NEW YORK ( AP ) -- President Clinton wants the government to offer financial incentives worth hundreds of millions of dollars to Wall Street firms and small businesses to resurrect the economies of underserved rural and urban areas from Appalachia to Harlem. The president is to announce the proposals Friday at an economic conference organized by the Wall Street Project, an initiative of Jesse Jackson's Rainbow/PUSH Coalition. The project's mission is to expand business opportunities for minorities and women. The proposals, which will be included in Clinton's budget plan, are the culmination of talks Clinton has had with Congress, federal agencies, community groups, finance experts and Jackson, who has been pushing for them. Jackson particularly wants to see agencies created that offer the same kinds of incentives the government now offers U.S. businesses going overseas.

http://www.newsday.com/ap/rnmpfn14.htm

--

That is IT ! I might get kicked off the forum for this one. RANT ON: You commie pinko bastard. You dare take tax money OUT of my home in Appalachia, take it to Washington DC, turn around and send it to a bunch of jackasses in New York City to try to inspire them to come down and help us poor pitiful folks in the rural mountains ? You slimy piece of AHHHHHHHHHH. My town couldn't even get 300K$US together to build a much needed parking garage and your dumb ass is sending hundreds of millions of dollars to New York in the hopes that it'll some how end up back here. Enough already, it don't even pay to talk about it. RANT OFF.

I wish I hadn't even hit the submit button on that last message, my apologies to the forum for ranting. Really, please accept my humble apologies, it won't happen again.

Eldo
Greetings. Someone is selling coins, 'cos I'm buying them downunder. I just don't get it. Every time I go to my local coinshop they've bought more coins from people walking in off the street. Even got another 1/2oz Aussie Pt Koala yesterday, a beautiful 1 oz Krugerrand with that old Kruger geezer on the obverse, as well as some kiwis and nuggets. Someone is selling, but who?

goldbaron
You, sir, are a scholar and a gentleman. I salute you with the traditional Kitco Great Gulp & Puff, indeedy!

All
I don't know nuffing about coins, really, what premium should one pay for a 1921 St Gaudens in good, uncirculated condition? I usually avoid numismatics in favour of bullion coins, knowing next to nothing about numies, I pay near spot for most of my precioussssss.

Envy
I hope you know Terry Allen's "Truckload of Art" about a truckload of art from NY city touring the country to show the peasants what are really is. The truck tipped over, caught fire, with noone around to see it, such a shame.

what *art* really is.

The_artfuldodgaur@tor

January 14, 1999

Argentina Gold raises stakes in battle with Barrick

TORONTO, Jan 14 ( Reuters ) - High-flying Canadian gold miner Argentina Gold Corp. released on Thursday a new set of drill results in an effort to galvanize shareholder resistance to a hostile takeover by rival Barrick Gold Corp. .
http://www.freecartoons.com/ReutersNews/CANADA-GOLD.html

Nah, hadn't heard that. *grin*, kinda funny. At least if someone would have watched it burn it would have been performance art. We do, here in Virginia, have a lot of talented artists of course. Most are rural artists painting wildlife scenes and other things I think are boring, but there are some really "out there" folks too, sort of a Northern Exposure kinda thing going on. Very good local music, I've always been impressed with that.

sitting in a bunker, here behind my wall...
waiting...

-c

Envy
Which part of 'Giney you in?

Little town up in the mountains of Virginia, west of everything, east of West Virginia *grin*. The county I'm in actually touches West Virginia. It's actually a valley, the Shenandoah valley, very pretty.

Why that's what I intend to do - buy it - Gold of course....

That snip was not of my writing, I just passed it along.

As to the POG, I remember joking the year before last that the POG would not take off till I got onboard.
I have never owned physical but intend to.
And I haven't been able to buy physical till my home was sold.

Well now my home is sold and very soon I'll have the neccessary cash to purchase lots of it.

So soon I'm going to be on the greatest goldrush in history.
I am very greatfull for the POG waiting for me before this happens.

We shall watch this market together yes???

Settlement date's on the 20th Feb so I'll have to find a new way to watch the web as we travel around Australia.

http://www.wired.com/news/news/politics/story/17350.html

WASHINGTON -- Ever thought of slapping up a Web page devoted to gold prices? Got an urge to vent about those overpriced pork bellies?

Be careful. Unless a public-interest law firm wins a trial scheduled for 29 March, you could face a US$500,000 fine and five years in federal prison.

New regulation would require banks to spy on their customers for Uncle Sam

WASHINGTON, DC -- A new government directive will force banks
to spy on their customers and report any "unusual transactions" to
federal investigators -- and there's less than two months left for
Americans to try to stop it from taking effect, the Libertarian Party
warned today.
"Under the so-called Know Your Customer rule, bank tellers can
quiz you about where you got your money and how you plan to spend it.
And if your answers sound suspicious, they can report you to federal
law enforcement agencies," said Steve Dasbach, the party's national
director.
"This new regulation will turn your local bank into a branch of
the federal government's civilian surveillance apparatus. It's the
ultimate invasion of your financial privacy," he said.
The Know Your Customer law has been proposed by the Federal
Deposit Insurance Corporation and is scheduled to go into effect on
April 1.
It will require banks and other financial institutions to
develop customer profiles, monitor bank transactions, and report to the
government any "unusual activity" -- such as large cash deposits or
withdrawals.
Since "unusual activity" could include depositing a Christmas
bonus or inheritance, or withdrawing money to buy a house or car,
ordinary Americans could find themselves trying to prove to agents from
the FBI, the Internal Revenue Service, or the Drug Enforcement Agency
that they are not drug dealers or money launderers, said Dasbach.
"This law would turn every bank teller into a government
informer and everyone with a bank account into a criminal suspect," he
said.
The Libertarian Party opposes the Know Your Customer regulation
for numerous reasons, said Dasbach.
* Your banking habits are none of the government's business.
"In a free society, the government has no business even asking
where innocent Americans get their money or how they spend it, much
less coercing businesses into secretly monitoring your bank account,"
he said.
* It's an illegal, warrantless search that violates the Fourth
Amendment.
"Monitoring every bank account to check for laundered money is
no different from pulling over every driver just in case some are
intoxicated, or searching every home to check for stolen goods," said
Dasbach. "It is unconstitutional -- plain and simple."
* It could subject your money to asset forfeiture.
"If you can't immediately prove you're not a criminal, the
government could seize your money under asset forfeiture laws," noted
Dasbach. "Instead of being the safest place to store your money, banks
could become the most dangerous place -- since Uncle Sam's bank robbers
can seize it at will."
The Libertarian Party has joined other civil-liberty
organizations and business groups like the ACLU, the California Bankers
Association, and the Free Congress Foundation to prevent this law from
taking effect, said Dasbach.
The FDIC has set March 8 as the deadline for public comment
about the proposed regulation -- and Americans need to let the
government know what they think about this
"Prove-You're-Not-A-Criminal" law, he said.
"We need to flood the FDIC with letters, faxes, and e-mails
demanding an end to Big Brother Banking," said Dasbach. "Americans need
to launch a Know Your Constitution program -- to remind these federal
bureaucrats that they have no right violating our privacy and dignity
this way."

To comment on the Know Your Customer regulation, write: Robert
E. Feldman, Executive Secretary, Attn: Comments/OES, Federal Deposit
Insurance Corporation, 550 17th Street NW, Washington, DC 20429. Or
fax: ( 202 ) 898-3838. Or e-mail: comments@FDIC.gov.

The Libertarian Party http://www.lp.org/
2600 Virginia Ave. NW, Suite 100 voice: 202-333-0008
Washington DC 20037 fax: 202-333-0072

http://cbs.marketwatch.com/news/current/erdman.htx?source=htx/http2_mw

http://206.67.59.5/wwwboard13/messages/2244.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/business/the_economy/newsid_255000/255432.stm

Gold PM fix US$294.7

All
Received long letter from Teddo yesterday. Building of Paradise@Swans_Island progressing a little slower than planned {always the way} & has been pushing himself hard day and night since May to finish their 2700 sqr ft post & beam house. It sounds very beautiful, Oak and Cedar and granite, every nail hes hammered in himself. Only one cladding on so far so they're still living in the basement, wich itself also has a spectacular view of the islands and out to the Atlantic, electricity now on, and no longer reliant on wood-burner. He says every call from Swans Island, Maine is a toll call, so if/when he gets back on the Net he will have to watch his time online.
[Can anyone suggest an alternative for internet access from Swans Island? Hed appreciate hearing of one]
He is waiting for ANOTHER dip in NEM and hell be buying again...
He says Hi to all his mates at kitco, Nick, StudioR, novice, cherokee, Earl, and all the rest of the great folks at kitco. He also said tell B that his padres and Lakers etc etc SUK. Also, Klinton Suks. &

GO GOLD!

bananarep . . Thu, Jan 14, 9:05PM CST ( -0600 GMT )
Sammy, did you know that during the crash of 1929 there were never more than
4 down days in a row?

bananarep . . Thu, Jan 14, 9:44PM CST ( -0600 GMT )
Elroy, I am not even totally convinced we see lower lows tomorrow. We may
have made a double bottom today that will result in a rally---a rally and up
finish tomorrow is high on my confidence rating though.....unless we truly
are going into an ****unprecendented*** crash

I just checked the map and Swan Island isn't that far off the coast, only a few miles. If Teddo has line-of-sight back to land from the roof of his house he should be able to install a wireless ethernet unit. If he does, that'll get him to dry land and he can probably get a better deal there. Actually, the best solution would be to find someone who already has constant internet access to their home or business, someone he can see, and he can do the same thing and use their net connection. I'm just figuring with that suggestion that service is more widely available on the mainland than it is on the island. Does he have neighbors ? Do they want net access too ? It's a lot easier to pay for if you've got a bunch of people in on the deal.

Envy
Thanks for your thoughts, wireless thernet? Can you advise manufacturers? Does he need a transmitter? Who receives on the Mainland Ooops... out of my depth...help...glug...glug

I'll ask him about number of netnicks on Swann's Island. I understand it's a sleepy little place...

It's wireless, spread spectrum so it doesn't require an FCC license to operate. With line of sight it'll get you quite a few miles regardless of what the weather is like. I'm using it here at my house to get across town to a business that provides bandwidth to me. It's fast, about 3mbps. You have to have an "access point" that sits in the center of all the places that you want to connect together, and one or more "bridges" that can all see the access point. A complete system can hook up about 16 different locations, they share the 3mbps but you can boost it up to like 21mbps by adding more access points at the center. Access point installed runs about 2K$US, bridges installed about 1500$US. There are other options, but that's a real good one, especially if you don't feel like digging fiber across to the neighbor's house. Best thing about it is once you've bought it, it's paid for, works free forever more.

http://www.breezecom.com

Tell Ted Satellite is about $100 per month unlimited time but still need ISP but only to post/trade, maybe only a few minutes a day. Check out DSS Website.

Actually it's probably a better idea to listen to Roebear's suggestion. I'm so used to over-killing bandwidth that it's not even funny. Here at the apartment I've got a 3mbps wireless connection, the house is wired with 10base-T and fiber, and I've got four different computers and printers all over the place. This is probably the only house in the world that has extension numbers and voice mail on it's own internal telephone system. I like the wireless stuff though, I can take the laptop anywhere downtown and it's still online via a PCMCIA wireless ethernet card. The life of a software engineer.

Uh Oh ? Something happened ?

Yes. Attack of the killer short manipulators. Making their raid after the close in Austrailia and before the open in London. Dark deeds afoot in the middle of the night.

They hit gold ?

Gollum
What are you watching?

Alas abscess is frequently if incorrectly spelled abcess in America. I can find no dictionary reference to support abcess, though I can find medical text that spells it incorrectly.

However my word Abc a noun : statement of the facts still works

And although I can not use any of the words you or Silverbaron mentioned, I can point out the word ABCEDARIAN as in:

ABCEDARIAN POEM

A poem having verses beginning with the successive letters of the alphabet.

http://shoga.wwa.com/~rgs/gl-a.html

also

abc

1. An imperative language and programming environment from CWI, Netherlands. It

is interactive, structured, high-level, and easy to learn and use. It is a general-purpose

language which you might use instead of BASIC, Pascal or AWK. It is not a

systems-programming language but is good for teaching or prototyping.

ABC has only five data types that can easily be combined; strong typing, yet without

declarations; data limited only by memory; refinements to support top-down

programming; nesting by indentation. Programs are typically around a quarter the size

of the equivalent Pascal or C program, and more readable.

http://www.dictionary.com/

and

ABC soil

noun a soil made up of three distinct layers, the A or top layer being humus and organic matter, the B

layer being clay and oxidized material, and the C layer being loose rock and mineral materials.

http://machaut.uchicago.edu/cgi-bin/WEDT_WN.sh?word=abc?query=Search&searchtype=float

IF I can still get the prize, you can contact me at corvus@cheerful.com

Gold was down over a buck too. Coming back a little now.

RIO DE JANEIRO, Brazil ( AP ) -- Brazil insists it is back to business as usual after a currency devaluation sent markets plunging, forced another Central Bank official to resign and led investors to take more than a billion dollars out of the country. As if to drive home the point, President Fernando Henrique Cardoso resumed his vacation Thursday, flying off to his ranch on Brazil's Atlantic coast. Presidential spokesman Sergio Amaral said Wednesday's surprise devaluation was a necessary adjustment to an otherwise firm economy and called the market reaction "panicked, excessive and exaggerated." "The facts show that there is no reason for the volatility because things are going ahead," Amaral said. Central Bank President Gustavo Franco resigned Wednesday and his successor announced a 7.6 percent currency devaluation. The move raised fears that the financial crisis that has battered Asia and more recently Russia has not gone away, and could bring down economies in Latin America. Traders also worry that U.S. multinational companies operating in Brazil could take a big profit hit.

http://www.newsday.com/ap/rnmpfn1h.htm

Survey of currently available wireless RF modem products suitable for wireless LAN and MAN applications:

http://hydra.carleton.ca/info/wlan.html

You ever get the feeling that something really bad was about to happen for no reason at all ? Weird. It's probably nothing, something I ate. Away to my warm bed for what I hope will be a restful winter's sleep.

For Thursday 14th Jan calculated from data published in today's FT.
Period------------1- month--------3- month--------6- month---------12- month
Gold Lease Rate---0.70---------------0.88-------------1.15-----------------1.56
( Change ) ------ ( + 0.04 ) ------- ( + 0.03 ) ------- ( + 0.06 ) ----------- ( + 0.08 )
Silver Lease Rate---1.05--------------1.88--------------2.71-----------------3.14
( Change ) ------ ( 0.00 ) -------- ( - 0.05 ) --------- ( - 0.05 ) ------------ ( - 0.05 )

Lease Rates are also available at http://mitsui-gold.com After today I will not be posting Lease rates at this time each day but will give the usual weekly summary Saturdays at 10:10 Kitco time from FT data.
If occasionally I see anything dramatic happening in the FT data during weekdays I will post it at 04:00 kitco time.
Aurator........Thanks for your kind remarks yesterday at 05:00. Let's hope gold will go up from A to B to C before too long.
Regards..............Dabchick

Based on rising lese rates Rhody perdicted that the price of silver would fall very soon. His assesment of the situation was yesterday and here we have a six cent drop in silver to below the $5.10 level. Apparently there is a gap at $5.04.

The XAU and the So African Gold indexes are below their 50 and 200 day moving averages. I'm trying to keep my finger off the buy button until the XAU can rise when the DOW falls. Recession must be reducing industrial demand for metals; net investment demand has to make up the difference. In the case of silver it would not require too much. As I noted before, half the value of the trading in Yahoo in a single day is equal to the value of all the silver production in a year. But so far for some reason I don't understand big money does not seem interested in taking a sufficently large position in silver to scare the shorts. The bears are used to winning and I suspect smell a run on $4 as soon a GNP in the US turns down.

CJS, Envy, Roebear,

Thank you. All info greatfully received, I'm going to try to work out the best and easiest way for Teddo to get netted. One question, what is the abbreviation for Maine?

I'm looking for hardware/service providers nearby Swan's Island, no point in hunting out one in Ca, eh?

TIA

http://customer1.barchart.com/custom/midam/1605.htm

http://www.constitution.org/amprnet/amprnet.htm

"You commie pinko bastard", Last time I heard that was from my Dad in the '50's. Nice memories. Good post also. :- )

I know of Silver Eagles, Onzas de Plata from Mexico with the angel and eagle and snake on them. I know about Maple Leafs, but they don't appeal to me. Are there any other bullion type silver coins? I don't like people heads on coins. I like angels, eagles that are not bald, and neat pattern type things. Oh I like women. Whole ones not heads only. As in Liberty on Silver Eagles and golden eagles. thers gonna be a sale! i think i hope

8-28-29 to 9-5-29, final Dow spike 15 points, 2.46% of total Dow
8-18-87 to 8-28-87, final Dow spike 67 points, 3.88% of total Dow
1-4-99 to 1-14-99, final?? Dow spike 468 points, 4.85% of total Dow

Although this might be considered a shameless plug since I am connected with the company, you might find something interesting at
http://www.cctv-wavelength.co.uk
( PC Links, CCTV security, Manportable etc.. )

I'm sure goldbugs can find a use for these things...

Most of the Pinko's in Foggy Bottom don't remember communism, just substitute dummycrat same thing

Notice the timing of the silver drop? Somebody decided to do their selling during the thinest possible market. I guess they weren't interested in getting the best price, eh? More like the largest pulldown.

This is the best reference I know of, for large silver coinage:

Large Silver Coins of the World
ISBN 0-87341-166-8

It is available through the publisher at http://www.krause.com or bookstores barnesandnoble.com, amazon.com, and if you're lucky - your library will have a copy so you can save the 60 bucks. In any case, if you are starting to collect silver coins, you need to take a look at this reference.

http://nt.excite.com/news/r/990115/04/business-brazil

http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/990115/ch.html

CJS, Envy, Roebear, All
Keep those thereal links coming!! I've been looking at satellite datatransfer for my own Co, but the radio bands I'd not considered. Gee, and I built a crystal set as a kid.
What's the cheapest/best way to connect Teddo to the world?

Aldebaran
Catch a falling star--put it in your pocket---
Now, it just so happens that there is a beautiful and relatively unknown series of Silver dollar NZ coins minted by the Reserve Bank of NZ in the eighties depicting several of our native birds. Several fantails have found their way into the hands of kitcoites already, they might like to comment on the fineness of the minting. In fact I picked up a few more fantails today as I left my eftpos card at the coin shop yesterday and had to return today.

There are about 8 native birds in the series. It will take about a week before I can scan them and post, I don't have a scanner. I buy them way above spot, but just think what the original buyers of the 1980 & 1981 coins were paying!

Fred@Vienna
They reckon the Sestertius you sent downunder is genuine. More in an email later.

For some unfathomable reason, Donald's call of a DOW top
is disquieting to me at 3:42AM, this Friday morning. : )

Note the question marks after the word final. I just wanted to point out that the time frames of 10 days or so are the same and the percentages are what you might expect for a top at this time. The big dropoff would be six or so weeks away if the pattern holds.

I am withdrawing your invitation to the DOW 10,000 party. Also please turn in your cruise ticket.
.............................
Right buttock...er...shoulder nearly formed. Perhaps low 280s before the turn. Stochastics still heading down. POG below 278 all bets off.

http://www.digisys.net/futures/chart/ts_cha70.gif

http://www.bloomberg.com/bbn/topww1.html

TUFF DATE!!!!! Very High Premium!!! In your stated condition I would, without actually seeing it, start the price at approximately $30,000 USD

I would still like to go to your Dow 10,000 party. I will be 114 then and qualify for the senior discount on the cruise ship. Sounds like fun.

That site you posted earlier has an unrestricted virtual directory structure.

What was the url of the site that linked to the silver chart?

tia

Goldbaron
Oh. I shall re-check the condition in the morning. It is not slabbed nor am I confident with condition. But she looked beautiful and untouched under my loupe. Thank you.

Nick@C
What's this I hear on NZ radio about an Aussie couple who decide to get married in, ahhem, the nude?
It seems they are rebelling agin the high cost of Wedding dresses, reception and breakfast. They are asking all their guests to appear in the nude too, so expect to have to cater for very few.

Now, if I was a merkan, I'd be very afraid of invasion, not just by the natives of Nude Sealand, but also by the nude natives of Stralia.

Got Figleaf?

Gleaned from the Gold Mining Thread at SI

To: Bill Murphy ( 26213 )
From: Richard Harmon
Thursday, Jan 14 1999 9:15PM ET
Reply # of 26248

OT
Got it!:
NREA Denver.
A new "cool car" was tested to reduce the effects of sunlight created heat in our cars, reducing the need for auto A/C, and saving gasoline. A new auto glass ( currently being made by PPG ) is a sandwich of traditional glass with a layer of SILVER .000006 thick to reflect solar rays.
It will be available in all auto glass by 2000 to reduce interior car temps. by up to 60 degrees.
I measured the glass on my wife's S-10 Blazer, and after some math found that the amount of silver to accomplish the job on her car would be .28 oz. Based on 1996 figures, this would increase silver demand by 59,000 pounds a year. Now, If only 2/3 of all cars sold in the USA are A/C ready, that would be 39234 oz extra demand a year of silver. Now we know what Buffy knows. ( posted July 27, 1998 )

http://cnn.com/US/9901/10/y2k.poll/index.html

Nearly half the people polled will pull some cash out of the bank prior to Y2K.

http://dailynews.yahoo.com/headlines/wl/story.html?s=v/nm/19990115/wl/china_36.html

Equadorian Sucre, Colombian Peso, Venezuelan Bolivar, Uruguayan "old"
Peso, Paraguayan Guarani, Guyanan dollar, and Surinam guilder. One
might ask...what's left?

http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/990115/bg.html

use min density to "zoom" in it was MidAm Custom charts
http://www.midam.com/ecb/mdmold.htm

...who may be interested in investment is a metallurgical grade lime/limestone deposit.

The geological resource ( inferred/indicated ) is the order of 4,000 million tonnes, the mineable reserve the order of 2,500 million tonnes.

The project was proven up during the 1960's, and held under a Ministerial reserve, and recently three exploration tenements were excised out of the Ministerial Reserve.

The project is a "one and only", and hasd substantial upside given the development of a number of iron pellet plants currently under construction in Western Australia. Other possible markets are Quick Lime, cement, and in the developing lateritic nicekl projects in Australia. the site location has immediate access to sea harbour facilities, and other potential markets exist in India, Indonesia and other SE Asia countries.

Expression of interests to:

haggis@ludin.com.au

Oche aye the noooooooooooooo...........

Haggis

http://www.midam.com/ecb/mdmold.htm

additionaly 850 000 oz according to my calculations.
The Ballard fuel cell uses a silver battery system and I
suspect that will involve more ozs per car than your silvered
window glass. And I hear that superconducting electrical
cables require silver sheathing that amounts to thousands of
pounds per mile of cable. Even if photography is digitized,
the 270 million oz freed up there, will be a drop in the bucket
compared to the demand for silver in sheathing superconductors.

All assumes we don't descend into a depression that terminates all
industrial demand. Perhaps the game has been to drop the price
of silver down to that of copper, so it can be used in these
new ways. It has been dropped below the price of cobalt, and
that's a base metal!

Speed
I read a few years ago, probably in "The Great Silver Bonanza' ( wonderful book, if premature ) that the silver heating strips that clear ice and condensation in the rear window of cars was gonna be the Great Fillip for silver.

It ain't happened.

Also that silver lining in the glass of Sky Skrapers [for heat retention/reflection] was gonna consume massive amounts of Ag.

It ain't happened.

It appears to mois that Ag is an industrial metal with strategic demands, and that Pt is the same. But Gold, our dear mistress, Gold, appeals to human beans like no other substance in this sweet gold world.

Gold is set apart from the hoi polloi of other metals.

For Gold is invariable.
Gold is unchanging.
Gold is universally appealing.

Gold speaks equally:
to an illiterate peasant in India,
to a village Frenchman who remembers the Boche,
to a frightened Cambodian Refugee,
to a wily Chinese Merchant,
to a gabby [in matters unimportant] Antipodean aurator,
to a Middle American Depression child,
to a Malaysian Jeweller,
to a labourer in The Black Townships of SA
to a Scottish Geologist in Australia
to a Guinean Craftsman
and
a New York matron.

Gold is the great leveller.

Don't give me advice! Give me Gold!

----------

OTOH

Gold is dead.

Har. Har. Har.


Yeah. Sure.


mock_turtle_soup_aur@tor

http://infoseek.go.com/Content?arn=a0853LBY311reulb-19990115&qt=gold+silver+platinum+palladium+rhodium+-olympic+-olympics+-medal+-medals&sv=IS&lk=&col=NX&kt=A&ak=news1486

hope this doesn't blow margins out.

golddkm ( South American currencies not worth a red cent include: Chilean Peso, ) ID#432148: Equadorian Sucre, Colombian Peso, Venezuelan Bolivar, Uruguayan "old" Peso, Paraguayan Guarani, Guyanan dollar, and Surinam guilder. One might ask...what's left?

Tick, tock, tick, tock..........

http://www.europa.com/~blugene/deficit/debt.html

North America......that's near South America ?!

Och aye,

Haggis

So, what happens when the "world" cannot afford to "buy" US debt ?

tick, tock, tick, tock.......

http://www.europa.com/~blugene/deficit/debt.html

I hope N.Z. is treating you well!

Well, looks like we have opened up the chute on the All Americas tobaggan run. Icy course ahead .. down, of course.

I wonder who paid/threatened them regarding timing this. Notice it didn't happen all Fall till just into the new year? Euro stealth indeedy-o.

Time to get to higher ground, compadre's. Looks like nasty weather ahead.

Thanking you.

It works fine for me - a good find.

I was wandering around in here.
http://customer1.barchart.com/custom/
Where there is a wealth of stored charts.
And you just gave me the key to them all.

Cheers Nick

Gold can do many "things", but it cannie speak......

I once knew a Prospector, who died a few years ago RIP, who use to "pay" the Girls in Hay Street with "little" gold bars.....aye, GOLD can do many things......but it cannie speak.....

Och aye,


Haggis

ps.........want to but a lime mine....AU$180 per tonne for Quick Lime.....times 2,500 million.....98% calcium carbonate purity.......equals..........

It tooks like the Egyptian market is in de Nile. Down -24.74%

Got sarcophagus?

Sell bond. Buy gold. Take delivery. Lower gold price in US dollars = opportunity to swap paper for metal ( if it ever happens ) . We need to remember that those who ride this beast do not have complete control OR mastery. There are many competing wills in this world: many competing agendas. We shall see.

Market Volatility due to wave two of the financial hurricane?

Fox-man
Glad you enjoyed reading my post, I enjoyed writing it.

Funny how the great illiteratati of the so-called end of the 20th Century, actually are writing again. Here we are, writing, writing, writing. Fortunately, many more are reading, reading, reading..

We have turned off the TV, and are playing parlour games with others who enjoy the same game. Hereabouts, the game is GOLD. Elsewhere the game can be:
cats or lighthouses,
Elvis or plumbing,
disease or The Green Lantern,
cooking or Greek Poetry,
Philosophy or pornography,
Nostradamus or weaving...

The world, or at least the human beans in the world, are talking to each other like never before. Long may it continue.

I've always warmed to JTF's vision of humanity, reaching for the stars. Ne'er before have folks talked to each other across the ther. This is rather special, no?

NZ, or at least the bit I live in is hot & humid right now. We're all getting a little bit ratty, waiting for the summer cyclones to ease the weather.
nytolTeddo

ra_ra_ratty_aur@tor

PS anyone seen AU_producer?

!

Today, the UAE said that the euro could become part of an oil pricing system, and the UAE's oil minister pointedly explained that the euro is in competition with the
dollar. Two more stories showed that the euro is now considered a "safe haven" currency, even against the dollar and the yen, and on a par with the Swiss franc.

Up until now the dollar has been the mainstay of large scale international settlement. However, if the dollar is weakened by Latin American contagion, and investors
seek the euro, the value of dollars taken in exchange for goods that form the bedrock of international trade, such as oil, will be seen to drop. Oil suppliers may very
well seek payment in a currency that is expected to be more of a "safe haven" of value. As this process gathers momentum, the notion of multiple reserve currencies
will be seen to be flawed, as only one currency may hold true reserve currency status.

Every little bit helps!

Over the past 10-15 years, the things you have mentioned have helped consume a vast overhang in silver supply. Now the purchase of a mere million ounces by WB can send the market sharply higher. Or I am engaged in wishful thinking....

Cash: small denomination bills and clad coinage

Barter items: Plastic, seed, twine, wire, nails, fastners, pesticides, common ammo, duct tape, lubricant oils, 1# Propane bottles, 20# propane bottles ( full ) , k-1, White gas

You can tell Clinton is innocent of all charges. How can I know you might ask. Easy, with friends like
Larry Flynt, Babs Streisand and Madonna how can he be guilty of even spitting on the sidewalk.
Such unimpeachable character witnesses one would die for; maybe even die because of. So soar gold,
soar on wings of angels, soar with the wild morning breezes, soar heavenward on gilded plumes, reach
for the anattainable sky.

having hit 5.05 a few hours ago. The dollar is sinking against the yen, so much for intervention.

Two days ago something snapped.

And the worlds markets are quivering from the shock of this.

What puzzles me is that we are seeing the signs of this quivering but we have yet to find the news as to why.

Normally Kitco is the place to find out the latest news but somehow this hasn't happened this time.

Is it just me or has something really broken that we have yet to hear about?

In the last few years of watching these cyber-space markets I haven't seen a shudder go through them like the last few days.

What has snapped????

Where's the news????

Cage Rattler: Your post makes sense. If South America and possibly China follow the SEAsia example, all markets will fall for a time. But -- the US markets will become even more popular for a while because there will be nowhere else to invest -- flight to safety.

Eventually the US markets will follow -- but not yet. We are following the 1929 script with variations. US last once again. But as I recall we fell harder when we finally fell.

I sold my funny money Mexican puts with a nice profit. Now I am wondering if I sold them too soon. I am way behind APH in these matters.

volatile day in the financials! T-Bonds are reacting, inversely of course. March T-Bonds hit a high of 127-30 so far. The S&P is now
bouncing back....currently.....1212

An estimated 20 million ounces of GOLD were recovered from mines in Egypt's Eastern Desert between 3600 BC and 2000 BC. Later additional GOLD was recovered from mines in the Nubian Desert ( now part of the Sudan ) . Much later, up until the 5th Century, the Romans continued GOLD mining....that was the reason they were in Eqypt.........

Check outPharaoh Metals Corporation ML:

email.... rock_kicker@bigpond.com

Also.... http://www.opengroup.com/open/atbooks/287/2879391423.shtml

There is still LARGE potential along the Red Sea...

Och aye,


Haggis

The EURO is alive and well...... and on the subsitutes bench.... we have....GOLD.......

IMHO the euro will never have the status of the dollar. The dollar is backed by the only superpower left and that speaks volumes. Everybody dislikes the top dog,it's a fact of life but oil countries in particular need the U.S. Their survival depends on the U.S. and it's continued use of oil.

Haggis
You, of all human beans, should be able to hear when gold speaks. This is what some of our progenitors have said about gold speaking:


Where gold speaks, every tongue is silent.
---John Ray 1670


Where gold speaks, you may een hold your tongue.
--Torriano Piazza 1666


You may speak with your gold and make other tongues silent.
--Thomas Fuller


I have bought golden opinions from all sorts of people.
--William Shakespeare


A word fitly spoken, is like apples of gold, in pictures of silver.
-- Proverbs 25:11


The tongue of the just is as choice silver: the heart of the wicked is little worth.
Proverbs 11:20


The law of thy mouth is dearer unto me: than thousands of gold and silver.
Prayer Book


How silver-sweet sound lovers' tongues by night,
Like softest music to attending ears!
William Shakespeare


If speaking is silver, then listening is gold.
Turkish Proverb


Gold is an orator.
Barnfield


The exact quotes, their sources and their meanings, together with thrice as many more will be available in aurator's book of Gold Quotations available when the world demands it.

Waiting_for_the_Golden_Dawn_aur@tor___THUD

I've got save room for when Gold gets really "hot" and the kitco posts
come streaming out in "rare" "golden" fashion!!

Yes sir, something snapped. Basically, without going into the dynamics of economic/market crashes, it was the coming of the "second wall" of our financial hurricane. Where first walls come after a long buildup of ever increasing financial stress, second walls come suddenly with little news. They are enough to take one's breath away.

Just like the eye walls of real hurricanes, the onset of the second wall has the wind blowing from the opposite direction of where it left off at the first one.

Instead of interventions to support the yen, we have interventions to support the dollar ( just wait till you see the dollar carry trade, you won't believe it ) .

Just because it's the opposite direction, though, don't feel that what the first wave started to take apart the second wave will put back together. No sir.

The second wave is always the coup de grs.

The Rocks Speak.......


The Rocks Speak

The Rocks Speak, a 300 page book of
essays by Haddon F King commenced to
take form in 1954 and is one man's
understanding of changes in geological
thought over a lifetime's work, by one
who has contributed greatly to those
developments. Part 1 of the book presents
the background as the author remembers
it. Part 2 traces the development of a
broadening view of the subject which,
largely based on work by collegues,
confronts orthodoxy in the broader
geological fields of folding,
metamorphism, and deep
continental-scale fracturing, as well as the development of
igneous-looking rocks and visualising a role for biology in ore
formation. Part 3 is concerned with present thinking and, in
addition to geology, treats problems of national mineral policy and
land use, statistical methods of ore evaluation and fundamentals of
education. This volume of essays is essential reading for all
geologists and students of the subject, as well as those concerned
with ore formation and the search for mineral deposits. It is
recommended for all practitioners and others in the minerals
industry.

ISBN: 0 949106 39 9
308 pp 1989

Price:
$A40.00 Members
$A20.00 Student Members of The AusIMM
$A80.00 Non Members

sharefin: Glad all is well. Good timing on your house, given what may happen to China very soon. With regard to your question, I was actually surprised by how little the US markets have gone down wrt the Brazil situation.

I am also surprised by the lackadaisical action of the precious metals markets to the Clinton impeachment trial and the EURO commission corruption fiasco. I think the use of gold as a proxy to support the US dollar has so gotten out of hand that all else pails in comparison. Now we can use gold price dips such as the one we just had to predict a financial collapse somewhere a few days or so later.

I think another aspect of what is happening is that more dominoes are falling in the deflationary cycle all over the world. We are repeating the 1929 scenario with minor variations in the script. Have you been to the Privateer site to see that the pice of gold is now going down in the Aussie dollar the Japanese yen, and the German mark? Now it seems that gold is looking relatively good only in the US dollar.

Competitive devaluations and trade wars here we come. And DOW 10,000 probably from flight to safety to the US before the US markets really tank. Maybe we are still working on the head of the head and shoulders in the US.

.....what's that smell.............oh, not another Septic Tank.....

to be upon us! I sure didn't expected the "eye" of the storm to be this
long, though. In retrospect, the length of time does make sense. These
types of hurricanes ( financial ones ) take alot longer to play out than you
would expect...

anyone notice how quiet ag has been this week? isn't he in china
week? can't wait to hear his take on this situation.

anyone care to advise on timing of purchasing physical? think next
week will be cheaper???

Don't be afraid to set yourself unrealistic goals: it will be so much more challenging.

Firstly, trey and rssolve the US national Debt....

http://www.europa.com/~blugene/deficit/debt.html .....

If you cannie manage it....don't worry about it .... shave your eyebrows off, and draw them on every morning !

Och aye the noooooooooo.....

Haggis

Wait. I shouldn't be so recondite.

The news was posted here at Kitco. Essentially the Japansese acted to support the dollar against the yen. This was a very important event.

As you recall, the Fed reacted to the liquidity crises last year by raising interest rates. This made the dollar less attractive.

Fear of a falling dollar ( and what happened to LTCM ) had acted to suppress the carry trades which had been engendered by the high dollar of the last few years.

Which in turn brought a respite to the turmoil.

The Japanese intervention signaled a base of support for the dollar.

Which renewed the game plans of the hot money speculators and turned up the spigot of currency flows ( out of Brazil, for one ) .

See?

Feb Gold @ 286.60 ( low was 285.90 ) Mar Silver @ 5.12 ( low was 5.05 )

If you look at the chart of the crash of '29 ( a classical example ) , you can see that the time span between the first wall ( the initial "crash" ) and the second wall ( the end of the "sucker rally" and final collapse into the great depression ) was about two quarters.

http://www.lowrisk.com/image/29crash.gif

We tracking very close. If anything, a little ahead of schedule, but then things have a way of happening faster nowadays.

It's currently at 1233. Would this bounce up be considered a "wave 2" or
"wave b" or what? Help me out Elliott wavers...

03:13 CHINA'S AIRLINE BOSSES ORDERED TO TAKE FLIGHT ON NEW YEAR'S DAY 2000: FT.

TIMELINES OF THE GREAT DEPRESSION:

This page features two timelines: the first for general events of the Roaring 20s and the Great Depression, the second for
leading economic indicators.

But don't take my word for it -- here is the raw data:

TIMELINE OF GENERAL EVENTS

1928

Between May 1928 and September 1929, the average prices of stocks will rise 40 percent. Trading will mushroom from 2-3 million shares per day to over 5 million. The boom is largely artificial.

1929

Annual per-capita income is $750; for farm people, it is only $273.

Stock market crash begins October 24. Investors call October 29 "Black Tuesday." Losses for the month will total $16 billion, an astronomical sum in those days.

Congress passes Agricultural Marketing Act to support farmers until they can get back on their feet.

1930

By February, the Federal Reserve has cut the prime interest rate from 6 to 4 percent. Expands the money supply with a major purchase of U.S. securities. However, for the next year and a half, the Fed will add very little money to the shrinking economy. ( At no time will it actually pull money out of the system. ) Treasury Secretary Andrew Mellon announces that the Fed will stand by as the market works itself out: "Liquidate labor, liquidate stocks, liquidate real estate values will be adjusted, and enterprising people will pick up the wreck from less-competent people."

http://www.scruz.net/~kangaroo/Timeline.htm

The pattern since July has been 4 days down hard and buy the spike low on the 5th day. Today is day 5. Yesterday's close landed right on the 30day moving average, a favorite support area of Oldman and the Avid Traders. Gold often corrects during these falls ( could it be hedge fund activity related to the general market ) . The DOW should recover today and so should gold after early morning pressure. The best buy out there now is Durban Deep which has corrected strongly away from its moving averages. The XAU stocks are way overvalued in my opinion. This rally may not last long but should be worth about 10% on DD.

Thanks. It's a weight off our shoulders and leaves us free to continue with our plans.
- No debt
- Hold physical
- Store foods
- Move to a rural setting.

It looks like we'll stay in Cairns for a while yet before grabbing our swags and going for a wander.

----
I think there's a lot of control and pressure being applied to the markets.
The PPT being active so soon really surprised me.

What is going to come from China?


Gollum
The second wall of the financial tycoon, I mean typhoon?
Welcome to my nightmare.

This side should be very interesting and revealing.
And make for great ringside veiwing.

Brazil seeks IMF, U.S. support as currency floats

BRASILIA, Jan 15 ( Reuters ) - Brazilian Finance Minister Pedro Malan and Central Bank President Francisco Lopes will head to Washington this weekend to drum up IMF and U.S. Treasury support as the world's eighth biggest economy let its embattled currency trade freely on Friday, an official said.

``It's one thing to try and do something like this on your own, it's different when you do it with support,'' the government economic official, asking not to be identified, told Reuters.

( Note: this article is ``in progress''; there will likely be an update soon. )

http://quote.yahoo.com/m2?u

Up 14%

Globex going crazy?

Don't they know which way to bet???


Gollum.
I don't know - I have been pre-occupied of late.
But something smells bad out there and I haven't caught a glimpse of it yet.

I think it's still hidden under the carpet.

I know that I watch what you watch and I knew silver would crash today. But come on, 5.05 for what 5 seconds? I would like to purchase 100 oz of silver today. I want you to short it down to around 4.60. Look, you almost have to try, silver is getting away from you as I type. Enough, quick go borrow some more silver. Hurry.
Thanks in advance.

go silver short
Me and 1 billion Indians are counting on you to save us a buck.

Oh yes, there's plenty under the carpet, fire in the hole as they say.

Luke: "But I'm not afraid."
Yoda: "You will be...YOU WILL BE."

You ever wonder why it's free to chart all these neat things? As you know that site isn't owned by the MidAm exchange. Now I don't know any of the following but it makes sense. Suppose you had the ambitious goal of knowing what commodities lots and lots of small investors were interested in. Why you could set up a free charting service for them. And keep track of how many hits a particular commodity gets. What time frame the people are charting. What technical analysis tools they favor. If it interested you, you could keep track of their ip addresses. Maybe you could figure out who is interested in what. You probably wouldn't need to do that though, just knowing the amount of interest in a given commodity or contract and the tech analysis tools would be worth... well worth at least enough to provide such a nice service, probably a lot more than that. Smart money is ah... well informed?

Different data vendors sometime show slightly different info for supposedly the same information. I use Quote.com quite a bit for some daily and intraday charting and quotes. I looked at March Silver on a daily chart yesterday on Quote.com. For the technical crowd, it showed what looked to be an island reversal for March Silver. If this is actually the case and not an error due to bad high and low prices, then APHs 4.40 target just might be hit sooner than later. Couple this with the fact that the daily stochastics which everyone was drooling over a few weeks ago as bottoming and turning up, have now topped and are turning down, even as the price trys little intraday rallies to try not to fall through 5.05. Any thoughts from the technical crowd? Especially anyone who can verify if the data from Quote.com is accurate or not. Thanks in advance!!

If you want to look at the Quote.com chart, the URL is as follows:

http//fast.quote.com/fq/quotecom/chart?sysmbols=SIH9

When you get the screen, type in the symbol for March 99 Comex Silver: SIH9
Then hit Get Chart
Then click Daily

The national debt will never be re-paid.
Gold doesn't seem to mind. Watch the aerospace and defense industry soar in the next few years,military needs new toys,troops more money and an injection of funds for R/D. I love it.

I was going to send a thank you note to all of you who told me your experiances, but I can't figure out how to grab all the return addresses and send a note BCC to all of them and there are more than 20. I posted a brief thanks, but I posted in the middle of the night a day or so ago, and I fear that most of the people may not read the posts in the morning hours. The ability of consumers to quickly ask other consumers over a wide area about a vendor is very benificial to us consumers. As this becomes more and more prevalent, ripoff artists, bad merchants and over priced businesses will be at a greater and greater disadvantage, while the good merchants who care about their customers will also have an advantage.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/bluesky_exnews/19990115_xex_checkpoints_.shtml

Would someone be so kind to explain to this dummy why the us stock market is up today in the face of the Brazilian 20% devaluation and the hit that the US will take??

TIA

dummy

IS THIS NOT SURREAL??

Brazil devalues and their market and ours goes down. Then they decide they will not support their currency against outflows and their market goes up 25% and our market is up also.

What gives? Did Brazil announce their country is now an internet country? Foreign investors will get killed now. I can see how that might make Brazilians happy as they may now get lower interest rates but they will now default on all their dollar denominated debt. Foreign investors are offered no protection against their assets devaluing in dollar terms. WHy is everyone so happy?

1997.12 5376.79
1998.01 5423.32
1998.02 5464.12
1998.03 5530.11
1998.04 5579.74
1998.05 5613.32
1998.06 5644.14
1998.07 5652.55
1998.08 5712.35
1998.09 5784.98
1998.10 5850.36
1998.11 5924.87
1998.12 5983.11

Everybody is happy that Brazil has stopped wasting their various reserves propping up their money. Less chance the country will go broke.

per Reuters

care less about the destruction financially in other countries, they do not see that they are merely enhancing the financially ravaging effects on themselves in the long run...I remember reading a few years ago how the fellow who was writing the piece was praying that we would not inflate to the 10,000 mark because of the devastating depression that would occur afterwards.

All the intellectual and social babble in the world will not change this as I see it...this will come home to roost and those that are not prepared will be destroyed...it is that simple...

...or can they? In the face of Brazil becoming worthless and Latin America going down with it, the markets rally with joy. I no longer understand nor trust any method of following the markets. I truly give up trying to figure it all out. I am just going to sit back and watch the show from here on out.

Its kind of like knowing the end of a movie before you go to see it. Then, while you are sitting in the Theater, you get confused about the plot; never the less, you still know the ending.

go gold, and make sure you also go silver!

http://www.rollcall.com/commentary/kondracke.html

Are we a superpower? We have nuclear weapons. So does Russia, Russia used to be a superpower, they arn't anymore. Isreal has nuclear weapons supposedly, and their pretty powerful in their region. So possesion of nuclear weapons does that make us a super power? It used to. But India has nuclear weapons, and Pakistan too. And from what I hear their nukes are farily advanced nukes. Not as good as ours or the Russian's but hey nukes are nukes. So then is the US, Russia, India, and Pakistan the four superpowers of the globe? Maybe, but I don't think thats the common perception. Ok well, we got a real strong economy. Strongest in the world. Japan comes in second. So is Japan a superpower? Well it kinda looked like that for a little while. But there is a new country, well not a single nation more like a collection of states. Those Euro people. I don't think they have any Nukes, but their economy is the second largest, easily displacing Japan and if they grow and we grow less or shrink just a tad, they might be a SuperPower. It surprises me a little bit that they have only had their new euro money for just a couple of weeks and those United Arab Emerites are talking about maybe accepting Euros for oil. And hey that euro money isn't even real yet, you can't spend it in a vending machine or put it in your wallet. Whats gonna happen when they start printing some of it. I don't know if euro land is a superpower. Kinda soon to tell, two weeks and all. Maybe superpower is about conventional military. Hmmm, so if thats the case, then is Iraq a superpower, no of course not, unless we base superpower status on brinkmanship, in which case Iraq is a superpower. Well our conventional forces are the best in the world right? well yes, but the best army in the world is no better than the worst if the generals will not fight. What about N. Korea, are they a super power, it looks like their willing to fight, and though their army isn't as good as our army, it's alot bigger. If we end up in a fight with them, we might wipe out half or more of their army. They know that though and it seems to be acceptable to them. We lose on Ranger in some piss poor little nation and we run back home. It's a shame about the Ranger, but he would be sickened if he knew that we abandoned a mission cause a couple of soldiers got killed. So maybe willingnes to use force makes a superpower. But that would mean that we are not one and a mob of teenaged muslim boys in Palistine are. Yea, we used to be a superpower, but I look around and I don't see any superpowers.

That's the one thing that I've noticed with increasing regularity on TV and radio, vulgarity. There is no doubt that ever since the 'Clinton' episodes took to the airwaves, everything else has followed a similar course in to the gutter. It's as if, in order to 'justify' Clinton, all other standards must be lowered. Sad, very sad. I expect the State of the Union speech to be loaded with 'promise, after promise, after new ( bogus promise ) programs to hand out non-existent money. We have to buy them voters back! After all, we're all just like Buba... NOT.

CHINA...

From Today's Gold Mining Outlook: http://www.goldminingoutlook.com/

DIFFERENT DAY, SAME STORY: The stock market continues to decline as
put-call ratios remain low, indicating that nave investors are eagerly
snapping up shares at "bargain" prices. Look, mom, I bought Yahoo below
400! As long as there is no fear in the market, it will continue to
fall. Remember that the greatest danger in the financial markets is
buying any financial asset just after it has made a major top, since it
has a long way to go down, and plenty of time to get there. Meanwhile,
commercials have accelerated their accumulation of COMEX gold futures in
anticipation of a rally in the near future.

In a surprising departure from the brokerage community's neutral to
bearish near-consensus on the future price of gold, Goldman Sachs'
investment bank released its weekly FX report predicting that "the spot
price of gold bullion is poised for an upside breakout." Part of the
reason for such a prediction is their belief that the Australian dollar
will rise sharply against the U.S. dollar, as it is close to breaking
above a downward sloping trendline. A strengthening Aussie dollar will
make Australian gold producers less eager to sell gold forward, as they
will receive diminished U.S. dollar returns.

**********************************

The Brazilian gov't has decided to float their currency every Friday for the rest of the year. On Monday they intend to institute new regulations
on the Brazilian stock market,to help keep it from flucuating more than 50% in any given 4 hour period.
In speaking with officials from the IMF, they have not been able to make a judgement as to weather or not floating the Real has been sucessful. If stocks stay within a 45% band today, they ( Camdussus and Fisher ) will consider it a sucess and are planning on offering Brazil a BONUS -$25 Billion dollars loan at 3.5% interest, repayable de-valued Reals over 60 years.

Both Robert Rubin and Alan Greenspan are undecided as to the Bonus plan and have been ivited to meet with Brazilian authorities next Friday,with Brazils president, for a "FLOATING REAL PARTY" at AMAZON.COM.
in the Amazon basin.

Looks like TV is like alcohol--fewer people are using it. Rather than getting too depressed about things I see the current situation more as a final "blow off". Like gold at $800 back in the '80's. The pendulum has got to the end of its travel and we will now/soon start back the other way.

How many really care now whether or not Clinton gets removed from office? The major networks are not covering The trial of the President of the United States--more viewers for soap operas.

Tells you all you need to know. The future lies with Clinton's replacement ( s ) and not with his future.

Interesting comparisons to present day... Instead of "farming", now the comparable industry is "manufacturing"... The technology has changed, but the impact remains the same!

Anyone have any history for precious metals prices in that period?

I'm involved in a play by email game called VgaPlanets. And for the past year I have been allied with a player in Germany. We have been in email contact nearly every other day, and I think we have become "e-frinds". Yesterday, he called on the telephone. His spoken english is very good, he is an engineer. A bit older than me, I'm 30. A bit wealthier than me, I think maybe a yuppie type if you can say that in a nice way. We spoke about the game and then I asked about the Euro. He said it has not been accepted by the regular people YET. I asked if it will be and he said Oh, yes, but it will take a bit of time, he mentioned several banks had had settelment problems and he was surprised that I already knew this. He said it would help Europe, that before there was so much difficulty with exchange rates that there is no way to project what Europes economy will be like under the Euro, I mentioned that it had become second largest just a bit under the US, and he confirmed that with a bit of pride I think. He said it will change everything. That was my opening I thought and so I said, yes I think it will change the world as much as if France, Germany and Italy together decided to build atom bombs. He immediatly got a bit excited and said Yes, Yes that is exactly why it is so important. Then there was the briefest of pauses, and suddenly I think I felt a gap between us. The distance, the Atlantic between us. Less than a second maybe and he calmed down and said but for now there are some problems and they have to be fixed. He changed the topic back to the game, where we intend to attack the Lizards and maybe the Crystals too, where we are strong allies and friends and there is no fear of discord between us. There was something in my conversation with my friend. An emotion or ambition or something that he didn't wish to share with his American friend, with whom he shares so much personal thoughts. I think the Euro will be accepted by the Germans at least the educated and well employed ones. I am not sure what it is that they feel about it, but I think it means a great deal to them. Of course it is foolish to extrapolate one Germans opinions to represent all of Europe.

If a specific currency is devalued in real terms aganst the dollar is this not inflationary in the host country that is devaluating? are not goods imported from other couuntries going to cost more? world wide inflation figures have to be changing in an upward direction. When does it affect the U.S. or will it?

I had typed China, but had to delete it. I couldn't think of any reason that disqualifies them from super power status. The best I can come up with is that they are not a super power because they don't seem to want to claim the title, YET. They think different than we do. We think about the course of our nation over the next few months. They think about what China will be for the grandchildren of their children. I think, but I'm no expert on China.

I find it interesting that Goldman's, the vehicle to dump gold on the market for RR, has made an announcement that Gold is due for an upside breakout. hmmmmmmmm........ I also find it interesting that they STILL have not set a new date for their IPO. hmmmmmmmmm..... As many people on Kitco have said, things are much worse than they appear.

Now the truth is all out. Brazil devalues and the game is over. Paper worthless, gold crashes sideways.

Picked up a copy of USA Today this AM....bacl page of the money section...article titled "Bazil's problems just the start"...in the fourth paragraph...Equador propping up their curriency with 130 % interest rates...this is how Russia and SE asia started off...IMHO..the Equador domino trips Columbia that trips Brazil that trips Venezuala and Argintina....in same article...Venezuala needs 2 Bil. by March from the IMF

Could somebody brighter than me be able to post this article for all to read?

Just a scary thought..Chicken man..

pointing out that any discussion of "superpowers" would have to include China, based on military, economic and political influence. And you are correct in that they plan in years while the USA seems to plan for the next sound/film byte...

I nominate myself as having the worst spelling and grammar on Kitco. By the way, what is happening with Rhodium? It's gone up quite a bit. Since this would not be a metal that would be manipulated, I'm wondering if that may show that deflationary pressures are ending. Perhaps copper could be looked at in the same way, although I don't follow the price of copper.

oh really, is ANYONE suprised that the Brazil market has gone back up?

They've been taught the inflation-hiding trick that the US uses - as long as all those virtual-dollars ( or virtual-Reals ) keep disapearing into the local stock market - everything is okey-dokey.

Just keep EVERYONE believing that the market will rise forever, and you can keep the scam going forever.

A select handful actually siphon off a small amount to live like Kings and Queens, while the cow-eyed masses, blinded by the headlight glare of their future wealth wait forever...

I only wonder how these elaborate scams finally end.

My own take is that here in the US, all IRAs, Roth IRAs, Keogs and 401s will be nationalized by the FedGov into the new, improved SS.

Spud, sipping vanillia soymilk

Did this mysterious Jeil have anything to say about silver in
conjunction with gold ( on or about Jan 20 ) ???

http://quote.yahoo.com/m2?u

any comments from the bubble queen.

Insanity...or I'm out of my mind. Time will tell. The US markets, by all rights, should crash yet today...fat chance.

Tulips for the poor?

Tom

I didn't get to see good old Abbey, but her sidekick, Ralph Acampora, who said jump in the market 100% a few weeks ago, must be shaking in his wing-tips

I think I'll go downstairs and hit a few levers. That was always fun.

Now up 28% according to CTV in Toronto! Nice one day flip! Can we even imagine Dow, Nasdaq or TSE up 28% in one day?

Like your typo better. More descriptive of those sheep who will be left holding the bag.

I would ask that you take a moment to pray for the people who have invested too much in YHOO, I'm not jokeing, they are hurting right now, and you can not say it is their own fault. You know they were suckered, and you know that they are being terribly harmed. Pray that they see more in their lives than thier stocks. ask that they be given enough strength, for some of them I fear the world is ending right now.

she talking about the the us super tanker ..... I 'm wondering who going to clean this on up.

re:oleman wedn night: "1300 before 1200"

I remember some movie recently...Waterworld....remember what happened to the supertanker in that movie? All those lemmings suckin down that oil and living off that shell of a boat...ravaging the people around the ocean trying to eek out a living. Maybe some similarities exist here. That supertanker went down in the end I do believe....

criminal the manner in which they addressed Y2K...I also feel terribly sorry for the people that are influenced so heavily by the comments made today...it is a sad commentary on the financial times we live in...no fear whatsoever, the IMF is only ONE part of the big picture, etc, etc...

Yours is an excellent question, and one that I have been asking people to explain to me for years & no one has been able to explain it to my satisfaction. Let me give you an example. Although I live in Missouri, and althoguh the US has never had a formal currency devaluation, I have nevertheless been in the middle of several devaluations in other countries, namely Mexico & South Vietnam. Now to my example. When I was stationed in Nam in 1971 there was a Vietnamese currency devaluation. When I first arrived, the exchange rate was 220 or 240 piasters ( dong ) to the dollar. After the devaluation the exchange rate went to 280 piasters to the dollar. My roommate ( in Nam ) & I were paying our hooch maid ( mamma san ) $2.00/week each ( 440 piasters ) , to clean our room & wash our clothes. When the devaluation went into effect, the mamma san came to us in tears about the devaluation. She had seven kids, no husband ( all Vietnamese men had been conscripted into the military ) . Anyway, I told her that we would still pay her $2.00 American ( which was now 560 piasters ) per week. As you can see, it did not cost either me or my roommate any more than before in terms of our paycheck, but in terms of the exchange rate, we gave her a raise. My question is this. If everyone had the same attitude that we did, and still paid the American amount for the Brazilian goods & services, then what's the point ( WHAT IS THE EFFECT ) of the devaluation. To me, there is no effect. Am I correct or am I looking at this all cockeyed?

There once was a central banker from Nantucket
who grew weary of holding gold so he chucked it
He left with a grin...not noticing the den
of goldbugs, who happily into their pockets, did tuck it

Where did you find the information about Ballard's silver usage? I've been poking around the net for over a year looking for that specific info and haven't found it. Thanks

Exports suffer

devalues in relation to the goods and services in your own country. The dollar cannot remain at the top of the heap...when the US currency devalues you will clearly see the personal, destructive forces of a devaluing dollar...

Last time I saw you do this to gold there was a power outage in philidelphia or san fransisco or someplace that wrecked your plans, have a contingency plan as there are power outages due to an ice storm in New York. I can't believe that I'm takeing you seriously about the levers, but he*l I don't know you for all I know you may have some sort of influance. The chart says so.

Missed out on the Brazil gain...Instead am long gold calls, t-bond calls mark calls and yen calls...could be wrong on the whole works...as always time will reveal the truth..watching Lou Dobb's tulip-Marketwatch.com...he's the prez of this little flower...nothing like an IPO for excitement....riskier than options...but could be a ride...like living close to the edge....

Flirting with the hatchet...Chicken man...

"Date: Mon Jan 04 1999 11:26
Mooney* ( Joanna Effect, the Changing World and Volatility ) ID#350194:
Copyright  1998 Mooney*/Kitco Inc. All rights reserved
.... Someone yesterday was repeating the touted bank line of more of the same - low commodity prices ( included Gold/Silver/etc. ) and a minor stock market correction. Yada Yada Yada. Sorry folks. It ain't gonna happen that way. Too many opposing forces that have to be reconciled. Mooney's 1999 Predictions Continue With:
Rapidly Increasing Volatility on All Fronts! ...
For the skeptics:
"It's more fun to arrive at a conclusion than to justify it."
---Malcolm S. Forbes

( I hear some exchanges in NY are on back-up power supplies )

PLease give me an example. Look, if US companies buy, for example, some comodity from a Brazilian company for $50.00 US ( which is XX Brazilian dollars ) , & the Brazilian money is devalued by 50% ) . If the US company is still willing to pay $50.00 US, which is in actuality now worth 2 timess XX Brazilian, then where is the effect? I honestly can't see an effect. What is the effect?

PLease give me an example. Look, if US companies buy, for example, some comodity from a Brazilian company for $50.00 US ( which is XX Brazilian dollars ) , & the Brazilian money is devalued by 50% ) . If the US company is still willing to pay $50.00 US, which is in actuality now worth 2 timess XX Brazilian, then where is the effect? I honestly can't see an effect. What is the effect? I can see an effect if the US company is unwilling to do that. Is that what you are saying, is that US companies absolutely will not do that?

That jiggled things, but not very nuch. Must be losing my touch. I'll just run down and hit it a little harder.

http://www.nymex.com/new/dates99.html

and describes the US economy as virtually immune to the crisis
sweeping the world and has the audacity to outline a string of
rationales for US strength, one of which was that the export
portion of the economy was only 13% and that the American markets
are consumer dominated ( and therefore little affected by world
events )

SHE NEVER ONCE MENTIONED THAT A CONSUMER BASED ECONOMY BASED ON PRINTING
INFINITE AMOUNTS OF THE WORLD RESERVE CURRENCY TO BALANCE THE BOOKS
AND IMPORT AT WILL IS WHAT IS CAUSING THE WORLD DEFLATION. As country
after country devalues their currencies, their exports to the US become
cheaper and cheaper. This is deflating the US economy and allowing
Americans to go on a super buying spree, while Brazilians et al experience the exact opposite.

I wonder how long the powers that be outside the US are going to let
this abuse go on.

I thought the entire Cohen travesty reeked with arrogance. I wonder
what a European would have thought of the Cohen tirade where the US
economy was lauded for creating 10 million new jobs over the last
decade, while Europe lost one million. But most of these jobs were
created in the service sector, where just printing the money to import
and distribute can account for all. Meanwhile Europe and the rest of
the world had to grow, and drag along the American economy and its
propensity to consume 20% of the world's output, while paying for it
with pieces of green paper. It is quite advantageous to be the economy
that operates with the World Reserve Currency, and doubly advantageous
if one's country has violated Bretton Woods and prints indiscriminately.

I think the world has already taken the first step in ending this.
It is called the EURO DOLLAR.

wonder if they will sleep well

Imagination is more important than knowledge = Albert Einstein
( got a shovel?? )
l_b

Besides what Tolerant1 has said...right now, our currency is top dog, so it has not been devalued...so wherever you go, it carries the same or higher value, but this is about to change....The Euro will be top dog and the US$ will be the one which is devalued against the Euro...you now become the "Mamma San" and now you are the one who is buying less with your dollars. If you don't think this is true, look at the speed at which the US$ is falling. The game is over and nobody here knows it yet...so, if you're smart, you will find a way to protect yourself before everyone else realizes it....Back in the early 80's, I would travel to Mexico City on business, the Mexican Peso at that time was 5 to the dollar, within a year, Mexico had gone thru a currency devalueation, which took it from 5/$ to 2850/$ within 2 weeks....After this, when I would go down there, instead of paying say 1000 pesos for a hotel room ( $200 ) , I would pay 150000 pesos ( $200 ) for the room. The price was the same for me as an outsider requesting a service, however, for the people who lived there, their money became worthless, their savings were destroyed, their lives in utter despair because they could not translate the inflation rate back into their salaries...so they were in essance working for a fraction of what they were getting before....It is the people who live in the counrty that will feel the pain of the devaluation...not the foreigner....In this case, it will be the people in the US who will feel the pain and the people in Europe will not even be exposed to the effects of the falling US$.

http://www.marketwatch.newsalert.com/bin/story?StoryId=CnP7lub8ZtJe1mtaWmtC4&FQ=v%25reuter&Title=Headlines%20for%3A%20v%25reuter%0A

...bitte melden !! egruni@compuserve.com
bin in Wien zwischen den 22.1 und 8.2
l_b

Currently up 38% in less than a week. Not bad.... Meanwhile Ebay dropped by about 30% this week...UmmHmmmm.....

Go Silver... ( and Gold )

Thank you, but I do understand what the devaluation can do to the Brazilians. I too saw & was a part of the Mexican peso devaluations when I was stationed in El Paso, TX in 1971. I was there for about a year and there were several devaluations. Not to throw this discussion into even more confusion, but I really did not notice any effect on the people in Juarez, other than it caused the black market to expand tremendously in Juarez. That is a big effect. I recall that as you crossed into Juarez, all of the little shops were offering more pesos per dollar than the official exchange rate, and the farther into the heart of the city ( near the Catholic Cathedral ) you went, the more pesos you could have received for your dollar. The reason that I recall this so clearly is that I sincerely was thinking about the money I could make if I brought greenbacks to Juarez and sold them. However, at that time it was illegal to do that, and if you got caught, you would have received plenty of jail time.

U.S. jobs leave our shores for cheaper labor. If i can pay 1/2 as much to produce in a foreign country I'll do it. Nobody is going to pay more than necessary. When they devalue the price to import goes up and the price to export goes down.

Kinda funny about Ebay. Lot of investors out there suddenly wondering why they bought it. When it's all said and done, somebody leaves with a lot of money, and somebody leaves holding a piece of paper with the word Ebay on it that they paid 200$US or 400$US or whatever stupid amount of money for. The same thing will happen with the entire market before it's over. Somebody will leave with all the money, and somebody will leave holding a bunch of equity paper that nobody wants. What a beautiful game.

Would this be considered hindsight?

There once was a manic stock market
10000, 11000, 12000 is our glorious target!
But when the market did crash and they lost all their cash
Alas! They knew how far their head had been up their ___!

The dollar is top dog, I think we need about 6 mth's into the euro to see how strong it is,but don't forget they are heavily into dollars for reserves. I'd be a lot happier if the euro was backed by a higher % of gold. That might start a discussion for gold standard in US by folks other than Forbes

was posted here on Kitco over one year ago. The article suggested
that it was the new silver battery technology that was behind the
new Buffett position in silver. As with all info on the net,
two or three additional sources to verify is the minimum due
diligence one should do. This was so long ago, I can't remember
who the source was. FWIW Rhody

Frail -- I don't suppose it pays to save under the devaluation scenarios. One is MUCH better off spending it the moment they get it to get full value of the pittance, even if they got a 'payraise'.

Up 32% today. http://quote.yahoo.com/q?s=^BVSP&d=1d

All of the borrowed $US must be repaid in $US, not to mention the Europeans whom I believe are even more exposed to possible Brazil defaults. Their oil industry won't bring in many $US because of low oil prices. The world's 8th largest economy will not be able to afford $US products. Soon most items will double in price for them. On the bright side Abbey said it dosen't matter so I guess everything will be fine.

Bovespa perspective, last three months--

http://quote.yahoo.com/q?s=^BVSP&d=3m

Ah, the smell of burning shorts in the morning.

Here's the graph of Yahoo, crash graph if I've ever seen one.

You might be right. I can recall some twenty or so years ago, I didn't really have a full-time job, I was just Hustling - buying whatever I thought I could resell and make a few bucks. It eventually led to me opening my own tire store. Anyway, during this time, my dad was naturally worried about me, but I really was doing o.k. - not great but o.k. He asked me if I had any money in the bank, you know, for emergencies, etc. I had maybe $3500-$4000, and told him that. I also told him that I thought the bank was the last place you should put your money. I told him that I would much rather have had a warehouse with $4000 worth of new tires in it. I still believe that, but you must have something that people really need, like tires. If, for example, you had transistor radios & times got tough, a person could do without the radio, but they have got to have tires to put on their car to get to work - assuming they got a job.

There once was a young trader named Fisk
Whose trading was quite brisk
He cashed it all in one fine day
And put it all into Ebay
Wasn't that a silly thing, his little *

Burma Shave

Of course, it doesn't look much different than this one.

I've heard that, but several weeks ago, I was listening to a radio news report. Thay were talking about the IMF loan to Russia. The report said that the IMF was making the loan contingent on Russia repaying the loan in greenbacks. Russia allegedly told the IMF that they would get paid with the same currency that was loaned to them. I could never verify the story, but this is basically what I have been talking about all afternoon. It is currency trading or manipulation, depending on how you want to look at it.

There is discussion here on Kitco that the U.S. dollar is overvalued. I suggest that it is other country currencies that are overvalued? My experience here in Africa is this, small economies that create nothing and import everything, bloated corrupt bureaucracies that spend like theres no tomorrow. YES I believe that the dollar is being printed to much but compared to the alternatives Ill stick with it.

if the Brazil Central Bank is channeling the money it would normally use to defend the currency into the stock market? I think other countries ( Hong Kong and Japan come to mind ) "intervene" to prop up their markets. Also I think people are fearless. After all, every country in trouble gets a rescue package eventually. Caution is no longer required. Could be an interesting year the closer we get to y2k.

COMEX Metal Warehouse statistics for Jan. 15

-- TOTALS
Gold 809,210 + 0 troy ounces
Silver 75,492,948 - 411,558 troy ounces
Copper 99,422 + 44 short tons

Today is simply representative of the reasons why ALMOST everyone is IN the stock market. Buy the dips...you cannot suffer a loss...have no fear...etc.

PMSP

Tom

in that they have no intrinsic value...

Whilst in my local watering hole today the "PUB" magazine announces at least one brewer will close at 8pm .The article goes on to say that staff are expecting 200.00 per hour ( Pounds sterling ) ( more than 1 Tr ounce AU per hour ) ( they ommitted to mention the extra 10% National Tax on jobs ( NIC ) .
Conclusion ,there is talk of the celebrations being a damp squib he he he..
by the way baby sitters 400.00 per hour !! gues this must be anticipated inflation to soak up all the newy printed notes

Go something but stay real
cpo

All across the country, workers are finding their vacation time canceled due to Y2K concerns. It started with police officers, who now know they will not be spending New Years Eve with their families, and quickly spread to other professions covering emergency services, medical care, and utility companies.

This USA Today story reports, "Word is already out among city employees in Denver that essential personnel could see vacations canceled. The mayor issued an executive order to that effect, even though efforts have been under way since 1996 to correct Y2K problems. But city workers will be standing by if traffic lights fail, elevators get stuck, automatic doors slam shut, or other mishaps occur. "We're going to be on full alert," says mayoral spokesman Andrew Hudson."

The story goes on to cover examples at General Motors, Ford, the Federal Reserve, and even the Hilton hotel. Read it at:

http://www.usatoday.com/life/cyber/tech/cte154.htm

You can get more here folks:

http://www.y2knewswire.com/19990115.htm

It is an excellent method of receiving information on Y2K.

Namaste'

I saw a greater impact to the Mexican people when I went to Mexico City than I did just over the border from Brownsville, because the people in the border towns had US incomes, so they were not as effected...but the people in Mexico City were reeling from the devaluation...I would see many more people in Mexico City begging for change after the devaluation....as for another example, how about indonesia?

As if the markets weren't "funny" enough.....

New 1999 Computer Viruses You Should Know About...

Lewinsky Virus: Sucks all memory out of your computer, then emails everyone about what It did.

Ronald Reagan Virus: Saves your data, but forgets where it is stored.

Mike Tyson Virus: Quits after one byte.

Oprah Winfrey Virus: Your 300MB hard drive suddenly shrinks to 100MB, and then slowly expands to 200MB.

Dr. Jack Kevorkian Virus: Deletes all old files.

Ellen DeGeneres Virus: You can no longer insert disks into your computer.

Titanic Virus: Your whole computer goes down.

Disney Virus: Everything in your computer goes goofy.

Prozac Virus: Screws up your RAM but your processor doesn't care.

Joey Buttafuoco Virus: Only attacks minor files.

Arnold Schwarzenegger Virus: Terminates some files, leaves, but will be back.

Lorena Bobbit Virus: Turns your hard drive into a 3.5 inch floppy.

From SI:

To: Richard Harmon ( 26270 )
From: hjsimpson
Friday, Jan 15 1999 12:15PM ET Reply # of 26282

A little OT,

I spoke with the resident NRC inspector yesterday when he visited the control room to "help" us along. I asked if he had heard of the NRC talking about shutting us down for Y2K issues. He said no and also added the Chairwoman Jackson would prefer we ( nukes ) were online to add to grid stability.

FWIW

homer

Demographic segments of the population without a collective memory of stock market scams...

i ) recently financially liberated and empowered working women, their mothers have never told them how their grandmother lost her blouse in crash of '29, '74, '87 .... role models are Hiliary Clinton and Abby Cohen.

ii ) recently prosperous Afro America, similarly never any money period let alone to put into stocks before .... role models Vernon Clinton-Jordan and Jesse Jackson.

Both these groups are being led like lambs to the slaughter.

Question is just how much does Oprah Windfrey have in the market?...she seems quite affluent and financially adept. Perhaps we could get Oprah to air the real ills of the global financial casino and the security in BUYing GOLD.

I say let's all email Oprah and tell her to warn the sheople about the dangers of the market and the security of gold agianst all forms of enslavement, be it chains of debt or otherwise.

http://www.oprah.com/email-oprah.html

Demographic segments of the population without a collective memory of stock market scams...

i ) recently financially liberated and empowered working women, their mothers have never told them how their grandmother lost her blouse in crash of '29, '74, '87 .... role models are Hiliary Clinton and Abby Cohen.

ii ) recently prosperous Afro Americans, previously never had any money period let alone to put into stocks before .... role models Vernon Clinton-Jordan and Jesse Jackson.

Both these groups are being led like lambs to the slaughter.

Question is just how much does Oprah Windfrey have in the market?...she seems quite affluent and financially adept. Perhaps we could get Oprah to air the real ills of the global financial casino and the security in BUYing GOLD.

I say let's all email Oprah and tell her to warn the sheople about the dangers of the market and the security of gold against all forms of enslavement, be it chains of debt or otherwise.

http://www.oprah.com/email-oprah.html

Aldebaran - There must be many many people here, lurkers and posters, who could discuss your ideas of "superpowers" better than I, but as no one has bothered let me at least add a couple of facts.

...err, France has had the "atom bomb" for some time

...as has the UK.

...Germany has good reasons not to get involved with "superpower" bomb building

...as has Japan.


Also, you should not be surprised at embarrassed silences when mentioning "atom bombs" ( or any bombs ) or bringing up the subject of world domination with a German person, let alone during your first live conversation. Some might call it tactless.

Such matters are still extremely painful and within living memory. Your friend sounds very polite in changing the conversation. It can take years, if ever, for a friendship to be strong enough to discuss these things openly. It is not that they hide from or ignore such issues, it is that they take them all too seriously.

I have travelled to a few places, and the overriding impression I had of the US was that here was a place that had never been bombed. You are lucky indeed, but needn't be so flippant.

Enjoyed your post, as usual. What do you think the results of Y2K will be for systems people? More demand because their skills are needed?
Or perhaps less demand when companies figure out that they don't need ( or can't afford ) customized financial systems, email, web browsers, et al?
The result COULD be a massive overhaul of accounting standards. Get rid of the bean-counters, and you could run a huge company with a standard accounting package from Oracle or SAP. More concentration on the business, and less on systems.

Just because there's a Y2K crisis, I'm not 100% certain that the price of PM's ( and especially PM stocks ) will do extremely well. Anyone have any numbers on the POG in the first month or two after the 1973 oil embargo? after the 1929 market crash?

I agree with you on the Euro...however, I think that they soon will start dumping US$s and replacing it with more gold or Yen...They know that they are in a competition with the US for World Currency Leader and safe haven currency of choice...and this will make the difference IMHO. They want the demand from other countries for their currency and their stocks as well...they will soon organize a stock exchange to challange the NYSE in size and volume...this is when it will really come together...until then, the US bond market is having it's problems and as more are sold back to the US, the dollar will fall......

I like your take on my bad grammar.... "Goldman's Sack" A new word for the Kitco Lexicon? Thanks sorex, for the update on what Oleman is saying! Go Golf

FOX-MAN your 15:22 post noted COMEX warehouse stocks were 809,210 oz of AU. CNBC interviewed a fellow at 3:45 pm who said the Feb contract had eight and one half million oz of shorts.....8,500,000 oz

if that be so and I saw him say it, that is 10 times the warehouse stocks, My Question to the forum is where in hell are the shorts going to get that much gold to cover in the next two or three weeks?

Can any one explain this to me in words that make sense.
CoBra P.S. I am long and I am not giving them mine cheap

Special Commentary

We have identified Goldman Sachs and JP Morgan as the "Leaders of the Gold Selling Pack". We also believe, that for various reasons, U S officialdom and some highly visible financial entities have orchestrated the capping of the gold price to keep it below $300. For months we have documented anecdotal evidence for you that this is so.

Recently, Goldman Sachs replaced John Corzine as its CEO. A new regime was installed. One of our more plugged in and astute www.lemetropolecafe.com members suggested to me at the time that there would be changes in Goldman policies. He told me right after the change of leadership was made to also look for a change in their gold shorting policies at some point, because if the gold loans are as dangerously large as we think they are, the newly appointed Goldman regime would not want to be caught heavily short in a gold buying panic. We have been on that alert. Until late yesterday we heard nothing, and saw nothing, but more Goldman selling.

We also suggested to you that if JP Morgan and Goldman Sachs were going to try and extricate themselves from their very large gold short positions ( along with some others in the "Crises Management Team" ) , they might first do everything they could to attract shorts to the market, so that when they wanted to start buying, the price would be a good deal lower and there would be willing sellers around that they could buy size from.

Then late yesterday, one of our members sent us the following: From Steve Kaplan's www.goldminingoutlook.com :

"In a surprising departure from the brokerage community's neutral to bearish near-consensus on the future price of gold, Goldman Sachs' investment bank released its weekly FX report predicting that "the spot price of gold bullion is poised for an upside breakout." Part of the reason for such a prediction is their belief that the Australian dollar will rise sharply against the U.S. dollar, as it is close to breaking above a downward sloping trendline. A strengthening Aussie dollar will make Australian gold producers less eager to sell gold forward, as they will receive diminished U.S. dollar returns"

Midas did not know what to make of it. Was it a planted comment as a result of even the Financial Times knowing how short they were? Did they want to deflect some attention away from their shorting? It was time to do some checking around, so I called one of our Wall Street wizards, a Le Metropole member. It just so happened he was on a Goldman Sachs conference call. What a coincidence!

To my surprise and delight, the gist of the conference call is that Goldman Sachs said today that the dollar has to go down and go down a good deal. They see a good chance of our trade deficit ballooning to $20 billion per month at the rate things are going. The Brazilian devaluation and their allowing their currency, the Real, to float, can only exasperate the situation. A Brazilian soybean farmer now receives 30% more for his soybeans than a US farmer does. Thus, he can sell his soybeans to end users more cheaply than the US farmer can. This is not a happy day for US farmers as they are big losers - his soybeans are just not as competitive. US exports of soybeans have to suffer. It is not a happy day for other types of US merchants. Profit margins will be squeezed.

And this is the first week of the devaluation. The Thai Bhat, Indonesian Rupiah and Russian Ruble, all continued to devalue after their first round of devaluations. What if the Brazilian Real goes down 50 to 100% against the dollar? "Beggar Thy Neigbor" is now in full bloom. How does Mexico compete against Brazil? By the way, the Mexican Peso slid about 6% this week. How about US companies that have to compete against Mexican ones?

Then, there is the minor problem of Brazil's US demoninated debt which I understand was $275 billion last week. That has to be paid in dollars. The debt service went up 30% in a week. Two Brazil states are not paying their own government. Russia defaulted. What if Brazil HAS to?

We, the US, are a debtor nation already and our debt is growing by leaps and bounds. Debt has to be serviced. According to Goldman, the servicing of our own debt is going to be a problem unless something is done about reducing it. Our trade deficit has to be reduced. It is already too high - $20 billion per month is unacceptable. The dollar must be depreciated to reduce this deficit.

Goldman Sachs is Secretary Treasury Rubin's former firm. You can be sure that if Goldman Sachs is putting out this commentary, it has Mr. Rubin's blessing, and most likely, his encouragement. The best way to start the selling of the dollar is to let the hedge funds and Wall Street insiders know what the next deal is. If I know this now, you can be sure the Wall Street big guns do too. The wink is on.

This also makes sense because you have the Japanese and Euro crowd calling for more stability in the exchange rates among the dollar, yen and euro. Maybe our Treasury officials and Fed are considering just that. If so, the dollar must be trashed first, according to Goldman. It must be trashed enough to erase our monthly trade deficit. Then, perhaps some acceptable range for the dollar, yen and euro can be structured.

This should be a very bullish development for the gold market. First, our assessment that Goldman and JP Morgan did whatever they could to break gold down so that they could buy gold in size at favorable prices, may be correct. Second, there should be some substantial gold buying coming from Goldman very soon. That should attract other "informed" buying. Maybe that is why the XAU is so steady. Third, it may encourage the Asian official sector to step up to the plate and buy many hundreds of tonnes of gold.

Why not? You can be sure that if I have knowledge of the Goldman Sach's conference call, they surely do. The Asian's dollar reserves are very large and their gold reserves are very small. Why not switch some of those dollar reserves into gold reserves - especially when you desire to have the Yen acquire reserve currency status. The greater gold backing the better. And why make 5% in US bonds if the currency is going to go down 15% from here. That is a negative 10% return. Worse, if the dollar is headed south, then the prices of bonds are probably headed south too. That represents another loss. It only makes sense that this "outed" information will bring the Asian official sector to the gold pits.

The Midas quotes- "Got them right where we want them" and " Fasten Your Seatbelts" are beginning to resonate. Up up and away for gold and silver. The bugler is blowing a bullish gold and silver tune. Tally Ho, Ray.

TALLY HO! Where are you Ray? You are missed on Kitco!

http://www.crbindex.com/reviews/story2333.html

One trader pointed out that gold may also have been helped from falling
further earlier today on a positive forecast from T Hoare and Co analyst Rhona O'Connell. She said that spot gold is set to average $320 per ounce this year and that prices should be closer to $350 than $300 by the end of the year.
O'Connell also suggested the first weekly financial statement from the
European Central Bank implied that European Central Bank gold sales are "a thing of the past."

to have ten times the amount of shorts than there are physical to
deliver because most of the contracts traded on Comex are "paper
trades" and delivery is rarely the end result. Now, as the LTD ( last
trade date ) nears, those that are heavily short may rollover into
the April contract. If so, we could still have a heavily short Gold
market in Comex. BUT! If a large percentage of the gold shorts don't
rollover their positions into the next contract month, we could see
the price of gold climb higher! I suspect that as the end of the Feb.
contract nearers, we will see POG go up. The only problem is that
many of these "gold shorters" will re-enter at that time and start to
to drive the POG back down when the April contract has been active for
awhile. What we really need is for a larger fear of shorting to occur
because those "shorters" would be afraid of being caught on the wrong
side of the market! Larger demand ( than we already have ) would be one
fear. Further instabilities ( like on a grand scale, especially in the
U.S. ) would be another fear. Inflation that is perceived to be "out of
control" would be another fear. The U.S. Dollar continuing to plummet
would be another fear. And on and on...I still think it's just a matter
of time. Something or another will be the catalyst. Once Gold takes off,
it will then start to trade more wildly. Volatility will increase with
uncertainty. Well, I hope this all makes sense! Anyone else want to add
and/or correct the above, please do so...Thanks, Fox-man

I've thought that before and been smashed. We all have. My gut says the dawn is seconds away. Hang in there fellow goldbugs. I am thinking about the day when Kitco posts are filled with so much exclamation marks, that you couldn't count them all. ( and I don't think we need the end of the world to get gold moving, just get rid of the shorts! ) Thanks to all Kitcoites for making this the best site on the internet. If there was a Kitco University, I feel I would be in the first graduating class. I came to gold because I saw the mania but had little understanding of the markets. I stayed here because of the incredible intelligence, wisdom, culture and humor. The things I've learned......

A puff and a gulp, and Tally Ho to all Kitcoites.....

A boobus while cyber engaged
Thought to fly on a stock called ebay
Though it went up in a flash
It most assuredly crashed
And his butt and his poke disengaged.

A dippy quite smitten by DOW
Was equally grasped by yahoo
Said his wife, "don't you dare"
He replied, "'Tis quite rare"
As his bucks disappeared in thin air.

Tyro: Typical nuke plants usually have two NRC inspectors assigned on-site. These are technical guys ( usually ex-navy nukes with NO personality ) are NOT in the loop for policy discussions in Washington. They just read it AFTER it comes out. Many of the nuke plants have old Data General or Westinghouse processors in the control rooms that are at least twenty years old. I LOVED your post yesterday ( from the NRC dated 12/08/98 ) that said this issue was "too cumbersome and unworkable" for the NRC to manage. Were less than twelve months away, and theyre currently assembling a Task Force, and have a high-level DRAFT of a plan to deal with Y2K. ( Probably 100+ pages of specs for sodium pentaborate, but no specs for Y2K! )

GunRunner: My favorite bumper sticker this week: "Warning: Driver carries less than $20 worth of ammunition"

Final thought for the week on Iraq: Instead of allowing Saddam to build evil weapons of mass destruction, why not just nuke him?! No country should be allowed to have such weapons.. Errr.. Except the USA, of course ( sarcasm intended )

has posted earlier! Thanks crazytimes ( Bill ) ! This commentary ties
in with what I said about one of the fears that could be a catalyst.
That fear is the continued decline of the U.S. Dollar! It has to occur
in order to correct the other imbalances in the U.S. that Bill Murphy
writes about!

I've gotten the most education, as well! I look forward to seeing
alot more of these "!" as well...Thanks for your posts Bill. It is
Bill isn't it? I think I saw you end some of your posts with "Bill".
If not, oops. Be sure and correct me. Thanks,

Gary

The poets at kitco are fond
Of speaching to toute le monde:
That Wall St skullduggery
Will give way to goldbuggery,
By then we will all be Long Gonned.

Thanks for your post. I am not Bill Murphy though. I post his commentary here with his permission. I won't post all his commentary as there would be no need to join his "Metropole Cafe". He has told me that on occasion, I can post them. This one in particular, I thought was very important. My name is actually Chris. I am an Acupuncturist in New Hope, Pennsylvania.

the one that posted Bill Murphy's commentary, but what I mis-interpreted
was that the end of HIS commentary was the name Bill, and I thought it was you leaving YOUR name. But, I got it now, Chris. Hopefully, some day
we'll all meet at a kitco gathering and discuss our successes!

believe that there will be a tremendous thinning of the herd due to dis-intermediation...much of any answer to your questions/comments will be greatly affected by the severity of Y2K...or lack thereof...

One thing which may occur for instance in a severe scenario is all computer people might be conscripted by the government or that part of local government that functions, at government imposed wages carpenters, plumbers and electricians could be receiving far greater rewards...

On the other hand, a new method of interacting with the Internet could put Microsoft/company x - out of business, as operating systems will be available right off the Internet in a new multi-faceted language which will make the need for any one specific operating system or software package a moot point...making browsers as we know them a thing of the past, you just turn it on like your tv and instead of going to an abc, cbs, etc., you go to the accounting channel/site, pick the specific medium needed, plug in your numbers, print it out and voila...plus download a copy to disk...or you could go to the real estate channel, plug in your info, see houses you can purchase, talk or leave a message for the home owner you wish to buy from, the owner agrees, everything is transferred and downloaded, you get a receipt as well as an electronic disk or tape copy and voila...

I just do not have the technical wherewithal to know if Y2K will cause major problems, nor do I know if it will make people/entities scrap older this that and the other and purchase the latest up to date whatever and the impact that would have on xy and z...

I do know that I am preparing for Y2K on a worst case scenario as I live in a colder climate and no electricity here for more than a few days could make things intensely hectic to say the least...

I have to admit that I have had to wing this response as my knowledge of the specific, "systems people", is limited...it would seem to me that certain simplistic basics have to be in place for the more complicated items to even be considered...

That and the fact that I could probably do a better job of discussing this over a beer, in that my spoken words would make a better brush for this canvas rather than my fingers beating the keys...

As per Kaplin:

In a surprising departure from the brokerage community's neutral to bearish near-consensus on the future price of gold, Goldman Sachs' investment bank released its weekly FX report predicting that "the spot price of gold bullion is poised for an upside breakout." Part of the reason for such a prediction is their belief that the Australian dollar will rise sharply against the U.S. dollar, as it is close to breaking above a downward sloping trendline. A strengthening Aussie dollar will make Australian gold producers less eager to sell gold forward, as they will receive diminished U.S. dollar returns. If nothing else, this report should debunk the absurd conspiracy theory popular on several recent precious metals chat sites that Goldman Sachs, Robert Rubin, Alan Greenspan, and the Federal Reserve ( and the ECB, the IMF, Goldfinger, and/or Mickey Mouse, et al ) are "secretly" selling gold massively short in order to bring about a "new world order", to keep the U.S. dollar "afloat until Rubin resigns", to "provide a counterweight to the pending Y2K disaster", among the less absurd rumors I've seen in cyberspace. Don't forget that these chat sites are a primary reason that Yahoo got up to $445 per share. No intelligent person would believe that Goldman Sachs would sell gold short and simultaneously publicly proclaim an imminent upside breakout.

Kitco is indeed blessed...to be gilded by the best!!

Dow/Gold Ratio = 32.55. The 233 day moving average is 29.76

XAU/Spot Ratio = .240. The 233 day moving average is .247

So you are one of the first tier banking enterprises in the entire globe. That means that you are a controller, a power. Its not about money or making money. Its about power: making it and using it. Power means having your way, doing it your way. Of taking what you want, when you want it. Its a matter of ownership of nations.

Think of it: to own nations. The ultimate power. The trans-global power. To be a master of the universe. To own and to take what you want when you want it. To use others as your servants. For them to HAVE TO DO what you want. Because you are a MASTER. Everyone else is a slave to you.

Currencies are the leverage of your power, followed closely by bonds. You manipulate nations such as Australia to sell gold by driving the currency down. Local economics takes over and the 'little people' behave so predictably; they sell what you want, when you want. Same for South Africa. Its not about making money .. its about getting done what you want done when you want it done. You control the markets by the shear size of your operations. You own the market, they are only participants in the market.

Look at all the nations in this way and you will see nations being bought and sold. The recently destroyed economies of asia .. a fire sale that you have arranged to your benefit.

The recent manipulation of the gold suppliers by the manipulation of their currencies to induce them to sell into a market. The direction is down. That's the way you want it .. for now. Until later, when it suits our purposes for it to be the other way.

Again, it is not about making money .. it is about owning nations and the people of the nations.

~~~~~

Y2K will be the obliteration of the infrastructure that these powers have so sucessfully used in their current game of power. They know it. They are planning on the next page of this journey in the novel they are writing. Consider the obliteration of the present medium of power to be superceded by another, more primative medium of power. They know. But only recently. They are positioning their pieces to endure .. if they can.

Goldmans may be getting out of short positions in gold, but they couldn't say that! They must proclaim that the foward sales in Australia may be coming to a halt due to the increase in the Aussie Dollar. In other words, they have knowledge of a break out in gold but "officially" announce a different reason for an upside breakout. They wish to build their reputation, don't they? It would not be good P.R. for them to announce an upside breakout if they didn't think it was going to happen. Perhaps the real reason is the unwinding of short positions. It's all just part of more "smoke and mirrors"

competition for the USD. Euroland is effectively being run by a bunch of wild-eyed socialists. They have over 10% unemployment & generous social programs that they have vowed to maintain. On top of that, France is going to a 35 hr workweek which will make them even less productive. They are also much more reliant on exports than the U.S., so I don't think that they even want a strong Euro to begin with.

A Marine colonel on his way home from work at the Pentagon came to a dead halt in traffic and thought to himself, "Wow, this traffic seems worse than usual. Nothing's even moving." He notices a police officer walking back and forth between the lines of cars so he rolls down his window and asks,

"Excuse me, Officer, what's the hold up?"

The Officer replies, "The President is just so depressed about the impeachment thing he stopped his motorcade in the middle of the Beltway and he's threatening to douse himself
in gasoline and set himself on fire. He says his family hates him and he doesn't have the $33.5 million he owes his lawyers. I'm walking round taking up a collection for him".

"Oh really? How much have you collected so far?"

"So far only about a hundred gallons but I've got a lot of folks still siphoning."

HighRise

"Euroland is effectively being run by a bunch of wild-eyed socialists."

Agreed, and guess what? That's who running the US too.

"They have over 10% unemployment..."

The USA probably has a 15% or 20% unemployment rate, it's hard to
say since they lie to us by citing utterly bogus unemployment figures
like they are gospel. For example, did you know that homeless people
are NOT considered unemployed? Did you know that somebody who works
one day out of the week is NOT considered unemployed? Did you know
that somebody unemployed, who refuses to suck on the government tit
known as the "unemployment check," is NOT considered unemployed?

..." & generous social programs that they have vowed to maintain."

Again, if I didn't know you were talking about Europe I'd swear you must
be speaking of the US.

There are few people in Congress and NONE in the State Department who
are friends of freedom. If there were, the Federal Reserve Act would
have been repealed decades ago, and the IRS would just be a bad dream.

~Silas~

All: The foreign creditors lost money, and the Brazilian people will now have worse inflation -- higher imported goods costs. However, the Brazilian companies will have a field day with the exported goods to the US, since their profit margin went up many times the 10% or so devaluation yesterday. Now the Brazilians will be much less able to buy US-made goods.

The foreign customers will have cheaper Brazilian goods -- at the expense of a lower standard of living in Brazil for most. My guess is that the US markets are benefitting from a deflationary 'flight to safety' from less stable markets -- which fits with the apparent resumption of the US equity rally. I would never have guessed how strong the US market mania is -- Eventually the US markets will wake up, however, and follow the deflationary dominos sweeping the world -- probably last! China and Europe next, IMHO. Trade wars and competitive devaluations coming up as well.

Don't forget salt! Westerners eat about 9 gm a day! That is far to much, but without any you will die within a few days. It nearly happened to me twice. Once after spending two days vomiting on a DC 3 and again when I was lost for three days while prospecting in hot weather. If I needed it badly, I would pay 1 oz/Au for 1 oz/NaCl.

P/B Brazil Fund .40 P/B Dell 50.

Salt is important for your health, true--but if you're stocking up on dry foods you might find that you are buying more salt that you know already. However, considering I can get a giant 2 pound container for about 49 cents, you won't find me low on the stuff!

I'm working on a new website about buying foods for Y2K. Since the old expiration dates are starting to show "00" in the date more than ever now, people need to know the best kinds of foods to store, how to prepare them, the dangers of drinking rainwater, and much much more. I think I'm call to call it "The Apocalypse Cafe" since that will be the name of the restaurant I plan to open come the end of the world. The 2nd cup of coffee's free, but the first one you got to pay... in silver, of course.

~Silas~

********** GOLD FLASH **********

http://www.gold.org/Gra/Pr/Sci/T3_9810.htm

Aye,

Haggis

There may be a lot of negatives for the U.S., but I don't think that anyone can seriously doubt that the work ethic in the U.S. is much better than Euroland.
I spent 4 years over there & even the Germans' work ethic has declined precipitiously in the last decade or so. Italy & the med Countries--forget about it. The French like to live well & demand all kinds of benefits from their jobs but don't want to work more than 35 hrs a week. They even have inspectors now that actually have issued summonses to managers who put in too many hours.
I doubt very much if there will even be a Euro in 3 years. Too much disparity between the people & economies & a refusal to relocate, etc. Can you imagine the frictions & animosity they will face when Spain has to deal with 20% unemployment? The whole thing will collapse, IMO.

Join up, see the world, come home, and............. DIE !

http://www.news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/health/newsid_255000/255462.stm

Your previous comments concerning increased aerospace and military spending suggest that you may be the sort of guy who eats licorice when going out on a date !

To ensure that you don't miss any points, on you computer install a siren and a flashing light.............. WAKE UP !

If you need a bit of a lift, I would suggest that you rub some Tiger Valm on your genitals. Be warned, this will cause screaming, which will help keep you awake.

Get a life...........

Och aye the noooooooooooooo.........

Haggis

A boobus while cyber enga'ed
Thought to fly on a stock called ebay
Though it went up in a flash
It most assuredly crashed
And his poke found a new place to stay.

A dippy quite smitten by DOW
Was equally grasped by yahoo
Said his wife, "don't you dare"
He replied, "'Tis quite rare"
As his bucks disappeared in thin air.

'Ol Haggis while searching for ore
All 'round dry Kilgoorlie's shore
Took respite by measure
And found a wee treasure
T'was the kilt that hid it fer sure.
( T'was a teeny tiny kilt, it was )

A Bug by name of Delancey
Got bit by the gold mighty fancy
He thought it a hoot
'Til the buck took a shoot
Now the pain in his pants make's him antsey.

EB! and Disney joined forces
Said it t'was he liked them there mouses
But a trip to Anheim
Were'nt really sublime
Now he wished it'd all been a farces.

Farfel was a bullish galoot
'Bout gold he had many a toot
Now it seems there's a change
Cause the Dame's got the mange
An 'ol Fel, he thinks it's all moot.

Sharefin done found his romances
With a gal who lacks for some pants'es
Why Too Kay is her name
And so great is her fame
That I doubt he'll escape her embrances.

On Kitco they pleasantly shout
The buck is nearly done out
But strange as it seems
The buck is still green
And the gold? It's still on a rout.

A lady while dining at Crue
Found an elephant whang in her stew
Said the waiter, "don't shout
Don't wave it about
Or the others will all want one too."

I love you guy's but this talk of gold soaring starting now will not happen. You keep pondering about the dollar and the money supply and this large short position in gold and all, every important things in the short to intermediate term but long term the only thing that will burst the bubble and get gold going is CRUDE OIL! Now I'm very bullish on Oil long term but it isn't moving now and does not look like it. If you believe in gold soaring you believe in oil above $25!! I'm a believer but not to soon. As far as a modest rise in gold to $300/$310 that could happen with some of the things talked about today but that would be it.

but the US is closed. could be a gold spike, catching the shorts on the tip of the pike pole.

here is how i would get out of my shorts.

1. create and participate in a bullish movement in gold. ignite the powder keg, knowing of course that i would have something to douse the fire with.

2. bull gold up and get weak shorts to cover and bullish specs to get on board ( create the "this time its for real" feeling ) .

3. throw on the cold water. in this case--turn on all the spigots.

4. cover the huge position. ( you need a lot of action to cover a big position ) .

5. go long and relax

eom

glenn: I agree with you! We are in a deflationary period right now -- the commodity price index really got trounced by the financial turmoil associated with the Brazilian crisis. The only thing that is fairly predictable about gold in the near future is that it will go down days before a major financial crisis just about anywhere in the world. Why? Because almost every country in the world has US dollars in their reserves. Whenever any country has a financial crisis and must sell their reserves, the only way the CB's of the world can keep the US dollar stable is to 'sell' gold. The gold market is thin enough to control, but not the US dollar market.

With regard to oil -- alot of oil producers will have to go offline before the price of oil will go up. Currently the competitive devaluations will reduce the worldwide price of oil. And -- as we learned after SEAsia, currency collapses tend to reduce demand for oil as well. Only a war would be able to price of Oil up in a hurry.

I always like reading your posts -- they show excellent insight!

http://www.golden-eagle.com/gold_digest_99/murphy011299.html

note... take the "en" out of "golden"

http://www.russiatoday.com:80/rtoday/business/news/99011409.html

The spike bottom that I referred to this morning occurred on the globex before market open. If you got into Durban Deep at 2 3/8 you are already up more than 5%.

from an email
Dear Cassius,

Are you still working on the Y zero K problem? This change from BC
to AD is giving us a lot of headaches and we haven't much time left. I
don't know how people will cope with working the wrong way around.
Having been working happily downwards forever, now we have to
start thinking upwards. You would think that someone would have
thought of it earlier and not left it to us to sort it all out at this last
minute. I spoke to Caesar the other evening. He was livid that Julius

hadn't done something about it when he was sorting out the calendar.
He said he could see why Brutus turned nasty.

We called in the consulting astrologers, but they simply said that
continuing downwards using minus BC won't work. As usual, the
consultants charged a fortune for doing nothing useful. As for myself,
I just can't see the sand in an hour glass flowing upwards. We have
heard that there are three wise men in the East who have been
working on the problem, but unfortunately they won't arrive until it's
all over.

Some say the world will cease to exist at the moment of transition.
Anyway we are still continuing to work on this blasted Y zero K
problem and I will send you a parchment if anything further develops.


Vale. Plutoniu

Gold Closed EVEN. Today was the first FRIDAY I can remember in recent times that Gold did not close Down !!!!

at this moment in time, perhaps the same could be said of any long
term holders of physical gold????

i keep looking for motivation..............

The dark muse continues to hold you fast. ....... The will to power is inexorable. There is little to be done but to protect our personal affairs and loved ones. ..... And work to unhinge the monster. Y2k may weaken it some but the booboisie will be unwilling and/or unable to resist the blandishments of the monster that bears cookies. Much will be done in the name of the people. All of it reprehensible.

In the meantime, cheer up. Enjoy what remains of a moderately civil living experience. There will be more than enough time to deal with meaner issues as they arise.

It would not however, be out of the question to begin consideration of some form of - nondisruptible - communication among interested, like minded parties. Don't know what form it could take but I have given it a lot of thought, in light of potentially severe communication failures. We may rest assured that such failure will take two forms: Formulated and unformulated. Yes?

My email remains: earl@worldaccessnet.com

In all the analysis of the Brazilian float, I have yet to see anyone ask a simple question:

Why is it that what China was praised for NOT doing throughout the Asian Crisis Brazil is now praised FOR doing? Remember everyone from Rubin to Greenspan to Clinton praising China for their heroism in not floating their currency?

Now, they have practically ordered Brazil to float theirs.

Latest charts and commentary up at The Privateer website.

In all the analysis of the Brazilian float, I have yet to see anyone ask a simple question: Why is it that what China was praised for NOT doing throughout the Asian Crisis Brazil is now praised FOR doing? Remember everyone from Rubin to Greenspan to Clinton praising China for their heroism in not floating their currency?

Now, they have practically ordered Brazil to float theirs.

Latest charts and commentary up at The Privateer website.

. If
nothing else, this report should debunk the absurd conspiracy theory popular on several
recent precious metals chat sites that Goldman Sachs, Robert Rubin, Alan Greenspan, and
the Federal Reserve ( and the ECB, the IMF, Goldfinger, and/or Mickey Mouse, et al ) are
"secretly" selling gold massively short in order to bring about a "new world order", to keep
the U.S. dollar "afloat until Rubin resigns", to "provide a counterweight to the pending Y2K
disaster", among the less absurd rumors I've seen in cyberspace. Don't forget that these
chat sites are a primary reason that Yahoo got up to $445 per share. No intelligent person
would believe that Goldman Sachs would sell gold short and simultaneously publicly
proclaim an imminent upside breakout.

Let's look at the facts. Successive countries with some of the most powerful economies in the world, representing a large portion of the world's population, have had concocted currency woes. Actually you could say the appreciating US dollar has caused them enormous financial difficulties.

Due to this leaders of these nations ( note elected leaders ) have gone to Washington to grovel before a small group of people, mostly white male bankers. Not only are they made to feel small, these leaders of nations of millions, they are told that there efforts are worthless and that they should also shoulder ever larger debt burdens for their nations.

So facts are we have a small group of unelected "officials" lording it over a large portion of the world's people. They hide behind the powerful US military might, even while creaming off billions in interest on the indebtedness they have conjured up over Americans themselves.

This is the state of our world today ...... definitely the end of the free world. As long as the US citzenry are ignorant and brainwashed to who is manipulating their thoughts, then this small group will continue to rule a good portion of the world through the enslavement of debt and their chicanery of monetary affairs.

I do not know if these people are religious, but if they do know what they do they are most certainly godless and who knows, perhaps they even work for Satan himself.

your witness is..."on several recent precious metals chat sites." Kitco is obviously in the clear as nobody could call Kitco a recent site...

Well said.

I have given some thought to this as well. I believe that walkie-talkies would be the best solution for distances under 5 miles. A relay system of these devices could greatly extend the area of effective communication. In the last few weeks, several friends and coworkers have been asking me for advice on y2k preparation. I am already envisioning an informal network springing up. For long distance, ham radios look like the most viable way to go. Perhaps a ham radio network of Kitco folks will come into being. Hopefully the internet and utilities will not collapse. However, the risks look high enough that contingency planning makes sense. Would like to hear more of your thoughts on communications.

Fox-Man
Thank you for your kind words.

Silas, Prospector
from my book of bon mots:

Some seek gold, but there lives not a man who does not need salt.
----Cassiodoros, Roman Statesman


sipping a bottle of Macs Gold, watching NZ play India at cricket, I remain

salty

Auric
Reading your post, I 'heard' Jimi Hendrix singing "All Along the Watchtower"

Pardon my perfunctory post a few spins ago.

Man, is it humid downhere.

Yes, I tend to lean toward ham radio as well. Might as well realize though, that most will be unlicensed. Including me. .... But that's not much of a consideration.

Wonder what the hams have planned for a y2k contingency? Must query some friends that are hams.

At least when Gold tanks in dollars you still get to keep the gold *grin*.

Ah, Timmie me boyo... you have spent altogether to much time scanning the skys for black helicopters.

So much so that you apparently have missed the significance of the National Guard involvement. You see, it really has nothing to do with Consititutional overthrow, or any such thing. I agree that having the Guard in position is probably the best possible thing that could happen. However, there is a subtlty in this that thus far appears to have escaped notice. You see, exercises such as MOBEX/COMMEX and even the activation of the Guard for "standby" operations costs $$$!!!.

This is at a time when the Marine Corps is having grunts buy ammo at their own cost to practice for marksmanship awards. Let me see if I got this straight, Y2k is a non-event, but, The NG bureau is going to spend several million dollars on:

1. the largest single activation of the NG since WWII.

2. the possible activation of the NG for the months of DEC-JAN at full pay... ( hmmm.. 425,000 personnel at about $1000.00 per month per man, times 2 months... Wow, thats a lotta cash at a time that the Military is broke )

If Koskinen is believed, there is little to no threat. Why just this morning, he released a cute little statement that said "whatever inconvenience that the American public feels, it will NOT be a result of a federal governement computer system. Hmmmm....

A great many people are taking solace in that statement. But, as one that works daily in the vagaries of governmental double-speak... you have to look at what was NOT said. There was no denial of event. In the past Koskinen has flatly debunked the potential for any impact, in light of previous statements this one was quite watered down. Now, couple that to the NERC report that nearly EVERY Y2k consultant and expert agrees is not quite forthcoming, to the point of almost being deceieving, and the recent statements from NRC officials expressing concern about the recently reported forgeries of Y2k complaince statements from Nuclear Power officials... Yes, Nuke power shut-down systems are fail-safed and will probably ( 80% confidence ) not melt down. But, Nuclear power generation is a Multiple step process that involves a power generation plant that is coupled to the reactor.

A previous thread made a statement about somebodys' sisters hairdresser's milkman saying that the Nuke plants are safe since they were built in the 50's and 60's and yada yada yada... Well the REACTOR is not the issue... it is the computerized power generation plants which have undergone massive modernizations since their inception. All the reactor does is create steam that the generation plant uses to create electricty.... Thats ALL. So, the Nuke may be ok, but the power contol computers, the generation plant the interface to the grid could be vulnerable.. Oh yeaah, that isn't a FEDERAL system now is it????
Hmmm.....

Regional power companies, municipals, etc... the chain seems to flow right down to the house. Now then, you all still with me, or have I been marginalized to raving lunatic??

Soooo... the NERC makes a seemingly glowing report to the Federales about the reliability of the power industry, and there are trial ballons being floated everywhere about power systems goiing "off-grid" to protect their consituencies. David Breshnahan, ( Yes I know that in some quarters he is considered a tabloid journalist ) is breaking stories about the activation of the NG because the NG Bureau says ( I havn't seen any documents as yet ) that full mobilization may be necessary because of black-outs. That costs $$$$$ The NG is going to blow about 80-90% of its annual budget ( payroll ) based on what the public is being told is a non-event????? Even Brashnahan has a reputation.. I don't think that he would go this far afield without justification. There are rampant reports of congressmen and even the WH stocking up on supplies. Hmmmm... Of course the Government would never deceive the public, would they??
Hmmmm... This stinks. Based on the FACTS, I suspect that the governement think tanks have a scenario that is so scary that they are afraid to let the sheeple know about it.

As a full-time Y2k consultant, I work in this environ every day. I have concluded the following:

The fundamental problem will not be technological in nature. It will be sociological. And, I do not feel that the impact of the Y2k debacle will be felt at one minute after midnight. Rather, it will take about a month for the process to begin. Small and medium businesses that discounted the potential impacts of Y2k will begin to fail as, to a large degree, these businesses are interdependent. By the end of January, many many shoesting firms will have gone under. This impact has a two-fold ripple. on the one hand it will further burden an tenuous welfare system. On the other hand, it will affect other businesses that had relied on the failed businesses for parts and supplies. I have not even begun to factor in the potentials from the impacts of failures from foreign suppliers. By mid February, medium sized businesses will begin to fail. This further excerbates the welfare problems. During most of this, the general population will be looking at the FED for guidance and answers ( as we have been program

Brazil floats; devalues and the stock markets goes up 34%. I agree; world of crazies. God help us.

Live Long and Prosper.

Live Long and Prosper.

RIO DE JANEIRO, Brazil ( AP ) -- The Brazilian currency tumbled and stock markets soared Friday as the government temporarily floated its currency, the real, in a new strategy to diffuse the global crisis hanging over Latin America. As euphoria raced through the markets, with investors seeing new bargains in Brazil, President Fernando Henrique Cardoso said the surprise action was necessary to save Brazil's foreign currency reserves and rebuild faith in plans to stabilize its shaken economy. "The devaluation will reduce the doubt in relation to our economy and create the conditions to lower interest rates," Cardoso said in a televised speech. The turmoil in South America's largest economy had raised fears that it would spread across the continent and even to the United States.

http://www.newsday.com/ap/rnmpfn1d.htm

kiwi
your
"Due to this leaders of these nations ( note elected leaders ) have gone to
Washington to grovel before a small group of people, mostly white male bankers.
Not only are they made to feel small, these leaders of nations of millions, they
are told that there efforts are worthless and that they should also shoulder ever
larger debt burdens for their nations. "

Is VERY astute. Our PM, The incomparable Jenny Shipley is in Washington, she met Al Gore, who 'quipped' to the press "I feel obliged to mention that [she] was born in Gore, New Zealand, and that Gore is just a short trip from a town called Clinton."

There is a choice cartoon: Shipley is shaking hands with Clinton. Clinton is saying "Glad you're here--Meeting someone so insignificant is such a neat snub to the Senate."


BTW
Do Merkans say "such a neat snub"? Sounds un-american, more kiwi or have I got beans in my ears?

Judge Makes Clinton Comment

PORTLAND, Ore. ( AP ) -- An abortion rights case erupted into calls for a mistrial today when a federal judge chided a witness by saying: ``Truthful means truthful.... This is not a Clinton deposition!'' Judge Robert E. Jones quickly apologized for his outburst and portrayed it as a comment made in jest at the end of a long week of testimony. The defense asked for a mistrial, which Jones quickly denied. A dozen defendants across the nation acknowledge that a Web site called ``The Nuremberg Files'' contain strong anti-abortion statements and graphic images. But they claim it is constitutionally protected political speech.

Im a little confused. You say that impact of Y2K will not be felt at midnight, yet in the previous paragraph you mention the failure of power generating facilities.

In the present morass of government lies and media hype, it is difficult to get ones bearing. What we really need is honest information from those trying to remediate the problem. Obviously if things are going badly, this cannot be acknowledged publically or even internally to management. We are already in the dark.

http://search.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/WAPO/19990115/V000916-011599-idx.html

Earl
Ham radio was discussed here on Jan 09 98. Load the whole morning and search on "Ham"

I tell you no porkies. ( rhyming slang for  )
I should stop hogging bandwidth

My compliments to the gentleman who, some time back, recommended James Grant's "The Trouble with Prosperity". It was an excellent historical review of banking and monetary matters from the '20s to 1996. Grant is one of the few who can do it and make it interesting as well.

If you're going to get salt, don't go out and buy 200 lbs of iodized table salt. If you *need* that much, you'll be doing canning/preservation, and iodized salt is not the best thing for that.

25lb bags of iodized available at Sam's for $4, and I got 2. But you'll need some plain salt ( canning salt, sea salt, etc. ) which is a little more expensive. One way to overcome that is to get "water softener" salt, which is more coarse and must be ground ( you *do* have a grain mill, right? ) . 50lb bags are available delivered for 5 bucks ( US ) . I've got almost half a ton, total cost about 100 bucks.

Tonight's "Where Are They Now?" segment focuses on a bankrupt and disappeared mining company, Dakota ( DKT ) , a high-cost producer brought down last year by excessive debt.

We our heroes left us, they were working on a bankable feasibility study for Thunder Mountain Gold ( THMG ) for Thunder's "Dewey Dome" project, expected to be a 1/4 million ounce open pit, 100 miles north of Boise.

I have not been able to find *anything* on Dakota since last summer. Has anyone heard where they are now, or more specifically, if they ever delivered the Dewey Dome study, or even more specifically, if THMG is doing anything with it?

If someone could dig up the gold ( literally and metaphorically ) , I would be very thankful.

Copyright 1999 El Borak, inc. Makers of Macarena Al ( tm ) jointless marionettes. Dances just like the real thing.

I mean Jan 09 1999

Thanks for your insightful post. There is no doubt that the price of oil could put a cap on the upper limit of how far gold could go. Isn't it true that gold is a leading indicator? Could gold lead oil back up? I don't know the answer to that but I pose the question. My other thought is the unusual circumstance of so much gold having been leased and sold onto the market. I still believe that there is a powder-keg situation out there. Long-Term Capital Manangement is another example. The Federal Reserve had a sudden quick meeting with Investment Banking Houses after that came out ( which shouldn't happen ) followed by three interest rate cuts. Also, I have read that another derivative mess is brewing with the Brazilian Real devaluation. The ingredients that brought out the global financial crisis are still there. If the newer use of derivatives in financial markets have replaced the use of gold as insurance, but derivatives have brought global markets to the edge of the abyss, I wonder how long before gold shines again.

Yeah, sort of like when our food shipment arrived today.

As the truck driver and I were greeting each other, I sheepishly said "Y2K."
He seemed nonplused. I asked: "You see a lot of this?" He then threw open
the roll door of the Yellow Freightliner semi and exclaimed: "You mean like
this?" The entire truck was pallets of food: some in buckets, some in boxes
-- all for Y2K.

Thanks. Will pursue the archives. ...... BTW, someone defined eternity as: Two people and a ham. ..... :- ) )

http://www.celtic-seasalt.com/saltoflife/celticsalt.html

Don't forget the CB band 27 - 28 MHz. Cheaper to buy and you don't need a licence. The current sun cycle is giving the best HF radio reception I have ever heard. From here in North Oz I can talk to west coast USA most mornings, the south half of Australia and Asia most days and Europe most evenings. Check out the DX ( long distance ) call channel on USB ( upper side band ) of 27.555 MHz. It's out of the legal band but that doesn't seem to worry anyone, least of all me!

If the DJIA trades between 9150 and 9400 for the next couple of days, there will be nice head and shoulders formation on the daily chart. This bearish formation in conjuction with earnings reports next week, and people coming to there senses over what the Brazil devaluation really means, could be the end of BULL.

Of course forcasting markets is a very hazardous job, and anything can and often does happen.

I currently have all my funds in cash, no PM, no stocks, no bonds.

All this is of course IMHO

Semi trailers loaded with palletized victuals? El Borak with 500 lbs of salt? ....... Sheeesh. I feel so insignificant. And I thought I was ahead of the curve.

On an eagle, both silver and gold, it says 1 oz. Are these troy oz's or regular oz's. If troy, how many troy oz's in a pound ? Thanks.

Those comments were not mine but lifted from cyberspace.

As to my own opinions we'll we'd need a case of scotch and a few hours.

Personally I doubt that Y2k will make the most impact as the clock rolls over.

There will be many effects starting to be felt this year and also spread throughout next year.

The rollover may create a lots of effects happening at once, but I somehow feel that the real effects of Y2k will start to show up a few months after the rollover.

As the domino effect turns into a contagion that slowly spreads.

How much power are you running with that CB rig? Also what are you using for an antenna? Probably more important than the transmission power.

about the increased GC volume on COMEX, going into a decline, that you can smell a currency crash. Or, that's my take on it.
I cannot fathom the glib rush to buy the NASDAQ 100, Or MSH, or SOX at these multiples, during the destruction of currencies that is taking place.
The CRB; how low can it go with the cascading devaluations that are coming from South America. let's not forget that the economies of the continent are heavily dependent on commodities. Is Argentina next? Likely not the next, but it is in the que.
I have seen references to the problems of Brasil because of low oil prices. I don't think that they produce much oil. The big deal with Brasil was that they were becoming self sufficient in energy by the reliance on ethanol from biomass.
The collapse of S America will bring devastation to the heartland of N America. US and Canadian grain and meat producers are on their knees from the past devaluations. What is in store for them now? How do they pay the bank for past borrowings? We goldbugs have gotten the preview of the defaults and closings of assorted mines, with the total loss to shareholders. It's coming home to Main Street NA.
In our county, Case-International Harvester is the largest employee. The employees that have lived on the credit bubble that was extended to damned near anyone with dirt in the world, will get a glimpse of the pop of the bubble. The plants have shut for the Christmas holiday and will not open until February. The layoffs will be staggering. The city is full of tractors that were to be shipped on long-booked sales, but, the buyers haven't the money to pay. The massive sales to Kazahkistan of the last years are in default, and a goodly portion of the inventory was scheduled to follow the earlier sales.
The unemployment pay to the laid off workers will drag down the rest of the manufacturers here too.
Meanwhile gold languishes. The paper that will be printed to rescue the agriculture and support industries, and the banks that finance them, is just the tip of the bear's ears that I see from my hometown. When the "service industries" that tag along with the hard goods industries lose their funding, the all hell will break loose.
It's the same-old same-old, all over again. Redundancies R'US.
The crash of Brazil was old business to anyone on this forum. You know that the float of the Real will not change anything that was put into motion by the ease of tree money. Trees make paper; Trees float, paper floats, but, eventually it gets waterlogged, and decomposes on the way to the bottom.
I did see the guy on CNBC today that seemed like the public perception of a goldbug. He is a medium-longhair/no tie, slightly baffled look, etc.
He mentioned the 80,000,000 Oz short position, and, called for 300.00 in two weeks. 10 x deliverable shorts.
This, if it happens, will be an out for the trading positions. ( XAU 75. )
Maybe the market isn't ready for the big run in gold, yet. It will come though.
There will be a massive devaluation in the reserve currency, and, it will not be the Euro that precipitates it; more likely the Swissie than the hordes of colorful papers.

http://www.mplik.ru/~sg/transl/weight.html

Thanks for the Kitco reference on ham radios. Will peruse and self educate. I continue to be amazed by the things that can be learned on this Gold forum. You name it, history, geography, meteorology, geology, civics, law, music, etc., have been discussed and debated here at Kitco. In addition, the more arcane and even "out there" subjects like UFOs, alchemy, and the Templars are written about. Somehow, it all works. It even manages to be related to Gold. Gs&Ps to one and all who frequent this sceptered forum. This Kitco.

Gold and silver are ( as far as I have ever seen ) denominated in Troy ounces. The Troy pound surprised me ( I just looked it up )

Troy ounce = 31.103 gm
Troy Pound = 12 troy Ounces

have banners on the golden eagle web site. I'm not surprised. It's interesting that there are few posts about the price of Durban, Harmony or Randgold. I guess we'd probably be better off not talking about that. I don't look at them. Too painful. If you're out there SKIP, I hope you are managing.

I'm with you, everything in cash. Actually, I am planning to purchase a few hundred of these silver eagles they're giving away, but everything else stays in cash.

Thank you brothers.

I am currently using 100watts through a vertical antennae. I have a five element Yagi but haven't bothered firing it up yet. In the early 1980's I spoke to a QRP ( low power ) Ham operator in Arkansas who was transmitting with 5 watts. I could hear him perfectly. He then turned his power down to one watt and I could still read him perfectly! Best to spend more money on the antennae than the rig. Cubical Quads ( full wavelength ) work best and are fairly easy to make.

Help!
I can't get on to the kitco ftp server, this link doesn't work:
ftp://ftp.kitcomm.com/pub/discussion

Gotta post sumpin !

Anyone with a Mac, please look at my post after midnight kitco time, if I can access the server..

I went looking for that article at the usatoday.com website...finaly I found it.. http://archives.usatoday.com/plweb-cgi/fastweb?search...only one problem...they want to charge me $1.00...I paid $.50 this AM and got the whole dang paper...Hope this doesn't make anybody feel I think this whole crowd is worthless...call them as you see them...OK.. I'm just one cheap clucker...might be I just hate to use these dang machines...My typing skills might be 4-5 words per min...wiyh errors...that might explain for my literary skills...didn't ever claim to be the brightest clucker in the flock!...oh well,that's what the scroll button is for...sorry about the article,it was a good one

From the one who can't chew gum and walk at the same time..Chicken man..

To all ..
CNN ran a piece last night showing how Merkans just
werent watching the Senate inpeachment trial.. Every
one interviewed said the same things .. "boring" ..
" a lotta yak yak yak " ... "leave the poor guy alone".
An amazing bit of manipulation .. ie it's trendy not
to watch .. CNN doesnt want anyone to see how damning
the evidence is .. the Congress did its homework.
For a while when I watch a few Senators make their
generally excellent presentations .. I felt sorry I
left the US. But when I saw the reaction of the
"people" .. I was glad I was outta there..
... and Larry King says he "loves the guy" ..

: Are you saying whether you use windowing or field expansion, no matter how
: well tested systems are before 1999-12-31, they can both throw up errors
: occuring in real time as a result of a number of factors, such as data
: entry errors, missed field conversions and such like? The article I was
: quoting said that 'code fixes work as soon as the system is in production'
: and this implies that one can be more confident in the testing carried out
: before the end of 1999. Our UK British Computer Society Year 2000 book
: does seem to confirm more confidence in date expansion, and I know Chris
: Anderson has said it is preferable. Whilst I understand there are good
: reasons for employing windowing, I would merely like to see if we can get
: some kind of measure of confidence in the testing results of, say banks who
: have used windowing as against expansion.
:
: I get the impression you would say whichever technique you use, the
: probability of the outcome when tested in real time will be the same?
:
------------------------------------------------------
[Alan] I believe that both techniques have the potential
to contain bugs that will not manifest themselves until you start
processing dates after 31/12/99. The field expansion technique is
probably less error-prone because conversion code has only to be added
once for each date field ( in the conversion programs ) and little logic
has to be added to application programs other than those which obtain
dates from the user. In a well run shop, all record layouts will be in
copy books ( COBOL ) or header files ( C ) and therefore each will only need
to be edited once. Windowing means that logic has to be inserted to work
out which century a date falls every time it is processed. OTH, the
conversions required for field expansion can be a logistical nightmare.
Windowing will only work for the extent of the date window used,
different installations and software suppliers are selecting different
windows.

Field expansion may require more programs to be re-compiled,
since all programs that read files containing dates will need to be
compiled to reflect the changed positions of fields in records.
Re-compilation can introduce errors because the source code compiled may
not be for the correct version ( many installations have thousands of
programs that have been developed over 10+ years, some may not have been
touched for years and the original programmers long since departed ) .
Again, these errors may not be encountered for some time.

Field expansion is a more clean and more logical approach.
Windowing is more straight-forward to plan and implement.

---------------------------------------------------
Thank you, Alan, for yet another excellent and informative response.

If as you say expansion is less error prone then Merrill Lynch are maybe
promoting their use of expansion over and above windowing to show that they
truly have used a 'more clean and more logical approach' to challenge their
competitors who they may know have used windowing? This might sway
investors who have some knowledge of the difference as they might expect
fewer problems to be exposed after 1999-12-31?

Surely in field expansion you can test for errors thoroughly before the end
of the year because you don't need to wait for real time running to see
errors occuring. Although errors will occur due to data entry errors and
maybe, even after exhaustive testing, fields may have been missed, won't
the testing results before the end of the year be more reliable than all
the testing on windowed systems?

I think you have to put it in the top level directory for it to work.

Crazytimes
when Vronsky suggested Harmony and Drooy, Harmony was
under 2$ a share and Drooy below a dollar as I recall.
I bought harmony at 2 $ .. sold at 5$.. bought back
below 4$ and now its 4 5/8. I dont mind pain like that
too much .

From one who chews and runs - don't bother it ain't worth it.

Who wants to pay for news when there's more than one can read on the web.

----
Who ya gonna call???
http://www.canoe.ca/CNEWSStormCentral/photo2.html

Don't forget that gas furnaces have electric blowers - got yours???

Crusty
we got this new, rather odd TV channel, we get half German TV {DW} and Some merkan channel I've not grocked yet. We saw Mike Tyson's live interview, he is quite mad this Tyson. Everyother word was a profanity, the interviewer firmly ended the interview.


Nope, can't get to the fttp server

To all ..
The South African Cricket team has been under great
pressure from the Gomment to have more Black faces on
the national side. Whether they know how to play or
not is a secondary matter. The team has three colored
guys ..Gibb, Telarmachus, and a little spin bowler
whose name eludes me. Gibb is brilliant .. Telarmachus
is always injured .. the spinner is okay but less good
than Symcox ...But these guys are not BLACK ENOUGH ..
Now they did have ONE Black Xhosa speaking Black
fast bowler named Ntini .. whose efforts were not
too overwhelming in the few matches they used him in.
.. them he disapeared .. "out with injuries" ..
was the message .. Then references to "personal
problems" .. then friday cat jumped from bag ..
in court in East London on rape charges.
.. did you say out for a DUCK ?? what was that ??

bbll

http://www.canoe.ca/TopStories/y2k_jan15.html

Dad wants to know how many Port-a-loos will be needed for New York if the sewerage system stops functioning.

Should he trade in his gold coins for Port-a-loos???