On Canada's economic health: Let say that your currently earn $100K per year and until last year you were spending several $K above your revenus. During these years of spending more than you earned, you built a debt that now exceed somewhat your $100K of annual revenus...and of course, your bank put the squeeze on you...asking to control your expenses..which you did. You are now in good shape because you now spend a bit less than you earn..so you can start to pay a few dimes on your debt every year..
You think your fine.

All this occured during 15-20 years of great economic expansion when you had stable and growing revenus. But now, the recession and possibly a depression is just around the corner. It is possible that some unforeseen problems will cause interest rates to rise big time...or worst, your employer could possibly cut your salary or even your job if things get that rough.. Keep in mind you can no longer cut in your expenses as you are running lean and mean.

Selby...are you in good shape ?

Hiroshi Ota Yomiuri Shimbun Business Editor,
Wednesday August 26. 1998
[Excerpts]
"Another factor contributing to the sell-off of Japanese assets is the vanity of U.S. dealers who claim that the Japanese government and financial authorities are incompetent.

What does the "hard landing" that they advocate actually mean?

Does it mean that, weakened by the collapse of the biggest economic bubble in history--with the loss of 1.3 yen quadrillion--big banks should end up at the mercy of ruthless international speculators and possibly be thrown out of business?

That would trigger a depression--not just for Japan but for the world.

Those who argue for a hard landing apparently do not know their financial ABCs. It would merely play into the hands of the international speculative fund and hedge fund operators who reaped huge profits by systematically selling Japanese financial shares short during the panic last November.

It is a fundamental responsibility of the government and the central bank to protect the nation, and in turn the international financial system, from market "violence."

The difficulty in resolving the problems originates from the fact that the financial world functions on the basis of trust, a highly unstable commodity.

In playing to the masses and hard-landing advocates, the media could end up responsible for a depression. As a member of the media myself, I must give this matter some serious thought.
http://www.yomiuri.co.jp/newse/0826ec22.htm

if it hits either Armstrong's target of $190 or Precheter's target of $100, it would most likely be a spike low with a nice V bottom. From what I can tell from historical chart patterns, the longer something lingers like the metals are doing now, the higher the probability that they will move lower. Silver gave you 1 chance to sell at $7.50 for about 15 seconds. How many times have we been under $5 - too many from what I can tell. A good bottom should be like a top. You are either ready or misss the boat. Chances are, if gold went to $190, the dollar would be up in nearly the same percentage terms so I don't think mines ourside of the US will be effected as much by $200 gold as the price may sound. Gold shouldn't drop to $200 if the dollar declines. If it does, it would most likely happen if the dollar takes off big time.

Today, Matt Drudge reported that Monica Lewinsky had her credit cards paid off by the White House. THAT, my friends, is a CLEAR PAPER TRAIL.

There are also rumors of more kinky sex stories on the way, involving Monica's body fluids and mentrual cycle.

And one poster in alt.current-events.clinton.whitewater claims to have a source in D.C. that has confirmed that drug use is a topic of investigation by Starr. : )

Indeed, this is some kind of indirect proof what really
took place. When people have nothing to hide, they are
looking for honorable person to back them up...in most
cases it's a natural attitude.

Nope. I'm like the C$. But I wouldn't be any better off with a lot of gold in the bank either.

Where is the Drudge report on credit cards?

treasuries and 466,000 in money market and credit union accounts
at the end of 1997'according to APress recently. Does he think
the shee shee is hitting the fan?

Bros!

The Second Law of Thermodynamics in A Major

Drudge was live on a television show. A brief confirmation of
his comments are in alt.current-events.clinton.whitewater, under
the heading "DRUDGE SCOOP". I confirmed this story with
my sister who saw the television show. Here's the posting,

************************
Drudge is reporting that Lewinsky testified that her
credit card bill was paid in exchange for her
silence.

No details.

Hmmmm...I wonder....does the Constitution mention
anything about bribery and impeachment?

We are indeed fortunate here in USA to have living examples of the way we
expect leaders to be. Let us now dump those that do not live up and try to at least recapture credibility in the community of man. This will not cost us anything, at least in inflated US$ terms.

Thanks. Odd he doesn't have that on his web site yet but maybe he is saving it for tomorrow.

The point I was trying to make was that a fiat currency derives its value from the government and economy that issues it. When either cease to function properly ( or possibly at all ) the currency has little or no purchasing power. Right now this is happening all over the world as currencies and even commodities devalue relative to the U.S. dollar representing the strongest economy and military in the world. What happens to the dollar when we join them via Y2K? Very short term we'd get massive deflation since something like 98% of the money is electronic and is either inaccessible or has gone to e-heaven. A little while after that, with the country possible in chaos and the federal government probably in the worst shape of all, people will stop seeing dollars as money and start seeing them as just paper. They'll barter instead and will want tangible goods and services in exchange for their tangibles. When that happens the dollar is done for. Sounds crazy right now in summer '98 but who knows in spring 2000? I sure don't so I'm diversifying into electrons, paper and metal. BBML.

August 25, 1998

Japan opposition boycotts debate, bills in doubt

TOKYO, Aug 26 ( Reuters ) - Japan's political opposition faced off against the government on Wednesday, boycotting debate on government bills meant to rid banks of their mountain of bad loans.

After late-night discussions, three key opposition groups agreed to jointly submit their own counter-proposals to the government's plans, a move that will likely delay any legislation and make overseas markets even more nervous about Japan's willingness to tackle the huge bank problem.

The boycott is meant to protest the government's treatment of the ailing Long-Term Credit Bank of Japan Ltd ( LTCB ) , seen by the opposition as a taxpayer-funded bailout.
http://www.freecartoons.com/ReutersNews/JAPAN-BANKS.html

chit chat and more thinking. Please?

I have not heard of this.

Maybe related to the coming derivatives boom...


Swing chart updated
http://www.cairns.net.au/~sharefin/Markets/Swing.jpg
Still heading up.
Watch out next time it heads down.

Seems like a dead rally.

Good night

http://www.drudgereport.com/flash.htm

Even if you assume the worse case scenario, in order for society to move back to a barter state you are assuming order rather than chaos. If Y2K was really as bad as some try to make it, there will be no barter. The hoards of people on welfare have nothing to barter. They will come take your gold, food, wife and maybe leave the kids. I seriously doubt that gold would help much. Society can't make such abrupt changes in an orderly fashion. That's the crisis in Russia. They never paid taxes under communism and they are not willing to pay them now. You get sheer chaos. If Y2K was really that bad, you are talking war. In that case, I think food rises to the top of the list because you can't eat gold.

A couple of points Jeff. Why would he buy a gold mine if he truly believed gold will head down to $190 per oz?. Second Greenspan may not have any choice but to cut interest rates. The world is deflating rapidly and it is being felt by many sectors of the American economy. Look at the farmers and many high-tech firms. Recently syquest let go of 85% of their work force and today Applied Materials cut 2200 people. Ask the longshoremen from the POrts of Long Beach and Los Angeles about the jam packed cargoes coming from Asia and the empty cargoes going back. The farmers can apply for subsidies and did recently miners basically can't. What is really happening is that the US economy is not as strong as people believe. Consider that two-thirds of the domestic economy is the
consumer. Today for the second consecutive consumer confidence declined. Consider that car loans and personal loans are tied to the prime rate which is 8.5% and mortgages are tied to the 10 year bond rate. What is really going on is that the American consumer is not saving ( saving rate 0.6% ) , is re-financing their home with a first or second mortgage therefore getting money @ less than 5.5%. This is how the consumer is continuing to spend more than they make. This can continue for a while but if there is a major crash or correction you will have margin calls and the consumer confidence number will plummet and so will the economy.

You state that there are many mines that are profitable at $150. Name a few. Let's take Barrick as an example, considered one of the premier mines in the world. Their cash cow the Betz-Post mine produced 1.6 million oz @$171. This is not an all inclusive number however. They would have a hard time producing gold @$150. Most companies would be bankrupt. I stand by this statement. Ask someone in the minng industry if you don't believe me.

Finally stating that countries have had their currencies devalued so they can survive isn't really realistic. How much exploration is going on in Australia or Canada? I am not totally familiar with australian environment but in Canada there is very little exploration because mining companies are having a hard time raising capital. You can't produce gold if you can't get money to continue operations. I stand by my comments about Armstrong.

I relay the following information with extreme concern. I have been retired from the US Army for two years and have a son on active duty now. All American forces in Germany and Naval units in the Persian Gulf and Indian Ocean have been placed in defense Condition #2 ( War is Imminent ) Israeli forces have gone to full war status National Guard asking for vo
lunteers for immediate middle east deployment. All passes and leaves for American troops in germany ( combat units ) have been cancelled ( my son included ) US Naval vessels have been dirverted from port to middle east. WAR IN MIDDLE EAST IS IMMINENT...
"s A lot of people are about to lose their life...Thanks in part to Comrade Clinton the biggest Traitor in American History.....

There is no such thing as an empty space, a space without field.
Space time does not claim existence on its own, but only as a
structural quality of the field. There exists no space empty of
field. Mind is massed, as in this case, the collective mind of
most of this planet. Mind is massed and the worlds are born.
Pain will soon turn to gain. Y2K and the EURO are looming on
the horizon like twin locomotives on steel rails at light speed.
The time frame is short indeed. Most of you goldbugs I would say
might after all the loss might be coined, ( pardon pun ) , meek.
But think hard on this, you fully know where it says ,"THE MEEK
WILL INHERIT THE EARTH". I think this will soon happen and I am
no goldbug. But my thinking is quickly changing.

Mike Sheller -When the candle burns out and the magic turns to Gold and old age ( Tired of the past ) becomes not. Then let all know your true goal. Let the Stars Shine.

RJ: Glad to hear you are no longer a gold bear -- I gather your news gathering network has picked up the CB buying instead of selling news. Am I right that your shift is based on assuming there are no gold fire sales from a currency collapse? I think we can rule out Venezuela, probably Russia, probably Japan, but what of Germany? How will they handle their defaulted Russian debt problems? I'm still dumbfounded as to how the 1+ trillion in bad debt from the Oct 97 SEAsia episode is going to be rolled over into some taxpayers lap, let alone Japanese and Communist Chinese debt.

My point is that we all know the equilibrium price of gold may not go below 280/oz in the near future, but there is certainly enough life left in the 'fiat' currency system for another 'gold fire sale'. Perhaps we need ping II, as sharefin would say before we can pile into gold and gold equities with impunity.

Eventual bottoming of the commodity price indices would certainly be bullish for gold. It is interesting that the CRY0 futures index is the one that is plummeting, not the JOC spot index. This just reflects the current powerful anti-gold ( deflationary ) sentiment. But -- just wait till CRY0 bottoms!

Gold as a commodity or money? I think Armstrong has a point. Gold is not now used as money, except at the LBMA, in very select Central Banking circles, big governments and the BIS. To the most of the rest of us it is still a commodity. How else do you explain the strength of the US dollar? Where Armstrong is wrong is that gold will not remain a commodity if a major buffeting hits the US dollar, with no other viable 'fiat' currency in sight. Then gold will shine. So, Armstrong is right now -- and wrong later.

Aragorn III -- I still challenge you to show me that COMEX gold trading is essentially the same as LBMA gold trading -- I suspect that the big guys prefer the LBMA -- if for nothing else, the privacy. Last I heard, '2000 or tonnes/day' traded at LBMA - which probably is based on face gold value of all trades, derivatives included. And what would be the face gold value of all trades on COMEX? I'll bet it is dwindling with the gold reserves. I would certainly like to be wrong about this.

ORIS: I have the solution, Tovarisch. We back the ruble with Vodka!

MURRSTEIN: True metaphysical Space is NO THING.

REGULUS: I am here to humbly serve so that the meek shall inherit the Earth.

6 feet of it. ^s^

Marshall, Old Soldier, Retired Soldier: Anyone know if this is the real thing, or 'Wag the Dog'? This could be WJC trying to pick a fight because he is losing his popularity.

This worries me. Anyone know anything more? The last thing we want is a war for no reason whatsoever.

Why would you want to eviscerate Prechter and Armstrong? If you did their heads would become dislodged from their butts.

....Viewing the darkness through a prechtosope. == Wow, I see waves.
It must be peristalsis!

Normal weekly scheduled Pentagon press briefings usually held at 1:30 PM on tuesdays, are suspended for the period 24 Aug- 4 sept 98. The Deputy Assisant Secretary of Defense for Public Affairs ( Information ) and director , Directorate for Defense Information will be avaibable during this period for the on-the-record or background statements and, should the situation warrent, onthe record breifings. THIS HAPPENED right before the INVASION of GRANDA, DESERT STORM and the INVASION of PANAMA. Alot of people are about to die.... May GOD SAVE a Portion of America...

President RESIGNS before he does any more damage to this country. What Contempt this guy has for us. ( I feel your pain ) Unbelievable! Do any of you, other than the illinformed still defend this guy?

in their backyards. At the bottom of every cycle, the opposite must happen. Just like in real estate. In Toronto they were knocking down buildings to reduce taxes. That was the bottom in real estate. At the peak, they were puting up office space everywhere. Low grade mining became possible only because gold went to $875. Before then, deep mines survived with high grade. I think if gold hits $190 it will be because the dollar goes to the moon. In order for bull markets to develop, mining has to take a big hit like oil did and is. Again, I think people are mixing up facts to say Armstrong is wrong and are not looking at what he is saying about timing. You can't simply say gold can't decline because mines will close. That's like saying the stock market can't crash because people will lose money. From my experience, markets will ALWAYS move against what the majority want. If it goes to such extremes in stocks, real estate and currencies, it will do so in metals too. I agree with Armstrong that it is a matter of timing. What price is reached will depend upon who nuts the world really gets.

thunder clouds that is your caring, dreaming that I might know the cusp of your breakfast tables...I really Love you guys...thanks for caring...all that is me will protect all that is you and death I will not fear...if I had a child the quilt would be made of your thoughts so the baby might sleep well...

mine eyes will close peacefully knowing the two of you and your families are in this world...NAMASTE'

There's a perfectly good reason. To save Bill Clinton's ass.

I've been mildlly worried about this kind of scenario for the past
six years. Y'all may not have been tracking WJC closely, but
I have. I believe that he is using some of Hitler's playbook.

The recent executive order to diminish state governments is
fully in keeping with Hitler's dissolution of Germany's representative
equivalent.

Un-freeking-believable.

marshall...

what you report is only half of the story.......the taskmasters have ordained this war against the west and islam....this is described
in detail in the history of the rosthschilds....the stage set hundreds
of years ago....by the red crescent...

yes, war IS imminent....the road leading to this point well dileneated
here at kitco over the last 2 years...crude calls are still cheap...the
peopleo sellers of oil do not realize the implications of the current
fervor formenting in the oil regions of the world.....crude to $50bbl
before 6-99.....my dec99 calls await.......$210 each......

this event will catapult gold into the strato-sphere...burst the stock
bubble...cause oil to hit $75bbl in less than 3 months...and evenly
distribute chaos and flux to the masses of peopleo around the world..
those normally insulated---due to money---will have their teat wrested
from their milk stained lips....the harsh reality of the masses will suffer
many to an early demise...

prepare....as though the 'machine' might collapse tomorrow.....it is
occuring today.

cherokee!;...heading.for.the.mountains.of.new.mexico..for.cellulose....$.

decline in Gold, Right AT the Bottom. It happens EVERY time. This time will be no different!

All: WJC is a smart cookie -- whatever you think of his character. Lets consider for a moment that he realizes that the US markets are about to tank some more -- perhaps AG said to him that the PPT is becoming less and less effective.

How else can he give a boost to his popularity? Perhaps we are about to have the WJC version of Desert Storm. Frightening thought. I wonder what his military objectives will be -- I'll bet number one will be how to raise his popularity with the public. And dead last will be whether the outcome of the war/skirmish accomplishes anything fundamental.

Perhaps the DEFCON2 is just a precaution due to some terrorist threat.

But wait -- what if our internal security is intentionally loosened somewhat, and the terrorists set off a bomb in the continental US. Given the way Islamic terrorists operate, they would wait until the perceived crisis blows over, and we are more vulnerable. If a terrorist bombing occurs in the continental US now, it will certainly be highly suspicious, IMHO.

Hot rumor tonight Deutsch Banks will be downgraded from AAA. Well guess those Russian got the best of the Germans afteralll, not to mention Swiss Credit and Soc Gen. Now the opposition in Japan is refusing to go along with the LDP.

Meek are the prettiness of so many ideas, let me be confounded for a mother century and the 7Th month of 1999 Goodnight and may God bless us All.

I'd bet hard money on it. Congress is too wishy-washy to force the
issue.

Get ready to lose your net connections and communications. I've
had my wife on alert for the past week.

The press conference pattern seems an incredibly public telegraph. Must be no fear of the opponent. Where are there tensions that would justify war ? Iraq ?

I never said gold cant decline. I said and I will be clear about this. If
gold declines to the levels Armstrong beleives, then 95% of the mining industry will be shut down and the world will be an economic basket case. I don't beleive this will happen because if Greenspan has learned anything from the 1929 depression is that you must LOWER interest rates and not raise them like they did in 1929. This is the premise I am going on and is the reason I beleive gold will rise. This situation will probably play out over the next few months IMHO.

MILITARY INSTALLATIONS in southeast are in 100 % total control access inspection status . Ft Benning, Ga which is normally a open post, which does not even have gate entrances has implemented over 12 road block inspecting IDs for all personnel entering post. This never has occured here before to my knowlege except for Force protection training excerises . WE MUST INPEACH CLINTON at soonest ...Call your representatives immediately... Ablert Pike envisioned the need to bring mankind to the edge of the total destruction in order to save it by fully bring to power a Super UN to rule over the masses.

If I were to strike at the US I would target those cities with highest Jewish populations, NEW YORK CITY,LA, MIAMI . We are about to see a demostration of the playing field being leveled terror as a weapon through the use of inexpensive agents BIO/Chemical and possible backpack nukes. Water supplies will be high on the list for BIO agents.

oleman . . good trade on the BP. It's a 'piece of crap' currency. I been sellin
rallies for yrs. Short from ytd this time.

oleman . . the bondo is trying to tell us something about the stock market. Who's
lissenin?

oleman . . Lotsa fookes fell for Friday's "spike" on the bondo. I predicted a bond at
150 on this board about 20 handles ago. anybody remember?

grizzly ., you think the bond will be the "fright to quality"?

oleman . . Ok, class, pay attention. The crb just crashed thru 200 from the topside,
Prices paid by Purchasing mgrs had 10% drop in one month, bond is at all
time high, dollar is kicking hell out of everything, gold is south of $300
and dying, RUT making new daily lows and down over 20%, trade deficit
approaches $300B/yr, and some fokes are calling for a FED rate hike. Now
what are them fokes smokin?: )

oleman . For over 3 yrs here on this chat, the very BEST arguments, with the
most facts to support em, have been made by the BEARS. While the SPX
doubled. Now watch----as we take about half off that index, the most
logical, r ational and learned posts yuou'll see here will be by the fokes
who will prove to you, beyond the shadow of a doubt, that we're still in a
BULL, and, ergo, we CANT go down. Go figure.

oleman . we WILL trade below today's settlement tomorrow ( today ) . If ytd low
goes, it's gonna be bloody in a hurry. "Blood on the saddle, blood all
around, and a big red pool of blood----there upon the ground". ( Marty
Robbins, 1959 ) : )

oleman .: ADV 1356, DEC 1653. Glad you aint usin my $$$.

lowery ...couldn't make ydays lows today ..they saved them late..still feeling
the same?

grizzly . . I really would like to see a .618 retracement from where ever this leg down
ends to load up on some puts, but so far the retrace has only been able to
muster up a .382 retrace.

oleman . .Naw, I dont know. It could be a buy after the early sell in the a.m. Just
gotta wait and see. All I know for sure is that we'll see a price lower than
todays close. Dont know where we'll end up.or down.: )

oleman . Yup, we got only 38% so far. But the other 62% could come in a few
minutes if the support fails tomorrow. Tight spot here. Down a few, and its
all she wrote. Up a few more and its off to the races. Big day comin, IMO.

grizzly . . so my parents current position is 100% t-bills fund.

oleman .: You can do better than that. It may get 50%, 62%, or even 80%, like
it did in '87. Why dont you just put a fast and slow ma on the hourly chart
when we start to rally and start selling when they downcross?

oleman . .Shouldnt put your parents' dough in the mkt now, unless your no-good brother
in law is gonna inherit.: )

oleman . . I stayed short tonite, but the best indicator I ever saw appeared tonite and
it says I'll be reversing to long tomorrow.: )

oleman . The trend is now DOWN. fwiw. I was thinkin today about all those
times the last 3 years that we had a big down day, then gapped down and slid
for 30-60 minutes, and I just did what mama Gump said and bought the sucker
and coined money. I wondered as I sold it at noon, for the umpteenth ( seems
like it ) time in the last month, how many times over the next few months will
fokes buy that gap up after a couple days rally? Not me. For the foreseeable
future, I'm layin in wait fer two days of good rally and a gap up oin the
third day. You might think they wont be that frequent, but I bet there'll be
a bunch of 'em.

oleman .: If I were forced to guess right now, I'd say I'll be buying in the
morning, too. But I wont be long LONG.: )

oleman . . I look at those big up bars on today's intraday cht during that first hour
or so, and ask myself, " How could anybody buy those things, unless he were
using goverment money?" Course that might be just who was doing most of
it.: )

oleman . We had a "gap and go" ytd, after a strong reversal Fri. The gap up and
early rally today was just to make the "distributees" receptive for the
off-loading by the "distributors". Vicious game, this. gotta flop. g'nite
and good huntin. gone...........

I think that many people are afraid to publicize their comments regarding Clinton because of fear of repurcussions... If he were to become a dictator, many people ( including Starr ) would fear for their very lives.

The ACLU: Are they liberal or conservative?
Or do they mostly just uphold the constitution?

I donate to them and was checking on their web site.
Rights when dealing with the police
http://www.aclu.org/library/bustcard.html

New York?

I don't think so. If I truly wanted to do maximum damage, I would
nuke San Jose.

----------
From: Consular Warden
IMCEAMS-EURNET_MOSCOWPOA_conswarden@nosync.us-state.gov
Subject: Warden Message for American Citizens
Date: Wednesday, August 26, 1998 9:21 AM

This is a warden message for all American citizens. Please distribute it
to all American citizens acquatainences. If you are a warden, notify
your warden group. In order for the Embassy to ensure that all American
citizens get this information, please inform us if you have received
this message. If you have any questions contact us, either by e-mail or
at one of the following numbers :
phone# 7-095-956-4295
fax# 7-095-956-4451.


In light of the recent U.S. military strikes against terrorist
targets in Afghanistan and Sudan, and possible threats to Americans and
American interests overseas, the Department of State urges U.S. citizens
travelling or residing abroad to review their security practices, to
remain alert to the changing situation, and to exercise much greater
caution than usual.

Large crowds and other situations in which anti-American sentiments may
be expressed should be avoided. U.S. diplomatic posts worldwide are
taking appropriate security precautions.

Americans should be aware that Embassy operations are currently
suspended in Somalia, Sudan, Republic of Congo, Brazzaville, Democratic
republic of Congo and Guinea Bissau. No United States consular services
are currently available in these countries.

The United States does not maintain diplomatic or consular posts in
Afganistan, Iraq, Iran, Libiya and North Korea, and therefore no support
services are available to Americans in these countries. In light of the
above, Americans need to take additional and enchanced precautions with
regard to this areas.

Family members and non-emergency personnel of the U.S. Embassies in
Kenya and Tanzania have been authorized to depart. In Albania, Eritrea,
and Pakistan, non-emergency personnel and family members have been
ordered to depart. Consular services in these countries have been
reduced to minimal levels and in most cases to emergency citizens
services only.

American citizens travelling abroad should contact the nearest U.S.
Embassy or Consulate by telephone of FAX for up-to-date information on
security conditions. Current information on post operations is also
available on the internet at travel.state.gov.

YOU POSTED METAPHYSICAL IS NO SPACE. ANY WEBSTER DICTIONARY
WILL DEFINE META AS TRANSPOSITION, AND PHYSICAL as MATTER, OR
MATERIAL. WITHOUT FIELD THERE CAN BE NO TRANSFER. YOUR POST
DOES NOT MAKE SENSE TO ME. PLEASE DEFINE IT SO I CAN READ IT IN
TOMORROW AFTER WORK. THANK YOU.

Forget what he said about gold and silver, he is saying that the U.S. market could drop 66% and two years of deflation like 1929. This is the big picture and he is very good at predicting global events.

I don't believe gold to $190.00, because big players will bid up the last asset that has no default risk.... Bet you those Banks and Hedge Funds who have Russian GKO's now wish they had gold.

Russia is the first major nation to default, who's next?

my RESPECT...thank you for allowing me to know you...thank you...

least not where I'm concerned------
Date: Wed Aug 26 1998 00:36
Marshall ( US MILITARY FORCES ON DEFCON 2 ( WAR IMMINENT ) ) ID#293211:
Copyright  1998 Marshall/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
I relay the following information with extreme concern. I have been retired from the US Army for two years
and have a son on active duty now. All American forces in Germany and Naval units in the Persian Gulf and
Indian Ocean have been placed in defense Condition #2 ( War is Imminent ) Israeli forces have gone to full war
status National Guard asking for vo
lunteers for immediate middle east deployment. All passes and leaves for American troops in germany ( combat
units ) have been cancelled ( my son included ) US Naval vessels have been dirverted from port to middle east.
WAR IN MIDDLE EAST IS IMMINENT...
"s A lot of people are about to lose their life...Thanks in part to Comrade Clinton the biggest Traitor in American
History.....
----------------
We're making peace, not war- Don't you guys read the papers?
Sorry if I'm upsetting you're scenario.

Whould you wish to discuss this further, let's do it in private.
Email Reify@sitcom.co.il and we'll chat.

Should something really serious be happening we'll inform one another
as usual. Do have a pleasant day y'all.

MAYBE???

If you were the USA would you sell IMF GOLD on the open market and give the cash to the Russian Mob, or would you take back your gold that you initially contributed to the IMF, print US dollars and then give the US dollars to Russia????????????????

to say to MY friend...SHELLER and you wish to speak of books and such spell HIS name right dimwit...

LOVE YOU and yours, the best from the Island that is Long even with the shoulder...falling out of cars ain't good...

Israeli Defense Forces took out the number two terrorist in Lebanon today using a helicopter gunship. Missiles rained into northern Israel afterwards.

Believe this. Israel did not forget it's promise to reserve punishment for Iraqi scud missile attacks. America will soon unleash the IDF airforce to pelt Bagdad. War is imminent.

I have been loath to condem Cinton over the sex scandal. I would be just as reluctant to judge anyone for their sexual lives. " Who tells the secrets of the night?" Give that a moments thought. If there is anythoing such as freedom, then we must be free in this respect. Freedom..not conformity..is the real issue.

This latest blunder is really pathetic. We are conducting ourselves according to the Israeli methods of reprisal. It's not appropriate for the US, and most here see it as a disaster. Unbeliveable stupidity.

So Kapex...off with his head.....but not over Monica.

I say he raises rates. The reason is the EURO is a comming round the mountain. Competition for the dollar. He knows the dollar has had it's day. Me thinks many of the big boys know, but nobody talks about it ( except here on Kitco ) If he lowers, he could be adding fuel to the fire of the dollar once EURO is launched.

sharefin: Thanks. His moves are really fluid, aren't they? If you trade short term enough, long term bull or bear is irrelevant. Even then, I sense uneasiness in his part. And -- if Oldman is uneasy, so am I!

Haggis: Still lurking? Antony C. Sutton's book, 'The War on Gold' was published in July 1978, ISBN # 0-89245-008-8, and it cost $9.95. Of course there has been no inflation since then ---- .

I did learn something about what Antony C. Sutton is doing these days, thought I have been unable to reach him. He has a newsletter called the 'Future Technology Intelligence Report'. I was amazed to find out that he is a 'zero point energy' convert, and knows all about DePalma's N'machine, Schaumberger's rotational turbines, and Wilhelm Reich. I will post his web site some other time. Brilliant man, though I don't think he has the zero-point energy business quite right. But -- on the other hand, I don't think anyone human in 1998 AD on Earth does, either. I still have a very dim concept of it myself -- frustrating to be on the verge of a major Physics discovery, and understand so little of it! Our ticket to the stars, and very likely the end of wars for energy resources.

A. Sutton thinks it will be a generation before the current establishment can accept zero point energy technology ( 'free energy', 'cold fusion', etc ) . And I am inclined to agree with him, unfortunately.

G'Night, all!

Well, I sure can't find any cofirmation on Defcon 2 on the net.

Except for a brief reference in misc.militia and it dates back to
Aug 22.

http://www.garynorth.com/y2k/detail_.cfm/2402

GAO Issues a Blistering Report on U.S. Government
http://www.garynorth.com/y2k/detail_.cfm/2392

GAO Warns of Threat to the Public
http://www.garynorth.com/y2k/detail_.cfm/2394

Natural Gas and Embedded Chips: Bad News
http://www.garynorth.com/y2k/detail_.cfm/2387

Noncompliant Messaging System: Threat to Communications
http://www.garynorth.com/y2k/detail_.cfm/2403

If I had any artistic ability I would draw men as puppets controlled by invisible electromagnetic strings, some trailing in from the depth of space, some coming up from the core of this earth, and yet more eminating from the sun and from the relationships between planets.

I know nothing of significance about astronomy, astrology, or electromagnetics. I do know that human activity like trading common stock or gold is a reflection of what is going on inside men. The tension and relaxation of the puppet strings are reflected in those markets. The ebb and flow can be measured statistically and can be projected into the future. The cycles are many and hide among themselves. Only occasionally can a more dominant cycle be glimpsed with the naked eye.

Nevertheless, there is a major combined cyclical component to market movement. If all movement were random then it would be impossilbe to invest or speculate with any degree of predictability. If all movement were trend then everyone would observe this and be with the trend and trading would be impossible ( Who would bet against the obvious trend? ) Successful trading is possible because of cycles. You don't need to know the cause of the cycles to measure them because they are reflected in the history of markets. You can buy cheap if you know where the bottom is and you can sell dear if you know where the top is.

My work continues to show movement down in the S&P500, Homestake Mines, and ASA. The projected movement down is significant. If Armstrong and Prechter have concluded by other methods that gold and silver will decline this is consistent with my work. In relative terms the end of the long gold bear is near but not yet here and any long positions I am sad to say are likely to suffer over the next several months.
If interested in the messy details check out my charts at the usual URL preface plus //pcis.net/jeannev/jeil.htm ( For some reason if I type the whole address KITCO blocks out my entire post. )

Jeil: I still find it hard to believe that your system has done as well as it has, but it is now evident that your predictions are still on the money. Gold equities are probably going down some more, at least until the plummeting CRY0 stops.

And -- it is hard to believe that the markets are going to rally, even if Mike Sheller is bullish. Now -- the US dollar being bullish -- that I will believe. And -- perhaps the general equities markets will rally -- after they drop some more!

Keep this up and you will soon start your own newsletter! Keep it up.

About twenty four years ago WJC, did, as a young but barely known Congressman, endorse and support the impeachment/resignation of one Richard Nixon for.........Obstruction of Justice......^s^..

Even has Auckland listed ( 6:08 PM at present ) . http://www.stud.unit.no/USEBIN/steffent/verdenser.pl

Thanks for the kind words. I hope this December you are saying the same thing.

http://www.stud.unit.no/USERBIN/steffent/verdensur.pl

"Who tells the secrets of the night" ?

I might ask you, my friend, "Who tells what is obviously right" ?

Forget the sex. This is all about PERJURY, PERJURY, PERJURY...

I don't give a god damned if it had to do with

1 ) A sexual act
2 ) Stealing a chocolate bar from K-Mart or
3 ) Taking a $100.00 bribe from a businessman

The man told a lie under oath, he committed PERJURY,
the man just happens to be the president of the US of A
who just happens to highest ranking lawmaker of the country.

Ordinary American citizens do prison time for committing
perjury, the only difference IMHO between them and the
president is that he should get DOUBLE the maximum sentence.

Jeezus George, get your head out of your arse.

Good Night and GO GOLD

I just tried this "world clock" site and it's WRONG!

It shows the time in Phoenix to be - 23.13.

I want my money back.

It's 1998. Do You Know Where Your Microsoft Access Data Are?
http://www.garynorth.com/y2k/detail_.cfm/2405


~~~~~~~~~~~~
Stats from my web site so far.
http://www.cairns.net.au/~sharefin/Freshwater.htm
-------------------------------------
ACCOUNT DETAILS:
Unique: 479
Total visits: 750
Today: 18
Yesterday: 188
Average/day: 89
Domain:.AU AUSTRALIA ( 48% )
OS:Windows 95 ( 89% )
Browser:Internet Explorer 3.x ( 46% )

DOMAINS:
AUSTRALIA ( .AU )  ====359 ( 47% )
Networks ( .NET ) ====128 ( 17% )
Commercial ( .COM )  ====109 ( 14% )
Unknown ( .??? )  ====89 ( 11% )
NEW ZEALAND ( .NZ )  ====23 ( 3% )
CANADA ( .CA )  ====15 ( 2% )
MEXICO ( .MX )  ====6 ( 0% )
Educational ( .EDU )  ====5 ( 0% )
NETHERLANDS ( .NL )  ====4 ( 0% )
United Kingdom ( .UK )  ====4 ( 0% )
UNITED STATES ( .US )  ====2 ( 0% )
ANTIGUA AND BARBUDA ( .AG )  ====1 ( 0% )
FINLAND ( .FI )  ====1 ( 0% )
SINGAPORE ( .SG )  ====1 ( 0% )
TURKS AND CAICOS ISLANDS ( .TC )  ====1 ( 0% )
JAPAN ( .JP )  ====1 ( 0% )
US Dept of Defense ( .MIL )  ====1 ( 0% )

BROWSER:
Internet Explorer 3.x ====346 ( 46% )
Internet Explorer 4.x ====190 ( 25% )
Netscape 4.x ====119 ( 15% )
Netscape 3.x ====78 ( 10% )
Netscape 2.x ====13 ( 1% )
Internet Explorer 2.x ====2 ( 0% )
Unknown ====1 ( 0% )
Unknown Netscape compatible ====1 ( 0% )

OPERATING SYSTEM:
Windows 95  ====666 ( 88% )
Windows 98  ====28 ( 3% )
Windows 3.x  ====18 ( 2% )
Macintosh  ====17 ( 2% )
Windows NT  ====16 ( 2% )
misc Unix  ====3 ( 0% )
Unknown  ====2 ( 0% )

------------------------------
Aurator interestingly pointed out the number of hits per O/S
Windows95 = 666

Good marketing for the first week with 479 unique hits.

Take a look at Adelaide, Australia. Shows
them 30 minutes out of sync with rest of the
world. They probably think its winter too.

I have not taken your gold etc. data and moved to Brazil. My schedule has been out of hand of late. I do intend to do an analysis on gold prices. I don't think I can use futures prices because of the time decay effect on the price, so will probably try the London PM fix on a weekly basis beginning with 1964 when the market was not controled. . I did pull some data from the KITCO site and just need to fill in a few more old years before I can begin. I nevertheless do appreciate your sending me the data you had and I will give you due credit whenever I get the projection worked out and posted on my little web page.

Neil

Just saw the movie, but I felt like I had already seen the movie! Talk about hitting the nail on the head. I saw the name Maxine Waters in the credits,.......naw......couldn't be......

Clinton Computer: 8 inch hard drive with no memory. Question is, will it be y2k compliant? Some say the statement is probably generous.... take a note, secretary, call Paula, or Gennifer, or Monica, or.....? and verify.

Prediction: Slick will slither out of this one..... and the Campaign Finance scandal will be too slow to do any good.

Lots of night training at the local Marine Airbase over the last two days........somethings brewing

It does seem that the scenario of a US-implicated Middle East war might be starting to unfold. The US provoking Arab nations with its attack on Sudan & Afghanastan, Syria & Israel taking jabs at one another, and a desperate Russia may return to her evil ways by invading some country like Turkey.

but not to much activity on the HF bands tonight. Perhaps war with Bonnie?

While this has not been reflected in the share volume for Richmont Mines, the number of hits on their web site has increased materially over the past month.

Excerpts from an interview with Martin Armstrong in the May 31,1996 issue of Silver and Gold Report, edited by James DiGeorgia.

Martin Armstrong:

You're going to see oil most likely reach the $60-$80 range over the next 2 to 3 years...

...Roughly, there's a 64-year cycle in gold, which is due for a peak around 1998. The last peak came in 1934 when gold was rallying substantially and Roosevelt was confiscating it.

Before that, you had the gold panic of 1869 when we first went off the gold standard. Prices rallied up to $162 on the NYSE back then. That's the equivalent to nearly $10,000 in today's terms!

What I find interesting is that every time this 64-year gold cycle pops up, it tends to earmark periods of crisis in the currency exchange rates...

Looking down the road further-say two years- I think gold will likely test its 1980 high by 1998, perhaps even the $1000 range by then, and then higher into the year 2003.

Platinum looks even better. I wouldn't be surprised to see it approach $1800-2000 level in the next two years.

I am not as optimistic on silver, but I expect it to break through the $8 level. Silver could move in sympathy with gold and platinum. It might leap over the $10 mark in the next few years.

I guess it was 1975 when gold and silver were freely traded. Also, I can't find your explanation of your data, but I seem to remember the gold and silver data was for futures rather than spot prices. Correct or not??

I'm on the left coast and can't recall such activity.

Forgotton all about that.
Thanks
Maybe oneday we all will a bit of spare time. ( :- ) ) )

I'm not sure what I sent you.
Futures or the cash price.
But in the long term view I think there would be little difference.

Like the charts you plot, the prices seem to self-correct over time.
Automatic self smoothing?

Seems similiar with my swing plots.
The extremes get averaged out to fit within the cycle.
Cheers

Armstrong, Soros, von Finck, Buffett, Bronfman, they all have their long and short term priorities that may lead the little guy astray.
I rather be wrong based on my own stupidity, at least that way I learn.......hopefully?

U-S INTELLIGENCE DEFENDS BOMBING
OF SUDAN FACTORY.
Wednesday 26 August, 1998 ( 3:36pm AEST )

United States Intelligence officials have defended the decision to bomb
a pharmaceutical factory in Sudan, saying soil samples from the area
showed traces of an ingredient for making deadly VX gas.

They say the Sudanese owners of the Shifa factory in Khartoum, which
was largely destroyed in the attack last Thursday, also had meetings
with Iraqis close to Iraq's chemical weapons programme.

Senior US intelligence officials say the chemical found in the soil near
the plant was EMPTA, which has no commercial applications and is not
a byproduct of any other chemical process.

Sudanese officials dismissed the soil sample, saying the investigation
was flawed.

All problems solved and bull rally time?
Russia up 15%

But the rest of Europe giving up some of yesterdays gains.

Turkey down 6%

What little I saw of the talking heads last night...
They are really beginning to circle the wagons around the President
and want to lay off the bashing because of security/defense concerns.
As prospects for war and national disaster increase
even the more rabid Clinton bashers will tune down their rhetoric.
This makes me afraid
that the positive ( for Clinton ) feedback loop will cause Clinton
to ratchet up the terrorist/war scenario to further stifle the bashing.
I would not put it past him to "arrange" for some incidents
to give him the excuse to make further strikes overseas and
impose martial law or at least severe restrictions here at home.

Do we have that pervasive feeling of impending doom yet?

back in Kinshasa. Angola have air
control.. Rebels in trouble
and need need stingers ..
Maybe brother savimbi has some.

Gold being dragged down the
crapper by gold and silver ..
I recall a guy who was short
gold long plat and a little long
silver .. now who was that ??

Frenzy, Folly and Fear, those Careless are
The fates that mould our destinies, and shape
The grave dishonesties, deceits, that mar
Our work, our very loves, our art
Stir the dark anxieties, the mortal pains
The dark and deadly pride that stains
The living dying heart.

We mime the random measure of their art
Act out the torment of their aimless play
Suffer all things with numb unfeeling heart
The less their willful torment day by day
Or wanton, toss to waste our life in play.

Only that man,
Who steadfast stands apart
And cries his manhood, cries aloud - I AM
Will be free of such dire fates
Only thus be saved,
Be his own man.

Is the last Bear Market leg in Metals


Just Getting Started?



By Martin A. Armstrong

August 25, 1998

Copyright Princeton Economic Institute


------------------------------------------------------------------------




The long-term perspective for both gold and silver is becoming very ugly to say the least. While the metals group has been the target on intense manipulation involving everything from copper, palladium, platinum and silver, there has also been attempts at trying to create the impression that even gold is getting tight.

( Armstrong means: I am an unmitigated liar and I do everything in my power to manipulate the metals markets. Do you remember my spate of falsehoods about Buffett selling his hoard of silver? All proven to be lies! That's because I am a complete BS artist! )

One trade house in particular has specialized in going after the funds day-in-and-day-out. Just recently, this house has been taking delivery of gold trying desperately to force it higher based solely upon the commitment of traders report that claims there are 60,000 short speculative positions. Despite selling in the cash and buying on the floor of the COMEX in a vain attempt to keep up the image that they rule this market, the overwhelming bearish fundamentals have prevented their latest play.

( Armstrong means: my hedge disciples keep shorting the crap out of these precious metals markets and damn it...there's a trade house out there that is spoiling our BS party by buying the stuff and TAKING DELIVERY! It's making me nervous as hell because it looks like there are some other players that might soon make hefty purchases of the metals and TAKE DELIVERY. Pretty soon, there won't be any silver or gold to cover my egregiously large short positions. Then the game is over for me and I will lose control of these markets. Yes, I am about to get F*cked! ) .

We have maintained that silver has been the primary focus of a group of serious market manipulators that have included one major member of the London bullion dealers. While stories of shortages have still filled the air, the truth is that these stories originate from London where the dealers still REFUSE to publish the inventories on hand. Given the fact that this type of behavior in the United States would be considered "insider trading" bordering on the line or criminal activity, the only way to approach this market is based upon price action since the fundamentals CANNOT be proven nor trusted.

( Armstrong means: trust me when I tell you that there is a superabundance of silver out there...just as you should have trusted me when I told you that Buffett was unloading his silver. NOT!!!!!!!!! )

According to our sources, the vaults in London remain full with
the greatest shortage still being storage space itself. Combining this information with the fact that nearly 70% of all silver exports from the US during the second-half of 1997 were made to London and not Asia, we tend to believe the US government statistics over those in the bullion industry, which a vested interest in hiding the truth.

( Armstrong means: my sources tell me that the vaults are full of silver in London...the very same sources that failed to tell me that Buffett was buying $100 million of silver ( yes, I was the last to know! ) and the very same sources that told me that Buffett was unloading his silver way back when, only to be completely contradicted by Buffett himself. My sources are the little green men dancing inside my duplicitous head ) .

We do know that demand for silver in India has fallen by 80% during the first quarter of 1998. We believe that Indias silver consumption will be down on an annual basis at least 40% and perhaps as much as 60% for 1998 thus wiping out any shortage between current production and demand. The sanctions imposed on India for its nuclear testing have had a major impact upon its economy as well. This situation is only further complicated by the collapse in Asian currencies. The rise in the dollar due to the continued meltdown in the world economy is also having a negative impact upon silver.

( Armstrong means: I don't have any unique original lies to spin so I'll revert to that tired old chant about India dropping its silver demand. I sure hope all you Sh*t for brain lemmings out there buy it! )

The popular belief that gold and silver will rally with a stock market crash has anything but materialized. This is largely due to the fact that gold is now a commodity and not the official form of money as was the case under the gold standard. Therefore, as economic turmoil swirls around us, the first priority is liquidity. Where during the Great Depression gold represented liquidity, keep in mind that gold was cash, which was acceptable to pay ones bills. Today, cash is the dollar. Gold is not acceptable as payment on your VISA card, mortgage or just about anything else within the modern monetary system. Hence, gold this time will act like a commodity.

( Armstrong means: hey, kids, it's a New Era, I've got all my net worth tied up in blue chips and bonds. I'm short PM's and God help me if there is a rush from the fiat currencies into PM's. Believe me when I tell you that gold is just another commodity...in fact, I happen to know that, during the Korean financial crisis, the Korean government didn't give a damn whether their citizens gave them soybeans or gold...any commodity would have sufficed. NOT!!!!!!!! ) .

ALL commodities collapsed during the Great Depression bottoming in 1932 along with stocks. Commodities, including silver, failed to provide any hedge whatsoever against the Great Depression despite the fact that the US remained on a gold standard throughout the entire period.

( Armstrong means: God, I really think there might be a market Crash. I must have complete SH*t for brains taking the kind of short position in PM's I've taken. Imagine a weasel like me making a bet against a financial wizard like Buffett?? Just lock me up in a funny farm...protect me from myself! )

As illustrated here, silver collapsed from $1.344 in 1920 down to 25 cents going into the bottom of the Great Depression in 1932. Those who have been preaching that as soon as the stock markets crash the metals will rally do not have any historical correlation to support such a scenario. Consequently, 1998 appears to have been the culmination of a 7-year bull market instead of the beginning of a breakout. We had hoped that a low in 1998 would have developed. However, given the manipulation of the metals group in general, we now see that the low will most likely develop in 2000 perhaps during the 2nd quarter. The portrayal of Buffett as the savior of silver, who will NEVER sell under any circumstances, again has distorted the facts. When it comes to bonds and crude oil investments, Buffett has NEVER been a long-term investor. He has always taken very short-term views. Buffetts long-term investments have been restricted to purely stocks that pay a reasonable dividend and good capital appreciation. At this time, Buffetts silver investment is already in a 10% loss position and it could become much worse.

( Armstrong means: I am really concerned about Buffett and his huge silver position. After all he is only worth around $20 billion and that silver position constitutes less than five percent of his aggregate net worth. Poor man just might go broke because he just doesn't understand the silver market like I do. HARHARHARHARHAR! )

There is one popular rumor that has been floating around the marketplace, which we have no solid opinion on. It has been alleged that PhiBro had a pre-existing silver position in excess of 100 million ounces dating back to 1995. In order for Buffett to sell Solomon Brothers to Smith Barney, he was had to take this unprofitable position on his own books. This cannot be proven either way without getting into the books of PhiBro. Nonetheless, we do not believe that some of the players who were front-runners would have jumped into the silver market with both feet if this rumor were correct.

( Armstrong means: it's time for me to make up another rumor, defaming a major institution like Philbro. I am getting desperate what with this jackass huge short position in the metal. Naturally, I cannot prove it because what mathematical proof exists to validate the existence of sheer Bullsh*t? ) .

All things considered, the metals are simply headed significantly lower. A monthly closing for silver below $5 will then warn that a decline to the $4.50 level is in order. At the end of the day, our computer models are still adamant that silver will drop below $3. If our sources are correct that the London bullion dealers are indeed hiding 500 million ounces of silver from the world statistics, then this target is very realistic. While we no doubt will receive the usual hate mail due to this forecast, the point is that this issue can be settled very easily. London should open its vaults for a full INDEPENDENT audit. The mere fact that the London dealers refuse to publish these statistics perhaps suggests that there is indeed a pile of silver they do not want the marketplace to know about. If there is indeed a vast quantity of silver beyond Buffetts 120 million ounces sitting in London, what better way to keep up the propaganda about shortages than refusing to publish the inventory statistics?

( Armstrong means: damn it, I just know there's a secret pile of silver sitting in London and the bullion dealers refuse to disclose it. Bastards! I demand a full independent audit. On the other hand, don't mention anything to me about independently auditing the gold reserves of the Central Banks. Trust me when I tell you that those published reserves are completely accurate. Central Banks would never lie, least of all to me, the grand shorter of PM's!!! )

If our sources are correct on this issue, then considering the collapse in Asian demand combined with 500 million ounces in London, there is NO shortage at all and in fact we are back to a 2-year surplus or much more. Those who simply point to the COMEX stockpiles and claimed that "we assume that European stockpiles have declined by a like proportion" are making a very dangerous and irresponsible statement. They should take great care in their reports when the bona fide statistics are NOT available. They are either being paid as a consultant to those who want to propagate the myth of a shortage on an undisclosed basis, or they are not exercising their due-diligence that is expected of all independent research. We are NOT prepared to join the crowd on this issue of a shortage until London becomes a market where who own what can remain confidential, but total supply is fully disclosed to the public. After all NO leading financial market in the world operates under such rules

( Armstrong means: I like to project my own egregious lies onto my antagonists. As you can tell, I am obviously little more than a front for PM-shorting hedge funds, propagating the myth of a superabundant PM market ) .

In the end, the continued collapse in Russia is likely to spillover into the former eastern block as well as into Latin America in particular Mexico. We are looking at another Asian contagion but this time in Europe. Unfortunately, this reality may keep commodities in a deflationary trend going into early 2000 before any reversal develops.

( Armstrong means: I sure hope you've bought my BS concerning PM's as mere commodities. If you have, and furthermore, if you believe we are going into a pure deflation, then naturally, you should expect PM's to drop in value ) .

Indeed, the similarities of our current global crisis are a much better fit fundamentally with the Great Depression than any other period in time. While the stock market peaked in 1929 and collapsed into 1932, the dollar soared into 1931 where it established its major high against every currency known to man. Every European nation defaulted on its debt, with the exception of Switzerland while Britain suspended payments for 6 months. Russia defaulted, China, most of Asia and Latin America. With each default, capital fled to the dollar creating domestic deflation within the US marketplace. Due to the fact that 40% of the civil work force in the US was employed within the agricultural sector, as the dollar rose commodities fell forcing farmers and miners into bankruptcy.

( Armstrong means: I sure hope you buy the Bullcrap concerning my direct analogy of today's US economy with the US Depression economy. Please forget that today, unlike the USA of the Thirties, America is the largest debtor nation in the world. Please overlook that little fact such that you may rest assured that the entire world will convert all their crumbling currencies into US dollars. HARHARHARHAR. NOT! ) .

To a large extent, we see the similarities with this period of the 1930s as striking to say the least. However, we do NOT see a 90% decline for stocks or commodities from current levels. While gold might collapse to the $190 area and silver down to $2.75, the US share market at worst might reach 3800 on the Dow or about a 66% correction. To be much more modest, we would expect perhaps a more realistic decline in the 40% area assuming that the next low in September/October unfolds with about a 23% correction. A correction of 66% would ONLY become likely if by mid October the Dow were down by 40%.

( Armstrong means: God, I'm really f*cked if all my DOW stocks crash over the next few months. Trust me when I tell you they could never fall as much as gold or silver! TRUST ME, PLEASE!!!! )

In summary, during the 1930s gold was money. It could be used to pay your landlord and debts. Today, a deflationary contraction drives the same forces into a search for liquidity. In the 1990s, liquidity is still cash; its just that cash is the dollar  not bars of precious metals.

( Armstrong means: trust me, gold is NOT money. The Central Banks are completely deluded in treating it as though it has any value or any liquidity. The US DOLLAR is king, even though the world is rapidly becoming awash in this overabundant paper debt. TRUST ME, DAMMIT, DON'T YOU BELIEVE ME YET???? )

Gold and silver might rally if the dollar were at risk. However, the economic crisis is NOT taking place in the US  it is taking place everywhere else but! Reagan at least reversed the trend in the US economy away from socialism and toward a more fiscal conservative system. This shift has yet to take place in either Japan or continental Europe. The unfunded liabilities throughout Europe are more than twice those in the US on a percentage to GDP basis. This too is similar to the 1930s when European debt simply collapsed due to fiscal irresponsibility.

( Armstrong means: the US is an island impervious to any outside forces. Global currency crises could never contaminate the US paradise. FOreigners could NEVER lose faith in the American government or its currency. The sun rises in the West and sets in the East. Why do these purple bugs keep crawling around my underwear? Who put the cat in my refrigerator YADDAYADDAYADDA. ) .

To add salt to the wound, the IMF has led the hedge funds and the Banks to the slaughter over Russia. By standing out as the guarantor of the world, many ran into Russia to buy GKOs yielding 100% or more. These guys looked at the high yield and assumed that the IMF would never let Russia collapse. The problem now is that Russia has collapsed and the losses are spreading around the globe. Again, Europeans hold about 90% of this exposure. Those who still think the dollar is a fiat currency are merely living in a fantasy world. The dollar remains as the most secure and fiscal responsible currency today. That might change in a few years, but for now  the dollar is looking very, very strong. The final death-blow to the metals may in fact be the IMF, which in the end will be forced to see its gold reserves for cash. The IMF is broke and with the collapse of Russia, in part propelled by the IMF itself, funding in the future is going to be lean indeed. With 70% of its liquid assets in gold, the IMF will become the next seller of last resort. With the rise in the dollar, we can also expect a continued increase in mine production for silver as well. Selling should be expected from both Russia and Mexico. A few years back, Russia was selling gold and buying silver switching their own reserves in part due to the shortage myth. Again reliable sources claim that Russia is also sitting on at least as much as Buffett bought.

( Armstrong means: BS and more BS and even more BS. Now can I ride on my pony, Daddy? ) . 

During the final days of any bear market one is confronted by fundamentals that suddenly turn very ugly. When governments began to default during the 1930s, the final low came about 1.5 years later. Here too, we may be looking at about a 50% decline over the next 1.5-year period moving into a final low by the 1st or 2nd quarter of 2000.

( Armstrong means: is it too late to unwind my huge short position in PM's, God? I'll do anything....ANYTHING! Just save my ass! Please!! )

Thanks.

F* 

Decided to beam in and check out the action in the ( US ) morning. Have sent an email to USAGold.

They got it wrong re: Oz dollar gold price never was $A 350; the lowest it got was $A 427 last December. It is now $A 490.

Oz dollar now at 57.5 US cents. Hmmm... still think we need a currency system.. Floating system is rubish. Money is not 'just a commodity'.

Live Long and Prosper.

Who really bombed the Planet Hollywood in your town. Do you think it was retaliarion for US attack on Bin Ladin. They seem to be implying the possibility on the morning news.

Silver....aint it beautiful.

Oz dollar tipped to go to 55c US. Hhmmm.....

Live Long and Prosper.

If my memory serves me correctly the cat made of prediction of gold being up over 300 by November. I wonder if he was looking at his chart upside down. Maybe he meant over 200.

http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980826/russia_cur_1.html

http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980826/russia_2nd_1.html

Just about everything in the world is down. Of particular interest to this SWC holder is the decline in Platinum ( -$10 ) and silver looks destined to take out contract lows and spot lows of what was it May 5th or June 5th - have to look it up.

APH - how is your wheat doing.

I can certainly understand the skepticism extended to Armstrong's comments but you have to say his timing was pretty good. Coming out today all bearish, warning of 500oz of silver hidden in London vaults and massive future deflation and depression. I'm sorry but I found many of his comments to be well worth considering. This flight to the dollar is certainly having business contracting ramifications. Liquidity is drying up and this is one of the reasons these markets are declining.

Silver off a cool 20 cents now in the last two days at $4.94.

Keeping powder dry - sage advice from somebody else.

Thanks for posting the oldman's Avid comments!

Bridge Commodities Index Slips Below Key 200 Level

By TERZAH EWING
Staff Reporter of THE WALL STREET JOURNAL

Commodity prices continued to drop across the board, sending the Bridge Commodity Research Bureau index below a widely watched level of 200.

The Bridge/CRB index of commodity prices had flirted with 200 for several weeks, and on Monday fell below that level before closing just above it.

Prices for 11 of the index's 17 component commodities slipped, with particular weakness in metals, livestock, natural gas and grains. The index fell 0.91 point to settle at 199.77. The last time the index finished below 200 was in February 1993.

The Goldman Sachs index of commodity spot prices slipped 0.29% to 141.0191. That index, on Aug. 11, hit a low of 139.6809. The last time it was lower was on Aug. 17, 1977, when it hit 138.08.

The damage being inflicted on the nation's economy by falling commodities prices is showing up sharply in the U.S. stock market, as well as in foreign markets. The greatest pain has been suffered by commodity producers, as displayed by the poor performance of energy and basic-materials company stocks in the U.S., and in foreign markets that are heavily dependent on commodities, such as Russia, Mexico, Canada and Australia.

Lower prices aren't all bad. Consumers, like airline companies and trucking firms, as well as U.S. drivers, are enjoying low fuel costs.

While commodities traders and analysts took note of the CRB's movement below 200, they said a more important barrier for the trading community is 198.17, set on Aug. 12, 1992, the lowest intraday trading level hit by the CRB in this decade. Technical players, who make market decisions based on historic trends, say that if the index slips below that level, it could trigger more selling and thus a more sustained bear market.

Robert Hafer, managing director at Bridge/CRB, says another level to watch will be a 12-year intraday mark of 196.16, set in July 1986. Mr. Hafer, among others, thinks breaking through that level is more likely than it has ever been. "There really is no end in sight other than the fact that CRB does historically bottom out in this zone," he said. "But the world economic situation is far more fragile now than it was in 1986
or 1992." Mr. Hafer said the index began to stay consistently above 200 in 1978. He and others attribute much of the deflationary pressure on
commodities to the Asian currency crisis and its damping effect on what was the highest-growth demand sector for raw materials.

Howard Simons, director of research for French bank Societe Generale's Fimat Group in Chicago, adds that some of the problem for commodities comes from the fact that government economic regulators are treating
the current economic boom as if it is inflationary. In fact, Mr. Simons contends, the potential problem faced now by the U.S. is the opposite one. "Prices are down because everyone's trying to sell to get U.S.
dollars," he said. "We're looking at what will become a competitive world deflation. If all these currencies keep devaluing, nobody's going to be able to afford to buy our goods."

Russia's woes, meanwhile, have added to the mix of problems, pressuring commodities, particularly metals. The country's decision to lease gold, said traders, has put more of the precious metal in the hands of sellers. "At first everybody said 'Oh good, the Russians are lending, not selling,' " said George Gero, senior vice president of investments at
Prudential in New York. "But it's all gone to the shorts." The key December gold contract ended Tuesday at $286.90 a troy ounce, down $1.60. Silver also ended the day down as did platinum, another metal that could flood world markets should Russia decide to export more of it.

Agricultural commodities also posted poor performances, capping months of declines as traders contemplate bumper crops and meat production amid
waning Asian demand. December corn settled at$2.135 a bushel, down two cents. Wheat, live cattle and live hogs prices also fell. Soybeans alone had a positive day, with the November contract rising 2.5 cents to settle at $5.3125 a bushel.

Still, not everyone agrees with dire forecasts of deflation. Many analysts cautioned Tuesday that while the indexes' low levels seem to suggest that deflation may spread beyond basic-materials prices,they more likely portend a bottoming out in the two-year commodity-price downtrend.

** Global meltdown poses nightmare scenario for U.S.



As Treasury Secretary Robert Rubin enjoys a last week of summer

vacation, a nightmare scenario is threatening to unfold for the

global economy that could be beyond the reach of U.S. policymakers.

The financial crisis that started in Asia last year once looked

manageable, but analysts warned Monday it may turn into a global

epidemic. Billions of dollars in international emergency aid have

failed to contain the turmoil. There is hardly an emerging market

left that has been spared. Russia's economy is crumbling fast, and

now Latin America threatens to become the next victim. "This is a

serious global emergency," said Greg Mastel of the Economic Strategy

Institute, a Washington-based think tank. See

http://www.infobeat.com/stories/cgi/story.cgi?id=2555711309-938

http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980825/mexico_ris_1.html

I don't remeber reading the chapter wherein under circumstances where ccurrencies are collapsing, war is in the air, and one's own government is coming apart that GOLD would be going down. Markets are a "discovery" process. We discover the new economics together. I suppose when we have it fiqured out and in is well enunciated on CNBC the trend will change.

I must remeber that gold is going up in just about every other currency but the one I use to pay bills - suppose I should be thankful for that.

Thin I'll go short some stock and get that market to a rising.

http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980826/russia_rou_4.html

Thanks! Now we can understand why the European bourses are
terrible today. Every last one is in the red!

Bloomberg t.v.

Spot silver is down 11 cents to 4.89
Platinum is down 5.90 to 366
Gold is "only" down .70

I hope this silver spike is brief.

The stage is set for a big 212 drop in the DOW today. The DOW went contra to the world yesterday ( slightly that is ) . But the USA dollar is carrying too much weight on its weary back. All over its paper looking to paper for backbone. Fortunately for the tissue paper currencies the dollar is poster board but nonetheless it is still paper and it creases, fold and bends eventually and most importantly it burns if enough heat is applied. The move to gold seems the only long term solution.

but as far as I can tell, lease rates are still down. All my data

indicates that they must move up before gold spot will move up.

BOYS AND GIRLS, IT'S A DEFLATION!

Alan Greenspan has said that the Fed's stance will not change as

long as the "cycle of viruosity" continues. I thought this meant

low inflation and rising markets, with stable interest rates.

It looks like what he meant was low inflation through a process of

ever cheaper ( deflated ) imports, and high relative interest rates

in the US to maintain the flood of foreign investment. Short term

prosperity in the USA will be at the expense of driving the world

into a depression. Those who are ignorant of history are doomed

to repeat the mistakes of history. Here we are in 1929 all over

again.

I can smell the paper burning from here.

Russian central bank voids rouble/dollar trade;
``People are also withdrawing en masse their rouble and dollar savings from banks,''

Then you have the Japanese LTCB Bank being exposed to $US347 odd billion in derivatives gone bad.

The dominos are toppling,
Knocking each other over at an ever increasing speed.

Watch out below.

Globex crashed 10 pts in one hour.
Now the PPT look to be at work.

Russia was up 15%, now down 12%
27% swings throughs the volatility out the window.

Capitalism sucks.
Can't you hear it???

The Loan Ranger would be whistling a happy tune today, buying those silver bullets for a song. He would be stockpiling, knowing that these low prices will not last. He might even be making Tono mold him out some gold bullets for show and to shoot really bad hombres who are shooting at him with paper mache guns.

That sucking sound you describe is the money which I have lost being in the gold market for the past three years. But as my law partner describes himself in the paper market, I'm dollar cost averaging in. My average cost indeed continues to decline. This does indeed suck.

The way things are shaping up, maybe this forecast is right on target. Watch tomorrow to see.

http://38.209.4.67/arc/rundown98b.html

I said yesterday that we might be starting wave 3 of 3 down in the dow daily chart.

I am also entertaining the possibility that waves 1, 2 that have just been completed might have rather been a I, II and now we start a new 5 wave sequence. So there might be some resistance from 8000-8300 from where wave 2 might start.

The weekly chart on the Dow looks terrible. It looks to me like a kondratieff type top you see at manic tops like 1980 gold, 1929 stocks, etc.

@DBog, You're right, all the media tries to portray it as a simple case of adultery with "lewinsky", when in fact it is a case of Perjury & Obstruction of Justice in the Paula Jones Sexual Harassment Case. The press is evil and manipulative.

I see the DOW down a little this morning, fairly flat, then actually rising a little this afternoon.

ON the other hand ol' Cap'n Gollum isn't going flying today. No sir. We are sending up a rookie pilot today.

News is that the Clintons are sailing with Walter Cronkite. The most trusted man in American with the least trusted man. Strange bedfellows indeed. Doesn't Clnton realize that Cronkite is retired and can't help him a lot--or did Cronkite quit watching TV after he retired and doesn't realize his reputation might be sullied? A riddle inside a conundrum; for who understands Democrats and the things they do to ease their pain.

Well, I'm going to have to sit out this flight as well today. I'll tune in from time to time on the black box though. Who might our rookie pilot be today?

Dan Ascani is Director of Research of GLOBAL MARKET STRATEGISTS - a leading international investment study group. His commentary is very alarming as well as well balanced.

"To scream "1930s-stlye depression" every time the global economy moves from an expansion phase of the business cycle into a declining phase ( typically, in turn, leading to recession ) would not be desirable. However, once every 60 years, 1930s style depressions typically do occur, and this time the global economy is, unfortunately, experiencing the kind of economic collapse that occurs only every five or six decades or so. It is, in fact, a full-blown depression in some parts of the globe and spreading at an alarming rate to other parts."

Mr. Ascani sagely observes "this generation of investors is on assignment: to learn what no prior generation has yet learned; to go where no generation has gone before. The assignment is to learn to be prudent; to not be "irrationally exuberant," as we and the U.S. Fed Chairman have discussed so many times in the past. It is to learn to balance portfolios as the marketplace changes, and it is to learn that being a conservative investor is not defined by holding onto stock and taking no action but, instead, to reallocate portfolios and keep them balanced ( i.e., between stocks, bonds, cash, gold, etc. ) at all times."

You may read his insightful observations at the following URL - - it's necessary to delete letters "en" in word "golden" before posting to the Internet:

http://www.golden-eagle.com/editorials_98/ascani082698.html

Maybe it's the old Rothschield dip.

nose dive! I think we'll see a close on the dow of -140 or more...

It's the chapter where ALL commodity prices are falling across the board. Gold is more than holding it's own in buying power. It's just that right now, the dollar is king and anyone in cash is doing great.

The question is, "Where have all the dollars gone?" Money supply is still UP. There should be lots of dollars chasing commodities. Where are they?

I think the Fed has them. With everyone from all over the world buying treasuries a lot of dollars have left the economic velocity cycle.

What say thee?

Rothschield? Please enlighten me.
SSC may sell as low as 9/16 to 5/8 today. It's hard to pass up a bargain. : )

Well, these rookies have to learn sometime. We have told our rookie ti just fly the same pattern I did yesterday, but we suspect she may have a bit of trouble getting off the ground at first.

Paine Webber thinks equities are a screaming buy now, but the Fiend disagrees.

http://www.fiendbear.com/marketre.htm

South Africa
Johannesburg All Share
^JSAI
8:06AM
5473.3
-424.3
-7.19%

I know all about, 'dollar cost averaging'. I do it very well. Now, when does it pay off??? :- ) ) Or should I say, "I feel your pain.....", quoted from a notorious source. :- )

The dip today smells like a buying opportunity.

Silver 4.95, platinum $360, gold $282, I like it all.

PS
Remember my arguments last November regarding the mucho silver to be found in London? We all know it is there ( or rather suspect strongly ) yet we had a $2 rally in the face of these supplies. Somebody wrote last night about their confusion concerning the supply demand picture for silver. Silver has been in production deficit for more than a decade, the same of which witnessed prices anywhere from 3.50 to 11.00 per ounce. Fundamentals are fine, but this is a cruelly manipulated market best approached by emulating the big boys than blazing new trails through the COMEX/LMBA wilderness. Whenever there are stockpiles to go to, supply deficits loose criticality and the metal is available for those that wish to whack the price about like a ping pong ball.


That said, I warn of a vicious bull trap after a quick run up to 5.30 or so. It will probably have one final washout before price starts to rise near year end.

Platinum is not sick, but is not at all well either. Holders of longs who stay with it will be rewarded for the fealty B4 the year is finished.

Im buying gold here, screw all you bears. Too many negative vibes, man.

( Donald Sutherland, "Kellys Heroes" )

OK, now off to do it

Indeedy do

The more I look around the markets these days, the more I see a currency feeding frenzy. Pick your favorite cause - hedge funds, fund-based shorting, plain old fashioned 'lack of faith', but anyway you cut it , everyone ( and I mean everyone ) seems to buying $US.

Noticed this morning that there was talk about the Scandinavian central banks intervening in their markets ( anyone want a kroner or two ? ) .

And my favorite currency, the Canadian Peso continues to drop like a small pebble in raging river - not quite sinking to the bottom but being dragged lower and lower and the river runs through the canyon.

There will be a lot of pain at Paine Webber and the other brokerages before this bear is finished. Million dollar bonuses will become as rare as a snowflake in Florida.

One of my favorite movies... and they got the GOLD!

Old Nathan Rothschild, among others, was pretty good at creating a panic in whatever eh was interested in and then buying it all up at firesale prices...

http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/slavery.htm#NATHAN

Yer sounding pretty bullish........

thanks! away to the ever growing network with non-compliant RTCs...

http://www.drudgereport.com/flash.htm



My Dear Mr. President

By MARK HELPRIN

WALL STREET JOURNAL

August 25, 1998





My dear Mr. President:



Certainly it is now permissible to be as blunt with you as you were with the American people when you squared your jaw, pointed your finger and, in intimidating fashion as if you were our sergeant, headmaster, or jailer, commanded us to listen. Even had you not, by your own admission, lied thereafter, this was unforgivable. Presidents do not speak to Americans with such seething disrespect. And for you it wasn't the first time. In 1994, you accused the country of being unworthy of your wife, when you said, "If everybody in this country had a character half as strong as hers, we wouldn't have the problems we've got today."

...

Click on 1998-21 at

http://www.nyse.com/public/invprot/5c/5cix.htm

More than mere pain. Much more methinks.

Click on Information Memos and then click on 1998-21 for Rule 80b update.

Form the market trading limits...
http://www.nyse.com/public/invprot/5c/5c1/1998/im9821.htm

http://www.nyse.com/public/invprot/5c/5c1/1998/im9821.htm

re your 1:20 - First, before you tell me to buy a dictionary, learn to spell. My name for one thing.
Second, learn to read. I did NOT say "Metaphysical is no space." I SAID "true space is NO THING," and I was speaking as metaphysically radical as I can.

Now if you would like to ruminate over that statement as I have made it, I would be happy to engage your comments and perhaps take it from there. As for dictionary definitions, they are about as insightful as market commentary on CNBC. They seem to be relevant, but somehow there'sd much more to know and understand.

Have a nice day.

http://www.fiendbear.com/dowmin.gif

One of the ads being run on the CBS Market Watch quote sight is from a, "MR. Stock", online trading. The ad states,

"In Remembrance of Black Monday FREE Internet Stock Trades Otober 19, 1988".

Yes sir, indeedy, only in America................ :- ) )

. "This is a

serious global emergency," said Greg Mastel of the Economic Strategy

Institute, a Washington-based think tank

This guy Helprin is what we will get after Bubba leaves...Psuedo-nazi
hatred of any humanity which doesn't measure up to "their" standards.
He compares Clinton to a thinking man's Tawana Brawley...I know of the rogue prosecutor in that case as I live in the area...the prosecutor and the local authorities are people who hate blacks and resent their progress in the area...the local authorities think it is ok to beat, maime and otherwise abuse any black or minority and get away with it...the area is run by the republicans and they lie and cover-up their misdeeds. The fbi was called in numerous times to investigate jailhouse
beatings....I am not a liberal but becareful because the other side of the coin don't look so good from here...

Hello. Today is a very bullish celebration in the Hindu temples of Ganesh, his personal birthdate. His manefestation in daily life produces great results for good luck, future goals and removal of obstacles. In the temples and at home it is considered great luck to pat his forehead, the broad friendly face of an elephant.
Silverbaron: Add to the astrological calendar dates, Sunday September 6 is a full moon in partial eclipse following a recent partial eclipse of the Sun. Could it mean more volatility? I would take any tax loss selling ASAP before the crowd does, although mining shares are so undervalued now for the companies that will survive, I think I will keep what I own and wait and see what happens. The waxing moon again reaches the asterims of the constellation Taurus in late December--about the 30th I believe, but not before. Moon in Taurus ( the Bull ) has stood for solid beginnings and time to begin what will stand the tests of time. That could be a possible time to buy assets to hold for increase in value.
Perhaps I just have faith in the supply and demand curve, believing that when a great number of mines have ( or are currently ) closing that the supply of silver, copper will eventually diminish. For so many years we have been seeing in the case of silver that the demand increases while the total supply diminishes.
The new factor in the world as I see it this year, is markets that
once were unconnected, now move in tandem. Still we hear that some markets have less correlation with the US than others, such as India, but even in the papers this a.m. see the WSJ article for instance--one world economy? They mention Japan as being "uncorrelated," when ( if ) it turns around, since it has bottomed.

Pinky's Tailing Box: a weekly Wednesday feature of SI's At a Bottom Now for
Gold...

Princess Greed: a Fairytale....

Gold bug, polish my silver bars--I want to see my face shining in them
by morning.

You're in silver? You mean you haven't lost face yet...er--as you wish.

Gold bug, fill these with water.

If those market orders for Zappa get filled you won't need water because
you'll already be splashed...er--as you wish.

Gold bug, fetch me that pinscher.

Your portfolio is so full of penny mining stock dogs I'm not sure which
one to grab...er--as you wish.

5 Years Later...

My Princess, we are but poor resource stock performers...is there a
village nearby--A-A-A-G-H!--we have her. Quickly now, on to the blue
chip ship...when we're safely out of sight, we'll dispose of the her.

No one said anything about killing the girl.

When I found you, you were so slobbering drunk you almost got elected
senator of Massachusettes...and you, you're so stupid if you left now
you'd be a giant tax write-off loss.

You forgot to floss.

Enough--I'm your boss...oo-o-o!

*

Then Vizzini says the girl comes to harm.

He's no one to cross in spite of his charm.

You have a gift for rhyme my giant friend.

Just get the ship going you two. And no more rhymes now. I mean it.

Gold at $800 an oz--I've never seen it.

Oo-o-o!

*
Despite what you think, the special prosecuter will find you and you'll
all be hanged.

SPLASH!

She's jumped ship--go in after her...veer left, left!

We can't--it's too close to the fall elections.

S-H-R-I-E-K-!

Do you know what those are? Those are shrieking liber-eels. They always
grow louder when Clinton's about to get attacked.

I got her.

No investment can catch blue chips now. Look! The cliffs of insanity!

Vizzini, we are being followed by a goldbug through these treacherous
waters.

Naturally.

Vizzini, he's climbing the rope faster than we are.

Naturally.

Vizzini, the Dow is below 8400.

Inconceivable!!! Grope that rope! We have to cover up faster--did I make it clear your job is at stake?

Mine or Clinton's?

The gold bug is still hanging on.

I'll cut the rope.

He's still there...

Gold didn't fall to new lows? Inconceivable!!! You finish him off. We'll
head straight for the Geld-er hills.

I'm going to use my left hand--I don't want to beat him too fast.
You know what a hurry we're in to win an election. Okay, do it your way
but move along.

*

Hello down there. I am in a hurry to kill you in the coming
election--perhaps I could hand you a rope...what if I give you my word
as a liberal?

I'm not a CNN pollster.

How about as an independent?

Throw it down.

My name is Inigo Montoya--prepare to die.

S-W-A-S-H! S-L-I-C-E! S-W-A-S-H!

You are good! Who are you?

No one of consequence.

I must know.

Get used to disappointment.

I already have--my tech stock mutual fund is down 30% this year.

S-W-A-S-H! S-L-I-C-E! S-W-A-S-H!

You have won. Kill me quickly.

Okay--I'll switch your remaining portfolio to penny mining stocks.

T-H-U-N-K!

*

S-M-A-S-H!

I could have killed you with that liberal sized stone.

Look, you hit that poor mouse.

Get off my back so I can see what I'm fighting. I'm choking...

As are most of the blue chips in your portfolio. Rest well and dream of
large gold deposits.

*

So, gold bug, it is down to you and it is down to me. You have bested my
giant and you have bested my liberal, but you are no match for my
intellect.

You are wise?

Have you ever heard of Placer, Barrick, Newmont, and Freeport?

Yes.

McMoRan, er...moronic investments.

I suggest a battle of wits...smell this.

I don't smell anything.

It's solanum powder--a tasteless and odorless derivative of the
nightshade family and considered one of the world's deadlier poisons.
Which portfolio did I just contaminate with lethal derivatives?

That's simple. All I have to do is reason are you the sort of man who
would poison his own portfolio or that of his enemy's. I know that you
are a gold bug and I am a market bull, and the markets have been
outperforming gold for years, so I would hardly choose the portfolio in
front of you. But you must have known that being heavy in blue chips, I
am wary of overvaluations and deteriorating company earnings due to
Asia, wage pressures, and YK2 so I most certainly can't choose the
portfolio in front of me.

Then you've decided then...

Not in the slightest. You must know that because of my intelligence, I
would know that most gold sold in recent months was from Australia
killing the POG and that low metals prices further errode the stability
of the Aussie economy making it likely the Australian currency will
weaken, adding to the Asian woes and precipitating further flight to
quality to the US markets, so I most certainly can't choose the
portfolio in front of you. But you also must have knew that I would know
that Millenium fever, spreading nuclear capability to unstable Islamic
governments, soon-to-come meteor showers that may take out half our
satellite telecommunications, and currency devaluation in China due to
La Nia natural disasters might impact the price of gold spurring a
spectacular short covering rally, so I most certainly can't choose the
portfolio in front of me.

You're stalling.

Don't interrupt me! Where was I?

Australia.

Yes, as the Japanese, Australian, and other Asian currencies devalue,
hoards of US treasury bonds will be dumped on the market, sending
interest rates soaring and US equities in a tailspin, so I most
certainly wouldn't choose the portfolio in front of me. But a 16 year
gold overhang from potential Central Bank and Swiss bank sales coupled
with continued fallout from the Bre-X scandal means I most certainly
couldn't choose the portfolio in front of you.

Are you finished?

I haven't even begun to tap the vastness of my intellect. For with La
Nina arriving, cold weather will spur heavy oil demand, sending oil
prices to multi-year highs and undermining the dollar. Further, since
the US is the lender of last resort to the IMF and since many of the IMF
loans are to mismanaged, basket case economies, a backlash against the
dollar and dollar denominated equities is inevitable and so I could
never choose the portfolio in front of me. But with metals demand in
Asia falling and the potential for Asian countries to become net sellers
because of financial panic, I could never choose the portfolio in front
of you.

You are trying to get me to give something away...

You fool--you've given everything away!

Well, with my holding gold the last five years, just about everything...

Look!

What?

It was nothing--swallow your porfolio.

SLURP

Fool! One of the most important lessons to learn is never get involved
in derivatives in Asia, but only slightly less known is this: never try
to outwit a stock market bull who's been right for the last 13 years!...

THUNK

How did you know where to put the poison?

I poisoned both portfolios my Princess. I've spent the last 5 years
investing in pennystocks and precious metals building an immunity to to
heavy losses.

$$$

From the Tailing box...

Dear At a Bottom Now for Gold:

Is gold really a relic? --Mystified

Dear Mystified:

Cross myself and hope to buy... --Whirlwind

Dear Pinky's Tailing Box:

So when is Zappa going to fly? --Frequent Flier

Dear Frequent Flier:

Go Greyhound. --Whirlwind

Questions about the PMs?

E-mail the Whirlwind at:

whirlwindbuyszappa@mindless.com

Can this be TRUE--DEAR GOD !!!!!!!!!!

Liquidators of Gold beware, this is what happens in the end. All confidence is lost. cANADIAN buck is in a relentless freefall........

"They hear, but do not listen."

09:09 BANK OF CANADA BUYS CANADIAN DOLLARS AT $1.5595/DOLLAR.

Is there a reason for this serious decline across the board in European stocks?

08:59 BRAZIL SETS DOLLAR BUY/SELL AUCTION IN COMMERCIAL MKT AT LOWER MINIBAND.

I'll trade you this colored paper for that colored paper...

09:11 MEXICAN PESO SINKS TO 9.842/9.85 PER DOLLAR ON RUSSIA WEAKNESS.

That was cool.

With the rookie out flying the DOW plane today, I'm going to go downstairs and fix up the gold and silver levers. Ever since I let Cheesehead and blooper go down there things have gotten messed up.

scdut@worldnet.fr - http://www.scdut.com/

had better do something 'right' for a change... or I shall be sorely pissed... and I do mean sorely.....

It's too late for cANADA. Cretiene the PM has botched the whole affair with his mouth and now we're in a full blown crisis. It should be nearing the AU$ level pretty soon.
VERY NICE TO BE IN GOLD RIGHT NOW.......

http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980826/bank_of_ca_1.html

You mean other than global recession, Russian currency collapse, and widespread chaos and disrutpion in the financial markets together with heightened expectation of increased terroist activity together with loss of faith in the presidency in the US?

http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980826/brazil_s_c_1.html

Report says 2nd quarter growth will be down 5%-6%, 2nd straight quarter of negative growth. http://www.smh.com.au/news/9808/26/world/world.html

Was Bloop 404'd? Just curious--
Today is Gold's chance to decouple--will it?

CEAUX-DUTHEIL Stphane -- Your a pessimist.. :- ) ) ( just joking )

Gollum -- You mean there are problems? What? Me worry? ( Alfred E. Neuman )

and when the dollar melts, we can trade the funny colored paper betwixt us, no? :- ) )

Asian stocks stumble, hobbled by economic anxiety

By Sonali Verma

SINGAPORE, Aug 26 ( Reuters ) - Domestic worries and anxiety over the global economic outlook hobbled Asian stocks on Wednesday, pushing some markets to record lows while others managed to limp higher.

A new dramatic slide in the Russian rouble, which fell 69 percent against the mark on Wednesday, came after most Asian markets had closed.

In Taipei, stocks fell to a fresh 20-month low as early gains evaporated amid persistent anxiety over Taiwan's economy. The benchmark index closed down 94 points at 6,814.33.

``By mid-session, investors started to sell stocks again as pessimism over listed companies' first-half profits weighed in,'' said Taiwan Securities Investment vice-president Joseph Chiou.

In Tokyo, the benchmark Nikkei average fell 206.90 points to 14,866.03 on concerns that political wrangling would stall plans to right the country's ailing banking system, and the yen lost ground.

In Thailand, the SET index slid to a new 11-year low as investors remained cautious about the Russian political situation and other emerging markets.

``The activity was quite low as many investors have slowed down their investment to watch developments,'' said Phaibool Rachniyom at ABN Amro Asia Securities.

The Nikkei's decline, the weak yen and a domestic parliamentary debate on financial reforms also dampened market sentiment, brokers said. The SET composite index fell 2.72 points, or 1.18 pct, to 227.50.

In Sydney, traders mulled the gloomy international outlook and a swiftly sinking Australian dollar. The benchmark All Ordinaries index fell 19.7 points to 2,608 on Wednesday after the Australian dollar touched a 12-year low of US$0.5739.

Hong Kong shares also closed lower after succumbing to profit-taking, with less active buying by the government than in previous days, brokers said.

The Hang Seng Index lost 55.69 points to finish at 7,834.40. Turnover stayed high at HK$9.38 billion against Tuesday's HK$9.92 billion.

The Hang Seng's drop weighed down Shenzhen's hard currency B share index, which dipped 0.42 point to 56.28 on turnover of HK$10 million compared with Tuesday's HK$11.8 million.

Shanghai's hard currency B shares also closed sharply lower, pushed down by foreign selling of market leader Zhejiang Southeast Electric Power Co ( 900949.SS ) , brokers said. The B share index lost 1.319 points to 27.562.

Concerns over China's slowing economy amid recent flooding and weak interim results added to the market's unhappy mood.

The Philippines' 30-stock composite index closed 23.17 points down at 1,287.02 on expectations the government would announce weak first-half gross national product growth, and traders warned of heavy selling if GNP contracted or stayed flat.

In Jakarta, the composite index closed down 6.22 points at 360.93 points on turnover estimated at 248 billion rupiah, sliding with falls in Telkom and Indosat, dealers said.

Elsewhere in Asia, speculators drove up share prices.

In Seoul, stocks finished more than two percent higher, buoyed by foreign interest and futures-linked arbitrage buying, brokers said.

But selling pressure at the 320 level was expected to cap any further rise on Thursday, they said.

The Korea Stock Exchange composite stock price index ended up 7.33 points at 317.56, although losers edged out risers 392 to 388, with 93.22 million shares changing hands.

In Singapore, investors speculated on the composition of the new key stock market index, pushing the 30-share Straits Times Industrials Index up 1.59 percent to 925.85 points.

In Malaysia, shares closed nearly unchanged after the country's largest bank, Maybank recovered. The stock closed two cents lower at 3.02 ringgit after slipping to a low of 2.84 ringgit a day after reporting an unexpectedly sharp fall in profit.

Kuala Lumpur's benchmark Composite Index closed 0.32 point up at 324.49.

In Sri Lanka, the Colombo all-share index rose 10.5 points to 515.7 after local buying drove up most blue chips, brokers said.

http://www.smh.com.au/news/9808/26/world/world1.html

Ah, but it is a fine day for buying, yes?

be made by calling 1-800-GO-GOLLUM. Mention you are a member of Kitco and be eligible for additional discounts on your fare.
Arrival at your destination is not guaranteed.

The investors lament, "If I only had more money to buy stocks with...."

After having lived in Tangier, Gibraltar, Jerez, London, Paris and Sydem\ney, visited about 30 countries around the world, I settled in Adelaide. It's the best kept secret in the world!

You are exactly correct about the dollar velocity and the FED having all the dollars...it's all in treasuries thru-out the world...but will come home here real soon...as Japan, China, Germany, et el need the money, they will be dumping those T-Bonds fast and furious...matter of fact, they have already started.

And yes the money supply is up and will continue to be UP, we are addicted to spending in this counrty and the politicians want the party to continue...could you imagine being the politician who bankrupt the dippies...unthinkable. But beware!!! As the world currencies continue to devalue, they will not have anymore money left to buy US T-Bonds and the FED will be forced to start buying its' own treasuries, thus throwing more cash into the US machine and not the world machine. This is one of the things which will cause the change in the inflation rate. As we all know, inflation is a result of printing excess currency...in any form...ie; bonds.

Maria sez "Down across the board ---- one positive: money is still coming into this market...." CNBC

And the rain appears to be subsiding. So off to work I must go! This old house awaits.... :- ( Besides, who wants to watch this pestilence anyhow? Working in high humidty and heat is so much more fun.............NOT!

BBML.

Spent some cyber time in Adelaide yesterday. Looks like a great place to live. http://www.adelaide.sa.gov.au/

Mr. G, where did Ms. newbie aviatrix get her flight training...at US Navy submariner's school????

http://www.cairns.net.au/~sharefin/Markets/Master.htm
Practise improves the soul.
And keeps one out of trouble.

Namaste

You must like all the holy shrines
As well all the red & white wines.
Up into the hills on the weekends
Sniffing out the good bottles?

Will be in Adelaide for xmas
Visiting the inlaws
Send us an email...
We could always quaff a few.
sharefin@cairns.net.au

......what a site, many thanks, it's a shortcut on my desktop !!
You are goooooooooood !
l_b

One of the reasons we let the rookie fly today is 1 ) We couldn't find any passengers to fly today, 2 ) None of the experienced pilots wanted to go up, 3 ) Rookies need to learn sometime, and 4 ) We finally got our insurance renewed ( they had a rookie insurance salesman working ) .

All: It is very difficult for people who do not live here to appreciate the incandescent incompetence of our Federal Government. As quoted from The Canadian Press "Prime Minister Jean Chretien reiterated that it's not his job to rescue the plunging loonie." "Its his job" he said, referring to Gordon Thiessen, the governor of the Bank of Canada.
We have continued to elect people like this for the last thirty years: but what can one expect from an electorate who mostly really do think that their brain surgery is "free"!
Max

We better not be feeling each other's pain too much or Ken Star will be taking a look at us. The pain of dollar cost averaging. Ouch. Ooh! Yeow! No Mas! No Mas! Go Gold!!

Namaste' .... You are fantastic!! All owe you a debt which will never be able to be repaid... what a site for sources. THANKS!!!!!

I just ran back up here to check on how my little nudge of the gold and silver levers did. Hmmmmnnnn, that seems to be in the right direction.

What do you say we have a fine old fashioned PM rally?

It's what I have been adding to daily.
Not tidy but functional.

Lots of links to some great sites.
Charts at the bottom.
Some need work but the basics are there.
Slowly it will evolve and improve.

Cheers

The sun came out, cooked up some recently fallen moisture, and now the clouds are back! One problem that I have... the prices on the gold stocks just got better this A.M. If you're a buyer that's good, otherwise...

I just got off of the phone with a few contract agencies ( high tech temps and all... ) that I deal with, and to a word they all said the same thing, "It's been awful quite out there, must be vacations during August, not many job reqs coming in. We expect more in September..." I hope so. Fixing up, 'This Old House', is becoming a drag... GO GOLD AND OIL!!!!

The Writing is now on the wall for all to clearly see. Financial and currency meltdowns in Asia for nearly a year. The Chinese yuan ( renminbi ) on the verge of devaluation. Stock markets worldwide beginning to tank following Wall Street's lead to the Bear's Lair. I read somewhere this week that more than 70% of ALL stocks listed on the NYSE are DOWN already 30% in value this year if that's not a full-blown BEAR MARKET, pray tell, WHAT IS?!

Over-night the Russian rouble crumbles 69%. And as sharfin so aptly observes:

"Russian central bank voids rouble/dollar trade; "People are also withdrawing en masse their rouble and dollar savings from banks,''

"Then you have the Japanese LTCB Bank being exposed to $US347 odd billion in derivatives gone bad."

"The dominos are toppling, Knocking each other over at an ever increasing speed."

"Watch out below. Globex crashed 10 pts in one hour."

International Market analyst John Kutyn has been warning for some time about the reckoning to come as fallout from the ASIAN CONTAGION. Unfortunately, it's just beginning. Mr. Kutyn's latest report demonstrates a complete understanding of where the world's economy has been, is, and will inescapably and painfully be going.

Kutyn continues to view GOLD as the "Noah's Ark" to material salvation.

His report "KEYS OF THE KINGDOM" may be read at following URL - it will be necessary to delete the extra letters "en" of the word "golden" before pasting the URL to the Internet:

http://www.golden-eagle.com/asian_corner_98/kutyn082498.html

at the waterfront ..
knocked 8 % off the market..

Was it the recycled remains of the dud cruise missle fired at Afghanastan? You know what happens when the U.S. gets a Lefty trying to use gunboat diplomacy... :- ) )

What makes you think we will be GOING into the millenium?

"The possession of gold has ruined fewer men than lack of it." -Thomas Bailey Aldridge, 1903

Anyone read about the late 1920's.. hey some of you might be old enough to remember those "good old days!"

Apparently the overseas markets went down first. Many investors fled to the US dollar and the US markets for "safety". Sound familiar?

Also in the 1920's they had a exciting new technology that made trading much easier: the telephone. Why investors no longer had to wait days/weeks to have their transactions processed by mail. They could just phone their trades in to a broker. Sound familiar?

I sure hope rookie remembered to fasten her seatbelt ( at least there aren't any passengers ) . Rookies always tend to overcompensate so it might be kind of a roller coaster up there.

August 26, 1998

U.S. economist recommends steps for healing Asia

SINGAPORE ( AP ) -- A prominent U.S. economist said Wednesday that the IMF's economic reforms aren't working in Asia and that the region should try to stimulate its battered economies by printing more money to cause inflation.

"The time has come to do something radical," said Paul Krugman, a Massachusetts Institute of Technology economics professor who gained some renown by predicting Asia's demise before its bubble burst and the crisis began a year ago.

Krugman said the International Monetary Fund bailout program, which includes large aid packages and painful economic reforms, has not worked in countries such as Indonesia, South Korea and Thailand.

He said a severe recession is now spreading across the entire region and "what Asia needs is inflation with increased liquidity." He recommended putting more money into circulation, especially in Japan, to encourage inflation and lower interest rates. Krugman said the value of the yen should be allowed to fall even further against the U.S. dollar.

Currently, he said, Japan's monetary policy is trying to prevent the yen from falling further, regardless of whether or not that helps the nation's economy.

Krugman said his remedies would boost consumer spending and growth.

http://www.usatoday.com/money/charts.htm

@Gaia's revenge.com

Dow topped at 9367! Buy gold. Sell Dow. It's a no-brainer!

gold again moving in the same direction as the dollar. More and more fear out there in paper land! Some of it seems to be finding its way into gold.

Panda/Fixing up, 'This Old House', is becoming a drag...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Yup. Windows, doors, siding, trim. Out goes the old
wood divided single panes and in goes the double insulated
vinyls. Two story, gets exciting. Everything's going in
plumb and square but of course nothing else is so it's
double taper everything-- wider and thicker at one end
than another. The ol' Rockwell jointer ( '47 ) is getting
quite a workout. The Craftsman tablesaw, '58. Shopsmith,
'61 anniversary model. Good stuff : )

Sorry about delay in replying. Because of my addictive personality have limited myself to 2 hours cyber access a day which I share with kidz and their homework. Have had to wait but it's now midnight in the city of churches. My time starts again...luckily kidz are asleep..
sharefin; the car is warm, ready to go and explore the Mclaren Vale and Barossa with you....auric....I know you'll love it here.
Greetings from the post millenium paradise

Ah yes, 1929, here's some of the inner workings:
http://www.radix.net/~tarpley/29crash.htm

The power of the Rothschilds and their octopus of international bankers is beyond comprehension. Noone knows about them except by legend because of the extremes they go to in order to remain secret. This fact alone should alert all to their cunning and ability to capture the world.

The article gives true meaning and understanding of the policies enacted by the Rothschilds in the past and is continuous to this day. Their policies of creating wars, panics, installing politicians that do their bidding, creating the fiat money systems under their control that keep major governments paying retribution for usary by taxation of the dumbfounded masses over the many generations is ongoing at this very moment.

Is it any wonder that currencies are collapsing world wide, commodities are tanking, especially gold, the one last threat to the fiat money system they engineered and have in place working to their benefit.

If anyone doubts who and what is behind the machinations that have occurred in the past and today in the markets has only to look to the Rothschilds and their cohorts.

Bet your bottom dollar that they are waiting in the wings to make the mother of all coups for their final conquest of a one world government and currency.

PREDICTIONS:

1 ) Islam and China are the only remaining forces that they do not TOTALLY CONTROL.

2 ) A war will be waged against Islam. This is in the works right now.

3 ) Next will be China.

4 ) A world wide currency crises is developing with the dollar as the final currency that will fall.

5 ) The worlds masses will howl and cry for a fix to the world monatary crises.

6 ) The powers that be ( Rothschilds ) will give them what they beg and yearn for, a one world currency.

For anyone to ignore or dismiss what happened after Waterloo as a one time occurence and not the start of their grab of world wide power is naive. FIRST A GOVERNMENT, THEN THE WORLD. What will be left for them to conquer? The universe, after all they will have conquered humanity and the world. EVEN GOLD WILL NOT HELP US. IMHO.

MAY THE FORCE BE WITH US, ONE AND ALL.

To the one who shares...Thanks from someone who cares. I
found your links quite tidy.

longtime lurker .....burning the midnight oil

The levers are in place.

Ph_LA, here we go again. The last time I tried this we only got 2 out of Ag. Let's see if I can do better.

I have to go see how the rookie is doing.

I would appreciate it if you could jam that Ag lever and bring us up by a buck. My posterior has been dragging on the ground for the past few months and its starting to hurt a little bit. Please? TIA

Eldorado--Any weather updates? Hurricane Bonnie looks like it could be real nasty. Hope you're keeping low!

Sharefin,

I disagree with your doom and gloom scenarios but I find that you are an extremely generous individual.

Your earlier message of 9:34 proves it.

Congratulations.

Sharefin,

I disagree with your doom and gloom scenarios but I find that you are an extremely generous individual.

Your earlier message of 9:34 proves it.

Congratulations.

Well, she's doing ok. Wings are still on. A little wobbly. I suspect except for a few ups and downs it's going to be a lot like a milder version of Friday. Might even finish up at the close.

I'm looking at making my first purchase of gold coins today.
My question is...when buying a roll of gold coins - American
Eagles, are they each individually sealed? Is this something I
should be concerned with.

longtime lurker .....burning the midnight oil in New Zealand......
two points
1. if gold is maintaining its price at 41250 yen per oz , does this mean it is the Japanese who are stocking up on gold ?

2. if we have 5,500,000,000 people in the world and 85,000 tonnes of gold how can gold ever become a circulated and held ( in coins ) currency , by my mathematics there is not enough of the yellow metal for us all to have a wedding ring let alone lots of coins in everyones pockets .......comments please .

ps... got gold and want more .

For an ex-sailor, you're a smart, fully qualified, serious computer geek!
Congratulations. Well done!
"Wisdom is knowing what to do, Virtue is doing it"
Chinese proverb

Woldwide anxiety is now just about to abate. For a while anyway. ( and maybe for a long time? )

It will be good for Gold, Silver and Platinum.

Auric -- Weather starting to come ashore around Wilmington. They 'claim' storm is to come ashore and then make an abrupt turn to the north and then to the north east. Perhaps. At least I'm not too near the coast, not that Fran two years ago was particularly pleasant anyway. Lots and lots of power out for many days. Trees down everywhere. Cash only at stores that still had anything anybody wanted. HOT and no ice. All was simply 'swell'!

A buck!? No, THAT flight is for Zelem in mid to late September, and it will be a humdinger. Methinks MORE than a buck.

look maw the stock market went way down an gold went way up. maybe I should call them guys whuts advertisin gold on the radio. they say the stock market is goin down a lot more

Should another card drop today we could see the first signs of panic....

You must've been working on my house... :- ) )

and detect a problem. Do you think Goldman will do it's IPO in the bad coming Nov. environment projected ( probably not ) ?

How will they alter the chart to make it fit THEIR needs ( and they will ) ?

This implies they may be damaging the market noe to make it rise in the 4th quarter perhaps?

Thanks,

HB

Methinks China is not that big a problem....

As for Islam, there are many Casablanka and Viennas of intrigue in the world today. Strange happenings in dingy hotels and little known dust spots here and there. Methinks things are being taken care of.

Gollum: Ever piloted a spaceship? My guess is that we will need your expert guidance for a Gold bullion suborbital shakeout sometime in the spring of 1999, provided that the currency meltdowns and debt crises have ended. CRY0 should have bottomed by then.

My only thoughts about now versus 1929 is that we are now net debtors. We do not have the cash cushion that held up the Japanese deflation for nearly 10 years. I don't have a clue regarding how quickly our tightly coupled, debt encumbered economy will fold up during a severe recession. If we have a debt implosion -- or a close call, the US dollar would tank, and gold bullion would rise.

My guess is that the scenario will resemble 1929 at first as our markets and economy spiral down. But -- if we reach a critical point of no return that not even AG can fix -- our monetary velocity will plummet. Then the US dollar will head south, with rising interest rates and rising gold bullion prices.

So -- my intuitive guess is that deflation will come first ( al la 1929 ) . But when our debt problems catch up with us, we are more likely to emulate Indonesia than the USA in 1929. When gold bullion starts to rise, we will be in very serious trouble indeed. Partially because it will mean that AG and RR have thrown in the towel.

It is still possible that we could squeak by this one, and make it to our next big crisis when the baby boomers retire. But -- I doubt it.

As I know from structural failure analysis -- the precise breaking point when the dollar collapses and gold skyrockets is unknowable -- too many unknowns. Just keep most of your powder dry, because the best part of the gold bug Tsunami will be after the US dollar tanks.

Notice Mexico is down another 5% today?

Have you got Jefferson coin's 800? Any other dealer you know competitive re junk silver bags? Many thanx- somehow I lost mine, must be Bonnie!!

Perhaps sooner than you think.

//Y2k Weatherman Report #63//

Today's post is another article from Randy Flink of Championship
Financial Advisors. Background on Randy can be found at:

http://www.homestead.com/y2kweatherman/RandyFlink.html

---

// Y2k Financial Asset Protection //

Anticipating When The Enemy Will Strike
by Randy Flink

In my last discussion, entitled "Scoping Out the Y2k Enemy," I
identified a host of different financial and economic scenarios which
could result from Y2k disruptions. The conclusion was that you must
gear your personal financial preparations for as many of these
scenarios as you think relevant.

["Scoping Out the Y2k Enemy" is archived on Y2k Watch at
http://y2kwatch.com/showart.php3?idx=91&rtn=y2kman.htm/]

There is only so much sand in the Y2k hourglass before the dreaded
hour arrives. However, it is unwise to assume that you have until
December 31, 1999 to get your house in order. Here is why. In July,
President Clinton gave his first public address on Y2k. In his
carefully crafted speech, the President intentionally hit a few panic
buttons but nevertheless assured us that THE US GOVT WILL BE READY BY
MARCH 31, 1999.

If you do your homework on the state of Y2k systems remediation within
the various US Government agencies, you quickly will come to the
conclusion that the President's March 31, 1999 deadline is completely
unachievable. When April 1, 1999 rolls around and the US Government
is not in a state of Y2k readiness, the air raid sirens will be
activated by such Y2k awareness advocates as Senator Bennett,
Congressman Horn, Presidential Candidate Forbes, and Y2k panic will
start to set in. The news media will accentuate this panic with their
tabloid headlines and TV sound bites. The talk show hosts are likely
to follow suit.

So, your real window of Y2k preparedness can be expected to remain
relatively wide open until March 31, 1999. Then, it will slowly close
in the ensuing months as the media coverage builds and builds as
reporters themselves realize that they are just as unprepared and
vulnerable as anyone else. The window of preparedness will
permanently close when the US Government senses that too many people
are withdrawing their money from the banking system, and that the
threat of bank runs is omnipresent. We can only guess at the US
Government's response to this perceived threat. My personal bet is
that at some critical juncture, the US Government will introduce
currency rationing and declare the private hoarding or stockpiling of
essential commodities as "very unpatriotic."

My greater fear is that the US Government ( and every other government
in the world ) will flood the banks and their ATM machines with
unprecedented inventories of banknotes in order to allay fears of
currency shortages and insolvent banks, giving us a serious dose of
hyper-inflation. For a guideline on how to safeguard your financial
assets from Y2k disruptions, see the Y2k Personal Insurance Plan
archived on Y2k Watch. ( This article was last updated on 8-6-98 with
information on the reduced investment minimums for US Treasury bills
and shorter-term notes. ) My recommended Y2k Personal Insurance Plan
can be found at:

http://y2kwatch.com/showart.php3?idx=81&rtn=y2kman.htm
http://www.homestead.com/Y2kWeatherman/RonBrown.html

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
http://www.numismaticproperties.com/main.htm
http://golddealer.com

golden eagles are sealed in plastic as they come from the mint.
If you open, just remember to handle with fingers on the edges.

It would seem that russia has taken the creditors to the woodshed and this is the FIRST sign that gold and commodities will rally. WHY? The fear that the market has been operating under is that to pay their bills creditors will sell assets to pay for loans made with US dollars.
Hence the CRB has collapsed and so has gold. IF the russians stiff their creditors and keep their assets then there is no pressure on gold but there is a lot of pressure on money and the dollars.

Thanks, off to buy.

We need to watch the closing prices, never mind the shenanigans of the neoteric internet day trader crowd, and see if they stay on chart.

Assuming that they do, then yes, the IPO will have a problem.

But then Goldman may have much much worse things to think about by then.

By George! I think she's got it!

http://www.msnbc.com/news/default.asp

$ 11,000.00 in credit card debt for Monica in December.

the markets are cloudy on this fine day.---Welcome to the Goldbug-tavern!
To give an one ounce goldcoin to every poor in the world would require how many rich people? How many ounces?

Hey man, you watching this? I've got spot silver at 5.09. Thats up 13 from the lows.

Tuesday August 25, 1998
Australian Financial Reveiw

US switches partners in Asian diplomatic dance
China Observed, By Rowan Callick
[Excerpts]

The significance of President Clinton's visit to China in June has been temporarily obscured by a sex scandal involving a stained, much-handled dress. But in global, historical terms, the visit is still considerably more significant than any presidential dalliance with the mesmeric
Monica Lewinsky.

"Body language means a lot, of course, in this White House - as it always has in China's imperial halls too. And the impact of the China visit and its images and vocabulary, is only now beginning to become apparent.

For one result of the visit is that the US is - in informal
relationships, though not yet in formal treaty terms -
making China its prime partner in Asia, replacing Japan.

Although the US two months ago intervened to help shore up a collapsing yen, this was driven as much by self-interest as by a sense of friendship and partnership.

A clearer message was sent by the President's decision to over-fly Japan, America's principal regional ally for half a century, en route for his week's stay in China."

Red across the board for commodities...They're headed for zero!

Lefty Kiwi - your reading of the Gold Supply vs. World Population is why I naively bought Gold last year. Then the POG commenced to sink and sink.
Nevertheless I still think that demand will eventually have to be reckoned with. There is only enough Gold for two dozen 10-grain coins per person. See my post of: Wed Jul 22 1998 02:17

RJ - Sutherland said "There you go again, makin' with those negative waves." or something pretty close to that. It was "Negative Waves".

Anybody here from Duke_A?
It should be getting pretty nasty there by now.
Though I think Bonnie is coming ashore somewhat south.
But she will sweep the entire Carolina coast before she is done.

Awwww, Cocoa and Cotton aren't doing badly.

Mike, your idea on backing up ruble with vodka
is very interesting and amazingly simple to understand.
Unfortunately, in this case ruble assets will be
drinkable, which means Russia will fall into
hyperinflation the next day this change from
ruble to buble ( ruble backed by vodka ) is announced...

However, I took it upon myself to send wire to Kremlin,
to Uncle Boris, offering him this idea for consideration.
I know for sure that Kremlin is already excited...

http://www.reagan.com/HotTopics.main/document-8.26.1998.3.html

Charlie:

Jefferson Coin & Bullion ( 800 ) 877-8847.

The top 3 U.S. junk silver coin dealers from an old Gold & Silver Report ( 1996 ) survey were:

F.J. Vollmer ( 800 ) 447-8368
Bill Youngerman ( 800 ) 327-5010
Dillon Gage ( 800 ) 375-4653

Tom

I assume these are still competitive.

All: So -- RJ is going long on gold bullion, Russia is still imploding, with South America not far behind. Canada next? Are we going to get to $0.50 US per Canadian dollar? I hope not -- but the rolling devaluations are not stopping for anyone. Perhaps Gollum is right -- that Gold equities will not wait much longer before they go up.

Anyone wonder why Kenneth Starr is smiling like a Chesire cat these days, and WJC is in hiding? Perhaps Monica's credit card bill being reimbursed by the White House has something to do with it. Can you imagine the arrogance of that -- and he should know about the information revolution -- that such things as a credit card bill are practically public information. Looks like Big Brother is watching alright, but it is Big Brother himself who lost -- this time. Notice how the Democrats now want impeachment proceedings ( minority leader in House or Senate said that today -- IMHO ) , but the Republicans don't? I wonder why?

So -- I'll bet Kenneth Starr has enough WJC illegal activity for Congress to go forward with impeachment -- FBI files or no.

Any guess what the markets will do when this gets out? You can forget about Dow 10,000. Any 'flight to safety' will be neutralized by WJC's folding fortunes.

Like bees gathering pollen and nectar, molecule size hunter-gatherers probing the waste-dumps and ore-bodies of the world to bring home the Gold and Silver. Within several years some outfit will implement this technology for this purpose. As an indication of its progress there is now an entire section on nanotechnology at Yahoo.
http://www.yahoo.com/Science/Nanotechnology/

Question: since Silver never goes away - it just gets spread around.
How much Silver is there above ground - the total that is recoverable?

Many thanx Tom- a big help.

August 26, 1998

FOCUS-Rouble melts down, central bank ends support

MOSCOW, Aug 26 ( Reuters ) - Russia's rouble plunged more than 40 percent against the German mark on Wednesday and the bewildered central bank declared it could no longer afford to intervene to support the battered currency.
http://www.freecartoons.com/ReutersNews/RUSSIA.html

Gollum:

Just got caught up with last night's posts. Made me very nervous seeing references to $4.89, etc. and was almost afraid to look. Any more of these downdrafts ( clear air turbulance? ) and there will be margin calls to contend with. What thinks ye of RJ's warning of a bear trap set at $5.50 before the real rally can begin? Or is it up, up, and away from here?

Keep up the good work!

For those who missed it last evening I suggest you take a look at JEIL's chart work at http://pcis.net/jeannev/jeil.htm He sure has an uncanny grasp of what has been and what is coming at us.

RJ is very perceptive, moreso than most. If we see any sort of rally before the BIG one, it will be just as he says, a bull trap.

Has anyone seen this story on the web and if so please post the URL.

August 26, 1998

European markets go down with Russian chill

LONDON ( Reuters ) - A chill descended on European markets Wednesday as Russia reeled from a plunging rouble, a banking system close to collapse, and an evaporation of investor confidence after its debt restructuring.

Wall Street opened with losses of around 1 percent in a broad sell-off, then went lower still, compounding falls in European stock markets indices of 2 percent to 3.5 percent.

"Between Russia and ongoing fears of Asia, it almost seems as if the end of the world is going to happen," said Peter Cardillo, director of research at Westfalia Investments.
http://www.freecartoons.com/ReutersNews/MARKETS-EUROPE.html

We just broke a record low set back on July 25th 1986 of 58.72 intra-day. Anyone got an idea what's next?

Also, any opinions on this article about gold/silver..... http://www.pei-intl.com/HMEFRAME.HTM

What network of clandestine agents would you say is the best and most well financed in the world today? Certainly not the CIA, KGB, NSA, MI5, FBI, and such. The Mosad?

Well they probably don't even have a name, and even if they did, if they were any good you would never have heard of them.

I doubt they would carry any sort of ID, but if they did I would bet it would have a red shield embossed on it.

August 26, 1998

Loonie falls more than a third of a cent

TORONTO ( CP ) -- The Canadian dollar came under relentless selling pressure today, falling nearly four tenths of a cent to 64.16 cents US on North American currency markets.

"Russia appears to be going through a financial meltdown right now, and don't forget it has one of the highest stockpiles of nuclear warheads in the world.

"A lot of people are very nervous in terms of how they evaluate financial risk. Also, the notion that Russia may be dumping more commodities and putting more downward pressure on commodity prices is not good news for the dollar."
http://www.freecartoons.com/BizTicker/CANOE-wire.Dollar-Markets.html

http://www.aci.net/kalliste/

Bonnie looks like a wipe out from Wilmington to Hatteras

July 86 Record Low was 0.5710. ( Was in a dealing room working that day )
It's just been broken: trading at 0.5682 US cents per Australian dollar. That makes Gold around A$499 per ounce. We watch and wait.
Bye the way Nick ( sharefin ) Great resource page. @Sunny_Brisbane

American money funds seemed to be the only safe haven recently, and the only thing in my bag of goodies that is going up. What about the equity in your home? The 10% currency decrease has taken a big chunk out of that also. At least with inflation, we were somewhat protected. THIS is much worse!

Gollum...you're right, cocoa and cotton and hanging on...there must be a well dressed sweet tooth out there someplace....by the way, I need to ask a favor...could you get Gollum airlines to get this market to 9000 feet so that I could fire one of those cruise missiles ( short position ) at the market. PS...the air doesn't get thin until 10,000 feet. I think Abbey Cohen has tried to climb Mt. Everest one to many times.

Yes, by George! She really HAS got it!

''Banks do have rubles now,'' said Irina Yasina, a central bank spokeswoman. ''We returned to them part of their mandatory reserves, hoping that they would settle with their depositors, with each other,
and effect clients' payments. But things took a different turn. Banks channeled the money to the currency markets.''

Brunswick Warburg, an investment firm, reported that the central bank had pumped more than 12 billion rubles into the banking system over the last three days to bolster banks, rather than let some of them go under.

US$ is ballooning! Where will the stampede go when it bursts?
There is only one exit left.
GGGGOOOOLLLLDDD!
It's Cheesehead time!

Jims - Here are my trades over the last few days:

Wheat Dec - B - 272, S - 278.5

Silver Dec - B - 510, stopped 508
B - 511, stopped 507
Long from 503

SnP Sept S - 1097.50 stopped 1103.00
S - 1109.00 B - 1082.00
B - 1082.00 S - 1095.00
Short from 1095.00

Coffee Dec This trade was posted in advance
Long 108.50
other orders were not filled may have to file a complaint

looks more like Aeroflop Airlines to me. Fire the crew and call in Cheesehead and Puetz.

Jims - Here are my trades over the last few days:

Wheat Dec - B - 272, S - 278.5

Silver Dec - B - 510, stopped 508
B - 511, stopped 507
Long from 503

SnP Sept S - 1097.50 stopped 1103.00
S - 1109.00 B - 1082.00
B - 1082.00 S - 1095.00
Short from 1095.00

Coffee Dec This trade was posted in advance
Long 108.50
other orders were not filled may have to file a complaint

Jims - Here are my trades over the last few days:

Wheat Dec - B - 272, S - 278.5

Silver Dec - B - 510, stopped 508
B - 511, stopped 507
Long from 503

SnP Sept S - 1097.50 stopped 1103.00
S - 1109.00 B - 1082.00
B - 1082.00 S - 1095.00
Short from 1095.00

Coffee Dec This trade was posted in advance
Long 108.50
other orders were not filled may have to file a complaint

All:

There have been some very interesting rumblings in the precious metals and currency markets this morning. One rumor that meandered over the wires had to do with a liquidity shortage in the Saudi banking system. This rumor occured in congruence with another rumor about the freezing of assets of Bin Laden and others. Coincidentally ( ? ) these rumors began at about the time that gold spiked upwards, in the face of further collapses in the Austrailian and Canadian dollars. There is some very strange ( *&^ going on here.

Speaking of strange, our good old friend from PEI was apparently in the Access market last night sweeping down the silver. On cue, someone came along and bid it back in his face. I get the feeling that there are some very personal things going on.

It sure looks like gold and silver should collapse into a pit of despair given what is going on about. It is actually remarkable that they are holding on. Copper and Lumber are also just kind of sitting around.

A few weeks back I commented on the possibility that a rising gold price would put pressure on Aussie miners who have large hedge positions. With the Australian dollar disappearing at an alarming rate, some bullion banks could be getting very nervous about their outstanding loans. The bizarre scenario where rising gold prices bankrupt gold mining companies is not quite as bizarre as it was a few weeks back.

US money supply, after growing relatively slowly over the late spring and early summer, is once again in rapid expansion mode. At the same time, treasury holding of foreign CB's is on the decline.

Once the contagion deals a serious blow to a country where there is a lot of US bank exposure ( Mexico! ) the dollar's days of strength may come to a screeching halt. In the for what its worth department, our currency system is long a medium quantity of Yen. Since we are trend followers, this amounts to a statement that the Yen has been one of the better performing currencies in our world over the past months.

I think you will need a Stinger, or Nike, Or Phoenix, or somesuch. Cruise missles are for ground targets.

9000? Can do. Have your missle ready for the week immediately following the ides of September. All of Gollum's pilots will be on vacation then.

As Dines forcasted gold will not rally until the currency wars begin and we are getting closer everyday!

Do not take Marshall seriously, he is hopelessy out of date and confused. DOD No longer uses DEFCON to describe the readiness posture. When they did there were 5 Defconlevels Defcon 2 was merely a low grade alert meaining personnel had to keep commanders informed of there location and standby phones. Defcon 4 was Emminate Danger of War Defcon 5 was War. Now we use Threatcon A,B,C,D. D. Is war we are at A which is the same as Defcon 2. I dont know where he gets his info but dont take it too seriously.

http://www.the-moneychanger.com/html/numino.html

For those that buy...

----------------------------------------
As to..
http://www.cairns.net.au/~sharefin/Markets/Master.htm

Thanks for all the compliments.
Any good links sugested can easily be added.
Namaste

Having sold their gold reserves , the Canadian and Australian currencies have been dropping and are becoming WORTHLESS. With deflation accelerating world wide, the purchasing power of the Canadian and Australian currencies instead of increasing in value , they are declining against the American dollar. What is the solution ? Immediately hike interest rates, cut taxes at the same time and start accumulating gold instead of selling it. These moves will stabilize these currencies and give their governments some time to tackle their structural problems.

FUN? How 'bout this?
FYI: Y2k Opportunities - The gold standard is another fix that eliminates much of the chaos that would otherwise occur in 2000 when the clock strikes 12 midnight. If the United States were to fix the dollar to gold, say at the end of this year, by the time the clock strikes a year later, every one of the 150 currencies could be plugged into it.
http://www.polyconomics.com/searchbase/y2k.html>http://www.polyconomics.com/searchbase/y2k.html

You can read through prepared testimony from seven different field hearings covering different regions and industries, at
http://www.senate.gov/~banking/hearings.htm.

My advice is that in addition to focusing attention on the $1 trillion in private lawsuits,Congress also take note of the gigantic problems governments everywhere will have because of Y2K, and the easiest way to alleviate them: A SIMPLE FLAT TAX SYSTEM AND A DOLLAR/GOLD STANDARD.
http://www.polyconomics.com/searchbase/y2k.html

August 26, 1998

IMF's Camdessus meets Russian, Ukrainian leaders

WASHINGTON ( Reuters ) - The International Monetary Fund's managing director held surprise talks Wednesday with Russian and Ukrainian leaders on the financial crisis gripping Russia and fallout across the region.

An IMF spokesman in Washington said the fund's managing director, Michel Camdessus, was meeting with Russia's acting Prime Minister Viktor Chernomyrdin and Ukrainian President Leonid Kuchma in Ukraine's Crimea peninsula, against the backdrop of the deepening crisis and plummeting currencies.

Ukraine's hryvnia has taken a battering in the wake of neighboring Russia's rouble devaluation. What happens in Moscow is critical for Kiev because Russia accounts for about 40 percent of Ukraine's foreign trade.

http://www.freecartoons.com/ReutersNews/IMF-RUSSIA.html

Dear John Kutyn:

In your essay at Gold- Eagle of July 16 you write:

"Speculating investors are relying ( indeed wishfully hoping ) on central banks to sell gold to cover their SHORT positions. HOWEVER, SHOULD central banks NOT sell gold, there is no identifiable source of gold to cover these SHORT positions - Except, of course, at much higher prices. Speculating investors who expect central banks to sell them gold would do well to first ascertain the ILLOGIC of why central banks would first lend vast amounts of gold ( which drives down the price of gold ) prior to selling the gold. ( Further commentary on this point is beyond the scope of this report. ) "

You go on to speculate that the Japanese might very well have already and/or be planning to sell dollars and purchase the resultant price-rising gold.

Your point is well taken. I, too have pondered the "ILLOGIC of why central banks would first lend vast amounts of gold ( which drives down the price of gold ) prior to selling the gold". Yet central banks would not seem so stupid as to engage in "illogical" practises. The inescapable conclusion is that a reason does exist.

I first recall reading one of your well-thought-out commentaries at Kitco. This would lead me to believe that you are also aware of the writings of ANOTHER, who also used to post at Kitco. You probably know that his writings can now be found at www.USAGold.com

My question to you is:

To what extent do you feel that ANOTHER's contention is correct that it is the European Central Banks that have conciously driven down the price of gold through leasing in order to allow it to rise upon the introduction of the Euro to insure the strength of their new currency? Doesn't this fit beautifully with your own analysis? After all, there is very little beyond mere rumors and threats on the part of their officials to suggest that Japan has actually been buying quantities of gold. Yet the Europeans have vast amounts as part of their treasuries. ( Even Spain has huge reserves, perhaps left over from their conquest of the Americas? ) In any case, the actual result would be the same, except that if it is theEuropean CBs we would have some clue as to when the rise in the price of gold should commence.

Thank you for your writings which I have always admired.

Sincerely, PH in LA

Having broken the 200 long term support line, my computer simulated software project the CRB to bottom between 25-50 within the next few years.

Another one of Jude's letters

Advice to Alan Greenspan
http://www.polyconomics.com/searchbase/08-19-98.html

-----------------------
Whipsaw markets
Sell - buy - sell.
This mornings gaps have now been filled.
Selloff time with a late pulback???

Always enjoy your comments. You make the trading market seem like a cold-war style war with lots of mystery.

Having broken the 200 long term support line, my computer simulated software project the CRB to bottom between 25-50 within the next few years.

Sep98 gold at 2856, down $1.30. Dec 280 puts @ 470 10 minutes ago I just got filled @ 580. This is not a good sign. Dec puts expire 11/13. Last night they were at about 440 at the close. If you own physical, it is time to protect the value with these puts. This is not anti-gold - it just makes sense to protect the downside. OK - so gold is going to $600 and I just lost my put premium. The risk of the premium is nothing compared to the risk of the price going down. IMHO.

Ooops, the lights are about to come on - what will we see?

Business World Considers High Inflation
Businessmen determine their 1999 targets according to their
estimations of % 60-75 inflation, not the government's estimation
of % 50. Businessmen agree that especially when the election
process starts, this target is difficult to be reached and presume
that the inflation may be % 60-75, US$ TL 320-340 thousand and
DM TL 180-200 thousand by the end of the year.

Sugar Beet Farmers Protest
107 thousand sugar beet farmers in Amasya, orum and Samsun decided not to harvest their crop since Amasya Sugar factory has not made the promised advance payments. Price increase of sugar beet is %50 this year and farmers who are not happy with it, revolted to the delay in payments.
107 370 farmers, members of Sugar Beet Farmers Cooperative, decided not to harvest sugar beet when Amasya Sugar Factory did not give punctually their advances of TL 2 trillion. President of the cooperative Mahmut Demir said that the total product harvested in Amasya, orum and Samsun was 1 million ton, which was equal to TL 18 trillion. Demir added that they were not guaranteed that their money would be paid and their contract with the factory was cancelled automatically due to delay in advance payments.
http://www.dunya.com/latest.html

The Senate Hearings url should be:
http://www.senate.gov/~banking/hearings.htm
[There was a period hiding behind htmSorry]

XAU just hit 58.25 and is not looking good.
Gollum have you started the new XAU aeroline?
GW

before every test RTFQ = read the fuc*ing question. My request to you is RTFS = read the fuc*ing statement.

You quoted me as stating that "THE worst attrocities were committed in the name of religion".

I actually stated that "MANY of the worst attrocities were committed in the name of religion".

Would you settle for--SOME of the worst atrocities?

I should have realized that Religion is such a touchy subject & although my comments were just meant for Alderbich, I will stay away from it in the future.

to all-time low of 5836, off 125, lowest since 1983 ( starting point ) . Hold on to your hats - this ride could be rough.

Perhaps like the stock market and the dollar - how long can this last?
Droughts take their toll, yet we hear of bumper crops.
As livestock producers sell off their stock it will depress meat prices and depress grain demand - which will further depress grain prices.
But grain demand eventually should increase as ever growing numbers of people hoard more food for Y2K & the biblical apocalypse {don't discount them just because we don't agree with their reasons - they are still buying and stocking for years to come}
AT SOME POINT {just like the PMs}
Demand should outstrip supply. But, for now, Walton Feed is saying:
"No food storage item is even close to being unavailable because demand has outstripped supply. For the near term, there just isn't going to be a food shortage here in the United States because of underproduction. Of course, it's really hard to say how Y2K will affect this when it actually hits."
http://www.waltonfeed.com/portela1.html#running

Cherokee - I know you went out on a limb. This year - I just don't know.
Next year the dam has to break. But Goldbugs have been saying that about PMs for months or years now. But unlike PMs, other metals and most other commodities for which demand will shrink during a depression - PEOPLE HAVE TO EAT! The system can supply more food as people eat less meat and more grain - but again if we toss in droughts and hoarding...

( COMTEX ) A: Leading Russian bank loses license
A: Leading Russian bank loses license

MOSCOW, Aug. 26 ( UPI S ) _ The Russian Central Bank ( Wednesday ) has
withdrawn the banking license of Bank Imperial, a move likely to lead
to the bank's collapse. Imperial, one of Russia's largest banks, has
been accused of falsifying its accounts.

*** end of story ***

Sorry, no flights scheduled til next ides plus half a score,
Zelem will pilot, and we'll see the cat some more.

Love will win out my very dear friend...uh huh...

New York-Aug. 26-FWN--MARKET WATCHERS HAVE LISTED A couple of factors that have
prompted gold and silver futures here to give up their short-covering gains from earlier today.

One trader cited the weakness in the Australian dollar, which has fallen to its lowest level ever against
the U.S. currency--listed on one price screen as 56.49 U.S. cents.

Another pointed to continuing softness in the Commodity Research Bureau Index, seen as a
deflationary sign. He added that technical traders in the silver have resumed their downward push.

Crown and Milleneum were reported sellers of the gold futures during the downward move, a floor
source said.

trust you are not giving there spin any credit its BS

I just wanted to share a site I found when I was trying to figure
out how to stop people from calling me with telemarketing calls.

http://www.junkbusters.com/

The site ( intelligently ) deals with all kinds of privacy issues and
seems to be run in a completely non-profit way. I found the discussions
of internet privacy to be very illuminating ( and a little disturbing ) .

They have a few tests which allow you to access their site and they then
print out all of the information they were able to glean from your
request ( such as, perhaps your name? ) . They also list sites which are
now selling the personal information being gathered about internet users.

They also have a page which allows you to request that telemarketers
stop calling you and also to request that junk-mailers stop sending you
stuff ( customizable and completely free ) .

Sorry, the only link to gold investing here is the aspect of keeping
your financial details secret ( Check out the anonymizer pages to
learn more about anonymous web surfing and filling out forms )

I thought it was a very interesting read and couldn't think of a better
group of folks to share it with. Enjoy.

I notice Battle Mountain Gold Preferred is paying an 8.69% dividend. Can anyone tell me if this mining company is OK or not OK to buy into?

2% here, 3% there, not-to-pretty soon you're talking real ( ? ) money.

http://quote.yahoo.com/m2?u


I guess the contrarian bet to the flow would
be USD and Treasuries. Not.

One reason why European central banks have been lending all their gold might be the following:
As we all know , the major actors ( hence profit makers ) in the gold repo market are the bullion banks. The most prominent being NM ROTHSCHILD. These banks have close ties to central banks and governments. One day , these bullion banks had an idea.Let's drive the POG to such insane low levels that the entire world of private and institutional investors will have no choice but sell. This was to be a self-reinforcing process with mine and hedge fund short selling.The problem was then to drive the POG lower.The only available supply was in CB's vaults and most would not sell except the weak hands ( Argentina , Netherland , Belgium, Australia , maybe the swiss with a carefully constructed defamation campaign ... ) . The solution was to adapt the REPO system already in use in the bond business . The ties of these bullion banks with CBs and Administrations were strong enough to persuade them to lend their gold. ( eventually , the faithfull would get jobs or incredible rewards as the scheme was to appropriate the whole world wealth or most of it. ) The second step would be to buy the entire stock of gold at sale fire price with paper made from stock profits and gold loan operations. Who cares if the CB never got the gold back as it belongs to the people and the people are there to get slaughtered.
We are witnessing the biggest financial scheme ever engineered and the appropriation of the entire world wealth by a few.
BUY GOLD AND TAKE DELIVERY

I really can't comment.
I just don't know enough about the subject.

Just picked the site up surfing and thought I'd paste it here.
I find it interesting to drop articles in here so they can be commented on.

T'is a learning curve for us all.
Gleaning the truth between the waves.

The site seems like many - to offer advice for a price.
So many out there - it's hard to read between the lines.

They obviously are out of touch on the numismatics.
After reading of that recent collection that went up for sale.

Could you perhaps poke some holes in his comments?
So I can learn some more.

Thanks
bbl

commodities that are always rationed during war....like in WWII...sugar,
is one of the first, it is essential to so many things......^s^

I bought all my gold under $300 an oz. and every oz. is protected with Dec 99 290 puts! I am glad to hear others at Kitco have limited their downside risk. I will post my system once again for the Newbees in about an hour.

The planes nose is becoming VERY heavy. Please remember to find a very deep valley ahead so that you have a chance to pullup out of this forthcoming DIVE.

You could start off by citing the statute that protects numasmatic gold from confiscation ( pre 1933 ) over currently issued Eagles. All gold
dealers I have dealt with except one has tried to push this collectable
gold on me using the "can't confiscate" song and dance. I have never bought the story then and now. The dealers make alot more money on the collectables than they do on bullion. Sharefin's post did include statutes. Please show us!

Regards, O.L.

You have been posting the necessity of puts to protect physical for months! The only problem with 12/99 280 puts is that the premium increases somewhat for the time factor. But these are not anti-gold, they are pro-physical. It's just that the market is

NASB. With the puts, we can watch this together, yes?

http://quote.yahoo.com/m5?a=1&s=XAU&t=USD

With the Xau convincingly declining below the 200 level , financial chaos world wide and business slowing down, it should become apparent to you that we are going into a depression in North America.

Somewhere in the world derivitives are unwinding and hedge funds are scrambling to avoid creating the dominoe effect! When word gets out about the exposure worldwide the fiat currency will have taken its last breath........ God bless the average hard working people of the world...

You did well pulling it out of that 50 point "downdraft" ! would you consider assisting in pulling the XAU out of the freefall that is happening today ?

no private property.....none.....that the gov't can't and will not take
under Marshall law....and the decision...of what is to be taken, and when it is to be taken, is left to the discretion of the lowliest gov't grunt...and that even includes your body for their labors....should they
be so inspired, to need clean dishes and someone to fix 'em a nice hot meal..^s^

and SDRer....sugar farmers didn't fall for pie in sky...but I bet sugar gets harvested bye and bye....^s^

Gary Shilling basically compares this current deflation to the one following the Civil War from 1869 to 1898 where a deflation of wholesale prices dropped by 50%. Why did'nt he compare the deflation of wholesale prices from 1969 to 1998 to the above? An exact 100 year cycle.

Excerpt from WSJ, pg A22 Wens Aug 26,98 of above; last paragraph:

"As the effects of the Asian crises become more vivid, the fear of the bad deflation of the 1930s will grow. Fortunately, the good deflation of excess supply is more likely."

How do you like them apples? There is a good deflation? Am I missing something?

Your post re. intelligence agencies as to which is the superior, the Mossad without a doubt. They all work hand in hand probably under the direction of the Mossad.

I've got a headache BBL

Where is our lovely and talented flight attendant Golden CheeseNoodle?
The DOW is down, and I have yet to see anyone scream about it today.

Missin' those CAPS.

MG ( Go Gold! )

got gold?

got gold?

Moneychanger site has no misinformation I know of.

If one believes as I do:
That the Central Banks are controled by their nations bankers and other monied elite, then the probability exists that such interests are the ones who promoted gold loans and later will take possession of a goodly portion of nations gold hoard at fire sale prices.

The well connected banks who lend this gold for sale by the speculators and mining companies, know that by legal contract this gold must come back, by law, while at the same time the existance of this gold depresses the gold markets, the low price gives those entities the opportunity to buy it back using their own agents, who will return this metal to the controling bankers.

Additionally mining companies, effected by the low gold price will be obligated to give up their properties; if they cannot perform their obligations.

So its my feeling that the monied elite are raping their nations gold stock at the expense of their people.

If I am right, then what I have alluded to above is a serious miscarriage perpetrated upon the people of these nations

imminent war, the Euro's birth, gold being cut loose from it's noose, Y2K, etc, etc, one should take into account who stands to gain, because about the ONLY thing they don't ( try to ) control is what happens OFF this planet.

Clinton is but a puppet. The ones standing behind him are the ones to

watch out for. IMO, of course.

After Bonnie and Danielle... Yep, you guessed it. This has got to be good for Gold. http://ww2010.atmos.uiuc.edu/ ( Gh ) /guides/mtr/hurr/names.rxml

Testing Aragorn.

###

Do you ever wonder who is on the other side of these transactions?

If you owned shares in many of the Central Banks around the world and you knew that there was going to be currency destruction, wouldn't you try sneak the gold out of the Central Banks and into your private vaults before the masses would start demanding that you sell the Central banks' Gold reserves to the general public, all in a futile attempt to restore calm.

Got yer message a few days ago. I am on Webtv
and can't cut and paste the URLs. Gotta type 'em out. Speaking of URLs, my 14:22 URL got screwed up! Will try once more-- http://ww2010.atmos.uiuc.edu/ ( Gh ) /guides/mtr/hurr/names.rxml

The Drudge Report has a story about Monica's $11,000 credit card bill was paid-off by "someone". She is so stupid. Why didn't she just take 36 Maple Leafs?

http://www.drudgereport.com

...I might just head down under to buy Sharefin's house. I'll live on Gator meat and Sugar Cane.

What's the Reserve, Sharefin?

Aug. 28,1933 issued EO # 6260..."An act to provide relief in the existing national emergency in banking and for other purposes"
Henry Morgenthau Acting sec. of the treasury, do hereby require every person subject to the jurisdiction of the US forwith to pay and deliver to the Treasury of the US all gold coin,gold bullion and gold certificates situated in the US,owned by such person,except as follows:



Section B ) Of this order states B ) GOLD COIN HAVING A RECOGNIZED SPECIAL VALUE TO COLLECTORS OR RARE AND UNUSUAL COIN ( but not including quarter eagles,otherwise known as $2.50 pieces ) ....



I would like to point out again as I have done many times the reason to buy numismatics has nothing to do with confiscation.....no question many dealers use this to sell high priced numismatics.....there are some of us who sell numis for fair market value for instance I sell MS 61 Libs/Saints for $495.00 I will pay $475.00 as for bullion US Eagles I sell for $309.00 I pay $295.00 ......why do I push numis....this time last year I was selling MS 61's for $429.00 US Eagles were selling for $325.00

Aug. 28,1933 issued EO # 6260..."An act to provide relief in the existing national emergency in banking and for other purposes"
Henry Morgenthau Acting sec. of the treasury, do hereby require every person subject to the jurisdiction of the US forwith to pay and deliver to the Treasury of the US all gold coin,gold bullion and gold certificates situated in the US,owned by such person,except as follows:



Section B ) Of this order states B ) GOLD COIN HAVING A RECOGNIZED SPECIAL VALUE TO COLLECTORS OR RARE AND UNUSUAL COIN ( but not including quarter eagles,otherwise known as $2.50 pieces ) ....



I would like to point out again as I have done many times the reason to buy numismatics has nothing to do with confiscation.....no question many dealers use this to sell high priced numismatics.....there are some of us who sell numis for fair market value for instance I sell MS 61 Libs/Saints for $495.00 I will pay $475.00 as for bullion US Eagles I sell for $309.00 I pay $295.00 ......why do I push numis....this time last year I was selling MS 61's for $429.00 US Eagles were selling for $325.00

Aug. 28,1933 issued EO # 6260..."An act to provide relief in the existing national emergency in banking and for other purposes"
Henry Morgenthau Acting sec. of the treasury, do hereby require every person subject to the jurisdiction of the US forwith to pay and deliver to the Treasury of the US all gold coin,gold bullion and gold certificates situated in the US,owned by such person,except as follows:



Section B ) Of this order states B ) GOLD COIN HAVING A RECOGNIZED SPECIAL VALUE TO COLLECTORS OR RARE AND UNUSUAL COIN ( but not including quarter eagles,otherwise known as $2.50 pieces ) ....



I would like to point out again as I have done many times the reason to buy numismatics has nothing to do with confiscation.....no question many dealers use this to sell high priced numismatics.....there are some of us who sell numis for fair market value for instance I sell MS 61 Libs/Saints for $495.00 I will pay $475.00 as for bullion US Eagles I sell for $309.00 I pay $295.00 ......why do I push numis....this time last year I was selling MS 61's for $429.00 US Eagles were selling for $325.00

.

The Drudge Report has a story about Monica's $11,000 credit card bill was paid-off by "someone". She is so stupid. Why didn't she just take 36 Maple Leafs?

http://www.drudgereport.com

If it breaks below 280 the support is not there until 250-260...capitulation?

It might be wise to try and contact that plane. You know, valleys
don't stretch out that long of a distance. This ole plane will have
to pull up soon or it'll be breaking into little dow pieces...

Seems to me one of gold's problems is that Comex closes too early. this morning the 100+ drop in the Dow had gold spiking up. Stocks recovered, gold tanked. Gold closed, stocks tanked...gold watches. Kitcoites are left hoping that the selling won't exhaust itself before tomorrow.

I am sure there are countless numbers of Lurkers ( like myself ) out there wanting to get involved in buying gold but are concerned about the horrific bear market we have witnessed over the last 3 years. The most pressing question is wheres the bottom? Because no one can guarantee me how low can we go I like to cover my bets. Because of the absence of detailed investment opinions with limited risk on the purchase of Bullion coins I offer you following information at your own risk.
IMVHO - If you have at least $31,000. to invest in gold bullion.
Buy 100 Austrain Philharmonic 999.9% pure 1 oz. gold coins and a COMEX Put option ( 100 oz. ) to cover your ASSets. One Put option will pay you $100. for every $1. gold goes below the strike price plus any built in premium.
1 ) You will need to open a account with a discount futures broker for $2,500 to $5,000. This can be done over your fax and the money can be wired from your bank in one day. Then you will need to send them the original forms overnight ( They Pay ) .
2 ) You will need to purchase coins from a reputable dealer because they will hold your funds for up to three weeks before sending your coins to you. ( RJ at Monex ) 800-949-4653 #2262
Example at yesterday's spot prices ( 282.75 ) :
A. Buy 100 Philharmonic coins ( 4.7%over spot ) for $29,604. or $296.04 per oz.
B. Buy one December 1999 280 put ( 100 oz. contract ) for $810. . Quotes at : ( http://www.iepstein.com/frquotes.html. )

Total cost per coin with Put option is $304.14 each. If Gold drops below $280 per oz. you can sell your coins for 3.3% over spot to: ( http://www.scpm.com/ ) and your downside risk is LESS THAN 4%. Gold has to be higher than $304.14 to make money but you have until the second week of November 1999 until the Put option expires!

The best Bullion Coin: The Austrian Philharmoiker one oz. 999.9% pure Gold coins have the highest monetary face value of any Gold bullion coin ( 2000 Shilling or $160.00 U.S. ) and are the biggest seller in the world. AND as a added bonus, if the Gold price were to collapse the coins could be redeemed for their face value.BUY REAL GOLD!!!
DON'T WORRY, BE HAPPY!

In such a situation it would be best for effected countries to remove those controlling the CB's and the nations themselves taking over the handling of their nations money.

It might be best for such countries to issue gold and silver certificates, denominated in ounces, but with a minimum attached currency value, so that their citizens might take advantage of a rising price if applicable.

Such certificates would also act as voting mechanizism which would become obvious when their citizens request the real thing.

Also to prevent foreigners from exporting such gold, their laws will allow only their own citizens to possess the certificates. Any deviation from the law would be a punishable act.

Gollum to rookie, Gollum to rookie, over. Gollum to rookie, please respond. It's getting close to time to prepare for landing. Let's start bringing that bird in.

In such a situation it would be best for effected countries to remove those entities controlling their CB and the nation taking over the handling of their gold and paper currency.

It might be best for such countries to issue gold and silver certificates, denominated in ounces, but with a minimum attached currency value, so that their citizens might take advantage of a rising price if applicable.

Such certificates would also act as voting mechanizism which would become obvious when their citizens request the real thing.

Also to prevent foreigners from exporting such gold, their laws should allow foronly their own citizens to possess the certificates. Any deviation from the law would be a punishable act.

.

Agreed that most numi's do not track the price of gold. You stated that
most of the stuff on sharefin's link was B.S. I simply want you to show
me why you say it is. Executative orders are not laws or statutes.

My sister got suckered by a BIG DEALER in New Orleans to the tune of
150k. Their line was "they can't take it from you like the they can take
bullion". "You will make lots of money on these rare coins". If she sells
today she would loose around 50k! She now only buys bullion and not from those guys!

I think sharefin's link was right on!
If the poop hits the rotary oscillator, numi's will be worth melt IMHO.

Regards, O.L.

A little misunderstanding seems to remain ( judging from my take on your comment: "Aragorn III -- I still challenge you to show me that COMEX gold trading is essentially the same as LBMA gold trading -- I suspect that the big guys prefer the LBMA -- if for nothing else, the privacy. Last I heard, '2000 or tonnes/day' traded at LBMA - which probably is based on face gold value of all trades, derivatives included. And what would be the face gold value of all trades on COMEX? I'll bet it is dwindling with
the gold reserves. I would certainly like to be wrong about this." )

You see, in my post I tried to show you that "COMEX gold trading" is essentially *NOT* the same as "LBMA gold trading." Please read it more carefully...I have pasted it here with a few adjustments in an attempt to make it crystal clear.

I offer this for your consideration:
These two, the LBMA and the Comex are fundamentally DIFFERENT
operations. It is comparing apples to oranges, to use a popular
metaphor.

The gold "trading" that takes place on the COMEX is fundamentally the same as speculating in the currency markets or any other market. And remember, that what is considered "speculation" to one man is "hedging" to another--a fundamental business activity for producers and users of ANY prominant commodity. Although the context for speculating and hedging are different, the PROCESS is the same. It is THIS pursuit that keeps
them busy at the COMEX--dealing with speculators and hedgers.

COMEX is the meeting place for both sides of the "bet" on the commodity price of gold. USUALLY the bets are settled with CASH, but sometimes with metal. The metal NEED NOT BE PRESENT for the "bookie" to take the bet...agreed? The losing side of the two-sided bet will ultimately provide the settlement. The gold need not ever pass the doors of the COMEX--either inbound or outbound.

In fact, one might reasonably wonder why COMEX would maintain any level of eligible gold inventory at all. The REGISTERED stuff belongs to someone else paying a fee for storage. That is a different business arrangement. I can only suggest that the ELIGIBLE gold is obtained as a broker for COMEX is instructed to take the purchase side of a "bet" against a seller when the price offered "is a steal," and the outcome of the bet is then settled with metal rather than cash. COMEX could then expect to participate on the seller side when prices are favorable to do so.

Those looking to PURCHASE gold DO NOT usually "go shopping" at the COMEX
warehouses. Those looking to "lock in prices" DO meet at COMEX. Brokering these "bets" is their principle operation...no gold required.

Have you noticed a large increase in the Registered gold inventory over the past 6 months? It is stored there for a fee. It would seems that some new owners without storage capability have taken a long position during this time. Agreed? Perhaps this gold was purchased through the likes of the LBMA...a fine place to meet all of your gold market needs whether they be derivitive in nature or outright TRANSFER of gold ownership ( their specialty!! ) Perhaps think of the LBMA as a vast global version of e-gold. If you understand the operating principle of e-gold, you grasp the crux of LBMA.

I hope this helps you recognize the distinction between COMEX and LBMA operations.

DA: Some months ago you argued that with rapid money growth it would be a mistake to short anything except bonds. Well bonds have been one of the few areas where the longs have done well this year.

Welcome to the ranks of those who have made bad calls ( and that includes me ) .

This personal 'Thank You' -is long overdue- but none the less warm and honest.
For many month now I am looking up the URL's you so freely post here.
The markets are not inspiring today, so; I spend several hours following your links,m oreover, just moments ago were guided back here by one of those harmless 'Gold-Links'.
We sure have a perfect exploration tool with this Internet.
The nature of the beast, although very addictive, has but little power to convince or convict.
However, it has the ability to form and build friendships. You are a real friend!
Of course I do appreciate all the posters and say 'THANK YOU TO ALL'
What would the lurkers do without you?
Servhard.

...and do not belong to the public. Actually money is far too important and should be a form of barter. Gold, Silver, and Copper have intrinsic value and can be traded as a unit of account. There could also be redeemable notes like you said for these metals or even agricultural products such as tobacco, wheat, etc.

The main evil to any currency is that of usury. Whether it is gold or fiat, Usury creates booms and busts and end the end the usurer ( Central Banks & their owners ) wind up owning the near totality of the wealth.

That is why Usury is illegal according to Christian principles, because of the damage, war, famine, and injustice it causes. One of the most prosperous periods in Europe were the periods when usury was not practised. It is amazing how quickly someone like the Rothschild clan can move into a country and in a very short time end up controlling most of that country's wealth.

Usury is the loaning of money for interest, plain and simple. Be it 2% or 200%, it is usury, it is a debt trap, it is a scam, and it is against God's law.

But remember, that A**strong has to make his follower's money, so lying through his teeth is acceptable to the following and those who want PM's on the cheap.

Sorry to hear about your sister however there are just as many horror storys on Wall Street if not more,


As for Moneychangers his first 6 points are in fact BS

1 ) I have already blown that one away

2 ) Any purchase that excedes $10,000.00 in a calender year of bullion that is paid for in either cash,Bank Chq,or money order is reportable

3 ) See EO 6260

4 ) first very few coins were minted in 1933 and if you do have one it is still subject to confiscation because they never went into circulation and therefore were stolin from the mint

5 ) where he sucked that from I have no idea same goes for # 6

It would be interesting how much this guy charges for his bullion products he is opposite to numis guys but does not have the guts to post his prices just a 800 # so you can turn in your numis for bullion ....me thinks he will pay far below market value on numis to sell you bullion

Our precious gold drops to $190 ( Armstrong @PIE ) before November 1999. You sell your gold for $190 + 3.3% ( $196.27 oz ) Multiplied by 100 coins = $19,627 and sell the Put for $280 - $190 ( $90. ) multiplied by 100 = $9,000. $19,627 + $9,000 = $28,627 return. Original investment of $30,414 - $28,627 = $1,787 loss or -6%.

How about $50.00 GOLD:

Sell the gold for 2000 shilling face value ( $160.00 oz ) Multiplied by 100 coins = $ 16,000 and sell the Put for $280 - $50 ( $230. ) multiplied by 100 = $23,000. $16,000 + $23,000 = $39,000 return. Original investment of $30,414 - $39,000 = $8,586 PROFIT or +28%.

Nice to have an acknowledgement of my jest...even at the expense of so much bandwidth. But not knowing exactly what bandwidth is, I hereby salute you and

the moon ( hi )
hi

and suggest that the testing is complete for now.

got smiles?

statistics based on the percentage of transactions in derivative and physical gold.

Gianni, thanks for your many clear and instructive posts.

I hope he will get what he deserves for misleading the gullible crowd about stocks.The PPT just fired its last round on CNBC

The dow has rallied sharply without the Adv/Dec line doing much at all. Whenever Tokyo closes below 15,000 it seems that there is damage control, first in NY then later on in Tokyo to get that damn Nikkei back above 15,000. The hurricane Bonnie is getting little attention over here in the Island that is Green. How 'bout in N America?

On another line, Gold coins often have a nominal value like $50 on them. I understand that if you wanted to you could take it into a store and buy a bag of groceries with it. It may be worth $400 but the storekeeper only has to take it for $50. Therefore if deflation were to kick in without currency destruction, they would want to have a low face value.

I sometimes wonder about recall ( glorified confiscation ) . I forget who it is who has his Maple Leafs stored in Canada. I think it's a good idea to have your monies outside of the country of which you are a national or resident, but I wonder if having Gold Canadian Currency ( ML's ) in Canadian Borders is the best. I suppose if they want it they's a gonna take it.

Another comment on possible impeachment by Klinton. It ain't gonna happen. Mozel pointed out that if Klinton were impeached, then it would throw into doubt every law that he has signed into action.

Resignation - likely, Impeachment - very doubtful.

Aragorn III: Thanks for responding. I apologize for being a little strong on my prior post, but the bearishness of gold equities has been a bit stressful. Better half is getting tired of my gold/silver - related losses. Silver better start moving soon, as I am in the doghouse.

I think I understand COMEX better after your post -- COMEX ( unlike LBMA ) does not require gold collateral, cash exchanges will do. However, I still have a serious problem with the LBMA, which I suspect is also doing what COMEX does -- and then some. Now -- certainly some of what the LBMA does is to act as a clearing house for physical gold -- e-gold -- as you put it. Probably some sort of 'scrip' is used for each ounce of gold in the transactions, so that the unweildy gold does not need to be moved around.

My problem is the LBMA is this. They claim that well over 1000 tonnes of gold is traded on the LBMA every day! Well, in two days that would be the entire World's production of gold.

So something is amiss --- the LBMA cannot possibly be exchanging this much e-gold. I'll bet that the LBMA is doing everything that COMEX is doing with gold speculation -- derivatives, gold carries, forwards, whatever. As well as the basic e-gold that the Rothschilds and their ilk might want. And, I doubt all the CB gold sales and gold loans are going through COMEX -- more likely the more anonymous international bullion houses.

Any idea how much gold and gold derivatives COMEX is trading daily? Does it come close to 1000+ tonnes per day ( on paper, at least ) ? Is it increasing or decreasing? There must be a reason why LBMA is boasting about the 1000 tonnes plus of gold traded daily. Perhaps they have an angle with the international speculators COMEX does not have. Perhap this has something to do with why Warren Buffett is trading silver on the european exchanges instead of on COMEX.

A log trendline analysis reveals the following about the current levels of the key indexes that are touching their historical support lines this week and today:

Supporting trendlines:

XAU at 1986 gold plunge bottom - horizontal support line.
CRB at 1986 oil glut bottom - horizontal support line.
POG at 1986 gold plunge bottom - horizontal support line
Real POG at 1971 - just at the disconnection of $$ from gold.
DJTA at 1995 -1998 bull market support trendline. 1997-8 bull trend is over. Reversion to 80s-90s bull trend would require a fall of 1000 pts to 1900.
DXY and $/Yen - $$ is at the 1995-1998 support line and at the 1998 horizontal resistance - forming a rising wedge.
DJIA is at the 1995 -1998 bull market support trendline. Reversion to 80s-90s bull trend would require a fall of 2500 pts to 6000.
NDX is at the Jun -Aug 1998 "technology is immune to economy" support line. Reversion to 95 technology bull market requires a drop of 150 to 1200, while reversion to 90s trend requires a drop of 300 to 1050-1100.
SPX is at the 1995 -1998 bull market support trendline. Reversion to 80s-90s bull trend would require a fall of 500 pts to 600. The 1997-1998 bull surge is over.
DJUA and 30 yr Bond are below the 1997-1998 flight to safety support line indicating that it is over.

Resistance lines:
DXY and $/Yen - $$ is at the 1998 horizontal resistance line.
NDX - at its downward Jul-Aug resistance line. At the point of a rising/declining wedge.

DJUA and 30 yr Bond are at the 1994-1998 resistance line.

Economic indicator turns:
Wage cost index growth rate - from down to up in Jan 1998.
Inflation growth rate - from negative to positive in Jun 1998.
Trade deficit - from dropping to rising.
Consumer debt - new all time highs at 95% of GDP.
US govt. debt growth - trend reversal at Apr 1998.

The economics behind this:

1. The current trend: dollar rise/bond rise/interest rate decline/rising stocks/rising technology investment/rising consumer debt and spending/rising technology and commodity exports/falling commodity prices.
This is part of a favorable self reinforcing spiral that is funded by the willingness of Japan and other trading partners to accept dollars for real product despite US trade deficits and from their willingness to reinvest in the US capital markets.

2. Continuation of the trend requires the following: Continued influx of Japanese and other flight capital to finance US private borrowing. Continued influx of people into the US to take up jobs without raising wages. Continued purchases by the world of US technology, services ( financial ) and entertainment. Continued drop in commodity prices.

3. The trends that must be continued to maintain rising stocks ( rising PE multiple and/or EPS growth ) and dropping inflation require competing imports that would utterly destroy all US manufacturing, this is contradictory and put technology investment out of reach of worldwide corporations. Rising consumption requires the growth of wages and money supply ( by low interest rates ) without inflation ( which raises interest rates ) the gap can only be filled with falling commodity/goods/services prices, this is contradictory ( productivity growth is not strong enough to fill the gaps ) .

4. The contradictory trends and their current intersection indicate that this is the point of reversal - something has got to give. The easiest - lowest resistance paths - are: a. The elimination of earnings followed by b. elimination of capital and technology expenditure, and c. closing of mines and oil fields as well as mass firings in the manufacturing side. d. On the services side, continued inflation and reduced growth as business and consumer consumption are limited by manufacturing margin declines and firings, respectively. e. Service wages continue to rise while former industrial workers sit at home. f. Closed mines and oil fields reduce supply to well below demand and prices start to rise as US import consumption ( in units- if not in $$ ) induce higher demand.

The results: a. Margin squeeze causes EPS collapse and stock market decline. b. Service inflation causes higher interest rates. c. Mass firings cause highly leveraged consumers to default, causing a contraction in the money supply and serious banking problems. d. Trade deficit grows as commodities and goods flood the US, which pressures the dollar. e. Services inflation further pressures dollar. f. Falling dollar raises long term interest rates and reduces money supply as foreign money exits the US. g. Commodity price inflation.

Bottom line: Dollar reversal, stock market bear, wage inflation, higher interest rates and higher gold.

When? When the Russian shoe is completely dropped and the Chinese either devalue or it becomes clear that they are not going to do so ( what I believe ) . When the Swiss stop selling gold for the Russians every Wednesday. When the bucket brigade runs out of money, ( since they are carry traders - when a Japanese intervention occurs ) .

A certificate is not the thing. A Certificate of Title for a motor vehicle is not the title to the motor vehicle. A certificate of title to gold is not title to gold and is not gold. Gold in your lawful possession is yours. Gold in the possession of the people is the people's. Redeemibility is but a promise.

In circumstances where the banks have all the gold, they function essentially as did the Jewish moneylenders of the middle ages. In return for delivery of something tangible or upon execution of a mortgage or other security instrument with something tangible as the collateral, they agree to let you have a sum of money on the condition that sum plus interest will be paid back by a date certain. It does not matter if the borrower is a King, a knight, a farmer, a manufacturer, or an elected government. It is all the same arrangement with the same legal underpinnings. And time and time again in history the one event which invariably creates a demand for gold is war. The legal underpinnings that we live still with today came into being when Kings and Popes wanted knights to go on Crusades and knights needed gold for armor. Now governments need gold or credit for motorized aerial and land armor. And interest is paid not just on loans of gold, but on loans of credit. Perpetual war for perpetual borrowing for greater accumulation of wealth in the hands of moneylenders and creditlenders does not happen by accident. Qui bono ? Who benefits ?

Hello... Does anyone know of a list created recently by any
professional ( for money ) advisor, or by a Kitco citizen, that indicates
names of gold and silver mining companies that will still be alive at
various points of time and price? JD and others have been helpful
with regard to SA golds. I am chiefly looking for a silver co. listing.
It does no good to bottom fish, as I did with Pegasus Gold, if they go
belly up before the market price can save them. I thought I was smart with Pegasus, and then sold out at .05 when I read that shares will be
worthless soon. Loss of 80% to me. My USERX which I have owned for about 15 years, is now down 96%, and that is after adding in all those whopping dividends throughout the years. Yamana warrants were
100% loss. Even SMR, SUR, VGZ, and of course many other metals
stocks are down 90% from where they were recommended by one or
more of Douglas Casey, Bob Bishop and others. I would be willing to
put more $$ into a 10-bagger or 20-bagger situation *if* I had
reasonably high confidence that a given co could weather another
year or two of depressed prices, if need be. Someone posted that SSRIF will run out of money soon. Is this true? Anyone? Lists? Ideas?

Another idea for a $31,000 Gold purchase-- Could buy 95 Mounties with a guaranteed price of US$ 310 until Jan 2000.

Another idea for a $31,000 Gold purchase-- Could buy 95 Mounties with a guaranteed price of US$ 310 until Jan 2000.

COMEX Metal Warehouse Statistics for Aug. 26

-- TOTALS
Gold 912,517 + 0 troy ounces
Silver 78,614,966 - 469,328 troy ounces
Copper 58,273 + 0 short tons

*******************************************************************
I'll show the individual stats for each shortly. Silver is getting
very interesting indeed! More Silver moved from eligible to registered!
Foxman

by Congress becomes law ?

You, not Sanders, are the author of disinformation. I know I will reget doing this, and doubt you will see the light, but if anyone wants your disinformation exposed, let them say so and let's start with number 1 of your 6 and proceed in order.

TOTAL REGISTERED
762,013 0 0 0 19,501 781,514
TOTAL ELIGIBLE
150,504 0 0 0 -19,501 131,003
COMBINED TOTAL
912,517 0 0 0 0 912,517
************************************************************************
The second to last column shows an adjustment of 19,501 oz's of Gold that
was transferred from eligible to registered.
Silver stats coming up...They're better!

Let's not get carried away here. The Quantum funds lost $2 billion in Russia and they also lost another $2 billion last year in October. They are not infallible and often wrong. They do make large bets in different areas and are rewarded but not always. He made some intersting comments regarding sentiment indicators. Mr. DruckenMiller stated that last April bullish sentiment was 80% and put/call ratios were extremely low. He surmised that the market was due for a fall, yet we know that while the transports and Russel peaked then, the Nasdaq and Dow/S&P did not peak till mid-July. Now he says the opposite is true, 19% bullishness and high put/call ratio. Is this an early reading or will this be another losing trade? He is also short Hong Kong which I think will be a big winner. The HKMA has spent $2 billion already in a futile attempt to displace reality.

Today has been denoted as one of these pre-defined points in this system.



23 of the last 25 major stock market turns since 1980 have occurred within 2 days of one of these points.



More info at http://www.supertraderalmanac.com/$TA_ap_points.htm

http://quote.yahoo.com/a8?u

It is my understanding that unless Congress overrules an EO, it becomes effectively a law after 60 days. Something we were not taught in civics 101. Can anyone else refute this?

SILVER
( Quoted in Troy Ounce )
DEPOSITORY
SCOTIA MOCATTA
Prev. Received Net Chg Total
Total Withdrawn Adjust. Today
R 3,544,911 0 0 0 604,658 4,149,569
E 1,380,909 130,859 0 130,859 -604,658 907,110
T 4,925,820 130,859 0 130,859 0 5,056,679

MORGAN GUARANTY
R 15,531,744 0 0 0 0 15,531,744
E 5,542,342 0 0 0 0 5,542,342
T 21,074,086 0 0 0 0 21,074,086

REPUBLIC NATIONAL ( New York )
R 23,499,459 0 0 0 0 23,499,459
E 21,651,670 0 600,187 -600,187 0 21,051,483
T 45,151,129 0 600,187 -600,187 0 44,550,942

REPUBLIC NATIONAL ( Delaware )
R 0 0 0 0 0 0
E 7,933,259 0 0 0 0 7,933,259
T 7,933,259 0 0 0 0 7,933,259

-------------------------------------------------------------
TOTAL REGISTERED
42,576,114 0 0 0 604,658 43,180,772
TOTAL ELIGIBLE
36,508,180 130,859 600,187 -469,328 -604,658 35,434,194
COMBINED TOTAL
79,084,294 130,859 600,187 -469,328 0 78,614,966
-------------------------------------------------------------
Sorry the columns don't line up, but essentially, what we have today
is this. There were 130,859 oz's added to eligibles at one depository.
There were 600,187 oz's removed from the eligibles at another depository.
This boils down to a drawdown of 469,328 oz's from the the combined totals. BUT! There was also an adjustment. There was 604,658 oz's
transferred from eligible to registered at one depository! This means that there are now roughly 1 million oz's LESS in total eligible Silver!

I'm still not completely sure, but if I understand correctly, the amount
of Comex Silver available for actual delivery is the amount that resides
in the total ELIGIBLE stock! This total is still going down! The Silver
that resides in REGISTERED stock is already spoken for, and is being stored there for a fee. Any corrections on this, please post them. TIA
Foxman

90 days it is then placed in the Federal Registra if no one objects during that period stated it becomes LAW,I have done extensive work on EO's see URL below as for Sanders I responded to all 6 points to Open-Loop

http://www.patriottrading.com/executiveorders.html

I would like to anounce that another new pilot has earned their wings here at Gollum airlines. Not a bad flight at all for a rookie. Although she did overcontrol a time or two here and there, she managed to get it back to the field without seriously damageing anything.

Inasmuch as yesterday we came in a bit above target and today a bit below target, we are still on course for our September rally. It will be interesting to see how it all unfolds.

I am sorry to say that I was not able to get the PM levers repaired and I am afraid we may have to wait until Zelem lights up his candle before anything of great significance occurs. I and all the maintenance staff will continue to work through the night however. If we can get things at least jury rigged enough to work a little it will give many of us a chance to lighten up our holdings a little in preperation for going down into Zelem's launch pit.

Again, welcome back rookie, good flight.

I have relatives in Halifax. They drove along the all of the Cabot trail and recommend it for a Nova Scotia 'MUST SEE'.
I will read up on Victor Hugo's daughters. Thanks.

As for your 15:21 and Usury-- just another way of looking at it:
There is one Law for Jews and maybe Christians too, but not for the unbelievers.
Rom.8:7
They are not subject to the Laws of God! But!!!!!!!!
Some of Abraham's children are the super Experts in this field.
As for the markets: No surprise for any of us! Or?

Based on your comments on reporting laws, I know alot of felons.

In the event of a catastrophic banking crisis, do you really think
that if gold is to be seized, that they would leave numi's alone?

I doubt it.

If E.O.'s become law if congress does not kill them, was Roseavelt's
E.O. to grab the gold the law of the land until congress made it legal for us to own gold once again?

And, how did so many double eagles survive the confiscation? Were they
not contraban?

Unless statutes are presented that I can follow up on I will go with whats on the moneychanger site,

Regards, O.L.

...appears to be in a contracting triangle formation. Contracting triangles tend to resume in the direction they were heading before the triangle, which in this case is down.

The next day or 2 may be rangebound 8400-8600. Watch out for a breakout lower.

@Jack, No problem, I'm learning it myself. A couple of years ago, I realized that if a country owned its central bank, then it would have no sovereign debt.

The userer ( the fed, BOE, BOJ, etc ) cons the masses ( thru the media which they own/control ) into believing that the govt by borrowing fiat currency from someone ( the fed ) who just prints up the stuff, is not just printing money. However, it is being printed, but with interest attached ( Usury ) . Lincoln & Kennedy were shot for issuing T-notes that circulated as currency.

As I see it...
The major source of difficulty in the world economic situation is the strength of the dollar. This strength is the result of many economic forces, but it is a fact. The dollar is strong because it is regarded as safe and because it pays more than other currencies.

Therefore, the only solution that the Fed can do is to lower short term rates ( fed funds ) and the discount rate. Long bond rates are under 5.5 and the market is trying to tell them something, but no one is paying attention. IMHO this would have the effect of decreasing demand for dollars by investors and ease all currencies in the world now fighting with the dollar. Naturally, this would upset all holders of US debt, because the dollar would go down somewhat. Since CB's hold most of it, they would not like it; ergo it most likely won't happen.

However, if it is done, it would be a buying time for metals. I would expect the Dow to go up until the effect of a weaker dollar sets it.

Lost $2 Billion? Wasn't he yelling that the IMF should give quickly and give freely to Russia last month? Now he is trying to line up investor confidence in large cap U.S. stocks? Very bearish sign. He obviously wants another shot to get out of the market with a final rally.

Sorry Georgie boy. The bear is here!

XAU closed at lows; Some of the mining stocks not too bad, it is just this interminable erosion that is so bad. Hope RJ is correct in his "bottom".
See: http://quote.yahoo.com/q?s=^XAU&d=1d
and: http://quote.yahoo.com/p?v&k=pf_3

Auric

The Mountie costs $325 per coin and the Phillharmonic with Put option is $304.14. My break even point is $20.86 lower than the Mountie. The downside risk for the Mountie is $325 ( cost ) - $310 ( Guarantee ) = $15 or 4.6%. The Phillharmonic downside risk is $304.14 ( Cost w/ Put option ) - $289.24 ( Selling Price at $280 spot + 3.3% ) = $14.90 or 4.9%. The only real difference is the break even points.
The best time to buy the Mountie is when Spot Gold is around $307 oz. because you can still buy them for $325 per oz. Unfortuninitly the small gold investor has no choice but the Mountie if he wants to protect his ASSests. I would recommend the Mountie for investments under $15,000.

"Date: Wed Aug 26 1998 15:44
mozel ( @Jack ) ID#153110:
Copyright  1998 mozel/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
A certificate is not the thing. A Certificate of Title for a motor vehicle is not the title to the motor vehicle."

Mozel:

Are you OK? Your prose seems to be suffering from more than its usual lack of lucidity. If I may ask; what, then, IS the difference between a "Certificate of Title" and the "Title" of a motor vehicle?

While I have your attention, would you mind also clarifying the following:? "...when Kings and Popes wanted knights to go on Crusades and knights needed gold for armor."

If the "Certificate of Title" is not the "Title", surely the gold is not the armor, either. Did the knights need the gold to buy armor or are you really suggesting that they fashioned their armor from gold? Was that solid gold, or gold plated silver, or what?

Have at it! I gotta get some work done. Thanks O.L.

I drove the Cabot Trail in may of '94. It is very beautiful. As to V. Hugo's daughter, there is the film, "L'histoire d'Adle H" which is set in Halifax.

People have God-given rights, and they cannot be taken away by govt. Govt may oppress, but the rights remain even if they are not respected.

1929-1933 foriegners would not take FRN as payment for goods and service so the US had to pay in Gold Currency ie. $20.00 gold coins.....the bulk of gold now being sold in the US comes from Swiss and other governments vaults....if you want chapter and verse on all legislation pertaining to US Gold go get yourself a copy of COIN-WORLD ALMANAC also available in your local libary it has ever law and EO ever signed....I really do not have the time to type it all however I have put together an extensive list of EO's on my web page

http://www.patriottrading.com/executiveorders.html

Dow is struggling to remain above the 200 day line; today is back below. Either some major event of a bullish nature or perceived as bullish ( Rate reduction? ) must happen rather quickly, or a sudden plunge through the 200 day moving average ( 233, 200, doesn't matter ) is in the offing. September is next week; early September is the beginning of time of "maximum vulnerability" per Peter Eliedes ( sp? ) and others. If down, I suspect further erosion in the gold mining stocks.
Dow: http://quote.yahoo.com/q?s=^DJI&d=3mm
Peter's chart:
http://www.stockmarketcycles.com/images/Prediction-Graph.gif

Comments?

I would like to see an amendment to the Constitution, stating, that upon demand government must redeem PM certificates issued only by the US Treasury.

Such an amendment will take the politics of power out of Congress and allow for Statesmen to control that body and people to vote their desires immediately when they cash these certificates in.

I have no problem with paper certificates for PM's along the treasury issuing other paper money without usery attached and according to needs seen by competent treasury officials working in each of the former Federal Reserve Distric and being subject to treason if they abuse the money of the US.

While this is asking for alot, I think that it will be much better than the present system.

The downward trend for the POG and particularly gold equities is not only intact but gaining strength. There is no apparent rationale to support that a very sudden reversal of this trend will occur.

Worse is the possibility that the downtrend will accelerate if the ~$278 POG is breached ( ~$4.95 for silver ) . Defensive measures are in order if only for one reason - to avoid the disgust phase of a bear market. It is popularly thought that the final phase of a bear market is some level of panic accompanied by capitulation. This is true for the market but not for the investor.

The final killing phase for the investor is capitulating in disgust. A great sense of aversion to re-entering the market accompanies this. This is the final blow - an inability to reverse to a bullish position when called for.

To avoid this, follow J.P. Morgan's advise to the question "when is the right time to sell?" His response was "I sell to the sleeping point."

thing is that a large portion of the 2 bil he lost in russia probably came from their ill gotten gains in SEAsia which caused the further impoverishment of millions of people. Even worse is the fact that most of the 2 bil ended up in the hands of the mafia who are now ensconced on the Cote Azur in their multi-million $ villas.

Kind of a reverse Robin Hood--would'nt you say?

any information on the London Stocks, the Swiss stocks, the German stocks, the Luxemberg stocks, the Russian stocks, the Arab stocks.

My conclusion is that they all must be substantial or the shorts at COMEX are plain ass stupid. They must figure the silver is somewhere . . .they probably know it is. What are we talking about 6,000 contract of eligible silver, what are we talking about $150 million of eligible reserves. Nobody seems interested in the challenge? WHY?.

Come IN SAM A give us the lease rate speech. Just copy it in from yesterday.

"Compelling evidence" ( word of the day ) on the charts says as of yet nobody cares what the eligible stocks are in NY. What are the eligible stocks of Platinum and Palladium in NY - ZERO???

I'm frustrated by this semming trashing of the obvious fundlemental. I have to believe that it not so obvious and that off shore stocks of silver are substantial.

While driving to lunch today the Drudge Report was being alluded to by Rush Limbaugh and the unfair treatment which his cigar received at the hands of Monica. Its fair to say main stream media will be handling the issue discretely within a couple of days. WJC better just stay on vacation, keep Hillary away from the TV set and radio and hang out with Walter Cronkite.

My one short up, everything else down. Off to the golf course to vent my frustration on the little white ball.

MTN Bear: Just how much do interest rates have to go down to stimulate the markets? Good question -- I wonder if AG would lower rates now, or wait for the US dollar to weaken all by itself. I think he is playing with fire if he does not lower rates fairly soon, as the US market/economy balancing act is getting dicier and dicier. The US dollar is not going to come down all by itself, but we don't want it to come down to quickly, either.

I wonder -- didn't we have a commodity price collapse in the 20's, some years before the 1929 crash? Around 1925? Perhaps it is time to review that scenario again to get some insight into gold, and the markets. Certainly the US economy and markets were stimulated by dropping prices then also. Don't recall exactly what happened to the markets -- did they go down, and then skyrocket to oblivion? At that time, however, we did not have presidential problems such as the current ones.

http://www.singapore.com/companies/sgmint/liongold.htm

Coming soon to countries near you. Sign up! Don't let Flaccid fiats
curtail a healthy, robust economic life.

Aurizon Closes $7 Million Convertible Debenture
Financing, Awarded $2 million Government Assistance and
negotiates a $1 million Private Placement.
Looks like they'll be going into Casa Beradi next month.
They believe the weak canadain dollar will increase CF
by about $150,000 per month. Also Yahoo is slipping on
its news releases of canadian compsanies. This from CanadaNewsWire 8/25
http://www.newswire.ca/August1998/25/c4811.html

http://www.newswire.ca/releases/August1998/c4811.html

http://www.newswire.ca/releases/August1998/25/c4811.html

I don't understand why these low Comex levels aren't causing lease
rates to rise. Maybe it's true about vast amounts of Silver at LBMA
or some other Exchange. But it seems to me that these traders that
are shorting Silver, are in the same position as us. They just don't
know for sure how much Silver is available to the open market. Do they
have inside information that people like D.A. ( or some other professional
traders on this site ) can't get?

I guess I'm stubborn, but I'm still going to play this Silver market awhile longer. I'm going to continue watching Comex Totals ( for what it's
worth ) and keep my fingers crossed that we won't go much lower. When we
see a continued drawdown in stocks plus rising lease rates, then maybe
these PM's will turn around. ( probably in the blink of an eye )
Thanks, Foxman

EOs do become law if not challenged. And certainly #6260 has been on the books for a long time....FWIW.......

from Bloomberg:
U.S. banks, including BankAmerica Corp., Chase Manhattan Corp. and Citicorp, were owed about $6.8 billion in loans, derivatives, foreign exchange and other securities by Russian companies and the government as of March 31, according to a division of the Federal Reserve.

Chase, the largest bank in the U.S., had $500 million in Russia exposure, a spokesman said. BankAmerica had $412 million, according to a recent Securities and Exchange Commission filing. Bankers Trust had about $1 billion, including $500 million from business with major U.S. hedge funds, according to David Berry,an analyst at Keefe, Bruyette & Woods.

I travel around a little and what happens? All sorts of interesting news, and I can't get to the internet! Wish I could have been here lurking more often, especially to see what Donald has dug up. Sorry to say, his analysis of markets and currencies is indeed holding up all these months. Sometimes you just hate to be right.

Well, just my greetings to you all and best wishes. Don't forget to do something to prepare for Y2K today! A little a day, like getting ready the kids' college funds. The only way to go. Sorry, often away from my machine lately. Hope to normalize soon.

Notes for today, would be headlines except so much other news.

My goodness. Saw a Donald report recently that Mexico's interest rates soared 20%. The Americas are the next hot spot. Currencies sliding, insurgencies cropping up in every country. Shouldn't this be headine news?

Latin and South American Bourses in severe bear market, threatening to freefall. Compared to their 52 week highs:

Brazil is down 48%; Chile down 38%, Mexico down 40%, Peru down 63%; Venequela down 70%.

These numbers are from Yahoo, and my understanding is that these are quoted in the local currency, without regard to any foreign exchange. So if you are in these markets but not in these countries, these losses are compounded by currency losses.

In the US, today's new 52 week lows were 581; new highs only 33. The BEAR Market is very much alive and actually expanding its base since my last post, a couple of weeks back.

Hang onto your hats, guys.

Namast

There has been some confusion about the historical
classification of pre-1934 gold coins ( as defined
by the Gold Reserve Act of 1933 as being "gold
coins of recognizable numismatic value", which
were an exception to the requirements for
confiscation ) .

I happen to have a copy of the 1969 Treasury
revisions which concern the distinction of pre-
and post-1934 gold coins in this regard. The
Treasury regulation is as follows, as recorded in
the Federal Register:

Rules and Regulations
Title 31-Money and Finance: Treasury
Chapter I - Monetry Offices, Department of the
Treasury
Part 54 - Gold Regulations
Imports of Gold Coin

Section 54.20 of the Gold Regulations is being
amended to permit the importation without a
license of gold coins made during 1934 or later.
Licenses for importation may be issued for coins
minted before 1960 which can be established to the
satisfaction of the Director, Office of Domestic
Gold and Silver Operations, to be of recognized
special value to collectors of rare and unusual
coin and to have been originally issued to
circulate as coinage within the country of issue.
Licenses for importation may be issued for gold
coins made during or subsequent to 1960 only in
cases where the particular coin was licensed for
importation prior to April 30, 1969. Because the
amendments relieve an existing restriction and in
the case of coins made after 1933 make no change
in present Regulations and licensing policies, it
is found that notice and public procedure thereon
are unnecessary.

#54.20 Rare Coins

( a ) Gold coin of recognized special value to
collectors of rare and unusual coin may be
acquired, held, and transported with the United
States without the necessity of holding a license
therefor. Such coin may be imported, however,
only as permitted by this section or # 54.28 to
54.30, 54.34, or provisions of 54.25.

( b ) Gold coin made prior to 1934 is considered to
be of recognized special value to collectors of
rare and unusual coins.

( c ) Gold coin made during or subsequent to 1934
is presumed not to be of recognized special value
to collectors of rare and unusual coin.

( d ) Gold coin made prior to 1934, may be imported
without the necessity of obtaining a license
therefor.

( e ) Gold coin made during or subsequent to 1934
may be imported only pursuant to a specific or
general license issued by the Director, Office of
Domestic Gold and Silver Operations. Licenses
under this paragraph may be issued only for gold
coin made prior to 1960, which can be established
to the satisfaction of the Director to be of
recognized special value to collectors of rare and
unusual coin and to have been originally issued
for circulation within the country of issue.
Licenses may be issued for gold coin made during
or subsequent to 1960 in cases where the
particular coin was licensed for importation prior
to April 30, 1969. Appliciation for a specific
license under this paragraph shall be executed on
Form TG-31 and filed in duplicate with the
Director.

Federal Register Doc 69-4994 Filed April 25, 1969

Tell her your PM losses are the tuition for an education that would not otherwise be attained without this vested interest of yours. What you've no-doubt learned over the past few years will serve you well for the rest of your days...may they be many, indeed!

We are getting there, my friend! Let's walk through some of your latest post. Yours will be indicated like this...[JTF text inside brackets].

[certainly some of what the LBMA does is to act as a clearing house for
physical gold -- e-gold -- as you put it. Probably some sort of 'scrip'
is used for each ounce of gold in the transactions, so that the unweildy
gold does not need to be moved around.]

That's it, you got it! Transfer of ownership without alteration of metal geography.

[My problem is the LBMA is this. They claim that well over 1000 tonnes of
gold is traded on the LBMA every day! Well, in two days that would be
the entire World's production of gold.
So something is amiss --- the LBMA cannot possibly be exchanging this
much e-gold.]

Sure they can, JTF! When I mentioned e-gold, I wanted you to think in terms of monetary gold. The same gold may change ownership many times in the balance of trade or other transactions. It's all about mass and ...key word...VELOCITY.

[I'll bet that the LBMA is doing everything that COMEX is doing with gold speculation -- derivatives, gold carries, forwards, whatever. As well as the basic e-gold] ( monetary use! ) [that the Rothschilds and their ilk might want. And, I doubt all the CB gold sales and gold loans are going through COMEX -- more likely the more anonymous international bullion houses.]

I think it would be very near to the mark to say that precisely NONE of the CB gold operations ( sales, purchases, and lending ) are facilitated
through COMEX..."COMEY don't play that game." ( sorry for the bad jest )

[Any idea how much gold and gold derivatives COMEX is trading daily? Does
it come close to 1000+ tonnes per day ( on paper, at least ) ? Is it
increasing or decreasing?]

Surely one of our reliable posters could boil the numbers down for either total outstanding Futures Contracts, or daily business in new Futures Contracts. Because Options come and go, often expiring worthless, they are a different kind of beast and I'm not sure they factor into the numbers you are tracking down. I simply have a difficult time seeing where COMEX figures shed ANY light on the global gold market. COMEX is an easy nut to crack. What you see is what you get. Wanna lock in a gold price either for buy or sell? Phone COMEX. Wanna gamble on the future price of gold for speculative cash profits? Phone COMEX. End of story.

Wanna trade metal immediately at spot price, or negotiate the best immediate deal? Hmmmmmmmmmm....who ya gonna call? NOT COMEX--they broker FUTURE prices. See? Hmmmmmmmmm....who ARE ya gonna call? Isn't there anyone out there boasting about how liquid their trading market is for immediate movement of gold???

[There must be a reason why LBMA is boasting about the 1000 tonnes plus of gold traded daily. Perhaps they have an angle with the international speculators COMEX does not have.]

You answered that one!!!! The members of LBMA all have some fluctuating amount of gold registered to their personal ownership yet in LBMA safe-storage. Like with the e-gold operation, or more familiar to most people, like a checking account, certificates of transfer/title/ownership/whatever are used to facilitate various high-stakes financial operations. Wouldn't it make sense to you to arrange payment in gold when floating international paper often gets soggy and sinks or burns despite its wetness? LBMA facilitates these arrangements. The BIS does this also, but their membership is much more exclusive.

Like the historic accounts of runs on banks, there is perhaps some degree of growing concern among LBMA members that apart from the "transfer of gold ownership" operations, some of the other activities taking place under the roof of the LBMA ( such as risky lending or any conceivable derivitive operation ) has served to place the notion of ownership of the same gold into many minds. Those who signed into membership by bringing their gold to the table feel that perhaps their claim is somewhat jeopardized as a result. As a result, perhaps the volume of gold traded via the LBMA will drop as the members redeem their "statements of account" for physical possession of their gold. ( Similar to a run on the bank! ) What the gold holding members are then left with are truckloads of gold but no trustworthy or safe way to continue their gold transactions.

( ...pssssssst...hey buddy... )
got Euros?

but that's ANOTHER story! ;- )

My pooint in offering the previous Treasury Regulation is not to suggest that this is current regulation or law ( which it is not ) , but instead to counter the argument made by some people that there had never been any distinction for pre-1933 gold coins.

I think the document proves that there has in fact been such a distinction.

FOUR times the market has tried to breech 8350 on the dow. The last time was Friday. Bears are selling this market like crazy. Vix is at very high

levels even though the market has basically been in a tight trading range for almost 4 weeks. Commercials have a multi year high number of net long S&P contracts. After Fridays scare I'm sure they have an even larger number of long contracts.

The bond market is making record highs. The dollar is strong. The problem in Russia makes the US more attractive than Europe for the moment.

PM's are still punishing investors. Goldman Sachs is going public in November. Bill Clinton will do anything to save his diseased rear end.

This stock market looks like a setup to punish the shorts. The puts and non commercial S&P shorts are providing an oxegen rich mixture for a scary rally. It won't be over for the stock market until the PM's can rally. That will be a signal that the smart money is ready for the market to fall.

Be careful fellow goldbugs. Sentime

this question has dogged me for some time now................

Is it too late to sell gold equity stocks?

not buy numismatics and in my opinion it was all bunk check it out and you tell me .......

http://www.the-moneychanger.com/html/numino.html

You were missed. {:- )

: )

IMHO

Fox-Man's 17:49 post is a good one. Does anyone have an answer?
Ted Butler talks about it. Seems as if no one has a plausible answer.

Also, does anyone have a comment about the small change in silver
open positions, given the drop-off in price recently? So many shorts
just won't cover. Who knows what I don't know about supply and
demand for silver? Today's price makes no sense to me. The huge
short position makes no sense. Any ideas? Thanks

12.6% since July 16th.

my dealer just mentioned the "Tefra" laws of 1986, which further defined seminumismatics, etc. I don't have a copy of that law, but maybe you do or know someone who does. Please post it if you find it.........
Thanks

...all the technicians are declaring that a fall below 278 ( for gold ) and about 4.95 will cause capitulation in the market.

Do you think for one moment this will NOT happen? Of course it will.

The shorts are counting on it. They will delight in watching the technical longs fall into a mass of hysteria. Moreover, the deep-pocket longs are counting on it. They will gleefully snatch up loads of gold and gold stock tossed at them by despondent, terrified gold technical longs.

It will be a once in a lifetime buying opportunity for those with balls of steel.

I can't wait.

I'm buying more.

And so are several people with humongous deep pockets.

The slingshot is in place, it will soon draw even farther back, then spring forward. Then, we'll see just who continues to call gold a "mere commodity."

Thanks.

F*

...should read: and 4.95 ( for SILVER ) .

Thanks.

F*

Federal Registra.....with a date certain 30-60 or 90 days....if no comment or challenge is made it becomes law.....on average there are 70,000 pieces of papers to go through every month guess what....you would need a staff of 20 to keep track of it all the recent EO Clinton signed on Federalism...was pulled back because we found out about it and caused a stink

Storm up-date ( quickly ) . She came ashore SW of us and is slow moving. Our power is back briefly, so if I go in mid-stream, you'll know why. Several trees down, a lot of rain and storm surge now beginning to build. Lost roof of hospital down south, various other similar damage. Storm not expected to vacate here until late tomorrow. This will bring much more water damage, and wind damage than normally expected. Even though we are in the NE quad, the high winds ( 100+ ) haven't hit us yet. We have had a constant 60 all day with bands up to probably 90 for short periods, so it hasn't yet been what it probably will be.

As night approaches, I know it doesn't in and of itself make things worse, but somehow it sure seems so. Got to go for now. Will post again later if possible.

Aragorn: Thanks for your post -- will read it several times. Anyone who understands anything about the mysterious LBMA is worth listening to.

You touched a point that also occurred to me. And -- that is that the LBMA and the other bullion houses have probably played a fairly loose game with all the physical gold to get business. Also, imagine the feeding frenzy when the CB's announce they need brokers for hundreds of tonnes of gold they want to 'secretly' sell or loan. Further, the regulation of the LBMA seems to be self - generated. No outside inspectors. Little real regulation. So -- what happens one day when all that physical gold that everyone thought they had is not where they thought it was? Physical gold liquidity suddenly dries up and we have a sudden surge in the price of gold. We will probably have little warning of this since the 1000 + tonnes per day is probably not only physical gold -- but the volume of all gold transactions. Would be interesting to know how much physical gold the LBMA actually has -- and compare it to the trading volume. But -- we will never get that kind of information.

I think the bottom line is that since the LBMA seems to have little or no regulation from outside, it is at risk for a liquidity crisis such as what happened in the 70's when the CB's decided to stop selling gold. All we have to follow is COMEX stocks, in the hope that they will give us a clue to what is really happening behind the scenes in 'virtually unregulated' international metals markets.

What really amazes me, given what we know about the lack of regulation of the LBMA, is how it could have existed for over 200 years. Surely you would think that rules have developed over this time. But no -- COMEX seems to be more regulated than the LBMA. Of course, if the LBMA does get into trouble, it can just blame the bullion vendors as failing to come up with the claimed precious metal -- as it is just a clearing house. Now -- if shady practices are unearthed where gold is not there when the LBMA says it is, that is a different matter. In that case, perhaps all the gold trading just moves to Istanbul for a time.

By the way, do you know if the LBMA has been involved in scandals in the past, during its 200 plus year history? Might be illuminating.

Date: Wed Aug 26 1998 04:11
farfel ( Parsing Martin Armstrong.... ) ID#17077:
Copyright  1998 farfel/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved

Is the last Bear Market leg in Metals


Just Getting Started?



By Martin A. Armstrong

August 25, 1998

Copyright Princeton Economic Institute


------------------------------------------------------------------------




The long-term perspective for both gold and silver is becoming very ugly to say the least. While the metals group
has been the target on intense manipulation involving everything from copper, palladium, platinum and silver,
there has also been attempts at trying to create the impression that even gold is getting tight.

( Armstrong means: I am an unmitigated liar and I do everything in my power to manipulate the metals markets.
Do you remember my spate of falsehoods about Buffett selling his hoard of silver? All proven to be lies! That's
because I am a complete BS artist! )

One trade house in particular has specialized in going after the funds day-in-and-day-out. Just recently, this house
has been taking delivery of gold trying desperately to force it higher based solely upon the commitment of traders
report that claims there are 60,000 short speculative positions. Despite selling in the cash and buying on the floor
of the COMEX in a vain attempt to keep up the image that they rule this market, the overwhelming bearish
fundamentals have prevented their latest play.

( Armstrong means: my hedge disciples keep shorting the crap out of these precious metals markets and damn
it...there's a trade house out there that is spoiling our BS party by buying the stuff and TAKING DELIVERY! It's
making me nervous as hell because it looks like there are some other players that might soon make hefty purchases
of the metals and TAKE DELIVERY. Pretty soon, there won't be any silver or gold to cover my egregiously large
short positions. Then the game is over for me and I will lose control of these markets. Yes, I am about to get
F*cked! ) .

We have maintained that silver has been the primary focus of a group of serious market manipulators that have
included one major member of the London bullion dealers. While stories of shortages have still filled the air, the
truth is that these stories originate from London where the dealers still REFUSE to publish the inventories on
hand. Given the fact that this type of behavior in the United States would be considered "insider trading" bordering
on the line or criminal activity, the only way to approach this market is based upon price action since the
fundamentals CANNOT be proven nor trusted.

( Armstrong means: trust me when I tell you that there is a superabundance of silver out there...just as you should
have trusted me when I told you that Buffett was unloading his silver. NOT!!!!!!!!! )

According to our sources, the vaults in London remain full with
the greatest shortage still being storage space itself. Combining this information with the fact that nearly 70% of all
silver exports from the US during the second-half of 1997 were made to London and not Asia, we tend to believe
the US government statistics over those in the bullion industry, which a vested interest in hiding the truth.

( Armstrong means: my sources tell me that the vaults are full of silver in London...the very same sources that
failed to tell me that Buffett was buying $100 million of silver ( yes, I was the last to know! ) and the very same
sources that told me that Buffett was unloading his silver way back when, only to be completely contradicted by
Buffett himself. My sources are the little green men dancing inside my duplicitous head ) .

We do know that demand for silver in India has fallen by 80% during the first quarter of 1998. We believe that
Indias silver consumption will be down on an annual basis at least 40% and perhaps as much as 60% for 1998
thus wiping out any shortage between current production and demand. The sanctions imposed on India for its
nuclear testing have had a major impact upon its economy as well. This situation is only further complicated by the
collapse in Asian currencies. The rise in the dollar due to the continued meltdown in the world economy is also
having a negative impact upon silver.

( Armstrong means: I don't have any unique original lies to spin so I'll revert to that tired old chant about India
dropping its silver demand. I sure hope all you Sh*t for brain lemmings out there buy it! )

The popular belief that gold and silver will rally with a stock market crash has anything but materialized. This is
largely due to the fact that gold is now a commodity and not the official form of money as was the case under the
gold standard. Therefore, as economic turmoil swirls around us, the first priority is liquidity. Where during the
Great Depression gold represented liquidity, keep in mind that gold was cash, which was acceptable to pay ones
bills. Today, cash is the dollar. Gold is not acceptable as payment on your VISA card, mortgage or just about
anything else within the modern monetary system. Hence, gold this time will act like a commodity.

( Armstrong means: hey, kids, it's a New Era, I've got all my net worth tied up in blue chips and bonds. I'm short
PM's and God help me if there is a rush from the fiat currencies into PM's. Believe me when I tell you that gold is
just another commodity...in fact, I happen to know that, during the Korean financial crisis, the Korean
government didn't give a damn whether their citizens gave them soybeans or gold...any commodity would have
sufficed. NOT!!!!!!!! ) .

ALL commodities collapsed during the Great Depression bottoming in 1932 along with stocks. Commodities,
including silver, failed to provide any hedge whatsoever against the Great Depression despite the fact that the US
remained on a gold standard throughout the entire period.

( Armstrong means: God, I really think there might be a market Crash. I must have complete SH*t for brains
taking the kind of short position in PM's I've taken. Imagine a weasel like me making a bet against a financial
wizard like Buffett?? Just lock me up in a funny farm...protect me from myself! )

As illustrated here, silver collapsed from $1.344 in 1920 down to 25 cents going into the bottom of the Great
Depression in 1932. Those who have been preaching that as soon as the stock markets crash the metals will rally
do not have any historical correlation to support such a scenario. Consequently, 1998 appears to have been the
culmination of a 7-year bull market instead of the beginning of a breakout. We had hoped that a low in 1998 would
have developed. However, given the manipulation of the metals group in general, we now see that the low will
most likely develop in 2000 perhaps during the 2nd quarter. The portrayal of Buffett as the savior of silver, who
will NEVER sell under any circumstances, again has distorted the facts. When it comes to bonds and crude oil
investments, Buffett has NEVER been a long-term investor. He has always taken very short-term views. Buffetts
long-term investments have been restricted to purely stocks that pay a reasonable dividend and good capital
appreciation. At this time, Buffetts silver investment is already in a 10% loss position and it could become much
worse.

( Armstrong means: I am really concerned about Buffett and his huge silver position. After all he is only worth
around $20 billion and that silver position constitutes less than five percent of his aggregate net worth. Poor man
just might go broke because he just doesn't understand the silver market like I do. HARHARHARHARHAR! )

There is one popular rumor that has been floating around the marketplace, which we have no solid opinion on. It
has been alleged that PhiBro had a pre-existing silver position in excess of 100 million ounces dating back to
1995. In order for Buffett to sell Solomon Brothers to Smith Barney, he was had to take this unprofitable position
on his own books. This cannot be proven either way without getting into the books of PhiBro. Nonetheless, we
do not believe that some of the players who were front-runners would have jumped into the silver market with
both feet if this rumor were correct.

( Armstrong means: it's time for me to make up another rumor, defaming a major institution like Philbro. I am
getting desperate what with this jackass huge short position in the metal. Naturally, I cannot prove it because what
mathematical proof exists to validate the existence of sheer Bullsh*t? ) .

All things considered, the metals are simply headed significantly lower. A monthly closing for silver below $5 will
then warn that a decline to the $4.50 level is in order. At the end of the day, our computer models are still adamant
that silver will drop below $3. If our sources are correct that the London bullion dealers are indeed hiding 500
million ounces of silver from the world statistics, then this target is very realistic. While we no doubt will receive
the usual hate mail due to this forecast, the point is that this issue can be settled very easily. London should open
its vaults for a full INDEPENDENT audit. The mere fact that the London dealers refuse to publish these statistics
perhaps suggests that there is indeed a pile of silver they do not want the marketplace to know about. If there is
indeed a vast quantity of silver beyond Buffetts 120 million ounces sitting in London, what better way to keep up
the propaganda about shortages than refusing to publish the inventory statistics?

( Armstrong means: damn it, I just know there's a secret pile of silver sitting in London and the bullion dealers
refuse to disclose it. Bastards! I demand a full independent audit. On the other hand, don't mention anything to me
about independently auditing the gold reserves of the Central Banks. Trust me when I tell you that those published
reserves are completely accurate. Central Banks would never lie, least of all to me, the grand shorter of PM's!!! )

If our sources are correct on this issue, then considering the collapse in Asian demand combined with 500 million
ounces in London, there is NO shortage at all and in fact we are back to a 2-year surplus or much more. Those
who simply point to the COMEX stockpiles and claimed that "we assume that European stockpiles have declined
by a like proportion" are making a very dangerous and irresponsible statement. They should take great care in their
reports when the bona fide statistics are NOT available. They are either being paid as a consultant to those who
want to propagate the myth of a shortage on an undisclosed basis, or they are not exercising their due-diligence
that is expected of all independent research. We are NOT prepared to join the crowd on this issue of a shortage
until London becomes a market where who own what can remain confidential, but total supply is fully disclosed to
the public. After all NO leading financial market in the world operates under such rules

( Armstrong means: I like to project my own egregious lies onto my antagonists. As you can tell, I am obviously
little more than a front for PM-shorting hedge funds, propagating the myth of a superabundant PM market ) .

In the end, the continued collapse in Russia is likely to spillover into the former eastern block as well as into Latin
America in particular Mexico. We are looking at another Asian contagion but this time in Europe. Unfortunately,
this reality may keep commodities in a deflationary trend going into early 2000 before any reversal develops.

( Armstrong means: I sure hope you've bought my BS concerning PM's as mere commodities. If you have, and
furthermore, if you believe we are going into a pure deflation, then naturally, you should expect PM's to drop in
value ) .

Indeed, the similarities of our current global crisis are a much better fit fundamentally with the Great Depression
than any other period in time. While the stock market peaked in 1929 and collapsed into 1932, the dollar soared
into 1931 where it established its major high against every currency known to man. Every European nation
defaulted on its debt, with the exception of Switzerland while Britain suspended payments for 6 months. Russia
defaulted, China, most of Asia and Latin America. With each default, capital fled to the dollar creating domestic
deflation within the US marketplace. Due to the fact that 40% of the civil work force in the US was employed
within the agricultural sector, as the dollar rose commodities fell forcing farmers and miners into bankruptcy.

( Armstrong means: I sure hope you buy the Bullcrap concerning my direct analogy of today's US economy with
the US Depression economy. Please forget that today, unlike the USA of the Thirties, America is the largest debtor
nation in the world. Please overlook that little fact such that you may rest assured that the entire world will convert
all their crumbling currencies into US dollars. HARHARHARHAR. NOT! ) .

To a large extent, we see the similarities with this period of the 1930s as striking to say the least. However, we do
NOT see a 90% decline for stocks or commodities from current levels. While gold might collapse to the $190 area
and silver down to $2.75, the US share market at worst might reach 3800 on the Dow or about a 66% correction.
To be much more modest, we would expect perhaps a more realistic decline in the 40% area assuming that the next
low in September/October unfolds with about a 23% correction. A correction of 66% would ONLY become likely
if by mid October the Dow were down by 40%.

( Armstrong means: God, I'm really f*cked if all my DOW stocks crash over the next few months. Trust me when
I tell you they could never fall as much as gold or silver! TRUST ME, PLEASE!!!! )

In summary, during the 1930s gold was money. It could be used to pay your landlord and debts. Today, a
deflationary contraction drives the same forces into a search for liquidity. In the 1990s, liquidity is still cash; its
just that cash is the dollar  not bars of precious metals.

( Armstrong means: trust me, gold is NOT money. The Central Banks are completely deluded in treating it as
though it has any value or any liquidity. The US DOLLAR is king, even though the world is rapidly becoming
awash in this overabundant paper debt. TRUST ME, DAMMIT, DON'T YOU BELIEVE ME YET???? )

Gold and silver might rally if the dollar were at risk. However, the economic crisis is NOT taking place in the US
 it is taking place everywhere else but! Reagan at least reversed the trend in the US economy away from socialism
and toward a more fiscal conservative system. This shift has yet to take place in either Japan or continental Europe.
The unfunded liabilities throughout Europe are more than twice those in the US on a percentage to GDP basis.
This too is similar to the 1930s when European debt simply collapsed due to fiscal irresponsibility.

( Armstrong means: the US is an island impervious to any outside forces. Global currency crises could never
contaminate the US paradise. FOreigners could NEVER lose faith in the American government or its currency.
The sun rises in the West and sets in the East. Why do these purple bugs keep crawling around my underwear?
Who put the cat in my refrigerator YADDAYADDAYADDA. ) .

To add salt to the wound, the IMF has led the hedge funds and the Banks to the slaughter over Russia. By
standing out as the guarantor of the world, many ran into Russia to buy GKOs yielding 100% or more. These
guys looked at the high yield and assumed that the IMF would never let Russia collapse. The problem now is that
Russia has collapsed and the losses are spreading around the globe. Again, Europeans hold about 90% of this
exposure. Those who still think the dollar is a fiat currency are merely living in a fantasy world. The dollar
remains as the most secure and fiscal responsible currency today. That might change in a few years, but for now 
the dollar is looking very, very strong. The final death-blow to the metals may in fact be the IMF, which in the end
will be forced to see its gold reserves for cash. The IMF is broke and with the collapse of Russia, in part propelled
by the IMF itself, funding in the future is going to be lean indeed. With 70% of its liquid assets in gold, the IMF
will become the next seller of last resort. With the rise in the dollar, we can also expect a continued increase in
mine production for silver as well. Selling should be expected from both Russia and Mexico. A few years back,
Russia was selling gold and buying silver switching their own reserves in part due to the shortage myth. Again
reliable sources claim that Russia is also sitting on at least as much as Buffett bought.

( Armstrong means: BS and more BS and even more BS. Now can I ride on my pony, Daddy? ) . 

During the final days of any bear market one is confronted by fundamentals that suddenly turn very ugly. When
governments began to default during the 1930s, the final low came about 1.5 years later. Here too, we may be
looking at about a 50% decline over the next 1.5-year period moving into a final low by the 1st or 2nd quarter of
2000.

( Armstrong means: is it too late to unwind my huge short position in PM's, God? I'll do
anything....ANYTHING! Just save my ass! Please!! )

Thanks.

F* 

"The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and government to gain ground." ..Thomas Jefferson

I looked at the Moneychanger site...it seems to be
that they are playing something of a Bill Clinton
act - in the way they state that there is no basis
in law or regulation, etc. etc.

It may be true that there are no CURRENT laws or
regulations ( as they so state ) with respect to
pre-1933 gold coins. I have not researched this,
and am not a lawyer or bureaucrat who knows all
the legalese.

However - I think ( as noted in a previous post ) it is very misleading to state that that there is NO
basis whatever for the differentiation of pre-1933 gold coins as coins of recognized special value to collectors. This is obviously UNTRUE - and was the written policy of the Treasury Department for many years.

I take it as a matter of personal judgement whether to take the risk that modern bullion coins are not different from pre-1933 coins with respect to potential US confiscation. Personally, I only
buy the old stuff.

Evening
I am absolutely convinced that the dow is going to soar tomorrow. Up, up and away.
Thank you kindly.
d:o )

and BTW, if ya got gold, HOLD it; if ya don't have it, GET IT

effected the privacy of investors and collectors,and also on the manner in which they can buy and sell coins,this provision added a new section to the IRS code ( Section 6045 ) reporting requirments on bullion vs numismatics....hence the $10,000.00 reporting on bullion

Just traded at 285.50...this is gettin painful folks....somebody slap me !!

Aragorn III ( JTF...more on LBMA )

For a dissection of the LBMA you might review numerous reports on the
elusive LBMA which trades about 30 MILLION ounces of GOLD DAILY.

It's necessary to delete the extra letters "en" in the word "golden" before posting it to the Internet:

http://www.golden-eagle.com/gold_digest_98/baron050698.html
http://www.golden-eagle.com/research/redbaronndx.html

I agree about the damage that Soros and his ilk have caused on innocent hard-working people. I remember back in October when the markets were tanking Hnery Kissinger mentioned that a review of Global currency trading should be undertaken. When you consider what the consequenses have been over the last year I believe this should happen but probably won't because the powers are here in North America and Europe while the impoverished, who had been making gains to improve their standard of living get slammed down. What good do they do other than line their own pockets?

( 1 ) LBMA regulation-Bank of England did a "turnover survey" in May of 1996. Their timing was interesting!. The turnover statistics were published as a one-off, with comparative data for May 1994 and May 1991. If I remember rightly, gold had held steady over the period, silver had grown.

( 2 ) JTF-are your photos and c.v. ready? Came across information this week about the hot new collectible: PHYSICISTS TRADING CARDS. I kid you not. Little sideline money maker ( specie only right! )

Duke: Take care -- hope you are inland sufficiently that you are not exposed to the surf or tidal surge. If you see the eye that means you got it head on. I saw the effect of Class III hurricane Hugo on Charleston, and what the main force of the hurricane did to a small fishing town north of Charleston ( forgot name ) . Nothing left. Huge shrimp boats scattered everywhere. Folly beach lost about 1/2 of the houses closest to the beach -- many were total losses. One 70 foot yacht vanished into the Aether -- occupants and all.

Another item I will never forget is the thousands of tornados that must have come with the storm -- because anything taller than about 50 feet was snapped off like it was a match stick. In a neighborhood shopping center, 6 1 1/2 foot-wide I beams for a sign were twisted all the way down to the ground -- like a pretzel. And -- after the storm it seemed like all the greenery of Charleston had been ripped off, and deposited in the streets during cleanup. Most side roads were effectively one way, due to the 20 foot piles of brush.

Hope the eye misses you, and your dont get 135 mph plus.

"Rainfall totals of 10 to 20 inches...locally even higher...are
possible near the path of Bonnie...posing a very serious flood
threat.

Isolated tornados are possible tonight over eastern North
Carolina."
-----------------------------------------------------------------
http://vortex.plymouth.edu/cgi-bin/hur_adv_2

How about this!? $10,000 per head for every American killed in embassy bombings by ben laben ( or who ever ) . Let's watch Mady alldike and Willy Cohen to see what they say. I wish Scott Ridder was head of security. He's the only one putting the UN and the US State Dept on the barrel. Like always, no guts- no results. I guess Clinton is going to Russia and kiss ass.

by Chas, Aurator, Tolerant1 & friends.
This time the file is 8KB in size for a much faster load time.
The coin is a one centimeter base metal miniature
of an Eisenhower Dollar recently purchased in a novelty store.
Note the 1 cm.ruler scale at the bottom of the photo.

SDRer: I doubt my visage would be anywhere as interesting as that of a professional ball player. We are not a particularly flamboyant group, with the exception of one in the 2' by 4' picture I have behind my desk.

Underneath the photo, it says:

' Peace cannot be kept by force.

It can only be achieved by understanding.'

A.A.

With that I head for home -- dinner is waiting. G'Evening all!

Well there is another colorful one and just as brilliant -- Nicolai Tesla -- but I don't know if he was considered a Physicist or an Engineer. Experimental physicists have something in common with the likes of him.

You're there. As for historical knowledge of scandals and whatnot...perhaps only the family...it would be bad for business, you know?

During that history you should also recall that gold really was used as money, so indeed, you had an institution not much different from banks as we know them today. When the gold standard was abandoned, that was a deal all about governments. Individuals are what make the world go 'round...and old habits die hard--such as using gold as money...expecting payment in gold, etc. No one said the LBMA had to close shop because world governments wanted to start writing bad checks to whomever would accept them.

The million dollar question is, is the LBMA in over their heads through some shenanegans through lending the same gold to many people ( via paper title ) with lessening likelihood of unwinding the situation without jeopardizing the fiat system that the big boys have tried so hard to develop over the years? Paper just can't hold a candle to gold. Or should I say gold just might hold a candle to the paper. Perceptions are important where paper is concerned, and this gold world is poised to become over-visible over-fast.

got gold?

With that...I'm gone, to savor every morsel of my dinner, and to think that things are so very nearly as they should be....

got gold??!

Thought I would pass this along:

The Psalm of William Jefferson Clinton
after being exposed by Kenneth Starr -

"Have mercy upon me, O Polls, according to thy ignorance: according
unto the multitude of thy investments in the stock market blot out my
lapse of judgment.

Wash me thoroughly from my inappropriate behavior, and cleanse me
from my private problems. For I acknowledge my irrelevant course of
action: and my possible impeachment is ever before me.

Against Hillary and Chelsey only, have I misled, and done this
withholding of information: that I might be justified when thou
thinketh, and be clear when thou judgest me in the next CNN poll.

Behold, my circumstances caused my problems; and it is the fault of
Ken Starr who conceived this plot against me.

Behold, thou desirest truth in the inward parts: and in the hidden
part I will show my ability to twist the English language.

Purge me with ignorant endorsements, and I shall be clean: wash this
investigation from me, and I shall be whiter than snow.

Make me to hear joy and gladness; by putting an end to this
seven-month public and wrongful investigation that I may rejoice.

Hide your face from the facts, and blot me not out of office.

Create for me a clean heart, O Polls; and renew a forgetful spirit
for me.

Cast me not away from the Presidency; and take not political power
from me.

Restore unto me the joy of my power; and uphold me with Hollywood and

homosexual backings.

Then will I teach transgressors my ways; and other adulterers shall
be converted unto my side.

Deliver me from Ken Starr, O Poll, thou god of my salvation: and my
tongue shall sing aloud of thy passivity.

O Nightly news, let me open my lips with contradiction; and my mouth
shall shew forth my praise.

For thou desirest not morality; else would I give it: thou delightest

not in ethics.

The sacrifices of the American public are a Bull stock market: a
defective and yet perjured apologetic heart for getting caught, O Poll,
thou wilt not despise.

Do me good in my good pleasure unto Washington: build thou the walls
of protection for my private life.

Then shalt thou be pleased with the sacrifice of morality and truth
as a burnt offering and whole burnt offering: then shall they offer
honesty upon the altar of ignorance."

- author unknown, but worth a round of applause!

@JTF: Sorry, intermittant times at this infernal machine. Have no ready access to the '25-'29 commodity regime, and it was before my time ( barely ) . Others may have the knowledge. You probably are correct.
I personally do not believe in the "history repeats" exactly, dates, etc.; but do believe "one must learn or be doomed". AG of course has waited a year or more too long to tighten, and now may be forced into a loosening by the market crashing. I have lost all faith in AG's will to do what is necessary unless forced and believe he has been bought and paid for by the Clintons or their masters....

M. Link: IMHO the derivatives thing will be what is blamed by market historians for the coming market collapse of 1998-1999.

Flash G.: Upon what do you base your conviction of a rally tomorrow? I hope you are correct, as I WANT a big ( 120-150 Dow points ) up day so that I may complete my planned purchases of RYURX and BEARX. I have been frustrated this week. Since I WANT this to happen you can bet that it probably will not.

Check with you once more around 2300 est; other duties call.

Best regards; Mtn Bear

and we are heading down for wave -c- of ( B ) . Then we can expect a 5 wave rally up to a ( C ) to complete the ABC wave ( 2 ) correction of the 1st wave decline.
You know what that means, don't you...........Wave 3 will begin and it won't be very pretty. At the least it should decline at a minimum of 1.618 x wave 1 or 1710 points from the top of wave ( 2 ) or 2.618 or 2767 points.

Gold and mining shares are available at bargain basement prices. Slightly lower prices on both in the short-term, but by October we will all be chanting: "Why didn't I buy more?" The washout we have been awaiting is on us. The gold bull is just over the horizon and he is mad as heck. Load up now or forever hold your peace!

This PM devastation is depressing, lately any word from your pal
devoto in golden or is time to drown one self in the liquid from golden

I have tried several times to contact Richard Devoto at Cau- no result. It would be interesting because Devoto is a rare name. Sorry, wish I could report, Charlie DeVoto

Since I get paid in Canadian dollars and all my expenses are in US dollars I am very interested in any best estimates of how low it might go.

Any guesses out there?

How can i find which gold stocks might be the most reliable when gold gets it act together???

backing the ruble with Vodka will at least make the curreency "liquid." No?

August 26, 1998

Canada sets conditions for Quebec secession talks

OTTAWA, Aug 26 ( Reuters ) - Quebec separatists might find themselves with only a fraction of their huge province if they decide to secede from Canada, the federal government has warned in the latest volley in its long-running verbal battle.

 The government's point man on keeping Canada united, Stephane Dion, sent a tightly reasoned letter to separatist Quebec Premier Lucien Bouchard late on Tuesday, laying out tough conditions for negotiations after an independence vote.

 "The time for stratagems and 'winning' tricks is over," wrote Dion, a former university professor who is now intergovernmental affairs minister.

 Both the federalists and separatists have been furiously trying to spin the public's interpretation of last Thursday's pivotal Supreme Court decision, which said Quebec may not leave unilaterally but that Canada must negotiate if a clear majority votes on a clear question.

 Dion said any negotiations would raise the issue of the boundaries of Quebec, particularly those of the vast northern lands occupied primarily by Canadian natives.

 "Nobody seriously suggests that our national existence, seamless in so many aspects, could be effortlessly separated along what are not the provincial boundaries of Quebec," Dion quoted from the court decision.

 One of the strategies of the federal government -- after the separatists' 1995 campaign which tried to show everything would be possible after a vote for independence -- has been to show the risks and uncertainties of they vote to leave Canada.

 It has warned before of the possibility of Quebec being divisible if Canada is, but was now able to draw on the Supreme Court for authority. Premier Bouchard reiterated, in a news conference on Friday, his position that Quebec is indivisible.

 Dion derided Bouchard's assertion that a "clear majority" means one vote more than 50 percent. He said the court used "clear majority""13 times and also spoke of a "strong majority," "substantial consensus""and "enhanced majority."

 In Quebec City, Quebec Intergovernmental Affairs Minister Jacques Brassard said a simple majority would be enough to allow the French-speaking province to separate.

 "The three political parties in Quebec have an official common position that says that Quebecers can shape their destiny on the basis of the democratic rule of 50 percent plus one," he told reporters.

 Dion said Ottawa would never sit down to negotiations if the referendum asked something as vague as whether citizens of the mainly francophone province wanted "sovereignty with an offer of political and economic partnership""with Canada.

 That is the essence of the question voted on in October 1995, when the separatists won more than 49 percent of the vote.

 "A clear question is an essential condition of a valid referendum in democracy," he said.

 "The National Assembly ( Quebec's legislature ) is of course free to ask Quebeckers any questions it wants. But you will appreciate that the federal government, among others, cannot surrender its responsibility to evaluate the clarity of a question which would result in the break-up of a country."



Aussie $ gold is now scratching the $500/oz level. Anyone in Oz who has been buying physical over the past year is UP 10-20% on their purchases. Gold is doing its job, maintaining a store of value in troubled times.

Aussie gold shares must be even better value. Most miners are locked in at prices above $500/oz. I would not be surprised if the current selling is due to Aussie producers taking advantage of these good ( A$ ) prices. We are nearing the end of a long drawn-out slow-motion panic selloff. A year from now you will be astounded at the current ( today's ) prices and will kick yourself for not having had bigger huevos/cojones. All MVHO. N.

http://www.crbindex.com/story2333.html

For us non Elliott Wavers what does that mean in terms of the price of the XAU and time frames? As a gold investor I follow numbers. Thanks.

from http://www.mises.org/

Milton Friedman, interviewed in Barron's ( August 24, 1998 ) , was asked:

Q: You were acquainted with the Austrian economist Friedrich Hayek and
also are familiar with the work of Ludwig von Mises and his American
disciple, Murray Rothbard. When you were talking about bad investments,
you were alluding to Austrian business-cycle theory. There is a certain
concept that has pretty much gone into our parlance and understanding,
which fits in with what you said about what happened in Asia. There can be
times and conditions in which the stage can be set for malinvestment that
leads to recession.

Friedman Responds:

A: That is a very general statement that has very little content. I think the
Austrian business-cycle theory has done the world a great deal of harm. If
you go back to the 1930s, which is a key point, here you had the Austrians
sitting in London, Hayek and Lionel Robbins, and saying you just have to
let the bottom drop out of the world. You've just got to let it cure itself.
You can't do anything about it. You will only make it worse. You have
Rothbard saying it was a great mistake not to let the whole banking system
collapse. I think by encouraging that kind of do-nothing policy both in
Britain and the United States, they did harm.

He continues on to say "I don't think there are business cycles."

* * * *

First, this response from Jeff Scott
Wells Fargo, San Francisco

Dear Editor:

Milton Friedman, in his interview with Gene Epstein ( August 24, 1998 )
presents a caricature of the Austrian theory ( and policy ) of the business
cycle, namely that Austrians are pleased to let the bottom fall out of the
market when constructive corrective action is a plausible course.

In contrast to the Monetarist School, the Austrian School understands that
economic upturns can be extended by the manipulation of credit and
confidence. Central banks and Treasury departments create misleading
signposts in the economy that channel capital into otherwise untenable
investments.

Sharp downturns are a natural response to such systemwide
malinvestments. Policymakers and central bankers best deal with
recessions of this type--the bust of a phony investment boom--by letting
prices go where they must. And if those levels are lower and lower than
anybody in business and government can imagine, so be it.

Why should the appropriate economic policy be stalled by the pretense of
imagination, or even worse, by a new inflationist policy?

Austrians emphasize the importance of allowing price discovery to fulfill its
function and work toward restoring confidence. Ultimately, there are no
artificial means of restoring confidence; they are all nativist boosterism in
one form or another.

The lessons of current day Japan, suffering gross maladaptation, make this
point rather clear. The unwillingness of their policymakers to allow prices to
take their course has prolonged the misery for everyone.

Sincerely,

Jeff Scott

* * *

theory: http://www.mises.org/fullstory.asp?FS=%3Ch3%3EBusiness+Cycles

[the above url contains both the above article and a more in depth response from a Misesean perspective.]

lower than the stock market. Isn't it great to be able to buy at these prices?..... Amazing, just amazing! ..... Don't get too negative guys.

.

How high in terms of Dow or SnP do you expect the 5 wave correction to go and over what time frame. I know thats not asking much but I always say ask and ye may receive.

Japan Nikkei 225 14449.10 -416.93 -2.80%

You ask if the LBMA might have been involved in any intrigues in the past. Well, to answer that question requires us to go back a few years. To a time when, just as now, the cold war did not exist. The LBMA was not known as such then. At least they did not openly bandy their name about. But given that they have been around since the US was an infant, you can be sure their hand was in the events described at:

http://www.radix.net/~tarpley/29crash.htm

With the ending of the cold war, we can surmise that many of these people, or the sons and grandsons are back to business as usual. As the writers say:

"As we have already hinted, we consider that these matters are not solely of historical interest. The repertoire of central bank intrigue, speculative bubbles, defaults, devaluations, bank rate manipulations, deflations and inflations constitute the essential arsenal being used by British economic warfare planners today."

Farfel, in your professional opinion how long will gold go down, how low will it go and when will it turn? Thanks.

How much more bleeding to we have to endure before these f**king PM's finally bottom out and start rising??????? If they don't turn around soon, I'll be ruined financially for life.

Janet Reno
ugliest????

XAU END OF DAY SUMMARY
1998-08-26
ABX-Barrick Gold-CLOSED AT $15.3125 -0.6875 XAU CONTRIBUTION ( Est. ) -0.84
ASL-Ashanti Gold-CLOSED AT $6.8125 -0.3125 XAU CONTRIBUTION ( Est. ) -0.11
BMG-Battle Mountain-CLOSED AT $4.6875 -0.1250 XAU CONTRIBUTION ( Est. ) -0.09
CDE-Coeur D'Alene-CLOSED AT $5.3750 -0.0625 XAU CONTRIBUTION ( Est. ) 0.00
FCX-Freeport Mc-CLOSED AT $12.3125 -0.5000 XAU CONTRIBUTION ( Est. ) -0.29
GGO-Getchell Gold-CLOSED AT $10.8750 -0.3750 XAU CONTRIBUTION ( Est. ) -0.04
HL-Hecla Mining-CLOSED AT $4.4375 0.0000 XAU CONTRIBUTION ( Est. ) 0.00
HM-Homestake Gold-CLOSED AT $10.3125 -0.1875 XAU CONTRIBUTION ( Est. ) -0.13
NEM-Newmont Mining-CLOSED AT $16.0000 -0.8750 XAU CONTRIBUTION ( Est. ) -0.45
PDG-PlacerDome Gold-CLOSED AT $9.8125 -0.0625 XAU CONTRIBUTION ( Est. ) -0.05

XAU CLOSED AT 57.68 -1.93


ABX and PDG have been taking down the XAU more than anybody else the past couple of days. I think this is a trend. It might be wise to swap ABX and PDG with other Gold Stocks.

or to the 9015 area which is not far above a .618 retracement of the whole 1057 point decline, or the 8960 to 9000 area. The fibonacci relationship of those numbers is spooky. This definetly looks like a bear market has started.

...I can't get no...I can't get no...I can't get no...

Any XAU Gold Stock is a good bet to rise when the POG rises. But there are other out there, AngloGold, Franco-Nevada

After discussions with arbitrage brokers re gold, it appears that LBMA delivery is good against Comex, but Comex delivery against LBMA is not all good. LBMA apparently works on London Good Delivery- 400+/- oz 999.95 fine, but Comex can have stuff as low as 990. Liquidity would really be enhaced if Comex would get everything to London Good Delivery standards. Evidently Comex takes in a lot of "trash". Any questions?

I have taken quite an interest in Y2K.

I have now studied everything I can get my hand on

and talked to hundreds of people from programmers,

computer board designers to the janitor.



I am now ( after buying more gold and silver coins,

food and the rest of things that might come in handy. )



There are others that I have talked to and that is farmers of

all kinds, seed and fertilizer distributors and was supprised

to find all this years hybred seeds were pretty well sold out

and those purchased this year has a 50/50 chance of bringing

in a crop next year.



Therefore I have found a private farmer with nonhybred seeds

and intend on stocking up just in case.



My reasoning is what if the seeds can't be germinated for

a couple of years by the mfg. due to lack of suppliers and electric.



Seeds than will be worth their weight in Gold.



I am not even taking into the equasion of weather

and inflation or something else that might upset the apple cart.



I know HN is saying this on his web. I didn't think too

much about it, Until I thought about it, after learning it could happen.



Eating is a way of life with me and I can't live without my food. Give me seeds and some ground and I will eat.



Twister

Yep. That's how I see it. I just added more to my gold stocks yesterday, bought more Homestake.

YOU JUST GOTTA LOVE LOVE THESE LOW PRICES WHEN YOU *****KNOW***** THE POG WILL RISE AND PROBABLY BIGTIME IN THE FALL, JUST BEFORE 1999 Jan 1. ( an important date )

JapanNikkei 225^N225 8:56PM 14569.23 -296.80 -2.00%

Your point is well-taken. Indeed, if I had more money to invest, I would be rejoicing over the fire-sale prices of gold and gold stocks. However, time is NOT on my side...so I can only hope and pray that gold and PM stocks will rise VERY SOON!!! Also, I'm certain that there are many other lurkers ( and posters ) who are passengers in the same sinking ship that I'm currently riding in. Will somebody please throw me a lifeline?

Free Republic poster re Fox News carrying story ref White House doctorin' visitation
logs.

which I expect in Sep, 1998. As I have posted before, expect a crash in Sep to end in early Oct. Gold mining shares will begin to move up
towards the end of Sep as the Dow descend to 4500-5500 range. All gold equities shares, as the Dutchman said " represent life time buying opportunity".

we are about to break ( or possible have already just broken ) , a very important support line for the Nikkei.

Japan Nikkei 225 ^N225 8:57PM 14549.45 -316.58 -2.13%

Of course, it may recover this evening, but lower than 14549 close doesn't bode well for Japan and the rest of the world market either.

Please correct me if I am wrong, since I have been wrong so many other times.

Thanks,

HB

http://www.netizen.org/arc-hive/BNK_NERV.TXT

on the NYSE and the American exchange. We may suffer for another 4 weeks but when the move begin in early October it will be very rewarding to the patient holders.

As usual, you have to delete the "w" in wrapped before posting it to
the eagle. Do we rely too heavily on spell-checkers, or what?

Isn't interesting how one man's words can turn a market. I don't know if it will hold, but the Soros guy on CNBC just said he was long the U.S. market and it immediately popped 50 points. I guess when you manage, what did they say, 20 billion, people listen. Wouldn't it be interesting if he had his guys back at the ranch are selling.

Bill Fleckenstein comments on the barage of lies spewing from the Wall Street Journal editorial page. Fundamental spin -- what me worry? The bull will continue forever.

http://www.stocksite.com/features/contrarian/rap/

The strength of the US$ will be lessened as the demand for the Euro strengthens next year.

In by books, there's a 99% chance the POG in US$ will rise based on this fact alone.

@HOPEFUL trying to predict the exact bottom is so hard to do and not worth the risk. Just keep buying gold stocks cause we definately are so close to the bottom.

Although others on this forum will refute my position regarding the gold stock with the best bang for the buck when gold rise, I like Echo Bay Mines ( ECO ) . It is among the most highly liquid gold stocks. It's price is low ( 1 3/4 ) relative to its 52-week and three-year highs, and I believe this stock will take off faster than most of the rest North American companies. I, personally, would not buy Canadian or Australian mining shares because when the dollar turns, these mining companies are less likely to realize the full upside potential of American gold mining companies ( IMHO ) . Hey, but what do I know. I still have a bunch of nearly worthless Pegasus Gold shares.

Skip, I wish I could throw you a lifeline but I'm afraid I can't. Like you I am way, way off on my gold investments. Much to my discredit I waited until after I had dropped a small fortune to do my homework. After a solid year of reading and listening I have yet to hear a credible argument put forth as to why gold should go up. I think Kitco is inhabited by some of the most intelligent people i haver ever run across in my life. Yet, at the very bottom of all their arguments it is always a matter of faith rather than a logical reason. Gold will go up because it did in 1929-1932. Gold will go up because adjusted for inflation it is cheaper now than when the Spanish took over South America. Gold will go up because a great wave of enlightenment will wash over the world and people will come to their senses and see the true value of gold as money. My prayers are with you my friend but until I hear a logical reason for gold to go up in value my bet is that it will only continue to go down.

because I thought that watching the Comex Warehouse Totals was
somewhat significant. I hope you don't mind, but I've tried to
carry on the daily postings of these Comex stats...

I know you haven't posted a whole lot lately, but would sure appreciate
your takes on the PM markets, and even the Comex Warehouse stats! TIA
Foxman

What if the Euro doesn't get off the ground 1/1/1999 ( for whatever reason ) ? Any takers?

We are so close to the bottom cause the POG is at $280 an ounce. Few mines can operate at a profit at such a low price.

Many gold mines are now takeover targets.

Yep, $280 is a magic number.

Japan down 2.58% to 14400+-..
Now that's serious...more meltdown to come ... which means ofcourse ..more holding Gold down as well..

bd

You may take the existence of this discussion as conclusive proof that government run education is a waste and a scam to raise up ignorant citizens. Boiled down the statement that executive orders become law after a time if not objected to is a declaration that we live under government by decree. That the Congress of the United States is indistinguishible from the Russian Duma. Spreading this nonsense amounts to public destruction of the Constitution and of the very idea of government according to law.

All written constitutions prescribe the mode and process of making laws. What says the Constitution for the united States of America on the mode and process of making laws ? It says revenue bills must originate in the House of Representatives. It says further that bills in general must be passed by a majority of both Houses and signed by the President within a specific interval of time in order to beome Law. Read the Constitution yourself if you doubt this.

Now, neither Congress nor the President can change this singly or in concert. It would require an amendment ratified by three fourths of the States.

Even if a bill is properly passed by both Houses and properly signed by the President, it may yet not be law. The essential parts of every bill to be enacted into law are 1. The Title 2. the enacting clause 3. the body. Without a Title a bill has no name, nothing by wich it may be referenced. A typical enacting clause is: Constitution of California -1879- SECTION 1. The enacting clause of every law shall be as follows;" The People of the State of California, represented in Senate and assembly, do enact as follows." Without an enacting clause, a bill cannot become law even if it is signed by the President or Governor and passed by majorities of both Houses. see In Re Seat of Government, 1 Washington Territory, 114, 123 ( 1861 ) US Supreme Court. Forty-six state Constitutions prescribe the enacting clause. However, there need not be a constitutional provision for an enacting clause to make its usage mandatory. So held the Georgia Supreme Court among others. Virtually every state Supreme Court has held the enacting clause essential and have voided statutes not having it. But, a statute without an enacting clause can be on the books masquerading as law and will remain there until someone challenges it on the grounds of its lacking an enacting clause.

"The enacting clause is that portion of a statute which gives it jurisdictional identity and constitutional authenticity." Georgia Supreme Court. Without an enacting clause a court has no evidence before it that it has jurisdiction and no evidence before it that it has authority to judge from the constitution under and by which it is sitting.

All the above is fundamental law. But, government will get away with just as much as people will let it and ignorant people let it get away with a lot.

A couple billion here, and a couple billion there... Dang, Uncle George better not come around asking me for a loan.

"I'll gladly pay you Tuesday for a hamburger today."

Japan now down 2.95% and dropping...14,425

"When in trouble, or in doubt,

Run in circles, scream and shout
"

Now's the time...

My wife and I were having a discussion about the slow destruction of freedom at the hands of government. I think freedom produces wealth for the majority. Slavery produces poverty for the majority and wealth for the priveleged few. Slavery only works that way cause there would be little advantage for the majority to plunder the few, while there is some real benefit for the few who manage to plunder the many.

Anyway, it looks to me that people lose freedom because they want to keep the wealth that comes from freedom and they keep paying more attention to wealth than freedom. At the same time the politically sly work to get wealth by destroying freedom. It is only when the loss of freedom finally produces so much poverty that people finally insist ( revolt ) on freedom and then the wealth comes back.


One comment I made was that some people work at becomming masters in a slave society like ours and a few like Billy Bob Clinton manage to make it to the top. I told my wife that he probably feels like he has made it to the position of king. She said that some others obviously think he is king also since they are kneeling at his feet.

and the 3rd wave down, as underway. The charts could be easily counted as 3 up, 3 down and 3 back up to yesterdays high. Just thought you might like to be aware of that also.

Thanks for posting the CRB index report. I took the family out for supper. Did you catch this line from Kaplan's site? Big money is moving in to gold mining now.

http://www.investor1.com/writers/kaplan/index.asp

In addition to gold mining executives heavily buying shares of their own companies, professional portfolio managers have been loading up on gold mining shares at their highest rate since January 1993, the last time the XAU was below 70. On Wednesday, for example, Trimark Investment Management announced that they had purchased 300,000 common shares of Kinross Gold ( KGC ) .



August 26, 1998
Trimark Funds Hold 10.1% Of Kinross Gold Corp.

Dow Jones Newswires

TORONTO -- Trimark Investment Management Inc. said mutual funds sponsored by it have acquired 300,000 common shares of Kinross Gold Corp. ( KGC ) , giving them a total of 29,420,000 Kinross shares, or 10.1%. In a news release, Trimark said the shares were purchased in open-market transactions through the Toronto Stock Exchange, for investment purposes.

Trimark Financial Corp. ( T.TMF ) , through Trimark Investment Management, is a mutual fund company.

Warning, off-topic. But zat's ok here in the k2 ghetto section.
What the hey, Gold, God & Guns on K1, not necessarily in that
order--- maybe Bart should add bibles & bullets to his bullion
wares?

Gotta admit farf I did enjoy the Jenny Jones takeoff from
your lingo prof bud, even crossposted to another ( nonfinancial )
hangout. Here's a little ditty by one Richard Dawkins on the
brilliant '96 hoax by Alan Sokal, a physics professor with
impeccable leftist credentials getting his postmodernist
metatwaddle published in one of that clique's favored
'zines. Enjoy.

http://www.spacelab.net/~catalj/postmoderism_disrobed.htm

Talk over at SI's Vengold thread sez that they have the right of first refusal ( trofr ) on RTZ's 17% interest on Lihir. Do you know anything about the validity of this?

Price fall probably has to do on how Vengold will pay off the funds for their last Lihir share purchase, to 19+% interest rather than the present gold price.

If the above rumor about the ( trofr ) is true, I believe that they are dealing the cards and PDG will let them exist. If your lurking and feel up to it, please comment. CAPS ARE OK.

but I too am interested in my family's survival, and eating as well,
not necessarily eating well, and I, like you have been reading and
studying the Why to Kay problem, and have learned that seeds when
saved lose their potential 50% the first year and another 50% the
second year. This from a specialist, in a nursery that sells them
in NY area. This would mean if you buy a package of seeds and intend
not to use them until the turn of the century, you success rate will
be in the neighborhood of 25%. I recommend you check into other ways
of how seeds might survive, and let me know. Reify@sitcom.co.il

http://careers.jpmorgan.com/CorpInfo/DoneDeals/deal0796.html

Any thoughts on ssc that might be encourageing? I have owned it at 3 bucks and it is now .75. I must admit I am scared it death.

Everyone *knows* if prices or wages rise, then CB's threaten to put up rates. Why? They still keep printing the stuff. Monetary inflation always increases. Does high interest rates encourage people not to spend ie. keep the stuff at the bank, thus reigning in the inevitable effect of monetary inflation? Is that the other reason to raise rates - to save the 'value' of a currency? The Ruskies have done it and it hasn't saved the rouble...

Lots of questions. I am seeking opinions and facts.

Today, the Editor-in-chief of TheStreet.Com ( TSC ) may have given us one signal to look for to start a turnaround. The following excerpt suggests that Wall Street has started begging for an interest rate decrease. If Mr. Greenspan acceeds to this pressure, it would almost certainly dramatically awaken inflationary expectations. . . and gold stocks.

". . .And the number of people arguing in favor of a reduction in Fed rates as a needed tonic for the stock market is growing. One of my favorite market thinkers, Richard Bernstein, the chief quantitative strategist at Merrill Lynch, has started to talk about the need for a cut in short-term interest rates. I listen to what Bernstein has to say because he has an excellent track record in this bull market. Long before
everyone noticed that the high-quality big caps would be the last dogs standing, Bernstein was advising clients to move in that direction. He pushed people more aggressively toward bonds back in June.

These days he's wondering when the current market volatility will diminish. Based on his assumptions, it won't be anytime soon. He argues that the Fed needs to ease and the yield curve needs to steepen before stocks can snap out of their current funk. . ."

and dropping fast...CHEEZEHEAD should be shouting...

/

Don't look now, but the dollar is down...against almost everything.

Don't pee your pants now. The good fight is about to begin. JUST LOOK AROUND. FEAR AND LOATHING On WALL Street. Je me souviens . Gold 330.

I wish that I could disagree with you, but I'm quite pessimistic after the incessant losses dating back well over a year. My two heaviest gold stocks were Caledonia Mining ( CALVF ) and Pegasus Gold ( PSGQF ) . Between the two, I had almost ten thousand shares... Let me disclose my bleeding:

CALVF was over $9.00 and on its way even higher in the not-too-distant past; and is currently at .15 ( 15 cents ) per share. PSGQF ( formerly PGU ) was well over $5.00 in just the last two years, and is currently .03 ( three cents ) per share!!!!!!!! Although I did not buy either at its high, my purchases average about 1/2 of the high. Pegasus is about to go totally under, erasing all my shares ( and my money invested ) . Although I believe that Caledonia Mining is solid, it is about to be de-listed from Nasdaq because of its low share value. It is still listed on a Canadian exchange; and is quite probably an EXCELLENT buy at current prices.

I've taken losses on ALL my gold stocks. Furthermore, I made the mistake of making LEVERAGED metals investments; and have been skinned alive financially. Almost everything I've done for over 2 years has resulted in a loss...non-stop, incessant, relentless losses for over two agonizing years. When will it ever end??? I made the right decisions for the right reasons, at the WRONG time!!! Let us have empathy for those who lose their asses when the DOW crashes. However, I'll have a difficult time having any empathy for those who have kept PM's artificially depressed beyond what is reasonable. When gold stays at its production costs for so many months, that is IMO nothing more than manipulation.

I only watch the silver market peripherally. SSC seems like a solid silver miner and should go up when gold and silver rise. Seems to me that at $.75/share, I might buy more. Cost-average your holdings and be willing to keep adding to your position until silver makes its inevitable turn skyward. Personally, I like silver common date coins at this time. Stock up for the impending fiat currency crash. Silver dimes and quarters will become the currency of the realm ( IMVHO ) .

Executive proclamations/orders are, and do become law if they cite text of an existing statute/constitutional provision...and congress don't and/or can't reject them.....^s^....

I do some day trading in SSC. At the end of the second quarter they had 14.5 million in cash and silver bullion. Their reserves are increasing and their costs are finally coming down. Even on slow days the volume is several hundred thousand shares. I know...I won't quit my day job.

I feel your pain. I own about 30,000 shares of Pegasus. Even though they are only worth $.04/share, I refuse to sell them. I believe there may evolve a law suit against Pegasus launched by angry shareholders who feel the company and their shares were manipulated. This is just a hunch. What do you think?

Date: Wed Aug 26 1998 16:55
PH in LA ( Mozel: Clarification Requested. ) ID#225408:
Copyright  1998 PH in LA/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
"Date: Wed Aug 26 1998 15:44
mozel ( @Jack ) ID#153110:
Copyright  1998 mozel/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
A certificate is not the thing. A Certificate of Title for a motor vehicle is not the title to the motor vehicle."

Mozel:

Are you OK? Your prose seems to be suffering from more than its usual lack of lucidity. If I may ask; what, then, IS the difference between a "Certificate of Title" and the "Title" of a motor vehicle?

####### The Title is the evidence of legal ownership. A Certificate of Title is a document issued by a government agency authorizing you to register a motor vehicle. The Title to a car or truck is also known as the Manufacturer's Statement of Origin. It may also be called a Manufacturer's Certification or Verification or Declaration of Origin. If a store gave you a Certificate of Receipt, it would not be the same thing as a Receipt, would it ? A certificate of a thing is never the thing itself. It is a fallacy to think it so and an impossibility for it to be so.

The State, having the Title in its possession, is the legal owner of your car. You are just allowed to use it until the State wants it.

While I have your attention, would you mind also clarifying the following:? "...when Kings and Popes wanted knights to go on Crusades and knights needed gold for armor."

If the "Certificate of Title" is not the "Title", surely the gold is not the armor, either. Did the knights need the gold to buy armor or are you really suggesting that they fashioned their armor from gold? Was that solid gold, or gold plated silver, or what?

######### It was beside the point and is immaterial to the process of borrowing whether the knights needed the gold to make armor or to purchase armor. Likewise, the bank doesn't care if you borrow FRN's to buy a silly hat or to make one out of FRN's.

"and under the Laws of the United States applicable thereto".....LOL

I'll check out ECO. I'm going to sell some dec. futures and move a part into stocks so i can get some sleep at nite!! At those kind of prices I can pick up a bunch!!

http://reports.guardian.co.uk/sp_reports/clinton/456.html

Is it too late to sell gold equity stocks?

According to my data, the two lowest levels reached by the Nikkei since the Japanese market topped at the end of 1989 are as follows.

August 7, 1992 14358

July 3, 1995 14485

Near mid-session on August 27, 1998, the Nikkei stood at 14414.

This is getting right to the verge of ultimate meltdown.

I have a page up at The Privateer website showing the comparative moves on the Dow and the Nikkei since the BOJ/Fed joint intervention to rescue the Yen back on June 17 this year. What the charts there show clearly is the fact that the two indices have moved almost in lock step since then.

Both rallied in the aftermath of the intervention. Both rallies topped out ( the Dow at its 9337 all time high ) within one day of each other in mid July. Both have been falling since then.

The action on the Dow and Nikkei for the past ten weeks, and the action in Japan today, are ominous indeed for the Dow.

There is a link to the chart at the home page of The Privteer

My 2 lorrins on why Gold will go up-- A shift of wealth from "paper" to "stuff." This process has occured in SE Asia, and is occuring in Russia and Latin America now. Up to now, Europe and the US have been relatively immune from this process. As I see it, the $ is at an extreme overvaluation. Not to say it couldn't get even more overvalued, just that the risk/benefit overwhelmingly favors Gold.

kapex & IDT - Here is my view of the waves as of 9 PM cst. SPU8 the move down from 1199 to 1048 was wave A. We have done waves a and b of wave B and are now in wave c of B, this wasve should top around Sept 4 between 1120 - 1125, then a wave c decline to 950 - 900.

On Chuck Harder show. Playing on audio continuously.
Dick Gregory says "Clinton will step down minimum 6wks, maximum 90 days"
or be assassinated. Listen to all the gory details. Mindboggling!!
www.chuckharder.com

It's never a bad time to take a profit. : )

are you home yet or just posting from someone else's computer enroute?

It is possible to make seeds last longer. You can store them at cooler temperatures under dry nitrogen, as I recall? You essentially put 'em in sealed cans filled with nitrogen.

I'm sure there are other ways to make seeds last longer. Why don't you do a search on the WWW?

Steve

An Executive Order that implements a duly enacted Statute does not thereby become a Statute. That is an absurdity void of all reason and logic. A statute may have no legal effect until implemented by the executive by order and publication in the Federal Register. In such a case, the legal effect of the order extends only so far as the authority of the enabling statute empowers it.

After nearly a year of agonizing stock market declines and currency devaluations, all that is lacking is for someone to administer the coup de grace and it looms on the horizon: the devaluation of the Chinese yuan.

Asian Intra-day charts at following URL - delete the "en" in word "golden" before Posting to the Internet:

http://www.golden-eagle.com/asian_corner/asian_id_charts.html

Skip,
you are not alone. And you will be less alone as the rest of the market undergoes the catharsis that you have. The primary difference is that they never expected to lose, and were told so time and again by legions of brokers, analysts, and media. Consider ourselves the learned, and the burned. Move up and on from here, and capitalize on those lessons. You are burned but not immolated as masses may be.
You invested in the most basic of fundamentals, which, as you see, have been most violated. This is not mere belief, but a fact.
Thanks for sharing the experience, and may all of us mark that well.
Keep your faith, because in the end, that is all you will have, anyway.
those that have none will be truly beggars.

This is the one to watch for a change in direction IMHO
http://www.iqc.com/chart/default.asp?period=180&time=60m&chart=bar&chart1=bb&stochastics=y&symbol=%24compx

XAU and gold look close to a turn. I have been wrong, at times.

I have been selling gold stocks and buying Prudent Bear. I think there is a good chance that the price of gold will go nowhere for a couple years, and the mining companies will mine themselves out of business. At that point, gold will rally big time, but the mining companies will already be liquidated. I cannot understand why they do not cut production proportional to the reduction in gold price. Instead, they continue to flood the market with cheap gold while fooling themselves with the "cash cost" figure. They are reducing costs by mining only richer ore and cutting exploration. Not good for the long term.

visit your sites. Obviously, there is great significance in watching
these foreign markets, especially the Asian ones, as of late...

I am not very smart but in my 35 years of retailing I have never seen people so scared or so sick of what is happening to our country. Most don"t really know about other markets in the world but they know something is not right and do not know what is going on. When the "Average Jon and Jane" on the street stop buying we have all had it!

Date: Wed Aug 26 1998 22:00
Steve in TO__A ( Hey Reify - Nice to see you're back online . . . ) ID#287337:
Thanks friend for the info, and a pleasure making your acquaintance.

you may all be in better spirits. Yes?

If you have not sold your gold mining shares by now why would you bother? They are not worth much now. Gold lower means nothing but physical will have value ...soon.

The powers that be better get gold up or the world financial structure is as DEAD as gold mining shares and only physical gold will have value.

Scary. Yes?

Tom

I'm wondering if you still hold that SPU8 short or were stopped out at 1101? Or are you now waiting to see 1120-1125 before shorting again. I find that I'm generally better off ( GT 50% ) being in sync with your positions. Best wishes,

What is things got soooo bad because of the strong $US that in order to save the world ( out of the kindness of their hearts ) the Warburg-Rothschild-Morgan-Goldman-Lehman-etc cartel that owns the Fed devalued the dollar. Would they then only have to buy back all those treasuries with devalued dollars?

Wouldn't the world be greatful to thus be saved from the $US catastrophe?

What if having sold all those treasuries in the first place ht Fed was in possession of so many of the dollars that they were in such scarce supply that the prices of commodities and precious metals and such would go down to record breaking lows? What if because of such low prices the central banks, moving furtively were able to buy large amounts of gold to stock up their reserves, which publicaly they hafd been rumored to have been selling? What if they called in their leases?

Gosh, so many what if's.

What if the new world order is almost at hand?

What if all the countries "helped" by the IMF are now basically owned by the central banking system?

What then, my friends, what then?

If the prime rate drops to 2%, how will this effect the price of gold?

I appreciate your droll humor.

Congress is enacting emergency legislation. ( look for "and for other purposes" in the title of the bill ) . State legislatures are likewise enacting emergency legislation. Look at state revenue bills. However, even in this emergency, E.O.'s do not have legal effect without enabling legislation or appropriations after the fact and never are Law.

Did anyone see the Ron Insane-a/Stanley Druckenmiller show today on CNBC from 3:10 EST till about 3:35 EST, curtesy of the PPT? Ron couldn't hold himself back TOO long from the staged, "So, Stanley, and how do you view US equities at this point....blah, blah, blah". What timing!!Market recovered in a flash.

How come the bad news on sees on line ( newswires, market indexes ) never seems to get fully manifested on CNBC? It's like some smooth-over deal, with those clones always smiling at the camera. Unless they mention gold, of course, which is always followed by a disgusted look, or a smirk, or a negative comment. What propaganda!

Pakistan by 2.39% and Sir Lanka by 2.08%... now that will make you fell better...right? WRONG.

Tom

Tom

Mozel good discussion, over my head, considering I am a Canadian.

Your position suggests, that citizen's are much the loser, because so few are aware of their rights. Well the truth is, citizen's such as yourself, are very informed, and do not get the just consideration, for the outstanding interest, and knowledge, you have in your presentation.

Hey, you can attack my positions regarding history,laws, and government, and I will be honoured. No, I will not like to be challenged, to rethink a position, but hell, the debate will be rewarding eh!

Take Care

Shhhhhh. Don't want to talk about it. It might not be good to have the wrong people listening.

at 1087.80//Gold and Silver are down small amounts tonight.

Don't you realize that the bearish tone represented on this forum is a sure sign that gold will rise. We are goldbugs, the last to throw in the towel on our precious. What more accurate signal exists to forecast that the bottom is nearly in? Patience. In another month, there will be an entirely diffcerent tone on this forum.

http://biz.yahoo.com/finance/980826/economy_fe_6.html

Don't the conductors, I mean the Rockefellers, have an expanse near Jackson Hole?

U-S SAYS IRAQ/SUDAN MAY HAVE
STRUCK DEAL TO MAKE CHEMICAL
WEAPONS.
Thursday 27 August, 1998 ( 10:07am AEST )

The United States says it is concerned that Iraq may have struck a deal
with Sudan to allow it to develop chemical weapons out of sight of
United Nations arms inspectors.

The American State Department says it has "evidence of ties" between
Sudanese authorities, Iraq and the al-Shifaa pharmaceutical plant that
was bombed by US missiles 10 days ago.

The U-S launched missile strikes on the factory in Khartoum, claiming
that it was producing an ingredient used for deadly VX nerve gas.

The al-Shifaa plant had a 200-thousand dollar United Nations contract
to provide Iraq with veterinary medicines under the oil-for-food
humanitarian program.

The U-S State Department says the contract could have provided cover
for Sudan to develop exports of chemical weapons to Iraq.

Tom

Just adding my vote of confidence in your position. I pulled up the site in question, and indeed, such blatant misinformation ought to be corrected.

But then, if you look at the sit eagain, you'll see that they are also advocating "Chelation" therapy, a totally disproven and dangerous "therapy" which ll credible studies have shown to not only be ineffective at what the proponents say it will do, but dangerous to the liver, kidney, and bones as well! ( Uh oh, now I've done it, the VooDoo anti science and medicine cultists will be after me now! )

In any case, it's quite clear that "Saints" went up in value about $50.00 each in the past year, while "Bullion" Gold coins dropped about $40.00. This doesn't mean Numismatic coins are for everyone, or even for the majority of Gold investors. Indeed, there are many dealers who are hyping overpriced pre 1933 Gold with phony contrived "confiscation" arguments ( why I can think of one such dealer off the top of my head that is near and dear to this very site! ) .

But to suggest that folks will always do better sticking with bullion coins is of course absurd for anyone who understands and follows the Numismatic market.

LGB

:{

I was going to work this morning, and stopped by the local grocery store to get a quart of juice. Seems like every time I stop by, the line just keeps getting longer. The lady behind the counter said "nobody wants to work any more". After waiting about ten minutes in line I was able to exchange my paper for the quart of juice. I thought to myself, if they paid $20.00 per hour, they might be able to get people to work there. No I thought, the work is very hard with lots of stress. It takes me about 20 minutes to get to work. I have noticed lots of help wanted signs along the route every morning. Seems like more and more every month. I thought to myself, perhaps they will have to raise wages! Oh no,
Alan Greenspan will take care of that. I heard that he is not going to allow inflation. Never mind that the world is melting, contracting and deflating. I am sure that a quarter point drop in the discount rate will do the trick. Stocks will soar to new hights and Dell will hit 300.
What about the War on Gold you ask! Go back to what follows these large deflationary periods ( CRB index ) ( 1978 ) . What follows is a reversal for those who stay in the game. Don,t you see, the U.S. must at some point join in the game. The U.S. will have to inflate in order to stop the deflation. M-3 is the highest since 1970. Read Miltons comments on M-3 in this weeks Barrons! Balance M-3 with World Events ( good luck ) . The market is a living organism that constantly changes. It is getting old and tired from going up since 1981. More money-more money it takes to stay afloat. More money-more money. At some point ( I dont know when it is ) the world will sell dollars. I hear the Russians stash them in their mattress. We will have the exact opposite of what we have today. The potential is huge and worth betting on. There is a war going on. It has just begun. I think I will come up with the Dell/gold ratio- might be interesting to track. CRB lowest in 18 years. I read on the world gold council pages once that all the gold every taken out of the ground, is only 60 yards by 60 yards by 60 yards high. I thought to myself, that can't be right. Surely their must be acres and acres of this stuff. Then I thought about my wifes gold. Not very much I thought. I guess if you melt all that stuff down- no it can,t be right. Buy Dell, never mind that it sells for x times earnings. Everyone will own a Dell. So little gold, maybe I should buy some of that 60 yards by 60 yards by 60 yards high! The War on Gold to be continued...............................................................

Well, it all depends. If everyone knew that rates were going to go down to 2%, they would sell everything to buy bonds. Gold and everything else would tank.
That sort of is what's happening now. The inverted yeild curve implies the world is betting on US recession. Recession brings lowered rates. That and flight money brings a run on bonds and rates go down whether the Fed does it officially or not.
On the other hand, if rate were just declared to be 2% byt the Fed unexpectedly it would bring a windfall to bond holders. They would immediately sell and redeem every bond they had to invest in things bringing a higher rate of supply. The resulting surge in inflation would bring a rise in gold/silver prices which would turn into a price explosion as the massive short positions tried to get covered.

Once again today, we see that highly Bearish stock market sentiment has been BAD for Gold and silver. We have seen the same effect from worldwide currency instability and even political instability lately.

If worldwide economic collapse occurs, and massive deflation with attendant depression and job loss rears it's ugly head, I'm afraid that all those who seem to THRIVE on signs of such a future, will be greatly disappointed in the outcome.

Gold will drop, gold shares will drop, the U.S. dollar will not become worthless by any means, but will be chased instead, and those who think they will somehow best all their "sheeplike" brethren out there by having metal in their posession, will find they have chased an illusion to it's final bitter senseless end.

Better to start thinking in terms of how to flaot all boats higher, than to think you have the only lifboat on a sinking Titanic. If the world drowns, we shall all suffer. IMHO, Gold will offer little if any solace.

A new boom and turnaound in the world economy, coupled with inflationary boosts in money supply, ( and perhaps an extreme political crises ) are the harbingers of higher Gold prices. Not worldwide depression.

With the track record of the past few years, I fail to see why so many on this site seem to light up with glee at any signs of U.S. or world economic collapse. You'll be proved wrong, not right, if things get bad enough.

LGB

mozel -- TOO often, the stupid legislatures do write laws conforming to EOs. Thus, rubber-stamping the 'Executives' wishes. Rule be decree by any other name. They all ought to be strung up by their balls! And even IF the legislatures do not rubber stamp an 'item', who out there is going to do squat about it?

I am, as 5 waves down for an -A-, 3 waves up for a -B-,then 5 waves down for a -C-? IMHO, we have only completed wave 1, of the 1st 5 waves down.
We are in the 2nd wave now. Wave 3 has yet to happen. ( it might be happening now! ) When those 5 waves down are complete, then that will be an -A-. If this decline from the highs were only a correction, then I would expect a A-B-C, 3 down, 3 up, 3 down. If the bull is done which IMHO, it is, then the first decline should unfold as 5 waves down. We haven't concluded wave 2 yet. ( maybe ) What say you?

Caught that Druckenmiller interview. There's an astute
observation posted by Shadowfax at the bottom of this segment,
at 21:01.

I would think paper money would be pretty meaningless to a central bank. I mean, after all, they can issue as much or as little of it as they want anytime they want. They can inflate or deflate it as much as they want. So when one central bank wants to buy or sell something to another central bank, what do they use for money?
When tons of gold are moved through the LBMA, who are the buyers? Many of the sellers, of course, are people convinced gold has lost it's luster because you can get so little paper for it.
Who determines how much paper you can get for it?

Have you guys looked at the NADAC 100 and the DOW transports. Each looks like they have completed 4 waves and are in wave 5 down. I'm confused. Comments. Do you look to the other indices to support or refute your models.

No confirmation that I can find yet. What's
this about. Hurricane Bonnie? Mid East?
Kosovo?
http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a560940.htm

If that doesn't shake your confidence in your position, maybe this will. Sanders is saying that there is no basis in law to justify paying a numismatic premium for a gold coin. He is not saying there is not a basis for doing so in comparative price histories.

If you maintain there is a basis in law to justify paying a numismatic premium for a gold coin, what is it ? [ And before we discuss paying with a bank check, please find out what a bank check is. There is no $10,000 cumulative reporting requirement on purchases paid for by bank check. And please do not use the expression "bullion coin" in reference to any coin which is money. All coins minted by the US mint bearing a $ mark are money. ]

I was short from 1097.50 stopped put at 1103.00....shorted again at 1109.00, used a trailing stop and was knocked out at 1187.00.....may go long but will look to get short at 1120 -/+

I posted this almost a year ago, but what the hell.

At http://www.westgov.org you might be pleased to see
what COULD be considered the nucleus, the merest seed,
the slighest whisper... of an alternate national government.

For readers in western States, I strongly recommend that
you check out the WGA Initiatives link and see how much
is already in place.

you've got to remember that when they say something 'negative' some very powerful people get upset. You can never count on establishment investment advisors to get you out of an investment when it is overvalued.

There are conflicts of interest and intimidation throughout the industry. I saved an article from the Financial Post about how some companies try to squelch bearish articles by investment analysts by threatening to sue them.

- Steve

All we have to do is go over to CNBC, PEI, read Abby and reports by Ted and Andy to read the trite your pitching at us.

Off hand, I only know of two bills of indeminity enacted by Congress. One for the actions of Lincoln before it came into Session and one for the actions of FDR before Congress came into session. After FDR, Congress changed inaugruation day so no more Presidents could steal a march on it. If you have other facts, please post.

AZAU: Thank you for your posting. IMO it was sincere, and filled with truth. Unfortunately, truth doesn't seem to be in fashion in 1998.

DUTCHMAN: Maybe it's not too late for Pegasus shareholders to receive some value for our shares. I wonder what would happen to Pegasus shares if gold were to suddently soar into the stratosphere? Maybe that's just wishful thinking... 1998 seems to be the year of punishment for all who believe in PM's and PM stocks. Let us pray that changes before the end of this year...we DESERVE some financial healing!!!

is a contrarian.
I looked at Ashanti ( ASL.NYSE ) .
They have been buying up their own shares for a while. In the past four trading days they bought 354,403 shares of their common at approx 7.30 USD/share.
PE 12.0 Yld 2.5 closed at 6.8125. The are buying for treasury stock, to be sold later at market price. -obviously they think this is near the bottom.
I don't own them, but am tempted.

As an African company, they have been hit later than the north American companies.
To throw approx 2.5 million USD at their own stock, when they really might need the cash soon because of the worldwide currency meltdown says something to me.
Do any of our equities gurus know much about Ashanti?

I posted this almost a year ago, but what the hell.

At http://www.westgov.org you might be pleased to see
what COULD be considered the nucleus, the merest seed,
the slighest whisper... of an alternate national government.

For readers in western States, I strongly recommend that
you check out the WGA Initiatives link and see how much
is already in place.

Yikes, my link to Yahoo wasn't updating properly. I jus refreshed.
Everything in Europe is down by 2-5%!

I wonder if the Nikkei will finally blow. I've been waiting so damn
long.

coin a tender in payment of debt." So, one plus one::: Are the bodies calling themselves State Legislatures the same bodies referred to in the Constitution for the United States of America and if so, how so ?

August 26, 1998
Bill Fleckenstein:
"Fallout hurts gold... All of this fallout didn't help the gold market, as the gold index was down about four percent ( gold itself was down only half a percent ) . Maybe after this panic puking, gold stocks might finally be reaching a bottom as the rest of the financial markets get pummeled. ---------"

"-----The other, more moronic article was in the editorial pages of the Wall Street Journal, entitled "Deflation is Nothing to Fear" by Gary Schilling. He winds up saying that fortunately, the good deflation of excess supply is much more likely than the bad deflation of the 1930s. That is like saying six is different from half dozen. The Wall Street Journal has had a spate of terrible editorials, starting back on March 30 with one entitled, "Are Stocks Overvalued? Not a Chance." Then on May 30 they published one called, "Let's Burst 'The Bubble Theory.' Then on July 30, "Growth Forever," Larry Kudlow wrote one that said, "The economy is safe, even if Clinton isn't." August 14 had one that said, "Asia's Crisis is Fueling the U.S. Boom", and now we have one that says, "Deflation is Nothing to Fear." These articles will be keepers. In a few years we will look back and wonder how adults, supposedly experts, could possibly write this garbage. The Wall Street Journal is spewing out horrendous dis-information on its editorial page. You should read this stuff just to understand the lunacy that is out there. The article in the Financial Times is a much more sober and realistic view.
Problems have been brewing for over a year, and we have real problems as we are butting up against bubble valuations. Pretending this isn't the case, as the Journal is trying to do, isn't going to help anyone get prepared. I feel like I have to vent. It is asinine that a paper with the readership and quality of the WSJ can print this garbage with no
counterpoint. It is an editorial page, but they should show the other side. "
William A. Fleckenstein