of the Austrian
School of Economics put it this way: "The
eminence of the gold standard consists in the fact
that it makes the determination of the monetary
unit's purchasing power independent of the
measures of governments. It wrests from the
hands of the "economic czar" their most
redoubtable instrument.. It makes it impossible for
them to inflate. That is why the gold standard is
furiously attacked by all those who expect they will
benefit by bounties from the seemingly
inexhaustible government purse." ( The truth and
wisdom from this master-teacher of true
economics, might help us better understand why
there has been so much media coverage of
reported central bank gold sales, the last year or
two. )

Now, the last several decades of mushrooming
credit-creation world-wide, has led to a debt-ridden
international economy with careening markets and
collapsing paper currencies. This debt-ridden,
artificially propped up, international economy is
symptomized by over-built real-estate, with grossly
inflated values. World-wide, property values are
beginning to feel the effects of spreading deflation.
The recent deflationary free-fall in Hong Kong
property values, will likely spread next to Japan
and China. The deflationary world economy is like
a Titanic, and their are never going to be enough
IMF buckets to bail her out.

Also symptomatic of this international economy
beginning to mire in debt and growing deflationary
momentum, is the overcapacity of industrial and
technological production. This has resulted from
first of all, a glut of easy credit for the asking, and
now, the world is not only awash in red-ink, but
also in a glut of goods and services that most
people don't want, and fewer and fewer can really
afford. These kinds of glaring symptoms are the
recipe for spreading, world-wide deflation, with
ominous implications. When desperate Asian
nations want to import new cars to sell here at half
last year's prices, the protectionism, trade barriers
and trade-wars will be looming right behind.

For lifeboats, we best look to the historical lessons
of gold: gold unassailable, real money, and gold as
a haven of capital preservation in times of
economic crisis and currency turmoil. We got
ourselves into this mess by allowing our
governments and special interests to divorce our
money from gold backing and convertibility. At one
time, our currency was originally as good as gold,
a virtual receipt for real money. It was even
printed, right there on each and every U.S. piece
of currency: "payable to the bearer on demand in
gold". It's enough to make our grandparents
generation roll over in their graves.

Deflation happens to artificial currencies and credit
instruments at certain times, just as inflation does
at other times, because they can be controlled and
manipulated by the powers that be. Naturally
stable economies, based on real money, are
immune to inflation and deflation, and the powers
that be -- their hands are tied, by the immunity of,
and independence of gold. I have an early 1930s'
chart of HM overlaying the DJIA. In 1973, I was
giving economics seminars in the SF Bay Area
entitled: "What Makes the U.S. Economy
Tickand Why it is a Ticking Time-Bomb." The
economy's turned out to have a longer fuse than
I'd figured/surmised, at that time. But now, the fuse
is, indeed, running out. From early 1930 to 1932
Homestake Mining appreciated approximately
500% while the Dow was crashing in wave after
deflationary wave, wiping out the livelihoods and
fortunes of millions who never knew what hit
themsort of the way growing numbers of
people are feeling in Asia. And the "Asian
Contagion" is spreading, regardless of our
self-absorbed, insular, wishful thinking.

Admittedly the U.S. government called in
( confiscated ) the American people's gold in the
early '30s - at the old price at about $20/oz.; and
then our President FDR 'pegged' it at $35/oz. He
was stuck between a rock and hard-place, and this
no doubt helped the HM price along its bull market
way. But I wouldn't wait for another confiscation, or
another FDR. The new baby bull market in gold is
here, now. And before its over, there's going to be
quite a stampede. All those mutual fund holders of
the '80s & '90s, will not be able to get out of the
same 'sell' door at the same time; it could get very
messy, interesting, but messy.


Ultimately, after the current painful but cleansing
cycle runs its course, there will be a new dawn,
and new day. The peoples of the nations of the
world, their governments and bankers included,
will at last return to the discipline and integrity of
gold-redeemable money, and gold-backed and
gold-defined credit instruments. These will be the
basic monetary building-blocks, the life-giving
ingredients -- like a healthy, renewed, purified
economic blood-stream -- that will be the
foundation for new and flourishing economies.
This will come, in a new millennium of economic
nation building, in which a thriving world economy
will create and produce enough for all peoples,
everywhere.

May all peoples, of every nation, creed and color,
have an equal opportunity to contribute; and enjoy
the fruits of their work, and their entrepreneurial
talents. May we all learn to live in a new world, in a
cooperative while yet competitive, international
community of nations, committed to the dignity of
the human soul, the inherent freedom of the
human spirit, and the sanctity of human life.

David Blair Macrory

2 February 1998


Back to Gold
Editorials



Copyright  1997 & 1998 vronsky and westerman

GM

CRB would be positive if Gold were even, they have to support the markets some how, so take Gold down again.

CL N8
July Crude Oil Light
1520
+35
+2.4
1525
1470
56.7K
HO N8
July Heating Oil
4037
+37
+0.9
4080
3925
24.7K
HU N8
July Gasoline Unleaded
5102
+95
+1.9
5110
4970
19.4K
NG N8
July Natural Gas
2170
+99
+4.8
2175
2105
31.2K
CR A0
Commodity Research Bureau Index
21577
-13
-0.1
21653
21576
0
This is not normal, Oil up and Gold down?

HighRise

I would have to think scenario #2 is more likely. People invest
in what they invest in for a couple reasons. To accumulate
savings, to make speculative gains, and to preserve accumulated
wealth.

Those who wish to preserve accumulated wealth always look for
prudent, perhaps conservative, ways to avoid risk. If the markets
get risky enough ( and I believe they will ) to jeopardize the
value of the dollar, thes people will have no recourse but to
go to precious metals, gems, and other real assets.

The town is Willimantic ( affectionately known as "Willy" ) . They are pretty innovative there. To keep the cost of town parades low they have a "Boom Box Parade" The town radio station plays the marching music and everyone carries a Boom Box tuned to the station as they march. Saves big bucks on brass polish and gets their name in the paper every year.

Who wudda thunk that Disney would have put out a film that coined the term, "Tar Baby".

Speaking of Disney, I suppose the market caps of 2 of the largest companies in the US could be sold in exchange for all the Gold in the World CB's. I guess that kind of shows the irrationality of valuations.

Money Barons will never rid themselves of Gold. CB sales are IMO a shell game--get rid of the stuff before the populace clamours that you use it to defend the fiat. Of course by getting rid of it, they secretly sell it to themselves. Maybe if the Rockefeller Family Trust were audited, we might just find that they, among others, are the recipients of the CB sales.

Or maybe they will wait til gold is in private hands and then confiscate it back.

For Gold to have value to a Robber Baron, it must be to some extent circulated and valued by the people. Think of Thurston J Howell on Gilligan's Isle. His money was useless paper, but even if he & his wife had a ton of gold on that isle, and the other 5 had none or were prohibited from having it, what value would his gold really have? I mean, What good is money ( to a king ) , if he can't spend it?

"When the credit bubble in America bursts, so too will the bubble in stocks."

"The time is nigh approaching when America's great credit-fueled
stock market will come to a sudden and inglorious halt. When it
does, economists will no doubt hasten to point their fingers at a
great number of undeserving suspects while the real
culprit-excessive credit-will remain hidden from the eyes of the
public as the real cause of America's second Great Depression."

Market expert makes insightful observations - Remember, you must delete the extra letters "en" in the word "golden" before pasting the URL to your Internet locator:
http://www.golden-eagle.com/gold_digest_98/droke060198.html

The XAU/Spot Ratio has fallen below its 50, 100 and 200 day moving averages.

Today's collapse in gold is IMHO extremely negative. I'm going to buy more toys. I don't have a clue as to how to invest.

trying to "keep the money in the local economy". But, it seemed to indicate that it had some sort of "official blessing" One guy got his paycheck in "Willy" dollars. What is to stop another local entity ( say
NYC ) issuing its own currency ? Or Dallas, or Houston, etc.?
If I hadn't been watching Kitco for last six months, I would have thought it was just a local event but I took it as more than that.

What is our next support level for XAU and spot gold???

should it go through-he who has the money wins. Meaning we give up lots of rights to the banks and big companies. Very technical white paper available $30 by calling 360-288-2652. Ask about Vol 1,2,&3 of Global Triage Report. Also 2hr tape interview at $15. He is advisor to selected Gov't reps on subject.

I'm sort of fuzzy on interpreting MA,S ON xau/spot ratio.

How good or bad is it .
Does this suggest a fall in both or that physicals will lead the stocks on the next leg up ?

Y.O.S.


TAR BABY

Tsclaw: I think we are in a kind of noman's land here with no support before 280.

The S&P futures have started what will be a two week, or likely more, slide in prices which will take it down to the 1050 area, or lower, perhaps much lower.
T-Bonds will stop their price increase this week, and turn lower late this week or early next week.
Gold and silver are near the lows for this move, and will turn up for a nice trading move, before heading lower than today's prices.
The Canadian Dollar has likely reached it's low for this move, and will move upward for a nice trading move, before also turning down and going lower than it's recent lows.
How is that for sticking my neck out?

That could well be, it is very difficult to project the future
since so much of the far future depends upon the outcome of
near future events that themselves can only be dimly percieved.

The rate of events proceeds at an ever accelerating pace so that
if one uses the past as a guide one tends to underestimate the
rapidity with which current events can occurr, so if anything I
have underestimate the sharpness and compression of timescale.

I believe that the global economy is today in the fix it is
because in a world of central banks there is no central bank.
That is too say that since each currency attempts to maintain
it's own effectiveness they each become individually vulnerable
to external forces. Think what it would be like if each of the
states had it's own economy and we had to worry about strenght
in the New York guilder or weakness in the Arkansas Razorback.
Money would flee from the weak states to the strongest state and
no single state would be able to withstand economic chaos.

The Federal Reserve pays much attention to US economic strength
but with little consideration of the effects of its policies on
global economies.

To achive any kind of long term stability there needs to be some
more global mechanism or mangement of world economys. I don't
think that's going to happen in my lifetime. We have spent millions
of years in evolving and searching for Utopia and no one has found
it yet.

Who would be in charge of a world currency, a Global Reserve, so to
speak? The French would demand that they be in charge. The Russians
would refuse to cooperate. The Japanes would withdraw in a huff and
the Pakastanis wouldn't want to be involved with anything the Indians
had anything to do with.

Hell, half those guys don't even know why they are in the fix they are
in let alone hoe to cure it.

No, my friend, there may be ashes for something to arise from but I
fear it won't be any organized or perhaps even desireable thing.

Everyone has their neck stuck out, it's just that not
everyone knows it.

All quote services are down. What's going on?

I have the same feeling. Maybe the best place to be right now is in ( gulp ) cash..

Monday June 1, 3:07 am Eastern Time

Politics delay '98 PGM exports -Norilsk

MOSCOW, June 1 ( Reuters ) - A shake-up in Russia's government in the last few months has helped delay 1998 exports of platinum group metals ( PGMs ) , the deputy chief executive of Russia's main producer Norilsk Nickel ( NKEL.RTS ) told journalists at an investment conference on Monday.

Asked about Russia's PGM exports, which have been suspended since last December, Yevgeny Yakovlev said, "I'm not very positive on the way things are being processed in the Russian government. It concerns that issue ( PGM exports ) as well."

President Boris Yeltsin sacked his entire government at the end of March, and wrangling with the opposition-dominated parliament held up confirmation of the new prime minister Sergei Kiriyenko  and other key decisions -- for almost a month.

Yakovlev said the politically sensitive process of approving 1998 PGM exports had also been delayed by the government shake-up.

"This issue was delayed for another month or two," Yakovlev said. Asked what the outlook for exports was, he told Reuters, "It's difficult to say." Russia accounts for 60 percent of the world's palladium needs and one fifth of its platinum consumption. Norilsk produces almost all of Russia's PGMs.

Although both a presidential decree and a government order setting out quotas for exports have been signed, export licenses and other technical documents have yet to be signed.

so why has platinum not taken off? anybody??

Maybe?, like I say I don't have a clue.

This site working: http//www.qs.secapl.com/cgi-bin/qs

This is CRAZY..

The Sun Sets on Modern Society, Yes? Free download. It works. I like it ( the screensaver ) .

Hope you didn't have any trouble with tornado last. Been here about 30 years and used travel your country frequently. Had some buddies at Meat Camp. My old sour mash man died out, but the Stanbury crowd is still there. Great trout fishermen. Give me a hollow when you can Charlie 704 433 6473

RANGY still 3/32 above last weeks low. If this holds up its a good sign. If it doesn't I'm going to start listening alot closer to John Disney.

Some of the services have been down today.
Yahoo +Bloomberg
Y2k bug???

June 1st fiscal rollover???

http://www.silkmoth.com/download/y2k.htm

I have the Dow after opening down 10 quickly reversed and is up 52 points.

Live chart at http://fast.quote.com is working.

Try this: http://www.secapl.com/cgi-bin/qs

Some of the Jap work on quakes has been translated, a little rough to get, but most has not last I heard. Maybe the quake center can dig up some of this- I'll try it. Have you ever heard of EQL's? That's earthquake lights- almost as good as the northern lights and a lot closer. I could give a rough description of appearance and cause, but I need to freshen up a bit. Let you know what quake center says, Charlie

To avoid confusion I must add, that my conception of deflation is the same as Prechters. From The Tidal Wave:"When the end of the deflation arrives, a swift shift to gold will be essential. Its low will present the buy of a lifetime, your last chance to put wealth into the form of real money at an advantageous price."

JM

Yesterday, Skylark indeed posted a "thought-provoking commentary!" However, he inadvertently left out the due credits. The insightful and erudite analysis of the Asian Contagion is THE VERBATIM WORK of the globally-acclaimed market analyst, JOHN KUTYN. Unfortunately, Skylark copy/paste rendition was flawed by transmission errors, resulting in misspellings. The unblemished treatise is called " Currency Chaos and Financial Collapse," - and may be found at following URL - you need to delete the extra letters "en" in the word "golden" before pasting the Internet address to your web locator:

http://www.golden-eagle.com/asian_corner/kutyn111597.html

Yesterday, Skylark indeed posted a "thought-provoking commentary!" However, he inadvertently left out the due credits. The insightful and erudite analysis of the Asian Contagion is THE VERBATIM WORK of the globally-acclaimed market analyst, JOHN KUTYN. Unfortunately, Skylark copy/paste rendition was flawed by transmission errors, resulting in misspellings. The unblemished treatise is called " Currency Chaos and Financial Collapse," - and may be found at following URL - you need to delete the extra letters "en" in the word "golden" before pasting the Internet address to your web locator:

http://www.golden-eagle.com/asian_corner/kutyn111597.html

I apologize.

All: This can only mean that there is a 'paper' crisis somewhere. Russia? Japan? South America? SEASia?
From another point of view, I think gold has bottomed at about $280/oz. If you think about it for a minute, given the rather strong bear market we have had in gold for two years, it may take gold some time to come around. Perhaps we will touch bottom one or two more times before gold starts to rally -- in a big way. We may not like what is happening to the world when it does.
In a few days, we may have another gold bottom. RJ is right about one thing -- there is alot of gold to be leased or sold out there. The CB's do not need to stop at 8000 tonnes of gold loans if they are facing oblivion -- paper-wise. If we go below $280/oz, heaven help us! I think dropping gold prices and a stock market blowoff are both in the same category -- a sign of paper burning -- soon.
R Rubin's idea of letting the US dollar rise so that Japan gets a better deal for their exports is foolish -- as it encourages China to devalue, and worsens the effect of dropping gold prices.
Things are getting really wild -- as someone said this morning -- strap yourself in!

Sadly, gold stocks have been generally hazardous to one's wealth for the past two-plus years that I've been watching. Thought we'd turned the corner in January, but have revised that opinion over the past 2-3 weeks. Earlier this year I decided not to let a stock drop more than 15% below what I paid, after some bad hits in 1997. Adhering to that "rule", did some selling early this morning and will hold cash until a more positive environment for Au emerges. Overall markets look pretty sick too IMHO, notwithstanding the Dow being up this morning. Good luck!

Gold index off 32. BUT the rand
has fallen to 5.21. My son the soothsayer
predicted 5.3 when it was 4.6. My switch
to dollars was good for me.
Rangy is equivalent of 7/8. Durban
did pretty well considering. Closed
at 14 rands which is $2.7. My conversions
went through on the preferred.
I sold off some deeps - 10% .. will
do more tomorrow. Rand cash is now
yielding 17%. When we clear 5.3 to
$ .. I will move dollars back in.
Harmony was off to 21 rands today ..
that makes $4.03. I will buy it as I
said before for $3.25.
Soothsayer says gold 250/280.
Plats could take a hit to 310/325.
You think he's crazy ??? I used to.
Now I dont.

Check gcq8 - Aug. I think they're rolling over to this from gcm8

Gold has been nothing but a DOG.. to put it mildly.

Gold is down on rumors Russia is selling to help support its currency.
USAGOLD has a pretty good summary of this mornings big dive.
Frankly, I'm more worried about Russia selling military equipment over gold. Right now, they could make a lot more on a long range missle than an oz. of gold.

I think it's just a matter of being in the midst of chaos
even as we speak. Desperate central banks here and there
are going down the tubes even as we speak. Their first
instinct is to support their currency, so they sell off all
the reserves they can in order to do so.

Many long turn trends end with either a feeding frenzy if it
has been a bull trend or a swoon if it was a bear trend, and
it has been a long long bear trend in gold so we would kind
of expect something dramatic.

Better keep that boy happy. Anybody is entitled to one bad call. Maybe his is coming- hope not, Charlie

All: The Mexico index has been in free fall for weeks ( MEX ) . Down again today. I think we must watch South America closely for the answer to our gold bear -- may not just be threats of Russian gold sales.

The only system that will ever give mankind the opprotunity for a fighting chance to escape the "necescity" for the depressive cycles you describe is a system that is relatively immune from inflation & where international trade isn't predicated on a "begger thy neighbor" system where the softest money & the dirtiest float obtains an unfair trading advantage, a system that is not based on a security or a promise to be a store of value. It must be based on an asset that is both steady in it's supply & not inherently subject to any national monopoly.
America & now Japan have inflated the world & now it having reached it's point of equilibrium expansion must now contract, like exhaling & inhaling.
The collapse of Britton Woods makes clear that no country can be trusted to be the world's monopoly banker. A post Britton Woods world of floating exchange rates proves that national ambitions & politics make currency cooperation more imagiary than real. All countries must be fixed to the same polar star or all orbits will continue to endlessly collide.
Alan Greenspan knows this. The whole world knows this.
It's just a question of stopping the world so sanity can get off.
A.G. can not stop the world, but he would know how to fix it if the fiat system truly collapsed. A.G. is no FDR who would find a way to scuttle it before it's natural demise, like the isolationism prior to Pearl Harbor or the bank hollidays prior to solemnly declaring the emergency status that covered confiscation & devaluation.
I know it sounds silly to think of it in such simple terms, but when you know both the cause & the cure to any crucial problem, it by necessity will come to pass, being the mother of all inventions, or re-discoveries for that matter !
America is truly a paper Tiger. We will defend our own shores, but do you think we will send the marines to the southern Korea or Malaysia or any where else to collect the debts owed to the money center Banks ? They are hopping mad & are totally unable to repay the money center banks. Debt things will collapse & something will have to take it's place that is not based on the decrepit power of a conventional toothless Tiger. We don't even have a missil shield that would prevent or deter a third world country like China from holding a 1/3 of our economy hostage to attack. If Pakistan has the bomb, how long before it is leaked to it's moslim brothers in Iraq & Syria ?
We are reaching a point of proliferation saturation where all nuclear & conventional threats will be neutralized. The US is already in stale mate with th rest of the world. How long will it be able to hold the world hostage to it's dominating currency ?

Something's got to give & when the debt fiasco predicated on the USD comes tumbling down, perhaps the world will look collectively to a system that does not require trust or bondage to assure a level playing field or fair result.
It does require a paradigm shift back to the future.

Y.O.S.


TAR BABY

Seems like somebody up there did the same thing over 200 years ago. Was it the Pine Tree? Charlie

Yet another 'timely' story about Nazi Gold....

http://www.msnbc.com/news/169605.asp

Fresh Chickens on sale and Pick'nPay for 7.95 Rand per
KILO .. thats 7.95/5.21 = $1.53/kilo or $ 0.69 per
pound. This sounds like 1965 prices.
I bet no one can find a cheaper chicken than THAT ..
Even Aikido Man cant find one cheaper .. not even in
Chickenola.

I thoroughly agree with what you say, except that I am a
bit more cynical with respect to the final outcome. Will
wiser heads prevail? Or emotional zealots. From the ashes
of chaos in the past have risen many Hitlers but few
Camelots.

And what happens if somehow the US economy survives this
while all others crash and burn? There's nothing like living
in a castle in a poor neighborhood to make a person rest
uneasy at night.

I am hoping for the wiser heads, but I am keeping my door
locked at night.

I paid .47/lb in Boston area a few wks ago, also frozen swordfish at $3.97/lb. IMHO food is relatively cheap, produce most expensive, cost of eating out is going up.

I'm not much on hollywood, so I must have missed something. What's Tar Baby? I hope it's from Uncle Remus- one of if not my best favored philosophers. Thanx

Kitcat: Couldn't get into your post. What I'd really like to learn about is the boatload of ( Nazi? ) gold that went to the US. Perhaps it really belonged to the BIS, and that is what they have over us. The BIS has some kind of leverage of the US for some kind of unpaid debt -- going back to before the 70's.

proper accommodations must be made and then the August arrivals, never ending giving, so very thankful to be alive and bring kindness to so manyTRULY a privalegealso anything I can do for people attending the August Kitco festivities, simply let me know what I can do for you and I WILL do my utmost to make your stay comfortable...PROMISE...I WILL...

To Anyone ..
Isnt the gold used in teeth in some
alloy form. How was it purified for
use as ingot gold .. Isnt pure gold
a bit soft to use in teeth ??

To Rube ..
Believe there may be less ounces in
the Boston pound.

Sorry late: don't stay out just to make LGB prediction of the week wrong.
People on this site are grown-ups. If anybody invested in anything because of your posts it was, I hope, in full awareness of the risks involved otherwise they deserved the loss.

You guessed it. "Song of the South" by Walt Disney. In it Uncle Remus tells of how Brer Rabit gets thrown into the tar pits......and the Tar Baby.....

I guess you never heard about Le Marquis de Lafayette .

'beggar' nation controlled by Gangster's, Mafia and prostitutes.
These corrupt entities are milking the last drops left in Mother Russia's bosom.

Somebody may be acquiring / amassing all the Gold sold by the public and Govt ( s ) in Asia, Eastern Europe and S.America cheaply. Is there some way to know WHO WERE THE BIG BUYER'S OF GOLD SOLD RECENTLY BY ASIANS, RUSSIANS AND CB'S. If we know this, it may be easier to figure out future movements in POG. Why is it that the BUYER is never disclosed, I have spent countless days here and have read numerous accounts of CB and other sales, BUT NEVER ONCE HAVE I READ HERE ABOUT ANY BIG BUYER THAT HAS BOUGHT LARGE AMOUNTS OF PHYSICAL BULLION. More Gold is traded EVERY DAY in paper in LME/Comex than exists on this planet. But this paper traders are only Gamblers, Wall St. shyster's, Sting Operators etc.
WE NEED TO KNOW WHO IS BUYING BIG PHYSICAL AND THEN PERHAPS WE WILL KNOW ENOUGH TO STOP THIS CONSTANT BLEEDING OF OUR LIMITED RESOURCES...

I request members of this esteemed forum to find this out for our mutual financial benefit.

Bought chicken ( leg quarters ) at 37 cents a pound, special
at Basha's supermarkets in Phoenix AZ yesterday ( 10 lb. bags ) .

Full circle. I saw that when it first came out in the 30's. I thought there may be a new one. Yeah, ole Br Rabbit is really cool- not like the monkey on the street car tracks. Uncle Remus ought to be required reading for all traders. If this doesn't make sense, read some. I have an original Joel Chandler Harris 1889 edition. Constantly refer to it. Great laughs- it's human nature. Thanx, Charlie

http://www.drudgereport.com/1.htm

During the Depression hundreds of communities and corporations issued scrip. Its use was outlawed. Your comment was the first I heard about its recent use. Let me do some research.

This is 16k stuff for the dentist. You can refine same way Harmony does. Put it in the pot and flux, then use any of several standard methods to bring it to 999.95. At that time, it was probably aqua regia to dissolve and when precipitated, there are a couple of further refinements to get 999.95 or run it thru 2 or 3 times with a/r.

free range? the ones here are frozen Tysons ( Bills Buddy ) I would not touch them at any price

Asia melting, Russia, Brazil too. S&P overnight was mostly down until just before the opening. Dow is up 60 points, but Adv/Dec is slightly negative on NYSE and well negative on AMEX and NASDAQ.

One of these days the PPT ( or other manipulators ) are going to get caught when everyone is convinced that this time it really is different.

In the not so distant future, a Dow component like Kodak will perhaps report a $Billion loss, and Abbey Cohen will tell everyone that based on the P/E for the year 2010, Kodak is a screaming buy, but just maybe the people won't listen.

We use scrip out here as a fund-raising activity. Stores issue scrip, which charities buy for 96 to 98% of face value. They sell it at full price to their supporters, who then shop at that store. I could see this idea working for a town. Just give the difference to the shopper. It's legal, but then, the original scrip is purchased in USD. Not quite as it sounds.

and it's here.

Why the confusion with the slumping gold price? The yen is dropping and as the giant economy of Asia it will have a bigger impact than S.Korea , Indonesia...recall each time one of these countries was hit, gold dived. Gold is the barometer to the WORLD economy not the the US. The writing is on the wall...the world economy is sick, sick...worse than it has been in 70 years, gold merely reflects this.
Only when the DOW/dollar begins to wilt will gold go up in dollars. Already gold is appreciating in most world currencies...if you have access to US cash that's the place to be but beware for the change may come fast and remember it's only paper. The lower gold goes the longer and more severe will be the panic, depression, recession....pick your poison.
If you're in already take heart that one day gold will rise well above these depressing levels...price gold in year 2000 dollars not todays sick money and set about preparing yourself for an economic winter. The farmer's seeds in the shed are more valuable than any paper, gold is seed for the new economy that must be rebuilt.
Time to stock up on VALUABLES.

Sounds awfully suspicious. What if that gold was in payment for war materials!! gold from whom and war materials for whom!!!??? Scary as hell

I wouldn't put it past FDR!!

http://www.newsday.com/ap/rnmpne1f.htm

The way I am reading the XAU/Spot ratio is that it is in neutral territory, trending down toward a buying opportunity of the XAU. Being below the 200 day MA seems to indicate it is a serious drop.

Where is "outhere". If it's Mo., Kan. Ill. area- you got a big one that's rumbling a little-New Madrid Fault. A bad history. Let me know. Don't feel bad, I live within 15 miles of the biggest known fault here- the Brevard. It's 1/2 mile wide here and runs from the Gulf of Mex to Nova Scotia with plenty of splits. Hold on

We supped on US$0.29/lb chicken last night! The price was remarkable, and a topic of conversation. We pluck this new market together, yes?

How could a country with the wealth of Russia ( farmland, natural resources ) and that not too many years ago had no debt, be on the verge of collapse?

Welcome to the world of Usury.

And when the IMF loans money to these Gangsta's, do TNC's get exploration rights, marketing rights etc?

And when these so called socialist countries privatise something, why don't they just issues shares to citizens, and then let the people sell the shares if they want? Not these "nod & a wink, secret handshake" kind of deals.

Do they think the public is that stupid?

I think yes, and they're probably right.

chas: I don't know details, but near the end of the war their was a train that the US commandeered. As I recall there were many tons of gold on it. I do not know what happened to this gold, but it was rumored that somehow it found its way to the US. In those days, the safest place for gold would have been the US, I would think. The question remains -- it may have been gold that belonged to the BIS or the Rothschilds.

Perhaps all these years the BIS has been hanging this over our heads. Shipping invoices, etc? That would make much more news than the Nazi gold sent to Switzerland. Of course, after these years, it is doubtful that anyone would believe the BIS -- but perhaps the threat of disclosure is still effective. ( This is all hearsay, but needs investigation ) .

The next question is -- if this actually happened, where is the gold now? Spent? Not part of the safekeeping bullion stocks at the NY Fed?

There is another reason why the Swiss are bearish on gold right now. They don't want to be left all alone with the rest of the world in deflationary collapse. Hence they must talk gold down, even if they do not wish to sell it. But -- this postponement of the inevitable cannot last much longer -- can it?

You might be thinking about the Charter Oak. In 1634, after the King of England issued a Charter to establish Connecticut, he had second thoughts and sent Sir Edmond Andros over to get the Charter back. At at meeting to discuss the return of the Charter someone "accidently" knocked over the candle and when the lights were out grabbed the Charter and hid it in a hollow oak tree. The King never got it back. The tree was still standing about 75 years ago. I know who stole the Charter but am sworn to secrecy.

Mr Midas, I Agree --- EXPOSE THE BIG BUYERS OF GOLD -----

That will present the "weight of the evidence" for the future POG!

http://www.opengroup.com/open/aabooks/087/0873410475.shtml

Agreed. Seems to me I read a post last fall late that had a real helluvamess over this but can't remeber the post. That post had this gold definitely nazi and there was some squabble , hushed a little, about who owned it and when it came. If Harry Hopkins had anything to do with it, and I would bet he was the bulldogger, then you can bet it was very ( worst word you can think of ) bad. Have changed computers since then, but maybe I can get a lead somewhere. This really needs some attention. Thanx, Charlie

http://www.abcnews.com/onair/worldnewssaturday/index.html

http://www.transaction.net/money/gc/gc01.html

once again they got handed thier heads,called Robert Rubin who bailed them out with US tax payer funds.....

I wonder how many people being will saying the same thing about the US and the Dollar in a couple of years.

"They had everything. Natural Resourses, Strong workforce, the only 'reserve currency, and so much more. How could they be on the verge of collapse now."

Corruption, power and greed can, and will, bring the strongest to thier knees eventually.

These are not new charts; they were created as of the date in the title.

The projection line is calculated based on the past so the match is fairly good. Several people have misunderstood and thought that the projection was made at the beginning of the data shown and the actual turned out to be a near perfect fit which they surmised to be impossible.

While my current projections are slightly different than these old ones, I wanted to point the charts out since what they show as the future is close to what is now happening. My current projections are not materially different.

My conclusion is that if you are in gold shares you must enjoy pain. Even if you were in the stock market with a reasonable spread in you holdings you are only likely to lose 30% in the impending correction before the bull resumes. In gold shares you stand to lose 90%+ before a genuine turn in direction.

http://www.pcis.net/jeannev/hmda.gif
http://www.pcis.net/jeannev/spda.gif

I'm sure you would never tell. This ones goes on the wall. What I had in mind was the coin, I think, that had"Don't Tread on Me..". But the Charter Oak is better- real representative of the area. Thanx, Charlie

( UGH ) .......is it a buy?

http://chart5.bigcharts.com:80/report?r=cobrand&site=avidtrader&onbad=cobrandsymb&symb=bost&time=7&uf=0&sid=11488&sec=c&xyz=18468969&s=14719

-------------------------------------

looks like a bargain to me.............

away.......to eat some chicken



I bought NO plat today........will w/w. JohnD's 'Genes' say to wait......so I'll wait. This blessed gold is holding up the works. Midas seems on the edge of the abyss..........step back Midas.......take a LARGE breath.................tomorrow is a new day......uh huh.

Where I live in Corbett, Oregon the school district has been issuing script for the last couple of years. They use it as a fundraiser. People buy the script at face value and then can use it at any participation local business. Since this is more of a fundraising program it isn't quite the same as the folks in Conneticut, but very similar. This helps the schools and keeps money in the community because only local businesses participate in the program.

Nazi Gold: The Untold Story

BY MICHAEL HIRSH


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

THEY WERE "A SORT OF CLUB," Thomas MicKittrick explained. Banking buddies, pals, confidants. He and Emil Puhl and Per Jacobsson. Theirs was a typical old-boy camaraderie of cigars and bar talk and walk along the quiet cobblestoned streets of Basel, Switzerland. It didn't seem to matter that the year was 1943, and they were an American, a Nazi and a Swede. Or that beyond their Swiss sanctuary, a hellfire was raging. Young men were dying by the tens of thousands. Jews packed into cattle cars were crisscrossing Europe toward slaughter, stripped of property that, in one form or another, was often funneled as loot through Switzerland. In fact, these genial clubmen don't appear to have been bothered by their complicity in that horror. They simply went about their work, helping to cash looted gold--gold that they must have known, as officers of the Bank for International Settlements, was stolen by the Nazis from treasuries and cities across Europe. Gold that financed both the war and the Holocaust.

There were a lot of people like that during World War II. Collaborationists, fifth-columnists, ordinarily people you would never think of as Nazis, such as McKittrick--president of the BIS, a blue-blooded Harvard man from St. Louis. Under his stewardship, the bank took in gold pirated by the Nazis and laundered it into currency--the Swiss francs and U.S. dollars that Berlin needed to buy raw materials and munitions. That was long ago. But like so many legacies of the war, this, too, still lives. Where did all that gold go? Is it still locked in Swiss bank vaults or somewhere else? And who are its rightful owners?

For years now, a great hunt has been underway for the supposed Nazi cache. Holocaust victims lay claim to some; so do national treasuries. Last spring the decades-old search took on a new urgency when families of Holocaust victims mounted an effort to reclaim accounts of their forebears held by Swiss banks ( NEWSWEEK, June 24, 1996 ) . And lately, for the first time, the quest has reached beyond the Swiss. Recently the Clinton administration created a commission to search for any Nazi funds that might have ended up in U.S. Federal Reserve vaults. "We have to be willing not only to focus the spotlight on Switzerland," says Under Secretary of Commerce Stuart Eisenstat. "We have to be willing to follow the trail of assets into our own treasury."

That trail, it turns out, leads to the likes of McKittrick. It also suggest that there is no huge stash of Nazi gold in Switzerland. An extensive NEWSWEEK probe discloses that after 50 years of financial sifting by central banks, the loot has scattered worldwide like the treasure of Sierra Madre. And it's probably almost as irretrievable. Perhaps more important, an examination of numerous wartime documents, including newly declassified allied memos and Swiss bank ledgers, makes it clear that it wasn't just the Swiss, the chief cashiers Nazi gold, who have something to hide. Many odd parties--neutrals, Allied governments and the ultrasecretive BIS--were involved in laundering Nazi funds or, after the war, withholding stolen assets.

By most reckonings, some two thirds of an estimated $660 million ( about $7.8 billion in today's dollars ) in stolen Nazi gold passed through Switzerland during the war. That's where the BIS comes in. Founded in 1930, the bank is a quasi-public institution known as the "central bank for central bankers." It never played a bigger role than during World War II, when its key clients were the German Reichsbank and the Swiss National Bank. The bank's president at the time, Thomas McKittrick, traveled freely to Berlin, hobnobbing with Emil Puhl ( a Reichsbank vice president and BIS delegate ) and almost doing business as usual. Thanks in part to McKittrick and the BIS, Germany's window to the outside financial world never closed.

Washington was outraged by McKittrick's behavior, and, in 1944, it tired unsuccessfully to close down the bank. It all but considered McKittrick a traitor. While the BIS bought little gold form the Nazis itself--a scant $15 million--it was a crucial facilitator, lending the laundering an aura of honor among thieves. "The BIS was a central transmission place where deals were struck, where the Portuguese representatives would meet the Reichsbank representatives," says Harold James, a Princeton University historian. And that's what kept money flowing into Nazi coffers.

Because so many banks were involved, the amount of gold left in Switzerland is probably negligible, contrary to what investigations have until now presumed. A British Foreign Affairs Office report made headlines last month by suggesting that the Swiss were still sitting on top of some $400 million in 1945 dollars. And U.S. Sen. Alfonse D'Amato, whose banking committee is investigating the issue, two weeks ago criticized postwar U.S. officials for accepting only a $58 million settlement from the Swiss in 1946.

Documents obtained by NEWSWEEK suggest that both D'Amato and the British are wrong. Like any sharp businessman with hot goods, the Swiss disposed of much of their gold quickly--through Portugal mainly, but also to Sweden, Spain and other central banks. Probably no more than $140 million remains unaccounted for, and a good portion of that was probably sold onward as well. Nuno Jonet of the Portuguese central bank in Lisbon confirmed that "we acquired a lot of gold coming from Germany because, as you know, we sold a lot of goods and services to Germany." Then he joked, "I suppose one or two bars are left with swastikas on them, but they're museum pieces."

No one's laughing, least of all Holocaust victims and other wartime plaintiffs who have filed reparation suits. Despite their mad scramble, the complainants are likely to be disappointed. They may find a few dormant bank accounts here or an extra piece of "residual gold" there, but what remains of the known nazi hoard is worth no more than about $65 million. That's what is on account at the Brussels-based Tripartite Gold Commission, set up after the war to return stolen gold to national treasuries.

None of this money has gone to the Jewish community, which rankles Edgar Bronfman, head of the World Jewish Congress. he has long been negotiating with the Swiss Bankers Association to retrieve dormant bank accounts of the Holocaust dead. "One of the things that bothers me is how blithe everyone was about Jewish property," says Bronfman. "it was 'The Jews are dead, so to hell with 'em.' It wasn't just the Swiss. That was the attitude of everyone"--the Americans, too.

It's a sad denouement, but Bronfman's not giving up. Last week, the WJC released declassified documents showing that the Allies found bags of gold tooth fillings and Passover goblets in a huge cache of Reichsbank gold--$293 million worth--at a salt mine near Merkers, in western Germany, a few days after V-E Day. The cache was mainly handed over to the Tripartite Commission, but has never been fully accounted for.

Nor has the BIS's wartime complicity. Washington forgave it as the cold war descended in the late '40s. In 1947, the Federal Reserve Bank of New York gave it a clean bill of health. McKittrick and his pals move on. Jacobsson became head of the International Monetary Fund, while McKittrick glided into a cushy post at the then Chase National Bank. His 1970 obit in The New York Times was respectfully headlined, T. H. MCKITTRICK, WORLD FINANCIER. Nothing about helping to finance genocide.

The Strategic Forecasting site is down, so I figured I would post the attached article rather than the link: These guys are bang on again. The masses get all worked up about India, then Pakistan, but it's Russia's meltdown that will change everybody's lives in significant ways.

Global Intelligence Update
Red Alert
June 1, 1998

Nuclear Buildup and Financial Meltdown: India, Pakistan and Russia

The past week had two major foci. The first was the decision by Pakistan
to demonstrate its ability to conduct underground nuclear tests. The
second was the sudden and fairly unexpected crisis in Russian financial
markets. The international community was transfixed by events on the
Indian subcontinent, while seeming to take the Russian crisis in stride.

From our point of view, the order of priority should be dramatically
reversed. The Russian events constitute a decisive, definitive event, even
in the history of a former superpower. The Indo-Pakistani events, while
appearing more dramatic, are actually a minor evolution rather than a
decisive break with the past.

It must be remembered that no one has doubted that both India and Pakistan
are capable of detonating nuclear devices. The fact that they have
detonated the devices has certainly attracted attention, but is merely a
statement of the obvious, this time with an exclamation point. The threat
of nuclear war on the subcontinent neither increased nor decreased because of these tests. The threat of conflict did increase when a new,
nationalist government was installed in India and played off against an
already established, nationalist government in Pakistan. But the mere
explosion of nuclear devices simply confirmed what everyone knew, which was
that both India and Pakistan had the ability to test weapons.

It is, of course, unclear that either country, especially Pakistan, has the
ability to deliver nuclear weapons. Even the availability of delivery
systems, such as aircraft and missiles, does not mean that either country
has the ability to marry their nuclear devices to the delivery system.
Creating a device that can explode in a cavern and creating a device that
can fit on a delivery system and be detonated over a target are two
different matters. Therefore, it is important to recall that we have seen
a demonstration of the ability to detonate nuclear weapons and not a
demonstration of the ability to deliver them as weapons of war.

But let's assume the probable, which is that both India and Pakistan have
the ability to deliver nuclear strikes at each other. This leaves us in
the same position we were in a month ago. At that time it appeared
probable that both India and Pakistan could deliver nuclear strikes against
each other if they wished. Today it appears probable that both India and
Pakistan can deliver nuclear strikes against each other if they wish. We
end this cycle of tests in the same position as we began it.

Indeed, what changes have occurred tend to argue against armed conflict
rather than for it. The Indo-Pakistani conflict, which is now a half-
century old, entered a new phase with the installation of the new Indian
government. The confrontation along the entire border, and in Kashmir in
particular, increased markedly. The probability of armed conflict
increased to some extent. However, even this was limited by military
realities. Pakistan's ability to engage and defeat the Indian army is
doubtful. Therefore, a full-scale assault on Kashmir is not in the cards.
The Indian army's ability to conduct extensive offensive operations also
has some limits. Moreover, India holds Kashmir and really doesn't covet
Pakistani territory. Since it is not clear that the dismemberment of
Pakistan is in India's long-term interest, the willingness of India to
launch a general offensive, were they to judge themselves able to carry it
out, has always been doubtful.

Therefore, while border skirmishes remain possible and even likely, all-out
war makes little strategic sense for either side. With the public
demonstration that nuclear weapons are a probable factor, the likelihood of
all-out war decreases rather than increases. The one strategic
possibility, an Indian invasion of Pakistan designed to secure India's
western frontiers permanently, ceases to be possible if Pakistan has
nuclear weapons. To be precise, the presence of nuclear weapons does not
abolish conventional conflict. However, it tends to decrease the
willingness of combatants to challenge the very existence of a nuclear
state, as that is the only rational circumstance under which the use of
nuclear weapons makes sense.

If the history of the nuclear era has taught us anything, it is that
nuclear powers tend to become more, rather than less, circumspect in their
use of warfare. Neither the Soviet Union nor the United States threatened
the very existence of the other, therefore, both sides refrained from using
nuclear weapons. Indeed, the circumstance when the use of nuclear weapons
seemed a real possibility was in Israel in 1973, when it appeared that
Israel's very existence was threatened by Syrian forces on the Golan
Heights. Once the limited capabilities and intentions of the Syrians
became clear, the nuclear threat passed. Other nuclear powers, including
the United States and the Soviet Union, endured substantial politico-
military defeats without resorting to nuclear weapons because neither had
its very existence at stake.

The real significance of nuclear weapons is diplomatic and psychological.
They are a tool for appearing to increase the stakes without increasing the risks. The very fact that India and Pakistan have focused the world's
attention on their subcontinent by doing fairly little, demonstrates the
utility of nuclear weapons in this regard. Not only is the United States
suddenly interested, but the apparent failure of the CIA to provide warning
of the blasts means that there will likely be a major shake-up in the
intelligence, defense, and diplomatic strata responsible for India and
Pakistan. This gives both countries added visibility in the U.S. analysis
and policy-making communities and marvelous opportunities for manipulation
as the bureaucratic struggle mounts in the coming months. They have gotten
the attention of the only country that counts. The real issue is what they
will each try to do with it. In the meantime, skirmishes will continue,
each side will practice brinkmanship and each side will court favor in
Washington.

The one danger is that the Indo-Pakistani conflict will be dragged into the
general Middle Eastern conflict. Iran has not had good relations with
Pakistan because of differences over Afghanistan. The Iranian Foreign
Minister will arrive in Pakistan on Monday to discuss these differences.
Pakistan now has something Iran badly wants. The entire dynamics of these
discussions could shift. The real issue is: is this a Pakistani bomb or an
Islamic bomb? The Iranians will be far more interested in the answer to
that question than in Pakistani relations with India. And so should we.


In the meantime, the collapse of the Russian financial markets was noticed,
but not sufficiently. This was not a transitory hit by foreign
speculators, but a massive vote of no confidence in Russian economic
policy. Foreign capital, which had stopped arriving in Russia, now is
withdrawing. The Russian Central Bank said that foreigners withdrew
between $500 million and $700 million from the government bond market
during the past two weeks. It said that foreigners held about one third of
the bank's outstanding instruments, about $20 billion. The total market
is valued at $60 billion. This would mean that the stampede out of the
markets was led by Russians, since we find it difficult to believe that a
withdrawal of about 1 percent ( $500million-$700million ) of the total market
could cause the market to crack.

In actuality, we suspect that the Russian Central Bank has no real idea as
to what happened over the past week, since its ability to track who holds
government bonds is limited. This also means that the RCB's brave
declarations that the ruble is in no danger because foreigners are staying
in the market, should comfort no one. There is no way that the Russian
markets crumbled as they did without major foreign liquidation. That means
there are a great many rubles in foreign hands still waiting to be
converted, and that the RCB's declarations that the ruble is in no danger
of devaluation is unsupported. Particularly given the weakness in the
energy-related markets, Russia's hard currency reserves must be dwindling.
The pressure to bring the ruble to more realistic levels is irresistible.
Without a currency crisis, the only alternative is a general financial
crisis. Given the Russian track record, we will probably see both.

The problem is that no one really knows the extent of the situation. As in
much of Asia, corruption and inefficiency beyond imagination have rendered
Russian financial statements meaningless. The state is spending money it
doesn't have, and its ability to raise money in foreign markets has become
doubtful. The crisis: what will the Russian state do for money? The
Russians have focused on tax collection, firing the old head of the service
and promising a complete overhaul, going after the largest companies first,
since they are also the largest deadbeats. The problem is twofold. First,
the entire economy has been built on tax evasion. Second, we suspect that
most of these enterprises couldn't pay their taxes, even if they wanted to.
After seven years of failing to deal with fundamental problems in the
economy, the Russians have hit the same brick wall as the Asians. This is,
of course, only phase one. The next sixty days will bring other calamities
galore.

As in Asia, we are brought to the social and political consequences. The
Russian economic problem, like the Asian economic problem, has become
insoluble. As the tax situation shows, even obvious reforms can't be
implemented. The question remaining is, how will Russian society respond?
We continue to feel that the massive failure of liberalization for all but
a narrow stratum of Russian society will lead to the return of traditional
Russian authoritarianism, both to contain unrest and to respond to it. We
expect the regime, with or without Yeltsin, to crack down on unrest while
focusing that unrest on the only group that can be dispensed with: foreign
bankers and their Russian allies. They can be dispensed with because they
are dispensing of themselves. No sane foreigner will invest in Russia
today. Their dilemma is how to get out in one piece. Blaming them for the
crisis is safe and well within the Russian tradition for coping with policy
failures. The real losers, of course, will be the Russian bankers who made
their living peddling their connections to Western banks. The lucky ones
already have their money in the United States. The rest will be driving
cabs in New York, if they are lucky enough to get out.

With repression, comes more traditional Russian foreign policy. Indeed,
one of the more interesting aspects of the Indo-Pakistani crisis is how the
Russians, traditional allies of India, will respond. As with the recent
Iraqi crisis, we expect Russia to place itself in a more familiar role than
it has in recent years: a thorn in the side of the United States. Next
week, the focus should still be on Russia and the subcontinent. We expect
it to be in a more rational ratio than this past week.

I don't like to pay the pessimist, but I think many posts are overly optimistic on gold. Like you, I thought back in January we were about to turn the corner. Now, I don't think gold will recover before lower prices are seen. I wouldn't be surprised to see it drop below $280 now. Below that, my guess is $250. I don't know where support is below $280; it's been too long for me to remember.

If we would remove our blinders and allow ourselves to be objective, it's obvious that nothing so far that has happened in the world the past couple of years or so has had any real impact on the price of gold in a positive sense. I'm sure there are many here on Kitco who can offer all kinds of erudite arguments to refute that statement, but the fact remains that gold is dead in the water and listing slowly.

Look at the facts. Our country ( the USA ) is rife with corrupt politicians, all the way to the top, the stock market is at absurd levels, debt is rampant, morality is below gutter levels, SE Asia is bankrupt, Japan is tottering on the brink, nuke testing by belligerant nations may escalate into real nuclear exchange; the list goes on. Many ( most? ) Americans perceive the government to be an enemy intent on controlling their lives at every turn.

WHAT will it take to cause gold to revive from its stupor? Maybe the Second Coming, but I doubt it. You wouldn't need it anyway, then.

I didn't intend for this post to run away like this. I guess I am as frustrated as I am sure a lot of others are.

Do they want to be completely at the mercy of the IMF/USG? Then again, I guess that the parasites will cling to power anyway way they can, as tempoary as that may be.

smile if you are........... ( smile ) .....

away........to sell some cotton 'holdings'



London Metal Exchange Copper Stocks have been falling
steadily over past month + a bit, but can't figure where they are going?
Look like one of Cananda's prolific Silver Producers
United Keno Hill is getting ready to rev-up. Check
Selby's post or go to http://www.newswire.ca to find out whats going on in Canada business in general.

company will not be able to acccess its credit facilities after June 3rd, as it is not "posting an average weekly net revenue of $18,000 per store
and therefore may violate its loan agreements". Company says no plans to file for bankruptcy protection. Be careful.

At 4 corners ( where 4 states meet, Colorado, Nevada plus 2 others ) . Friday police officer machine gunned down. On the weekend 1 more killed and 2 wounded. Over 100 FBI agents there, plus National Guard and others trying to find who did it. NO News on this in media. ?Would this have anything to do with Freeman trial going on in Billings, Montana?? Did you see any news on this??
And it is not in news there.
Uh Huh, it is being hushed.

Hiya EB --

What're you hearing about plat? short-term, mid-term? Talk to me.

Thanks! dj

The US Stock Market Crash Index calculated by the Ford Pitbull Investor organization has hit -8. An index reading of -10 is a "get out of equities" signal.

- Steve

.

4 corners killing are a big story here in Arizona ( one of the 4-corner states ) . It is belived to be militia-related and the search was centered in Durango Colorado last I heard.

.

4 corners killing are a big story here in Arizona ( one of the 4-corner states ) . It is belived to be militia-related and the search was centered in Durango Colorado last I heard.

BOST bought alot of their franchises back because revenues had dropped off compared to the company owned stores. They took on a massive amount of debt to buy the franchises back. They are in big trouble now because the business is dropping off more than it was before the buy back.

With the amount of debt they took on and the outlook for our economy for 6 months to a year from now I wouldn't touch it. Just my opinion!

One more thing,the restaurant sector of the market has already made its run-up and has been backing off for a couple months

From "The Spotlight"
http://www.spotlight.org/html/order.html

The bail-out of Russia by the IMF is puzzling to say the least.First , why pour money in a dry well ? Then, why save speculators as they will get encouragement from a to big to fail policy which will only slow the unescapable outcome ? I guess the altenative if to scary to contemplate.

However, the IMF argued this week- end that it has only 15 $bn in uncommited resources and 25 more in the cumbersome mechanism of the" general agreement to borrow". Hardly enough to cope with any new crisis of the magnitude of ASIA's.

As the IMF is out of money and the elected representatives in the US unwilling to commit much more money , new developments will be fun to watch.

Gold goes down, GOLD goes up ( not much lately ) Who cares?

Unless you scalp it , the conclusion will be the same. No sweat : Gold is out of favor and therefore about 300$ below its mean adjusted in $ over the last 600 years.When the tide turns ( and that is the interesting point )

it will overshoot the other way.

THANKS

Q. What does Disney Land and Viagra have in common ?
A. 2 hr. wait for a ride...

@ Steve in To; could you post the url for Pitbull crash alert ? TIA.

hi

Viagra works in 20-45 minutes trust me!

....did the same in re Mexico. I have a friend who was convinced Klinton had Mexican investments in his "blind trust". Others say Rubin was bailing out his cronies at his former place of employment.

I think we agree Bailouts don't help out the majority of the people of the given country.

Policy seems to be bankrupt them, give them loans to pay off the bankers, tie the new loans to opening up the country to Yankee onslaught of Citicorp & Coca-Cola.

and out-smarted by a bundle of lettuce, I still can't figure why anyone would mine gold, I find tons of it falling out of little children's ears.

The URL for the Pitbull Investor U.S. Stock Market Crash Index:

http://www.wwfn.com/crashupdate.html

- Steve

Only sick persons need it....

to depression..

Buddy can you spare a drumstick..

It's all down hill from here.

Chickens, viagra, and then someone posts "Hi".
Can Kitco get any more depressing?

Off with their heads! All of them - the chickens, the hardons, and most of all the beasties that post "Hi".

All over the media here-abouts:
http://www.denverpost.com/news/news0601e.htm

a stranger...

banks could not carry loan defaults on thier books for longer than 12 months,what did the banks do instead of writing off the loans,you guessed it lent them more money , so the dead beats could pay the interest on the loan thereby inabling US banks to carry over the debt for another year,this was how things were done before the Clinton Mafia moved into the WH

The same thing that's happening to Boston Chicken is happening to Ionica, a telephone start-up in Britain. They didn't make targets and now the banks are pulling their credit line ( Hundreds of millions ) , the stock price has come crashing down.

Looks like we are seeing the beginning of a liquidity crisis: 10 for 11. How can you pay back 11 when only 10 exist?

John D. "Chickens lead the way... to depression"

Is this mental, or economic, or both ( for gold investors ) ?

Several months back I put a host of limit orders in based on the YTD lows. Just pick up 10,000 shares of "Tan Range Exploration" and "Azco Mining"....

I feel good ....

Any feedback ...

TIA

"15 more words" and get told it does not exist. Just typing it in would be fine. Thanks.

You will get old one day too!

mine !

Thanks for the news
Have passed it on.

Agreed. The world is in huge trouble. The overdraft protection on the world's checking account is the IMF, and it is just about shot.

The hope for Gold may be Y2k. If that cannot revive gold, I don't know what can.

The International Economy is the Titanic, and the band is playing "Happy Days Are Here Again". A lot of us think the band should be striking up "Nearer My God To Thee" right about now.

.

The remarkable Son of Disney ( Duke Disney ) is agressively, and cleverly I might add, buying gold and RSA gold securities as we speak...unbeknownst to all, including his dear father...he will meekishly admit to this Wednesday. Tomorrow 'tis Turnaround Tuesday, uh huh. ( puff and gulp )

"Date: Sat May 30 1998 22:10
Servhard ( RETIRED SOLDIER.....wish I could be so young again...... ) ID#287193:
saw your post. S."

Now what?
Lets keep in touch.--re my post's meaning:
Some poeple need 'Theophylline'......I do...so..
I have a Dis..!..ease.! Or 'Goldfever'='Disease ( like today! )
Thank you,
S.

looking at its history. First, take a look at the great article by Orlin Grabbe: http://www.zolatimes.com/v2.16/gold1text.html

In a nutshell: the IMF started out as an organization that would maintain currency exchange rate stability under the Bretton Woods agreement of 1944. As strains began to develop in the gold-backed US dollar reserve system set up under that agreement a new role was proposed for the IMF- issuer of a new type of reserve, the Special Drawing Right. That role never really developed, and the SDR mechanism fell apart with the closing of the US$ gold window by Nixon and the subsequent abandonment of fixed exchange rates around the world.

During that time, however, mission creep was taking place at the IMF. They developed a role as advisors to collapsing third-world countries, and developed an informal authority of sorts, in that these basket-case countries couldn't obtain loans from firts-world lenders unless they followed IMF dictates. After 1974 there was nothing left for the IMF to do with regard to its original functions, but bureaucrats are well-trained in the art of finding something to do, whether that thing is useful or not. The OCED countries turned the agency into a sort of international lender of last resort for countries that were on the verge of economic breakdown.

THe IMF is run by ex-corporate bureaucrats for the benefit of the huge financial interests in OCED countries that are "too big to fail." You've often heard the proverb: "If you owe the bank ten thousand dollars and can't repay it, you have a problem; if you owe the bank ten billion dollars and can't repay it, the bank has a problem." Well, if you're the US government, and six of your biggest banks have loaned 60 billion dollars to say, Mexico, now the problem has become government-sized. Or suppose US, Japanese and European banks have loaned 200 billion to South Korea- a default could mean financial Armageddon ( to the big financiers, and the hundreds of thousands of employees- read voters- of those banks. )

Another way of putting it is that the IMF functions as a sort of depositor's insurance scheme for huge financial institutions, and the same perverse results happen on an international scale because of it. Lenders take huge, unwarranted risks, because on that grand a scale they know that governments will be forced to bail them out- and if they don't take the risks one of their competitors will, and crush them in the Darwinian world of international finance.

Of course, the corporate statists who run the IMF immediately impose their ideas of fiscal responsibility on the recipient countries, who have no options to resist. These prescriptions include tax increases, interest rate increases, price increases in those countries where prices are government-controlled and immediate opening of restricted investment markets to foreign investors. Now, some of these things are good and important ( although tax increases never are ) but they have to be introduced to the economy at a pace people can handle. The way they are introduced by the IMF kills initiative among the small businesspeople who create the majority of jobs and destroys the lives of the common people to ensure that foreign bankers get 100% of their investments back. There's no mention in IMF press releases of the losses endured by the shop owner who loses his life's work because of tax increases, no mention of the people who die as the health care infrastructure crumbles, no mention of the brain drain that occurs as any educated people who can leave the country for the First World.

Diane Francis, editor of the Financial Post, has pointed out that wherever the IMF goes, there are riots within months of the government knuckling under to IMF edicts. The robber Barons have been doing it to the people since the 15th century, and they won't stop anytime soon.

Would someone refresh my memory. Who is the US Sec'ty of Treasury ? Is it Mr. Brady ?

A service of the Seattle Independent Media Coalition. This site is a service designed, compiled and maintained by Citizen Vagrom.

Have you seen or read non-corporate news that's not listed in our archive?

http://speakeasy.org/citizen/infosubway/newswire.html

Date: 05/19/98.....When the people speak, the corporations squeak

Facing a rising tide of state and local sanctions, Big Business has banded together into an outfit called USA*Engage to defeat and roll back grassroots efforts to influence where multinationals do business.
USA*Engage has more than 600 members, including Aetna, Bechtel, Cargill, Caterpillar, Exxon, Mobil, Monsanto, Pepsi, TRW and United Technologies.

In March, the state of Maryland was on the verge of enacting a selective purchasing law that targeted Nigeria. Nigeria is ruled by a military government that feeds of oil money ( provided by companies like Shell and Mobil ) and drug money.

The government annulled a democratic election held in 1993, has jailed the victor in that election, allegedly killed his wife, executed Ken Saro-Wiwa, a leader of the Ogoni people, murdered and tortured thousands of citizens and jailed the nation's trade union leadership.

All in all, Nigeria is an excellent candidate for sanctions.

The purpose of this corporate campaign of intimidation is clear: While multinationals may or may not prefer to do business with dictators, they certainly do not want citizens interfering with their commercial operations in authoritarian countries -- even if those operations help prop up dictatorships.

At root, the suit over Massachusetts's Burma law is a clash between corporate internationalism and citizen internationalism.

http://speakeasy.org/citizen/infosubway/newswire/1998/May98_Whenthepeoplespeakthecorporationssqueak.html

.............................................................

HOLY COCAINE

Pope Leo XIII ( 1810-1903 ) endorsed Vin Mariani, a cocaine-laced wine very popular in Europe in the mid-1800s. When Colonel John Pemberton in Atlanta brewed up his first batch of Coca-Cola in 1886, he was trying to imitate Vin Mariani but dropped the wine to avoid problems with Temperance groups.

Pemberton did, however leave in the cocaine... which remained in Coke for at least the the next twenty years.
http://www.forbiddenknowledge.com/cocaine.htm

Maybe gold will drop to $280 or $250 personally i hope not however do you know many who got in at the bottom of any index commodity or share by it volatile nature unless you are a Rothschild you are unlikely to get in at the bottom with the gold market ( other than by chance ) Patience think of WB and his silver ~ I have persuaded my neighbour to buy Physical Gold its a hard slog but try to persuade as many people to buy the Physical. and have patience .

There has to be an economic turn down with Y2K the contribution on the subject in the past 21 days is exponential.



Asia tokyo hong Kong Think so far US nuclear to shut down 20% BEFORE OTHER PROBLEMS I have yet to see a comment on the former USSR ( change borders but N power plants stay where they were ) .

At the moment Russia has serious financial problems yet no reports on Y2K or provision for such problems

Think chernobyl no total shut down ( many brave russians took big risks ) there is no way Russia will shut down Power unless forced by Y2K

Think Murmansk Submarines a while back almost had their external poweer shut off ( bills not paid ) a pragmatic Admiral threatened the local poweer company how many pragmatic thinkers are there ( in the Former USSR ) with gansters /military selling all and sundry assetts to the highest bidder ??? I am an optimist however I like to look ahead worst case senario gold will buy time ................

.............. Gold will not avoid destruction ....but give an edge .



I live in the UK and find the comments from the US of A facinating if in 1933 the USG condiscated Gold and with all the US legislation ( in 1998/2000 ) I find it hard to believe that there would not be DEEMOS 1968 style but public cynisism & perception have changed.......#

p[atience



Buy physical GOLD

#

CPO

hi

ATTENTION RANGY SHOPPERS! Otay, think about it this way....if rangy goes down only seven more days like today...on the eighth day we won't have shat to worry with.

http://www.foodtv.com/rlomonac/09-25a.htm

THANKS
I might say that I am not sure about the "anytime soon " part unless you add " willingly"

The gold market could use a viagra pill or two to perk it up. Viagra has now adopted its slogan---Take the pill. Be like Bill.

I have been wrong before, but in the next few we will see a reversal to up for gold and gold stocks.It could happen between June2/June10.The next time band June 22/July5. Just my opinion, but believe we are near an important bottom.

May 21, 1998

DAILY BRIEFING

Koskinen: Y2K problem is time, not money
By Brian Friel
bfriel@govexec.com

Federal spending on fixing the year 2000 computer problem will not increase dramatically above current estimates, the Clinton administration's year 2000 czar predicted Wednesday.

In February, the Office of Management and Budget estimated that federal agencies will spend $4.7 billion from 1996 through 2000 on the year 2000 computer snafu, which may cause information systems failures throughout the world at the turn of the century.

In an interview with reporters Wednesday, John Koskinen, recently appointed as President Clinton's special adviser on the year 2000 problem, said that estimate will be revised as agencies continue to work on the problem, but "I think it's very unlikely that it will double."

"I think it will continue to incrementally increase," Koskinen said, "as people discover there are new things they run into. Those increases may be 20 or 30 percent over time--and that's not to say that's a small amount of money--but if you have to add another billion or two to [the $4.7 billion estimate], that's not a constraint. In the present situation, financial constraints are not our problem. Our problems are time and personnel."

***[Note last sentence in the preceeding paragraph.]

Whatever costs the century change imposes on federal agencies, Koskinen stressed that federal executives face no more important management issue than solving the Y2K problem. He also described how the President's Council on Year 2000 Conversion, which he chairs, plans to prepare the government and the nation for the century change. The council includes senior executives from across the government.

Here are excerpts from the interview with Koskinen.

On how much the federal government needs to add to its Y2K budget:

The administration's budget for 1999 has a $3.2 billion emergency contingency for everything from Bosnia to the year 2000. One of the questions has been how much of that would be available, if necessary, for the year 2000. The answer is, nobody knows, because we're not in 1999 yet.

Last week in the Senate, in the Senate Appropriations bill, Sen. [Ted] Stevens [R-Alaska, Senate Appropriations Chairman] with Sen. [Bob] Bennett's [R-Utah, head of the Senate's special committee on the year 2000 problem] support, put in a $2.2 billion emergency fund designated for the year 2000, which could be used if the President declared an emergency for the year 2000. We think that would be an appropriate backup consistent with the administration's proposal in its budget.

On the federal government's overall plan to combat the Y2K problem:

Think about this as a three-tiered problem.

The first tier, which we have the most control over, is our own systems. We have an ongoing process to deal with that. OMB monitors that on a quarterly basis. [Rep.] Steve Horn [R-Calif., chairman of the House Subcommittee on Government Management, Information and Technology] gives his reports. OMB tells people where they are. Then everybody argues.

The second tier is the data exchange points. As I told the agencies, they need to be very conscious of the fact that we have to have not only our systems working, but we have to be able to exchange data and information with our partners in the state and local governments and in the private sector. For instance, we have now provided to chief information officers in each state a detailed list of every data exchange between the state and the federal government.

Tier three is this: Information technology is wired into everything, so in some ways the world is linked now by information technology. The good news is it allows increased productivity and communication and an improvement in the standard of living. The bad news is if a system goes down anywhere, it probably affects everyone. This is an international,
global problem. If the Singapore stock market can't open on Jan. 3, 2000--we don't have anything to do with its operations--it has, obviously, a significant impact on the American economy. The biggest exposure to us is international. At least 70 percent of the world hasn't done anything.

***[Note last sentence in the preceeding paragraph.]

On the year 2000 council's progress after two meetings:

We have created working groups in the energy area, telecommunications, financial institutions, emergency preparedness, and workforce issues. The creation of those work groups represents a judgment on our part that there are a number of agencies that are very active in those areas. They also are areas that are critical parts of the preparation.

Our overall concept in these areas is to work through logistics, trade or national organizations that are umbrella organizations with working relationships with individual companies. One of the things I try to remind people is that [***]we don't have authority or responsibility [***] over a lot of these activities. What we're trying to do in all these areas beyond worrying about the federal systems and their interfaces is primarily trying to play a leadership role in coordinating and encouraging private sector and state and local government organizations to make sure there's awareness among their members about this problem, to encourage them to share information across organizational lines and to facilitate their own solutions to the problem.

[***See second sentence of the preceeding paragraph. Interpretation: "We are window dressing".]

We have to figure out how we can help people organize themselves. There's no way for me or the federal government to manage this problem. What we can do is be a catalyst to help people organize themselves.

On President Clinton's involvement in the Y2K issue:

The President will address this problem in the next few weeks. We're still reviewing what the appropriate way for him to do that is, in light of the state of knowledge and where we are. The question is what the appropriate forum is with balancing the need to raise awareness, without unnecessarily causing people to think there's a problem out of control.

[***'Raising awareness, without .. causing people to think there is a problem out of control'. Read that a few times.]

We're very anxious to make sure we give accurate information to people if there are going to be issues and areas of difficulties and complications. We need to be candid about that with people. If we're not, we'll lose our credibility. So if we say that Social Security checks are going to go out, they're actually going to go out. We're not just saying that to make people feel good.

[***'we'll lose our credibility'. Translation: 'We will lose control over people'.]

On the idea of a nationwide study of the Y2K problem:

There's been some suggestion that what we ought to do is somehow do a national assessment. But when you start thinking about what that entails, that would mean a phenomenal volume of detailed questionnaires going out across the economy and then trying to figure out how to get people to give you back real information in real time. I just don't think we
have time to set up that kind of system and then figure out how to make it work. So I think we'll do much better having a working partnership with the industries, in which the umbrella organizations that are created for this purpose are, in effect, the active bodies providing us with that information.

On the problem of embedded chips:

The growth industry in this problem are embedded chips. When people first started thinking about it, they thought about it in terms of hardware and software applications. Only in the last year have people begun to understand the magnitude of the number of chips out there that may have difficulties. It's a small percentage of chips. We shipped, give or take a little, 5 billion chips in 1996. Nobody knows for sure, but the estimates are that of the billions of chips out there two to three percent have a date sensitivity. But you know, two percent of 5 billion is 100 million chips. They're all over the place. They're in
manufacturing processes, oil refineries, waste treatment plants, power plants.

[***Manufacturing, refining, waste/water treatment and power plants. Oh, well. I suppose we'll fine out which ones are no good when the date rolls over, eh?]

On measuring agencies' progress toward meeting the Y2K deadline:

To the credit of the agencies, with the D- or F grades they've gotten, they've continued to try to provide accurate information. You would think the natural inclination of an agency would be to fill out the forms so that they at least get a C. But when I met with the heads of 42 agencies, they were all clear that they weren't happy with the low grades, if they had a low grade. They were focused on solving the problem. We'll see progress being made but we're not going to see suddenly everybody producing reports that don't reflect reality.

Our goal is not to have the better of the argument. Our goal is not to have nice documents. Our goal is to have the systems actually function. The great advantage of this problem is it has a simple performance measure and that is what works or doesn't work on Jan. 1, 2000.

[***And you're fired if it doesn't work. Ha, ha, ha!]

On who will be most prepared for the century change:

I feel really good about people who are still operating in the Stone Age, who don't have computers.

[***This little comment tells a whole story. They know what this means. That's why there will be no big budget increases for Y2000 remediation .. because 1 ) they will not be enough people to hire, 2 ) there will not be enough time, and 3 ) they are diverting material resources into emergency management ( see paragraph 11 ) .]

Another one of our interest's:

RUSSIA- OIL- IRANIAN CONNECTION- PRAYER'S for more Nuclear-resonance!

http://www.salamiran.org/Media/IranNews/980531.html#HLN06

Clinton and Gold not the only problems.--Palestine!!

What about it? Go to the other side of the world for an opinion.

Get more provoked!

S.

Our frustration and disappointment with the performance of gold and gold shares is shared by many others here I'm certain. Realistically, until SOMETHING turns the mighty US$ and this mother-of-all-bull-markets around ( and we might not like that circumstance either ) , gold seems destined to languish. Markets have not been fun or financially rewarding for this goldbug since early February 1996. Time to batten down the hatches and preserve some remaining capital, I think. What ho, is that the mighty Dow now down too? Good luck.

Have your in-laws buy rangy at the opening bell of Turnaround Tuesday....then leave town.

We watch this gold market together. Yes?

Tom

Have you got a way to contact Hirsch? I got a couple of questions for him. Thanx, Charlie

input into that aspect ) , but I do think that many here "want" certain things to happen ( sudden breaks in DJIA and POG ) and, for some reason or another, those "things" are not happening. Many here are "too close to the trees" to see the forest. I do think that "there are lots of icebergs surrounding the Titanic" but I haven't a clue as to whether the hull has been breached ( maybe it's just been very badly scraped ) . Maybe the hull has been breached but the hole is not big enough yet. Something totally unexpected may just do it ! Maybe it's just a matter of keeping things in perspective.

ASB...ASB...ASB...

Remeber, you heard the refrain from this quarter last week....2-8-9
Where did we close today?

Monday June 1, 10:51 am Eastern Time

Revamped silver fix passes smoothly, dealers say

By Patrick Chalmers

LONDON, June 1 ( Reuters ) - London's revamped silver fix, rolled out for the first time on
Monday, passed off without incident as participants voiced hopes of attracting greater volumes
of business under the more transparent pricing regime.

Spot silver was fixed at $5.1425 an ounce, up on Friday's $495.65, as physical demand
uncovered last week just below $5.00 helped underpin the market despite the gloominess in the
currency-blighted gold price.

``It went very smoothly on what has been a relatively quiet day anyway,'' said a senior dealer
at one of the three London silver fixing banks.

London precious metal fixes, which occur once daily for silver and twice each for gold,
platinum and palladium, are intended to set prices for physical business so as to absorb all buy
and sell orders accepted by the participating banks.

The fixes serve as benchmarks for metal prices which are more or less relevant depending on
the volume of business transacted and the time of day at which they occur.

No data on fix volumes are released.

The London Bullion Market Association said daily average silver turnover in April was 230.7
million troy ounces - the lowest on record. That represented a fall in turnover values to $1.5
billion from $1.7 billion in March, it said.

Monday's change to the silver fix introduced a system similar to the one used for gold, though
with three banks involved instead of gold's five.

Peter Hillyard, vice president of Bank of America's Commodity Trading Group in London,
welcomed the change from the more closed fix but complained it should have come 10 years
earlier.

"It's long overdue," he told Reuters.

``Ten years ago the then market makers approached the silver fixing banks and said it was time
the fixing was changed. The long and the short of it was that the banks told them where to go,
saying the fix was working perfectly well.

``There have been times when we have had rogue fixings, when people had not bothered to put
in enough orders to give a decent price,'' he said.

``My own feeling is that there may have been some pressure put on the fix by the market
makers and the regulators. It was an absurd anachronism to have this done in secret,'' he
added.

Hillyard said the fix remained significant as a benchmark for the market, helping industrial
customers with a reliable figure for average price contracts for example.

The fixing dealer denied any pressure had been brought to bear by regulators at the Bank of
England or elsewhere, saying changes had come about in response to customer requests and a
desire to modernise the system.

From Monday, the fix takes place from 1200 PM ( 1100 GMT ) , not 1215 as previously, setting
a dollar and sterling price for spot silver but no longer fixing prices for three, six and 12
months delivery metal. Lending rates will instead be offered directly by the three fixing banks,
Bank of Nova Scotia, HSBC Midland and Deutsche Morgan Grenfell.

http://www.wwfn.com/crashupdate.html

The Inscrutable Index is 289.

Looks like they ( ME ) are trying to close ranks around the world and "exorcise" the US. If we had any competent negotiators, maybe we could join up. !!??

from -8 to -6. Things are looking up for the stock bulls : )

BTW- I won't be upset if gold goes down to 270, or something. It'll just make the ultimate rebound that much juicier.

- Steve

pyramid ( Question ) ID#217268:
Would someone refresh my memory. Who is the US Sec'ty of Treasury ? Is it Mr. Brady ?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

No, but he's feeling pretty good and says he has
half a mind to go back to work.

Ominous "whiff of deflation" comment below...

Monday June 1, 3:35 pm Eastern Time

Canada gold shares sink as bullion continues slide

TORONTO, June 1 ( Reuters ) - Shares in Canadian gold mining companies fell sharply in midday trading on the Toronto Stock
Exchange on Monday as renewed pessimism about Asia's economic health and fears of future European gold sales gripped
markets.

Gold fell to $288.50 an ounce, its lowest level since mid-January, after Russian bank Uneximbank said it had begun gold shipments
under a new export regime.

The move triggered fears of gold supply hikes from Russia and further gold sales by European banks.

Gold markets also reacted to a torrent of gloomy economic news and lowered credit ratings in Asia, with some economists
forecasting the region would face a more pronounced economic slowdown than previously expected.

``The selling has come from reports of some gold from Russia, but basically it is the whiff of deflation coming out of the Far East
that is causing a rush to the U.S. dollar at the expense of gold,'' said John Ing, president of Maison Placements Canada Inc.

Coincidentally....

Two Eight Nine
The Goose drank wine
the Monkee chewed tobacco
on the streetcar line

( Apologies to non U.S. and those too young to know the song...just hope it doesn't become more accurate to the original lyrics which were "2-6-9" )

Going back a few days.....the answer is indeed, I did not understand your question. Which base metal coins can be hidden in noble coins ( or something like that... ) What did that mean? Sorry, I'm just plain dense obviously ( no commentary solicited from the gallery )

Monday June 1, 11:19 am Eastern Time

Russia's Uneximbank exported gold, silver

MOSCOW, June 1 ( Reuters ) - Russia's powerful Uneximbank said on Monday it had delivered
the first lot of over one tonne of gold and 12 tonnes of silver to London on Saturday under a
precious metals export licence it had recently obtained.

An Uneximbank statement quoted the head of the bank's precious metals department, Yevgeny
Ivanov, as saying that gold exports would allow Uneximbank to buy precious metals from
prospectors at a price above what the central bank pays commercial banks.

Another big Russian bank, Rossiisky Kredit, said in May it planned to export 20 tonnes of gold
and 50 tonnes of silver this year.

Russia has recently allowed commercial banks and major gold producers to export gold
directly, instead of through the central bank, as part of the project to liberalise the heavily
centralised sector.

Output has slumped in recent years since as producers do not have the funds to pre-finance
production, and the government introduced the current measure to enable commercial banks to
arrange finance which it was no longer able to do.

Uneximbank's statement said the bank had already extended credits to gold-miners to finance
seven tonnes of gold production, adding credit volumes would increase.

No offense taken or meant, we will all get old. I am buying some more gold when I leave the office today. NOW is the time!

You just got lucky, fortunately I waited till this week to buy more.

finer man exists, he and his people are giving their BEST...their ARE good people in the world and they are TRULY...giving their all...

http://www.tfc.com/syndication/current.cgi?tfc+inger

hi

But then I thought seriously, "No, that would make him overqualified for the position."

Well, he writes for Newsweek apparently here is a URL for another
one of his articles:

http://www.newsweek-special.com/emu/emu.html

I motice they have a feedback button.

Hiya moon, howya doin?

hi

hi.

It sure is in the works

When will gold go up?

Why look at the more fundamentals?

After reading "The Professor" you will get an idea where 'our' gold will go!

http://econ161.berkeley.edu/multimedia/USPCurve.html

And here is the calculator for it!

http://econ161.berkeley.edu/TCEH/1998_Draft/World_GDP/Estimating_World_GDP.html

( a bit to long )

Are these article's fit for a 'Gold' site or a' Good' site or a 'God' site?

RETIRED SOLDIER,

You will be better off. I was stoped in last Thursday!

S.

As Treasury secretaries come and go one can only assume the
position.

Wouldn't want to miss this chance to say "Hi" back to the moon. Personally, I've never thrown any rocks that landed there. ( Remember that little 'poem' of mine, TolerantOne?--throwing rocks on the moon )

Turn-around Tuesday sounds good to me, too. Hi, Studio.r, I read those books, and feeling 'right brave, told friends at the Memorial Day picnic that Gold had good buying support at $275, so don't go makin' a liar outta me.

Are there any books on how to recover after making really bad calls? Seems just about everyone here has needed it at one time or another!

Hi, the moon. Welcome.

Like bailing out a foundering boat with a coffe can. Valiant effort. Hope they are not disheartened by seeing alot of what they worked for sucked down by the undertow of the boats sinking around them. 75% of the national governments in the world have no organized plan. 70% of small businesses ( under $500 million capitalization ) in the USA have no plan.

Consider that you manufacture cars or trucks or tractors or airplanes or computers or chemical plants. 70% of your suppliers are not doing anything about Y2K. ~~poof~~

its sure heartening to see that 'the moon' has arrived. Our lucky day!

RIO TINTO SAYS IT COULD HAVE
DONE MORE TO RAISE BOUGAINVILLE
ALARM.
Tuesday 2 June, 1998 ( 2:50am AEST )





The mining company, Rio Tinto, has admitted it could have
done more, ten years ago, to alert the Papua New Guinean
government to the problems in Bougainville.

A dispute over environmental damage and profits from a
copper mine, run by Rio Tinto's majority-owned
Bougainville Copper, led to a ten-year civil war and the
mine's closure.

Chief Executive, LEON DAVIS has told a business gathering
in Melbourne, that Rio Tinto could have been more
pro-active, in addressing the central dispute about profits.

BEGINS: Back in those days, it was considered politically
correct for large corporations to rape the land upon which
families had lived for thousands of years. We destroyed
it enviromentally with total disregard for the rightful owners.
We precipitated war with neo-colonial attitudes, then lobbied
the PNG government to inlist Sandline Mercenaries to kill
Ona leader of the BRA as well as members of the BRA. Our plan
backfired and to distance ourselves from all our nasty business
we changed our name from CRA TO RIO TINTO. You cant say we
didnt try to kill them all. We were just doing it for our
shareholders and slush fund, Southern Bahamas Gold. Our Tax
haven has been the corner stone of our business.
RipItOff ToInjureNativesTOday

Despite a peace treaty signed in April, the company has
given NO indication it will soon re-open the mine.

US Treasuries may look unsafe enough that many who might otherwise look to conserative interest bearing investments as a place to park the money they pulled out of the equities markets will take a chance on gold, even though there's no guarantee it will increase in value. This of course is what Japan has threatened to do. But theirs is a special case. If they were ever to make good on their threat to sell treasuries and buy gold, they'd both cause gold to increase in value and debase the reputation of US Treasuries.

It's looking more and more to me like gold is being held down exactly to try to prevent such a scenario, to keep the dollar up and to keep US Treasuries looking like a better asset-parking investment.
-EJ

June 1, 1998

GM says it wants labor peace but braces for strike

WILMINGTON, Del. ( Reuters ) - General Motors Corp. executives insisted Monday that they do not want a strike at a key metal stamping plant in Flint, Mich., despite moves to brace themselves for a walkout that could lead to widespread plant shutdowns.

United Auto Workers officials attending GM's annual shareholders meeting here said the labor situation in Flint, GM's birthplace, is quickly deteriorating and could soon lead to strike deadlines at two other plants there.

North American Operations chief G. Richard Wagoner said the automaker did not intend to fuel union distrust when over the Memorial Day weekend it moved stamping dies for its all-new full-size pickup trucks out of the Flint Metal Center, where workers have set a Thursday strike deadline.
http://www.freecartoons.com/ReutersNews/AUTOS-GM.html

Jerry Fallwell was seated next to President Clinton on a recent flight.
After the flight was airborne, the flight attendant came around for
drink orders.

The President asked for a whiskey and soda, which was brought to him.

The attendant next asked the Minister if he would also like a drink.

The Minister replied in disgust: "Ma'am, I'd rather be savagly raped by
a brazen whore than let liquor touch these lips!"

The President gasped, then handed his drink back to the attendant and
said: "I'm sorry. I didn't know there was a choice... I'll have what
he's having."

Thank you. I have put it to Hirsch. Let you know if any results, Charlie

Thinking again about the gold market place. Ya' got yer physical. Ya' got yer paper. Yearly production/reclaimation averaging 2300 tonnes over the past few years. Paper all over the place. Tonnes of paper. Love that paper. Maybe 8000 tonnes of outstanding naked paper. 3 to 1 or so.

World's getting saturated with that paper gold stuff. Not scarce, is it? Price going down. On the paper stuff. No one taking much delivery. Yet. Got alot of paper promises, alot of futures. Got a tonne of futures out there. Getting cheaper all the time, that paper. Way to much of it so the price goes down.

Must mean something.

'I wouldn't pay you a plug nickle fer that, Sam. Price goin' down. To much out there for demand on PAPER. I was jus' wondering how long some folks will continue to be interested in buying that 'paper' gold stuff, when the real stuff is so scarce. If'n ya' wanted the gold in yer hand, well why wouldn't ya' just buy it?'

'George, I tried to tell ya' that its because paper's so convenient and all. If'n everybody's feeling good about the paper then its just as good as gold, only better.'

'En if'n they some time don't be feelin so good about the paper?'

'Well, I suppose that *would* be a problem, now wouldn't it?'

NY precious metals end lower on Russian woes

Gold prices fell to their lowest level in four-and-a-half months, following news that Russia's Uneximbank was granted a license to export one tonne of gold for London delivery.

COMEX August gold settled at $290 an ounce, down $4.50 an ounce from Friday's close, trading in a range between $295.50 and $290.40 an ounce, the lowest level since January 15.

In the bullion market, spot gold was quoted at $288.20/70 an ounce, compared to the late London fix, which was $288.75 an ounce, and Friday's New York close, which was $292.70/8.20 an ounce.

COMEX July silver followed the gold market lower, ending down 3.0 cents at $5.055 an ounce, trading in a range between $4.98 and $5.155 an ounce.


"Gold has already started to filter into the market from Russia. We've heard the reports of palladium sponge entering the market. With the weakness in the rouble, it's not surprising that Russia would be turning to its hard assets to generate dollars."

COMEX July silver followed the gold market lower, ending down 3.0 cents at $5.055 an ounce, trading in a range between $4.98 and $5.155 an ounce.
http://www.freecartoons.com/ReutersNews/NY-PRECIOUS-METALS-EN.html

The last line seems a bit dramatic, don't you think? "Poof?"

The factories will still be there, with employees ready to work. The largest problems will be with the orders and invoices, and the companies that get caught with their pants down will have to set their machines back to 1993 and suffer or switch back to pencil and paper and suffer. Suppliers will still make supplies. Short term I'm concerned about embedded systems ( esp safety related ) ; Long term I'm concerned about data warehouses ( banks, etc ) . I don't expect any long-term manufacturing problems that can't be resolved. But then, who knows? I bought gold...

"Eyes full of sorrow, never wet
Hands full of money, all in debt
Sun coming out in the middle of June
Everyone's gone to the moon"

How very apt, considering that fiat money is debt "notes for nothing".
And the middle of June is not far away

Artist: Jonathan King
Peak Billboard position # 17 in 1965
http://www.summer.com.br/~pfilho/html/lyrics/e/everyones_gone_to_the_moon.txt

Did you notice the sudden reversal of the S&P futures just before the
US markets opened up today? It was like being in another universe
after the turmoil in Asia earlier in the day, and losses in European
markets. Never underestimate the determination of the bull - a
mania is what it says on the packet, after all. The bull could
very well steam on for some considerable time, crash index or
no crash index, PPT or no PPT. There are no doubt vested interests
outside the PPT that would not like a precipitous fall. And
anyway, perhaps the PPT wouldn't get out of bed for anything as
trivial as 100-200 points fall? What if those pieces of paper
fell close to their cost of production... it has happened before.
100 Billion Reichsmarks, anyone? 1929 share certificates?
We await the turning of a cycle in the long term, comparable to
the human lifetime, that is to say the Kondratieff wave. A few
months more for the bear market to get properly under way and for
gold to soar is chicken feed in those terms.

http://www.eo.com

The Dow Jones Transportation index today cracked its 200 day moving average and fell below its previous low. The Dow Industrial index will confirm a bear market by falling below 8780 which I expect before the weekend. Once the bear market is confirmed , the senior averages will begin a substantial decline to be culminated by the middle of July around Dow 6000. Interest rates will continue to decline as deflation accelerates. I expect the long bond to yield around 5.5 % or less by the middle of July . Gold may decline to about $282 before stabilizing and then rebound to about $298 or so by the middle of July.

- Russian stocks plunged 10.2 per cent

Monday amid a frenzy of selling by Russian banks and rebuffs from foreign investors wary of the market's turmoil

MOSCOW ( AP ) -- Russian stocks plunged 10.2 per cent Monday amid a frenzy of selling by Russian banks and rebuffs from foreign investors wary of the market's turmoil.

Panic selling gripped the Russian Trading System late in the day; reassuring comments from government officials failed to calm the jittery investors.

Monday's close matched the 10 per cent fall on Wednesday, when hectic selling sent the stock market plummeting and threatened a run on Russia's currency, the ruble.

The market has fallen 44 per cent since the beginning of May

Russian leaders have said that the economic crisis was triggered by a combination of forces, including a sharp fall in world prices for gas and oil, the financial crisis in southeast Asia, and social unrest, including a recent wave of coal miners' strikes.
http://www.freecartoons.com/WorldTicker/CANOE-wire.Russia-Economy.html

Dow/Gold Ratio = 30.96 This is a new high. The 50 day moving average is 29.78

IMHO the labor union movement in the US is desperate to maintain its chokehold on the workers and to maintain its leader's advantages. Big labor is the unrecognized third branch of the American power troika, the first two being the more commonly discussed big government and big business. Here is an URL to compliment the one you posted. ( $-^] ) http://www.226info.org/

Of COURSE I remember, it is filed and taken out from time to time to re-live the WONDER in those words. A HUGE SALUTE TO YA!!!

This is two cubic feet of metal folks! Such is the irrationality of the gold market these days. Examine the duality present in this situation. The price tanks on a perception of the supply-side flooding the market. Gold must INDEED BE SCARCE if two-cubic-feet is sufficient to "flood the market". Yet if gold's availability on the open-market were truly that scarce, then why is the current price ONLY $290 per oz?

And before someone counters with the thought that this authorization for the sale of one tonne simply represents more to follow, I say this...YOU could not lay your hands on this gold if you TRIED. It will never reach the "open-market." The new owner is already clearing out space in the cookie jar...

Liked your recent post, Allen ( USA ) .

Please email me tolerant1@email.msn.com I have some lovely news to tell you...

XAU/Spot Ratio = .246 The 50 day moving average is .272. My database contains 10 readings of the XAU in the 70.XX range. The reading today is #9 as ranked to the price of gold. The #1 rank reading was on 4/22/86 with a gold price of $346.80, an XAU of 70.87, producing a XAU/AU ratio of .204

This is its true form...

If you haven't got gold, choosing instead to hold
your wealth on paper,
you just might rather
count the rocks you've thrown that fell upon the moon
as your legacy
than prove to me
those ashes over which you weep were once other than fallen leaves.

A product of my soul...indeed.

Gold/Silver Ratio = 56.84

Truly, you are a treasure, me MuMM is reading it at this very moment...

John,
Are you going to the Harmony share holders meeting on the 10th?

A humble thank you.

The ratio closed at 3.785 today, finally closing over the previous high reached on March 20th, of 3.769. It has been flirting so close to a new high for about three weeks now, but today finally pushed things over the top. So far this year, the ratio is up 11.3%. *sigh*

--Fergie

Central banks only sold 406 tons of gold in 1997: Amgold review


JOHANNESBURG, June 1 ( AFP ) - Central banks only sold 406 tons of
gold into the market in 1997, despite damaging speculation that they
would offload significant quantities of their reserves, Amgold
chairman Nicky Oppenheimer said Monday.
In a statement to coincide with the Amgold ( Anglo American Gold
Investment Company Limited ) 1997/98 annual review, Oppenheimer said
the sales were "easily absorbed into the robust physical market."
On the market "demand for gold for fabrication purposes exceeded
new mine production by a record 1,426 tons," he said.
"The damage done by speculation arising from this negative
sentiment was reflected directly in price, which fell from its
operating level of 350 dollars per ounce to an 18-year low of 281
dollars in December 1997.
"The average spot price of gold of 317 dollars per ounce was
over 15 percent lower than the previous year."
Oppenheimer expressed concern about the negative sentiment in the gold market.
He said: "Those who did sell on the back of the speculation
found that their short sales easily drove the price down in a market
which discouraged buyers, and the resultant fall in the gold price
made the sentiment fulfilling, even though no flood of central bank
sales eventuated."
According to a report from Gold Fields Mineral Services, 14
central banks sold 844 tons of gold from official reserves while 19
of them acquired 438 tons.
He said as a result of this, some major producers undertook
face-to-face meetings with leaders of the largest European central
banks in Davos, Switzerland, which resulted in "improving the tone
of central bank announcements in the gold market."
In contrast to negative sentiment and depressed prices in 1997,
Oppenheimer said off-take of gold for jewellery alone increased 17
percent to 3,328 tons driven in large part by deregulation and
demand in the Indian, Middle East and European markets.
This helped push up by 17 percent the total off-take for 1997 to
3,890 tons. New mine supply rose by only five percent to 2,464
tons.
"The shortfall between fabrication demand and new mine supply
rose by 48 percent to a record 1,426 tons, into which the net
central bank sales of 406 tons for 1997 were easily absorbed."
In South Africa gold production fell marginally from 495 tons in
1996 to 493 tons in 1997, he said.

A confirmation a a Dow bear market by itself is a confirmation of a Gold bull market. One more test of the $280 level which I expect to hold and then a sustained upward move after the $280 area had been tested 3 times and held. The upmove wiil begin very slowly and in time will accelerate. The price of Gold will rise despite all the negative talk about it and CB sales.

Tears...Hmmmmmmmmm...of Joy they be...that the likes of you consider me friend...more GOLD shall be given to children in YOUR HONOR, we need more like you...off to pull an ounce of GOLD from a childs ear and introduce them to magic.......................

Have you really considered this Prof's stuff? I would love to have your take on this!! Thanx, Charlie

Keep your eyes open for sack of scratch feed. I don't know about gold out of chicken ears, but I have run acroos several verifiable accounts of gold from craws. You know how they like to peck something bright. If the gold is around they'll get it. How can you beat this prospecting?

Reorganization not Bankruptcy.
http://quote.yahoo.com/q?s=PSGQF&d=1d

HighRise

Seems I remember the CCCP fell apart when the coal miners got a litte fed up, with having no pay, and stopped working. Maybe the central banks are driving down the price so they can squeeze out Russias gold at a good price....Give them lots of loans, but get the gold out!

hi!@promey ;^ ) ~

bye!@the.moon ( ! )

http://europe.cnnfn.com/markets/wires/9806/01/pakistan_wg/

Parting with cash is such sour sorrow. studio.

With the Kitco sentiment indicator hitting bottom, just thought I would inquire about R. Nolan's forecast....are you still following this? If so, when is the 'big move' she was forecasting for this summer supposed to begin? IDCIBM, tomorrow. Physical.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/asia-pacific/newsid_104000/104573.stm

http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980601/swiss_holo_2.html

I don't know if you two ever found the test kit you were seeking, but Southern Coin Investment's current catalog lists one for $55. Phone ( 770 ) 393-8000, Fax ( 770 ) 396-1734

where I just dont listen to anybody anymore who says thay know which way the market is going. They are all wrong a lot of the time and if they aren't wrong they say its going up unless it goes down.

Goldbugs are truly lucky today. Presented with yet another buying opportunity.

Studio, ain' t this fun.

Absent a very strong move by June 12 I concede ASB.Yes?

Tom

The world's most exclusive club wants supremacy in the judicial and economic fields.



EXCLUSIVE TO THE SPOTLIGHT

By James P. Tucker Jr.



TURNBERRY, Scotland



Although moderately distracted by the new nuclear arms race between India and Pakistan, Bilderberg concentrated on its major goals on the road to world government:



Establishing a global court that would be superior to the U.S. Supreme Court and to those of all nations.



Pressing British Prime Minister Tony Blair to have the political courage to drag his country into the European common currency, the euro.



Pressuring the U.S. Congress into approving $18 billion to make interest payments to international banks which made bad loans to uncreditworthy countries on the assurance that taxpayers would make them good.



The British prime minister was summoned to shuttle back and forth from the summit of the eight industrialized countries held 450 miles away in Birmingham, England, at the same timeby design. Blair was hardly treated as a head of state. He was lectured severely for failing to bring Britain into the common currency, which is to be phased in beginning January 1. Blair assured Bilderberg that Britain would join, but he had to revolve "political problems" because "there is a surge of nationalism at home."





VEILED WARNING?



"You're a Maggie Thatcher in long pants," a German told Blair. This was a crude reminder that Lady Thatcher had been dumped as head of state by her own Conservative Party on Bilderberg orders and replaced with trapeze artist John Major, for the precise same reason ( SPOTLIGHT, May 29, 1989 ) .



After being deposed, Lady Thatcher told The SPOTLIGHT she considered being denounced by Bilderberg a "tribute" because neither Britain nor any country should surrender sovereignty.



"Helmut Kohl ( German head of state ) never flinched" in pressing his country to join the common currency, the German told Blair. "He may lose this election because of this. You know Germany has a problem with nationalism. But Helmut stood firm." Blair turned and walked away.



There was much discussion and optimism among Bilderberg participants about a June meeting of the UN in Rome, to draft a treaty establishment a permanent International Criminal Court. Unlike the present World Court, the ICC is to have enforcement power and could impose its decisions universally.



"Will America's nationalists ( an expletive in Bilderberg dialect ) give us trouble about the court treaty?" asked one.



'I think not," replied an American believed to be but not positively identified as Casimer Yost, director of the Institute for the Study of Diplomacy, School of Foreign Service, at Georgetown University in Washington.





NOD FROM SENATE



The American pointed out that in 1994, the U.S. Senate voted 55-45 to encourage establishment of the ICC under the UN. The Senate did so, he said, with the full knowledge that the global court, with judges from ( Red ) China or other rogue nations, may pass judgment on the United States and individual citizens.



"There was some objections by the American public, but not much," the American said. "Most of them know nothing about it and probably won't."



"Unless one of them is sent to jail by the ICC," interjected another.



"Yeah, then they will notice," the American said. The latter exchange was jocular and scornful.



On expanding NATO, Bilderberg participants were impatient. "The shortest path to permanent peace is to bring everybody in including Russia as fast as practical," said one speaker whose comment met with general approval. A question was raised about costs.



"Costs, you ask?" the speaker responded. "How much did two world wars, Korea, Vietnam and the Gulf War cost Americans? Peace is far less expensive." To ensure "permanent peace throughout the world requires a strong enforcement mechanism, which means keeping the expanding NATO intact but under UN direction, for which there is a precedent to which none except rabid nationalists objected," the speaker said.



The "precedent" referred to was UN forces in Bosnia, where American soldiers were issued the UN uniform and served under a foreign commander who reported directly to the Security Council, with the U.S. president and Congress having no role at all.





CONGRESS BALKS



Bilderberg participants were clearly stating that the UN is to emerge into a world government with its own army patrolling the globe enforcing its will. Bilderberg luminaries expressed outrage that Congress did not approve the $18 billion for the International Monetary Fund to bail out the big banks a year ago.



"How could you let your Congress get so out of control?" asked a Frenchman of an American during informal glass-tinkling. "It was never a problem before."



"Our Congress has a problem we call voters," came the answer.



"That's because we have less direct communication," the Frenchman said. "Leaders of your Congress no longer accept our invitations to attend Bilderberg."



"Again, the problem is voters," the American explained. "For years and years, we enjoyed almost total privacy. Now, right-wing extremists stir the voters up and congressmen have too many questions asked of them."



For decades, such congressional leaders as former House Speaker Tom Foley ( D- Wash. ) , former Senate Banking Chairman Lloyd Bentsen ( D-Texas ) and others attended Bilderberg. Bentsen continued as President Clinton's Treasury secretary, but was not listed among this year's participants.



For the past several years, the only legislators to attend were Sen. Sam Nunn ( D-Ga. ) and a House member but only after each had announced his retirement.



"We need them back, as the IMF problem shows," the Frenchman said.



"But how?" asked the American. "Congressmen now consider attending Bilderberg to be political suicide."



Bilderberg regulars were all accounted for, including David Rockefeller, Henry Kissinger and Evelyn de Rothschild, chairman of N.M. Rothschild & Sons of Britain and Europe.



President Clinton, himself a Bilderberg member, sent his usual assortment of administration officials: Marc Grossman, assistant secretary of state; Vernon Jordan Jr., a top unpaid advisor who will report Bilderberg demands directly to the president; Lawrence Summers, deputy secretary of Treasury; and Christine Todd Whitman ( R ) , governor of New Jersey.



This is Mrs. Whitman's first Bilderberg meeting, which means they have plans for her. After Clinton's first Bilderberg meeting, in Baden-Baden, Germany in 1991, he became president.



Other old-time luminaries present included Chairman Lord Peter Carrington, former secretary-general of NATO; Paul Allaire, chairman of Xerox Corp. and Conrad Black, chairman of the Telegraph of London and owner of a vast newspaper chain, among other global interests.

Yep, It's a gas, gas, gas...... ( choke, cough, hack....my god! I'm suffocatin'! ) 'Member what Butch and Sundance did on the cliff?........ooooohhhhhh shhhhaaaaaattttttt! ( splat )

if the price of gold can get down to $1.00??

Sorry, don't tell anyone.

I don't know if they are purposely being held down or
not, but there are certainly some strange things going
on. Price moves at strange times, like today for instance.
This was a holiday in much of Europe. Lately we have
been getting our biggest drops during holidays or
after the London market has closed, often accompanied
by some vague rumor of some CB sale. Today it was the
news that the Russians had sold a ton. Might even be
going to sell six or seven tons, Pshaw!

If you wantef to sell a bunch of gold, would you wait
until the market was as thin as possible?

Insider selling of stocks picked up considerably some
weeks ago, much of it by fund managers out of their
personal accounts even as they encouraged their clients
to buy more. Many advisory services have now begun to
be negative so I guess they about done with getting
their own butts out of the fire.

Much of this money will just sit as cash and/or go into
short term treasuries. Flight capital is not going to
be in anything long term right now.

The market will crash, the economy will start down, and
eventually longer term bonds will begin to look good if
there is any expectation the Fed will lower rates.

If during any of this sequence cash and treasuries start
to look risky there will come a renewed interest in
precious metals and other forms of real assets.

Any number of things could triger this. A bank or
brokerage house failure, a crises in the white house,
unexpected death of a key financial figure and so
forth.

We'll just have to watch the dive.

It could, but if it did ther would be worse things
to occupy our thoughts.

Jeil, you seem to have the hot hand right now. What are you projections for Gold 3mo, 6mo, 12mo? Just curious.

...But it IS going up unless it goes down. Discounting
of course the possiblity of it just sitting there.

What cracks me up most is when I sold Rangy @ 1 3/8, and some guy got on my case and said I should not have been in it in the first place.

This ,because I didn't understand the fundamentals. I wonder what his opinion is today? One thing is for sure , he was right. I should not have been in it!

http://www.newsday.com/ap/rnmpwh0s.htm

Require plain English in new rulings -- perhaps a little English remedial education would be even more effective. How do you force anyone to use good English?

But you bought back in @ a cheaper price, right? A smart move, my friend.....but, we both know, words on the internet are readily available for less than one cent/word. Who has our money? Do we know them?

But than.....we have here a certain bias on many subjects.
How about an efficient police force guarding the net..?
the Quebec Munich connection
how long will free speech survive?

http://chantry.com/ga/

is this an efficient judicial system?

Thanx , I have one located in Charlotte for about $40. Waiting on confirm. If it fails, I'll go to SCI. I have a catalogue and failed to check it. Charlie

rubles, rupiahs, rupees, baht, won and dong for toilet paper...

and the toilet bowl out of gold....

suicide is an option....call or put?

Acording to S. Kaplan, The fact that the Xau approached 70 but didn't break through it, was a slightly bullish sign.

was last week when the xau held above the 80 mark for 4 DAYS IN A ROW.
And then crashed through like a metiorite!!!

Where's Farfel? He's a great moral booster. So...how low can gold get!

Suicide is not an option. Its a gold stock.

At least I KNOW what I want, yes sireee, bob....I want all my gold back and some of theirs.

Well, I just came back from vacation to discover that PM's are down, and my leveraged PM's have been sliced and diced... but that's not all! Upon checking the value of my gold stock portfolio, I discovered to my dismay that they are almost ALL down; and some are down quite substantially.

Words cannot express my frustration at the unbelievable incessant hammering of gold, silver and platinum. When you consider the supply and demand factors, how is it possible for the ( numerous profane adjectives deleted ) SHORTS to keep blasting down the price in such an unrealistic fashion? Can't the shorts recognize their own danger in such folly??? Certainly the time will come when they will lose their you-know-whats at the slingshot effect of price. The day will surely come when a small percentage of traditional investors recognize the value of PM's and gold stocks.

Well, no doubt many of you on this forum have felt the sting of the last two weeks. I just wish that I had not considered it impossible for the raging bull to go so far into the stratosphere before its inevitable correction or crash. While I do not wish to see a crash, I most certainly would like to see PM's and gold stock go to even a more realistic price before the stress kills me.

--Skip

Me hide is tough, let them talk, but for Gods sake keep the Gov. out of private affairs. Troubles I have plenty, but I will take care of mine.

The SHORTS are going to keep flushing the price of gold down the toilet, until one of us becomes brave enough to jump in and put a stop to this nonsense. Frankly, I think you should go first because you are smarter and better looking than me!!What do ya say??

Also the fact that the sun came up this morning is
a slightly bullish sign.

There's silver

It will be even more bullish if the sun comes up tomorrow and the
XAU holds at 65 without going through!!!

Silverbaron- I jest got it and it is almost exactly as JP says.

Date: Mon Jun 01 1998 17:52
JP ( A follow up to my previous post ) ID#253153:
A confirmation a a Dow bear market by itself is a confirmation of a
Gold bull market. One more test of the $280 level which I expect to hold
and then a sustained upward move after the $280 area had been tested 3
times and held. The upmove wiil begin very slowly and in time will
accelerate. The price of Gold will rise despite all the negative talk about
it and CB sales.

$280 or there abouts will be the los and not a lot happening in June, more
base building then slow but steady UP for July and August. She is really
bullish for the longer term but only charts 3 mos @ a time.

For 20 years I bought gold stocks on June 30 and sold them in the Fall for a seasonal trade that did not work for the past two years. I think
like cousin Bill Murphy of Veneroso says, WE ISSA GOIN MUCH HIGHER LATER
THIS YEAR!!

Tally Ho

PS- for those of you out there that are shakin, times like these is when
fortunes can be made. I got the FARM bet, course you know I got more than
one FARM. One of these days them DAMN lyin bankers and politicians gona suffer for this book entry money they been playin with.

Tally Ho II

WE can lose more money than this and eat a sammich at the same time! ( gulp ) ;^ ) ~ Let's make a list of who has our money!

I offer the first name to the forum: Frank Veneroso

The kind of bullish I like is gold goes up $20 overnight.

Is there some way we could spread the rumor that gold is
on of the key components of Viagra?

All I can say is its a damn good thing you have another farm, or you might be pitching cow chips for your neighbor!!

Frank said he doesnt have the money. He thinks either S. Kaplan or J. Dines has it .

With time my projections change enough to make someone starting out sane into the opposite; and I didn't start out sane.

In any event, right now I am looking for a double bottom Early December , 1998, and early February 1999. That will change, but will not likely come early. Recently I have pushed back a likely bottom from September to what I stated above. Of course there will be plenty of bottom pickin' along the way by the faithful in their worship of the yellow stuff.

Those with some serious money to lay on the line when the real bottom hits should wind up with significant fortunes. I estimate Homestake hitting sub $1 and then ultimately rallying to the $50 over the course of the ensuing several years.

I think the odds are better that it will go down $20 over night.
But that is only on a bearish night when the XAU isn't sitting so bullishly above 70

I would love to see the look on a few faces with gold limit up about 3 days in a row. Yes indeedy!

It will end when....

Bank failures start to cascade into the US... or

We learn that an oil for gold ( or gold backed currency ) deal has been reached....or

We find out who that one country is that was buying all of that gold that has been sold ( remember! it was also bought ) ...or

Someone calls in the paper, and asks for physical in return ...or ...or ...or!

I suspect we will all be asked to wait for that time. Perhaps, its something to look forward to, but increasingly I sense that our society will reap a terrible harvest coincidentally at that time.

Mother never said it would be easy. Did She?

I have no intentions of doing any bottom picking, nose picking, or bellie button picking here at KITCO. And there could be kids playing this gold market and reading your posts, so lets stop this talk of bottom picking!!!

I hope we are on the beginning of an upswing. You know that none of us has even the foggiest idea what gold will do.I will suggest that if we were all to sell our positions tommorrow we would probably miss the greatest bull of this century. Thats the luck of the goldbug.

placed a limit buy order for 5,000,000 shares of RANGY at 1/128th. Thank you. I soon will rule.

Anybody know why it was down today?

I've been working over the charts you put up today. I think I know what you're doing, but I sure as hell wouldn't know how. Apparently, you have got it down better than 50/50- a lot better. What do you charge for a weekly update on the S&P500? I may have to pay off in gold dust, but I am serious about trying to track it out for the feel. It looks very tradable. Many thanx, Charlie

the dollar got greener and gold got yellower. studio.

GC Q8
August Gold
2901
-5
-0.2
2906
2900
27.1K
http://www.dbc.com/cgi-bin/htx.exe/dbcfiles/curcommt.html?SOURCE=core/dbc

Gold
2901
-5
http://www.dbc.com/cgi-bin/htx.exe/dbcfiles/indicators.html?source=core/dbc

Nothing, just like 06/01/98? Bart went home?
http://www.kitco.com/gold.graph.html

288.20 four hours old I think?
http://www.kitcomm.com/comments/goldlive/index.html

Nothing at all???
http://www.kitco.com/gold.live.html

GOLD 01 2045 28845 -515
http://www.sharenet.co.za/spots.html


GC M8
Exchange - COMX
As of: Jun 01, 1998 @ 7:53 pm ET
Last
2875
Change
-4
http://cbs.marketwatch.com/http2_data/squote.htx?source=htx%2Fhttp2_mw&ticker=GC%3DM8&tables=table&format=decimals

Not Found in Data Base?
http://cbs.marketwatch.com/data/squote.htx?source=htx/http2_mw&ticker=GC=G8&tables=TABLE

Spot Prices May 26 Kitco ??? $296.60 -$2.90
http://www.golden-eagle.com/quotex/goldcorner.html

Hong Kong Gold
07:26
288.00/50
Loco London Gold
07:26
288.00/50
http://www.hkabc.net/cgi-bin/mtl-cgi

Tough way to make a living.

HighRise

I spoke to the investors relations dept at RANGY today about the future price of their stock. The head of investor relations has in a buy limit order at 1/64 for 10 million shares, so I kind of doubt you will get hit Studio. Sorry!!

Because I wanted it to go up.

HighRise

That ol' boy must know somethin'....yes siree bob.

.....ain't gonna fail. They's a gonna be nationalised. That's why the big ones are merging, so that they won't get thrown away, shut down.

Banks won't be allowed to fail. Physical Currency won't trade though. If you want to access your account, you will need a smart card ( like a debit card ) .

All banks under one roof, assets & liabilities pooled; no cash-no crash, no bank runs on Clinton's Bank Holiday. Boy, he reminds me of FeDR.



Avalon, e buono di viderti, Senatore. Ecco me, Agnelli.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/europe/newsid_104000/104514.stm

Years ago when I was struggling with some of the concepts underlying my calculations I had a phone conversation with a fellow down in Dallas. He had experimented with using a variable calendar ( based on the eliptical orbit of the earth around the sun ) in taking his readings of the markets rather than our conventional calendar. He was working with yet someone else down in Florida. They were then going to analyze the data base for cycles. It never did work, so they figured the only way left to make money out of it was to sell a newsletter.

If I get to the point where I can't make money from my calculations, I'll consider selling you a newsletter, but in the mean time you will have to be satisfied with my occasional free postings on this site which I do more out of boredom than anything else. That way I don't feel any guilt should my work turn out to be less than I think it is. By the way, the charts I reposted today were the one's I originally posted on Kitco either on the date shown on the chart or early the next morning.

Does that mean that all you have to do is want it to go down , and that will make it go up??

Up to 25 cents today. My only gold stock to go up in the last two weeks is MINE. STUDIO.R -- add to the list Rebecca Nolan. I would have done better turning her gold and S&P charts around. Not too many have been on with their predictions, we have to give Steve Kaplan some credit there. He got the reversal.

it's the paper profits mentality all over, if you're selling gold you'll be whining because it's too cheap...The CB's that are selling are whining because they are weak.

If you're buying you'll be keeping ya gob shut and hanging around until the absolute bargain...if you don't plan to sell...stop whining, it's only a paper loss when you realise it...until then gold is cheap by every historic measure, land, suits, chicken, cars and sparklies.

Skip --

I take it your new around these parts?

employ clever ruse to avoid market down-draft today. They stayed closed! So that Dax index plus 1.4% I marveled at on Yahoo was from Friday. Now maybe the gold market should try that. Just stay closed, like "just say no", that worked real well. . . . on second thought . . . .

War is no fun and people get hurt and there is a lot of crying and real crappy feelings. So lets pray there isnt a war. It is much more fun to protest inflation at a govt's steps. And inflation will get gold up.

says they've got the missile that can deliver a nuke.

http://nt.excite.com/news/r/980601/07/news-pakistan

We're not whinin'....we're bitchin'...... ;^ ( ~

The problem is their lead scientist has also been seen out back of his house worshipping a cow.

From Altamira...

"Gold issues tumbled after India, the world's largest consumer of gold, announced that it will be increasing import duties on gold by 14%. The new import duties combined with a strengthening US dollar is expected to decrease bullion demand in India. A strengthening dollar raises the cost of bullion for investors outside the US."

Hey if gold drops low enough, I'm going to buy myself a range of gold suits, the kind Elvis couldn't even afford. Oh, and I always wanted to get me a bathroom made of solid gold. That would impress the chicks.

So, I guess the price is always right.

Gene Inger 35% stock allocation lowest since July of 1987

Monday June 1, 8:24 pm Eastern Time
Dollar seen up to 145 yen in 1998 -Merrill Lynch
``I do not share this view of the euro's prospects and remain a steadfast dollar bull,'' Rosenberg said.
http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980601/dollar_see_1.html

Wouldnt this suggest Gold @ $150 / oz.

HighRise

Let's hope together that we don't see an escalation in Kashmir or Kosovo. But we must watch. Looks like Iran and Pakistan may come to some agreement over Afghanistan. There are high-level meetings scheduled. We must watch closely as the world is shape-shifting at a remarkable speed.

All: Interesting article from Washington Weekly

http://www.federal.com/jun01-98/Story01.html

I am now long, real long, toilet paper. I figure with the PMs making people cr@p so much that when the Dow/Nas. goes to hell there is a fortune to be made!

Keep your powder dry for another day. Physical is cheap. Hope silver stays above $5.

Patience, my son, patience.

Tom

Pakistan got their missile technology from China, who got it from us. The kitty is outta de bag. BTW, it's the other side who likes dem moo'ers.

I like that tale. I caught the dates ok. So far, I have a few of these and they seem to be tracking pretty well. If it holds up, they should be good for week to week trades. Thank you very much for the help. Charlie

I like that gold bathroom idea. I think I will do that to. Hell, and then I will wallpaper my whole house with worthless gold stock certificates. There will be the"RANGY ROOM", and "DROOY PLACE"

Not to be a smart alleck, I was reading somewhere about the Yen going to 275!!!

I can't be serious about wanting it to go down, they wouldn't believe me. Plus I am afraid to try that - With my luck, It just might work, Gold would crash to $1.50.

HighRise

As the Dollar goes up Gold and Oil have gone down. Kind of scary.

Highrise

You know, that's not a bad idea. If all of we Kitcoites
were to get out of gold, I bet it WOULD immediately
turn around an go up. An excellent idea. Why don't
you guys do that?

All: Look at my post below. This is old news, but it is the same relaxed Chinese trade rules that let these weapons in the country -- by the same administration that is supposedly anti-gun ownership. I guess any rule can be bent for a little money.

So -- galvanize public opinion against private ownership of guns -- pistols, rifles, shotguns, etc. -- but permit various gangmembers, criminals, etc. nearly free access to Chinese assault weapons. How is that for the ultimate double standard? Does the current administration care about the safety of the American people, or about making a fast buck?

What do our allies and business partners all over the world think of our ethics? At one time I was proud to be an American.

To all:

The charts look very bad tonight, as you might imagine. Gold and the XAU have fallen near to the level they reached at the March low as the announcement was made about the Belgian central bank gold sale.

The downward momentum the gold stocks have achieved is pretty scary. And on weekly charts, there is NO oversold condition.

About the only hopeful sign I see is that when markets fall this rapidly, sometimes it is a sign of exhaustion and they can give a quick reversal and turnaround. This is known as a V-bottom.

Of course, always before a V-bottom is made, things look mighty bad. Well, they look mighty bad right now.

Newmont Gold has moved down to its low for the year. Bema has made a new low on this decline. Oddly, Glamis is still holding up fairly well.

When all you have left is hope, you hope. So let's hope a V-bottom is right in front of us and this market can turn on a dime.

Happy trading, if possible,

The Preacher


PS. BCIWN -- I couldn't get anyone at CFCM today. The secretary wasn't volunteering any info. Maybe tomorrow.

You and I must be of the same design. If I want gold to go up, it goes down. And if I want it to go down it goes up. So , get this, if you talk to yourself in a mirror you won't know who is really talking and then you can slip in an order to go the other way. This only works if you dont see your broker in the mirror with you. Unless your broker happens to be a georgeous chick. In that case get back in bed and the hell with the price of gold!!!

Want predictions? Here's a low risk one for Y2K.......More babies will be born in the month of September 2000 than ever before in the history of the planet.... ( Buy stock in companies that make baby stuff if/when the market crashes?....hmmmmmmm ) Oh, yeah - Go Gold!

How does one calculate the kitco sentiment index??

Anyone with independent confirmation of the information in this article? Or of any part of it? Are we plunging into a new cold war?

St Petersurg Times [Russia}

May 29th 1998 Bradley Cook

Clinton's China Syndrome

By Bradley Cook

U.S. DEFENSE analysts are wide-mouthed in awe over recent reports in The New York Times, The Washington Times and other newspapers, of the extent to which U.S. President Bill Clinton's administration has supported the massive transfer of military weapons technology from hi-tech U.S. companies to the People's Liberation Army of China. This transfer of technology has allowed China to vastly improve its guidance system for nuclear missiles. Even more astonishing is the revelation that China currently has 14 nuclear missiles targeted on the U.S. West Coast, and that Clinton overruled his Justice and State departments and the Pentagon to ensure Chinese access to technology to improve the accuracy of these missiles.

Human rights organizations continually accuse China of massive ongoing atrocities - including torture, executions, slave labor, human organ sales, arms proliferation and repression of religion - and provide documentary evidence to back up these allegations. In 1994, Clinton refused to make these human rights violations a factor in granting to China Most Favored Nation status, or MFN. MFN is a U.S. commercial designation that has been worth hundreds of billions of dollars in U.S. tax breaks to the PLA. As New York Times columnist Abe Rosenthal wrote last year: "The great part of U.S. business in China is with companies and cartels controlled by the Chinese military." The "Chinese military" is the PLA.

Consider the treatment given by the U.S. to China - a regime guilty of murdering hundreds of pro-democracy students in 1989 - and to India, the world's largest democracy. Clinton last week imposed a host of economic sanctions on India as punishment for nuclear weapons tests, cutting off virtually all U.S. aid, barring American banks from making loans to the Indian government and restricting the export of computers that might have military uses. Clinton issued these sanctions against India despite Pakistan's announcement in April that it had successfully tested its longest-range missile and is now capable of striking targets deep inside India; and despite Indian Defense Minister George Fernandes' assertion that China provided Pakistan with the technology to improve their India-targeted missiles.

Meanwhile, China's trade surplus with the United States since 1989 ( the year of the Tiananmen Square massacre ) has resulted in $105 billion in hard currency reserves. These reserves, according to military intelligence analysts, are being used by the PLA to buy Russian submarines, ships, planes and anti-ship missiles, all targeted on the U.S. 7th fleet in the Pacific Ocean.

A Chinese military attack against the United States? In 1996, Lt. General Mi Zhenyu, Vice Commander of the Academy of Military Sciences in Beijing, was quoted as saying, "[As for the United States], for a relatively long time it will be absolutely necessary that we quietly nurse our sense of vengeance ... We must conceal our abilities and bide our time."

The fact that the Clinton administration has allowed China not only to gain sensitive military technology but also to stuff its war chest via MFN status is made even more alarming by a U.S. Defense Department report on China's military intentions. The report, titled "Selected Military capabilities of the People's Republic of China," concluded that China is focused on developing "a capability to fight short-duration, high-intensity wars in the region" and defeating the U.S. Navy.

In 1994, a computerized war game at the U.S. Naval War College conceptualized a sea battle between U.S. and PLA navies off China's shores in the year 2010. The battle hypothesized that China continued to acquire military technology at a rapid pace - a pace that has accelerated with Clinton's approval. The game, which Pentagon officials have refused to talk about, ended with a PLA victory, according to reports in the military newspaper Navy Times.

Despite the advice of his own security, intelligence and defense experts concerning China, Clinton continues to appease. He personally intervened last year to allow a PLA front-company, the Chinese Overseas Shipping Company, or COSCO, to take over one of America's most fabled navy bases - the Long Beach Naval Air Station in Long Beach, California, as well as the George Air Force Base near Victorville, California. With a telephone call from Clinton himself, COSCO was given the rights to the Long Beach base for 50 years.

When asked about helping China by giving away U.S. "secrets" at a White House press conference on April 30, Clinton gave this bizarre reply: "We [U.S. and China] are trying to build the same kind of world in the future ... a very different kind of world."

The POG is relative to public sentiment. When Starr v. Clinton takes center stage in the media, or when countries like Japan begin dumping US greenbacks, or the Arabs decide not to provide cheap oil, or EMU decides to back the Euro with more than 20% gold bullion, or some other factor comes out of nowhere, gold will rocket up. The way I see it, the more physical or shares you can accumulate now, and be prepared to hold for a year, the smarter you will look when the current paradigm shifts. Don't worry, be happy...buy gold.

I'm still holding it. I figure after this short run up, it has to drop.

Preacher: I am 100% in favor of a V-bottom. This would be the time to have it. Problem is -- I would feel more confident if there was less 'paper' market brinksmanship going on.

Just where is that new cycle of devaluation going to start this time? South America? How long will it take for the gold and silver markets to absorb the Russian gold and silver? My guess is that the silver markets are hardest hit by the tonnes of silver leaving Russia -- is this discounted already?

Get ready for the crash. With deflation sweeping the world and the USD still supreme why not SELL GOLD. Only when US confidence is lost will gold rise. Notice the support for the DOW today, that was clear "keep the bubble " growin' manip but it is getting thin.

We all agreed, earlier this evening, there would be no bottom picking here at KITCO. V bottoms included.

Only a metaphor that has been used here a lot as a contrary indicator of the direction of the price of gold...my earlier reference to it was a judgement call of the overall negative feel of the forum today. Maybe someone can find a way to quantify this, or perhaps someone already has.

Promethius: Could be -- but I think it is more likely a backlash against placing the almighty profit motive above world peace and US national security. I would be disappointed if we stopped trade with China, but there are limits to what should be traded. And -- by now the Chinese must know that this WJC administration has 'no' stand on human rights within Chinese borders, and that they can sell any weapons technology to any country without fear of repercussions. All they need to do is tell the present US leaders that those sales of nerve gas cannisters to Iran won't happen again.

All,
seeking info on Anglogold, the largest AU producer. Read about it in
newsletter, but need to know how much forward sales they have committed.

This is an important factor in my decision to buy or not.

Goldbugs must be as patient and stubborn as anyone at anytime, anywhere.
Waiting for the worm to turn seems almost geologic in scale.

Steady as she goes...

I commented some time ago that the rally from January to April was a completed classic Elliott wave pattern; three waves up. The rally represented only a 12% retracement of the entire decline from Feb'96; not enought for a primary wave corrective rally. If that is the case then it was only wave ( a ) of a larger ABC rally. Wave ( b ) would unfold shortly. It did. As Preacher has suggested a V bottom may be the order of the day. I orginally thought a meandering triangle formation would take place for wave ( b ) ; in hindsight that would take too long to unfold. B waves are notorious for sharp advance or declines representing the middle part of the move. In this case many people think it is the resumption of the old bear market. If a quick zigzag is in store then today's lows or a re-test of the January lows is in order. I don't believe the disaster senarios are with us yet, unless the deflationary forces are stronger than anyone thinks.

The weekly momentum oscillator is showing very strong positive divergence from the January lows. This needs to stay in tact.

I'm as interested as anyone to see what happens.

Sojourn

Mirriors, I can't afford any, all my money is tied up in Gold. I am serious, I have been remodeling my home, work stops when Gold is below $ 350 - my wife is still with me....for now, she found a mirrior.

HighRise

You can contunie to be proud American.
What probably happened is a "sligthly planned screw up"
by customs brokers upon the order of the shipper, or
just pure screw-up. USG is also probably not invoved,
at least directly. I dealt with customs brokers a lot,
and they just love to screw-up, ALL OF THEM, NO EXCEPTION.
This is a big mystery of their profession. They usually get
the job done, but it will cost you...

Hey if you are asking for advice as to when to buy gold stocks, the answer was yesterday. If you wish to continue posting on this page , you are going to have to prove that you are a masochist and show us your gold stock certificates!!

I go out on the road for one day and look what you guys have done! Now I have to go and buy more because you can't be trusted with the POG!

I just hope gold comes back before my wife finds out how much I am down. Or I am going to be a single man again. For the third time. Man, this gambling can get tough on the family life!!

We haven't heard from Midas in several hours....and as EB pointed out, now is not a good time for Midas to be alone......Midas, let's talk...let 'er rip....you're not alone in this.... ( click ) ( boom! )

.

Well, I for one am going to set out a few hooks tonight and see if I can catch some carp.

http://quote.yahoo.com/q?s=RANGY&d=1d
http://quote.yahoo.com/q?s=HM&d=1d
http://quote.yahoo.com/q?s=DROOY&d=1d
http://quote.yahoo.com/q?s=SSC&d=1d
http://quote.yahoo.com/q?s=PAASF&d=1d

Uh, well, it was Monicas day to watch the price of gold but she couldnt see the screen because she was down on her knees "tying Bills shoelaces.!
I think we should fire her and take her before a grand jury!!! All in favor say I!!!

oris: I sometimes get a bit carried away. I hope you are right about that screwup with the Chiness assault rifles. Problem is -- we do need more ethical leadership -- we cannot afford to continue encouraging nuclear proliferation. I suspect that we are moving from a period of peace to a period of conflict in a number of areas on this planet, and our US military ( with current executive leadership ) is ill-prepared for the policeman role.

I like the concept but you're right: how to quantify it
objectively? While we're on the subject: how many MarketVane
gold bulls i wonder?

Carp fishing or not, that is the question? Carp=goldfish for all you dumb Mericans.

http://quote.yahoo.com/q?s=NEM&d=1d

http://quote.yahoo.com/q?s=CEF&d=1d

Midas, are you still hanging in there with us? This ain't easy is it, I probably have another margin call tomorrow.

Guess I will have to dig out a few more credit cards........and buy some more. I may watch tis deflation in the CRB for a while first.

HighRise

Hey, just being here proves my masochism ( over a year now ) . As for my stock certificates, I am saving them to wallpaper my house. I figure another two years of this and will have interesting wallpaper. The question still stands.

and oh, please stop the whining.

Gambling hard on the family life? Gambling? I thought
we were all doing prudent investing.

Its time for me to leave tonight but not without my prediction for tomorrow. Does anybody want to hear it?

oris: Do your connections in Russia have any idea how much gold and silver was sold, and when? This might be very helpful in guessing when to go long on gold again. I don't think the South Americans have much gold left -- but Hong Kong might still have some to mess up a nice gold rally. Thanks in advance

I couldn't find Marketvane on the web, but here's the same idea from another service. Updated on Wednesdays - looks like it will be in the lower regions by the time it is updated again. http://www.topline-charts.com/HotCharts/GSAIIndex.htm

BCIWIN: Perhaps you shouldn't give us your prediction for tomorrow. If you guess wrong it will only make you feel worse. By the way, never ignore the wife factor -- it makes you a better investor. When I do well, she builds me up -- but when I do poorly I really get it. Also -- make sure she knows what you are doing. Then at least you won't get it later when she finds out about those bad trades you didn't tell her about. I know all about that -- won't do that again.

I'll sucker...what's your take?

The first in a series of "off topic" posts from a skeptic of the "Sky is falling" school..... ( though it does seem to be showing cracks here & there... )

Global Warming: So Much Hot Air:
Environmentalists, Note

Edited by Scott Reeves
Copyright 1998 Barron's Magazine
May 25, 1998



At last December's U.N. meeting in Kyoto, Japan, the U.S. agreed to cut emissions of greenhouse gases 7% below
1990 levels. At best, according to a climate model developed by the National Center for Atmospheric Research and
recently featured in Science magazine, this would reduce average planetary warming by 0.19 degree Celsius over the
next 50 years.

Patrick J. Michaels, a professor of environmental sciences at the University of Virginia and a senior fellow at the
Cato Institute in Washington, says it's doubtful that the current network of surface thermometers could measure such
a minor change from normal year-to-year variations. Since 1986, the average temperature of the earth has shown no
significant warming, despite incessant press ballyhoo. Three independent checks -- temperature measured at the
earth's surface, temperature of the lower atmosphere measured by weather balloons and temperature of the lower
atmosphere measured by satellite -- show no statistically significant change.

Some global climate models have predicted that the world's mean temperature should already have risen by 1.3-2.3
degrees Celsius because major greenhouse emissions began in the late 19th century. Such figures provided the basis
for the Framework Convention on Climate Change, signed in Rio in 1992. But the observed warming since the late
19th century is only 0.6 degrees Celsius.

Ten years ago, Michaels argued that forecasts of dramatic global warming were likely to be wrong because only
minor climate changes had been observed until that time.

So, it doesn't look like global warming is going to fry us, but treaties to limit its anticipated effects may cook
economic growth. If the U.S. complies fully with the Kyoto agreement, Michaels says the U.S. gross domestic
product will decline 2.3% a year.

As hobos in the Great Depression used to say, "If we had some ham, we could have some ham and eggs -- if we had
some eggs."

I didn't read deep enough below the chart - the gold bulls indicator IS from Market Vane.

All: I have a suggestion regarding when to buy gold. Whatever you do, don't buy gold unless: 1 ) Gold bullion showed a very bullish technical trend -- like it shot up to $320/oz in two days, or 2 ) The commodity price index is rising again.

One of the most effective anti-gold indicators known is a dropping commodity price index. I forgot to watch -- and it got me, too. Indicators are not much good it you forget to watch them. G'nite all!

Thanks for the link. I like to study financial astrology too.
Wonder what Arch Crawford sees?

OK, no prediction. And I am going back to the bedroom to tell my wife how much money we are losing. Good advice JTF.

Don't Do It!

HighRise

JTF dont read this. Tomorrow gold is going down the crapper. The only question is how fast and how far... Unles of coarse it goes up!!!

The blood of his BCIWN's broken marriage is on your hands....wives come and go.....but there's only one kitco...uh huh...

Was only kidding hiRise. I might be a masochist but I dont think i am an idiot!! But thanks.

Despite my dislike for Mr. Clinton, he's merely following a hundred year old policy of American government. Truman is the one who sold Taiwan out many years ago, so I guess you could dig him up and try him for mopery. IMHO

There has been a mutual regard between the two countries for many years. The only difference is that when China was old and corrupt and the US was young and healthy we were the ones who sent military envoys there. We are merely another layer of dust on the floor of the temple of history. IMHO

Great timing! I also read that article ( Fleetstreet, I presume ) and am curious if any Kicoites have an opinion on Anglogold. It would be nice to catch the biggest gold producer in the world at the bottom, no?

I don't have your e-mail at this computer.

steve@familyjeweler.com

Come to think of it, if I had invested in gold instead of wives, I would be WAAAAYYYY ahead now. Even if gold was $25/oz.

Shame on you for reminding me!!!

All: Here is the Nikkei from a different source. Heading down on June 1. June 2 data should show up soon, I would think.

http://web.kyoto-inet.or.jp/people/je3tbc/html/sthome.html

Who said it was a ripple on the water?

Ozzie current accout deficit just blown out by $2 billion.
Now up to $7.5 billion.

Needless to say the market's tanking along with our gold stocks.

OZ All Ords down 44pts

In somewhat the same manner, husbands come and go ( to sleep ) and there's still just one kitco. Now, that even's it out, yes, sir.

http://www.afund.com http://www.astropro.com/contents.html

Are you a girl??

All: Looks bearish in Asia -- unless I've got temporal amnesia. Good night from upover -- sharefin, and our other friends downunder!

http://www.bloomberg.com/markets/asia.html

NO.....but I'm a very sensitive fellow.

No offense intended. Pretty good prediction huh??

Ya must be crazy. Right "Old Gold" ? Where is TED?

Repent at leisure.

In my last query on starting a new cold war, I wasn't thinking in terms of US/China relations, oh no. Rather, seeing the news out of Iran that they're ready to cozy up to Pakistan and settle their disputes over Afghanistan. And the excitement of the Palestinians ( reported in the Iranian news this morning. I followed the link from Kitco ) about the Islamic Bomb. Pakistan says they can make 'em. Iran wants to buy 'em. We're seeing a major shift here in alliances and power. India/Pakistan, Iran/Israel? You see? Patterns shifting all over the place. What would it take from here to generate a new jihad?

Bankable.

Gold went down yesterday after starting up in earlier day trading.
Today, from the looks of the prices right now, which are down in
Gc,Si and Pl, I feel that this is a good sign for the opposite to
happen. That means we start with a little gap down, but finish the
day on the upside. What we should be looking for, I will, is increased
volume.
Some stocks like GLG ( Glamis ) have held up better than others, but that
means nothing, as not all stocks move in tandem. We may see many gold
stocks turn up from these levels, while a stock like GLG may suddenly
take a sharp hit.
The near term stochastics are also very low,- so expect a turn in the
next day or two. IMVHO.

I heartily agree with your prediction. Now get back to the bedroom and make your wife so happy she won't care if you lose all your money.

BBML

True, neither gender has a corner on the jerk market.

1. US military seems to be well prepared for any
military conflict of "world police" scale. The problem is
that political leadership may not allow military to win...
Sounds strange? Think about it. Old Soldier will probably
confirm the importance for military commander to act upon
pure military neccessity, and not political directives...
Nothing hurts military success more then hesitation
assuming all intellegence is correct. Political leadership
is a source of hesitation.

2. All I can say to you now in regard to Russia:

It is not central bank which is selling or PLAN to sell
its RESERVES, those are private banks selling EXTRA supplies
they bought for less from current producers of broke
companies ( in need of cash ) , also for less then market price.
It is pure business - buy low/sell high, and quantities are
very small, but rumors generated by WESTERN traders are very
big....shortsellers got a good legend and cover to shortsell..

Yes, would be....
could be....
But I have learned that you must do due diligence, for any and all investments, particularly gold stocks. Then you must argue with yourself, even once you have the facts, as to whether it has the remotest chance. Add to this the uncertainties about predicting the future, and whether you should just buy lottery tickets instead.
Still looking for the forward sales information; perhaps someone familiar with South African Gold Stocks. AGOLY was down today, and I expect it to give more ground if this downtrend continues.

thanks

http://www.pcis.net/jeannev/spda0601.gif
If this is correct the next few weeks should be a serious move down to under 1000.

after listening to many call in shows the
only Clinton defenders in large part are
women and blacks,women I can
understand,blacks are another
problem.......women buy into a smooth
talking,fast moving slick operator,and if he
says what they want to hear...saving the
children,taking care of them from cradel to
grave,bingo....meanwhile everything he is
doing is selling them down the river
exploting a natural function of women being
compasonate.......compassion will kill you ever time

Did you ever wonder what happens to money when it is taken out of service? If its gold its melted and recycled, but what about paper?

http://dailynews.yahoo.com/headlines/human_interest/oddly_enough/story.html?s=z/reuters/980601/odd/stories/cash_1.html

http://www.gold.globalcenter.net

All,
1 ) The properties/consumers/infrastucture ect nearly "Dead"!
2 ) Gold retail/wholesales markets drop sharply . ( 70% or more )
3 ) Fear of the 2nd currencies attack,leave the Stock and currencies markets sinking!
4 ) more coms bank-kruptcyyyyyy!
5 ) nuclear alert scared away foreign fund and investors!
6 ) instabilty in INDONESIA....storms behind the curtain...the tense built up dai by day!
7 ) inflation
8 ) RESSESSIONSSIONSSIONSSION!
9 ) YEN DOWN
10 ) REMINBI AND HONG KONG DOLLARS down
11 ) Xxxxxxx
12 ) xxxxxx
13 )
14 ) ask jtf,
15 ) ask DONALD,NICK,STEVE from downunder!
16 ) vronsky asia corner tell you all.
17...

bye..take care.life still go on!
JIN

Oris, 22:27 You are, as so often, exactly correct. The executive should designate the enemy. The details of his destruction are the realm of the military commander. I am reminded of FDR's instructions to Eisenhower. "Invade the Continent of Europe and defeat the enemy." Actually, General of the Army George C. Martial was sitting at the conference table when FDR made the decision verbally and not so eloquenly. Marshal grabbed a piece of paper, scralled the above and shoved it in front of Roosvelt for signture. It is now in the National Archives. The instructions for Vietnam filled volumes. No wonder we lost.

Check out the daily charts for Oil, Cotton, Copper, Gold, etc.
http://bohl.minot.com/
http://bohl.minot.com/display.pl
They are bouncing along the bottom - I hope this is the bottom.

And yes, of course that compost is used exclusively in the cultivation of money trees, from which an ever increasing supply of notes is harvested. As more is grown, the more compost is generated, thereby generating even more. A growth industry. Get out your wheelbarrows...

My analysis suggests that we are in for a period of decline through the month of June. Looking at the TSE gold index we have fallen into oversold condition on the slow stochastic and the RSI. The RSI went below 40 a week ago bounced back to the 40 mark and headed down again, a harbinger of an extended decline lasting from 3 1/2 to 5 1/2 weeks if past history is a prelude to the future. Five weeks will put us at the beginning of July which is a good guess for a bottom in this decline. Bull markets either start at the beginning of the year or in the June/July period. I'm hoping that a low in late June early July holds. We will be hearing lots of scarey talk about meltdown of the world economy, etc. and will have to suck it in and buy anyway if we want to buy at a potential bottom.

http://www.kitco.com/gold.live.html

A friend of mine went to the local coin store here in So. Oregon today to buy some coins as the price is so low. Well, seems that there is a 5-6 week wait to receive any coins you order. Used to be that you picked up the coins you bought on the same day that you paid for them. The low price as well as Y2k preparedness has dried up the supply here. The local coin store said that he had 2 STOCK BROKERS in to buy! The time is at hand for skyrocketing prices!!!!

"If you wanted to sell a bunch of gold, would you wait

until the market was as thin as possible?"

So what's the motive to sell gold into a thin market? To drive the price down. What's the motive for the seller to drive the price down? To buy it back later at a lower price? Takes a lot of coordination among a lot of countries that aren't all that friendly with each other. My guess is that it's more a simple matter that gold is being sold by distressed parties to cover short term obligations and getting bought up almost as fast by countries with strong currencies and lots of debt to build reserves to defend against the devaluating effects on their currencies when they start to choke on their debt. Cycles in capitalism are all about debt, and even though the dollar is riding high now, ultimately the country holding the most debt when the music stops is the biggest loser. Which would you rather be holding when the default dominos start to fall, dollars, US Treasuries, Swiss francs, or gold?

"Insider selling of stocks picked up considerably some

weeks ago, much of it by fund managers out of their

personal accounts even as they encouraged their clients

to buy more. Many advisory services have now begun to

be negative so I guess they about done with getting

their own butts out of the fire."

You got that right. Two financial advisors I know have over just the past two months gone from calling me "a big 'ol bear" ( this from a 26 year old fund manager ) to telling me they personally are out of the market and are fearing for their future. One told me she has clients calling her "all day long" ( she says, rolling her eyes ) asking about Y2K and telling her they're literally stuffing cash under the matress.

"Much of this money will just sit as cash and/or go into

short term treasuries. Flight capital is not going to

be in anything long term right now."

I agree. They're in for a couple of gnarly surprises, to wit:

1 ) The government can legally turn your short term treasuries into long term treasuries ( Sure you can have your T-Bills money back, with interest... in five years )

2 ) Your broker doesn't have to give you cash. When you sell your crashing mutual fund, he can give you crashing IBM stock instead of cash, if that's all he's got.

"The market will crash, the economy will start down, and

eventually longer term bonds will begin to look good if

there is any expectation the Fed will lower rates."

Lowering rates is the first thing the fed will do to try to get the plane's nose back up again, to use your excellent analogy. I've been thinking lately I might diversify into bonds for any money I will not need access to for a while. I'm 20/80 gold/cash.

"If during any of this sequence cash and treasuries start

to look risky there will come a renewed interest in

precious metals and other forms of real assets."

Regarding my earlier point, the dollar will be hit hard if we have a depression, since depressions are all about clearing debt out of the financial system, and who's got more debt than the USA? Last time 'round the US was a creditor nation. The US doesn't have that advantage now.

"Any number of things could triger this. A bank or

brokerage house failure, a crises in the white house,

unexpected death of a key financial figure and so

forth."

The list of possible crises is endless, but isn't that always the case? Haven't we already had enough crises to create this effect? Imagine the effect on the stock market and gold prices of Pakistan/India nuke tests in 1980. The problem now is that the US thinks it's invincable, immune. That's why the US stock market shrugs off the collapse of Asian economies. Until the lightening starts lighting the night sky in NYC, gold will languish.

-EJ

http://europe.cnn.com/QUICKNEWS/#World

Are you sure? Is that site live or dead like the Kitco charts? Green light is on but that doesn't mean S+++ around here. Gold @ 288.20 for hours. Out of all the sites/URLs, which is correct? No other market has this problem.

Gold could be at 200 and we wouldn't know it. We just have to wait till the day is 2/3 over before we get spot quotes. Pretty sad, IMHO.

Sorry, if this some sort of holiday again, seems we have two or three every week now.

HighRise

This evening I watched the 20-20 program on T.V. ( thats a hour news magazine type show for you un-North Americans ) . They featured a story about how Donald Trump ( rich Casino/Real estate tycoon ) got Atlantic City to use emminent domain law to force a little old lady out of her home so that he could buy the property and convert it to a parking lot for the limos of people that use his casino. The city told the old lady that her property was worth about 1/6 of what Trump paid for a similar but smaller property. So the wealthy use the politicians to steal the property of the less well connected for bargain basement prices. They did a few man on the street interviews and got responses like "its thieves law" ( I liked that one ) and "I guess we don't live in a free country". Maybe a few people are beginning to get the picture.

HONG KONG ( AP ) - Gold in Hong Kong opened at $287.55 an ounce on Tuesday, down $5.10 from Monday's close of $292.65 an ounce.

http://www.smh.com.au/news/9806/02/world/index.html

Subject: Vet Story

A man runs into the vet's office carrying his dog, screaming for

help. The vet rushes him back to an examination room and has him put

his dog down on the examination table. The vent examines the still,

limp body and after a few moments tells the man that his dog is dead.

The man, clearly agitated and not willing to accept this, demands a

second opinion. The vet goes into the back room and comes out with a

cat and puts the cat down next to the dogs body. The cat sniffs the

body, walks from head to tail poking and sniffing the dog's body and

finally looks at the vet and meows. The vet looks at the man and

says, "I'm sorry, but the cat thinks your dog is dead too."

The man, finally resigned to the fate of his dog, thanks the vet and

asks how much he owes. The vet answer, "$350."

"$350 to tell me my dog is dead?!" exclaims the man.

"Well," the vet replies, "I would have only charged you $50 for my

initial diagnosis. The additional $300 was for the cat scan."

http://www.smh.com.au/news/current/breaking/index.html

Sat May 30 1998 02:08 mozel ( @Tom @EJ ) ID#153102: US citizens are not confused only about gold, they think equities are as safe an investment as securities, but return higher rates. Why else do they keep putting ever more of their hard earned dollars into stocks without even demanding dividends? When they learn the hard way that equities are very high risk, in spite of recent historical experience, and that in fact securities may not be as good as "money in the bank" and that in fact "money in the bank" may not be "money in the bank" then what's left?
-EJ

Do not have many soothing answers now, except to say the deflation theme is rampant among the hedge funds.
Bonds up, transports down, commodities all trashed, Dow up. Tech stocks trashed. By the way, maybe of interest, I posted two weeks ago our commentary, "High Tech, The Boom Bust Cycle of a Generation", and got not one response on this sight. The whole report is on our website, www.venerosogold.com.
The best of the best insider gold bullion analysts we know thought $295 was the downside for gold. We said $290. Gold now at $288+. We think brutal overkill by the avengers ( hedge funds ) . We know the Dutch are or have been until very, very recently still there, sitting on the market. Fear selling is everywhere.
Somehere in here, sanity will prevail. We advise hold tight on all gold related investments.

Bill Murphy

Cotton is by no means scraping bottom.......uh uh.

In fact it is BOOMING......uh huh.

away.......to the gin

eliwitney

was predicted by the commitment of traders pattern

I noticed that, others could be ready to bounce? Cotton really has bounced off the bottom that must be one of those classic V bottoms they were tlaking about earlier.

Cotton is saying something, I am not sure what, could be Pakistan and Indian Military uniforms?

HighRise

It has been awhile since I posted some of my thoughts but lets see......

There are 149,568 ounces of gold in comex warehouses that are 'eligible' for delivery against 160,445 contracts.

Hmmm?


That looks like less than one ounce for each l00 ounce contract!! But yet their are 927,753 ounces in 'registered' gold in comex warehouses.

Seems to me that this is the case of the emperor wore no clothes! But you can look at the Montgomery Ward catalog to see new clothes!!!! You just can not but them at this price!

The flow of gold into and out of comex portends future events my friends. Something big is going on, and it isn't betting on the downside!

Sorry to ruin the doom and gloom here.

Arden

"As a rule, there is nothing that offends us more than a new kind of money. We felt humiliated during the early days of the war when we were no longer paid in heavy little disks of gold, and had to accept paper pounds and ten shillingses. We even sneered at the design. We always sneer at the the design of new money or a new stamp. But we hated the paper even more than the new design. We could not believe it had any value. We spent it as though it were paper. One would as soon have thought to collect old newspapers as of playing the miser with it. That is probably the true-secret in the fall of the value of money. Economists explain it in other ways. But it seems likeliest that paper money lost its value because we did not value it. Shopkeepers took advantage of our foolish innocence, and the tailor demanded sums in paper that he would never have dared to ask in gold. I doubt if the habit of thrift will ever be restored till the gold currency comes back. Gold is the only metal for which human beings have any lasting respect. No one but a child would save up pennies. There is something in gold -- the colour, perhaps, reminding us of the sun, the god of our ancestors -- that puts us into the mood of worshipers. The children of Israel found it impossible not to worship the golden calf. They have gone on worshiping it ever since. Had the calf been paper, they would, I feel confident, have remained good Christians."

Robert Lynd
'The Three-Halfpenny Bit'
The Pleasures of Ignorance, 1930

could be the thing that finally arouses the sheep from their slumber in the US.

It's not just "emminent domain" laws, it's asset forfeiture, which is being used by corrupt federal agencies to steal innocent people's property.

What is most astounding to me is how corrupt agencies are not afraid to intimidate people even when they are in danger of being exposed through lawsuits. Have a look at http://www.qui-tam.com/ to see a description of astounding arrogance, the justice department, the Resolution Trust and the US marshall service are colluding to cover up mistakes they made in dealing with a corrupt judge and lawyer, preferring to destroy the lives of a family in Massechusetts rather than deal with the consequences of their folly.

- Steve

I hate to say I told you so but........

"was predicted by the commitment of traders pattern"

Would you be kind enough to elaborate on what this means, Thanks.

HighRise

Then Don't.

HighRise

I saw the same story on 20/20. It really reminded me what I have read on Kitco. We do not OWN anything. We are just leasing or borrowing from the Government. People are too stupid to realize this. That IDIOT woman should have negotiated with Trump a little, settled on 1.5 million, and been satisfied. Instead she got greedy, got lawyers involved, and got what she deserved. I usually agree with John Stossel, but he was very one sided in that story. That old woman was no better than Trump, and her house WAS ugly.

PPT + 3 oz - 2 stuffed it again.

your statement about women voting is valid but not really. While it would appear that we elect our president, thus is not the case. Slick was actually given the job by Elites. Don't really know what to call them anymore, you could call them Bilderbergers orTrilats but whatever you call them they run the show from all directions. They decicide where the wars are,who the peoples puppets are, what currencies rise and what currencies fail. They decide how high gold can go and when it's time for the dows freefall. Don't get me wrong, you still have freewill to do as you please. Just don't mess with important issues and you live your life like they are not even there.

GC Q8
August Gold
2895
-11
-0.4
2906
2893
27.1K
I don't know how current this is, but it is as good as anything other info available - from futures chart.

HighRise

"Green Convertable Currency"

"The primary practical effect of a negative-interest currency is a strong incentive to avoid hoarding. People prefer to spend the currency very quickly on goods or services and thereby generate a chain reaction of economic transactions that otherwise would occur much more slowly or simply not at all."

Point is, currencies that are not backed by gold or silver are perceived by users to have less tangible value. They are more readily spent, thus helping to propel capitalist economies forward without the incentives created by inflation. Or, you could say non-backed currencies are inherently inflationary.

-EJ

It is not just paper that people object to when it comes to new "money". We have new C$1 coins about twice the weight of a 25 cent piece--almost gold colour and a newer bigger C$2 coin with the centre 50% also near gold colour. Makes your pocket very heavy real quick. It isn't the paper people dislike --its the change.

I think gold could go much lower. Think about it, we are up against the combined power of the whole worlds Central Banks!! Our time will come when they lose control. Until then we will get killed. On the other hand, when gold turns up after they have lost control, there may not be time to get onboard. Until then we will lose. The everyday
guy is going to have to lose faith in the system. Will Japan going under start things off? Korea defaulting? Civil war in Russia ( again ) ?
I'm done buying until silver goes to $3.50 or gold at $200. I'm up to my eyeballs in stocks and physical, no more. If my wife found out how far down we are down! BANG!! I'm dead.

That is interesting Highrise......I have many customers in the military and few came in today to pick up their contacts and told me they were being deployed somewhere ( could not tell me where ) and that it was a "hot" place.....or will be heating up soon. I was very curious but did not press further for details............didn't want the young laddies to have to kill me with their bare hands.......nope.

anyway.....I am trying to figure out this Cotton thingy myself. I am on the right end of cotton though.......this time. ;- ) .... ( yahoo! )

away........to w/w



Heard him talking about computer stuff...offered to help...found out later in the evening he is a computer wizard, that kid is still laughing at me...Hmmmmmmmmmmmm, yeah, me MR. SCHMARTGUY...a man so far inept I cannot locate the tent opening!!!

When you decide to come down to earth, you might want to explore "Commitment of Traders". One way - just a suggestion - might be thru a charting service - just one of many good ones that include 'Commitment of Traders' patterns ( COT ) -- a service such as Commodity Trend Service's Futures Charts. I think they might offer you a trial subscription, at phone 1-800-331-1069; or you might try visiting them at http://cts.dearborn.com.

If you sincerely, are 'brand new' at 'COT', you might re-focus your energy from kitco narratives, to other avenues of perhaps more focussed research.

Just a suggestion.

Where they test and launch missiles................hmmmmmm.

away....to add more 'stuff' to ponder



away to make tea for me MUMM...to all...SWEET DREAMS...NAMASTE'

In a few hours, I'm off to buy some gold--- I still beleive in cost averaging. But somehow I get the feeling that I'm a main character in an episode of Rod Sterling's 'Twilight Zone'. I can hear the music.
Anyways, this is one heck of a site. Good posts and good people!!!!

Did you ever notice that gold starts a slde right at correction time? Couldn't be that they are trying to make it look like there is no other option so you might as well keep that $$$ in the market. Naaa Well maybe

Yes, they especially want people to consider US Bonds the "Safe Haven" above all other investments like Gold.

CNBC talking heads, many times this am talked of investors moving to safe havens - bonds and blue chips.

Good night all, I hope tomorrow is a better day for all.

HighRise