Foundational Gold Trail Commentary

The Inside Story on the Gold-for-Oil Deal that could Rock the World's Financial Centers

(Wed Feb 04 1998 18:47 - ID#60253)

Consider, can they all buy silver?

The most important thing to observe is that Mr. Buffett did NOT use any form of paper to represent his silver. No options on silver, no futures, no options on silver futures, no silver mining stocks, no leased silver deals from mining stocks and no MARGIN! Most of the large buyers of metals are buying the physical, outright. Mr. Buffett had Berkshire

Hathaway purchase silver as part of it's long term "economic investment outlook". Not to be confused with a leveraged, quick profits bet. Understand, that Berkshire plays within the "world paper economy parameters", they are not looking for a currency replacement. What is not seen, are the personal holdings of Mr. Buffett, Mr. Soros and countless other "world wealthy". In those accounts you will indeed find silver, but also, much more gold!

Note, that he was buying thru much of last year. So were a number of others. The one common thought from them all is that, "the real wealth will be held in PHYSICAL form"!

"you may also follow in the footsteps of giants"

(Wed Feb 04 1998 19:37 - ID#60253)

Mr. H. Hitter,
Timing? Most of the very large buyers completed much of their conversion all of last year. When we speak of these entities one must know that they purchase much larger amounts than Berkshire. Most cannot understand that it is difficult to take five or ten million oz./gold in physical in a month or less. Note that Mr. Buffett has taken six months and only purchased about half of his silver! Even here we speak of only $300m for the amount taken. At this time the market is very, very tight for large money to go into physical. Paper, yes! I could move five billion US into paper metal very fast, but not physical.

Is silver being played to ignite ? Only the small paper movers are trying for the "fast buck squeeze". Most of them get eaten when the lions come for food. The big wealth is only trying to convert! Silver is good, but always to small. Perhaps at $150us it would work? Most are looking for a "currency/wealth" holding with history! They, ( this includes some CBs ) want a holding that is spread far and wide, and very deep! Gold is good.

(Wed Feb 04 1998 20:24 - ID#60253)

What are your "THOUGHTS" regarding the major currencies being backed by PM's?

Mr. Junior,
Any nation/state can put it's economy/currency on a gold standard. They only have two requirements. Own a stockpile of gold and raise the price very high!

In the past, when currencies were gold, a nation could not lower the amount of gold backing it's currency ( raise the price of gold ) because it lowered the currency unit worldwide and created payment imbalances. Today, no nation/currency is on a gold standard. The first country that starts will own the rest for some time.

Find me a country with many needed resources, little debt in relation to the assets and a national pride to lead? Let them price gold at many thousands not only in their currency but also in their resources! The world would buy from them, cheaply in gold but dearly in all other unbacked currencies. The markets would do the rest!

The large modern currencies, of today have only debt ridden economies to back them. They cannot change as debt blocks their path. "To change is to live and to live, some debts must die". The owners of much of this debt must lose if change is to occur. Even the new EURO will not be backed by gold! It will HOLD gold only as insurance against the worst outcome, war.

Yes, an oil state comes to mind! It could even be China!

(Wed Feb 04 1998 21:02 - ID#60253)

Mr. Kiwi,
Will the paper market ever represent the physical?...

You will see it in out time!

Will a total collapse be necessary first?

Perhaps a "almost total"??

It seems the vested interests in the paper game are powerful enough to

keep the physical down indefinitely?

In a very real sence, games can go on forever. The question here is;

Can those powerful thru "paper wealth" go on indefinitely? History has shown that they end suddenly, with great puzzlement as to the loss of importance without wealth.

(Wed Feb 04 1998 23:23 - ID#60254)


Mr. Studio. R.,
Will several ( or many ) bullion banks fail?

"when one cannot repay a loan, it is done" !

Are the bullion banks bonded?...

In the real national/ world there is no such thing as "bonded".

Look to Korea for proof!

Mr. Sweat,
If oil or the BIS bid for gold, you will know it ! In your terms,

" up front and personal"??

RBA's 167 tonnes ? No comment.

Mr. Kuston,
Please understand, that wealth will move into all forms of real assets as the destruction of our debt/ digitial currency system continues. When the currencies move to a final resolution, it will be the "marketplace for precious metals" that will die first! It is well known that gold will hold it's value above everything. All other metals could lose much of the value they gained prior to this meltdown! Remember, "when the currencies go to nuclear war, all paper and paper markets will burn"! Many hard assets will lose in the public mind as confusion will rule. In the thoughts of many, gold will perform!

(Wed Feb 04 1998 23:39 - ID#60254)

Mr. A. Goose,

Davos ? Watch what Mr. Munk of ABX does with his paper gold. A move to copy WB, but buying physical gold for his personal account would not be of supprise! The CBs have stopped selling/leasing and that has put the entire world of LBMA "at risk". ABX is of that world.

(Thu Feb 05 1998 00:09 - ID#60254)

Mr. Aurator,
As in my 23:23 post, I cannot comment on this.

167 tonnes ?

(Thu Feb 05 1998 00:16 - ID#60254)

WetGold and JTF,
I will reply on the 07th .

(Sat Feb 07 1998 18:45 - ID#60253)

Some see metals from a view of only "supply and demand". Supply must be put for use and real demand must consume to produce a product. It is not this way with all things! If a person holds gold, must that holding is viewed with the one purpose, to sell some day for profit or loss. It is for some minds that gold in both hands can have no use? Such a mind can only see value in paper terms. For such thought finds gold as wealth, only if it is someday turned back to paper! Paper, indeed! A dangerous position to hold for the future in our lives!

Brokers and traders will show you, "turn your gold into wealth", "put it to productive use, Trade It"! "Sell your gold and buy it again, many times". "Do this and find the value lost from your youth"!

But I say, spend your time in the company of truly wealthy ones, see how they make gold lie very still! Know this now, the world will again, in your time, feel value in gold as never before. And that value will be as the "productive use of holding wealth thru the fire of change". "Yes, you can also walk in the footsteps of giants".

Think now in light of the real world around us. Hold your assets in the sun of day, what do we see? A government bond denominated in a currency? Now, remove the currency from the bond, show what is in your hand? Hear me now, we see nothing of "productive use"! Yes, there is supply of the currency, and we have demand for the currency, but the end product is as the space between stars! Even in this "light of day" a trader/ government will tell you, "hold not that commodity, gold, for it is as a dead, unproductive asset". I say, run from these lies, for they see not deep in the future!

Is this not true? I an slow, but many think for me. Read please:

"Noone can see the value of a real asset when knowing how many currency units it is denominated in. Value is only known when holding one real asset next to another real asset and comparing the currency unit valuations of both. Use as an example, a $75,000 $US Mercedes and a small apartment, also $75,000. They can be traded using the currency as a temporary holding until the transaction is complete. The car and apartment are viewed as having productive use of equal value. However, it is the items that have the value, not the currency unit! The currency is of but momentary value expressed as "the intention of a trade completion". Complete the trade and "poof" the units hold no future value. At this point in time, everything in the world is "denominated" in currencies that have no use, except to complete the trade! Trillions upon trillions of digitized currency are currently being held for the "completion of commerce", extending out into other lifetimes! Of course we are speaking of any form of currency denominated debt, be it government or private.

The major threat to this collection of wealth holdings would be the introduction of any real asset currency. Any country that could "resource a currency" of use the world over does pose a threat to the wealth of nations greater then war! It is in the realm of possibilities, that a gold or oil based system would bring a resolution to the present structure as equal to " a nuclear war of currencies". Our concept of value, would indeed have to start over. "

Mr. Cjs1, To say "this is good" or "your view is a good one" in my world, is to say "I agree" in your world. "good thoughts flow as cool water for a thirsty mind"


Date: Thu Feb 05 1998 00:01
JTF ( Peter Munk, ABX, and LBMA ) ID#57232:
Another: Could you tell us more about what Peter Munk may have done?

Mr. JTF,
ABX is in debt for gold. They owe not currency but gold. They are a paper company operating in a paper world. No government will allow any entity to sell gold for thousands an ounce when debts by that country go unpaid. Especially when the paper that represents the gold that is owed by a miner, is held by some who gain thru the loss to the all. In that time, gold will have a far better use. Remember, "gold and oil will ever flow in the same direction"


Date: Wed Feb 04 1998 23:52
WetGold ( ANOTHER ) ID#243180:

Without speaking in parable ?

Buy physical gold and hold it close. Real wealth can not know time, it is good for all seasons. It will buy you honor during a time without truth!

I will return in a time.

(Sat Feb 07 1998 20:51 - ID#60253)

In addition to this "What is the catalyst for the coming event and when will it happen ?"

Mr. WetGold,
One fine day, life in your world will change. The newspaper will show what has happened. In that day the price of oil will rise to, prehaps well over $100/bl if purchased with US$ alone. It will cost , perhaps $8.00/bl if purchased with an additional, tiny amount of gold. Perhaps, in a time before 2000, a new oil currency will be born! In that day, debts will burn and currencies will war, and you sir will, with honor, raise your standard of living with Gold!

(Sat Feb 07 1998 23:22 - ID#60253)


Date: Sat Feb 07 1998 20:00
Forklift ( Another ) ID#156161:
What country would have the brilliant wisdom and daring to make gold it's currency and thus own the world? What new regional entity, yet to form, could accomplish this?

Mr. Forklift,
Your eyes are, no doubt more clear than mine. Stand here with me as we view this race of two! As in all things, it is a game for some and to others it be life and death. I would say, stop this effort, but it is late in history. So, make ready, as we will be here for the finish!

(Sun Feb 08 1998 09:51 - ID#60253)

Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 08:50
CJS1__A ( Replies ) ID#329157:

I would say you have chosen well! Over many seasons, the currencies have come to bid in this race and all were found as "low bid". The time for "full production" is at hand. No currency is large enough for this race, so a new one will arrive from the past!

This you say: An alligator is, they say, "all mouth and no ears".

This is good, I show a great smile!

Mr. Pete,
I have written of this. See the list from Mr. Fin. Try using $30,000/gold, the value is better for all!

(Sun Feb 08 1998 10:17 - ID#60253)


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 09:42
Forklift ( CJS1__A ) ID#156161:
"it is also something of great value which they cannot defend"

Mr. Forklift,
You must place yourself in that time! Nations with gold and armies will stand for Arabia! $8.00us/bl oil is indeed a resource to fight for!

(Sun Feb 08 1998 10:31 - ID#60253)

Date: Sat Feb 07 1998 21:28
refer ( ANOTHER @ THOUGHTS ) ID#41229:
Is your warnings to us of something that may happen?, something you feel will happen?, or something that is in progress and you know will happen?

Mr. refer,
I submit to you that, thruout time the progress of men does proceed at many speeds. I do offer my thoughts on a direction that is taken for a chosen time. But, who can know the minds of builders? Of my life and times, I do say, this structure will be completed of the well being of all! For this new system to fail, it will be as Mr. Donald has said, with much destruction of commerce.

(Sun Feb 08 1998 10:45 - ID#60253)


Date: Sun Feb 08 1998 10:24
WetGold ( ANOTHER ) ID#243180:
Since Arabia will be protected AND the U.S. has a strong allie in Arabia ---
Will the relationship sour or will be united with a common goal ?

Please see Another's post from yesterday AM and on. You and all western minds must weight this offer as it is heavy for your side! A great many losses will be for the holders of debt and paper things, but the gains are for a better life. There will be many for NO! Time will prove all things!

(Sun Feb 08 1998 11:01 - ID#60253)

I will be gone for some time.

(Sat Feb 14 1998 19:10 - ID#60253)

I would say, you are thinking well with this thought:

Date: Mon Feb 09 1998 18:20
SDRer__A ID#288156:
"derivatives EXIST because the system is broken"

To this I would add:
" a broken system EXIST because oil still backs the US$"

It is good, this system, for the world economy is strong from the easy flow of oil. But, the economy is as living persons, and subject to the stress of real life! We do now reach high production of goods and service worldwide. But, in terms of our financial system, the ability to trade these goods, has reached it's limit! Even as a mountain climber, humans have limits, as we can move only "so high" and "so fast" at this altitude. Today, the derivatives start to fail because the world trading system is slowing down, even as products are produced faster and cheaper. The economy has reached "the top of the mountain" and noone can see this.

As you read this, persons buy companies thru your Dow Jones at values that reflect "the supply of cheap oil" and it's good effects for business in general. What they do not see is the undoing of the currency world that "good business" must have to operate. The "oil standard" created and held this currency world intact, thru much abuse. Today, the "derivatives", that require a long future of "good business", are being "devalued"! Look far and wide as you are, now , at the top of this hill! The world will head down this slope because it is not a machine and is subject to "thin air".

History has shown that as persons slip from a high stance, they grasp for items that are known to be secure! They do reach for real things! Derivatives offer not a solid hold. It is well known that the modern gold market is fat with contracts derived from "intentions to supply". It is also known that the US$ continues on the "oil standard" because of this paper. No doubt, oil will continue to flow, but what currency will take this supply as we "walk down the mountain"?

In that day, "good money" will become "bad money" and "derivatives" will be paid to the holders of "derivatives"! In that day, a gold mine will also be paid in "derivatives", for it's gold will be for the benefit of all.

This is the way for you to see this modern gold market:

"Today, the paper gold market only affects the physical as the price is pushed down! It is the physical market that destroys the paper gold as price rises. In a falling market, paper can be settled in physical gold or cash! In a limit up market, paper can only be settled in more paper or cash!"

It is of this knowledge that wealthy ones and some CBs are taking in physical gold.

Look to LBMA, for currency looking for gold! Compare the Comex average open interest with it's average daily trading volume. Now use average daily trading volume at LBMA and convert to open interest in London, using comex ratio. Here you will find "real currency" in "paid for" gold derivatives ( not futures ) ! This money is now looking to convert to physical! It is caught in this paper with no way out! Know that this amount covers not CB gold moved by big trader! That wealth is safe, as it is for the good of all in those countries!

Mr. Bart,
Your fee, it is a good thing. I would be more open and bring the thoughts of others for all to see. " all persons live for as one world and secrets are for the fools"

(Sat Feb 14 1998 20:18 - ID#60253)


Date: Sat Feb 14 1998 19:34
Preacher ( ANOTHER; A Question ) ID#225273:
"free flow of oil is more important than the Pacific economies. Could you explain your view on that more clearly? "

Mr. Preacher,
A time ago, the Asians were buying great amounts of gold thru South Africa. This alone was enough to drive the price of physical very high. As cheap oil required low gold, this action was, not good. In addition, during this time, a person in Hong Kong was moving many wealths into much "paper gold" in London. The amount "leveraged" was so large, in physical terms, that delivery would not happen, as no CB would sell that much. This gold paper was purchased from $365 down with intent to buy all at production cost ( below $300US ) . Much of this paper was converted, but London had to sell so much new volume that it changed the paper market, forever! That is why the CB had been seen as selling to honor this paper. The BIS stopped the CB sales and drove physical gold from Asia as a last resort! Oil has locked the CB and IMF gold from sales of significance. What metal that trades worldwide, is all there is.

Perhaps, this has answered your first question, also. WW3? Wars are fought over oil, not gold!

thank you.

(Sat Feb 14 1998 20:50 - ID#60253)


Date: Sat Feb 14 1998 19:58
Heavy Hitter ( ANOTHER ) ID#403159:
"but maybe you have a hunch?"

Mr. Hitter,
The price of "hunch" is very to high for investment! It is the reason so many paper gold buyers take on appearance of " to much sun"! I offer this, do not use the solid reasons for owning physical gold, as a purpose to trade it. Your profits from such trade, will, on the last day, in the heat of fire, burn as paper does! Sir, the world is going to change, and the rules of engagement will also change. Gold will be repriced, once! It will be enough for your time of life.

(Sat Feb 14 1998 21:32 - ID#60253)


Date: Sat Feb 14 1998 20:00
WetGold ( ANOTHER ) ID#243180:
This appears to be a monumental world crisis much worse than the depression of the early 20th century. Could U expand further ?

Mr. WetGold,
In the past, nations and states have lost all as " the world changed" and these entities lost the ability to trade, at a profit. It is as history, and happened many times. Today, it is not the same. The "wealth of nations" are held as "thoughts of value" not real value! And even these thoughts are "in debt" as they are owed to other nations. As it has always been, time moves the minds of people to change, and with this, the thoughts of value also change. In this day, as not in the past, the loss of paper value as a concept will destroy the very foundation of wealth that this economic system is built on. This drama has started and is well underway!

There are nations that will try to "resource a new currency" as the old financial system implodes. Oil or gold or both may be used. If it is done at the correct time, much will be gained by all! Fail this Attempt, and gold will never trade on an open exchange again, in our lifetime! We will see this end in our time.

thank you.

(Sat Feb 14 1998 22:22 - ID#60253)


Date: Sat Feb 14 1998 21:01
Preacher ( ANOTHER & Interest rates ) ID#225273:
"Thank you for that answer. Perhaps I'm dense, but I'm still not clear on how driving the gold from the HK traders collapsed the Pacific economies" ?

These Pacific economies were "on the edge" for some time, that is why many peoples there were buying gold. As the financial systems approached resolution, " the OPPORTUNITY was observed" to allow the currencies to plunge, without help! Much gold ( not all ) was driven from the Pacific rim, and the buying has slowed much. Many underestimate the need to keep gold in the low $300US.

" Also, you are looking for lower short-term interest rates, but skyrocketing long-term rates along with a higher US$"?


In an effort to maintain the dollar/oil bond. It is well to know that oil holds not long term US debt as backing for it's currency. In the end the CBs will let the long bond plunge in price. That is why most of the US debt is not "long", this change is for that time.

(Sat Feb 14 1998 22:29 - ID#60253)

Date: Sat Feb 14 1998 21:21
WetGold ( ANOTHER ) ID#243180:
" How do Muslims in the Middle East and around the world reconcile this in their pursuit of GOLD with the "New Paradigm" ?

Sir, I do not know.

(Sat Feb 14 1998 22:51 - ID#60253)

Date: Sat Feb 14 1998 21:22
Goldhawk ( Another Excuse my brashness ) ID#433286:
" Just curious"?

Mr. Goldhawk,
Your life and times, it would fill a book I would read with much thought and intent! My book would be thin as compared to this history of gold. Together, we will read this book of gold and live it's modern life. It is the truth of this life of gold that pulls our minds to gain knowledge, not my life.

Mr. Pete, another time, thank you

I will be gone for a time.

(Mon Feb 16 1998 14:40 - ID#60253)

We will have a "change of events", please read,

"The Time Is Right For A CHANGE OF EVENTS"!

They traveled a long road to get here. Back in the early 70's they ran out of gold after printing too many dollar commitments. If they couldn't use gold anymore, what else could be used? You know and I know that the buck would have been dumped real fast without something behind it! All the talk back then and now, "everybody's gona hold the greenback because of the USA economy and it's military might", yea, right. Didn't see any coverage on the TV, showing the behind the door financial rooms. Truth was, everybody was going to move straight to the hard currencies and gold! Dam the effects on the world economy, figure that out later.

But, look here, the oil states said, "we will settle all oil payments in US$" ! Buy the oil in any currency and rate, but when you make the check, dollars please. The US agreed to float gold up to $250 if they went along. At that time, oil agreed because they held a hunk of gold in the NY fed bank valts. Looking at it back then, 250 looked to cover anything! Well , anything happened and the Carter had to slam gold in 78 when it crossed 250! Guess the US thought oil would just stop buying gold with excess cash, per the "agreement back in 71". Anyway, the rest is history through the 80's. Everybody learned to "love the dollar and hate the Russians"!

Everything changed in a hurry during Desert Storm. Remember how gold got hammered, big time! War in the oil fields and gold down? Looked good on the TV news, "America is winning, the dollar is good" Gold? No need! Here's what really happened.

In a very real way, the US dollar was inflated so much that even oil couldn't back it! Yes! The US ran through the gold backing in the 70's then went to a much larger oil backing in the 80's. But, even oil couldn't contain the huge expansion of dollar commitments that were created by the early 90's. Back to the drawing board. This time the US had to add gold to the oil backing mix, if the dollar was to remain on top!

A little political thought first, then we continue.:

Do you really think the US is the only country that will stand a military in the oil fields? What if they told the US, NO, we want someone else to defend us? You think there are no other takers? The truth is, everyone is lined up to offer defense. The price of "oil backing the defenders currency" is worth almost anything! All the deficit spending you want, goes to the defender! Even Russia, if you can believe it! As my friend would say, "you think long and hard on this"!

Now, back to gold. The deal: you may stand your army for us, in return, " oil will back the dollar, if the dollar is made strong by gold" "in as much as our people may replace the lost value of oil with gold" "in as much as we will produce oil in amounts to equate a gold/oil/dollar ratio close to that which existed at out previous agreement in the 70's" And, pray tell, how does the USA make the dollar strong in gold ? The BIS leads the creation of a paper gold market that will lower the world price of gold to the extent that it remains above "production costs".

Guess what, it worked! Contrary to all expectations of oil shortages, inflation, debt collapse and what have you, It Worked! But, there is one small problem?

The BIS and other various governments that developed this trade ( notice I didn't use conspiracy as it was good business, as the world gained a lot ) , thought that the paper gold forward market would have allowed the gold industry to expand production some five times over! Don't ask where they got this, as they are the same people that bring us government finance and such. But, without a major increase in gold supply, the paper created by this "gold control operation" will either be paid by, 1. new supply. 2. the central banks. 3. rollover existing. 4. cash? 5. or total default! As the Asians started buying up everything last year ( 97 ) , number 5 and 5 started looking like the answer! When the CBs started selling into this black hole of demand, the discussion of #5 started in their rooms also.

What is really interesting is how gold is being viewed and traded in some areas. Some people are using it's future "reset price, in terms of oil" as a value discount. In other words, they use paper gold to buy things based on the new oil/gold relationship perceived as a given in two years or less! It is assumed that this proportion of paper gold held by oil, will be converted, no matter what? We are talking, many thousands an ounce here!

So where are we now? I'm' not sure! How much gold paper is out there? If you look at the comex ratio of average daily volume to open interest, it's sometimes around 8. Funny thing that ratio is close to the gold commitments traded in London. Multiply, say 40 million ozs by the ratio of 8 and we get 320,000,000 ozs. of gold. Now, the money is in this gold paper, paid up. Just no gold yet, I think? That's about 10 tons, I'll be dam! That's a lot of IOU gold, don't you think? Add to this, that between the IMF and what CBs could sell, only about 1/3 of it is available at a much higher price, if at all! Then again, I'm not in any position to know this, am I?

Wonder if anybody else knows or thinks this? Sure could mess up a sweet deal for the world economy. Does anybody have a plan, a currency plan, if things change? But, then again, just like in the early 70s, nothing changes. Does it?

(Mon Feb 16 1998 19:39 - ID#60253)


Date: Mon Feb 16 1998 18:09
STUDIO.R ( @Obsidian.... ) ID#93232:
I believe that the estimate should have read 10,000 Tons=sold position.

Thank you,

My good friend did not place three 0s. My thoughts come thru one computer, but move far thru time and ones in line. I will return.

(Mon Feb 16 1998 20:51 - ID#60253)


Date: Mon Feb 16 1998 20:19
mozel ( @ Silverbaron ) ID#153102:

Mr. Mozel,
Thru these "thoughts" I have made effort for many months, in haste, to make clear. My words are plain, but hard, and others have presented this truth in a western way. But, you sir, have made the best of it!

"make your path through the darkness, despair not, for one with direction and purpose, will read the map and complete the journey"

I make clear for you to lead!

thank you

(Sat Feb 21 1998 23:47 - ID#60253)

A CB lends gold at 2% to a producer for a better purpose than make money on idle asset. This gold loan is now the gold asset with a mine behind it! Such assets are traded and create solid paper for oil. If reason for good return was real, it would look like below. Read ABX page and consider, please.

There is much with this question!

Why doesn't a CB enter into a "reverse spot deferred gold contract" from the same Bullion Banks it lends gold to? Conditions:

1. CB lends gold at 2% to the Bullion Bank.

2. The Bullion Bank sells the gold at $300US.

3. The BB earns interest on the proceeds.

4. One year later, if gold is below $300, the BB buys in the gold and the CB gets it's gold back plus the contango.

5. OR, if gold is above $300, the CB invokes the "spot deferred" clause and lends more gold at $300+ to the BB. The first deal is deferred until another time as intrest builds.

6. In this process the CB will bypass the gold companies and gain more return.

Read the ABX hedging page, we discuss at another time!

(Sun Feb 22 1998 20:13 - ID#60253)

It is written that "A voice that is true has many minds for reproof, but one tongue can never be as the same thought with all men ". I say, "draw from these words what you have not and make use as your past will allow".

How can one know value in currency, when paper does not lie still? It moves at night, where noone can see, and this we hold to prove out worth? Real things know not this paper value, for they hold tight in the earth. In this time, we do stand firm with value and watch as "thoughts of others change in the wind"!

The modern currency price of oil and gold does not show the "risk" of a paper storm. It offers "no sign" for the weather ahead! Today, some see the value of oil as true, thru gold. But "risk" comes not in currency inflation by price of things, but in currency destruction thru "choice of use"! Find "one nation for gold" and "all thoughts will move as one". For as persons need real things for life, they do "want" and "reach" for a "real measure for worth". Not one by concept, but as "true from the past".

All persons hold wealth as never before, but search in vain for "this measure", one that "blows not in the wind of thought". For the good of all, this search does end, but brings with it the storm of change! The trust of old values will break in this new wind. Hold your worth firm on the ground as no storm will move a true value with weight, a weight for the winds of this season, gold!

It is a poor reason and purpose, that a CB lends gold for 2%! A simple farmer is better not to plant, as a harvest of grain for 2% is as a wage below life itself! Know they do this for a higher reach, as the gain is not for the return of metal, but it's use in trade. As in all things, the world does change and this purpose of CBs is now of the past. A "Desert Storm" offered birth for this new "paper oil currency" and a "currency storm" will now bring it's change. As a "currency of gold" springs from this wind, western trading in this metal will end. The "terms" of all currencies will change as the "use" of these moneys is changed. Many will now know true worth as the "terms" of every asset does find a "real price" and a "real value" in the "true world of things". For the future of most, "the wealth that was shown in paper" will be seen as clouds in the sky!

Thank You

(Sun Feb 22 1998 20:38 - ID#60253)


Date: Sun Feb 22 1998 20:29
Heavy Hitter ( ANOTHER ) ID#403159:

Mr. Hitter,
I must wait to answer all questions! I will save and reply, as much is in "progress" as we speak!

Thank you

(Tue Feb 24 1998 19:14 - ID#60253)

Many ask, "why does gold act in this way"? I say, "it is not the gold market of your past"! Tonight, I will have one bring you "the ways" of my thoughts. It be in a clear tongue for you.

For most of you, your time is very expensive, but still, I ask you to read this as "it may be worth your time"! I say this now in light of posts from JTF 13:14, ALLEN 13:00 AND SDR 12:10.

If not to transmit, then the next day. Tonight, if yes!

(Tue Feb 24 1998 21:46 - ID#60253)

One of my favorite sayings comes from Another, "this thing of life, it is a hard game we play, yes?". It does seem to cover all the emotions, I use it often.

But, this game of gold, it is not only hard, but will cost anyone dearly if they try it without all the facts! Do we have the facts, or is this really just a game? I think, for many investors, the precious metals have become a game of such, even "a gamble that they never intended to take". Conservative persons, trying to protect a life's savings entered this arena with a clear direction, that of protecting their assets from uncertainty. Far too few made it to this end. They read the numerous gold books and newsletters from the last 20 years and came to a solid conviction that, "I can make a fortune at this" or "at least a small killing"!

The gold market is made up of a very broad spectrum of investors. At the very farthest ends of this spectrum lie the persons with the largest influence on the physical bullion. The super wealthy at one end and the "third world no ones" at the other. The middle is occupied, mostly, by the "investors with western thought". The far ends buy bullion. And they don't buy it as a gamble or a game! It is a way of life that has worked, through thick and thin, even before the West was "The West".

Now, on the other hand, this "modern day middle of the spectrum"! Well, they have read why we need gold, but they have never "Experienced" the need for gold! Until that day, when they gain "Experience", most of them will make "A Gamble That They Never Intended To Take". Yes, they do invest in all forms of paper and or leveraged gold and all the while, expounding from the roof tops the coming currency crashes and stock market declines. Even looking for bank closures and bank runs, as they cling dearly to comex options and gold stocks!

Anyone, from the outside looking in can clearly see that "westerners" do lack "experience". What does this have to do with the current market? Let's move on.

As Another has said, "this market is like none before". That is so, very, true. There is a "flaw" in this modern market that many do not quite grasp. In time, they will! There have always been people and companies that make a living dealing in gold. It is an ages old business. Today, we see a phenomenon that is "as none before". It is mostly done by the investors at the middle of the spectrum. The "trading of gold" has grown to a level never seen in history! You read every day, that no one wants or needs gold! In a way those statements are very correct! No investor wants to hold gold, but everyone and his brother ( and sister ) want to trade it! The volume of paper trading, worldwide, on and off market is beyond belief! It has created a type of "Parallel Paper Gold Universe", existing side by side with the physical. The major "flaw" in this system is found in the makeup of the "traders" of this "paper gold universe". Without fail, the majority is made up by those in the "middle of the spectrum", those without "loss of currency "Experience" ". Mostly, they are of "western thought".

Without the experience of " the destruction of currency" as a mental control, the "paper gold universe" will expand! I will not begin to list the types of paper gold available for trade, but from comex gold options to huge corporate derivatives, the overriding motive with gold is clear. "I will trade gold, up or down and make currency on it"!

Ladies and gentlemen, today, the paper gold market is larger than available, tradable physical gold, by a factor of three! This market will continue to expand until we reach a massive gold derivatives failure. This will come about as those, who had no wish to gamble, but traded paper gold anyway, make a mad rush to dump paper and buy gold. Very, very few of them will succeed! You see, the largest bulk of the tradable physical gold will never come back into the market, "in terms of currency"! It will return as a trade for "another commodity"! OIL!

What do we look for to see the coming end of this present overleveraged economic system? The complete and total destruction of the world gold trading system!

From Another: " the destruction of the present currency system will be preceded by the total unlinking of all gold for currency trading" "gold may find a price of $50US/oz or $50,000us/oz, but the truth will not be known as an open market" " yet gold will find an increase of value of biblical proportions"

Thank You

(Tue Feb 24 1998 22:38 - ID#60253)

Some Replies:
I will answer as seen, as time is short.

Lending slowed the end of last year. Some sales still ongoing. CBs wanted gold to stop in the low $300s as that priced $12 to $15 oil. The paper market is now out of control. The BIS will step in at below $280. They have currency as "trees in the forest without limit". But, the gulf problem may change things. This is ongoing?

Silverbaron ,
you know what to do. Physical gold will serve all, very well.

each person must sail their own ship. My allocation, is not your allocation, plan as your thoughts will allow.

(Tue Feb 24 1998 22:46 - ID#60253)

Date: Tue Feb 24 1998 22:28
Isure ( @ Another & All ) ID#368244:

My gold is for my family and country and my thoughts, are as free like the wind.

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